ba_tetsuo
ba_tetsuo
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Survivors got basekit borrowed time, anti camp features, etc. Killers should absolutely get basekit antitoxicity
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@NeverSolus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4096446#Comment_4096446
More than this, all M2's that I'm aware of ignore it. Including Knight's ghosts. It's 'invulnerability from M1' in the same way Exposed is a one-hit for M1's.
Not quite. Bubba saw for sure doesn't ignore it.
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Hens winstreak is a result of three factors:
1.) Survivors refuse to learn the counter play for Jason in general. Every other thread is a variation on "OE is busted nerf it!"
2.) Its a strong hex build that you can't really dismantle without coordinated effort. I'm not talking perks. I mean the second Jason shows himself and starts a chase, all 3 survivors need to be on a hex.
3.) This is, arguably, the biggest factor. Hens has so many hours in this game that he should absoultely be wrecking most average players. Its the spiders george issue, but in real life. -
I think its a bell curve. At low MMR/skill levels, killers generally win. As survivors get more competent, the game errs on their side, but at the top of the top (talking 5000+ hr players) I think games generally favor killer, but only marginally, and only if the killer is tunneling, slugging, etc. If the killer is ever trying to play fair and spread hooks, it swings back into survivor sided hard.
This is why tunneling is so common and such a solid strategy. IMO, Bhvr spends far too much time trying to dissuade tunneling and not enough time trying to encourage spreading hooks. The reward for spreading hooks needs to outweigh the benefit of tunneling, but survivors aren't ready for that conversation. -
I find SF enduring bamboozle legion with iri pin and poison hilarious. Watching them fumble around being unable to run after a frenzy+poison is choice. The table only heals mending, they stay injured afterwards
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I found one neat use for them. Legion gets a frenzy hit, poisons, cancels power, they're too slow to run. Free and easy downs
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M1 killers need a lot of help, and delegating that help to perk slots isn't the way to go imo. It'll help, but the gap between perkless M1 killers and perkless mobility/m2 killers is so wide that perks aren't enough to actually close it in a meaningful way
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4093337#Comment_4093337
exactly, plus the side objective can act like a bit of slowdown for gens, if they are doing the plates they arent on gens.
Not to mention if you poison the tables you mess everything up for them, regardless of how annoying it is.
Quick queues too lolThis would be true if morsel plates weren't 2 seconds away from the banquet tables, or if poisoning the table affected more than one survivor
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@ChurchofPig said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4093341#Comment_4093341
Yeah I know it's on going for years, but it feels like it's happening more right now idk, maybe it's just me.
Its not an MMR thing. Survivors DCing or standing under hook to soft-throw isn't a skill bracket issue, it's a behavioral one. Years of the game being designed around their comfort has produced a playerbase that treats any match that isn't going perfectly as not worth finishing. Killer got an early down in the first chase? DC. Running a perk combo they find annoying? DC. God forbid they queue into Ghoul or Nurse or whatever killer they've personally decided they shouldn't have to play against this week. DC. And when they don't want to eat a penalty for it, they just walk under hook and let the killer kill them instead. Same result, no consequence. They figured out that dying on hook is a free exit that the system can't touch, and now it's standard practice. BHVR built a penalty system and survivors immediately found the loophole that lets them keep quitting without it costing them anything. This isn't a matchmaking problem, it's an entitlement problem.
When the game has spent years treating survivors as the protected class, eventually they start acting like it. I genuinely will never understand how survivors aren't insulted by the amount of hand holding BHVR does for them, and the latest event is just the natural extension of that -
@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4085860#Comment_4085860
Depends on killer but both some 4,6 while others 4,4 and some can be both like springtrap depending if he has axe on him or not.
Nurse is like 3,8 m/s. If you want more info go to dbd wiki where sll stats are.
I'm well aware. Their original post said killers should be 3.8 or 3.9
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Am I having a stroke? Killers are 4.4 m/s or 4.6 m/s.
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I agree that gens can fly by, but making them take longer isn't the answer. It just makes for boring Survivor gameplay. I actually think lowering gen repair times is the way to go, but it needs to be coupled with fixes elsewhere, because there are several compounding issues.
On the killer side:
The biggest problem is that too many solutions are tied to underused perks, and devs just gesture vaguely at them whenever someone complains. They could cut roughly a third of perks from the game and fold many of them into weaker basekit versions. This would need to come alongside nerfs to the most-used perks, or killer strength just skyrockets. Deadlock and Monstrous Shrine are good examples: some version of both probably should exist basekit, with Monstrous Shrine's effect gated to basement hooks specifically. Beyond perks: being injured should naturally slow down action speeds, and being inside a killer's terror radius should have some mechanical teeth. Something like erratic skill checks, more frequent skill checks, or a cap on great skill checks could all work. Killers without a TR would need separate consideration here.
On the survivor side:
Make gens faster, but add a secondary objective like scavenging parts from junk piles around the map so there's still something to engage with. Anti-camp and anti-tunnel protections need to be meaningfully stronger, though the hard part is designing them so they can't be weaponized to harass killers. Injured survivors should have access to more reliable self-healing options baseline, since the current perk dependency for recovery is pretty punishing. Hiding and stealth play could also use some love: crouching and breakline mechanics feel underdeveloped compared to how much the game rewards killers for tracking, so giving survivors better tools for actually going dark would add a real counterplay option. Finally, the looping toolkit could use more variety built into the base game
The throughline is that gen speed is a symptom. The actual problem is that too many systems are held together by perk band-aids, and stripping those out while adjusting base timings is the more honest fix.
What the game really needs is a 2.0, but they've got too much tied into the current game to do that, and there are too many big concurrent fixes needed so they just keep putting band-aids on various things.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/RFFYKABR7Z2O/image.png
What are the survivors supposed to except dc?
They could try playing the game they queued up for.
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Man, what a trashfire. If I've learned anthing about dbd players from this thread, its that they don't understand subtext
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@Deadman7600 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4010560#Comment_4010560
I don't think anyone here thinks he's a bad killer, just one that has so many little hindrances that they pile up and get annoying.
"The killer is mostly fine but has a bunch of annoyances that should be removed" is how we got Krasue :D
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The Krasue has taught me one thing: If nurse released today in her current state, survivors would absolutely lose their minds.
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Idk man, I just picked up Springtrap not too long ago and he feels fine to me. Comparing him to Huntress doesn’t really work. She can swing sooner after a throw because she doesn’t get the 5% speed boost he does since he goes from 110% to 115% while his axe is down. On top of that, he gets free tracking after landing an axe hit. Meanwhile, she has to manage her ammo and lacks map-wide teleports, which leaves her with a lot more downtime between chases than he has. He pays for that lack of downtime with slightly longer cooldowns
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999642#Comment_3999642
The point is that we have identified some kilers that are apparently too strong and so they want to adjust basekit mechnaics.
Where does it go though? Perks had to be nerfed because they were too strong on nurse. Do we now make perks behave differently on different killers? Its a slippery slope that leads to massive complication of an already massively complicated game with hundreds of different perks, dozens of maps, and 30+ killers to already learn. I'd rather instead they nerf those killers so we don't have to also make perks bad just because it might be too strong on 1 of these killers.
I don’t find slippery slope arguments very productive. If you’re not interested in discussing the proposed changes, that’s completely fine, but framing it as “Change A will inevitably lead to Change B, and Change B is bad” doesn’t really move the conversation forward.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999627#Comment_3999627
But again, that is alreay super confusing to new players. The point is that they should adjust those killers individually not make basekit things work differently. At least with things like terror radius, height and movement speed are understandable things to a newer player.
Adjust them how? Change their power? Sure. For example, Trapper could get a new line in his power description, such as:
- “Each time you hook a survivor other than the last survivor hooked, reset X traps on the map at random.”
- “Each time you hook a survivor other than the last survivor hooked, your next kick deals X damage.”
- “Each time you hook a survivor other than the last survivor hooked, fly into the sky and become a tactical nuke.”
If the goal is to incentivize killers to go for unique hooks, they need to be given meaningful benefits for doing so.
Changing their power vs simply giving each killer a “unique hook benefit” attribute has the same effect. The advantage of putting it in a tooltip (whether in the killer’s bio or power description) is that it’s documented in-game, rather than hidden.
On complexity:
In a single match, a new player may need to track over 30 different elements that the tutorial never explains:- 12 survivor perks
- 4 killer perks
- 3 survivor items
- 6 survivor add-ons
- 2 killer add-ons
- 4 offerings
- The killer’s power
Some of these can be ignored (items, survivor add-ons, offerings), but that still leaves 19 things for a new survivor to track. The game’s complexity is already extremely high. Adding a unique hook mechanic only adds 1 more element which brings it to 20. That’s about a 5% increase in complexity, but with significant benefits:
- Quality of life improvement for low-tier killers.
- Allows changes to be tailored per killer, avoiding blanket buffs to top-tier killers.
- Makes going for unique hooks a meaningful decision instead of just “being nice.”
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@ArcT said:
Ya'll think that there were too many anto-tunnel rules for killers to learn, but expect survivors to learn and remember 40+ new rules unique to each killer for what ways they may or may not subtly affect the game, on top of their powers, add-ons, perks, and ever changing maps and tiles.
Come on.
I'm gonna be real honest, outside of the few high impact perks (UB, DS, DH, etc), I don't even know what most survivor perks do any more. I just kind of accept that gens are gonna be done in 45sec and they're going to get 15 pallets per chase.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/456412/anti-tunneling-incentives
I don't like it. The game is already complicated enough without adding things like "basekit mechanics for these killers work differently just because" if these killers are actually too strong with getting an extra bonus to kicking gens that is the basekit, then those killers should be individually adjusted not rebalancing basekit mechanics around them. I already don't trust BHVR to balance correctly, why introduce even more variables?
New players already have a hard time figuring out what is going on. What about the new killer players? They won't even understand what is going on with all the new anti-tunnel and anti-camp mechanics because the UI literally does not tell you what is going on, and now they want to add additional complexity by making these base things work different depeneding on the killer because "they are perceived to be stronger" when that really isn't necessarily the case.
Honestly, what they should do is add a section to the area of the bio where they display the killer's Height, Speed, and TR that explains their unique hooks benefits.This would give them space to make something more complex that you can read about from the character select screen so new players can just click into the character and read about it, even if like 70-80% of killers just said:
UNIQUE HOOK BENEFIT: 10% haste and 20% bonus regression to the next generator kick -
You lose nothing with the update. You keep all perks you already have. You will still keep the perks you already have. Nothing changes there.
Prestige 1 unlocks tier 1 of the characters perks for free. You may still buy tier 2 and 3 in the web.
Prestige 2 unlocks tier 2 of the perks for free. You may still buy tier 3
Prestige 3 unlocks tier 3 of the perks for free. No need to buy anything.
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Do people not remember that the DS stun used to be 3 seconds? It was bumped to 5s to accommodate Enduring reducing the duration. I'm honestly surprised it wasn't bumped back to 3 when enduring stopped affecting it.
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This thread is still going on? Love that for us.
@ BHVR please give us angy birb.
On the off topic discussion, I side with Karl Popper on this one:
"Unlimited tolerance must lead to the disappearance of tolerance. If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them.—In this formulation, I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be most unwise. But we should claim the right to suppress them if necessary even by force; for it may easily turn out that they are not prepared to meet us on the level of rational argument, but begin by denouncing all argument; they may forbid their followers to listen to rational argument, because it is deceptive, and teach them to answer arguments by the use of their fists or pistols. We should therefore claim, in the name of tolerance, the right not to tolerate the intolerant. We should claim that any movement preaching intolerance places itself outside the law and we should consider incitement to intolerance and persecution as criminal, in the same way as we should consider incitement to murder, or to kidnapping, or to the revival of the slave trade, as criminal."
Yes, we want an open, diverse, tolerant community. In order to have that, we cannot allow intolerance to gain a foothold. Any argument of "Hide yourself so that I can participate even though I hate you" should be cut out as quickly as possible. (Yes, this includes your desire to not see the rainbow icons).
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@KateMain86 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2989356#Comment_2989356
Actually my idea was to give an option to disable the visibility of all charms, not just the pride ones. I think if players don't want to see them they should have this option. Why would you care if any individual had the option to disable charm visibility? You would be able to see them if you want to.
Surely you see the optics of asking for this feature on a thread about a cool pride-related charm. Like, even if you're asking in good faith, you see how this appears, right?
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@fulltonon said:
Is there actually someone like that?
Literally why I posted this. Dudes name was "Legion = DC", brought a lery's offering, then DCed as soon as I put someone in deep wound
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You need to watch the intro all the way through.
Wait 7 days, you'll get a new cutscene after the first one. Watch that, then bingo bango, new charm
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I've been a legion main since they dropped. Love those funky friends
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@Xornedge said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2005714#Comment_2005714
I mean that for some reason the middle of my screen snaps to a location where a survivor is. It only happened when i played Blight though.
Doesn't Blight have an add-on that causes this? Make sure you don't have Compound 7 equipped
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I mean, I've consistently hit rank 1 every reset since I started playing, and the game is kind of awful for killers right now. I really don't know what it is, but gens are seemingly going faster than they've ever been, and the minute you start getting an advantage as killer, someone finds a key and 2-3 people escape anyway. The DS changes can't come soon enough, but it really feels like the core gameplay loop is even more broken than what it usually is. I'm holding my breath for the fabled Game start fix that is allegedly coming, but the game just really isn't fun for killers right now
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@UseTheValve said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1948677#Comment_1948677
Please don't stoop that low. We aren't animals.
Just do bones. Easiest way to counter noed
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Just slap on NOED. They wanna ignore everything and just slam gens, punish them
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@DownUnder said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1948276#Comment_1948276
This again? Doing your main objective fast should be punishable? Same as downing/hooking DIFFERENT survivors fast within 1 minute and then eating the 59 sec current DS from the first hooked?
The bones are there. Do em or get NOED
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"It rewards the user for bad game play"
DS
Unbreakable
DH
BT
etc
I'm sick of hearing that. "Those are are anti-tunneling perks!" NOED is an anti gen rushing perk. Do bones
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I'm a simply enby. I see 2+ items in the lobby, I equip franklins.
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@MongolPSR said:
@Almo is human, when hes on twitch he is ideally not suppose to be working. So I can get getting annoyed by constantly being peppered by the same questions about his work. He is human after all though his hair looks like the protagonist of Yakuza Like a Dragon. anyway getting off topic.
He is also at the same time a representative of DBD and BHVR, he is a public figure so he should at all times remain professional. his comments were anything but that. his comments while he is streaming is often anything but that. Almos recent situation brings up an interesting debate that has been active in the world of game development in the past couple of years (honestly since that whole guild wars 2 dev disaster). how transparent should game devs be? I think ultimately the more visible a specific person is within a dev company the more pressure is put upon them to represent the company because they do at all times. This means that maybe BHVR as a company should pull back with the amount of streaming they do both for work purposes like their dev hangout streams and their personal streams. Or they need to be more strict with separating work from personal life, IE no asking devs questions about DBD on their own streams.
I'mma be honest. If I got asked the same question over and over, I'd just set up a bot command with the answer.
!Colorblind
We are aware of community desire for a colorblind option, but we don't currently have a timetable for when we'll have more information.
a bit more formal, but would avoid issues like this. Or you could just not be dismissive of disabled people. I love Devs who interact with their community. I also think that words matter regardless of intent. Hell, if he came out right now with a "Sorry, I was just annoyed. I didn't mean to downplay the issue of being colorblind.", it'd all be water under the bridge for me.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1889086#Comment_1889086
I'd say the fact that the new UI is making things LESS colorblind friendly absolutely warrants bringing up the issue over and over again until the devs make it clear that they will rectify the issue in some way.
Completely agree. Like I said in OP, colorblind mode itself is a different discussion. Even if he can't say they're working on it, his response was extremely disrespectful and dismissive of legitimate concerns from a disabled portion of their game audience
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@Mew said:
the dbd twitter also tweeted about it
transcript: “Thank you for bringing this to our attention. This is not indicative of the views of the team, and we deeply apologize for any frustration or harm this may have caused.”
”This is not how we wanted to reveal this, but we feel it's the right time... we have been working on a colorblind mode for some time now and we are planning on a release shortly.”
“We want to make sure this is done the right way so while we are hoping to get this into the next major release, we are unable to commit on the release date just yet.”
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/AOAH7KATPK7C/d76ea206-5029-41b4-b70d-687624b32f2e.jpeg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/VVXGORQDL2F2/59c6fe0a-d390-4c75-bd8e-4122ce03ccaa.jpeg
proof: https://twitter.com/deadbybhvr/status/1352323137678045185?s=21
Awesome! Glad to see they actually addressed his comments. And the color mode is super hype.
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@TheMythicalCat said:
Because I trust that Survivors are able to leave without the Killer escorting them out.
This. Survivors don't need me to hold their hand to leave. I just tab out to a youtube video till its over.
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Good advice everyone! I wasn't running any BP offerings, but was running No One Left Behind. As soon as I unequipped it, it started tallying normally
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@scarslookgood said:
Nice, I like theirs. Was just curious about your preference, thank you!
Me too! They're my favorite killer(s)
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@scarslookgood said:
Do you switch to a specific killer to use a specific mori, or do you have no killer or mori preference?
Legion. I have about 70 moris stocked up on him
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@Awakey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1116960#Comment_1116960
Take it as a suggestion.
I'm not open to suggestions at this time.
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@Awakey said:
I use Devour.
Can't get DS'd if you don't hook them.
I can get all 5 stacks and leave one Survivor unhooked.
Interesting addition. This is an ama. There was no question
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@KingFrost said:
Cool. When I get Mori'd, I bring a Key into my next match.
Terrible addition. This is an ama. There was no question
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@Pepsidot said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1116811#Comment_1116811
With your idea killers could tunnel and hard camp any survivor without DS activating. That kind of defeats the purpose...
Awful addition. This is an ama. There was no question
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@Dreamnomad said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1116811#Comment_1116811
It's not the player who was hooked's fault that they were unhooked too soon. That's why I focus the guy doing the rescuing if they make an unsafe rescue.
Excellent point! Scratch that addendum. DS can proc inside 32 meters. Expose the unhooker instead
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Addendum to my previous balance ideas: I would also be fine if DS only proc'd if you get unhooked more than 32 meters away from the killer. If you unhook someone right in front of me, there should be punishment, not free escape.
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@[Deleted User] said:
um why are you telling us this?
if you get hit with ds 3+ times you probably hard tunneled and if you did you should not be mad about the survivors using the perk to counter tunneling and you can still get hit with decisive strike even if you have a mori all people need to do is hide in lockers and force you to grab them and if you wait that is 60+ seconds for the others to fix gens
Conclusion
1. you lost 1 match and you posted this out of anger
2. or I fell for the bait
Because I like to talk to strangers on the internet.
As for the 2nd part:
Edited for profanity
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@ClickyClicky said:
If you’re getting hit with DS 3 times per game on a frequent basis you need to look at how you’re playing. Very likely you don’t realize how hard you’re tunneling.
Not such an excellent addition this time
Edited for profanity