Tucking_Friggered
Tucking_Friggered
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@Lost_in_the_Fog said:
DC'ing when the killer camps you will not teach the killer not to camp. If you stay on the hook and struggle till the last possible second you will allow your teammates to complete a lot of gens. THIS is how killers learn that camping is not a good strategy. If you DC you're only screwing the other survivors and making the killer's life easier. The more you know!
Except you don't punish the killer by doing so and it requires a coordinated group to even make use of in the way you suggest. The killer is permanently removing one of the four at the cost of a scant few more seconds they may lose if each of the survivors play everything perfectly.
If it's a swf the game was going to go fast anyway, assuming they are the type of swf group people refer to when they complain, and it's better to just ensure a kill and chance being better able to deal with the three than a full four.
Then there is the fact altruism is a requirement so you have to rescue when you can or lose out on that part of ranking up.
If the survivors were/are in a position to take advantage of a camp they were just as likely to finish those gens whether you camped or not.
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I'm excited for the game to receive new content but I just spent $95 on Total War 2 Warhammer and all the DLC for it and from part 1 I was missing (weekend sale) plus I'm currently into Dark Souls so I don't think I'll have the time to dedicate to it. I'll play the free path and see how far I can get and whether buying premium afterwards is worth doing so. It's not that it's expensive but I can get carried away with my expenditures on video games.
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Basically, no one else is going to get it. Or at least nowhere near the rate they once did. The original version was hard enough, it took me quite a while to do. Without being able to go through floors and walls? Good luck.
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@NoShinyPony said:
If they target you and you get mori-spammed, record those matches and report them.
If the killers play normal and "just mori" you, play SWF like the others suggested.
No one is going to be banned for targeting a survivor and mori'ing them. It's never happened in DbDs existence and it isn't ever going to. I don't care what the rules concerning griefing state. It's all fluff designed to steer people into playing nice.
The reality is that if the survivor is known to be a gamechanger, a great survivor, it is solid strategy to get that person out of the game. No one is going to be banned for doing so.
Now perhaps if in chat afterwards they made it clear they did it because they don't like the person things might be different. Maybe. Even then I still doubt it.
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@Liruliniel said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/773541#Comment_773541
It's because it's TRUE not that I'm disconnected. It's a good perk used by bad player's. You dont see a good player go "if only I had NoeD I would of gotten the 4k" they make it happen. You can say whatever you want, but the facts are there. It's like why BBQ is significantly better than Bitter Murmer other then the BP gains. BBQ&C rewards your success and Bitter Murmur rewards your failure to be proactive. Same with Devour Hope vs NoeD.
It rewards failure and nothing more. It's like the EGC hatch escape. It rewards the survivors failure not there success.
The game isn't over because 5 gens were completed. The game ends when you escape. Five gens complete are the same as one gen complete if you can not get the gate opened and make it out.
NOED doesn't reward anyone with anything. Survivors don't magically die because it's in play.
You do realize there is a perk that allows survivors to play exposed all match right? People escape.
NOED can be prevented from firing at all before the end game and easily cleansed if it does.
Adrenaline requires no effort at all. The gens complete and it fires regardless of whether you did a single thing all match, regardless of whether you are on the ground or injured.
You have no facts, only very biased rhetoric.
Lol.
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@Liruliniel said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/773320#Comment_773320
NoeD rewards failure
Adrenaline rewards success
DS rewards failure, but punishes tunneling.
If someone wanted to say they did good they would run Devour Hope which Rewards success. If someone actually thinks they did good when they use NoeD and used it to secure a 4k because they couldn't do it before that gen. Then honestly they lost.
Lol. Your disconnect from objective reality is so great as to be comedic to read. Instead of debating it I think everyone should just have a good laugh.
The best part is you really believe it. It isn't just a meme for you.
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Longer range shock therapy and Iridescent King baked in. Long range shock is minimum because a Doctor without it is weak sauce. Without King the madness is dull and generic. It certainly would put him in a better tier and is certainly feasible when you look at what Freddy and Spirit can do. They feel powerful when played. Doc doesn't.
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@Rivyn said:
It's rather easy to tell who's swf and who isn't. The level of coordination and communication put on display makes it obvious. Yet, 'I'm solo' seems to be the prevalent remark when called out on it. You can't double check on their profiles, because they always keep them on private. I don't play swf myself, no friends interested in the game, and a killer main on top of that. So, I don't have the mindset. Why deny it?
I'm not saying there aren't the rare survivors out there that just click, but again, with enough playtime experience, it's not hard to spot the solos from the swf.
Because they know it's broken and exploitive and if they admit to it then it kills their ability to pretend to be as good as it allows them to be.
Humans lie to themselves to feel better about themselves. C'est la vie.
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@AkiTheKitten said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/765925#Comment_765925
I think I'm not gonna continue this conversation. Good day
I understand. Next time bring up the kid in a sub saharan village who cranks a windmill to supply power for their internet and gaming as it might garner more sympathy than the perpetually victimized college student.
If one can afford college but wont give up their Starbucks coffee shot once every 3 months then do without. The game shouldn't stagnate development based on them.
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@AkiTheKitten said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/765910#Comment_765910
What about people who just play on a console on cheap internet? Those 6-10 dollars can stack up, that could even be a college student's lunch money. Just saying, we should be slightly more considerate of others
I don't care about a college students issues. They are spending many thousands of dollars per year on their education, I don't want to hear their laments about spending coffee money equivalents 4 times a year.
Considerate of others? This absolutely rare minority is expecting a game to work around their first world problems and inconvenience 99.7% of everyone else, and the rest are inconsiderate?
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Then you are saying those who wish to play the pass free should not have access to the lore of killers or survivors they have bought in the past.
Stagnating development for this mythical poor person who has access to a computed that can run DbD and high speed internet yet can't afford $6-10 every 3 months is ludicrous.
If they aren't going to cover everything in the DbD universe they need not cover any of it. There is also the issue that the free and premium path follow each other so I'm not seeing how one can have the option while the other doesn't.
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@Mr_Goodman said:
Freddy is boring...…….spirit is boring...………..Nurse is boring...….. Dear god, entitled survivor mains seriously complain about every killer. I swear there is at least one complaining post for each killer.
Boring is codeword for difficult. The idea being if they say boring instead of difficult they won't have killer mains counter their wish for change.
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@AkiTheKitten said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/764671#Comment_764671
What if people don't have the funds to buy DLC? One solution could be to make the challenges be able to be completed with splinters, but that would require a>making them more common for a few days and b>making new ones for dlc characters that don't have splinters
So what? Do we not create new killers because those who can't afford them are on an uneven footing against people who can? This is even less severe than that as its cosmetic and lore rewards.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/763827#Comment_763827
It's not so much that perks were forced to appear, it's more like two perks were rerolled. There was an issue with Aftercare and Wake Up! that caused them to be unobtainable, so we had two new perks randomly selected and swapped them out. We try not to influence it as much as possible.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/763967#Comment_763967
This first one focuses mostly on Claudette and the Trapper, so they'll be available to everyone. However, future Tome may feature challenges that require other characters (or their perks). It's something we're keeping in mind and discussing, I can't really give you a solid answer just yet. If we stick to just free characters, the types of challenges you can have are way more limited. If you open it up to other characters, you can have much more diverse challenges, but then you risk leaving people out.
Choosing not to participate is not the same as being left out. I mean the people with the characters are the people financially supporting the game. You can certainly do the free characters first and always default to the oldest to ensure people have time to collect the new but I wouldn't completely avoid purchased DLC to spare those who refuse to buy any DLC from participating.
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@KillermainBTWm8 said:
"As a Killer, your goal is to sacrifice as many Survivors as possible". "As a Survivor, your goal is to escape and avoid being caught and killed."
First of all I respect all your opinions on this topic but I'm going to share my reasoning on why people shouldn't worry about pipping as a "win" condition. The two quotes I just stated above are my first reasoning as to why pipping is not a win condition. Nowhere does it say that you have to gain "pips" to win. It says that your goal is to sacrifice or escape. Nothing more. All pips really are stated to do in game are to make sure you are ranked within a certain skill group of players. To separate the noobs from the red ranks mainly. My second argument is that if your a survivor/killer and everyone is equally skilled then you can still win and get a black pip. That doesn't mean you lost or tied. You still won because you completed both your objectives. People who think pipping counts as winning can you please leave your thoughts on why you think so? Feedback is always appreciated.
Winning is determined by score. Escaping with 7k blood points is hardly celebration worthy and 4king with 10k bloodpoints is equally unsatisfying. At its core the end game score is the only means we have to know who came out ahead in the match. Ranking up doesn't affect anything outside of the people you play.
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@bendermac said:
A lot of people will say "Only bad killers will camp". This not true. A really good Killer can decide to camp just for giggles and it's up to the Survivors to make the Killer pay. But the reality is that camping is rewarded by the Survivor more then you would believe. 3Ks or even 4Ks are not rare. They do happen far more then they should. Yet Survivors get very mad at the Killer that he got them all. The only one who can be a bit salty is the one who gets hooked -> camped first. Yet many times the other try to safe the hooked guy and then soon they are all hooked... one by one.
Just saying guys, look at yourself and don't blame the Killer if he succeed ;)
But in all fairness, it's a ######### play.
Down one, camp until dead. The other three then have a choice. Send two for a rescue or let them die. If they choose to let them die and power through gens they may face Bitter Murmur, NOED, and Blood Warden in a rough end game.
If they send two for the rescue, one person is on gens which is ideal, a hook is achieved and the killer now has a lead on two potential targets and a crippled survivor who was just rescued.
Throw in Insidious for extra trolalalala as Borrowed Time won't fire.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/763833#Comment_763833
Can you speak in layman's terms, please?
Cadre - members of a group that acts with a unified purpose.
Ultracrepidarian - a person who expresses opinions on matters outside the scope of their knowledge or expertise.
Basically a large group of armchair devs who claim to care about balance when in reality they only care about making things easier on themselves at the expense of their competition.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/763822#Comment_763822
The problem with tic tac toe is not that it is "balanced"; the problem is that it is poorly designed, with the gameplay pattern being both too on-rails and too likely to end in a draw.
Fun and balance do not have to be mutually exclusive.
They don't have to be but within gaming communities they almost always are. Nothing sucks the life and fun out of games more than a cadre of ultracrepidarians.
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Whatever else it would be, it would definitely be boring.
Tic-tac-toe is balanced to a degree most games can not be with the only imbalance being in who moves first.
Balance does not equate to fun.
Fun trumps balance.
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@Shura37 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/763026#Comment_763026
Don't you have an e-girl to orbit right about now?
Someone is salty.
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@Shura37 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/763016#Comment_763016
You're welcome to believe what you want and use all the new big words you learned from Google. 'Same survivors posting on alt accounts". You have a absolutely no idea what you're talking about and it's comical.
Then I guess you have nothing to worry about Mr. 18 post alt account. I'm sure everyone will laugh right along with you and not see things as I've outlined. You have it covered. You're all set.
Sorry, Mr. 13 post alt account when you started the thread.
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@Shura37 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/763008#Comment_763008
It's not an "agenda", it was a question. I don't think Spirit needs a nerf, I don't think Nurse needs a nerf (although I welcome her changes and the new playstyles it will bring), or anyone else. I just noticed something and decided to bring my question to the community. Don't lump me in with everyone else who wants to complain about every killer. I actively play both sides and before reset, I was equal rank on both.
Sure, it's your question. A completely transparent question following the pattern of behavior I outlined.
Spam the forums with requests to nerf this killer for a few days, then switch up to that killer, then move on to the next killer and repeat the cycle until a theatre of consensus is created when in reality it's the same few survivors posting on alt accounts.
Pretending to be in disagreement with Nurse nerfs after they are all but assured to seem disconnected from it is equally transparent. If one thinks Hillbilly needs a nerf then one most assuredly felt Nurse needed a nerf. She has/had the same capabilities Hillbilly did but better in application.
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@Shura37 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/762990#Comment_762990
Is there a reason you're being so hostile? All I did was suggest a simple change and asked people's opinion. There is no need to be so rude
Calling out an agenda isn't being rude, it's calling out an agenda. When I can predict something to the tee and it plays out one can deduce what I say is accurate and should consider whether that agenda is nefarious in intent.
Now this thread will spark others to do the same keeping the thrust of the forums geared towards killer nerfs while avoiding the potential backlash from spamming the exact same thread for a given killer day after day.
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No, because I respect my competition. If I let you win I'm saying that you are an inferior unworthy of the respect of trying my best.
Additionally, I wouldn't be preparing you for better killers who will not give you a pass.
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As predicted in other threads, here we go. Moving from Nurse, to Spirit, to Huntress, now to Billy. If the killer can't be looped or has the ability to project around the map to limit genrush, spam the forum with threads suggesting a change is needed. Too predictable.
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@ScottJund said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/762494#Comment_762494
What does that have to do with anything? The topic is "Spirit is impossible to loop", which I believe is true. Where does VOIP come into play there?
Spirit isn't any more impossible to loop than Nurse is. Trapper is impossible to loop as long as he has a trap. Hag is impossible to loop. Spirit is just difficult. With bloodlust I guess we could say all killers are after a point impossible to loop. But then when was it established looping the same object over and over was good or necessary? If it were why on earth did they remove infinites? To make it more reasonable?
Then I guess the argument boils down to degree. And that, Scott, is in the realm of subjective opinion. When you and others put Ruin as a perk almost necessary at all times we can assume the gens move too fast. So then where does the logic come from that making delaying through loops the right path to take for any killer?
Additionally, with Ruin being almost universally required, it kind of makes a good argument against your assertion that survivors shouldn't be forced to choose perks based on what killer they have the most difficulty against.
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@ScottJund said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/762388#Comment_762388
that was awfully personal for a debate about Spirit. I don't get it, just show me these counters. You're very confident in them so just show me and shut me up, its super simple.
It's not personal. I watch your videos. I listen to what you say. I'm a fan actually. Breader! But I also recognize how above others in skill and out of touch with those same players you are because of it. So much in fact you feel sorry for your competition.
That said how about you show us how you own Depip squad with Spirit? A fully functional VOIP using efficient group. Not some randoms.
Demonstrating you have dedicated a good portion of your video game time to mastering every tile and beating those who do not sink the time into the game won't demonstrate Spirit is OP only that you are. And that's to be expected.
If one spends 10000 hours on Dark Souls to where every single challenge in game is a breeze that doesn't mean that the challenges need to be made impossible for those who do not.
Maybe, just maybe, YOU have outgrown DbD and the level of challenge it can offer you from normal players. Maybe if you accepted that premise you would understand how calling for nerfs on any killer that isn't low tier isn't kosher with other killer players.
You wanted Nurse nerfed, you want Huntress nerfed, you want Spirit nerfed. I'm sure once survivors start losing to Freddy and Billy again you'll call them OP as well because they aren't as difficult to succeed with as others. I assert you'll do so because you have the tiles memorized to the point that 9 out of 10 survivors you face, who do not, will go down to you with a perkless killer. Any killer. But that goes back to my initial response to you. Most of us do not want the game boiled down to who can keep up the most optimal path through the tiles before screwing up. It's linear and boring to those not interested in a tournament style game.
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@ScottJund said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/762173#Comment_762173
"I went against a bad Spirit" does not mean she is easy to loop. Not a dig at you whatsoever. In fact, the Survivors skill is barely relevant against a good Spirit.
Yeah, and going against the best Spirits who know how to play doesn't mean we dumb down the Spirit to the point looping is the safe choice against any player that doesn't make a living streaming.
I'm sorry but your asserting running tiles is all this game should ever be, that stealth means nothing, even though it isn't a 100% failsafe is beyond tedious. We might as well just get rid of all killer powers and make every killer a m1 clone because running tiles is all there should be.
That is at the core your narrative. Any power that takes away a loop or bypasses a survivor safeguard is OP and needs to be changed, leaving us with a dull game of run the tile as optimal until the timer runs out and you go down.
Boring as hell.
Killer powers break the linearity.
You might want to play the game like an Esport tournament, most of do not.
I can think of a dozen games easily I'd rather waste time in than playing a glorified game of hide n seek and tag where every tile and chase can be calculated down to the second if no one makes a mistake. The "mindgames" if you can even call walking backwards to disguise a red aura that, are as exciting as watching paint dry. A killer that is a threat though, where you can not plan how to win and have to play it by ear and hope for the best, is much more exciting.
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No matter how many times you say differently, git gud is contributing to the conversation. It's ridicule which is very effective as a means of protest and diminishing the effect of propaganda and/or rhetoric. The more that do it in response the more effective it becomes.
As proof of its effectiveness look how much energy you are putting into disputing something you assert adds nothing. If it added nothing it wouldn't be worth addressing as people would naturally disregard it.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/761563#Comment_761563
How am I wrong? You added nothing to the discussion with telling somebody to git gud. It's absolutely useless. It's like telling a killer who is struggling to do well with an aspect of the game to get better at it. Like why didn't they think of that already? If somebody is struggling in an area it's obvious they need to get better at it. Telling them to get better is annoying and does nothing. Offering advice on how to get better does. If you don't feel like offering advice to people who are struggling with something that's your right. But don't pretend telling them to git gud was useful. Because it damn sure wasn't.
You said git gud doesn't qualify as contributing. I told you the devs use it periodically. You said you doubted it were true. I told you it's on stream. Instead of saying you were wrong in what counts as contribution you then disregarded it and stated Mathieu isn't credible because he isn't good at the game.
Given enough time you'll be back to parroting the narrative because you aren't here for debate or to learn, you're here to convince the devs that Spirit is OP as anything less means you are the problem and would require effort on your part. It's easier to have the devs nerf a character so you can use one simple method (looping) to win instead of having to learn to play better.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/761547#Comment_761547
Coming from a guy who is pretty clueless about how to play his own game.
And this is why people like myself don't bother responding with anything more than git gud. When people like you are wrong you don't admit it. You just continue parroting your narrative.
So, git gud.
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Pinhead. They need to get Pinhead.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/761535#Comment_761535
You're right. I'm not in authority on what constitutes contribution. Though I'm fairly certain git gud doesn't qualify.
Then you'd be wrong. Watch some dev streams, you can find times where Mathieu Cote has told people to git gud.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/761522#Comment_761522
Which brings us back to you contributing nothing. Also considering I haven't complained about, nor do I give a rat's ass about Spirit. You telling me to git gud makes no sense.
I don't have to contribute anything beyond what I choose to. This isn't your forum and you aren't the authority on what is or isn't acceptable contribution.
She is anti loop by design. Don't loop. Use stealth. She uses sound extensively so use perks to help counter that, Iron Will as an example. She tracks with scratch marks often so using Lightweight can be useful.
If you find that unacceptable then you deal with losing. If you demand she be made weak so that you can have your 1 dimensional strategy of pallet looping, then you get told to git gud. Simple.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/760818#Comment_760818
Telling people to git gud isn't contributing. Laying out an actual argument as to why you think Spirit is fine would be. Sharing techniques you use to combat Spirit is contributing. Mindlessly telling people to get better adds nothing to a conversation.
I don't owe you that information. This is a forum where people leave opinions. In my opinion the problem is the complaints come from bad players who blame the game and not themselves. Every person that recreates the same thread does not deserve endless well worded responses designed to help them. Learn to help oneself.
The perks to use have been mentioned over and over, the things to avoid against a Spirit have been mentioned over and over. But bad players come with an agenda and will hear none of it. They want the killer nerfed so they don't have to think. Thinking requires effort.
Git gud.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/760357#Comment_760357
@Tucking_Friggered Another un-needed "git gud" post.
Thanks for contributing the discussion, there is so much substance in your one sentence I can hardly contain myself.
It is contributing. It's telling mediocre players what they need to hear and do instead of whinging on a forum, in a to-do list cadence, over each and every killer that isn't loopable, low tier, fodder.
The thing is you lot will never accept the answer no so a conversation is pointless. You have an agenda and you work towards it everyday instead of putting that energy into getting better.
Let's say I do this for survivor perks. Let's have endless conversations where I make up nuanced complaints about any that are remotely effective and demand you defend them endlessly. Are you going to be here having the conversation day after day knowing I have no interest in conversation and only care about pursuing an agenda that wants survivors nerfed into ineffectiveness by any means possible? No you will not. At some point you will tell me I'm not as good as I think I am and that the perk isn't the issue but my personal skill is.
Nurse changes are not even set in stone on live and you lot are already in full force starting the propaganda over Spirit.
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@AshleyWB said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/760041#Comment_760041
I would advise investing in Skynet. It's really gonna take off soon.
So Google? Sheesh, you could have said that 2 decades ago now the stock is expensive.
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Imagine survivors telling the opposition something needs to be made difficult.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/757636#Comment_757636
@DrVeloxcity 3 minutes?? Lmao That must have been a really bad Spirit then.
Even on normal killers that sounds impossible. Looping her is a constant guessing game.
It's not fun to do that over and over. So if she wants to keep her base power 2 things need to go... Prayer Beads and Collision. Because it doesn't take that much skill to know you are bumping against an invisible object and swing.
Nah. She's going to keep her base power, her addons, and her collision. What survivors can do is git gud.
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They had a rational moment where making every solo player as effective as people exploiting a broken grouping function seemed like a bad idea. Four solos all given Kindred turns 16 perks into 20 perks versus 4.
That and you can only drop propaganda concerning "Buff the solos so you can buff the killers." for so long before even the solos want an answer to "What kind of buffs are you going to give killers to compete?". Never having an answer to that is problematic.
Though I'm repeating myself here from the past, Behav10r has a dilemma with the new dedicated servers. They allow SWFs to form and join queues remarkably easy and allegedly disguise those groups to avoid dodging. The disguise will only work for the game creation though, as it will be absolutely apparent to the killer after the miserable experience. That's great for SWFs but tedious for killers who simply will not face that every game. That's most killers by the way. Anyone can tolerate it for a game or two here and there. But even streamers being paid to play would grow tired of it every single game. Those killers will play far less or even stop playing altogether.
Considering the pretty laughable accusations of impossible challenges in the battle pass from survivor players (most main killers recognize those challenges as fairly common to achieve) there isn't going to be a flood of converts from the survivors willing to pick up the slack. (Wait until they try those challenges and every match is a SWF)
Once you flip the switch to dedicated server permanence and allow the SWF teams to enjoy their new convenience you won't be able to smooth over going back if it isn't working out. That means killers have to be adjusted to deal with it and my God if you think the OP cry now is bad just wait for that. You can not leave the killers weak to where only True, Otz, Scott, Tyde and a handful of others can succeed. They simply can not carry the game which means the lesser talented players have to be boosted. Those boosts will only serve to make the top tier players nigh unbeatable and the lower tier players competitive.
SWF is the issue. It breaks perks and the uncertainty and information part of the game. At some point it is going to have to be tempered with a debuff. There is no way around it. Particularly when the one remedy to it, dodging, is being hamstrung. Threatening killers with DC bans when they eventually grow tired of facing it is not going to work. You won't have a killer population that can sustain the queues. It certainly doesn't help that the survivor tactic du jour is pick a killer and complain until they are made mediocre and then immediately switch to the next highest threat. Freddy, Legion, Nurse, now Spirit. After that will be Billy.
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@smappdooda said:
I am always amused by the mentality on the internet of "my opinion should be your opinion". Everyone thinks there has to be a "winner" in an argument/discussion instead of just shaking hands and saying well we don't see eye to eye so let's look at something else.
That aside, some of the arguments I see here are "They need to keep the lights on and make money etc" but a lot of you might be too young to remember video games before DLC and micro-transactions. There was a time when skill would net you rewards, not just your pocket book. Those companies made plenty of money by having good games without any of what we have today. For fun reading, see how it all started here- https://www.usgamer.net/articles/the-history-of-gaming-microtransactions-from-horse-armor-to-loot-boxes
I know "times they are a-changin' and this is the world we live in now" and all that but dismissing it that way is like someone saying, "Dhamer? Oh yeah he eats people. That's just how he is. Its fine. He's wacky". (If you don't get the reference, google it) Don't accept the things you don't like. That's how we got where we are politically.
We need to speak up and if the new system is governed by money, vote with your bank account. Don't just give in and say "Oh well I guess...". If you like it, buy it. If not... don't. Times will tell and the community needs to speak up collectively if they don't like something. Let the people who do like it stand in the back and shake their heads at you (and vice versa).
TL;DR: Pay for the rift or don't. Just stop thinking you are right and everyone else is wrong. The old days are gone and we have to learn how to navigate the new system to work FOR us.
Yes, but the west for the most uses a fiat currency that has debt built into the system. If every dollar on earth of the currency was confiscated the debt could not be paid back. The initial bond the government took out to acquire the cash came attached with interest that was never printed. This continues year after year. It matters because it means that the currency will continue to inflate. What you could afford back in the early days of video games simply does not exist as a possibility now.
There are higher corporate taxes, more entitlements including employee entitlements and more competition from other companies that can afford to offer more. The programmers you hire are not going to dismiss raises and perks commensurate with their talent and education because the public thinks it's due everything until the company closes for the initial cost of the game.
Another issue is back in the day once you bought a game you were done. Very rarely did it come with support and patches. A many a game from that generation has bugs you can still repeat today. Not to mention the online play and anticheat improvements that have to be ever present lest hacks be developed that ruin the game for everyone.
Is Behav10r likely raising money beyond present requirements? Sure. But it's smart to do as it gives them leeway if and when things slow down. It also allows them to procure more expensive licenses.
The positive to this is that if it's profitable the game can look forward to becoming ever better and it's future is secure. There aren't to many times on earth something profitable is discarded. In the reverse, a game that has no means for growth and barely scrapes by is likely discarded in the future when it requires more headache than return it gives.
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Boring is codeword for effective. Counter play is codeword for strong against loops.
Both are used interchangeably such as "I can't dominate and make a mockery of the killer therefore Im bored at the lack of counterplay."
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@Ark_the_Bonsai said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/757830#Comment_757830
I responded with a negative attitude because the first thing you wrote to me was "You're entitled." That was uncalled for, and I apologize.
I'll be real with you. I don't like the battlepass at all but that's because I would never pay to work for someone. I would never provide money to do a job.
And you're right, I do feel a bit entitled to get what I, personally, paid for with my hard earned money. As such I would, in most cases, just buy the cosmetic I want. Not purchase a pointless battlepass as all of it will end up on the store anyway.
But I do agree with the people who are willing to spend money on a battlepass that it should be easily accomplished. Why would you spend money for something that only a select few can achieve.
As a matter of fact, I would compare the Battlepass system to a Carnival game. It's rigged so that the majority will fail. The difference is that most people who participate in a Carnival game are aware that it'll be a waste of their money. They're just doing it for fun.
I propose that BHVR lets you keep your intense grind, since that's what you'd want, while also applying an obvious warning for new players that informs them that unless they have X amount of spare time, the battle pass will be impossible for them to complete. This way less people will buy the pass expecting something different.
There'd be no problem with that if they genuinely wanted people to feel challenged by the pass and struggle to complete it. If they're selling to the "hardcore" gamers who have the time.
And after this, I'm done with the conversation. I'd rather not get a ban for arguing with someone over something as silly as a difference in opinion, a mod has already commented on the thread for obvious reasons.
Nothing you said is ban worthy broski. I also respect your opinion. It's honest.
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OP was tunneled, camped, and chain vomited on until death at the hook. So very traumatic.
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@Ark_the_Bonsai said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/757673#Comment_757673
On the same note, who are you to say that everyone else has to abide by that time crunch just because you want it. Do you see the problem here?
Your entire argument hinges on you telling someone that they can't have what they want because you want what you want.
Right here. When you take this position your implication is that you have an entitlement not presented to attain the content.
I'm not interested in having a hair splitting session though, cupcake.
If you want to pretend to be disassociated and only acting as a devil's advocate to avoid accountability for your position be my guest.
To those with appreciable comprehension of the English language, ascribing motive to thought when following a conversation is fairly simple.
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@Ark_the_Bonsai said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/757673#Comment_757673
On the same note, who are you to say that everyone else has to abide by that time crunch just because you want it. Do you see the problem here?
Your entire argument hinges on you telling someone that they can't have what they want because you want what you want.
This is absolutely broken logic. No one here is telling you to abide by any time schedule. You are free to ignore it. It's you demanding that in ignoring that time schedule you be given everything based on your personal and subjective acceptable level of effort.
You have no entitlement to everything you want. You do have the opportunity to achieve everything you want in the same fashion everyone else has in being offered that opportunity.
I do see a problem here. The west has created a culture where people who do not own the intellectual property believe they have an entitlement to dictate how someone else's intellectual property is handled.
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I somewhat agree and definitely understand the point you are making. I think the issue is "need". If Behav10r needs $10k today to pay X, money received 2 years from now doesn't help. So the question is asked what can be done today to generate that $10k. Timed exclusives can certainly do it, distasteful as they are. I don't think Wicked is in the minority as far as humans go. I think you and I might be though. Most people want status and recognition. If everyone on earth has a PHD would a PHD have any value? Maybe a high school diploma is a better example. I can't think of a single job available to high school diplomas that aren't available to those without one. There are so common and mostly meaningless as to not warrant any extra benefit or pay. At least here in the States.
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@ProfessorDunwich said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/757580#Comment_757580
Absolutely no one is saying that. You are creating a straw man. Plenty of people buy the new chapters when they come out and many buy the cosmetics as well. This system has served the game well for years and they have grown many times over. They are certainly making money. Now they are opening up a 3rd stream of revenue that is based in free 2 play games and psychological manipulation. Of course a business wants to make money, but there is certain point where it is too egregious.
DBD is a cult game with a stable but not large player base that should be treated well. I think this game requires a lot more thought than most. Honestly, I am surprised so many of you are defending this.
It served the game well enough when they only had to cover the cost of salaries.
Dedicated servers have injected a monthly cost into their overhead that has to be ever increased as more people play with no guarantee those new players will ever spend more than the baseline salary covering initial purchase.
I have gigabit ethernet. I never wanted, needed, or advocated for dedicated servers. Quite the opposite actually. I knew what was coming.
I support Behav10r with the battle pass in so far as I understand the need for revenue and limited ways to generate it.
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@SleepyWillo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/757559#Comment_757559
None of the content is free. We've already paid for the game. That isnt even the point of this discussion.
The point is that the rift is not complete-able (free or otherwise) without paying IRL money to complete tiers (or play ~4 hours a day every day for 70 days)
You already received the game you paid for. You are not entitled to free content for the rest of your life just because you made the initial purchase. If you buy a burger at Mcdonald's do you assume you are entitled to a free lunch for the rest of your life?
The battle pass is designed, as all are, to offer you some goodies for participating as a baseline and compel you to either dedicate time playing or spend cash to advance. It is 100% intended to generate income to cover the cost of dedicated servers knowing that few will be able to attain everything for free and most will spend money to avoid the challenge. Even those committed enough to attain everything for free still provide a service in filling the queues.
The question is why is that bad? Dedicated servers are not free. The money has to come from somewhere. Amazon doesn't accept IOUs or best intentions.
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@BunnyTheHutt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/757485#Comment_757485
So because BHVR has too make money, the majority should be forced too pay up for content that should be accesible for free if you play well? Again, if you don't participate but want everything then you can pay for everything, but a casual player should be able too unlock everything for free if they play right and smart.
Establish for me why content should be free at all. I mean on a fundamental level it isn't free to create and it was created after you bought the base game so you were never promised anything more beyond technical support. I'm not against free content though, I just don't feel entitled to it.
As for playing well and receiving content, this is a game. There is nothing wrong with rewarding completing challenging content. I think it's self evident humans want rewards for accomplishments. On a deeper level the longer you play the more easier the queues are filled which makes all the other players happy.
Money, tasteful or not, keeps the bill paid and the lights on. People don't part with it easily and rarely if ever freely. So yes, you can pay straight up cash to bypass the challenge if its preferred. Though frankly I think you cheat yourself of the sense of the accomplishment by doing it that way.
Define casual. Is it based on time or skill? I'm definitely casual when it comes to time, I struggle to hit rank 10 anytime I play because I do not sit down and play for long periods. In terms of casual in skill I'm far from it. I understand how to run tiles, how to pressure gens, and how to generally make life difficult for my competition. If the pass is made easy enough for an absolutely skill-less casual to complete without sweating it will be a boring and pointless endeavor for the better players. It is meant to provide a challenge for those who do play a lot as they are ones sticking around for long periods growing bored.