Yeah that sounds about right, way too much outrage towards something entirely unknown. Nobody knows what release will look like for a killer with such an overwhelmingly strong power even with high skill requirements. if its too weak on release just remove the extra warning… no big deal.
Forums are half overrun over a nerf to something unreleased… I get the worry that the killer they want to play will be weaker than it should but at least wait and see.
Tbh even in the PTB I didn't really have ANY issue dodging long-range snipes. Once you see the killer do it, you expect it.
It's just a part of how this killer plays. I hope they don't add any other hand-holding for survivors and I'm glad the bigger visual indicator is not applied on release
Imagine having an indicator when Myers or GF stalks you 😭
Tbh even in the PTB I didn't really have ANY issue dodging long-range snipes. Once you see the killer do it, you expect it.
It's just a part of how this killer plays. I hope they don't add any other hand-holding for survivors and I'm glad the bigger visual indicator is not applied on release
Imagine having an indicator when Myers or GF stalks you 😭
There is an indicator when you are in imminent danger from both Myers and Ghostface, though. first and most obviously the unmistakable "Exposed" Sound but also the red ring from ghost face and the Myers sound to inform survivors that he has stalked enough to use his power. Having an indicator for Judgement would put them on the same level Myers and Ghostface already are on.
Stalk is not equivalent to "you are about to receive damage", that's why myers and ghostfaces indicators are hidden until they pose an immediate threat of downing someone VIA Exposed status.
The Pig does not have this because she does not have exposed in her kit, although there is still an SFX when she chooses to use her lunge rather than grab off of gen or sneak up for a hit.
The reasoning being used for Judgement is that even if it isn't exposed status instant down, people deserve to have proper warning so that they can react to damage and unlike myers, ghostface, or the pig, Judgement can aim targeted damage at a player without being anywhere near them. The Nurses TP has an audio queue, Trickster daggers aren't used to snipe but even they "clink" off of objects… the huntress hatchet requires quite a bit more skill to hit at orbital range, more than Judgements beam ever will and AFAIK its the only example of a hit from somewhere that survivors aren't given a particularly good warning about, and it still has a SFX its just kind of quiet unless its the Eddie variant then its just obnoxious.
Glad to see that the vignette is gone, but I think the 0.3 second redirection timer is too short. She was already hard in loops, this makes it even harder.
Glad to see that the vignette is gone, but I think the 0.3 second redirection timer is too short. She was already hard in loops, this makes it even harder.
This is an adjustable number, so it is something we can edit - its not set in stone
This is an adjustable number, so it is something we can edit - its not set in stone
I am not sure I understand why it was changed to begin with if there is any clarity to add. As mentioned. It was already tough in closer loops. Also survivors still now, have a good heads up with White Aura from far away showing their going to be hit by a celestial beam. It almost feels as if I am a little doomed either way I play the Character.
I guess to be clear, how does BHVR want us to play this killer? How is she supposed to be played?
Even if it was a joke, I do believe there was an element of truth behind what they said. BHVR has been balancing around the lowest common denominator for a while now, and these changes are just a continuation of that. Any time something takes any amount of skill or focus to counter, it is deemed problematic because there is the assumption that the playerbase of DBD is too incompetent to learn or adjust and everyone will remain at a beginner skill level forever and the game, and skill expression, hurts as a result.
so now she can patrol totems and gens with no issue right by spamming her m2 with her "MOST BORING POWER LIKE HENRY THAT RUINS EVERY LOOPS"? one sided change yet again, backpedaling as usual to please killer players!
Honestly, and respectfully. Killer players? That's where we are going for this? People were upset on their "joke" and giving a full on window around you. respectfully the players rightfully had the right to complain about it.
Instantly going for the us vs them argument isn't it.
This is an adjustable number, so it is something we can edit - its not set in stone
Thanks for the quick response, I appreciate it!
Are there any plans to adjust some of her kit to become better at shooting in loops, like a minimal reduction in the beam immunity timer or a short ability recovery reduction so she can fake beam attempts for M1s, or will this stay as is?
(I would not mind it staying as is, but I figured if she is getting nerfed in the long range department, maybe a small readjustment would help for more casual players)
I personally would prefer her beam-mechanics going back to the PTB-values as I thought they were perfect, but I understand if you want to redesign her a little.
After 10 years of working with a community that has the knee-jerk reaction of The Thing from the 2005 Fantastic Four movie, you'd think they would be more careful with what they say. I'm not saying they should be forced to walk on eggshells with every little statement, but considering their reasoning for MANY of their questionable decisions in the past 5 years, I'd say the backlash was warranted. At the time, it didn't sound like a joke to me.
I am not sure I understand why it was changed to begin with if there is any clarity to add. As mentioned. It was already tough in closer loops. Also survivors still now, have a good heads up with White Aura from far away showing their going to be hit by a celestial beam. It almost feels as if I am a little doomed either way I play the Character.
I guess to be clear, how does BHVR want us to play this killer? How is she supposed to be played?
its a slight change from the way it was coupled to the Delay State (so the time before Divine Light becomes lethal) in the PTB. It is now not linked to that at all (meaning things can be balanced seperately). It might well be that the number isn't completely accurate but the Team felt this was a safe number to start with to see how players understood the curve window in comparison to the PTB.
The number being adjustable will mean we can easily make adjustments.
This is what they should have done in the first place. Making the beam more visible from farther away is totally fine. If this somehow isn't enough and Judgement has a super inflated kill rate then we can have the vignette conversation but I suspect it won't be necessary. Very happy I can actually be excited for tomorrow again!
its a slight change from the way it was coupled to the Delay State (so the time before Divine Light becomes lethal) in the PTB. It is now not linked to that at all (meaning things can be balanced seperately). It might well be that the number isn't completely accurate but the Team felt this was a safe number to start with to see how players understood the curve window in comparison to the PTB.
The number being adjustable will mean we can easily make adjustments.
Thank you for the clarity and the follow up statements on Reddit. I am looking forward to playing The Judgement. 5 Million BP and 150k Iri shards to spend!
Thank you for the clarity and the follow up statements on Reddit. I am looking forward to playing The Judgement. 5 Million BP and 150k Iri shards to spend!
Thank you for the clarification, I've moved over to boon builds to support others so I'm looking forward to trying steadfast and salvations cry to see if I can find a new fav perk.
I have a brain break now. So does that mean that this indicator change will not be happening tomorrow?
The Short Visual Warning on the edge of the screen will not be pushed through, but increased range of aura reveal on divine light should according to how I read it
The Short Visual Warning on the edge of the screen will not be pushed through, but increased range of aura reveal on divine light should according to how I read it
I'll take anything I can get. Thanks, BHVR! Appreciate it.
If accessibility is the name of the game, then it's interesting how survivors who are deaf just still get wrecked by Spirit. It's a shame because I think Spirit is about the most fair and balanced "top tier" killer, if we can still call her that.
I'll take anything I can get. Thanks, BHVR! Appreciate it.
If accessibility is the name of the game, then it's interesting how survivors who are deaf just still get wrecked by Spirit. It's a shame because I think Spirit is about the most fair and balanced "top tier" killer, if we can still call her that.
Ok but even with specific settings this will still probably kill flicks for controller.
That killer wasnt created for majority of controller players only for the ones that are super good with controller but she is viable mostly on MK because of flicks.
Simular to trickster,xeno but she is way harder i would bet she will be number 1 hardest killer for people using controller.
I'll take anything I can get. Thanks, BHVR! Appreciate it.
If accessibility is the name of the game, then it's interesting how survivors who are deaf just still get wrecked by Spirit. It's a shame because I think Spirit is about the most fair and balanced "top tier" killer, if we can still call her that.
Tbh if you are deaf you will get wrecked with anything that has no terror radius so its not just spirit like any oblivous or stealth power that has no lullaby so people that are deaf dont see tr indicator and they get wrecked by even oblivious billy that canceled his saw sprint just behind the wall near them.
Cant even imagine how terrible it is to be deaf and play DBD honestly, like unless it has terror radius indicator you have no clue where will killer apear unless its super open map.
They honestly should know by now, they have a a reputation that makes "jokes" like that not sound like jokes. The power already gives massive warnings and such, this new even more visual indicators is just… honestly I find them saying it's an 'accessibility' thing now kind of insulting. If that's the case, why not say that originally? Most of us would have been okay with it then. But again, with their reputation, this "joke" just made people angry for no reason, and they should have known it would.
If I am being honest, I think that the tweet is just damage control. It might've been "joke", but knowing BHVR's history, I wouldn't be surprised if that is actually the thought process in the balancing team and they got scared that Jeff "outed" them on live stream.
And not to mention the utter lack of self awareness. Do not joke like that in the dev stream, where you're supposed to give "accurate" info about coming updates.
If I am being honest, I think that the tweet is just damage control. It might've been "joke", but knowing BHVR's history, I wouldn't be surprised if that is actually the thought process in the balancing team and they got scared that Jeff "outed" them on live stream.
And not to mention the utter lack of self awareness. Do not joke like that in the dev stream, where you're supposed to give "accurate" info about coming updates.
Thats kinda how I feel too because later on in stream, they had the chance to clarify it was for accessibility reasons but they gave was would be easier for survivors who are not "not paying attention and 360ing the camera" minutes later separate to the streamer comment. and ngl was ready to defend before I saw because assume it was blown out of water.
If both are jokes was the whole dot point just joked about with no serious comments during that part of patch notes? that would be unlikely imo
If it is accessibility I feel like it would of been addressed as such and at very least not referred to as survivors not paying attention.
(just wanted to add no hate to anyone Ive seen some comments online get real riled up over this, Im just here for online discourse about game we like and want to see balanced in good ways)
You know how much killers dominate and control the game. Even the tiniest change to make a killer bearable to play against causes an uproar and daddy BHVR has to run out with a reassurance statement and reversion.
That killer wasnt created for majority of controller players only for the ones that are super good with controller but she is viable mostly on MK because of flicks.
Simular to trickster,xeno but she is way harder i would bet she will be number 1 hardest killer for people using controller.
Yeah, but you know what I mean. Kind of bums me out a bit.
You know how much killers dominate and control the game. Even the tiniest change to make a killer bearable to play against causes an uproar and daddy BHVR has to run out with a reassurance statement and reversion.
If someone needed that visual alert to make a killer more bearable for them when I've seen people say "it wasn't hard to dodge in PTB" is.… Hilarious imho
If someone needed that visual alert to make a killer more bearable for them when I've seen people say "it wasn't hard to dodge in PTB" is.… Hilarious imho
what was the PTB like? is Judgement like as bad to go against as ive heard?
what was the PTB like? is Judgement like as bad to go against as ive heard?
The major problem with The Judgment is specifically being. Able to protect Hex's and snipe gens(which in most cases isn't bad it just that i've seen that been a bit of complaint.)
If your paying attention you won't get hit, but the problem with it is it makes progress really hellish.
The problem with Judgement wasn't the projectile itself but more along the lines of how often they can fire off their projectile. So giving the visual alert won't really help the MAIN problem with that style.
The major problem with The Judgment is specifically being. Able to protect Hex's and snipe gens(which in most cases isn't bad it just hative seen that been a bit of complaint.)
If your paying attention you won't get hit, but the problem with it is it makes progress really hellish.
The problem with Judgement wasn't the projectile itself but more along the lines of how often they can fire off their projectile. So giving the visual alert won't really help the MAIN problem with that style.
Ah i see, i havent the ability to play or go against her yet so.
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Comments
Yeah that sounds about right, way too much outrage towards something entirely unknown. Nobody knows what release will look like for a killer with such an overwhelmingly strong power even with high skill requirements. if its too weak on release just remove the extra warning… no big deal.
Forums are half overrun over a nerf to something unreleased… I get the worry that the killer they want to play will be weaker than it should but at least wait and see.
Tbh even in the PTB I didn't really have ANY issue dodging long-range snipes. Once you see the killer do it, you expect it.
It's just a part of how this killer plays. I hope they don't add any other hand-holding for survivors and I'm glad the bigger visual indicator is not applied on release
Imagine having an indicator when Myers or GF stalks you 😭
There is an indicator when you are in imminent danger from both Myers and Ghostface, though. first and most obviously the unmistakable "Exposed" Sound but also the red ring from ghost face and the Myers sound to inform survivors that he has stalked enough to use his power. Having an indicator for Judgement would put them on the same level Myers and Ghostface already are on.
Stalk is not equivalent to "you are about to receive damage", that's why myers and ghostfaces indicators are hidden until they pose an immediate threat of downing someone VIA Exposed status.
The Pig does not have this because she does not have exposed in her kit, although there is still an SFX when she chooses to use her lunge rather than grab off of gen or sneak up for a hit.
The reasoning being used for Judgement is that even if it isn't exposed status instant down, people deserve to have proper warning so that they can react to damage and unlike myers, ghostface, or the pig, Judgement can aim targeted damage at a player without being anywhere near them. The Nurses TP has an audio queue, Trickster daggers aren't used to snipe but even they "clink" off of objects… the huntress hatchet requires quite a bit more skill to hit at orbital range, more than Judgements beam ever will and AFAIK its the only example of a hit from somewhere that survivors aren't given a particularly good warning about, and it still has a SFX its just kind of quiet unless its the Eddie variant then its just obnoxious.
Glad to see that the vignette is gone, but I think the 0.3 second redirection timer is too short. She was already hard in loops, this makes it even harder.
This is an adjustable number, so it is something we can edit - its not set in stone
I am not sure I understand why it was changed to begin with if there is any clarity to add. As mentioned. It was already tough in closer loops. Also survivors still now, have a good heads up with White Aura from far away showing their going to be hit by a celestial beam. It almost feels as if I am a little doomed either way I play the Character.
I guess to be clear, how does BHVR want us to play this killer? How is she supposed to be played?
Even if it was a joke, I do believe there was an element of truth behind what they said. BHVR has been balancing around the lowest common denominator for a while now, and these changes are just a continuation of that. Any time something takes any amount of skill or focus to counter, it is deemed problematic because there is the assumption that the playerbase of DBD is too incompetent to learn or adjust and everyone will remain at a beginner skill level forever and the game, and skill expression, hurts as a result.
Honestly, and respectfully. Killer players? That's where we are going for this? People were upset on their "joke" and giving a full on window around you. respectfully the players rightfully had the right to complain about it.
Instantly going for the us vs them argument isn't it.
Thanks for the quick response, I appreciate it!
Are there any plans to adjust some of her kit to become better at shooting in loops, like a minimal reduction in the beam immunity timer or a short ability recovery reduction so she can fake beam attempts for M1s, or will this stay as is?
(I would not mind it staying as is, but I figured if she is getting nerfed in the long range department, maybe a small readjustment would help for more casual players)
I personally would prefer her beam-mechanics going back to the PTB-values as I thought they were perfect, but I understand if you want to redesign her a little.
Ok but even with specific settings this will still probably kill flicks for controller.
After 10 years of working with a community that has the knee-jerk reaction of The Thing from the 2005 Fantastic Four movie, you'd think they would be more careful with what they say. I'm not saying they should be forced to walk on eggshells with every little statement, but considering their reasoning for MANY of their questionable decisions in the past 5 years, I'd say the backlash was warranted. At the time, it didn't sound like a joke to me.
its a slight change from the way it was coupled to the Delay State (so the time before Divine Light becomes lethal) in the PTB. It is now not linked to that at all (meaning things can be balanced seperately). It might well be that the number isn't completely accurate but the Team felt this was a safe number to start with to see how players understood the curve window in comparison to the PTB.
The number being adjustable will mean we can easily make adjustments.
THANK YOU!
This is what they should have done in the first place. Making the beam more visible from farther away is totally fine. If this somehow isn't enough and Judgement has a super inflated kill rate then we can have the vignette conversation but I suspect it won't be necessary. Very happy I can actually be excited for tomorrow again!
Thank you for the clarity and the follow up statements on Reddit. I am looking forward to playing The Judgement. 5 Million BP and 150k Iri shards to spend!
only 5m BP pfftttttttt
(and to be clear, that last comment is a joke….I hope you enjoy the release tomorrow @MechWarrior3 <3
yes, we'll be monitoring the feedback carefully and you can be sure we'll be discussing it heavily.
Oh no worries, I can take a joke. Thank you! <3
Thank you for taking all of this seriously too. Monitoring feedback will be crucial here.
I'm glad the devs have been listening a lot lately the game is definitely going in the right direction.
I have a brain break now. So does that mean that this indicator change will not be happening tomorrow?
Thank you for the clarification, I've moved over to boon builds to support others so I'm looking forward to trying steadfast and salvations cry to see if I can find a new fav perk.
Tomorrow is going to be fun!
Correct.
The Short Visual Warning on the edge of the screen will not be pushed through, but increased range of aura reveal on divine light should according to how I read it
Thx, there's been a lot of changes lately 😊
I'll take anything I can get. Thanks, BHVR! Appreciate it.
If accessibility is the name of the game, then it's interesting how survivors who are deaf just still get wrecked by Spirit. It's a shame because I think Spirit is about the most fair and balanced "top tier" killer, if we can still call her that.
Thank you for listening, BHVR. I have no other comments. This was good.
that's for a whole other discussion…
yup, but today we celebrate! Gotta take the wins when we get them!
That killer wasnt created for majority of controller players only for the ones that are super good with controller but she is viable mostly on MK because of flicks.
Simular to trickster,xeno but she is way harder i would bet she will be number 1 hardest killer for people using controller.
Tbh if you are deaf you will get wrecked with anything that has no terror radius so its not just spirit like any oblivous or stealth power that has no lullaby so people that are deaf dont see tr indicator and they get wrecked by even oblivious billy that canceled his saw sprint just behind the wall near them.
Cant even imagine how terrible it is to be deaf and play DBD honestly, like unless it has terror radius indicator you have no clue where will killer apear unless its super open map.
It was super hilarious to see people fall for an obvious joke. Just shows what this community is all about.
Most people did not fall for the joke as you describe it, most people got upset about the underlying
"not paying attention to the game is okay and we design/nerf characters around that" stance.
That is what did grind some gears.
To be fair, some people seem to be perma offended by everything.
They honestly should know by now, they have a a reputation that makes "jokes" like that not sound like jokes. The power already gives massive warnings and such, this new even more visual indicators is just… honestly I find them saying it's an 'accessibility' thing now kind of insulting. If that's the case, why not say that originally? Most of us would have been okay with it then. But again, with their reputation, this "joke" just made people angry for no reason, and they should have known it would.
If I am being honest, I think that the tweet is just damage control. It might've been "joke", but knowing BHVR's history, I wouldn't be surprised if that is actually the thought process in the balancing team and they got scared that Jeff "outed" them on live stream.
And not to mention the utter lack of self awareness. Do not joke like that in the dev stream, where you're supposed to give "accurate" info about coming updates.
Thats kinda how I feel too because later on in stream, they had the chance to clarify it was for accessibility reasons but they gave was would be easier for survivors who are not "not paying attention and 360ing the camera" minutes later separate to the streamer comment. and ngl was ready to defend before I saw because assume it was blown out of water.
If both are jokes was the whole dot point just joked about with no serious comments during that part of patch notes? that would be unlikely imo
If it is accessibility I feel like it would of been addressed as such and at very least not referred to as survivors not paying attention.
(just wanted to add no hate to anyone Ive seen some comments online get real riled up over this, Im just here for online discourse about game we like and want to see balanced in good ways)
You know how much killers dominate and control the game. Even the tiniest change to make a killer bearable to play against causes an uproar and daddy BHVR has to run out with a reassurance statement and reversion.
Yeah, but you know what I mean. Kind of bums me out a bit.
"i am 4 universes ahead of you" ahh moment
"Tiniest"
"Make a killer more bearable"
If someone needed that visual alert to make a killer more bearable for them when I've seen people say "it wasn't hard to dodge in PTB" is.… Hilarious imho
what was the PTB like? is Judgement like as bad to go against as ive heard?
The major problem with The Judgment is specifically being. Able to protect Hex's and snipe gens(which in most cases isn't bad it just that i've seen that been a bit of complaint.)
If your paying attention you won't get hit, but the problem with it is it makes progress really hellish.
The problem with Judgement wasn't the projectile itself but more along the lines of how often they can fire off their projectile. So giving the visual alert won't really help the MAIN problem with that style.
Ah i see, i havent the ability to play or go against her yet so.