Is DS too easy to abuse?
Please read below in full detail: (people seem not to be reading more than the title)
TL;DR: I was curious what people think about DS. I'm not complaining, I don't have an issue with it, and I now understand it better. you can all stop arguing now, but feel free to keep sharing and discussing.
also, does anyone know how to close this can of worms?
side note: can someone close this discussion? I think it's run its course.
I feel like it could use another caveat to make it so it's not a team-wide second chance.
I'm not angry or anything, but it has certainly lost me kills and sometimes games before.
I feel like maybe it should turn off if the killer downs someone else, would that still be fair?
edit: I'd like to specify that I don't personally have an issue with ds, I'm just curious what other people think. :)
abuse = as a game mechanic, take advantage.
Comments
You want all exhaustion perks disabled after last gen??
DS is fine. I preached about how broken it was for years but after the last change, I feel it is in a good spot now.
You don't have to. I rarely tunnel and I play Legion and Pig. If you accidentally find someone again, then you can slug them.
DS stand for ?
Imagine still complaining about DS.
decisive strike
ohh its a perk !!
sadly it seems certain killers wont stop complaining until the survivors spawn hooked and have to kobe to even play.
People complaining about DS = tunnelers.
A lot of games I wish I was wearing DS. The amount of proxy tunnelers these days is extremely high.
I also agree with some people that said self heal shouldn´t deactivate your DS, or you shouldn´t leave scratchmarks on floor for a short time. When u are facing a tunneler is very risky trying to cure the unhooked guy, because killer will come back in seconds. So if the DS user is able to scape, and try to stay safe with a selfcure, he is eliminating his only life insurance. And that shouldn´t be like this.
It's much better now. It cannot be abused by survivors for a quick gen fix, but does punish killers from going for an immediate tunnel. Also, less people run it now, so overall it's much better from both sides.
Ds is fine as it is no need to change it again if they do that perk would be most useless thing in game
DS not deactivating when opening an exit gates is really an oversight by the devs and should be changed, yeah.
About the healing, instead of deactivating it when you heal yourself just a fraction of a second, it should deactivate when you are fully healed (by yourself OR by others). If you had time to heal up, you are not tunneled, so you don't need the ds protection. So no more jumping into locker heathy to force the ds on the killer. As a compensation, you can heal in the killers face without loosing it.
Ds is fine. In fact I think a QOL buff to remove the skill check and simply escape the killers grasp would be good.
I'd say when I equip DS, most games it's never used. So it's usually a waste of a perk slot, but it is comforting at least. There shouldn't be a requirement to hit a skill check when you are actually able to use it IMO.
That's technically not true considering that you can open the exit gates and not lose DS. Maybe this is just me, but I would absolutely count opening the exit gate as an action that progresses the game.
Only thing I think needs to be changed is it functioning during the EGC. Feels pretty bad when someone is effectively guaranteed to escape because they were downed close enough to the open Gate with an active DS. I'd be willing to buff DS a bit in exchange.
Except Adrenaline of course.
You actually need to get good
I thought for sure this was a Necro Post. How are we still complaining about DS in it's current state?
Aside in the end game phase, when you can literally open the gates with that perk active (devs forget to add the escape gates to the conditions that will disable DS). It would be perfect if DS will be disabled after all the generators are done (in exchange it can be used 2 times, but with less time available)
A Perk should work all game, unless said otherwise.
So you propose making NOED a generic hex perk that starts working from the beginning, and all hexes uncleansable? Interesting way of thinking.
Agree!
I try so hard not tunnel (even when it obvs its the survivor messing up). With old DS I would go hook another survivor, find the previous one, not realize a minute is up, and still get hit with DS. It was a very frustrating perk on the killer end.
Now it is still strong but not a 'get out of jail free' perk ^^"
I even said "unless said otherwise".
Imagine complaining about DS after being nerfed.
In the meantime, Camping and Tunneling still remain in the same broken state they have been in.
Well, then it should be "stated otherwise" for DS to make the perk balanced, that's what the thread is about.
Especially with console performance in the state it’s in. Considering input delay and how laggy the game is, I’m surprised console survivors are able to hit DS half the time.
i mean on the one hand i feel that, but on the other i feel like it would take away the off chance that they legitimatley miss. plus sometimes you just dont want to use ds immediatley yknow
The literaly definition of “Decisive” is as follows, according to the Cambridge English Dictionary:
Strongly affecting how a situation will progress or end.
If it didn’t affect the outcome right at the very end of a match, it’s just a “Strike”. Not to mention that would absolutely kill the fantasy of the perk.
No, it's a design problem, people with tons of hours played are complaining about they cannot do nothing against that type of perks in the endgame, those perks (DS, BT, some exhaustion) in multiple survivor are simply a free win for them, don't really mind how good you are.
while i understand your frustrations and others', the simple truth is that sometimes you just lose dude, and it has to be accepted. whether by ds or not dosent really change that.
I don't really mind if I lose sometimes, but losing due a combination of strong perks at the very end of the game seems unfair. I don't know if you are killer main of not, but losing a lot of times due strong perks not due survivor ability make anyone feels bad.
They... Weren't complaining though? They didn't post an aggressive, angry 20 word letter about how DS needs to be nerfed. They stated they had no issue with it - it was just costing them some hooks / kills and inquired if it should be tweaked. They weren't playing before the nerf, so they didn't experience the bs survivors would pull with DS and they ought to feel lucky as I do that I wasn't playing with the old old DS. I think I'd lose my mind if I had to do the dribbling.
i play both, and ive had my fair share of ds on both sides, it does feel genuinely bad. it also feels genuinely bad losing the game because your whole team is allergic to generators in red ranks, my point i reckon is that, typically if this game is going well for one side the other side feels bad. however i dont think nerfing ds, even considering that and several other issues, will really help anything. sometimes ppl legit get tunneled and ds is the "one last blade, forged in defiance of fate" in those cases. and tbh if it gets nerfed much more it wont even be usable for that.
And Leader of Dwight means Leader, and he is the Leader of nothing, it's just the name of the perk.
The etymology argument is bullshit that has no place in balance debates.
thank you so much for A. respecting my pronouns and b. reading my message and understanding I wasn't whining. : )
That's a good idea, almost like what babysitter does when you unhook someone and they have no scratch marks
i feel like that might be a bridge too far, what i think should happen is a side grade i reckon you could call it. you can heal yourself, however opening a gate deactivates it.
same, but you could always run Inner Strength with Small Game
It's not a design problem. It would be ridiculous to disable exhaustion perks and second chance/anti-tunneling perks during endgame collapse. The game is designed like a boiling process. From the beginning, the more gens get done, the more survivors get hooked or eliminated, the harder it gets (for survivors). I play Solo queue, and it's exceedingly rare to see a 4 man escape. Many times there are two of us left, and the chance of escape in that scenario for both are incredibly slim (unless a Killer is camping the 3rd last survivor). What you suggest would turn the survivors into sitting ducks and render escape hopeless unless you happened to have a strong team with 4 people up.
With second chance perks like Unbreakabill, you can go 5 games with never using it and it's a wasted perk slot. So you would have survivors running a perk all game, only to have it disabled when it really could make a difference for them.
Hope of escape is the only thing that survivors play the game for. It's the entire point. If you eliminate all their chances to get away just as they complete their objectives, there's no point in trying imo.
At the same time, I'm in agreement with others that I'd gladly exchange DS being disabled opening the gate, so it would not be disabled when healing oneself.
No, if anything it's too hard to use now.
“Don’t make it to endgame, it’s your fault for not being able to occupy multiple places at once”
also survivors main: noed is op and unfair 🤡🤡
This needs to happen.
Right!!
People defending DS = bad loopers.
See how easy this is?
Just because you got downed after being unhooked doesn't mean you got tunneled. It USUALLY means you're just bad at hiding, and bad at looping. TWO different elements that would have saved you the trouble in the first place, where you're running DS to fix your weakness.
The game shouldn't force the Killer to go easier on bad players just because they might run the crutch perk DS. Borrowed Time gives you 12 seconds, that's MORE than enough time. Do you honestly need 60???
"Proxy tunneler" doesn't even make sense. You're just vomiting out random combinations of buzzwords you hear other people say when they die.
Holy actual #########.
This is prime Survivor posting, ladies & gentlemen.
No way. survivors are still playing and should always get a DS chance no matter what.
killers that think DS is unfair at EGC are wrong. Just slug and wait the timer out. Or eat the stun early.
Yeah because teabagging at the exit because you hide all game and still have ds are the most important part of survivors game. I do it all the time, I just avoid killer and get hook intentionally egc so I can teabag the killer for 60 seconds at 1 of the far exit gates
What does teabagging have anything to do with DS?
I so like when tunelers cry about DS :D Maybe we should cry about BT too? Cuz u cant down surv just right after the hook ? :D Well, if the DS and BT got nerf someday, ill just tunel ppl untill they will cry about bringing back the DS
did you read what I said? I said I don't have issues, I'm just new and want to hear the opinions of others. DBD's a game about storytelling; as far as I'm concerned, you win if you have fun.
I disagree. I personally think the cut-off point should be once the End Game Collapse starts.