hagling
hagling
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presumably everyone will drop it tomorrow to gush about the new content / complain about the new bugs, but who knows if that strat's gonna actually pay off. i don't think there ever would've been a good time to tell us, it's awful news.
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https://twitter.com/DeadByBHVR/status/1427279180438417417
there's one answer, at least.
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@Mooks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1978583#Comment_1978583
Have they really confirmed that?
can’t remember it..
unfortunately, here's the article:
"As for the Killers, who some people have found themselves drawn to either because of their tragic pasts or just because they look particularly tasty in a certain skin, they barely remember their pasts and romance and love is something that won’t be touched upon. In Côté’s own words, the sexuality of killers will be left “to the fan fiction.” Sorry killer fans, maybe next time!"
https://gaymingmag.com/2020/11/dead-by-daylight-has-a-promising-queer-future-ahead/
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they've confirmed any representation will be survivor-sided only, which honestly.. is kinda disappointing when you consider frank x julie and wraith x nurse. evil straights are valid but evil queers aren't? there's an argument to be made that we've been over-represented as villains in media and that's well and good, but if they're giving us queer survivors to balance the scales i'm totally onboard with queer killers too.
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how dare you?
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altho it warms my heart that you care so much, i really don't think the devs can make the current situation worse by including us. just take a quick glance around the forums right now. gamers are practically imploding because a png had bisexual lighting, that level of irrational panic doesn't just go poof cuz you're too cowardly to confront it.
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if we're taking into account every piece of media in the entire world, cishet ppl are way over-represented. are you suggesting dbd should have more than 4 queer characters to compensate for the lack of representation elsewhere? cuz i'm down, let's do that then.
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@Orionbash said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1977351#Comment_1977351
The LGB population make up 7% of the world. The T less than 1%. 7%/1% of the population don't need to be in 100% of media.
so if we're about 8% of the world, naturally you'd be okay with us being represented by 4 out of dbd's 46 characters right? that's about 8%.
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honestly i'm just excited to see fewer of these threads popping up once we have rep and people realize it's genuinely not that big of a deal, it's just a nice bit of inclusion for a marginalized community to be like 2% happier playing DBD. any opposition to that feels disproportionate. barely requires any effort on the devs' part, doesn't influence gameplay, most of the community probably won't even notice it's there and that's completely fine. sooner the better imo, the longer they delay the more antsy everyone gets.
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BHVR cuz some kpop stans @'d them on twitter
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taking into consideration the latest teases and the korean hashtag i don't really think it fits an american animatronic indie game, my bet's on original. i was trying to cling to the possibility of a ringu chapter but for whatever reason they refuse to license asian horror IPs.
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+1 for adept achievement portraits, i'm still sad they didn't add 'em to this latest hotfix.
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@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1949610#Comment_1949610
Oh, so you mean the way that the norm is that people assume you are straight because the majority of people are straight?
No, there is 1 confirmed heterosexual, that being Ace. The rest(like, what, 5 people out of the 49 remaining characters?) are maybe heterosexual relationships, but they are not necessarily straight. All that has been shown is that out of 50 characters, 1 is heterosexual and 5 have engaged in a heterosexual relationship. Not even including the fact that the lore only represents only a few months before the characters were dragged into the fog.
Considering the lore is mainly about the daily lives before entering the fog, there is plenty of room.
As for gaming communitys being welcoming and open-minded, well, dead by daylight is quite open-minded. It literally leaves room for a lot of things. The lack of information given to characters on purpose is pretty much the definition of an open-minded lore. Unless you're talking about "blackface" bubba, in which case you need to get out, because that's racist. Removing Claudette from Bubba's inventory because she is black is like saying Bubba doesnt think Claudette's face is worth wearing because she is black. Bubba is not a racist murderer, he wears the faces of his victims equally.
so you clearly aren't capable of understanding what i was saying but i'll go ahead and repeat myself: when we pretend that only alluding to heterosexual relationships/attractions means that the characters could be bi or pan or any other flavor of queer rather than pressuring the devs to confirm that in concrete terms, we're letting them off the hook on representation. it's something that's totally true irl, it's quite rude to assume you know a real person's sexuality based on some small shred of evidence but this is fiction and imagination isn't representation. i've said similar three times now in this thread alone, which you didn't care to read or maybe just didn't process cuz you were too busy conjuring some strange unrelated argument about blackface bubba?? weird thing to defend given no prompting but do you i guess.
you can tell me the dbd community's super open minded when an LGBTQ+ topic can exist on the forums without getting random bigots drawn like moths to a flame (even this thread had a couple replies bad enough that when reported, they were removed by the mods) or the use of the F slur dies down in endgame chat, seems like you're trying to pretend something isn't an issue because it doesn't affect you. pretty common here tho.
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betting they all popped on unbreakable after that round and gave the next killer hell, all you did was amplify their feeling like killers are ######### and deserve to be bullied, assuming that's what they were actually doing, and perpetuate the meta. gg tho you really showed 'em who's uhh.. boss?
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x ray vision or shirtless myers, pick one bhvr. 🙏
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@ItzZane_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1954304#Comment_1954304
The devs could just say his boyfriend or her girlfriend in one of the tomes That's an easy way to make a gay character
excluding the current tome cuz it's not finished yet, there have been lore entries for a total of 17 playable characters. only 2 of those were about or alluded to a romantic relationship, julie's tome and david's tome. both straight relationships. if you really think the devs are gonna give the remaining characters multiple tomes each focusing on their romantic exploits in order for us to reasonably conclude they're bi or pan.. well, that's very very unlikely.
and yeah, they could totally give david a lore-only side character ex boyfriend after they complete every other remaining character's tome and start double dipping but us imagining that's the case before they tell us isn't representation, and frankly waiting that long for something they promised us back in june 2020 sounds miserable. i'd much rather they confirm rep in a way where we don't have to assume anything, it's right there on the page. david's bisexual. yui's lesbian. jake's gay. practical, bold, and quick, y'know? until then, all we have is heterosexuality. pretending otherwise gives the devs credit they haven't earned yet.
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neither. it'll be an improvement but the UI and animations are intentional artistic changes that indicate where their heads are at and what we'll see going forward so i think if anyone's quitting because of this, the patch won't change that. the rest of us will get used to it begrudgingly and hope the next update at least isn't unplayable.
BHVR listens to
feedbackbacklash to a point, but they won't revert bad decisions they'll only tweak them. -
@Superyoshiegg said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1956991#Comment_1956991
Is there a particular reason why it's non-optional? I personally don't care either way myself as I'm not in the habit of harassing people in the chat, but I can't imagine why there at least wouldn't be an option.
Side note, I know slurs are now rightfully censored, but does the filter include 'minor' cusses (f**k, s**t, c**t, etc come to mind), because I think it's pretty hard for anyone to get offended by them.
looks like it won't censor general profanity
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as someone who plays hag a lot this is the QoL improvement i've been waiting for.
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if hook struggle changed to pyramid's cage mechanic with the skill checks instead of the buttonspam that'd work nicely. you could technically still die, but it'd take a few missed skill checks first to give the killer / your allies time to do something.
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@ItzZane_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1949610#Comment_1949610
A character that had a relationship with the opposite sex could be bisexual or pansexual tho
true! but when we decide that's the case rather than pressure the devs to actually MAKE that the case by clarifying their sexuality, we're giving them an easy out on rep.
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this is a really good PSA, thank you! i hate sets so much, just let us do what we want with the overpriced cosmetics we bought 😒
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@Snowstruck said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1949610#Comment_1949610
I mean, they shouldn't outright state sexualities. Yes, they have states couples but have never straight up said, "This person is straight!"
That's what I meant :0
you don't have to say felix is straight or frank is straight or ace is straight for the majority to reach that conclusion but if you tell us yui kimura's a lesbian in no uncertain terms? that's a clarifying, strong statement, one many gamers wouldn't even consider unless the lore provided that intel. that's the big difference here and ultimately why clear representation matters imo, we're not just fighting for inclusion, we're fighting the perception that heterosexuality is the "default" and so it does need to be louder and more distinct to get that point across.
that said, i'm honestly gonna celebrate whenever we get any representation at all, ambiguous or defined. 🌈💕
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coming from a queer person, representation matters and hiding behind the excuse that everyone should get to decide for themselves has been at odds with the canon for awhile. frank x julie? confirmed. wraith x nurse? strongly implied. david has an ex girlfriend, felix has a current girlfriend and an unborn child he wants to get back to. ace has multiple references to being a skeevy 'ladies man'.
as is, ONLY heterosexuality exists in dbd. the incoming LGBTQ+ representation doesn't take away your headcanons any more than the current canon sexualities do. imagine whatever you like, but it'd mean a bunch and make a lot of people really happy to have concrete evidence BHVR isn't all talk when it comes to supporting us and to see ourselves reflected in characters we know and love. especially in a gaming community not well known for being welcoming and open-minded.
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i remember the devs discussing shifting the struggle phase to pyramid head's cage skill checks way back when his chapter released, then nothing really came of it. seems like that happens way too often with BHVR, they discuss a good idea to tease the community, then we wait forever while they continue implementing features nobody asked for, wanted, or ends up liking.
they're a mess. i hope they start prioritizing accessibility options too.
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wraith op pls nerfthe devs do listen when we're loud enough it's just a question of how long before their solutions actually come to live, they nerfed undying, they're nerfing ds and ooo, they're bringing colorblind accessibility options [finally], they're revising both the UI and the animations. imo the backlash just feels extra severe cuz the PTB seems pointless, they don't give themselves enough time to implement PTB feedback into live which makes everyone feel ignored and annoyed that we have to repeat ourselves and wait even longer for changes. good ideas terribly executed, that's how i feel about BHVR atm.
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their plan is to 'review' the new animations not revert them so your overblown reaction isn't necessary.
It would be a clear indication that the game isn't for horror fans its for people with repressed emotions and stan cams on twitter.
but also? just liking the old animations better than these weirdly stilted new ones doesn't imply nearly as much as you're projecting 👀
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i saw someone doing it in one of my lobbies earlier this morning, maybe you're not shuffling quickly enough? i really hope they just let us keep the glitch, sets are so stupid.
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it's just a result of both sides sweating, you encourage each other the further up the ranks you climb or you're punished for it. i'll have the occasional round in red ranks where nobody's brought ds so there's no obsession and more often than not killers take that as an invitation to tunnel as much as they possibly can. guess what happens after that round?
to me the problem isn't strong perks, it's how necessary they feel because of the core game design. if killers couldn't tunnel or camp without being punished, if there was a true secondary objective to tempt survivors away from gens, maybe dbd would have a very diff atmosphere at the top. but playing nice and giving the other side a chance isn't what the game encourages so it isn't what happens.
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i'm a survivor main but the killer challenges i've completed haven't been fun, hits not registering, general strangeness, the awful UI. especially with the event going on being connected to finishing gens + the new year toolbox, survivors are incentivized to rush to get maximum points and doubly to avoid getting smacked a mile off. additionally like others have said, survivors seeing ridiculous hits on their screen isn't really a thing on the killer's screen. it's not a telekinesis update, everyone's suffering.
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idk why diversity's such a cursed topic on the forums, whenever BHVR drops a new poc survivor it's not like a billion threads pop up demanding their deletion. starting to think people here hate the IDEA more than the actual implementation cuz it's the exact same reaction whenever LGBTQ+ rep is mentioned. an indian character would be a lovely addition, i hope the devs take notice. ✌
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i'll keep my feedback solution oriented:
- reorient the onscreen information how it used to be while keeping the improvements like the hook counter and changing the character portraits to the adept achievement icons, that way it feels like we're still going in a new, better direction rather than 100% reverting.
- either tweak the animation sets to behave like actual humans, modifying the strangely upright meerkat-like idle stance, quickening the pace of the running animation so it aligns with about the same visual speed as it used to, de-hunching the injured animations so survivors look hurt, not constipated.
OR
- my preference, create new animations tailored to each survivor (using lobby idle animations as a baseline for how they hold themselves), released in waves like the map reworks as time goes on and while using the old animations as a stand-in. i know this probably won't be the attractive option cuz it requires a lot more work, but killers have lobby animations, ingame custom movement, power animations, breakable wall animations, and elaborate mori animations (which look amazing honestly) while survivors get a pre-packacked set of male or female generic animations that don't reflect their character for the same price.
- maybe expand the window of time between the PTB and live so yall can take PTB feedback onboard and substantially update the build before releasing, that way we feel heard the first time.
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DBD isn't scary beyond like the 10 hour mark and there's a good reason survivors aren't called "victims" instead. each side should have a fair shot at completing their objective, not getting destroyed because of ######### hit validation or clunky poorly implemented movement -- neither of which relate to a killer's skill or spook potential.
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i came here to say exactly this, i was open minded and hopeful that maybe it'd feel more natural than it was on the PTB but it's just so clunky. movement itself feels more sluggish like every survivor's on a casual morning jog and the killer chasing behind them with murderous intent is purely incidental, and somehow standing still, now firmly upright, isn't any better.
ever since they mentioned updating survivor animations i looked forward to it. be careful what you wish for i guess 💀
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@TragicSolitude said:
This is actually a nice thread to get necro'd.
Seeing Medusa in there, I'd like to also suggest a Siren or Banshee.
No matter how unrealistic it is, I'm going to mention Laura (creature) from The Evil Within.
Jorōgumo (spider woman)
Hone-Onna (skeleton woman)
a nun (could specifically be the nun from The Nun, or it could be original)
laura from evil within i didn't even consider but she'd be SO cool to see in dbd i swear, tysm for the suggestions!
@kriemhild said:
Bathsheba (The Conjuring, with the Warrens as survivors? She could even hold Annabelle.)
Lisa Trevor (Resident Evil franchise. I've seen plenty of people suggest Mr. X or Nemesis, but never Lisa.)
The Woman in Black (The Woman in Black)
BTW, out of everyone on this list, I want to see Annie Wilkes in the game most of all. Her body count is second to none, and the idea of her is horrifying.
i'm not big into resident evil so i just saw lisa trevor for the first time via google images, her whole leatherface aesthetic is just 👌
@Uistreel said:
Wasn't the twins just released?
yup, this thread's from september. back then we hadn't gotten a woman killer since the plague, but the point of the thread stands based on the math alone. if we include victor and count each legion member separately, there are a total of 17 male killers and only 9 female killers.
thank you all for adding to the list! 💕 i'll try to keep this updated if anyone else has suggestions
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snow hag, hag of the snow. 👍 swamp hag will finally have a friend she can eat ppl with. i approve.
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between that challenge + the dropping pallets while being chased there have rarely been many pallets on the map by the time the killer gives me attention, too. 💀 feels like there should really only be one pallet-centric challenge per level if that.
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@Hlidskialf said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1704270#Comment_1704270
Dude, i literally lost hours of grind because of this. I don't consider this "free skins" because you need to play a bunch to get one of them. And its not about getting refund to buy more skins, is getting a refund to buy the same skins for the discounted prices and keep all my hours grind still.
If you can't play the same amount you can get with real money but this is not the point of the thread.
And yeah, if they don't refund ill just quit because i don't want to support/play a game with bad devs. already did this in the past with other games.
if you're only playing dbd to get iri shards to eventually purchase cosmetics i think quitting is a great idea, it shouldn't feel like a job and iri shards shouldn't feel like necessary payment for doing so. if it's really that tedious, at least take a break for your own sake. i plan to do the same honestly, it's really hard to enjoy a game everyone else is so vocally miserable about all the time.
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1704202#Comment_1704202
It's free of you think your time isn't worth anything. I pity you if that's true.
Also, if these people used their shards after this "sale" they would be able to get another skin plus be even closer to another with the additional login bonus. If they bought 2 skins at full price? The math shows how badly screwed they got.
And again, they were screwed because this was time they put into the game and time is worth something for most people.
i don't count 'time spent playing one of my favorite games' as money, no.
dbd isn't my occupation and if were iri shards wouldn't be my salary. 👀
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if they threaten you or use hate speech you can report via ingame, record chat, and send in a support ticket with their info. JUST reporting doesn't seem to do it, but honestly that's my method of coping at this point. i'm really really sick of how disgusting this community can be, and people like that shouldn't get to be here trying to ruin everyone's day.
i think it's good to stay sensitive to it, though. when you stop caring and just expect that from everyone, they kinda win, they've changed you.
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@Hlidskialf said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1704202#Comment_1704202
No, i'm not mad.
The whole point is: I bought 2 skins for 21k each and one day later they are 9k each. So i want a refund not only for me but everybody who bought for 21k. This has nothing with the free Iridescent and Bloodpoints.
Also iridescent shards are free currency but is earned by playing the game. If you lost hundreds of hours you would be requesting the same thing.
Just try to put yourself in the other people shoes before trashtalking.
Thanks and good luck.
okay but some of us paid actual money so from your position getting 3 free skins sounds like a pretty amazing deal, i'd love to be in your shoes. i assume you thought about the hours you'd put into the game earning those shards before purchasing either of the halloween skins initially? you must've thought they were worth it at the time, right? and now because you aren't getting 5 free skins instead of 3 you'd be willing to quit DBD, or at least threaten to. surely you understand how that sounds.
i'm really not trying to trashtalk, that's just a pretty strange hill to die on.
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@Yogerman1997 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1704202#Comment_1704202
is free currency, but imagine you are a new player somehow manage to have exactly 21.600K
and this halloween he says... well... atleast i can buy one, just to the next day he get slaped in the face with that discount, he will be able to have 2 skins and still extra shards to buy 1 part from another, but because they dont want to give us the price difference he can't.
also, the difference between both prices is very big, even if we have slighty more shards to still can buy 2-3 skins don't change the fact that hurt, a lot of hours farming them throwed to the trash...
is not fair.
i know it feels kinda ######### and people wish they knew in advance, but in that scenario you're still getting two skins free of charge. it feels really entitled to demand refunds on free products that actually took time and effort and money on BHVR's end to develop.
ik it's cool to bash BHVR whenever they do anything, but this time they actually listened to our complaints that none of the halloween outfits could be earned thru the event and they're still being dragged through the mud because it's just never enough for some ppl.
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wait so you used free currency to buy two full halloween outfits and now you're mad they're giving you enough shards for a third halloween outfit you also don't have to pay for? and you want a refund.. on your free currency.. so you can get more outfits for free? 👁🗨👄👁🗨
i paid $10 for the yui outfit before i knew, but now i can get the feng outfit for free. that's.. not something to complain about.
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closing thoughts
yall can keep throwing me essays on how much you don't mind queer characters and then listing the reasons including us is a bad idea, but i'm finished responding to individual posts here. if you wanna keep the topic alive go for it, hopefully the devs will see it. thanks to the couple of you who are genuinely unbothered about representation; that's exactly the reaction this should warrant.
if it'd been in the game from the beginning it wouldn't seem like a big deal at all, because ultimately it isn't. it's a reflection of real life in fiction and it adds flavor, that can be it for most people. if it also happened to help this community unlearn some ######### biases that'd just be icing.
✨ representation IS still happening until the devs say otherwise. i suggest you all get right with that. ✨
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i'm really grateful they're doing this, hopefully now people can try their best to enjoy the event for what it is rather than being upset it's a flagrant cashgrab with no redeeming qualities. thank you devs!
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@Terro said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1701920#Comment_1701920
All the characters are whatever you want them to be. U don't need a company to define things for u.
you're absolutely right i don't need them to, i want them to! like representation, nuance is very important. 👻
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- LGBTQ+ representation 🌈🌈🌈
- ... and hair reworks for nea she has so many unintentional baldspots and janky polygons that it's almost funny.
- oh and masks designed to look like the killers each survivor was released with, that'd be cute.
- better, more interesting dailies that reward rift fragments / iri shards.
- as @KingFrost mentioned, more women killers. the last we got was plague about a century ago.
- substantive events that give both the killer and the survivors a secondary objective to keep it balanced.
- unique survivor animations that set them apart from the rest INGAME, not just unique idle animations in the lobby.
goth girl survivor i beg
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@Rex3 said:
You honestly think adding diversity will stop toxic behavior? Are you knew to the internet?
nope! but the thing about communities that allow bigots to thrive is.. they're full of them. i fully expect 'heated gamer moments' regardless of the quality of representation because at this point expecting better from ALL gamers is just too much to ask, although much fewer if the devs keep to their word. the most intolerant among the community will be so outraged there are now LGBTQ+ characters in their video game that they stop supporting it and leave; good riddance to smelly trash.
@ABannedCat said:
The developers wont even bother to include colourblind people. And you expect these people to include LGBT?
Dont be ridiculous.
they've already said they would include us, please read the tweet i attached instead of commenting like all i posted was the title.
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@ChrispyIce said:
Ah yes I don't see anything that could go wrong if a straight white character would kill a LGBTQ+ character in multible horrific ways.
No one would have a Problem with that, not at all.
this is the argument against any sort of inclusion at all, why have black survivors if white killers can target them specifically? ah #########, they're already ingame. what about fat characters? wait, jane exists. damn. oh and there are tons of women, what can be done about the inherent misogyny of killing them? you're just forgetting one massive detail.. we're in the entity's realm where 'death is not an escape', it's simply losing a match. it's not a hatecrime that permanently strips a character from the very fiber of the game -- they come right back in another trial.
yall are reaching for anything to avoid representation the devs have already said is coming. 'get over it', as one reply generously put it. 🙄
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@xdshaunted said:
I'd rather have greater race representation than sexuality representation. In fact I don't want to associate sexuality with characters that are going to get sacrificed to the entity.
why do you feel like it's one or the other? i'm not asking specifically for white LGBTQ+ characters.
@Manky said:
While LGBTQ+ representation is important in the real world, this is just a horror game. The characters have very fun lores right now and changing them would have a negative overall impact on the game in my opinion. If behavior were to add new characters with an LGBTQ+ background it would be nice, but also not important. Of all the issues in the game right now, I don't think a made up character's sexuality really matters. They don't really have relationships of any sexual orientation anyways. So yeah, it is just a game, not real life. Their sexuality literally means nothing. And to be honest, why do we need to know their sexuality? We play as them to run from a killer or use them to kill other people. Their sexuality has absolutely no impact on the game what so ever. Adding sexuality to the game can and probably will happen, but it really isn't a pressing matter.
i don't have time to teach you why LGBTQ+ representation in media is important so i'll just say this: i've been called so many slurs in endchat just because the other side didn't enjoy how i played. DBD, specifically, especially, needs representation to normalize diverse experiences because so much of this community is so toxic and gross and ignorant and that culture thrives when there's nothing to oppose it. the devs know that and the sooner they follow up on their own commitment to represent us the better for everyone.
i'm also unsure why you think adding gay people would detract from 'very fun lores' rather than enhance it; diversity is fascinating.