wydyadoit
wydyadoit
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@Xendritch said:
Community: So what does the new killer do?
BHVR: Well they have these drones that scan an area and you can become stealthy inside them and after a while survivors become exposed if they're in range of the drone too long but then if they try to disarm them they get tagged and you get to know where they are wherever you want so you can be guarding area and chasing down survivors constantly as long as you setup correctly. Oh and then they have these add-ons they basically customize the drone letting you decide if you wanna focus on gen defense or chase more giving the killer multiple playstyles.
Community: BOOOOO! BAD! DELETE! WORST KILLER EVER! BOYCOTT DBD! Well what do these killers over here do?
BHVR: Wesker and Blight?
Community: Yeah
BHVR: They move fast?
Community: What else?
BHVR: No that's it they move fast. I mean Wesker has an infection meter but that's so easy to get rid of you won't notice it much so yeah mostly just moving fast.
Community:
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/35/13/59/3513597b68d1f2b3b732330d79b47a20.gif
what does hillbilly do? moves fast.
what does cannibal do? moves fast.
what does spirit do? moves fast.
what does nurse do? moves fast.
what does wraith do? moves fast.
what does pig do? moves fast.
what does hag do? moves fast.
what does nightmare do? makes people sleepy.
eww no. and he moves fast.
oh okay 👌🏻what does oni do? moves fast.
what does legion do? moves fast
what does dredge do? moves fast
what does clown do? makes survivors slow.
... you mean fast right? uhh... sure. checks notes
good. what does trapper do?
you know what i think i see where this is going...
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@RainehDaze said:
Yeah, I have no clue. I've seen it a bunch too; 4k, no DC, no moris or bleed outs... Ruthless.
😭guess i have to keep trying to get my adepts.
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@Mooks said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3348801#Comment_3348801
me personally?
yea absolutely. Until Dawn with Sam as survivor especially.
not the biggest fan of the Quarry. And my fav character (Eliza) doesn’t have a chance into DbD anyways, but I would still like a Quarry chapter!
i would like to see the girl that dies in the start and the one that turns into the windigo be added at the very least, but there are a lot of cool "horror cliche tropes" in until dawn's roster. and maybe an alternative skin for their brother for each.
i haven't played the quarry yet. but it seemed similar.
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@Phasmamain said:
Hooks are now irrelevant for end game performance. 4k is now a merciless and 3k is ruthless
@Snowflake_Syndrome said:
Merciless now is just a 4k. Can't have any DC's, or kills though. They need to be sacrificed as far as I know.
then can someone tell me what happened here? i got ruthless instead of merciless.
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@Mooks said:
Until Dawn being PS exclusive might make it less likely? But in general, both should be possible as they are both clearly horror genre and that’s pretty much the main requisite for licenses to be added.
of course the devs would need to want the license in their game, and need to negotiate with the license owners (and possibly with the actors of the characters) and find an agreement..
Would you want it?
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@Basement_Bubba420 said:
Accounts that have such a ban have already been caught cheating in another game. Therefore, we know that the user has cheated in multiplayer games before to such a degree that they caught and banned for it.
Riot Games who develops LoL and Valorant estimates that only 9% of caught cheaters actually reform and stop cheating. Additionally, they estimate that it takes on average 5.1 bans before a player uninstalls the games. For the overwhelming majority of cheaters, once a cheater always a cheater. Additionally, Riot once unbanned a bunch of cheaters in hopes they would reform. Within a few months, 80% of these people were banned again.
In my own experience, just about every time I've encountered blatant cheating in DbD (flying, firework spamming, uber flashlight, spawning bots, insta gens/gates, speed hack, perma exposed, etc..) it's been from an account with at least one VAC ban. The other times it's either some other platform or they just don't have a ban.
I would think that such users are a liability to the game and it's community. Maybe its better to deny such accounts access to the game entirely. I am aware that some users do reform and stop cheating but I think these users are in the minority. If they want to play the game they can create a new account. Also, users with VAC bans are a minority within the overall community but likely present a very disproportional amount of problems.
What do you think?
Nope. Steam has determined the account was used for cheating. If anything the account should be disabled from steam multiplayer.
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oh look a parade. Better start my rain dance.
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@SolarNight said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3348389#Comment_3348389
Only by leveling up? That's crazy for a paid game. I'm waiting for a sale so maybe
gamepass typically always has sells for it. And recently there was a valentines day sell. The game itself isn’t a “true” paid game. I know it might seem weird, but it’s a game as a service kinda game. Like sea of thieves, rainbow six siege, for honor, battlefield 2042, chivalry 2, hunt showdown, resident evil resistance, elder scrolls online, fallout 76, etc.
basically you get the base game. Then you can grind to earn the dlc that isn’t licensed or you can pay for it which helps to keep the servers alive and makes the company enough money to run a skeleton crew to keep making content and updates. And by grinding you provide a crucial member of the online community so that matchmaking isn’t dead.
you’ll never be able to earn the licensed dlc through shards and most of it is better quality (more thematic/ more fun) than the ones that can be earned - with a few notable exceptions. So honestly I’d recommend just buying those characters.
If you want an example of a good online game that did the expansion dlc, but for whatever reason died on release look mo further than “back for blood”. The game is actually really well made in my opinion, but for whatever reason it just died outright. So 🤷🏻♂️
for whatever reason this is what keeps a game alive. Dead by daylight has been around since 2017. Back for blood released 2 years ago. I can find more dbd matches faster. B4b’s servers are dead.
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@Brokenbones said:
Heyo, I wanted to make a thread on this topic because after the Eruption fiasco the Dead Hard discourse has already begun to flare up again.
As somebody who's not really cared too much for new DH since it's rework, I wanted to try to come to an understanding about what issues people have with the new version and what bothers them the most about it.
For me personally - The only issues I've encountered with new DH while playing Killer are:
- Sometimes playing pallets is a lose/lose if the survivor has good timing
- The 'wait game' has only gotten worse compared to how it was pre-rework. I still think New DH is weaker than old DH but the fact that the perk is still pretty rewarding when it goes off leads to a lot of waiting.
- This also means that even if a survivor doesn't have it, they can pretend like they do to waste a bit more of the Killers time in chase. If you play survivor but don't use DH, try it - do the thing where you turn toward the killer when they are within lunge range and see how many times they actually wait.
That's it for me, what are your problems?
It shouldn’t be an endurance and exhaustion perk in my opinion. It should be a consumable perk like deliverancr/decisive strike.
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@SolarNight said:
I'm trying to buy some characters right now but the grind for iridescent shards is taking SO LONG. How do I make it faster?
You get them by leveling your account and occasionally by participating in events.
if you want it faster just buy it.
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@Laluzi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347854#Comment_3347854
Speak for yourself. I play killer to play tag on the internet. I'd like to hope more people are here for the gameplay than to grief randos, at least.
sure. but i play for bloodpoints and challenges. if i get a chance to farm some unfortunate players i take it. every chance except working with survivors. if a survivor tries to assist me i kill them first.
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@Laluzi said:
I hate it. Destroys any chance of a fair game and usually just guilts me into taking it easy on everyone else.
I don't have an issue with people who dip out because something IRL came up, but let's be real, that's not usually the case.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3346635#Comment_3346635
I mean, sure, but that's just being a dick for no reason.
Pretty much the epitome of playing killer.
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@Wexton said:
Yeah they're really cool but they're expensive too, 15 bucks when I can buy a whole new character for 5 seems like a ripoff to me.
Exactly my thoughts. But if the redfields had been separate dlc characters with another killer or even just carlos and sheva in a 4 survivor pack then you’d bet i’d have forked over $20 for it. Skins are a hard sell for me.
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@crogers271 said:
I probably can't elaborate much beyond the articles, but I'll try.
Many early psychological studies have come under attack for not being able to be replicated. These studies did not have the general checks you would have against observer bias. Basically, the study author saw what he wanted to see and helped make what he wanted. In Stanford you see the person doing the study also participating as one of the roles, which completely throws out the ability to do a neutral evaluation.
Not to mention many of the studies are so small that they could just be a false positive (i.e. coincidence). And in some cases (covered in the Vox article) the authors hid data that would contradict their theory.
With the Stanford case you see some of the participants say they were behaving that way because they thought they were more playing a role (wikipedia even has a note about the guards being instructed to be more brutal). They were meeting the expectations set for them. If they all just sat around and did nothing then their professor would be disappointed and they'd all be bored.
It's not that everything about the study is fake, I'm sure the prisoners experienced actual levels of distress, but the finding that if take a person and lock them up they become deeply unhappy isn't actually shocking.
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I think there is a lot about DbD that is interesting from a psychological perspective.
The Us vs Them nature of the Survivors/Killer divide.
The fact that many of us talk about it as if our game experiences (killer dominant, survivor dominant, prominence of certain behaviors, etc.) is the standard for everyone and when confronted with the fact that others are having different experiences the reaction is disbelief and anger (kind of like egocentrism).
What circumstances cause a killer to give mercy.
What causes players to just give up.
That the game provides things that are clearly superior (Iri addons), but that frequently these aren't taken to be more fair.
That players can use offerings to either give themselves an advantage or more blood points. Frequently it is blood points. Is this for fairness purposes, or greed?
That the prior two statements seem to go out the window with an SWF.
The thing I find most interesting is how frequently survivors will risk going back for someone stranded on a hook. The game says you aren't a team. The BP reward is minimal and the risk is relatively high. Yet even with the door open it's pretty common to see survivors in a soloQ all work together to rescue their remaining 'teammate' (some form of impromptu altruism? De Toqueville's view on inherent group formations? Straightforward Empathy? The desire to "beat" the killer?).
Ahhhh.
gotcha. So basically it was data that wasn’t properly recorded and modeled in terms of modern experiment design.
i think one thing to also account for is how humans behave is based on cultural influences as well. And with the example given it would also be fair to say that the study group of a bygone era is very different from a modern control group and experimental group. Some people may even be trying to influence the current data to oppose the previous outcome to prove a point - though that gets into conspiracy theory territory.
Human experiments are very taboo now. So I would argue that the truth is buried in the past and we should still use it as a stepping stone if for nothing else the argument that continued research will always benefit the long term as the world is forever changing.
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@Mr_K said:
Are you saying this is one big BHVR experiment?
lol. Sometimes it feels that way. The entity has always seemed to represent game development in an artistic expression sort of sense.
a ton of psychological observations go into game development these days. That’s how loot mechanics for example are developed.
then there are the survivors and killers. While seemingly arbitrary and above all the roles make common sense for gameplay elements - the choices initially presented in the original game model were notoriously open ended and allowed for better freedom of expression and execution it felt. Which in a lot of ways could have been preserved as data in regards to human behavior.
i mean the company is called “BEHAVIOR” after all.
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If a player dc’s i farm the other three for 10k points in each category and each emblem. And if my challenge hasn’t already failed because of the rage quitter then i do as much as i can of it and achievements.
If the other players want to leave they can either imitate their compadre or they can escape the normal ways while I’m busy farming. The whole reason to play killer is for the advantage the role is supposed to get when grinding blood points.
it’s not like I’m going to feel bad for strangers on the enemy side when a survivor rage quits or someone leaves for personal reasons for more than a fleeting moment. I have things to do myself. But I committed to a potentially 15 minute session as the killer. Blame the rage quitter.
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@LordSturm said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3344198#Comment_3344198
to punish them for what lmfao, do you think they're a hive mind?
it is possible to punish without identifying a reason for the punishment.
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@philward1953 said:
I'm just curious, are there any DBD-specific issues that are preventing voice comms from entering the game?
I know the common thing people bring up is the heightened chance for toxicity, but that isn't a DBD specific issue, and its one that does have solutions such as muting.
If you ask me, that's not a good reason to not give people the option to use voice comms.
I'm not strictly an advocator for voice comms, but due to the recent increase in the devs trying to merge Solo-Q and SWF survivor groups, I figure this is a question worth posing.
Edit: I'm reading some great responses, but I'd like to ask two questions...
1.) A lot of reasons for not having voice chat that I'm seeing have some weight to them, but I've gotta ask why other casual games have voice chat and DBD specifically couldn't. One comment has mentioned how most matches aren't competitive, and I do agree, but I feel like some simple instructions to other players has the potential to really increase efficiency in regard to survivors. I think everyone has encountered a match where they could have easily escaped if they had just a little bit more communication with others. Just a LITTLE bit more specificity.
2.) What else could bridge the gap between Solo-Q and SWF more or equally? That's what this is all about, and I don't think things like the Survivor Action Icons have closed the gap as much as people think. They've helped alot, but if you ask me, Solo-Q survivors should basically know EVERYTHING about their teammates (such as their perk-loadouts, items and their addons, etc.), and should be able to communicate more (maybe with more hand gestures like the pointing and calling that we already have).
the simplest explanation is: the game was never supposed to have it. mechanically and thematically the game was never supposed to allow players to communicate.
as far as coding and implementation of a voice chat system... nothing is stopping them.
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@FizzyWizze said:
In an ideal game, your Scourge Hooks are evenly distributed around the map making them accessible for you to use. Maybe not always accessible, sometimes the downed Survivor is just out of reach of one or another Survivor is currently on that hook. Regardless of those two instances, which is sometimes inevitable, you still have the chance to use your Scourge's many times throughout the match. That's the ideal game, which doesn't happen all that often unfortunately. RNG plays a huge factor in where the Scourge's end up, and a lot of times RNG completely screws the killer over. Maybe one hook spawned on one side of the map, and the other three ended up on the other right next to one another. Or all four spawned in one area of the map and 90% of the time your downs are on the opposite side. Needless to say, RNG can either really bless you with some fantastic spawns or just making the perk(s) almost pointless to equip with how little you get use out of them. Will we ever see an update to make Scourge's almost not be completely RNG reliant when it comes to where they spawn? I think a little RNG is fine but I don't think the entire Scourge Hook system shouldn't be 100% reliant on it.
i think basement hooks should always be scourge hooks. and then you just play a basement build. 🤷🏻♂️
monstrous shrine is the perfect scourge hook example imo.
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@DyingWish92 said:
Was trying out Stalki bois Halloween 2018 lore build with Michael. No slow down in the build. Kinda of a gimmicky stealth build. Sloppy, Face The Darkness, Fearmonger, Hysteria. I played 3 games and every game was less then 7 minutes with one game 4 minutes and 47 seconds all 4 survivors out the gate. Really sad state this game is in. You can't do anything fun with killer, gotta bring slow down or else. 2-3 hooks, 5 gens done, try and face camp at the end to get a kill. Nerf all slow downs though. Here comes the "I'm not applying pressure" and "I'm playing a D tier killer with no slow down" comments. I still don't think games ending this fast is acceptable no matter what killer and build you use. Back to Corrupt, Deadlock, chase perk, additional slow down just to have a fair game. BORING.
if you're not stopping the generator progression through your perks you have to be doing it through your actions. after all - gens are a main goal for survivors. and it only take 90 seconds to solo a gen unassisted by perks.
90x4+40+20= 2.5 minutes for a game with an afk killer.
so dont be afk.
(though i agree that gens are too quick to complete.)
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@HamsterEnjoyer said:
Title. Blight is literally F tier on console since he can't counter survivors spinning him at all and he needs console specific adjustments to make him playable
this makes me want to try blight just to see if he gives me issues. 🤦🏻♂️
but i was saving up for plague!
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@Volcz said:
By that I mean, the individual. I'm talking about the people who only or majority of the time, only play this game if they are in an SWF. My friend and I got into a discussion bout this today; I only solo que (I've tried SWF once, the full voice comm experience, calling stuff out, etc - its such a downgrade).
I personally think SWF players, the people who rely on voice comms, knowing their teammates, etc are not all bad but a lot of them are and their egos are inflated.
My friend thinks the way SWF is should just be the norm in the game, ie voice comms and call outs, etc. He does agree a lot of SWFs are cocky and have their egos raised.
Curious, what do you guys think about SWF players? Do you judge them? Do you think twice about them? Sweat when you see them, punish them, or just a normal game (per say)?
until they add a killer judge with a gavel... unfortunately no. but punisher could also become a killer. just saying.
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@DemonDaddy said:
Huntress looks like she is going through an adolescent phase and needs to grow into her swimsuit. Was there a reason for not changing the body?
If i had to guess? different art style.
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@Wowie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345669#Comment_3345669
get owned then nerd
im too expensive. no one can afford to own me. but i appreciate the offer.
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@Mooks said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345450#Comment_3345450
I thought Baba Yaga, Minotaurus and Krampus counted as legendary as they are changing who the characters are?
unfortunately they're not as far as the store is concerned.
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good conversation everyone. i enjoyed reading the insights.
@crogers271 @EntitySpawn @BenOfMilam @CatnipLove @Seraphor @YOURFRIEND
i particularly found the statement about the experiment possibly being a sham interesting. i hope you'd be willing to elaborate. i will check out the articles you've provided.
ben and catnip's posts provided a lot of information on the background of the experiement, but here are my thoughts FRIEND since you asked
guards are killers, observers are community leaders, prisoners are survivors, scientists are developers.
outside of this one matrix there are also other analogies i can make using various perspectives of whom is who. but this is the initial thought sequence.
@Zeidoktor i understand your concern, but i was intentionally snubbing replies from those who did not know and did not care to know. the fact that you bothered to investigate on your own shows you're interested and willing to facilitate discussion even without my interference. so it was intentional. i hope that explains my reasoning. as you can see from the responses there was indeed discussion even without my involvement.
as far as the topic you pulled from the wikipedia - yes. that's the correct one. it's taught in several courses that also cover classical conditioning by pavlov and self actualizatuon by maslow. sometimes freud which is fun. essentially what you said from the wiki is correct.
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@Wowie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345341#Comment_3345341
boring. i like pre-game chats.
only available on pc
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@EntitySpawn said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3344566#Comment_3344566
My mistake, even more mechanics would screw the game over though for both sides imo.
Killer isnt gonna have the spare time to go off and do X in a trail and then survivor doing more objectives other than gens will increase the games where people arent on gen (most survivor games I lose is due to a DC or people not on gens and this would encourage that)
At most you can put in an effect that triggers at X for both sides and pauses both objectives but at that point if killers cant hook and survivor cant do gens what's the point?
Theres no way to add base mechanics without ruining the experience for certain players especially with killers who already have extra mechanics like pinhead and the last thing you want is to nerf killers like that further
nah. hexes are an example of mechanics that were added. so i think it can work
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@Piruluk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345325#Comment_3345325
Before the 6.1 patch, one had to wait 15+ minutes for a survivor game, at evenings.
like i said - there can be a correlation, but that doesn't necessarily signify a causal relationship.
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@Wowie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345333#Comment_3345333
making dbd more like league of legends is the last thing they should do
that goes for any game
i just meant the queue. if you don't know what i mean it works like this:
you create your build, choose your mode, hit search, the matchmaking finds enough players to fill a match, everyone is asked to ready up (in a 10 second countdown), those that don't ready are kicked out. those that do ready are kept in queue. if all players ready the match starts immediately.
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@Heeman said:
Everyone has been wanting a new game mode for awhile myself included, and I feel that this new game mode should be a step away from the heavy competition that is the basic game.
The new game mode which I'ma call it hide and seek (or something better) and this game mode would be featuring 1 killer vs 8 survivors on a large map (example macmillan) and the map would consist of all main structures however there will be no pallets and maybe 3 or 4 windows on the map, it would also be condensed by heavy fog so players can sneak around, moving to gameplay changes I would like to see a timer at the top say 15 minutes and instead of repairing generators survivors could cleanse these large totems that reduce the time by 45 seconds and maybe a total of 5 will spawn, after time runs down to 3 minutes there could be 3 exit gates that will be powered and survivors need to leave otherwise they die when it reaches zero, perhaps add the end game collapse at 3 minutes.
For the killer role I have decided that only certain killers should be allowed to participate otherwise you will have to rework them and the basic killer could be the trapper since he is the easiest to change, anyways the killers need to hunt down each survivor before time runs out and if the killer catches them they should be granted two options of elimination hook the survivor to increase time or just mori them right then and there (hooking instantly kills them), there should be no loadouts allowed either so no perks,items or add-ons can be spawned with but you can of course find items in the map maybe increase chest to 8, definitely remove the toolboxes and increase medkit chances on chest searches.
i don't want a new game mode. i want new mechanics.
but if i did have a new game mode it would be:
barebones mode. no perks. no items or addons. no offerings. just pure skill. and whatever you find in a chest.
oh and no swf.
edit
oh wait. no there's one more.
killer realms mode. so instead of getting an rng based map the killer makes a map inside of certain perameters (think resident evil 3's multiplayer). of course there would be rules that prevent certain abusive features from the killer's end, but every player chooses a killer and builds a map for them. then the player chooses a survivor and makes a kit for them. then that player queues up and get assigned randomly to either killer or survivor. if killer then it's on the map as the killer that player built. if not then it's on someone else's map as the survivor the player chose. i think this would be a fun mode.
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@Rogue_Element said:
I've always been at a loss as to why there is a second lobby at the start of each trial, except of course, to give the killer a grossly unfair advantage. But given the amount of my time that has been selfishly wasted in this lobby, I'm begging you to do away with it or at least introduce a mechanic that stops time wasters. I can honestly say that I can't even hazard a guess at how much of mine and other players time has been wasted by someone not bothering to click to ready up in the second lobby. Players who literally wait for the clock to time out instead of pressing to start the match. This happens EVERY damn game. Guaranteed I'll get pulled into that second lobby and be kept waiting a full minute for one other player. Then sometimes we get a killer up and leave before the timer runs out, so the whole lot of us have to wait in the lobby for another killer to match up - and then the timer starts AGAIN! This happened three times in a lobby I was pulled into recently, I ended up following another player's lead and quit it. If you did away with the second lobby and just pulled everyone straight into a game, you wouldn't give these time wasters (who are probably checking their phones instead of readying up) the opportunity to waste everyone else's time. This is a huge issue and I'm not exaggerating when I say it happens EVERY game, it really does. Please get this sorted, because never in all my years as a gamer have I ever rage quit a lobby... Until DBD!
i dont care what your wall of text says.
i agree that the ready up lobby should be removed. once all players are found the game should do a ready check then shove all the players into a trial. failed ready checks kick you out of the queue and put you on a timer.
just like league of legends.
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@Piruluk said:
Switched to be killer main and the only time killers have bonus incentives are evenings and night, I would hate to think how would queues look after even more killer buffs.
Simply put I don't think it's worth to play if there isnt +100% bp bonus, now add to the fact when too many killers playing the MMR is turned off and you will get the first four survivor in the line, which will either result destroying them easily or you will be destroyed by them, the games are extremely unbalanced when MMR isnt working.
Now in the past few days, the killer bonus would only come play after 20:00, and if you have job you can't really afford to play too long into night, even if you are free isnt worth messing up sleeping schedule.
I tried to look on days when I have no work, but then there is only survivor queue bonus from early morning to evening, 6:00-19/20:00
The point is the role already very popular, and for most part the only time people playing survivor when they can do it with friends, because ultimately if you are playing to win and you are solo then killer is the only choice in dbd.
i would argue that it's flawed to assume balance is based on play rate. or that there's a causation factor there. there might be a correlation factor, but causation is almost impossible to determine based on play rate and location
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@HugTechLover said:
I think for some it definitely can.
isnt it fascinating?
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345307#Comment_3345307
I didn't fail to, I just didn't have anything to say.
Still terrible design, tbh. Blurring is another 'completely pointless and just kind of annoying' mechanic, but slower movement goes back to the 'easy to have unhookable situations' flaw. Anything that's predicated on 'makes the Survivor harder to hook without reason' is bad. Flip-flop? Pick up immediately. Power struggle? Ditto. Also don't walk through pallets. Boil over and that proposed variation? "Don't down Survivor in a bad area"... which you have no control over because 'bad area' can just be where they held W to. It doesn't reward the Survivor for playing well or punish a mistake on the Killer's end or reward teamwork.
okay. then let me try again...
how about this:
"survivor no longer has to perform skill checks. will gain maximum progression as if the survivor had performed all skill checks."
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345296#Comment_3345296
"Obnoxious and often ineffectual" is not good design. Purely being annoying isn't good design. If anyone ever designs a game and thinks 'something that only really exists to bug other people and irritate them is good!', they should quit game design and go be an accountant or something, because they clearly don't understand the point of video games.
Flavour is not important. If all something does is vacillate between being annoying and being uncounterable except by slugging (and slugging being something that is supposedly discouraged, not to mention just punitive in general on the BP and pipping front), it needs a redesign. It's stupid.
And what it doesn't do is act as a preventative measure against Basement hooking specifically (anyone doing that is probably running agitation and/or iron grasp and will manage that if they really want to, or find some other hook--the people that want to do it are least affected). In The Game and Midwich it just exacerbates the hook RNG, but where it really shows up is, again: second floor of main buildings that don't generate hooks up there. Because what really needed to be prevented was... the Killer hooking people whenever there's an easily accessible main building? Don't think so.
i provided an alternative that addresses your concerns. you failed to comment on it.
edit
also - i forgot to say this.
if you truly feel that way then maybe asymmetrical games line dead by daylight aren't for you 🤷🏻♂️
this entire game is designed to be a griefing simulator. from start to finish your job as a killer is to grief people trying to grind for upgrades. you technically lose nothing as a killer when you finish a match, but survivors can technically spend 20 minutes trapped in a match for no gain.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345270#Comment_3345270
It's been used, but it's never been considered good gameplay. It's generally been the opposite.
I mean, you can summarise my points as:
- If you don't know how to counter it (or can't, and that definitely seems to be harder for controller players--it comes up a lot), it's obnoxious, especially with how hooks tend to cluster around oddly-shaped objects, and how many maps have doors.
- If you know can counter it, it's not only ineffective to outright beneficial, it's still annoying in one of those 'force a silly pointless view wobble' ways.
- There are a number of maps where you can be effectively unhookable if you go down in the main building and not too close to the edge. Not only is this terrible design for one perk, at least two of them happen to be single-map realms, so it's easy to guarantee if that's your plan.
And this isn't even counting sabo play on top of it all. Or the aura hiding, because I tend to forget that's even there.
it is meant to be obnoxious. the whole point of the perk is:
obnoxious movement that forces camera and walking abnormalities - this is base kit, but enhanced.
aura blinding - this increases the duration of the interaction
forced use of stairs - this prevents the killer from traversing large distances and ensures the killer can't guarantee basement hooks or drops to lower levels like the saw map.
this ensures extended interaction with the obnoxious movement to annoy the killer. it's meant to be annoying. that's the whole point. that's why it's called boil over and is the "southern belle's" perk with a bucking bronco as the icon.
again i'll reiterate that i like the current version. it's thematic and purposeful.
but to show that i'm not a terrible sport i'll give you an alternative version:
current version
my new version
edit
think ela's grzmot mine effect. but every time the survivor gets a skill check.
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@DredgeyEdgey said:
At the end of the new teaser there is definitely something being charged if you ever played fallout it sounds a bit like a guass rifle
umm...
it's clearly a grinder.
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@Crowman said:
Until killers don't have to worry about losing 3 gens in the first chase alone, I don't see a reason to nerf 3 gen strats.
3 gens in the first chase. 2 in the second. both gates in the 3rd.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345212#Comment_3345212
1) When it can be perfectly countered by M&KB and memorising the perk, it's still terrible for yet another reason (and it doesn't for controller, to add reason #4 to the pile). 'You don't do a stupid look side to side sashay' should not be a perk's success condition (and I REALLY hate doing it).
2) 'better than another skill check or button mashing mechanic' has zilch to do with Killer gameplay. Like, what? How does a perk that makes wiggling more obnoxious have any benefit for gameplay variety?
i play exclusively on controller. i wasn't talking about mouse and keyboard. call it a "stupid side to side sashay" if you want, but i like the mechanic - as a killer main and as a controller player. opinion that may be, but then again that's what this post is about. opinions. i was sharing mine as well as providing helpful advice for overcoming the perk's current design - in case you were unaware. after all i don't know how skilled you may or may not be. at 2000 posts you're a frequent poster, but technically my account on here is older so 🤷🏻♂️.
the killer mechanic was already addressed by the above statement. the survivor mechanic is what I was addressing by commenting on the skill check and button mash system. however, if you want i can address it as a killer condition and gameplay element to suit your fancy. that doesn't change the fact that the perk is technically a dual animation perk meaning it affects bother survivor and killer at the same time,
i can empathize with you for your dislike of the forced walk mechanic, but this is actually a mechanic that has been used in older games.
if we're to refer to killer gameplay exclusively then i would still rather have the stumble walk than the insertion of a forced skill check where the survivor causes the killer to have to press skill checks based on the success of the survivor's skill checks. because that would require that i remap my controls since killer and survivor controls are different on my settings. likewise - i do not want to have to be spamming a button when i have only 2 thumb and walking alone takes up both of them to control the camera and the movement.
this is why i'd rather the mechanic be survivor based and the killer element be related to an action already being performed - walking and turning.
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@Yoshirama said:
What I want is the person who has the box is not affected by the chains
what i want is that whoever solves the box becomes the obsession. and whoever is the obsession is the one the chains go after.
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@RainehDaze said:
90% of the time: makes you walk into a rock at best, because your character being literally uncontrollable has always been considered a hallmark of good design or planning (this is sarcastic, in case you missed it); 10% of the time: person gets to second floor, where even if you didn't have to contend with your new wall obsession it would be barely possible (if at all) to get to a hook because you must take the stairs that triple the distance.
Also, guess we can add Borgo to "places with a central main building that can be run to from almost anywhere before you get hit twice and is safe to go down in".
I don't think I've ever seen anyone claim it's a well-designed or balanced perk (in any regard), but at the same time, I also don't think I've ever seen a suggestion for what it should actually do that isn't some facet of its current 'be annoying'. So, anyone got any ideas?
Struggle-buffing perks in general are kind of a terrible idea, for one, and at least flip-flop + power struggle can be played around. Boil Over only has... encourage slugging. Er, not great.
the way you counter it is to turn 45 degrees roughly in the direction you're forced to walk and continue walking a straight path. if you're familiar enough with the randomness you can beat it out by doing this.
it also works against the standard wiggle movement jerking.
if you're good enough you can actually speed up your ability to get to a hook faster.
the only thing that i struggle with in regards to boil over is the drop height struggle meter gain. because sometimes i get greedy and want to put a survivor in the basement, but sometimes there's a small drop that occurs and the survivor breaks free.
i don't mind the mechanic personally. it's better in my opinion than another skill check or button mashing mechanic.
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@BlueHorkew said:
So, can plunderer give a speed boost to opening chest's like 100% speed or something ridiculous like that.
i don't want the perk to be meta or good.
But i would like to have a perk to get the chest challenges in archives faster.
Because that's what the perk is used for anyway.
Don't make it work with Nemesis and Wesker chests, again i just want to finish the chest archives faster and play the game.
i think keys should instantly unlock chests.
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@BenOfMilam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345136#Comment_3345136
I just click the π symbol on the calculator 💀
and you call yourself a true non-euclidian. as i would expect from a stawman tactics user. lol.
real balance lies between the realities of negative infinity and positive infinity. or in other words. the all mighty "0"
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@BenOfMilam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345126#Comment_3345126
ok you got me, I don't know enough maths to keep this joke running lol
i bet you only use pi to the 2nd decimal point 🤣
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@BenOfMilam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3345067#Comment_3345067
I would expect as much coming from a side main.
Bringing up rays and angles is just whataboutism
you can't just see the world in only line segments.
but fine i'll level with you. how many units in radians when nearing infinity before a linear angle becomes a curve?
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here's me having fun getting adept artist even though i never play her.
https://clips.twitch.tv/SparklyHotGnatDAESuppy-dkL4bzCvVuFicB2a
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@BlueHorkew said:
So, what if you replace the endurance effect of DH by iframes.
This would change some interactions for the perk for both sides:
- Can be used in deep wound so counters tunneling and doesn't get countered by 2 killers that inflict deep wound
- No longer counts as an hit, this can help survivor or killer depending on the situation (STBF, NOED, mettle of man, WGLF)
- No speed boost and killer is put in a miss attack cooldown, this just means the perk gives way less distance if the survivor times it right
Basically the goal is to make it like the old DH, but can't be used for distance, getting to pallets or windows.
Just now thinking, i guess this would mean you could use it to dodge slingers gun and traps from trapper with this change.
Idk, i am just trying to suggest simple changes that could be easier to implement while keeping the spirit of the perk.
Just say what you think
i think deadhard should work like this:
you equip the perk
you play the game
you choose to deadhard which activates the shoulder dodge animation and one of two things happen
A. you get hit, you become broken, you become injured if not already, you gain the speed boost, you scream, you bleed, you do not go down, you cause the killer to do the wipe animation as normal, the perk disables, and you can no longer use it during the trial, you are not exhausted, the broken status is removed after a couple of minutes.
B. you do the animation, the killer doesn't hit you, the perk resets and you can do it again after the animation completes.
tell me why it shouldn't work this way?
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@BenOfMilam said:
Is it just me, or do the devs only care about objects with finite and determinable sides? Every patch, it's shapes with clear delineation of left and right, while shapes without an easily determined left and right are COMPLETELY ignored. It's blatant favoritism, and I think we all know it.
Where are the spheres and non-Euclidian geometric shapes? It's complete BS, but the devs are too busy catering to the needs of the Euclidean player base. They are side sided, and they don't even try to hide it.
i disagree. theoretically speaking circles and spheres are infinitely sided to the point that their sides are indiscernible in terms of surface from one another. so in this regard by not choosing to include circles and spheres they're limiting themselves to a select number of sides.
this is clearly an effort to balance sides and angles.
what we really should be concerned about is the lack of rays to sides. there is clearly an inbalance to the amount of open geometric faces as everything is clearly a closed shape.
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@Filipino1490 said:
the only time when nemesis says stars is when performing a mori and finding them in a locker. So what if he could say it for example when he starts a chase, hits or hooks a star member to have more of an interaction.
or what if he could press the d-pad and emote it.