jedimaster505
jedimaster505
About
- Username
- jedimaster505
- Joined
- Visits
- 0
- Last Active
- —
Comments
-
@Munky said:
Cheating is absolutely out of control right now. I play both sides and while I do get some cheating killers, probably because I play solo and thus not very high MMR (mostly speed bots), the cheating survivors are absolutely rampant in comparison. Sometimes they aren't even subtle and they are still gaslighting you… So yeh, don't ever interact with these ppl, I bet they thrive on it. Just report, send in recording and move on.
I bet BHVR is so swamped in reports right now, (at least I hope that is the reason, because if it isnt, it means that BHVR just doesn't care) that I personally still see steam profiles that I monitor, hacking after multiple months of me reporting them with blatant video evidence. Like they literally still get hackusation comments daily on their profile… Because of this cheaters are absolutely fearless (obviously, since they do it on steam accounts now and not get banned somehow) and often even cheat in swf… They just don't care anymore. It rly is ruining the game for me.
I am also saying this (complaining) from a place of care. I rly want my favo game to be in a healthy state. But right now I just don't feel like BHVR is doing enough to combat it. Especially because killer Q time is so miserable as is, to then get a cheater in your lobby is absolutely infuriating. I sometimes get them multiple matches in a row, as if they are inserting into my lobby, probably on cloudID, cause I alrdy tried changing platforms to dodge them.
Edit :
Update 1: 4th match of the day. Blatant as hell, crouch animation speeding towards the horizon and then "cry more" in endchat… wth is wrong with these ppl, this is a mental illness right? For the life of me I cannot understand what they gain from this, unless its a mental illness…
Update 2: 5th match of the day. Someone instantly escapes before the camera ends panning at the start of the match, so everyone backs out to lobby automatically. No, it wasn't a DC, it was an actual escape.
Killer cheats are just as prevalent, they're just generally harder to detect, because they don't make it obvious. Tons of killers are wallhacking and try to play it off as just aura reading perks. But I catch them frequently because I hide in ways that would be impossible for them to detect me even with their aura perks and add-ons. Funnily enough, several of these killers that I report have actions taken against them by BHVR, which verifies that my judgment is accurate.
-
Healing is stronger when survivors all bring 4 med kits with syringes and healing builds, obviously. But then every other aspect of the team is weakened: no gen speed perks/items, no info perks/items, no exhaustion perks, no keys, no flashlights, etc. Killers will get triggered that a team pulls off multiple insta heals, meanwhile that same "healing meta" team has so many weaknesses to exploit. So it doesn't necessarily make teams stronger to go all-in on healing, it just makes them one-dimensional and strong in one aspect, but weak in all other aspects.
As for why it's considered a "meta", is that a few popular streamers claimed healing is OP and then this mythology gets regurgitated ad nauseum by the comp bros just like the myth that you can't get enough protein from plants gets regurgitated by gym bros. It basically amounts to social media bro-science that the "cool kids" circulate, and if you counter this narrative with logic and facts they all go "no brooo, you're wrong broooo, healing is meta brooo, trust me brooo, 1 v 1 me broooo"
-
Survivor mains are masochists, and killer mains love the power trip as much as if not more than Reddit mods.
-
Singularity is another one of those overpowered killers like Blight that killer mains like to pretend takes a lot of skill to play, when really they're very easy. It's just that the standard for what constitutes "skill" in killer role is so embarrassingly low that even easy to play killers are considered "hard". Hard is a relative term. Hard compared to the other killers…that are also very easy to play. So in an absolute sense, your choice as killer is between very easy killers or extremely easy killers since all of them have incredibly high kill rates that give them more wins than losses by design. The word "hard" does not even belong in the killer roster except for Nurse on your first 20 hours. Singularity is certainly not as bad as Kaneki to face, but he's right up there with the most easy killers to win with in Dead by Daylight. Long story short, the answer is no, because unless the Singularity is much worse than average, the match is inherently unfair.
-
@Imtouchingyouvro said:
In the current state of the game ranks honestly just feel like an indicator of playtime at best. I’m not sure what the need for the change was but back then ranks felt like a mostly sure way to have an idea of how good someone was , when you thought of red ranked players you thought about actually skilled killers and competitive Survivors and that definitely feels like it’s missing now. And there’s honestly no incentive to play the game and actually be a good team playing survivor, the pip system wasn’t perfect but you at least actually had to participate as a part of your team to píp and rank up and that served as a weak but important incentive to actually play the game and be a decent teammate even to your randoms, incentives would be nice, I may have missed something’s , I’m not proofreading this.
Red ranks were mostly meaningless. Just about any player could hit rank 1 if they grinded enough matches. This game is not skill-based. Killers are made to win by design. The survivor player typically needs several times more skill than the killer they are going against to win consistently. Play other competitive PvP games with good balance and this becomes immediately evident.
-
@bnork said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3969794#Comment_3969794
i nerfed nearly every element of his kit. his vault is completely gone, his grab-attack is significantly worse. 3 of his most problematic add-ons got completely reworked. and his pallet break would be a consistent 5 seconds of breathing room. i think thats more then reasonable to suggest one addon he uses every game to be basekit, another niche addon aswell, a range reversion, which is barely a buff and more of a reversion, and a small quality of life change in the form of minimum leap distence being decreased by 2 meters, aswell as a 0.25 second buff to an already naturally higher input fatigue. this weird conclusion you've jumped to is incredibly weird, and you clearly don't understand game design or balance. please dont put words in my mouth again.
it's just way too complicated a solution for no reason. the #1 problem with Kaneki is the Scenario 2 BS in the graphic in that link:
Asking for clarification in terms of yesterday's revelation about Ghoul — BHVR
Slow down his ability to jump over a pallet and smack you immediately and the killer is fixed. it's currently uncounterable if the Kaneki knows what they're doing. Most of the problems with killer balancing in Dead by Daylight are extremely easy to fix and don't require massive reworks, as the survivor simply needs a bit more time to have viable counter play. Kaneki is one of them.
-
@PetTheDoggo said:
But remember, Kaneki is just M1 killer when you are injured…
Totally M1 killer behaviour.lol, sadly it's not just Kaneki. the killer role as a whole has been made massively OP due to the total irrational complaints of killer mains. but hey…it helps sell that licensed DLC
-
its not too fast at all. you're too slow in chases. if players all bring healing builds then you don't have to worry about all the other tools they could bring. the "healing meta" is an imaginary fiction of coping killer mains.
-
the irony when killer mains suggest a killer change, is that they almost always pretend they're being reasonable by nerfing the killer slightly, then asking for several more buffs which would make the killer just as bad if not worse to play against. Kaneki needs 0 buffs whatsoever and only nerfs. He needs a bigger cooldown when he cancels his power and when he leaps over vaults since he both slows the survivor and vaults very quickly and can hit you almost immediately afterwards. also, the first free hit should require him to aim instead of being an aim bot.
you can't greed pallets or he just M1's you. you can't pre drop or he just fast vaults and downs you. you have to stun him like a legion stand off and pray he's too stupid to back up a foot when you drop the pallet. basically, it requires the survivor to have several times more skill than the Kaneki to even stand a chance to prolong the chase. currently a moderately competent kaneki can turn any god loop into a 50/50 where the survivor has to get a stun or will get downed after the first free hit. it's broken BS and needs a heavy nerf with no buffs whatsoever to compensate.
fortunately, in practice most Kaneki players are very bad mechanically at playing the killer since like most Blight players, they main the killer to tunnel for easy 4K wins with minimal effort. the only reason kaneki is not currently as oppressive as Nurse and Blight despite Kaneki requiring far less skill to learn, is that Nurse/Blight players have had thousands of hours to master abusing their mechanics to their full potential. whereas most kaneki players are only semi-aware of how to abuse his broken mechanics so if you're a seasoned survivor you can punish their ignorance when in principal the Kaneki should never lose.
lastly, putting lots of exclamation marks and spamming the same convoluted descriptions in multiple posts does not make those changes a good idea. in general BHVR overthinks killer changes and reworks way too much when all that is needed is a nerf to their speed to make their OP cheese tactics less effective, leaving less room for error for the killer. survivors in general are expected to be God tier loopers just to escape against mediocre average skill killers, which makes no sense in a PvP but not much I can do about it.
-
@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3969284#Comment_3969284
BHVR said multiple times that the game is balanced around a 60% kill rate and 40% escape rate.
Therefore, survivors having a 40% escape rate, means survivors DON’T need major buffs, because they are literally at the target escape rate.
This is an appeal to authority fallacy. Just because the devs think the game should be easier for killers, doesn't mean this actually makes for the most engaging gameplay. To the contrary, a 50% kill/escape rate is the perfect ratio of challenge to reward, which induces the flow state, which is what makes games fun to play in the first place. Players play games to have fun, so making the game braindead easy for one side just leads to unengaging and boring gameplay for killers, and frustrating gameplay for survivors, as well as a rage quit epidemic that has only received band-aid fixes.
-
@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3968949#Comment_3968949
Can we also demand for survivors to post the average kill rate of their Nurse character (official stats), when they say Nurse is super easy to play, and needs to be nerfed???
And in general, if someone says a certain killer has “zero counter play”, they should post their official stats for that killer?
Well, yes, survivors can post the average escape rate when complaining too. But anybody in the loop already knows this ranges from 48% (high MMR 4 stack SWF) to around 40% (solo Q + 2-3 stack SWF). So the survivor role as a whole warrants a huge buff, namely for solo Q, which should be addressed with anti-tunneling/slugging/camping and MMR measures in Stage 2 quality of life update. If any killer's average player-base wide kill rate falls below 50% kill rate as a result of Stage 2 update, then they deserve a buff to bring them in line with the other killers.
Whereas every killer character has a unique average kill rate, survivors only have a single average escape rate. Now, I am not asking for killer mains' personal kill rates. That is irrelevant when it comes to balancing because that specific killer player might just be better or worse than average. I am saying they should post the average kill rate for that character across the entire player base, which gives an objective overview of how deadly that killer is independent of player skill. This will reduce the noisy complaints from below average killer players that don't want to actually learn how to play killer, but just want easy mode at the expense of fair matches for the opponent.
Nurse at high MMR was recently shown to have nearly a 70% kill rate, which is extremely high. Of course, given that she requires a few more hours practice to get decent results with compared to other killers, her kill rate is lower across all MMR, since most killer mains want easy 4Ks out of the box with as little effort as possible. The last time I saw an official breakdown of per-killer kill rates in 2024, her kill rate across all MMR was 55%, which is well above the 50% fair balance target. Now, Nurse is a case of a killer like Ghoul, that is completely broken and needs a serious rework to give her more viable counter play than just running behind a wall and praying she both sucks and doesn't have wall hack perks, but also to have her kill rate be closer to 50% at both low and high MMR. Well-designed killers should be accessible to new players but difficult to master, just like survivor role. It is time to make Dead by Daylight great again.
-
@Coordi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3968949#Comment_3968949
This is an astonishing take; first with unnecessary "Killer mains" generalizations and then a straight sweep into demanding killrates before we listen to feedback? This is unnecessary commentary, let's not go there.
Lets be real here for a second…killer mains on social media as well as this forum are constantly asking for buffs to killer and writing doom posts about how hard killer is to play now. Yes not all, but at least a loud and vocal minority. Meanwhile, the kill rates are through the roof. So yes, to keep discussions objective, the average kill rates for a given killer character should be posted before any killer asks for a buff. If someone shows official data that a killer's kill rate (across the player base, not a personal kill rate) is below 50%, I fully support giving that killer a buff. It just so happens that since the latest official data was released, there are 0 killers on that list.
-
I love looping a killer the whole match and escaping after he humps me on ground for simply being the better player.
Killer mains disingenuously pretending there are "weak", low tier killers in DBD when every single killer has an average kill rate well above 50%. They have moved the goal posts so far that the S tier killer of 2016 is basically the "weakest" killer of today. There should be a new rule where you have to post the average kill rate of your killer character (official stats, Nightlight doesn't count!) before asking for a buff or nerf to survivor to help that killer. That way everyone will see that you just want easy, free wins handed to you by BHVR instead of a fair match.
-
Welcome to the real world, Mr. Anderson.
-
@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3967802#Comment_3967802
Just laying this out there, I didnt mean asymmetrical means power role or whatever else... I meant you dont have a case where both sides have the same stuff. This means when you have a really strong item being introduced, it DOESNT effect both side equally.
Every item in this game is attempting to be balanced around opinions. You'll have ppl claiming something needs a nerf while another person saying the same thing needs a buff. All BHVR can really do is what they HAVE been doing, which is applying tweaks and seeing how it plays out. Thats the best they can do about balancing.
It's not balanced around opinions, it's balanced around kill rates, which the devs have forcibly increased so that killers win more than they lose by design, with some killers having outrageously high kill rates. They don't make blind changes, they heavily buff killers on purpose to sell licensed killer DLC, which is the only reason a PvP so fundamentally broken can survive this long.
-
@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3967793#Comment_3967793
Thats kinda of the deal with asymmetrical games. With CS2, both sides have access to the same stuff. Even if they make a great sniper and a crap shotgun... that might determine META, but its still considered balanced. Same goes for Rocket League. If they made the cars boost twice as much TOMORROW, it affects both teams so its still balanced.
DBD can't really do that. They can tweak perks, killers, maps ect to try to figure out some kind of balance, but there's going to be room for opinion on everything. As for addressing soloQ stuff... they HAVE been doing that. They introduced stuff into the game like the UI changes specifically to aid SoloQ. They saw knock out essentially only effected SoloQ so they changed its effect. Let's not pretend like BHVR hasn't thought of addressing ANY pain points in 9 years.
Okay, DBD is definitely more challenging to balance due to the asymmetrical design, but not impossible. However, killer mains have coopted this "asymmetry" term to mean something completely different than its original meaning. The game was asymmetrical since 2016 even when survivors purportedly had the advantage. Why is that? Because "asymmetrical" always referred to the difference between killer role and survivor role. The 1 to 4 dynamic and the fact that one side's job is to kill, and the other side's job is to escape. That "asymmetry" did not refer to the game being made easy to play for killer, yet now that is how it is being used.
The devs can make the game far better balanced with some basic common sense. They've mainly given survivors band-aid fixes for an arterial bleed. It doesn't matter if survivors have a pretty UI if the kill rates are forcibly increased to well over 50% after the fact. They could just reduce the average kill rates to 50% for the strongest killers like Blight, Nurse, Spirit, Kaneki, etc. If any of the so-called "weak" killers (which according to the latest official data, all have over 50% kill rates, by the way) fall below a 50% kill rate, then give them a little buff to bring them in line with the stronger killers. It's really that easy. But instead the devs have this silly philosophy that killer role ought to be way stronger than survivor role by design. This has led to the go-next epidemic which has simply received more band-aid "fixes", as well as more killer buffs, that fails to address the real elephant in the room: killer role is easy mode.
-
@shiiroo said:
I've seen similar report but it has been declined for some reason even though many people said they are experiencing the same thing.
I don't know about playing Freddy, but the stutter occurs also when playing against him. Pretty much every time he uses snare or explodes his pallets.
This makes playing against him even more miserable than it already is.
Watch any popular DBD streamer for a while, and you'll see they have this stuttering issue too, even with very a very good PC and GPU. BHVR broke something as the issue suddenly appeared around the new year despite no noticeable upgrade to the visual quality.
-
@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3967784#Comment_3967784
Don't those 2 games you mentioned ALSO have a DC penalty? I just looked it upand saw CS2 will give you a 30 minute penalty after the very first DC. I think if anything, THAT might be why you arnt seeing it happen. Unlike DBD which was pretty tame in the punishments for the longest time, CS2 hits DCers hard.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/39CYHB0IKWPW/1000001817.jpg
Yes, there are increasingly long DC penalties for each consecutive DC. But, I am not opposed to having a DC penalty in DBD. I am opposed to the devs solely focusing on punishments like DC and making them more and more severe without addressing the player experience, which in solo Q survivor is quite abysmal. I've gone next in DBD for more often than I "go next" in Rocket League or CS2 and it's because the latter games have far better balancing and a far more accurate MMR system. DBD has too many situations which feel like complete BS for the survivor. Even the net code is designed in killer's favor, such that the worse their connection, the more likely they are to hit you, such that many killers intentionally use VPN to abuse this advantage.
-
Punishing players is like trying to prohibit alcohol. An alcoholic will find alternative ways to access the drug. You have to address the underlying reason for the addiction. Alcoholics are trying to escape emotional pain which is related to the culture in which they live.
So why do players rage quit? They're trying to escape a game that isn't worth the candle. They're effectively committing suicide within the context of the video game. The devs have to address the player experience. You can't just punish survivors more and more severely for quitting the game. They'll just leave for good and the game will die. Or worse, you'll see an increase in the number of cheaters who are retaliating because the game they once loved actively punishes them for playing.
The player experience is largely a matter of game design. Do I see rage quitters in Rocket League, CS2? Absolutely. But the overall percentage of rage quitters there is far, far lower. When I switch to these games, I immediately notice a couple things. The first, is that these games are fairly balanced, unlike DBD. That is, you are rewarded in direct proportion to your skill level. If you invest a lot of time to hone your skills, you will see results and you will win more often until you rank up and face more skillful opponents.
Survivor in Dead by Daylight is the exact opposite, you can practice for thousands of hours, and barely see a difference in the outcome because of how the game is structured to inherently favor killer role. Killer is designed to win by default, so survivor skill expression has been trampled. Meanwhile, you can invest a measly 20 hours into even "weak" killers and dominate survivor teams with thousands of hours experience per member. I know this is true because I've done it. I look at the survivors' profiles after absolutely steamrolling them, and these are seasoned vets I'm demolishing with sloppy mechanical skill as killer, just by abusing low skill cheese tactics like tunneling, camping and slugging. Meanwhile in Solo Q, make one small mistake and the entire match can easily be lost not only for you, but the whole team. So the challenge to reward ratio is very lopsided due to incompetent balancing choices, which is why Solo Q is so commonly described as "miserable" to play.
The second thing I notice about Rocket League and CS2, is that these games have a functional MMR system. Yes there are smurfs and cheaters, that is an issue, but in general, if you play skillfully and win more matches, you rank up and face better opponents. Your MMR is a fairly accurate representation of your skill level in these games. With DBD, this is not the case. In Solo Q, you can play like a pro and still have terrible outcomes because the killer found the 1 weak survivor and tunneled them out quickly, turning the match into a 3v1. Killers with any game sense whatsoever know to save the best survivors for last, turning it essentially into a 1v1 where the killer has 4 times more power by game design. You can be the star player in so many matches yet the outcome is a 4K, and the MMR system says "you suck, we're lowering your MMR".
So two things are needed to restore the player experience. The first is to heavily nerf the entire killer role, namely by making low skill cheese tactics like tunneling, camping and slugging less effective. Every single killer character should get no more than a 50% average kill rate across the entire player base. The game should not be balanced around a small percentile of high MMR 4 stack SWF teams that are essentially cheating using 3rd party apps. There needs to be a middle ground between Solo Q and SWF when it comes to balance, whereas currently the devs balance only around the strongest SWF teams.
Secondly, the MMR needs to measure player skill accurately, particularly when it comes to survivor. Escaping can't be the only metric that measures skill when a killer can easily save the strongest players for last, in which case their chances of escape are abysmal no matter how well they play. This makes solo Q a low MMR trap. As killer, your MMR should only increase if you play skillfully, and goes down if you play poorly. Currently, you can play poorly as killer and still inflate your MMR because you cheesed out a bunch of 4K's with blatantly OP mechanics.
BHVR has the chance to bring back a quality player experience with the upcoming changes that are to address camping, slugging and tunneling and the MMR system. Whether this succeeds or not has yet to be seen. If they do it right, yes, this means many killers will temporarily lose more matches as their inflated MMR decreases to accurately reflect their skill level. But these killers will have a better experience in the long run because the survivors they go against won't be God squads. Only the best killers will face the God squads, but they'll be ready for the challenge. The Silver killers will face Silver survivor teams, and the Global Elite killers will face the Global Elite survivor teams. The vast majority of experienced killers are not even close to being Global Elites, even if in their imagination they believe this to be the case since the killer role has been pampered by the devs.
-
Rage quitting is what happens when you balance the game heavily in favor of killers to sell more licensed pay to win DLC like Kaneki. The intentional 60/40 target is to aim for imbalance, which violates game theory and thus creates frustration (for survivors) and boredom (for killers) instead of a flow state.
The flow state is achieved through an optimized ratio of challenge and reward, which is 50/50. The fact that DBD is asymmetrical is no excuse to imbalance the PvP, because asymmetrical has always referred to the roles of 1 killer vs 4 survivors, ever since the inception of the game. It has nothing whatsoever to do with a difficulty imbalance for either side. Killer mains just now use this "asymmetrical" term to defend poor balancing decisions that have largely ruined the player experience.
All games have rage quitters because any game can get frustrating in certain scenarios. The issue is that DBD has the most rage quitters of any PvP I've ever played, and this is entirely a game design issue. Only masochists will willingly be the pinata for a low skill killer mains power fantasy. Anyone else who values their sanity just quits the game and ideally uninstalls, because a game without fair counter play isn't worth playing.
-
@LockerLurk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3965384#Comment_3965384
The problem with this theory is it's not just Killer Mains making videos about this. It's people who play both sides, and people who also play majority Survivor commenting on it. They're all saying the game has gotten tougher for Killers and Escapes are easier for Survivors. Some of these are people who have been in the community since 2016 and are well respected.
The other issue is, a SWF is not just a four stack. If you include 2 and 3 stacks, yes, odds are you're probably encountering someone SWFing with one or more friends about 70% of the time.
The source he used for that 70% stat is very old, from when SWF first released. Using the same stat distribution, you encounter solo Q players in 82% of matches, and 51% of players play solo Q, and 49% of players play in a 2/3/4 stack SWF. It's a misleading claim because it makes it sound like 70% of matches are against 4 stack, which is definitely not true, but killer mains act like it's true.
-
@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3965615#Comment_3965615
You 99% your heal, so when you are safe you get all the value from Resi.
When killer gets near, you heal yourself so they first have to injure you = longer chase and you can use resi until you get downed.
It's really not that difficult strategy…this is just a coin toss as to whether the killer has a perk which apply hemorrhage which is quite common now since so many killer mains believe there is a healing meta and run anti healing perks. plus a main benefit of healing is to not make noise to reveal your position and you lose that most of the match, which is why old iron will got nerfed in the first place cause killers claim its "OP". plus you can be jumped by undetectable killers and downed while 99'd which still poses a big risk, even more common now with Glitch trap. so to play most of the match injured like this and call it a "healing meta" is a really big mental gymnastics 😂🤣 it's called using the healing mechanic as normal like I do gens and run and throw pallets. might as well say there is an unhooking my teammates, throwing pallets and vaulting windows and holding M1 meta too because every mechanic that I use as survivor is some kind of OP meta abuse according to killer mains 😭
-
@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3965606#Comment_3965606
Resi is meta, because of Kaneki.
Also heal meta works with Resi quite well. You know it's possible to 99% your heal and just heal yourself with medkit when killers gets close, right?oh yes...it is certainly possible to heal with resilience, but the more you stay healed, the less resilience value you get in a match. objective fact. so a healing + resilience meta is an oxymoron and the dumbest play style I could think of. killers are just calling whatever perks survivors bring that they lose to "the meta". but there's no consistency to this claim, because in reality survivors are just bringing varied builds and it's all "op" to killers that perform below average. being injured is "op". healing up is"op", doing the main objective called doing gens is "op", bringing decisive to counter tunneling is "op"...in the average killer mains noggin, every unique strat that breaks their win streak is "op" 😂🤣
-
wait most killers mains say were in a healing meta…now resilience is the meta? so a stay injured meta? make up your minds 😂🤣
-
@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3965468#Comment_3965468
Why is pain res most used regression perk for killer? Because its great perk pop is better on more progressed gens but not all killers have mobility to use it correctly and effectivly as apin res (pain res has rng factor of spawning scoorge hooks and sometimes the scoorge hooks spawn location sucks but its still very good perk even it has 4 time uses). Pop reuquires mobility to get fast to the most progressed gen and ability to get consistent downs, if you lack both which some killers does but bigger problem is the mobility factor then painres is better option annyway, but someone who played more killers should know that.
Reassurance for solo q isnt what bothers me, solo q would still struggle to use it but swf can utilize it for maximal potential just like shoulder the burden (bad solo q perk but in hand of coordinated swf its game changing and can change the outcome of the game).
its most popular because some popular content creators used it and the killer mains followed suit. pain res is mainly effective against low MMR survivors that group up on gens and don't let go when someone is hooked. good survivors just let go briefly and the little bit of regression is no big deal especially if they have gen speed perks.
give me a pain res killer over eruption or surge any day. the latter perks are much more difficult to anticipate as survivor. or ruin and thrill of the hunt can easily lead to 3 hooks before the first gen pops cause players can't find the totem or are getting pushed off of gens by killer early game losing nearly all progress and then it's gg. but supposedly pain res is "the best", nope, it's just the most lazy strategy when you want to auto pilot killer.
what most players (both killer and survivor) don't realize is that the off "meta" builds are far more difficult to counter because they have the element of surprise for the opponent. a pain res + grim embrace + corrupt intervention + lethal pursuer killer is so easy to read and counter. I have his whole build figured out by the time the first gen pops and know exactly what to expect. it's like ive rehearsed for thousands of hours just to defeat this killer.
the "meta" builds for survivor and killer are basically the mid MMR strats that the average player adopts because he's too lazy to learn anything new but has a general knowledge of the game and searches on YouTube for what build to use.
in contrast, high MMR players have matured past that phase. the high MMR players create the new meta, they set the trends. it's like a chess game and they're always thinking 2 steps ahead of the opponent. high MMR killer knows to expect decisive strike and a syringe medkit, he just shakes it off and 4ks. high MMR survivors expects the tunnel and so is ready to punish it heavily. but most of all, the high MMR player expects the unexpected.
they realize that no single perk or strategy is inherently strong cause the real "meta" is not a static, fixed entity like healing or gen slowdown. the real meta is constantly changing in real time as players develop new strategies to deal with the old meta. and once this new meta becomes popular, the high MMR player has already learned to counter it by moving on. the real meta is a living organism that must be adapted to in real time, not reacted to based on the past.
-
@Rapid99 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3965391#Comment_3965391
It makes healing off hook entirely inconsequential. Shaving off an entire 12 seconds off of your healing is busted yes. And the only anti heal perks that even stop it are gift of pain and leverage so again… dedicating half of my perk slots to counter one perk. It's not about tunneling being countered, it's about the complete lack of time that survivors need to waste to heal. Healing is meant to be a natural slowdown and resurgence removes that entirely.
Also you say pain res is overrated. It's not overrated, the problem is it's the ONLY gen regression perk worth even rating lmfao. Every other gen regression perk is god awful.
resurgence can be a good perk, it's just not this overpowered "meta" people are whining about. nor is pain res. these perks are largely popular because most players just copy what content creators tell them is good. we have a culture of second hand learners. and especially using it now when most killers I face run anti heal of some sort is stupid and completely defeats the purpose. if "everyone" brings healing perks as killers claim then anti healing perks are not a waste of a perk slot, unless you face me 😉
I don't even run healing builds and rarely bring a medkit. I've tried resurgence a few times and I'd much rather run resilience and play injured for half a match with faster gens, faster totems, faster unhooks, faster vaults, faster healing, faster chests, faster gates. resurgence is just a waste of a perk slot if you're good enough of a runner to not get hooked in the first place. this "healing meta" is completely imaginary and overrated fiction. many killers can easily reinjure you anyways with 0 effort and then your supposedly "op" healing build is useless (cough cough, the low skill tunneling Kaneki I face every 3-5 matches).
pain res...I just laugh when I see that perk and of course it gets paired with a cookie cutter build like grim embrace, lethal pursuer and nowhere to hide. thanks for running that, I see this boring build so often that I know the perfect counterplay. yeah dumb survivors will not let go of gen and scream every time like fools and lose like half a gen progress cause they all teamed up in the same gen without Prove Thyself like the meta bro wannabe comp geniuses they are. it's basically good against low MMR players that don't let go of gen when someone is hooked, that's about it. but a tiny little quiet regression isn't gonna stop me finishing the gen when I'm injured breaking a 3 gen across the map with Deja Vu and Resilience at 15% increased speed. ill just waste 0 seconds healing and finish a gen while killers chasing someone else cause I don't sit under hook like most of these plebs that just feed tunnelers easy wins cause they know exactly where to find you
-
@Rapid99 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964118#Comment_3964118
No it's survivors realizing that resurgence is actually busted. So then as killer I'm forced to dedicate half of my perks JUST to countering healing off the hook because otherwise, the healing off the hook is entirely inconsequential for survivors.
Also… the overarching issue of every gen regression perk has gotten 100x worse, to the point where only pain res is left as anything useful, but gen progress hasn't gotten any slower for survivors.
lol ... resurgence is nowhere near busted. it's just at most 2 fast heals off hook assuming killer has no anti heal perks. what it does is make tunneling more difficult and since too many killers rely on that low skill cheese tactics to inflate their real MMR, they hate it
pain res is also overrated. let go of gen right before hook and lose a wee bit of progress. only works against low MMR survivors. but since most players copy content creators we end up with this braindead pain res/healing "meta" that isn't even real, just a snoozefest to go against
-
because Choy put out a video for his killer main audience saying that 70 percent of matches have a SWF, and they all jumped on the copium train
-
@CrossTheSholf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964392#Comment_3964392
Honestly it just sounds like you aren't very good at the game judging by your complaints
I'm a seasoned veteran with thousands of hours, been playing since 2016. in basically a killer mains worst night mare cause I tell it how it is 😂
-
@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964515#Comment_3964515
Thats not consistent.
If survivors are "bad" then they dont get to 1 gen with 4 alive and 3 hookstages.
I would think if survivors are "bad" or "low mmr" or whatever you typed about them. They wouldnt even get half the game done, let alone 4 gens.they got 4kd no matter what rhetoric you want to provide. those 4 gens took too long for any of them survive, let that sink in.
-
@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964502#Comment_3964502
You still havent answered though.
Why is there 1 gen to go and only 3 hooks, 4 alive, if the survivors are "so bad" or "low MMR" or "#######" ?I told you , cause after wasting way too much time to pop the first gen, they finally started applying pressure. too little too late. and still they were sipping that cool aid like lean addicts.
4 may have been alive but those gens popped way too late so clearly they weren't getting out alive. which they certainly could have had at least 2 out if they were on the gens early and could hold chase 30 sec (which would be far easier without the excessive cool aid consumption)
-
@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964468#Comment_3964468
Then explain 1 generator remaining, all 4 survivors alive. 3 hook stages.
I'd love to hear more assumptions
Just to be clear this thread is "you cant play macro, macro is bad"
And I did, and nothing you have said has addressed how I played not being macro.I even watched half of it a second time. Take off 1 min 45 sec cause the beginning was in lobby, still they took 5 min 20 sec to do first gen. Terrible.
gen is 90 sec and there's 4 of them. if they were any good they'd have 2 gens pop shortly after your first hook and if they knew how to loop 2 gens done before your first hook.
even if they're "stealthy" they shouldn't waste more than 30 seconds before holding M1. then if 1 gets chased, you have 3 players doing separate gens and they can be sick because you can only chase 1 at a time. so at least two gens shoulda popped by the 3 minute mark and that's very generous.
but instead, they cleansed 4 times at 5 gens and got hooked at least twice during that time. the only chases you didn't drop lasted 10 seconds before the down. in 90 percent of matches that's gg already against any killer.
they finished the gens cause they finally realized they need to hold M1 to escape. but too little too late and they didn't have talented enough runners to turn it around especially with vile...corrupt purge in every chase. it doesn't matter if you power the exit gates that late you've still lost and lucky to get 1 out.
now I was not saying you didn't play "macro". but 4 competent survivors would have at least 2 out in that match.
-
@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964457#Comment_3964457
Again its corrupt purge. Not vile.
Stop assuming others skill level at the gameThe names not important and vile purge sounds better anyway. I'm not assuming I watched the whole match and they were completely lost
-
@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964432#Comment_3964432
Dude...1 gen in over 7 min at 4 survivors. I don't care what killer you're facing there's no excusing that. It's a guaranteed loss. You have to get sick against plague and gen rush cause she can't guard every gen simultaneously and she's weak in chase without vile purge.
No it does not the backseat gaming is not helping and assuming peoples MMR is such a tried and weak argument. Thats not the only way to play this game dude. You need to calm down when addressing others you dont even know or know anything about.
Why dont you post something tangible rather than dismissing something that doesnt align with your beliefs calling "them bad" or whatever massive ###### you typed towards others.
You have managed not to really say anything but "oh they are bad it was a guarenteed win"
If we follow your logic:
1 gen remaining all 4 alive.
If they were so "bad" why is this situation true?
Am I just "bad"? Everyones just bad or "$@#%^#" whatever you typed?
Post something tangible backing up what you say rather than picking apart and selectively ignoring other peoples evidence.I just gave an explanation of all the mistakes they made. They did the gens but way too late once you had too much vile purge and their teammate dead. Most matches are completely over within 7-12 minutes and they only finished the first gen after that. If you don't see the issue there I can't help you. A competent team would have the gates open with all 4 alive if they played well. I watched that match start to finish out of curiosity and i was just cringing the whole time. No individual running skill and terrible strats from those survivors. A lesson on how to lose vs plague. And the results do t lie. if they played so well they'd have at least 2 out.
-
@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964399#Comment_3964399
They have an afk
Which I left at the start of the match. (Macro)
miss skill checks
Your matches people just hit every single skill check? Huh wierd. I think I watch streamers who play this game as a career and they are about 20x better than both of us combined.
And they miss skill checks.drink cool aid instead of doing gens
You dont get infected needlessly if you dont have to. Thats part of plague macro counterplay. They dont know I have an addon that extends disease 40 seconds though.
This would be like immediately getting on a gen against a nurse at the start of a match. A small bit of stealth at the start goes a long way not giving a fast early down.don't know how to loop and give you vile purge the whole match.
This doesnt track.
If they didnt know how to loop why did I have only 3 hook stages at the end of the match?
Yui and Dwight both knew exactly where to go every time for chase. Becca played the TL just fine she didnt know I had Bam.give you vile purge the whole match.
Corrupt purge is red puke just so you know. Vile is what you have to start.
Cleansing with this strong of a map is not a bad idea as well. The general rule that gets touted on the forums "dont clease until the end" is not something you follow after you have played the game longer than a couple hundred of hours. There is about 40 asterisks that come with that saying, and this match is one of those situations.
Pluss, I dont know if they are all just reacting to someone else doing it. One person does it you may as well all do it.
And they did extremely well given the fact that I had corrupt available to me all match. They are good players and loopers for sure.
So theres pretty much no truth to anything you have said in your statement. Nice backseat gaming attempt though!I wasn't criticizing you about the afk, but afk by itself basically guarantees a loss for survivor.
The pros miss skill checks too but they missed more than one before the first gen popped and that's embarrassing. Streamers aren't inherently better than me, just known cause they're extraverted. I mostly hit great skill checks and rarely miss altogether.
Dude...1 gen in over 7 min at 4 survivors. I don't care what killer you're facing there's no excusing that. It's a guaranteed loss. You have to get sick against plague and gen rush cause she can't guard every gen simultaneously and she's weak in chase without vile purge.
only drink cool aid in corners of the map with finished gens that force the killer to travel far distance to a useless position. if you are scared of vomit the whole match and especially the beginning you guarantee a 4k for plague. especially early game there's no reason to heal that much and be scared to do gens just cause of some green goo. competent survivors do the gens regardless and drink cool aid late game or for hook saves against a camper. it's because of the healing meta too many survivors don't know how to play injured. I do all the time cause resilience is boss, I get so much value vs plague. they need to split up and allow themselves to get sick to complete gens and limit vile purge stacks especially early on.
those survivors couldn't loop for ######### lmao...sub 10 second chases every time. part of the issue was the vile purge but all they did was run to a tile and get downed every time. the reason you had vile purge the whole time is cause they were way too immersed and spending all their time drinking cool aid and hiding afraid of green goo and taking turns getting hooked.
those survivors are low MMR and or throwing on purpose. my teammates are often bad but not that bad. if survivors took your advice and played like these guys you will 4k every match with plague. so never blindly trust a killer mains advice on how to play survivor.
-
@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964387#Comment_3964387
Sounds like you dont play or know how to play macro or against plague either. Thats okay though we are all learning
???
They have an afk, miss skill checks, drink cool aid instead of doing gens, don't know how to loop and give you vile purge the whole match.
obviously the counter to plague is to do the complete opposite of what those bots did
-
@SpringMyTrap said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3964349#Comment_3964349
"lets not pretend killer macro is any kind of rocket science"
i always found it rather hypocritical to say that because you making this distinction implies that survivor macro is something impossibly hard.
also, as solo q survivor you should ######### dread bhvr gutting down killer macro skill expression because their compensation will rob you of your only way to win the game - winning chases on your own.
the game where killers arent allowed to camp, tunnel, slug or hit&run is the game where killers are designed and balanced to be able to end every chase very fast with little to no agency from the survivor because only this way killer will have enough time to chase everyone.
I never claimed macro was particularly hard, but it's definitely way easier for killer. it's just tunnel camp and slug for the most part so the devs have done little to nothing substantial to kill macro play for killer. they've put band aid fixes that are a joke but hopefully stage 2 provides some worthwhile.
holding a 3 gen and hit n run is more sophisticated macro but most killers just go for the tunnel and camping in my matches.
the nerfs to clown and Knight nerfs chase ability, not macro play. it's harder for knight to pincer zone and harder for clown to spam pinks at every loop. this means they have to get good in chase, but bear in mind, these nerfs are very light handed.
of course they will still abuse tunneling and camping but that's nothing new. stage 2 is needed to address that. nerf the cheese macro so gen pressure is actually required instead of passive slowdown abuse and nerf the chase ability so survivors have actual counterplay in chase. yes, that means killer role is more challenging but that's a good thing considering the snoozefest it currently is. killer should only receive nerfs until the average kill rate is 50 percent on every killer
-
@ChuckingWong said:
Example of macro play:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fXDwRciiJU&feature=youtu.be
No tunneling, no camping, no movement killer, brought to Eyrie of crows, 4 survivors alive 1 gen to go, all gens found and being worked on, 3 hook stages at 1 gen.
Still wonlol "macro"...that's just an example of utterly incompetent survivors. early on the guy is just standing still doing nothing until he's hit. it takes them over 7 min to complete the first gen at 4 alive which is terrible even with corrupt intervention. during that time they managed to drink the cool aid several times cause they're too scared to play injured in the "healing meta". they also miss multiple skill checks not even close to killer, can't hold a chase longer than 10 sec and give you vile purge almost the whole match. it's actually a miracle they even powered the gates playing like that. wouldn't be surprised if one of them was immersed the whole time cause they knew the match was unwinnable with their caliber of teammates.
-
I'm very happy with these changes as solo q survivor main.
Now let's not pretend killer macro is any kind of rocket science here. Hold the best 3 gen and then aggressively tunnel and camp the weak link and then slug for 4k. Most killers focus on the latter which takes like a day to master. Killer role is designed to be easy wins out of the box.
The clown and Knight nerfs require both better chase skill and macro awareness from those killers.
After all, the purple bottle nerf is a nerf to chase ability. Clown can no longer get brain dead downs by never breaking a single pallet and throwing only pinks. He has to actually use two bottles to play well, although most clown mains are so lazy they're just switching to yellow only cause they never learned to combine bottles. Also cigar box proxy camping abuse is nerfed too which is great.
Arinad made a rage video on how he wants to quit clown now which is hilarious. The last vid I watched by him he was teaching clown players how to proxy camp basement with cigar box. What amazingly skillful "macro". /s
As for Knight, also great changes. He's forced to actually have chase skill instead of brain dead zoning with Jailor and Assassin which made grabbing the standard mostly impossible. More challenging chases means these killers must apply gen pressure more effectively and actually commit to chases to win.
As for survivor, it's more like 70 percent macro and 30 percent individual micro skill. First you have your unreliable teammates, often with less than 100 hours when I have over 3.5k. You could run killer for what should be a 4-5 gen chase yet only one pops. Or a 3 gen chase and none pop. So much for micro. Then you have broken OP killer mechanics which limit skill expression in chase. It's very hard to carry in solo q compared to other games even if youre the best player on your team, most killers just avoid you til the end.
Breaking 3 gens and split pressure from the very beginning are essential. So many solo q matches are lost because teammates team up on gens at the start without prove thyself and do safe gens first. I like to run Deja Vu so I see this happen all too often. And it's annoying when my teammates frequently come to work on my gen instead of spreading out, so I move to another gen.
These changes are a great move by the devs. The next step is a global nerf to the low cheese skill tactics like tunneling, slugging and camping. Get those average kill rates down to 50% across the board so killers can be reminded what a fair match feels like instead of having their egos stroked with auto pilot pay to win mechanics. Knight and Clown are notoriously braindead to chase with, the former had AI doing most of the work while the latter just spammed pink bottles forcing pre drops or free hits at every loop. We generally know these changes are great because of how much killer mains are complaining about having to play skillfully in chase. Very good job so far BHVR.
-
@DragonMasterDarren said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3963949#Comment_3963949
While the optimism is pretty cool, you can’t seriously say DBD has no bad perks when things like No Mither exist
No Mither build can be great. Put on resilience and you have faster vaults, gens, unhooks, chests, totems and gates all match and are hard to track and never waste time healing.
Then use an exhaustion perk like Sprint Burst with it and you basically have old iron will where you can make distance and break line of sight to lose the killer. This will also help delay first hits and get out of any dead zone. Pair this with the new dog vial for greater effect.
Then add Lightweight or Dance With Me so when you make distance with Sprint Burst or Lithe and fog vial, killer has no blood, barely any sound, and no scratch marks. If you break line of sight doing this easily lose the killer. So although you've lost a health state, you have more chases and you last longer per health state.
Then you could run Decisive to make a tunneling killer either pick you up and eat the stun, or leave you on ground for unbreakable value without running unbreakable.
Now of course you have to be a strong looper to play the whole match injured like this. So if you're bad at looping it's gonna be rough.
Personally I regularly run resilience and often avoid being healed and play most of the match injured to do gens faster so I'm not afraid to play injured. Healing can waste so much time so this "healing meta" is overrated and a lot of survivors are scared to play without a med kit and healing perks, let alone injured.
-
@Mr_K said:
If all survivors are slugged they can abandon immediately to save their time not the killers time. The killer still needs to find and hook every one of them to end the match.
Killer's want a similar function when exit gates are open and THEY feel no reason to continue and don't want to walk cross map to force survivors out.
But killers can't have this because? Because they can walk to both exits to push them out? Because they can wait out a timer? Because they could still catch a survivor?
What if a survivor has an unused unbreakable or other perk that can pick them up? What if a survivor has an offering or perk that allows them to kobe? Are you willing to disable the abandon option for them if even the slightest chance exists to get back up and continue? I expect not. I expecting the response to be, survivors have no chance and should be allowed to abandon.
It's not a false equivalence, give killers the option or stop saying the abandon feature is there to save time.
Killer is the power role. Survivor role is designed to lose most of the time, so devs implemented a rage quit mechanic. If you lose as the power role, you take the walk of shame. It's the karma for bullying survivors in your previous matches with OP mechanics.
-
@toukent said:
Why should I have to sit through survivors intentionally prolonging the game instead of just escaping? It is literally just the same thing as killers bleeding the survivors out except the survivors "bleed" the killer out. Like bro, what are we doing? These abandon changes just seem so one-sided.
The survivors time is SO important that we have to add an abandon system, but god forbid a killer be able to abandon when all 4 survivors are sitting at the exit gate, DELIBERATELY WAITING to bully the killer and make them feel like (bad word) when they have already lost on top of it.
The survivors time is so precious that the devs add the abandon system yet those same survivors sit in endgame and tbag for 2 minutes. because their time is just so valuable. Let me add that this happens so consistently it's comical.
PS: and before anyone says "just push them out", why should I have to deal with not only getting deliberately harassed on an already bad game? Just add the abandon feature it won't affect gameplay in the slighest. Legitimately every survivor dc's once the killer wins anyways, so let the killer dc once the survivors win and just give survivors the escaped points once the killer dc's
How about this….
The devs give you end game abandon option, but in exchange they balance escape rates at 50% average.
That's a fair trade.
Currently being teabagged at exit gate is your punishment for losing as the power role.
Also, that last part is half a joke because I never BM the killer during the match nor at the end unless he BMs me during the match and I manage to escape (like shaking your head after down, humping me on ground, hitting me on hook, aggressive tunneling/slugging/proxy camping. Pull any of that garbage on me and I'm celebrating the entire end game collapse 😂
-
I used to see way more Blights before Kaneki dropped. Seems most of them switched to Kaneki cause it takes less skill (not that Blight is even hard to learn), and they almost always tunnel for the 4k. Kaneki has basically become the poster boy for killer mains who want 3-4k handed to them with as little effort as possible. You can win with him, but you'll almost never get respect for doing so, cause only the most naive survivors would think his design is fair.
People say he has counters because he's "M1" after first hit but that's disingenuous. He turns every God loop into a 50 50 if he has any idea what he's doing. It's basically Legion standoff but you get downed if you miss the pallet stun.
Too bad because the actual mechanics of the killer are cool if he's balanced correctly. But BHVR can't resist cashing out on his pay to win market, so he secures his position as the most braindead easy to play S tier in the game. Have 10 hours in DBD and want to play in high MMR matches? No problem, buy Kaneki and 4K today!
-
Well generally it's easier for killer to find hatch cause he can traverse the map without fear of being spotted.
As survivor you have to move quickly, only stealth if the killer is coming right at you but hasn't seen you yet.
First you need to be aware if there are secret offerings, which means the hatch will likely either spawn at shack or main building in case a hatch offering was consumed.
So you circle the map towards those two locations, not directly in the center of the map nor on the complete outskirts. You look and listen and hope the killer doesn't run right towards you.
If the killer does intercept you, then you keep looking for hatch while you run the killer. Don't greed tiles too much, just pre drop and leave the tile to search for hatch. If you're lucky, you hear the angelic hum and get out alive.
-
@I_Cant_Loop said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3963711#Comment_3963711
I don’t believe for one second that you are that good at killer but somehow that bad at survivor. Why don’t you post your stats from the BHVR stats page? At least I could believe you then.
“Bad survivors shouldn't automatically lose all their games because the game "gives" killer an automatic advantage” — I interpret this as you want the game to be balanced around the lowest end of the skill curve. Ok, you’re entitled to that opinion, but let’s play out what would happen. Balancing the game so that the worst survivors can consistently escape means that it would be literally impossible for killers to ever have a chance of winning at higher levels. Nobody would want to play killer and you would either have hour-long survivor queues or killer bots. I remember when kill rate were lower having extremely long survivor queue times during peak evening hours, and it the average kill rate wasn’t even that much lower than it is today’s. If that’s the way you want the game to be, ok, but I think a vast majority of players would disagree with you.
All I want is 50/50 average escape and kill rates. That is not balancing around the "worst" survivors, it's finding a middle ground.
Currently BHVR balances around high MMR 4 man Swf which is a tiny minority of the overall player base. And even then, the most sweaty bracket only escapes 48%.
The game should not be balanced around the tiny percentage of top MMR 4 stack players using filters and comms, that are basically cheating using third party apps to get an advantage that was never part of the original vision of the game that became so successful. But that's the state we're in, the game is essentially being balanced around the sweatiest of the cheaters that can't be banned.
So what if these sweaty cheaters have the advantage at the highest level? Most killers hardly ever face this demographic. It makes no sense to ruin the gameplay experience of the majority of the survivor player base just so a tiny percentage of especially sweaty 4 stacks with cheats can be beaten more than half the time by S tier killers. A 50/50 kill/escape rate is the right balance. It's not the infinite loops of the old days, nor is it the pay to win broken killers that we have post 6.1 up til today. It's just a reasonable middle ground that acknowledges 4 stack SWF with cheats breaks the intended game design and their experience and the few high MMR killers they go against is objectively less important than the rest of the player base.
-
There are no bad perks in DbD, only people who don't know how to put them to good use.
Pain res is just annoying because it's used too often by killers that can't think for themselves , but is extremely easy to counter.
-
@cogsturning said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/LE30TCWVUA7Z/screenshot-20250713-123158.jpg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/9NPE6W3NT5CC/screenshot-20250713-123129.jpg
I'm only a little under the escape average but look at the difference in matches played as each. I'm better at survivor. I win many chases, get lots of pallet stuns, run a build that blasts through gens, and am a big team player with unhooks, heals, and taking hits for people in dire situations, even strangers.
On the flipside, as I said, I'm a fair killer and dole out a good amount of mercy, and still maintain an average rate without much effort. It'd probably be a 70-75% if I turned it up a little.
Meanwhile, I'm desperately trying to get my escape rate up, yet it's not uncommon for me to die 10 matches in a row. For me to play double the survivor matches but do much worse is not balanced at all.
I agree though, I don't believe it easy every match. It's just generally easier. The difference is my killer matches, even when the people are skilled, are easy like every other match or so. As survivor, even if we destroy the killer the whole match, they'll just panic and start slugging, or they'll have NOED. The issue is more that the game rewards bad killers but never rewards bad survivors.
@I_Cant_Loop
I have the same experience with both roles. Playing killer feels boring cause it's so easy to 3-4k most of my matches, whereas playing survivor is a frustrating uphill battle most of the time but I play survivor more cause I'd rather a hardcore challenge than boredom.
I've played since 2016 with 3.5k+ hrs mostly as solo Q survivor and I'm way better at survivor than killer yet still get substantially better results playing killer. Even against skilled survivors I can take them down with relative ease aside from a strong swf squad that comes along once or twice every 10 matches and even then I still often get a 2k. I'm not mechanically very good at killer but I know how survivors think and can massacre skilled survivor teams with just some basic game sense and sloppy execution on any killer I pick.
Rewarding bad killers is exactly the issue. Low skill cheese tactics like tunneling and proxy camping are way too effective. I actually feel sorry and sometimes apologize when I play killer and massacre the survivors because I know how broken and OP killer role is and how solo Q players feel. I'll go up against a squad with thousands of hours per survivor and just steam roll them on auto pilot after making tons of mistakes that would get me killed as a survivor.
-
@flipperino said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3953096#Comment_3953096
First of all, tunneling is not "no skill" and an "EZ win". It is most of the time just the most effective way of winning the game. And there is nothing wrong with that. And it is pretty funny that you are not accepting that pig and Ghostface are very weak Killers. Killrates are over 50% you are correct. But why ist that so? People disconnecting, failed communication through soloq, poor decisions from the survivors and and and. Killers are not overpowered. Nurse is arguably the strongest or the second strongest Killer in the game, yet she hast the lowest Killrate. So not everything is black and White. Hope this post helps with your own entitlement :)
Tunneling is definitely low skill. The problem is not that it exists, but that it is far too easy to do in order to win. Nerfing tunneling will separate the skilled killers from the ones with an inflated MMR, which will bring kill rates to a more balanced state.
"Weak" is relative. If these so called weak killers win most of their matches, they are strong compared to survivor. So yes, any killer above 50% kill rate deserves a nerf.
Nurse was one of the deadliest killers in recent stats, so no, she doesn't have the lowest kill rate, it was close to 70% last I saw. (edit: 67 in 1800 MMR and above, her overall killer rate wasn't specified in 2025 stats)
DCs arent included in the official kill rate stats and Nightlight is not a reliable source. Most DCs occur because the game is very likely lost. So the kill rates would be way higher if those were included.
Failed communication is not the survivors fault, it is the game as it is intended to be played before SWF existed. The game balance needs to take into account the limitations of solo Q players.
Blaming the player is silly. Killers make just as many stupid mistakes as survivors but they still win more because BHVR holds the hands of killer role so tightly. Bad players exist in both roles, so this does not account for the disparity.
-
@killer_hugs said:
seems like a lot of bad takes. for one, anyone who plays this game consistently has a healthy stockpile of the best items and add-ons.
secondly, self-healing has been gutted so substantially over the past few years that it's odd to be complaining about it.
third, are we really gonna act like franklins is supposed to be meta or that killers should just be able to freely invalidate items? its never been fun to play against but its never been the strongest either.
fourth, a lot of the perks introduced in TWD seem like they'll be best in strong coordinated groups. so yes, it may become more frustrating for killers at the very top end of the game but thats such a small segment of the overall player base.
five, killers are feasting and have been feating for a few years now. if he thinks the matches are going to get more difficult for killers on the "top end" then that's actually a good thing for the game and not something to be worried about. its a welcome change.
I agree with this mostly, healing may have gotten somewhat stronger but given the strength of killer role now, it's really not a problem to nerf Franklin's, which could in many matches almost completely nullify the entire survivor team's items. As for coordinated groups, I feel like almost all perks are much stronger in a well-coordinated SWF, but there are obviously some exceptions.
-
"meta" in this community really just means popular choice, at least within a small circle of comp wannabes that think they've mastered the game because they were able to do a search on YouTube for the "best" build. now many assume it's the popular choice because it's stronger, but this isn't really the case. these strategies tend to become popular because a handful of popular content creators publicly voice their opinion that a certain strategy or build is "OP", and then a huge swath of casual wannabe comp players accept what they hear without question and mindlessly copy this approach and preach it to everyone else until most casuals accept it too. basically, what we call a common myth.
There are so many off-meta builds that are just as strong or stronger than a "meta" healing build if you are creative and use your own intelligence to adjust your playstyle to the build. I've even checked in a combination calculator that there are multi-million number of potential builds a survivor could bring into a match. do you really think a handful of popular content creators are so masterful at this game that they've experimented with millions of possible builds to find the one secret build/playstyle that is most effective? Nope. they just found something that works moderately well and made a video about it to make money, and the hive mind then regurgitates this opinion as though it is the divine truth said from the almighty entity itself.
Now the irony here is that because everyone knows about the "healing meta", killers respond to it by running anti-heal builds and so you just end up with a predictable and ineffective carbon copy playstyle if you follow the hive mind. which means you have average results and if you're a survivor that means you lose most of your matches. if you want better results you need to explore builds for yourself and use your own ingenuity and creativity to get above average results and surprise the opponent. then if you do that successfully enough you might even inspire a new meta that the hive mind adopts. but by the time that happens the creative player has already moved on to a new approach they've discovered, so the hive mind that defines what we call "meta" is always lagging a few steps behind what is actually the best approach.
it's analogous to music charts and how an original artist can come in with an amazing hit that everyone loves. but before you know it all the other artists are copying that formula and so it loses it's appeal quickly. and the original artist who set that trend has already moved on to a new style of music because he wants to push the boundaries. it's cool the first time you do it, but once everybody copies it, it ceases to be cool.
that's basically what the meta is like in DBD. the pioneers of it may have been ahead of the curve when they discovered it, but everyone who is blindly following these pioneers is always behind the curve in their approach. that isn't to say that it's wrong to use any given perk or approach, but that the player who learns second-hand is always losing to the player who teaches himself through experimentation. this is what separates exceptional players from average players who want to be exceptional. to be exceptional, you cannot follow the norm.