Xernoton
Xernoton
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@Pulsar said:
Because it's effective
And also efficient. If a killer can't get another hook in the next 60 seconds or they have that survivor in a spot with gens to defend, then it's their best play. It's not nice, but most people care about winning more than they do about being nice.
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@Azulra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607294#Comment_3607294
Actually I'm a Skull Merchant main and I can confirm that crouch walking right before the scan lines hit you does work against her. I've had survivors doing it against me and it does work. Even more so if they have Urban Evasion-
And I can tell you what your play is. Reverse the rotation. If drone is still somewhat near the loop, then the beam moves too slow for the survivor to keep on running but it's too fast for them to just crouch underneath. Even if they do manage not to get scanned, the crouching will take a while and you'll easily get the hit.
Depending on how close the survivor is to the drone you can adjust the rotation and force either lock on stacks or hits. That's the problem with this killer.
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@Xendritch said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607013#Comment_3607013
"Best stealth in the game" lmao it lasts 8 seconds and she has to keep calling back drones if she wants to keep it past early game.
Also the drones are not unavoidable, if you crouch they don't detect you, if you don't move they don't detect you and then there's of course the fact they can be disabled. This by the way is why she's not that great at holding 3 gens, there's a reason the people who actively try to hold 3 gens mostly have left Skull Merchant in favor of Singularity.
This is less "forgetting" how to play survivor and more just not knowing how to play survivor lol.
Good luck standing still in chase and not getting hit. Same for crouching. Crouching is also something that she can deny with minimal effort by placing the drone at a slight distance to the loop just as standing still will not when work she reverses the rotation. I mean, what are you gonna do? Always stay behind the beam and hope that for whatever reason the Slog Merchant forgets how to walk?
In chase, all you can do is to pre drop the pallet and leave the second she sets up a drone. Because with even a least bit of effort, she removes any kind of counterplay you have. Thanks but I think conveniently "forgetting" how to play survivor is more fun than that.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607148#Comment_3607148
Yes, i am sure.
I am always getting report feedback if i reported cheaters. But i never got that after reporting exploiters.
Damn. If they don't ban exploiters, then what in the world is the report system good for?
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606997#Comment_3606997
It was beautiful, wasn't it?
Easily one of the best maps they've ever designed, in terms of aesthetics and atmosphere.
But it is ruined now. BHVR really, really should release a classic mode for us.
Old DBD really had a distinct look to it. It was beautiful and you would recognise these maps despite some of the textures having an objectively low quality. If it wasn't for the vaults and pallets though, I wouldn't be surprised to find many of our current maps in a FPS game. They don't scream DBD in the same way that they used to. Which is pretty sad because it makes these maps very forgettable.
If they ever released a classic mode, I doubt I would play normal mode again.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606989#Comment_3606989
They are not banning people for exploits. I reported a lot of them with video records but non of them is actually banned.
Are you sure about that? It's a reportable offense, so I'd expect them to act on it, if it happens repeatedly. On the first time I would understand they might be a bit more lenient (after all it's funny to find a new bug or whatever). But I can't imagine they don't do anything at all about it.
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The aura reading is pretty nutty but other than it's really not that strong. You get exposed, so you know that the killer has it and you also know that they are likely coming for you. Now all you need to do is to be careful for the next few seconds and run when you hear the TR. This lets you maintain distance and makes it pretty much impossible for most killers to hit you before the exposed effect is gone. Against the killers that can actually catch up, you'll only need to buy a few more seconds for yourself and you should be fine.
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I am lucky to have avoided her for the most part.
When I play against her I usually use the noob tech. It consists of me "forgetting" how to do anything in chase. I will not leave the loop and I will not pre drop the pallet, which pretty much guarantees that I go down in about 20 seconds. Fast forward 2 minutes and the game is over for me. Too bad. At least I get my 8k BP out of this very thrilling experience.
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To me it feels very boring, uninspired and forgettable in every way.
It has a very forgettable look, it's a very survivor sided map, it has a pretty terrible main building with very uninteresting gameplay (no mind games involved), the tiles aren't that great either, the abundance of maze tiles always makes me want to ignore half the map when I play killer and look for more interactive spots when I play survivor and it's so big that you better have some mobility as a killer or pick a corner of the map that you actually want to play around (which is not fun for either side).
If it at least looked like in @GeneralV's screenshot, I could find something positive about it. But as it is, it's one of my least favorite maps.
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It's not against any rules. You can play however you like, as long as you don't use exploits, cheats or display bad manners. Tunneling is a strategy like every other, so it doesn't fall into any of these.
They can report you all they like but you will not be punished for simply playing the game.
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It's not a meta perk but it's pretty annoying. Especially on indoor maps it's a real pain because I can never get through any doorways.
I wouldn't say it's super strong though. Just very unpleasent to play against.
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@CountOfTheFog said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3604324#Comment_3604324
You know I'm a Freddy main?
Nope. But it's good to see that we now officially have at least 2 Freddy mains on the forums. Might be time for me to put the glove back on too.
Regardless, it seems Freddy has a lot of support by now. Which can only be a good thing. After all, this community has managed to overthrow DH after 6 years of its reign of terror.
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@moulesfrites said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606677#Comment_3606677
I'm experiencing issues on my PC even though I bought a completely new one with the latest hardware a few months ago.
Ok that's weird. I'm playing on a PC with pretty mediocre hardware and it's better than ever for me. No lags and no crashes.
Might be a software issue? Is it possible you have something else running that might interfere?
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On PC it's in the best state in over 2 1/2 years, I'd say. I'm not sure how it is on console, though.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606466#Comment_3606466
…Unless they know that the terror radius is split into 1/3 increments, and that if Wesker uses Distressing, that they can ignore the outer-most 1/3 of the terror radius.
That doesn't matter, if they're in your TR constantly. They can either decide to leave the gen anytime you come somewhat close or they learn to ignore it for the most part. Eventually, they have to make progress or you win anyway. Pre running only works, if they can reliably tell when you come closer. Distressing makes this next to impossible for uncoordinated survivors.
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@Bran said:
It's my opinion that the way the game is structured gameplay wise, the devs are going to reach a point where the gameplay loop is going to get stagnated and basically be "locked".
If they add in base kits to everything...then we'd a game where the gameplay has changed so dramatically purely because of the amount of conditions there are to actually be able to play.
Perfectly said. Too many base kit restrictions take away any agency the players have in this game, which then makes it a pretty boring and repetitive experience. For both sides.
What they can do however is to make certain strategies less reliable and improve others. That way, we wouldn't have one go-to strategy but a number of choices that all have their benefits and weaknesses.
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@Krazzik said:
I don't think it's fair to say the devs favour killers. They've done some nerfs and buffs to both sides.
Survivor has gotten a lot added as basekit over the last year or two as well. Basekit BT with 10% Haste, which was later buffed from 5 to 10 seconds. The Survivor HUD which gives really good information on what your teammates are doing (or not doing 😔). They recently got the Anti-facecamp mechanic added and are set to soon get an anti-3gen of some sort.
Yes, Ultimate Weapon is a problematic perk and I personally think it needs to be nerfed but you can't use that perk as reason for them favouring killer.
Don't forget the removal of hook grabs. Camping is probably in the weakest state it's ever been (not that I'm complaining), so that is definitely nice for survivors. With all the upcoming changes announced, one of which being the 3 gen solution, I really don't think calling the devs killer sides is fair. We're moving towards a pretty balanced game it seems.
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Your TR is huge as Wesker, so you can try and give the survivors the feeling that they have no way of getting out of there (easily achievable by committing to one half of the map or using Distressing). This means they will take it similar to a Huntress' lullaby that pretty much only tells them you're on the map. If you see them in the distance, then don't be affraid to use your power to catch up to them. It might cost you a bit of time before you can get the hit, but you more than make up for it by skipping any distance they have on you. Undectable perks can also work quite well.
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Obviously you made that Wesker furious. So he did what he had to. He broke through the sound barrier to punish you for your crimes.
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@DrDucky said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606110#Comment_3606110
Then that means in a 3 gen situation, the survivors have basically 0 chance of winning.
Wrong. They either somehow pressure their way through before that happens or they don't 3 gen themselves. If a killer forces the 3 gen, the upcoming anti 3 gen solution should fix this. But I honestly don't see why survivors shouldn't be punished for their recklessness. Both sides should think about how they play at least a little.
And be honest, how many times have you had a match as survivor that you still won after 30 minutes in a 3 gen? I have had one of these and only because the killer eventually was done and gave up. In all instances, we lost. Because if you can't break through before that happens, then there is little chance that will change later on. A DBD game should never be dragged out that long. This idea is only a suggestion to force the game to end somehow.
If you aren't one of these special breed chess players, then you probably don't want to play out such a long game anyway. But the killer cannot really commit to a chase (else they'd lose the last gen) and you probably don't want to ######### intentionally either.
@BlightedDolphin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606110#Comment_3606110
They could make it like the hatch where it doesn't count as a win for either
That is only the case as far as MMR is concerned and who cares about MMR that much? As far the game is concerned, a survivor either lives or dies. There is no in-between. A hatch escape counts as surviving in that sense. There is even a score event for it called "Hatch Escape" and the icon in the after game lobby displays you as alive. So a hatch escape is an escape in all measurements but MMR.
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It's a slugging perk, so I don't really like it. It's decent on the right killers but not the most fun or healthy perk to use.
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Dredge is not bad by any means but not great either. He is just very slow outside of Nightfall and maps don't help him either. Sometimes there are no lockers for miles and other times you have so many interconnected loops that your power has no chance to work.
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I sometimes go for a M1 (mostly out of reaction, sometimes willing on windows). But for the most part I play with his chainsaw only. It's more fun for me that way. It's not always possible though. I used to play M2 only Hillbilly.
I have given up doing anything too crazy around the main tiles (jungle gyms, shack etc.) because it never works anyway and when it would work, then the survivor just goes one step to the side and teabags you for a bit before vaulting the next window or dropping a pallet. It feels awful and as if all of these cool plays are locked behind addons. It doesn't help, that his collisions are becoming more and more of a problem every other patch because BHVR keep messing around with these things.
Lately I have changed my play style a bit. Instead of committing to chases I switch targets a lot in the early game. When some pallets are out of the way, that forces survivors to play more greedy and allows me to use my power a bit more.
Still Billy has better in the past. It might just be me building up frustration but seeing how many maps there are that limit him in all aspects of his power doesn't feel great. Especially when pre dropping is a more common play style today than it was 1 1/2 years ago. So, I play more M1 killer than I used to and it hurts my soul because I don't play Billy to do that. I want to play around with his power but when that can't work I have no other choice.
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My boy Doctor doesn't tunnel. He just reminds you of your next appointment.
Myers can't tunnel because he Saves The Best For Last.
Nemesis can't help it. He's programmed that way.
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@Raptorrotas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606069#Comment_3606069
I think it doesnt feel right because it feeds into the mindset that survivors need all the info spoonfed for free at all times.
Its on the same level of giving survivors free bond. Etc.
Alternazively i heard some killers complain about survivors getting more info about their powers than themselves. Could be that too
On the one hand it's Nurse, so helping survivors out against her is probably not a bad thing. But on the other, you're right. This feels just very excessive and I don't like when the survivor side (or either side, really) is dumbed down in that way. It should be about prediction and mind gaming on both sides.
This would lead to her counterplay becoming a simple "dodge the glowing light or whatever", which sounds a bit boring to me. A good Nurse would still be just as hard to counter because she would flick at the last second, while a newer, less experienced Nurse would not be able to hit anything. So it would also end up targeting the wrong players.
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@ChaosWam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606110#Comment_3606110
This just gave me an awesome idea. Extend it to gen progression as well and make late games go even faster.
Heck, faster movement/actions/vaulting the works for both sides.
That would have some consequences on the overall of the game too, which I do not think should happen as a result of haste. It's basically a miracle that the game works as well as it does with the movement speeds we have. Increasing them, while maybe fun, could have the potential to break that balance.
Keep in mind, the faster both sides move, the more impactful every little imperfection will be. So mind games could end in guaranteed hits (which would not feel great to play against) and depending on how these changes are done, most structures could become either super safe or super unsafe. It's more risky than I'd like.
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I would like that. There are so many things to learn in this game and it only becomes harder the more content they add. So this would definitely be useful.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606079#Comment_3606079
Yes, A and S tier killers can win most games. B-tier killers are mostly fine but they can get some minor buffs and some good add-ons. Problem comes with C and below.
We really can't balance game around them because then your other killers will be buffed too. It's really hard to balance game around m1 killers. But they can buff their base-kits with some anti-loop powers. Some of them will be better.
Like for example; Sadako has good map pressure and she also coming with good second objective. All she needs better stealth or better anti-loop. Pig has amazing second objective which gives her amazing slowdown. But her anti-loop is so garbage. And she has zero mobility. So maybe making her better in chase in solution. Clown has amazing anti-chase but no map pressure or mobility. His problem is that. Maybe some mobility is answer?
We need to look to all weak killers one by one and fix their issues. Trapper is on other hand... I don't think anything can make him feel better. Every map rework makes him even worse to play and all of new maps are making him worse. His traps should not have default colour. Colour should just change based on maps.
Don't underestimate Pig's anti loop. It's not great, but she can play around some pretty save loops. It would go a long way to raise her movement speed while crouched to 102% (slightly faster than a survivor, so leaving the loop doesn't become the go to strategy against her). That's really all I think she needs in terms of buffs. Maybe some of her addons could use some slight changes too. As a compensation they could make it impossible for survivors to die to a reversed bear trap while they are searching a box but that is debatable.
I am unsure of what to do with Sadako to be honest. If the survivors play very well, then she falls off. But most survivors have trouble keeping up with her constand pressure, so making her stronger in chase would really hurt them. With her, the devs are in a bit of a pickle, I fear. Maybe we should wait for her upcoming changes before we think about that too much. They have said, they wanted to bring her closer to her original design after all.
For Clown, I would like to see one or two more bottles base kit. He should be encouraged to use the yellow bottles for mobility in my opinion. As it is, he won't do that very often because then he doesn't have enough bottles in chase.
I like your idea for Trapper very much but I'm not sure how that would work. They would need to find a good middle ground of his traps being hard but also not impossible to spot. Maybe they could also be slightly increased in size and this whole thing with vaulting over traps could be looked at. With that I think Trapper could be in a pretty good spot. Not A tier level but very decent.
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Honestly, these are nice suggestions but I think they could be turned up a little bit. Maybe give him a 20% resistance to stuns in tier 3 and allow him to quickly break pallets and breakable walls with a M1 (1.5 seconds, unaffected by perks) at the cost of 15% (maybe a bit more, depending on how much of an impact this would have) of his remaining tier 3 duration as well.
Basically he could play more and more oppressive the closer he gets to losing tier 3. When he loses tier 3 however, I would have him fatigue to be slowed down by 10% for 1.5 seconds.
One of my main issues with Myers is, that he invests a good amount of time just staring at survivors. The pay off needs to be very high and super oppressive to balance that out. He also doesn't feel like this unstoppable force when he enters tier 3, which is what my suggestion tries to change.
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It is not an anti camp mechanic but an anti face camp mechanic. It is not supposed to end camping, just to make it possible to get that survivor off the hook, which is already the case. So there is no reason to update it further.
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The only change UW could need is for it to activate exactly the moment the killer opens the locker, so they don't have it as a lingering effect. That would be a considerable nerf and I think it would be fine to turn up the blindness to 45 seconds in that case.
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Would that red stain behave exactly like a killer's or would it be projected on them like with Doc's Discipline addons?
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@CountOfTheFog said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3605974#Comment_3605974
It's a great hex, especially on backwater swamp. I can never find it when the killer plays it on that map.
Edit: Just had a Trapper send us there using that perk lol 😆
Whenever I have a hex on Grim Pantry it's in one of the 2 most obvious spots, so it's usually gone in the first 30 seconds. :(
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In the last 10 survivor games I've played, we only ended up in 2 3 gens.
One match was on Suffocation Pit with it's notorious 5 gen but the killer didn't fully commit to holding it, so we broke it early on and then continued like normal. On Ormond we gen rushed ourselves (I could have prevented this, had I been more vigilant) and ended up in a strong 3 gen too. We got through regardless, because the killer kept on chasing.
So, for me it really hasn't been so bad.
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What else should happen? You cannot have the match end in a Schroedinger's loss for both sides. Either the survivors die or they escape. There is no other option.
Ideally, we should try to make this redundant. A match shouldn't go on for 60 minutes, no matter who does what. My suggestion is to modify the anti 3 gen mechanic in a way. If the survivors do end up 3 genning themselves without the killer forcing it, then the killer should eventually grow stronger the longer the match goes. After 30+ minutes they could gain a permanent 15% haste (ridiculously overpowered, just to end the match). If the killer does end up forcing a 3 gen, then the mechanic should solve this issue.
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On Billy I mostly use the milkman cosmetic. Sometimes, I switch to a combination of all the other cosmetics I have.
On Ace it's always this:
Gotta show the killer, that I am a toxic survivor main ready to teabag and insult them only to then play nice, use non meta builds and be friendly after the game ends. It's the ultimate mind game.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3605797#Comment_3605797
don’t be mean to me. :(
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3605799#Comment_3605799
You haven’t seen filth yet…. Wait until that FOV slider comes out, and my 4th perk slot becomes unlocked. My power level will surely be over 9,000..
As uncle Ben said: "With great power, comes great responsibility." But in your case, I'm not sure there is enough reponsibility in the world to stop you from committing war crimes against your victims. Even the Entity herself might not be able to stop your evil scheme! If you ever end up taking over the Entity's realm, remember we're all your friends here. I might even buy some real soap, if you let me live. 🙃
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
You can't.
All of these killers are suffering from strong maps. But these maps are exists because of high and anti-loop killers. Balancing maps around m1 killers would break all B and higher killers.
So only solution would be to giving them some good anti-loop.
I agree for the most part. But I don't think an anti loop power alone will be enough to transform a killer to high tier. What I consider high tier may differ from you but I think of A tier killers as the sweet spot of balance (or at least pretty close to it) and when you have a look at killers we generally agree upon to be A tier, you'll find that all of them do have one more thing to set them apart from their B tier contenders.
Wesker has can use his power for mobility and also use it as a slight slowdown, Huntress and Artist have the ability to pressure survivors across the map, which can more than make up for their lack of mobility, Plague puts you in a rough situation where you need to decide between staying injured all game or giving her the arguably strongest chasing tool in the entire game, Oni has the ability to play explosive and start slugging as well as mobility, Xeno has one of the best mobility powers in the game, an inbuilt slowdown mechanic (turrest) and a tracking ability and Pyramid Head can save a bit of time by putting you in a cage (adds up, if he can do often) and is the scariest tunneler of them all on top.
This is what in my opinion grants them the upper hand over killers like Bubba, who focus solely on one thing.
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@CompleatBeet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3604816#Comment_3604816
An idea I had for a Nurse nerf was to allow Survivors to see where she will appear after her Blink allowing them to dodge it in time if they can react, kinda like Dredge's remnant. Allows her to maintain her identity as a Killer that can teleport through walls but making her easier to counter.
I don't like that idea to be honest. It just doesn't sit right with me when a killers power is that telegraphed. Maybe they could test it on a PTB though.
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@HugTechLover said:
47
"So you rush eternally through the Entity's realm, tunneling against SWFs where all others disconnect. May your thirst for 4ks never quench, may the blood on your cane never dry, and may we never need you again."
You can put the soap away now, friend. This filth will never wash away.
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If your team mates throw the game, then you are going to lose. It's as simple as that.
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@Nazzzak said:
Oh that sucks. Wonder if they'll killswitch it as fast as they did flashlight perks lol
I'm not quite sure, if this is even considered a case for the killswitch. It's not technically game breaking in the sense that you still get to play the game, just at a considerable disadvantage.
Regardless, I definitely hope they will killswitch it as soon as possible because this is certainly a pain to play against.
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The AFC is definitely "not a failure in all senses", although it is flawed. I guess they could try to code it so that the basement elevation difference doesn't add to the distance that a killer is considered to be away, or just increase the range slightly when someone is in basement but this is not going to go anywhere. Bubba will always be a fearsome basement camper because he could wait outside of the range and make his way down when someone comes for the unhook.
You would need to completely break either him or this mechanic to prevent that, which would neither be fair to him nor any other killer in case they decided for the second option. This mechanic is only supposed to stop face camping. That has been explained explicitly. And one might argue that this is already the case. He can no longer stare in your face while you die in the basement.
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@ryokoryu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3605062#Comment_3605062
he answered me as if I have never played vs Freddy before and no the Lullaby isn't the same at all distances or at least it didn't used to be. It's been months since I went against one and it used to get stronger slightly as he got closer. I started the game when he was new, he is the killer that brought me here and yes I didn't post a video here but when I am listening for the lullaby and it isn't there til he is right on top of you that's an issue and assuming someone just isn't listening for it because they ar new, especially when that assumption is addressed in the post as clearly wrong then yes. I get irritated because people assume I lost a blood trail because of lucky break, no lucky break on the survivors. I post that in the original post and they still assume because they didn't read. This was not a decent answer this was a patronizing answer directed and a presumed new player.
To be fair, it wouldn't be unrealistic for you to have never played against a Freddy before. You could play this game for hundreds of hours and never once play against Freddy. His pick rate is quite low after all. I certainly haven't seen a Freddy in quite a while. Also, when you ask a question, then it's only natural that people will assume that there are things you don't know. Otherwise, why would you even ask? Go to the Bug Report section, if you already know that it is a bug.
I didn't mean to offend you in any way and I also did not mean to patronise but how can I know what you do and don't know about this killer? If it did come off that way, then I apologise. Given the information I had, this was as good of an explanation as any other and it's always more likely that there is something we as players overlooked than there being a new bug. Frankly, I'm not sure what you wanted to hear. If you know everything about Freddy, then you also know that his lullaby hasn't been reduced. At least not intentionally. I trust that you would check patch notes first, if you know exactly what you are looking for. So I took it as a rhetorical question and tried to offer a possible explanation.
You are right though, that I was wrong about the lullaby not alternating. I apologise for that piece of misinformation. It does have in fact 3 different alterations. I have 2.4k hours in this game and I still don't know everything. Sometimes I also make mistakes and mix things up. I tried to look up further information about the range and my suspicion that it would build up for a survivor put into the dream world when he is already near but there isn't a whole lot to find.
To answer your question: There have been no patch notes stating that the devs changed anything about his lullaby, so it is safe to assume that this was a bug, if you can rule out everything else.
Hopefully this clarifies it.
Good luck and see you in the fog.
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A lot of what you mentioned is only a problem when you haven't quite figured out how his counterplay (I hope this helps a bit) works. Chucky is definitely a strong killer and can be quite overwhelming in chase but keep in mind, that's his only strength. Hiding in corners should never have been a thing to begin with because it's just a use of the FOV tech, which is exploiting the killer's poor FOV. This will no longer work, once the FOV slider is introduced anyway, so it's probably best to focus on how else to play around him.
His stealth doesn't quite work that unrestricted. He only becomes undetectable when he activates Hidey-Ho Mode, which is active for 14 seconds (less, if he attacks or uses Slice & Dice) and has a cooldown of 18 seconds. It's also not quite face camping when the killer is more than 16 metres away from the hook, is it? The term literally comes from the killer standing right in the survivor's face and that is not the case in that situation. As long as Chucky isn't on you, there is nothing stopping you from doing gens. In 120 seconds your team can easily do 3 entire gens and maybe even a 4th if you have the right equipment and when Chucky already loses a gen at the start of the match (very common because survivors spawn next to their objective, while the killer has to find the survivors) that should already put you in a good position, when that survivor doesn't go down immediately.
The reason why Chucky players may be more inclined to play territorial / camp, is his lack of mobility. He is 4.4 m/s killer with no mobility power. Everything does only really works in chase and it has a huge cooldown. Meaning, running across the map can cost him too much time that he doesn't have. His time management is his weakness. A weakness, that you can use to beat him.
For a killer like Chucky, it's common to be very oppressive in chase and feel overwhelming (part of what makes him strong) but he does not hold up well in the 1v4. If you can track him (not easy but not impossible either) you can avoid him and make him lose time looking for you, if you can delay him even a bit, that is time that your team will spend on gens. Your best bet is to focus on playing around him rather than playing against him, if that makes sense.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3605363#Comment_3605363
I disagree with the second part. Take Blight for example. He is so strong that he can be played in a way that allows him to slow down the game naturally. The same goes for a lot of other A-tier killers and of course Nurse. These killers do not need any base kit slowdown (other than Wesker).
that something i heavily disagree with. I don't think any killer has any game-delay whatsoever. it is survivor that are not efficiently doing the objective that is slowing down the game. It is everything to do with survivor team. The idea that your actually doing anything to gen is something that weaker survivor make you believe as killer. You didn't suddenly get better as killer from 1 game to next game. what changed is that survivor play went up or down. that is how little influence killer has game-tempo of the game.
Winning with shadowborn and Lightborn billy has nothing to do with your skills as billy. It has everything with survivor's inefficiency at objective. All that being good at killer is that you kill survivors in quicker time frame then another player. For example, if someone really bad at billy, they might take a whomping 10 minutes to get 8 hooks as billy because they're making mechanical errors while a billy that is good should hit a higher % of chainsaw that instead of taking 10 minutes to get same amount of hooks, they take 7 minutes to do that.
Billy A can still win games because he might face Survivor team A that is so bad at gen efficiency, healing and looping that they take like 12 minutes to finish all gens but any time billy A faces efficient team, he has no chance to win because his killer skills are inadequate for better teams. Billy B wins faster and he can win more teams at higher-levels but as soon as he faces team that is doing gens in say 6 minutes then Billy B physically cannot win anymore.
stronger killer have more consistency in devaluing survivor's skill-level in looping and they supposedly win "race" to hooks faster then survivor finishes 5 gens.
That argument is very flawed. A survivor that is on a hook, cannot progress their objective. Survivors that are busy healing, don't do gens either. Slugged survivors also don't progress the game and need to be picked up. This is what I consider natural slowdown. All of these things give the killer a lot more time in a match.
You may find survivors that end the game in 4 minutes, if you look hard enough. But you will never find a group that does that to a Blight, that gets 6 hooks throughout the match. There is just too much stuff going on for the survivors to solely focus on gens. When you play in a hyper aggressive way (something that I feel only killers with a very strong chase power can do), you threaten to progress the game so fast, that the survivors have no choice but to slow you and themselves down by healing, hiding, avoiding, pre running etc.
You are right though, that for this strategy to work the killer needs to be quite strong compared to the survivors. You either play a lot better or you play something so strong that it can make up for that lacking skill difference. Otherwise you will not be able to build up enough pressure to stop the gens from flying. This is also where I disagree again, that me winning with these weak perks has nothing to do with my own skill. Will I win a tournament like that? No. I could have 6 perk slots and 4 addons and probably couldn't manage. That goes for most of us. But assuming MMR works, it should put me against survivors that are about equally strong to me. And when I suddenly nerf myself like this but play more concentrated and still manage to win, I'd say this is because I play well, because the survivors I play against don't suddenly become a lot weaker than normal.
Play a difficult killer for the first time (Billy, Blight, Singularity etc.) and you will not perform nearly as well as someone that knows the ins and outs about that character even if your build is significantly stronger. Otherwise, it would imply that anyone with the best perks and addons on the strongest will reach the highest level of play. Strong builds can carry you quite far, but it's your own skill that really makes the difference in that regard. If you compare both sides, you will always be able to point that someone is less efficient. Does that mean they are inefficient overall? No. It just means, that their opponent is operating on a higher efficiency.
If you struggle with Billy's mechanics, you will be happy to get 4 hooks in 10 minutes. At least against good survivors. Because M1 killers aren't that strong, his map mobility isn't worth much, if he can't end chases anyway and breaking some pallets slightly quicker will not get you very far. Someone with more experience might just end up killing them all in 4 minutes. This is also how it works for every other killer (maybe not SM and definitely not Freddy). This basically my entire point from before.
You progress so fast or play so smart, that the survivors will not be able to keep up that pace for long. This forces them to focus on slowing you down, instead of rushing gens. Before 6.1.0, I feel this worked a lot better because the meta on both sides made this a more accomplishable play style. But even now, it still works. Just not as well.
With your second to last paragraph you have pretty much confirmed what I said before and this closes my argument. So I am not sure where you disagree now. It seems though we have drifted a bit off-topic, so I would prefer we continue this dicussion in private rather than doing that in a thread that isn't really about this specific debate. Or we make a thread of our own, if you'd like that.
TL;DR: It is possible to delay survivors naturally by giving them more to do than just sitting on gens. Like healing, rescuing etc. This is what I called natural slow down. If you perform well enough, this will alow you to slow down games by quite a bit and buy you enough time to win.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3605401#Comment_3605401
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3605350#Comment_3605350
Is good stuff folks, very good answers I feel. 😁
Sorry to test you, but it's all these subtle interactions that are gonna need thinking about. My goal is pointing out all those odd little scenarios that I'm concerned this wave of Stealth backlash doesn't account for...
I'm all for targetting ratting, but I have growing concerns a lot of the discussions around stealth right now need to ensure these kinda points are factored in, and pushed to the front of the priorities list. 😁
Don't be sorry. It's good to point any flaws you find in these suggestions. It allows us to think about it a bit further and find ways to fix potential issues. That's great because it also means we can give the devs some ideas, that could actually work.
As far as I am concerned, you add to a healthy and useful discussion.
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@finalgrrl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3605451#Comment_3605451
no different than equipping something like mettle of man on a meg.
Yeah. I find that funny too. I personally prefer to call Mettle of Meg, though in that situation.
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Somehow I think it would be weird, if I equipped it on Ace. But I don't mind. Might make for some funny memes.