Xernoton
Xernoton
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3610456#Comment_3610456
Incredibly based.
That smile never let me go. I got into MG:R for the memes and I was rewarded senator Armstrong's nanomachines, Monsoon's DNA of the soul and Jetstream Sam's beautiful smile.
There was more than one?
Indeed, friend. When she was released, the whole thing with her getting haste and whatnot wasn't a thing yet. So you couldn't play her in any way other than 3 genning. Then they reworked her, added haste, added the whole pallet break thing with the claw traps to her base kit (previously Ultrasonic Trap Speaker addon) and a bunch of other stuff.
This then allowed her to actually chase but also made her even worse in a 3 gen. Most of us hated it but endured until some random guy challenged Team Eternal and held them hostage for 53 minutes. The best part is that this guy called them out for "gen rushing" him. 😂 I don't remember the exact number but he kicked those gens over a hundred times. It was amusing and depressing at the same time. That was about the time when I started calling her Caitlyn 3Genner.
So Slog Merchant is already her 3rd iteration. For most of us to even be willing to give her a chance now, she'd need to be the most fun and interactive killer of all time. But that's just not the case. Fun is subjective of course but her power doesn't allow for a whole lot of interactivity between survivors and killer. She is an area denial killer and that isn't fun for most.
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I do. Mostly. But that might also be because I absolutely couldn't care less, if I die. I don't throw the game or anything but when I die, too bad, the match is over and I go next. As a killer losing is a bit more lengthy than that.
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@C3Tooth said:
Putting something on the ground (or in the air) and it just staying there was never meant to be "chase killer"
Trapper, Hag, Knight..., why would you like to chase if your weapon is on the ground? It was so obvious
Btw, sneak in a SM drawing...
No 3 gen? ☹️
@GeneralV said:
I have a soft spot for Skull Merchant because she is from Brazil, and I like the representation (of course, she doesn't quite reach the "Jetstream Sam" levels of Brazilian representation, but close enough), though I gotta admit I still don't know what I'm supposed to do against her.
My teammates have a tendency of giving up against SM. And I wasn't around for her previous version, so I don't even know where that is coming from.
Which of SM's previous versions weren't you around for? Both were terrible but one even more so than the other.
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@ratcoffee said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3610317#Comment_3610317
why on god's great green earth are you quoting me? i was simply asking someone else to define what they meant. I've seen that term used a whole lot so I wanted a definition on what it meant.
I quoted the wrong post. 😂 Sorry about that. <3
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@xEa You know, I could create a new account and do the same thing from a survivor's perspective, right?
See how many people here actually agree with OP. So far there don't seem to be any. Even killer mains defend these 2 perks.
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No survivor perks are ever 'fun' for the killer.
But Lithe and SB aren't problematic in the slightest. They are both super strong and should not be any stronger but they are in a good spot. Both can be baited out and played around.
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@TeleportingTurkey said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3610205#Comment_3610205
soma's photo would be nice, but im equally fine with it being an addon, because its effect is very powerful for something basekit, though it does feel mandatory to run on singularity. i would be careful with that. i liked someone's suggestion to split the effect 3/5 and add 3% speed / 12% penalty to overclock duration basekit and keep the rest 2% / 8% as an addon or deleting its effect entirely so that it doesn't feel like bis option nonetheless.
as for cam hitboxes, that's not the issue of cameras, but the issue of how hitboxes are very inconsistent to the actual visible models which are highlighted for the killer. it's the issue of maps as well, cameras are just working by the general rules. like, it's not cameras that have awful detection, it's this game's collisions that are that abysmal which is only noticeable when killer's power enables so much creativity, the game can't properly handle it.
This has little to do with hitboxes but with how much of a survivor you need to see to slipstream them. It's enough for a survivor to have one leg behind a rock to be considered hidden from view. That's terrible. If you can see more than 50% of that survivor, you should be able to slipstream them.
I think Singularity's power without the Soma Family Photo is just not very funtional. I did the math and holding Shift + W will always let you outrun the overclock mode (even with 4 survivors slipstreamed) and you still won't be in hit range after that. That's terrible because it means that survivors, who know that will not vault or drop pallets as long as it is active and then still get to another safe spot. This begs the question; what is Singularity's power supposed to do then? The mobility alone isn't worth it and the chase part of its power is undertuned. The addon fixes that to a degree, which is why I think it should be partially base kit.
With 4 survivors slipstreamed you should get some guaranteed value (pallet / hit) out of your power because it means that the survivors messed up monumentally. But as it is, that isn't the case. Not even remotely.
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If anything Singularity could use some slight buffs. Like Soma Family Photo being partially base kit and survivors whose feet are behind a rock still being vulnerable to biopods. Nothing major but as it is his power without Soma Family Photo doesn't work very well and it feels awful when you clearly see a survivor through a bio pod and can't slipstream them.
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BHVR are in a tough spot when it comes to killer design. They will want to design killers that are different from what is already in the game (otherwise, why play that killer?), interesting to play and interesting to play against. Especially the last 2 points often seem to be mutually exclusive depending on who you ask. For a killer to be any good, they need some kind of strong chase power and mobility or other kind of map pressure. Otherwise they either become weak or need to be overtuned in one aspect to compensate for the lack of others.
But we also had a time when they released Sadako and survivors rejoiced because it wasn't yet another "boring anti loop killer". Because of this lack of a chasing power, killers had to find a different way to make her viable. That's how the whole "slugging for condemned stacks" play style came to be, which was considered a nightmare for survivors.
On the other hand we now have Slog Merchant. A killer with no mobility but a chase power, that to this day nobody could convince me has enough counterplay in chase and pretty much nothing else. They had to make her chase incredibly oppressive to compensate for the lack of everything else. But this also leads to her being incredibly boring to pay against because you cannot commit to a loop against her. You always need to leave when she places a drone. Again, a nightmare to play against.
Wesker is considered the best designed killer by many. I also think that he has sufficient power and counterplay in every situation. So I do not see how he would be insufferable. What you described has nothing to do with the killer but with the person playing them. That could happen on every other killer too, so using it as an argument against Wesker in specific doesn't really work.
A killer that is generally regarded as fun to play against (by most players, it seems) is Hillbilly. But he is not in a good spot when it comes to how fun he is to play. He is extremely punishing for even the smallest mistakes, map and addon as well as perk dependent, frustrating and incredibly difficult to play. This an ungodly combination of factors that make him an unattractive choice to many players, which is why you don't see him very often.
So it's not that BHVR release killers with the goal of them being insufferable to play against but designing killers that are fun for both sides is no easy task and a killer that is only fun to play against has no chance of selling. So they try to come up with something that hopefully works for both sides and often miss that sweet spot.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3609596#Comment_3609596
Hahah! That reminds me of a huntress game I had. I downed a yoichi pretty early on, 30 seconds or so. There was a kate sitting nearby, and I left yoichi slugged to go chase her. After about another 30 seconds every single gen insta pops and the gates open.
There was a feng, and in end game chat said “we don’t slug around here” and left. I still have the clip of it. Kate stopped running and just turned around to look at me. It was hilarious.
That's the logical thing to do. Clearly. Someone unleashed the full power of their gaming chair to stop that sweaty huntress' evil deeds.
I also like: "How dare you insta down me? Now I gotta insta heal!"
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I don't think so. The last hacker I encountered started out subtle but when I couldn't catch up to her even in Bloodlust 2 out in the open, I knew something was off. A minute later Yun-Jin Lee used the perk "I believe I can fly" and made her way onto Ormond's main building. That was the last I saw of her.
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I think their point was more that friends are more willing to work together than complete strangers. Which I would say is true. It doesn't mean that solo queue couldn't be improved but it will never quite reach the same level a good SWF does.
Regardless, I agree with your suggestions for the most part. I don't think showing survivors each other's perks is the best idea because it would lead to lobby dodging when someone tries their adept or plays with a more fun build instead of using whatever is meta. Maybe I worry about nothing but seeing how people even dodge high or low prestige characters I think it's likely.
I think it's time for one more improvement to solo queue when it comes to communication though. A chat wheel to allow players to tell each other what they want them to do and what they plan to do themselves. Simple things like notifications that you go for the unhook or can't go for the unhook or that the killer is near you would already be a big improvement.
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I'd say it was the time when they first changed hit validation in 2021. That felt awful. Every other hit was validated but you still got the feedback that you hit them. I even had a match in which I gained a STBFL stack over a validated hit. It also worked with old DH, which became even more popular around that time. I still remember the 10 minutes queue times as survivor in the evenings... Good thing they changed it again.
Freddy's rework is definitely a close second though. I started playing around the Twins' mid chapter. So my first matches as a survivor were against some Forever Freddys. That trauma never goes away. Now they nerfed him in every aspect and made him a nightmare to play rather than to play against. That's not much better.
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@siro said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608684#Comment_3608684
It should be like this, being a killer of excellence and being the best of all, he should be 100% accurate and not throw the blinks anywhere to only rely on taking advantage of his own or the other's poor connection and hit hits that should not connect.
Also, with the second blink, as I said and we all know, if the nurse does something wrong, the first one has the second one to correct itself. And if she corrects herself wrong, it is the killer's mistake.
Nowadays, many hits that the nurse gives are incorrect and should not connect thanks to the third opportunity that is given to her (being able to extend her m1) to correct her two previous errors (two poorly thrown blinks).
"Sounds like a fun experience." Try to find more people than not, who enjoys or thinks its a fun experience playing against this killer.
I'd rather play against blight or spirit than a nurse because their gameplay its more flexible, fun experience.
It should not. Because killers that cannot make any slight mistakes are no fun. Nobody likes being told: "Just play perfect or nothing will work." all the time. Also, survivors have room for mistakes too. Why shouldn't the killer have that? What you suggested basically makes her a killer without a niche. You'd need to play 100% perfect all the time. A slight miscalculation or the fact that she has to guess as soon as she can't see a survivor lead to her power becoming pretty much useless.
You'd need to compensate that by giving her aura vision on the survivor she chases, which would then remove all counterplay against a Nurse that can blink this accurately. This would make her just barely playable for the average player but uncounterable in the hands of the best players. That's about the worst possible design philosophy to follow.
You say "nowadays" like this has ever been different. It was but not in the way you imply. It was way worse because she had more blinks at her disposal. So you really couldn't do anything because she would adjust until she was at point blank range.
I enjoy going against a decent Nurse every now and then. There are ways to make her guess and rely on mind games. A god tier Nurse is about as fun to play against as a god tier Blight or Spirit. They slug you and your team over the course of 30 seconds. But a decent Nurse is fine. It's just not achievable to play perfect all the time. Which is what this suggestion would afford to keep her working.
The less fun killers there are, the more people will play the remaining options. We already see that with Wesker and Blight. Do you really think less options beside them, will bring anything good?
I mean, try to play her without lunging and then show us well and consistent it works. If you can prove that this is fine, then I will stop arguing against it. But until then, I am convinced that it's bad design and will openly say so.
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I'd be happy to get a match without multiple commodious toolboxes. Can't have much fun with snowballs, if the match ends in less than 5 minutes.
I guess it's because this is the best time to experience a power trip. Some people will try to play around with the event stuff and others will just go on stomping everyone left and right.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608067#Comment_3608067
Empathy? Can’t find this word in the Blighted dictionary….
It's right beneath "egregious". The definition is: "An instance of a wrong or misinterpreted perception of human behavior or motivation."
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608795#Comment_3608795
Having a little more knowledge on this "tech" now...
Doesn't a more reasonable change seem to be to increase the turn angle at base as needed, rather than limit the power of the character to people who quickly look down, turn and look back up again? Logically if a character has a 90 degree turn arc, that can be completely bypassed by players on certain control schemes (i.e. mouse, not controller), and that same tech is what is required to make the character viable... wouldn't a better approach be to just increase this turn angle flat?
Like I respect yours and @HugTechLover's skill and experience, but isn't keeping this tech the wrong way to go about balancing the killer?
It's one of these killers that just don't work really well on controller, so anything to help with that would be welcome in my opinion. But you can't just increase the turn rate. You'd have players get frustrated with the killer because they would be so hard to control. A bit like Hillbilly on controller (only worse, because the turning angle would be greater). You can do curves. It just feels terrible. If you can mitigate this, then sure. But this is an issue with controllers feeling less responsive than M&K, I think. Which is why fixing it would be pretty damn hard.
As I said, I don't care too much about Chucky's balance here. It's just that they removed the thing I personally found most fun about him. Balancing Chucky without this, while not impossible, will still make him less fun because it makes his Slice & Dice less versatile, which means you'll use it less and rely on his other mechanics. Mechanics that aren't as fun.
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@Dumbtecher said:
Oh no they capped his m2 at 90 degrees.. A killer that when played by a 'decent' player can guarantee hits at most loops with an m2. Have played as, went against, and faced my friend countless times in 1v1s and can say good riddance. I still think he will sit in a good place, his height and 3rd person view still give him a great advantage at a lot of loops.
As for going back to blight, knowing bhvr, they might be giving him the nurse addon treatment ;)
That might have been somewhat close to the truth before but not anymore. With a 90° cap the survivor only needs to move around a corner and will always be save. They cannot do that against a Blight (thankfully) but it works against Chucky.
If they really wanted to nerf him, then they could have done something else. The nerf is less of an issue than them removing the mechanical skill expression and utility of his Slice & Dice because that's what made him fun to play for many people. I would rather they nerf him in any other way, if they have to. I'd prefer a 45 seconds cooldown on a fun and strong power over an 18 seconds cooldown on a power that's mediocre and boring to play with.
If I wanted to play a killer that is just strong and didn't care about fun, I'd play Slog Merchant. But being boring to play is the worst fate a killer in this game can have. Because it drastically reduces the amount of players interested in playing them.
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@Hunkulese said:
Not a huge nerf at all. He's still a top four killer, just a tad less oppressive.
It was eliminating an exploit. They also didn't quite fix it. You can still get to 135 or so. Same thing that happened when they did the same thing to Blight. We know how Blight just plummeted after they took away his 180 flicks.
He never was top 4. Never. Not even close. A killer with an 18 seconds cooldown on their power (that does not guarantee hits) and no mobility does not get that high.
I tested him and the angle capped at about 90° (maybe 95°). That is not enough to use his Slice & Dice in any fun way. Blight can still do J-flicks and they are quite similar to how Chucky's 180°s worked too. Now Chucky can no longer do that though, which means he won't be able to hit you around corners, which is a big problem because he needs to charge his power and isn't even remotely as fast as Hillbilly or Blight, so the survivor will make it around the corner and "dodge" almost every time.
If they had to nerf him, then they could have come up with something else. But removing fun and utility from his power is the wrong way to do it. His flicks were what made him most fun for me and now that's gone. So, I won't play him anymore and I'll wait for a few weeks before I buy another killer because I genuinely want a refund.
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I won't play him anymore. Vaulting pallets and windows until you hopefully get a hit isn't all that fun and neither is hoping the survivor won't see you run around the loop. But his Slice & Dice doesn't work with a 90° turn limit. I thought they only adjusted the max turn during the attack but they changed the whole thing. It feels terrible, sluggish and unresponsible.
They removed any kind of mechanical skill expression that this killer used to have and with it one of the main aspects of what made him fun. I'd rather wait 45 seconds for his power to come back but then offering fun gameplay, then having it ready every 18 seconds and feeling bored to death using it. Because running after a survivor and vaulting pallets and windows until you may or may not get a hit isn't fun. Neither is hoping that the survivor won't hear or see you coming and just get hit.
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Punishing a killer for any and all smallest of imperfections is not a good idea. Do you know how precise you would need to blink, so that you can hit a survivor without the lunge? Good luck with that because you'll need it. I mean, the survivor could react to your blink and move a bit unexpted and there you go. Can't hit them. Now try with the second blink and see the same thing happen again.
Sounds like a fun experience.
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I can't believe they actually crippled him like this. I genuinely want my money back. Chucky was a fantastic killer on release. He had a super high skill ceiling, potential to get hits around some very strong loops and his power was fun to play around with. Now, you don't use Slice & Dice anymore because you won't get a hit with it anyway and instead activate his power to vault after survivors and hopefully get a hit by brute force.
I'm less upset that they made him weaker but more so that they removed the most fun component of this killer. A 90° flick for this killer is nothing. It doesn't work around most loops, so you won't even try.
Big mistake BHVR. This killer had the potential to bring a bit of variety into what's usually picked but not when you make the killer less fun.
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1) Caitlyn 3Genner II
2) Skull Merchant I
3) Slog Merchant III
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DBD really is a weird game where you have less trouble with sore losers than sore winners. I can play like a saint and lose and my opponent will likely be a jerk. But when I play scummy (omega blink Starstruck Nurse on Midwich scummy), I somehow get the nices folks imaginable and ruin their day.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608545#Comment_3608545
It’s an added percentage of the default repair speed. But then the penalty takes all of that into account and is applied multiplicatively.
It might make more sense if I give you an example with multiple modifiers.
If you had, for example, Resilience + Overzealous (let’s assume dull totem, so 10%), and then the killer had Pentimento + Thana (with everyone injured), then it’d look like this:
(1 + 0.09 + 0.1) * (1 - 0.3) * (1 - 0.2)
(1.19) * (0.7) * (0.8)
0.6664c/s
I hope that helps.
That's interesting. May I ask, how do you know this? As far as I am aware there isn't a lot of information about how this works. Also, are you sure the second and third factors are calculated that way? That looks a bit weird, considering that the positive efficiency parameters are added into one factor.
It would make more sense to me, if both of these these were added in the same factor again (like Resilience and PTY). Then you'd have one factor that is the value for survivor efficiency and one for penalties. It's just so aesthetically unpleasing. 🤔
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608354#Comment_3608354
I'd suggest somehow adjusting the strength of Survivors in the 4v1 and 3v1.
You shouldn't have a big advantage in the 4v1 and you shouldn't be doomed in the 3v1. Then we can go about actually punishing tunneling.
Adjusting the 1v4 sounds pretty risky though. I'm not necessarily against this idea but tempering with survivor efficiency on a base level is something I'd rather they avoid, if possible. Playing smart can already put the killer in a favorable position in the 1v4 (with a bit of luck and the right killer of course), so I'm honestly not sure how well that would work out.
It's difficult to balance something so radical.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608533#Comment_3608533
It's a little worse than that because the 10% bonus gets the 15% co-op penalty as well.
It would look like:
(1 + 0.1) * (1 - 0.15)
(1.1) * (0.85)
0.935 for one survivor, then double that for 2 survivors so you get 1.87c/s.
(This is also why even with the old Prove Thyself when the bonus was 15%, the repair bar was still red because the 15% bonus getting penalized too means you're still slightly below 1c/s per survivor)
Thank you. I wasn't sure how the modifier of PTY works. It could be an added value percentage or a multiplier but since most things in DBD seem to work as multipliers, your calculation makes sense.
I will now shamelessly edit my math in order to avoid spreading misinformation. 😜
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@CountOfTheFog said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608525#Comment_3608525
But even without the perk at all, two people on one generator will make that generator faster than if just one person was on it, correct? I had a whole thread dedicated to that question alone and it seems like people agree while there's a penalty, it progresses the single generator faster.
Yes, but the game compares it to the efficiency the 2 of you would have on different gens. If you were to work simultaneously on different gens, you'd both make 1 c/s of progress, right? Because that's 2 of you working on gens, you make 2 c/s of progress distributed on 2 gens. Now, if both of you work on the same gen, you get the efficiency penalty and only work on a 0.85 c/s progression each. Together that's a 1.7 c/s progression rate.
With PTY and 2 people you get a 10% extra speed, which leaves you both at an individual: 0.85 c/s x 110% = 0.935 c/s. So each of you is still slower than normal, which leads to the combined repair speed of 1.87 c/s.
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For killer: Play Blight and use whatever perks and addons you're comfortable with. Try to avoid proxy camping and slugging, though.
For survivor: Play in a SWF. It's a bit inconsistent pipping as a survivor. Especially when you reach higher grades. Doing side objectives should help you get the objective category closer to max as it otherwise takes quite a bit of gen progress. You'll also need to go for some unhooks and heals to get the altruism points. When the killer is near but chasing after someone else, it can work to stay at a distance, run into their FOV, start a chase and run off again. That helps with the chase category.
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Yes, you both get the extra repair speed. But your progress is still slightly slower than it would be, if you worked on different gens.
There is an efficiency penalty when multiple survivors work on the same gen. In the case of 2 survivors working on one gen it's a 15% penalty and you only get a 10% repair speed boost. So you are still a little less efficient than if you were to work on different gens. When someone else comes near however, PTY counts that as 3 survivors in range and will give you a 20% repair speed bonus. So you repair the gen at: (0.85 c/s x 120%) x 2c/s = 2.04 c/s.
Note: I am not 100% certain, if the repair bonus is a multiplier or an added value. But looking at old PTY and its red bar it seems it is a multiplier.
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@DrDucky said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606460#Comment_3606460
Some 3 gens are so strong, that a killer could choose to hold them at the start, and then abuse this new growing stronger thing.
Please read the first few lines again. I said, that this should be added in combination with their upcoming 3 gen solution. So if the killer tries to abuse this, it won't work. Or at least it shouldn't.
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@xEa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608046#Comment_3608046
What do you think about Coup? You get Coup for free / failing like MFT does. MFT was limited to 1 health state while Coup gives you 10 downs max which is more then you need in all your chases.
Dont get me wrong, i disliked the power of MFT (to strong) and therefore almost never used it, but Coup is basically the same for the other side.
I am not a big fan of Coup De Grâce, honestly. It's not as constant as MfT (only active during a lunge not the entire second half of a chase) and you lose stacks for any lunge but I don't like it either. You don't do anything for this perk to activate but you get a damn strong effect. It's the same as MfT in that regard. You make a mistake / your opponent does something right and somehow you are rewarded for it. I think that's not good design. I will not judge on how strong exactly Coup is because it can vary from match to match (sometimes it carries you, other times it's basically a wasted perk slot) but I think it's less consistent than MfT was.
The only perks that I have no issues with, that follow a similar pattern are end game / comeback perks, that only get strong when the match is nearly over. Noed I dislike for different reasons and Fire Up is an interesting idea for a perk but it gives you a value that you shouldn't need anyway. Not only did you lose a good amount of gens for it to do something, you also should get rid of resources before that. If you didn't do that, then this perk is not worth much and if you did do it, then the extra breaking speed is redundant anyway.
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@SirXenomorph said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3608113#Comment_3608113
Uff it is a long answer but I will see to answer it properly.
To the first part of your message I can clearly say if I can get 36k bloodpoints out of a game where I played nice why do you think you will get much less by play fair? Sure I took with me some bloodpoint additional stuff but yet it would have been at least 20k without that, if not more. I think it will be better to take a try to see if you then maybe can get some hooks from the survivors after you realise the game for you is lost. Some will go along with it and some do not. But in my experience till now the most will do go along with that since they could get some more points as well.
On the part with the ego you are right. I also have stuff which challenge my pride and ego to its fullest. But I am someone who do not spill it all over someone who is not guilty for that. That is just me. If I have a bad round with survivors and the round would be lose I can accept that. There will be rounds where I will get them and enjoy it. I also can enjoy to lose a round since that means they were just to good for me to get. So why do I now have to camping, tunneling or slugging the hell out of the next group of survivors which are not these? If I am not good enough to get good survivors, then I have to get better it is just that simple, and if I do not get better I have to options either deal with it and still try to get better, or became a camper, tunneler and slugger, sure that will help me get more on the hook maybe, but yet I will not get any better and on top of that I make the survivors gonna hate the game, cause the likelyhood that the next killer is the same or even worse is more then 95% if not even more. So for me the solution is simple, just do not give anything more poison in that system and try to give the survivors a fair chance or play nice maybe and have a fun round, so they do not have to fear that every round will like that. That is my solution.
The part with the pallet Freddy I do not get. Did you say you just took no perks with you and go to a certain map which does no favours for you? Then sry, it is something you did on purpose? It means you ultimatively lead to the circumstances which made you camping tunneling and slugging? Or did I get it wrong here? Maybe I do not understand it right? But if you do limit yourself and begin to camp, tunnel or slug is not then even more troublesome, cause you yourself limited yourself and after you see that it works out for the favour of the survivors you start to play like that, even though you just lead to that situation? Please correct me if I am get it wrong, but it sounds like that to me. And yea they all do the Gens cause it is litteraly the only real task a survivor has. Either one of them can smell that you do not take perks with you or something they simply do not know that, and just do their task, and if you do not show them how you try to play and they do get it, it will be like that, so do they have to be mutants to sense that you play like that and if not you start camping, tunneling and slugging? Again if you mean it like that it is not the survivors fault that you start with that. Please tell me if I get you right and if not where I get you wrong okay? Ahh so it was a hypothetical example? Yea the survivors still would play like you are a serious killer cause the times a killer play more calm are so few that you can count it on one hand. And again since they do not can read your mind or smell that you are nicer they will rush. Especially if they are in their 20th round and you are the first who go calm on them, how could they knew that you now are calmer or nicer?
And yes it would be very good if a change in behaviour all together would lead to a more calm environment. I just show survivors who do not get that I am nice that I am nice by not tunnel them or even when I hit someone who just got of the hook to let the others heal him. Or if I play really nice I hit them down pick em up and bring them to a Gen. Cause I know that is very hard to see if a killer is nice or stuff. I just think it would be much better if these killers who are not good in compensate a lose try to learn it. And focus just of become better than start to use toxic behaviour on every round. (And I do mean these who does that every round. Those who just tunnel not intentionally or not the majority of the time are not meant)
That is no double standard sry. When you have the only task to do Gens and have no real control about how it is done, why is it the same when a killer start to use unfair tactics when he has much more options as the survivors? The survivors can do Gens only in one and the same style, while the killer, not even to mention that it is up to what killer you play, has much more options left. You as a survivor can not do Gens slowly you only can make them a bit faster. That is not the same. Sure it come up to the killer you play some are better for the trial and some maybe not, but all in all you can get better without these playstyle and even deal with gen rushs. While the survivors have no real option, they either can do Gens what their only task is, or not, what should they do? Also it sometimes is maybe not in the mind of the survivors to do it like that but sometimes it just goes as fast. But that showed that they did good or not? One maybe distract the killer and the rest do the Gens. Sometimes you get someone of the hook. And yet you say that they should stop Genrushing, when they do not have real control about how fast a Gen is done or over the other survivors and what they do? While you as killer get mad and start to play dirty, just because you followed this one survivor who successfully distracted you long enough? You have the chance to give up the hunt and go search for others. But if you start camping tunneling and slugging, that is not the same as to say but they do Genrushes. Sure the killers only task is to sacrifice the survivors, but how you do it is up to you as a killer, but how the Survivors do the Gens is not really up to them, since the Gens do work all the same in every trail, while the survivors do not. It is not the same. The survivors to not really brief the round they just do what they have to. And nothing more. And you as killer do what you have to and if you do it fair it get probs but if you do start to do it dirty, because the survivors do their ONLY task to fast as you can get them, that is not good. What should the survivors do better? Should they just look on Gens for 120seconds before start them? Should they just walk through the map for 5 minutes before do any Gens? You see the killer can directly start to hunt them and the survivors need to find Gens if you are lucky you find some and if you are good you can overcome the killer who approach you Gen with hiding. The killer on the other hand can see any Gen, he can take perks with to see if two or more work on the Gen. There are so many perks to reduce the Gen progression effectively, and yet you still need to camp, tunnel or slug then? (Not you in particular.) To say it is a double standard is simply not right. Cause all the stuff that a survivor can do a Gen faster is not stackable.
Maybe you can call camping and the other stuff skill, but I do not. Cause camping does not afford any skill whatsoever. Cause looke no matter if the survivor who come to save the day is healthy or not HE IS THE NEXT ON THE HOOK. That is no skill it is still the absence of it, cause if you only get a survivor by camp or tunnel him it is not skill it is just lazy. You know it work, so why use real skill instead if you can ruin the game for someone else, just to comfort yourself? Is it worth it? If so okay, go for it, but I do not think it is. Cause someday that maybe can destroy the game for to many people so the playercount drops and the game will die. Even I hope that will not happen. It is the combined skill when you as a survivor manage to do Gens without the killer get you, but you say it is the same skill when the killer just get someone because he do not search but wait for them to come? That is not the same really not. Skill is for a killer to get the survivors without any usage of that, the rest is just lazy. And that is done exactly because the killer have no skill in do the trail without that.
The rest of your post I answer another time!
I'll try to keep this a bit shorter.
I can clearly say if I can get 36k bloodpoints out of a game where I played nice why do you think you will get much less by play fair?
The reason is simply that you do not trigger the BP events that give you the most points as often or at all, if you lose. Hooking, chasing and killing survivors give a killer a lot of BP. If you lose, then the chances are that you got less hooks, had less time in the match and therefore couldn't chase as much and naturally didn't kill them all. You still get the other BP events like normal. 20k BP for a killer match is very little. There are some killers that easily get 30k-35k points a match, if they win. Most notably Blight. Nobody stops you from using BP offerings in that case either.
If I have a bad round with survivors and the round would be lose I can accept that.
That's great. Really. If you can do that, then more power to you. I try to keep calm myself too and remember that it's just a game. But we cannot take ourselves as the standard. Otherwise, we wouldn't have any kind of competitive environment in DBD. Being competitive means doing everything you can in order to win. This wouldn't be possible / necessary though, if we all just accepted to lose. Which would then mean, that both sides would stop trying as soon as things don't look well. If winning doesn't matter, why try?
If I am not good enough to get good survivors, then I have to get better it is just that simple, and if I do not get better I have to options either deal with it and still try to get better, or became a camper, tunneler and slugger, sure that will help me get more on the hook maybe, but yet I will not get any better and on top of that I make the survivors gonna hate the game, cause the likelyhood that the next killer is the same or even worse is more then 95% if not even more.
Again, this argument is flawed because we do not have a definition of what it means to play good (so it's subjective) and we do not have a definition for skill balance either. So one might think they play a lot better than whoever they play against and deserve to win even when the match doesn't go well. This could be the objective truth. After all DBD isn't a perfectly balanced game. Sometimes you win by playing the easy way rather than the hard way. Depending on your individual definition of what is and isn't skillful this means, that you could lose against people, who in comparison to you aren't good.
You also should not take responsibility for things that are completely unrelated to you.
The part with the pallet Freddy I do not get.
That was an example of what playing "nice" gets you. The survivors you go against don't play any different and the same happens when you do or don't tunnel. They have no reason to play nice just because you do. They will still play just like always with the difference that you may get a few extra teabags and some not so friendly tales about your family in the end game chat. Because for some reason this game has a problem with sore winners more than sore losers.
That is no double standard sry.
It is. The killer's only objective is to kill survivors. Why is it bad when they do that? Survivors could do the same we expect killers to do. Do one gen to 33%, then go to the next and repeat that until the gens are done. But that sounds ricidulous because you of course want gens done, so that you don't have to worry about them anymore. A tunneling killer follows the same logic. Why would they hook different survivors? The game doesn't tell you to do that and it's less efficient than tunneling. You also risk not finding that survivor again when you would need to. Survivors could also run around the map and do totems and loot chests. But they have no reason to do that, so they won't. Instead they focus on progressing the match as efficiently as possible. It's the equivalent of tunneling. Only we do not raise our fingers at survivors that play efficient. This is the double standard.
That is no skill it is still the absence of it, cause if you only get a survivor by camp or tunnel him it is not skill it is just lazy.
It's safe. Just as doing gens and nothing else. Or pre dropping pallets and holding Shift + W instead of looping. Both are extremely common in supposedly high MMR games and tournaments. But we equate these with skill because they work so well. So by that definition tunneling, camping and slugging are skill too because they follow the same logic. Anytime you use different norms but don't disclose that and pretend like it isn't the case, that is a double standard. And it happens with almost every argument against tunneling.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I have empathy for other players even though they lack any for me.
Wait, you have learned empathy? Damn. How many survivors did you need to kill to acquire that?
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@C3Tooth said:
I had the suggestion years ago that if they ever increase FoV, Shadowborne would let killer able to see survivor in the dark, similar like Myers/GF stalking, and Freddy. That fits more with the perk though.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/74CQ0EZKED4V/image.png
Monitor & Abuse, I dont know.
If they did that, then my build wouldn't change and my Shadowborn addiction would prevail.👍️
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@SirXenomorph said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607806#Comment_3607806
Of course I do not say try everything to win. But have it to be with camping, tunneling and slugging? And I do not agree that the only alternative you have to win like that is to give up. It simply is not. If you see you will not get all or any of them why not try to show you want to play nice to just get some bloodpoints out of it or stuff? If you just see that you can not do it anymore the most maybe think of just play like that then instead of try to made it a call and go joke around with the survivors. That will maybe also help that the survivors do not be so rushing, just maybe if a survivor do see that the killers became calmer and do not rely on these tactics to win, they maybe became also calm and do not go all in so much. (Even some will still does that) and also what is the point of be upset about survivors do Genrushs? IT IS LITTERALY THEIR ONLY TASK IN THE TRIAL to do Gens, so what is the point to been upset over survivors do their task? If you as killer wont be able to get them then yea the survivors might be to strong, but that I would set up as skill. If survivors who by the way most of the times are outright strangers to each other can do the Gens that fast without the killer get any of them is that not equal to they do their job good? So if the killer then do not get any of them his logical conclusion is okay if they are that good I become just bad? Sry where is that anywhere near a good way? (I do not attack you here it is just what I think about it)
Yea I think some can not take it to lose. I mean I can understand that it will be frustrating to lose multiple rounds as a killer, but so does as a survivor. So if you ask me begin to camp, tunneling and slugging survivors only lead the survivors to Genrush and fool the survivor around. On both sides that behaviour just drags it more and more down. It is like that behaviour of the killers made the survivors become more and more rushing and that makes the killer even more relying on these stuff. And it just got worse and worse with every time.
I do not think that we can get rid of camping at all. Because when you try to do something against it it maybe would be like the system declares a action you do as a killer as camping and then you, while you do not even camp, got punished. So for camping at that it should be a rethinking for anyone itself. Cause if you wont have survivors who make you do use that stuff, do not raise them!
For tunneling that alone I do not think could be get rid of as well. There are also perks, at least one I know of, that can prevent it kinda okay.
For slugging would be my idea to set a counter like these for camping on the hooks, which starts if two or more survivors got slugged. It slowly fills when two survivors got slugged and start to fill faster with any more survivor who got slugged. The one that got slugged first or which heal is finished can stand up ONLY ONE can stand up, and the timer reset for the others and because the one who just got up is not slugged anymore it is slower again. So the killer either risk to get them instead of one can recover themselves, or he just take them and hook them. But I already know that this idea will be so mean against the killers because it favours the survivors again. I just can say then yea you do not say? Why slug them in the first place, so none of them can do anything anymore? Is that not in favour of the killer to be able to do so?
I just think before we need real changes in the game it should just be a rethink and that killers might think about not do it in every single game. Cause I am sure these who really do it even in a normal survivor group just use it as a excuse that they do it because of top tier survivors. That is not true because if so why do it on a normal group you know? (At least I think that about these killers)
If you see you will not get all or any of them why not try to show you want to play nice to just get some bloodpoints out of it or stuff?
The question is, why would you try? You're going to lose anyway, so why not get it over with and play the next game? A match in which you already know, that it doesn't matter what you do because you can't win anyway, is not fun for most people. You don't get anything for playing nice. Mostly not even a "gg". It's more likely that your opponent will relish in the power trip and double down on rubbing it in to make you feel bad. Which feels even worse, when you try to be nice because then you don't deserve it. The game doesn't reward you for that either. If you lose, then you'll likely get less points out of the match then if you win. No matter how you win.
Also, every one of us has a bit of an ego and anything that damages that ego will lead to us getting upset and irrational. Some people are better in controlling these emotions than others but for the most part it hurts our pride, if we wanted to win and then lost. That's also why many people constantly aim to improve themselves. In that situation, you will likely not feel like joking around anymore. So that option doesn't exist for a good portion of players. What remains are the 2 options I listed before.
That will maybe also help that the survivors do not be so rushing, just maybe if a survivor do see that the killers became calmer and do not rely on these tactics to win, they maybe became also calm and do not go all in so much.
I'd say we had that before. Not because killers played calm but because killers were so weak, that survivors could relax anyway. This is not something I want to go back to. The era of bully squads is over and that's a good thing. It's also wishful thinking that this would only lead to survivors playing nicer. Because survivors like winning just as much as killers do, so they wouldn't stop. I mean, try it yourself. Play pallet Freddy without perks and send yourself to GoJ. Now, don't tunnel, camp or slug. I did this a few times and every time it ended with the survivors rushing me anyway and enjoying the power trip. Even in solo queue you notice when a killer plays Freddy, you weren't by any perks, they use dream pallets and have had 1 hit by the time 4 gens popped. But they don't stop doing gens. Because they have no reason to.
This by the way comes from someone, who tries to play nice as killer. I follow the categorical imperative. I would not want to be tunneled, camped or slugged, so I avoid it. But that's why I know, that survivors still play as if you did. If the roles were reversed, it would still be the case. Most people care more about winning than they do about playing nice.
and also what is the point of be upset about survivors do Genrushs? IT IS LITTERALY THEIR ONLY TASK IN THE TRIAL
Do you not see the double standard here? The killer's only objective is to kill survivors. Yet we do get upset about how they do that. Gen rushing is efficient survivor gameplay, tunneling, camping and slugging are efficient killer gameplay. The truth is that the most efficient way to play this game minimise interaction. Interaction is the only fun part about DBD as far as I am concerned and when that gets reduced, naturally the game becomes less fun in the process. This is only amplified by the fact that you also lose against the strategies.
If you as killer wont be able to get them then yea the survivors might be to strong, but that I would set up as skill.
The argument is basically: "It's efficient and it works, so it's skillful." I don't disagree, necessarily because "skill" can follow different definitions but that is also true for a killer playing mean. It works and it's efficient. If they camp brainlessly, then they lose. So by the same logic, you'd need to consider that a form of skill too.
It is like that behaviour of the killers made the survivors become more and more rushing and that makes the killer even more relying on these stuff.
It's not such a simple causality. The more efficient killers play, the more efficient survivors need to play to keep up. And the more efficient survivors play, the more efficient the killer needs to play to keep up. It's a cycle. Both sides can for their opponent to adapt.
Cause if you wont have survivors who make you do use that stuff, do not raise them!
This is strongly connected to the point before. Both sides force their respective other. It's the problem of the chicken and the egg.
For slugging would be my idea to set a counter like these for camping on the hooks, which starts if two or more survivors got slugged. It slowly fills when two survivors got slugged and start to fill faster with any more survivor who got slugged.
There had been a PTB in which the devs tested a solution for slugging. The result was a resounding rejection. Any base kit mechanic can and will be exploited somehow. Anything that allows survivors to pick themselves up is highly abusable. There is also a perk called Unbreakable (teachable of William "Bill" Overbeck), which allows you to pick yourself up once per match. This used to be a meta perk before 6.1.0 when play styles and meta perks shifted.
Your suggestion has some heavy restrictions though, so it might be worth to test it on a PTB.
Why slug them in the first place, so none of them can do anything anymore? Is that not in favour of the killer to be able to do so?
When survivors last longer than a few seconds in chase, then heavy slugging doesn't work and I see little reason to give survivors a helping hand when they play that terrible.
Cause I am sure these who really do it even in a normal survivor group just use it as a excuse that they do it because of top tier survivors.
That may be true but it doesn't change the fact that these strategies lead to more wins than playing nice does. The "nicer" you play, the more you need to outclass the survivors you play against or you'll lose. So you actively make the match harder on yourself. We always consider the strategies as killers making the game easier on themselves, but this is just as true. And nobody defined when survivors and killers are equally good. We don't even have the necessary norms to define that. The devs would need to define skill balance for us to even make this argument valid. But they haven't.
The only thing we have to go by is a balance of results. Which arguably is not where many think it is, because the last kill rates we got were from 6.1.0. The time when survivors killed themselves on hook every other match. The time when Eruption and CoB + Overcharge were meta and also the time when survivors still used OTR for an anti tunnel perk.
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Bloodlust is one of the reasons MfT was too strong. After 7 years, maps are still broken and many killers without strong chase powers have no option other than running after the survivor and building up BL to get a hit. If something like this is necessary, then how can a free 3% permanent speed boost be fine?
Other movement speed perks on the killer side are either easily avoidable, only active for a short time or need considerable effort to do something. PWYF is a perfect example for a perk with an overpowered effect that is still weak because the requirements are so harsh. 1 stack isn't worth much on most killers (one easier hit at best) and it still requires the killer to find and chase the obsession as well as drop the chase. That takes a lot of time. MfT on the other hand, activates for no effort whatsoever on your side and stays active permanently until you decide to deactivate it by healing.
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@MrDardon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607543#Comment_3607543
The thing which makes P100 kinda worth it are 2 guaranteed Ultra Rares in every Bloodweb which can be insane on Survivors and even most Killers.
You'd be right, if it wasn't for the abundance of these addons you have anyway. On Billy I typically try to go for 4-5 specific addons and ignore the most expensive ones. Still, I have built up a considerable stack of these. And if I were to actually not avoid but focuson them, this would be way higher.
You get so many addons and items anyway, that P100 makes little difference in the matter. Worst case scenario: You use a BP offering to get more points out of the match. Even if you go out with only 15k, that's easily 30k with a BP offering and 45k with the incentive. Statistically that should be more than enough to get back what you put into the match.
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@mecca said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607634#Comment_3607634
We always forget about general consensus as soon as we talk about fairness. Killers with a supposedly tremendous advantage in game because it's a horror game.
So, aura perks is like cheating. If killers have a big advantage why should they always know where survivors are?
I don't know how many hours you've spent in modern day DBD but you probably noticed that most games don't go on for longer than 10 minutes and survivors recently (about 6 years ago) discovered something, that is called "looping". If a killer has to spend a considerable amount of time just looking for survivors, then that is free gen progress and no pressure at all for the killer. Which is always a problem, because it leads to matches ending even quicker and less possibilities for the killer to win by hooks.
So the killer now has only 2 options. Give up, which as far as I am concerned is terrible, or win without going for many hooks (tunneling, slugging, camping, whatever works best). You can't get a hook in 60 seconds, if you need 30+ seconds to even find a survivor and when even that becomes impossible you cannot slow the survivors down enough to actually pose a threat. It also encourages the killer to play more defensive (camping hooks or 3 gens). This however is widely agreed upon to be pretty unfun.
The last time I've had survivors hide from me (really hide), it was one of the worst experiences I had ever had in this game. It was boring and nothing happened. They knew I was unable to track them, so they used this to minimise the interaction time with me. In a game where the only fun part is the interaction between killer and survivor, that is pretty horrible. Unfortunately, I wasn't allowed to face camp either, so I couldn't even force someone else out when I got a hook.
Killers always have a HUGE disadvantage, when they are not in chase. Survivors progress their objective at any given second. It doesn't matter, if you or the Dwight next to you don't sit on gens. Someone else does. For the killer that is not the case. They can't progress as long as they aren't after a survivor. This is what makes information in whatever form so important. If a killer can't play into their strengths and gen regression only works when they do (after downs / hooks), then how do you expect a killer to compete without info against survivors, who do not run into their face (99% of survivors)?
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607674#Comment_3607674
Perception vs. reality.
In reality, mostly everybody gets along. There’s really not much bullying, hate, or fighting.
The game is fine. SWF is fine.
You haven't seen me after finding a new hitbox they messed up. I start speaking in tongues and there is definitely a bit of hate. Mostly self hatred because I keep playing Billy even when the game seems to not approve in the slightest. 😜
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@HamsterEnjoyer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607418#Comment_3607418
Her rotation has a cool down to it and in order to pull something like this off you'd need to know the timing of how to do it without it over shooting
You do not need "know" the timing. You easily see how fast the beam moves compared to a survivor and can react to it. There is not need to follow an exact number value.
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@SirXenomorph said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607428#Comment_3607428
Yea with the part that most do care more of winning than play, not so much nice, but fair. It is just a rant I made. I do not see anything good in play like that. Sure you will get them maybe all, but you do not improve yourself in any way and just are a sore loser then if you do not accept that you just lost that round. It is just that.
I see where you're coming from. But isn't it better when people actually try everything in their power to win? The alternative is to just give up when it seems that match might not work out in your favor. Personally, I hate when a survivor kills themself on hook and ruins the entire match. Because it makes the rest of the match incredibly boring and takes away any tension.
Also, who decides when they should lose? If that is not on the players but the game, then it feels terrible because you might think: "I could have won, but the game forced the loss on me." or "I didn't lose against my opponent(s) but the game itself." And when it is on the players to decide when they should lose, why would they decide they should lose when they could still turn the match around by tunneling or camping? So this argument, as understandable as it is, is flawed in its core.
Ideally, we should aim to make these strategies less appealing and what we consider 'fun to play against' more appealing. The best way to do that in my opinion is by a "carrot and stick" approach. The killer should have a very clear incentive (outside of BP) to play normally, while camping should be a bit more risky. I am against removing camping as a whole though because the core of the killer role is the constant decision making and taking that away would not only dumb down the role but also make it less fun. The less agency you have in a game, the more predictable and boring it feels after all.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607529#Comment_3607529
I blame the new prestige system for that.
Going to P3 was a fun little goal, but all the way to P100? Unnecessary.
It would be the same, if there was no P100. It could be different, if there was an actual reward for it, though. But maybe that's just wishful thinking. It's more that we have quite the inflation when it comes to purchasables in the bloodweb. The decreased grind was a good thing overall but this is sadly also one of the consequences.
Reaching P100 is a nice to have but honestly, you get that eventually and then it's just kind of there. Like you haven't really anything to show for it. You don't suddenly become a comp level player and you have nothing to gain from it. If there were some special cosmetics or anything like that, it could mean that players actually would try to get more characters to P100.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607525#Comment_3607525
We don't care either way but wouldn't showing who's in a SWF shatter that coping illusion? Or are we thinking about it wrong?
I think it would lead to a massive amount of lobby dodging and killers giving up from the start because they think they can't win anyway, if it's a SWF. Maybe it could work, if it was displayed after the match but before that, I don't think any good would come of it.
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@bloodyknife said:
I have 25 upvotes and I look at all these comments saying they got no issues whatsoever. Are they Behaviour behind these accounts?
You got me. Now hand over your email password so I can "fix" these things and also add 5000 auric cells as compensation. 😈
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@Agt_Scully said:
The worst offenders are Killers who hardcore camp, proxy camp, and tunnel using Nurse or Blight after 4 hooks with 5 gens left. Its in the Killers best interest to back off and gain more Bloodpoints, Pips, Score, etc. Simply destroying a team in minutes by using all the noob techniques is pure evil, especially when you are using a top tier Killer and the game is already stacked in your favor.
Those people don't care about BP anymore. I mean, why would they? Prestige is nothing more than a number to tell others how many BP you dumped into that character and if you're gonna play with fulll meta loadouts every game anyway, there is no need to unlock different perks either. The amount of items / offerings / addons you get is so high, that you'll never run out anyway, so nobody has any reason to play for BP, if they only care about winning.
That goes for both sides.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
It is not an illusion. It is bad Killer players thinking they lose due to SWF and not because of their own mistakes.
Does not help that there are certain very vocal streamers at giga MMR and in the sweatiest region who advocate this opinion.
I would say that goes for both sides. Many players seem to believe that only top tier SWFs can achieve even basic results. I have played against countless SWFs that played pretty bad and against countless solos that were amazing. I play almost exclusively solo survivor, when I don't play killer, but really, for me it's mostly other people that play in a SWF that throw and not other solos.
For the most part it really doesn't matter, if the survivors play in a SWF. It only matters how they play. A coordinated group that beats the killer in the 1v4 will always have an advantage but that can happen in both situations, if all survivors play somewhat good.
This is one of the reasons I am against the killer being told who plays in a SWF. It's a natural coping mechanism to find reasons why one couldn't win but when you base your opinions on balance solely on that, it becomes an issue. After all, if there is nothing you can do, then there is no need to improve and someone else, who would have played better surely couldn't have gotten better results, could they?
The situations in which one side really couldn't do anything to win are few and far between.
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@skylerbound said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607505#Comment_3607505
Well I can’t clone myself, unhook everyone and myself and do gens at the same time. Again… this is soloq and you get matched with whomever is on at the time
Still, don't blame it on the perks, then. If your team plays that terrible, then you cannot expect anything else. Whoever plays better and uses the better stuff wins. If you run full meta perks but play poorly, then naturally you will lose. Pretty badly.
This is not a problem with regression perks but a problem with matchmaking, which should never even be attempted to be fixed by perk rebalancing.
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0-1 gens done? I hate to break it to you, but that is on you guys. The strongest regression perks only work, when the killer gets a down. If you go down so frequently, then you're doing something wrong. Mostly I lose 2-3 gens for my first down, so maybe instead of blaming everything on regression, you could focus a bit more on actually standing more than 20 seconds in chase.
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I agree with @jesterkind, if players want to play that way, then they should be pushed to play against opponents, who can deal with that, so that others don't have to. It's the same with people that use the strongest loadouts to get carried.