WesCravenFan
WesCravenFan
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@Mane said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3387991#Comment_3387991
Killers shouldn't camp, tunnel or slug at 5 gens.
And there's that "5 gens" argument again.
If Killers can't do those things at 5 gens, why are you allowed to heal, flashlight save, and loop at 0 hooks?
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Why do you need that overly specific information? It is on the ground, unused.
And the perk used to destroy items. It was removed.
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Against good Survivors, they will drag out your entire frenzy timer and then all you get is one it. This effectively makes Legion a killer without a power against players that can do this. Good teams will never let you get the 5 hit off.
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@TWS001 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3387992#Comment_3387992
Oh I see, is that on Level 4? Got to Level 85 of the Rift a few weeks ago so have been doing older tome challenges instead of worrying about the current one.
Yeah. I avoided it for many of the reasons listed in this thread. I literally did the six, SIX count of Blood Debt first.
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@TWS001 said:
Do you mean the achievement for causing 50 killer attacks to miss before taking a vault?
I got it fine on PS4, but since switching to PS5 two months ago, it seems to be stuck at 35/50 for me. Just can't get anything else to register.
Or the current tome challenge to force killers to miss you a few times.
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@piplup55 said:
BHVR please reconsider your position on camping, tunneling and slugging. I've been trying the new PTB and to be honest the changes on healing were not that bad when playing against "fair" killers who went for multiple chases and didn't tunnel off hook. The real problem were the killers that did use those strategies to secure a 4k. They had it easier than before because of the healing changes:
Camping is easier because a good chunk of the hooking phase goes down before someone can heal/self-heal. Doing gens is now slower (90 secs) so staying on gens while the killer camps someone from 1st hook til sacrifice is not an option.
Tunneling is easier because after getting someone off the hook it's impossible to heal fast enough before the killer comes back. Hiding is not an option either, cause the killer usually comes back to the hook right after they receive the unhook notification so they have time to check around covers or follow the unhooked person's moans before a heal can be completed.
Slugging is easier because survivors can't pick themselves up and recovering and healing are slower because of the healing changes.
Please BHVR, focus your attention on these problems first before making more changes to the base mechanics. By allowing these strategies you take away everybody's fun: survivors' cause they don't want to play gen simulator AND want to be able to make a comeback and killers' cause they feel like they need to engage in these strategies to win.
If you take care of these issues, you can then revisit killer strength so they don't feel the need to resort to such strategies.
SOME SUGGESTIONS:
- Double hook timer on both phases
- Make hook timer stop if killer is in close proximity and not in a chase or looking directly at the hooked person from afar
- Remove hook timers completely but make unhooking attempts progress hook state
- Base current DS on every unhook until conspicuous action or someone else is hooked (remove survivor collision while active and don't let it activate from locker grabs). Doesn't work after exit gates are powered.
- Make it so hook states are shared. For example, no one can die on hook until 5 total hooks are done. Survivors directly die on second hook after these 5 total hooks.
- Base unbreakable like in that past PTB, but make something like a new status effect called Helpless which always affects people that enter the dying state. While Helpless, you can't get up by yourself. Killer addons and perks could affect this status effect.
- Let dying survivors crawl and recover at the same time (something like: stay still = 100% recovery speed, move and recover = 45% recovery speed and 45% crawling speed, move and not recover = 100% crawling speed)
All these changes incentivize survivors to play smart and cooperating while incentivizing killers to go for multiple people instead of focusing just one person.
You really hate it if a killer does ANYTHING to win except mindlessly chase people through connected tiles until all the gens are done, huh?
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I love Dredge and Frosty is one of my favorite costumes.
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@Nirgendwohin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3387974#Comment_3387974
i'm on your side that its meaningless but people like progress and have a goal. when they are denied their goal by things that are not in their control, then people complain.
I think this is why I try to keep my goal to be to hit 85 in every rift.
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@Nirgendwohin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3387930#Comment_3387930
its the only metric you have ingame.
A metric for... what? It's meaningless. All it does is track a monthly reward stipend.
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@Skill_issue said:
the proposed healing changes doesn't affect your ability to genrush...heck even overzealous is getting a buff and you don't have to waste time healing...i guarantee your matches are going to be much shorter with the new changes and the nerfing of gen regression perks on the killer side. slap on a resilience/overzealous/stake out/fogwise with a good toolbox and you will still be able to listen to music and chill
the medkit and circle of healing changes are also needed...it was always ridiculous that survivors could heal mid chase (and very easy to do all you need is to predrop pallets and heal quickly)
as for killers you still are going to need more chase and aura reading perks than gen regression and try to get those downs as quickly as possible
your thoughts?
You spelled "SWF" wrong.
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@BougieBlackChick said:
I would agree with that change. I’ve been saying that depippping is more often than not unfair because it happens due to circumstances outside of your control.
-Other survivors hook suiciding or DCing immediately making it impossible for you to play long enough to safety pip at least.
-Killer being AFK the entire match either just cuz, or in order to drop MMR so you can’t get any chase/evasion points or altruism points. Or killer DC.
-Killer finding you first and tunneling you out immediately at 5 gens or face calling you out at 5 gens.
Its not fair to lose pips that you earned because of how others play. I’ve been saying they should automatically allow safety pips for any DCs in match. However I’d be in favor of taking away depips but just making pips a bit harder. As long as you keep the pips you earned.
This would cause any SWF having a bad game to have one member DC to game throw and then rescue the rest of the team's pips.
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People still care about pips?
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Things no one asked for?
We actually do ask for these things. Read the forums. We want the perks nerfed and the meta changed. Not EVERY change in this update, but at least half.
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I think all Trapper traps should load into every trial in the set and locked position. You'd still have to manually pick up ones you want elsewhere, but at least they'd enter play with some use.
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@BarnesFlam said:
Remove the micro-transactions that reeks of FOMO, it's not that hard.
You think Veterans are leaving the game because certain costumes leave after 6 weeks?
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When I load in and hear that gong of the Lament Configuration spawning.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3386540#Comment_3386540
I'm sorry you had to go through that :(
I don't like to doompost, but if these changes go through, Solo might be getting a LOT worse
I think you are right. And I think the reason why is because the things that are nerfing killers are more a high skill / MMR problem and the things nerfing survivors are a low skill / MMR problem.
In other words, at the top this is crushing killers more and at the bottom this is crushing survivors more. I am not looking forward to the laughable 86 second Mangled Self-Care in the corner. That's 4 seconds less than a gen.
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I was onboard with the HUD hiding, but @Pulsar makes a good point about the Solo Queue aspect.
Blindness is unfortunately just one of those things that will always disproportionately screw Solos. And right now the Solo experience is beyond miserable. I played nothing but Survivor last night for six hours. We only got all 5 gens done three times and I only escaped once.
Adding a Blind=No HUD aspect would cause perks like Fearmonger to just destroy Solo.
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When Dead Hard users cry about the death of their crutch perk.
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You go on the hook.
If you get unhooked, and I come back and you are still there, standing idle under the hook, I'll leave you alone.
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You were blatantly tunneling as you were loaded into the map.
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I have Skilled Huntress.
I'm scared to do the Nurse one where you have to do a series of blinks and land a Grab.
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A bully squad is any groups of Survivors that come into the game with the intent of making the Killer as miserable as possible.
No, going for a flashlight save doesn't make you a bully. HOWEVER, if you refuse to touch gens because all you are doing is following the killer around specifically do flashlight saves, now you are bullying the killer.
Is sabotaging a hook bullying? No. But it becomes that if the whole team went full Sabo, complete with Boil Over and running up stairs every single time.
It's not about the mechanics. It's about making the killer feel like garbage instead of doing your objective.
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My issue is the difficulty disparity. Michael just has to tier up a few times, which is literally staring at people. Artist has to get downs with her birds. Legion has to hit four people in Feral Frenzy. Demo has to get fully charged shreds.
The difficulty is all over the place disparately for roughly the same reward.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3385201#Comment_3385201
As much as I hate to say it, I very much agree with you on this one.
Difficulty, in of itself, is a hard thing to measure to begin with, since some things come naturally to some but not to others. I personally find Killer significantly easier and more relaxing to play than Survivor since I can control the flow of the match with my own decisions, meanwhile as Survivor, I feel like I am at the mercy of my teammates; other people have an easier time with Survivor than Killer. Everyone handles things differently, so difficulty is measured different from person to person.
Furthermore, "difficulty" and "application of skill" are sometimes non-factors in DBD, just because something is skillful to do does not necessarily make it smart to do (and vice versa). It is often better to make the smarter play than the skillful play, yet by doing so, the other side will always complain about how it is unfair (this applies to Survivor and Killer). The highest possible difficulty that can be achieved does not matter if people are always going to play smart and take the path of least resistance, Billy's low pick-rate is a prime example of this. But this could be it's own topic so I digress.
I once heard it said that the best definition of "lucky" is where skill and opportunity meet and intersect and I think there's some truth to that.
You could be a great looper, but if you have nothing to work with you are just holding W in a dead zone. You could have an amazing tile setup, but if you don't know how to use it you probably go down trying to camp a pallet. Have neither and you just die. Have both and you can last a long time. But only some of that is in your control.
Like with your example of controlling the flow of the match, there's not much you can do as a Survivor if one teammate is AFK getting crows, a second teammate is trying to get the killer to farm, and the third teammate is off trying to complete a challenge by opening chests. You just aren't winning that game.
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I am not crazy about the Dead Hard on Protection Hit. All that does is encourage more of the playstyle that Dead Hard users do, which is try to harass the killer. This will turn Dead Hard users into annoying fruit flies that just hang out around chased people, hoping the Killer tries to hit them so they can get their perk charged.
Yeah. That's what I want in Solo Queue. Me getting chased by the Killer and a teammate that, instead of doing gens, is trying to get the Killer to hit him to power his perk.
Nice try, IHOP.
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@Tostapane said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3384947#Comment_3384947
This. This is the kind of attitude that i DESPITE: those are often the same people that in the game will bm the other players in the endchat no matter what will happen. They want to dismiss valid criticism and try to discredit good reasoning with a STUPID sentence that doesn't bring anything positive/constructive
I literally had someone this week try to defend Dead Hard by saying I'm bad at using it as a Survivor. Apparently there's nothing wrong with Dead Hard as a killer, because I have no skill in using it WHILE I AM PLAYING KILLER.
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It will never be "easier than it has ever been" for either side.
Killers no longer have instant death murders with the old Moris.
Survivors no longer have true infinites and insta-pop gens.
Claiming either side is in its easiest state ever is just a flat out lie. Like, it's not even an opinion at this point. It's like saying 2+2=37.
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I want Blast Mine to get its unused refund back.
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@09SHARKBOSS said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3384640#Comment_3384640
im being genuine it works really well
I've never seen any value in Furtive Chase.
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These killers are ranked waaay too high.
We have to go deeper.
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@09SHARKBOSS said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3384499#Comment_3384499
jolt/surveillance/furtive/devour hope
.............
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@ad19970 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3384550#Comment_3384550
That nerf is kind of needed when considering the large nerfs to the main regression perks. The entire idea is to give killers more slowdown by playing well and injuring a lot of survivors, and less by simply equipping perks and kicking gens.
I think it's a very good change, and doubt they will revert it, because of the slowdown perks also getting nerfed. I can see it going down to 20 seconds however, if too many people feel that 24 seconds is overkill.
I get that part, I just think there should be more incentive to heal a teammate and less selfish actions like Self-Care.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
Imo it has the potential to be the best update DbD has ever got.
Outside of the Billy nerf, that one is stupid
My only request is they roll back the base speed for healing when healing others. The self nerf is fine.
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I loved Hawkins. It was a lot of fun. But I love indoor maps. I prefer them to outdoor maps. I had so much fun taking Deathslinger in there. It also made a lot of Myers builds viable.
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While I don't necessarily agree with the tactic of running four slowdown perks, which is miserable to go against in Solo Queue, I am now worried what defense killers are going to have against highly skilled players slamming gens and leaving. There is almost no good gen defense perks left. I guess we have to settle for Jolt?
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I've seen one NOED in 6 months and we blew it up in less than a minute when its aura lit up like a neon bar sign.
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I love how every patch is the worst patch ever. Comic Book Guy would be proud.
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I think we need to see how long this trap removal takes now. If it is borderline instant, this will be a problem. If it takes several seconds, then it MIGHT be fair.
I feel like survivors should take at LEAST four times as long to undo a killer power as a killer does using it, to make up for the time loss.
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BHVR: *Changes literally anything.*
Community: "This is going to make camping and tunneling even worse!"
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3382314#Comment_3382314
Then survivor outplayed you when that happen. Most often dh is used on prediction and possible for killer to outplay. Few times though I havd outplayed dh and they still been able to drop pallet so that really only change it needs you should not be able to drop pallets or vault an window after you used it for few secs.
It doesn't matter. That's my point. You can try to play the "Skill Issue" card all you want. That power SHOULDN'T EVEN EXIST IN THE FIRST PLACE.
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"Due to player feedback about this developer update, we've decided not to move forward with the bloodweb changes. Billy will still be nerfed, though."
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I hate the term "party game".
Smash Bros. is a party game.
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Even for people that do not actively play Billy, this is gonna make the Billy daily ritual even more miserable.
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Are you implying Killers should be FORCED to hook you?
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The problem with your idea is we would need to buff those low pick rate perks to power levels that EXCEED Dead Hard and Circle of Healing and that's just insane.
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@Rudjohns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3383152#Comment_3383152
Oof, sounds like a...
... busted perk, yes. Hence the insane pick rate.
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@Pink_Ronin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3383152#Comment_3383152
So you've never used it. That explains why your opinion is complete garbage. Go play 10 games with DH and then come back and tell us how easy it is. If you are hitting 5 DH'S a game the issue isn't DH and I don't even need to tell you what the issue is because you should know what I'm gonna say.
That's a lot of words to try use "skill issue" like some kind of weird uno reverse card.
Especially since it changes literally nothing I said. At all.
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To me the important thing is you can no longer Dead Hard on first chase. That is where the most damage comes from in terms of lost gen pressure. If you are REALLY behind as killer the survivors cannot use Dead Hard to make it worse because no one has been hooked yet to give it to them.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3382519#Comment_3382519
There is a huge chunk of perks that do not see any use, and they are not improved with the removal of others.
Think of it this way: No matter how badly you nerf Dead Hard, Red Herring will -never- be a good or worthwhile perk.
Maybe not, but that doesn't justify Dead Hard's existence. Hit negation shouldn't be in the game in any way, shape, or form. I don't even agree with the Styptic Agent, but even that has several barriers behind it in the form of needing to bring a medkit, and add-on, only working once, etc.
Hit negation is a terrible idea.