Tostapane
Tostapane
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378972#Comment_3378972
....so you nerfed yourself hard and still 4K'd against a meta SWF "bully" squad?
You aren't really making a good case for Survivors being too strong here.
... you wanna see only what you want to see it seems... i just stated how i won that match: not for my skill, not for theirs since the pushed gens like madmens, but because in the end they were slugged by protecting at all costs their mate... literally 4k because blind altruism where they could easily get a 3 escape... as always you are focusing on the final result, not taking into the equation the gameplay... you can see from this point of view, but then you can't complain if there are people like patrick that says that dbd is like hockey (if you get what i mean)
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@Firellius said:
No because I usually don't do those tactics, but if you don't, you can bet that survivors will have an easy time to finish all the gens (the killer is only 1 while survivors are 4: if you are busy with a survivor, there will be 3 of them free of doing generators, but even in the case you have 2 survivors always busy due to keeping them busy to do saves, 2 survivors will finish all the generators in less than 4 minutes... This is pure and simple math) while you'll end the match with few points/hooks...
Well, you already got this one wrong, because once you get that first hook, most of the time the gameflow will have only -one- survivor on a gen. One in chase, one on rescue duty, and one waiting for the save. That's one survivor left, not two.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378983#Comment_3378983
What are you talking about with 'unfair chances'? You WON. Whatever they brought was clearly not unfair because you STEAMROLLED them.
You can't have it both ways. You can't run tactics that clearly overrule whatever 'unfair' thing survivors bring and then complain that THEY are being unfair to you.
You wanna complain about BNP, I'll gladly be there with you. But as long as you cling to this idea that you're 'forced' to tunnel and camp, you give the BNP a reason to exist. They NEED that stuff to stand a chance against the tactics you pull out. That's what happened after DS got gutted: Without actual anti-tunnelling protection, the only counterplay to tunnelling became genrushing.
Every time you employ these tactics, you are part of the problem, and all you are showing here is that the game is either perfectly balanced in this terrible state, or that killers are overpowered.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378987#Comment_3378987
And you will have made plenty of mistakes as well and won in spite of them. But you're not in a position where you can objectively judge that, because it's way harder to judge your own performance.
Listen, you want my advice? You want 'chill' matches where you can just slap on whatever and have fun?
Don't. Kill. Anyone.
Tank your MMR. Slap, chase, and get everyone on two hooks and then just AFK or just go for scares but do not kill anyone. You want to have chill matches, you want to have 'for fun' matches, you have to dedicate to that.
1 in order to have that kind of scenario you have to find survivors that are bad both at hiding and looping... we both know that it's easier to be said than done when it comes to people that know how to play
2 the point is not winning par se, but having matches that i can enjoy that wouldn't require to be "mean" in order to get some results (aka the same goddamn playstyle)... add that in some matches you'll feel powerless for how much a map can be safe (just to make an example the decimated borgo with normal m1 killer is pure pain... i won matches with those kind of killers in that map, but this doesn't mean that i had fun or that the match was balanced and interactive with chases... there are situations that just require a certain gameplay if you want to avoid to get steamrolled sadly, especially with certain people, one of these is to relying to the survivor's excessive altruism). Also if i employed those tactics is because they are forcing me to do so, not because they are reacting to tunneling/camping since i would never be the 1st to use those tactics unless it's necessary; think about it: why i should play with nerfing addons with those kind of builds that aren't even suited for that gameplay? For winning at all costs? i would have used other addons and other builds if i wanted to win every game and/or playing by tunneling people to death, don't you think? Not to mention that the only scenario when i'll tunnel from the start is if that specific survivor is acting toxic for no reason (tbag and pointing after a stun, clicking with the flashlight)
3 no mistakes in that case since they went down like flies (if you are referring to trickster case, regarding my match with wesker i wasted a bit too much time the 1st chase in the main building) despite they choosed the map but anyway... don't kill anyone? hmf, i've already tried in the past but there are 2 main issues regarding this:
- i won't ever let escape people that want to be toxic toward me or other survivors (sandbagging people, hiding on purpose for the entire match just to get the hatch without doing nothing the entire trial, etc etc...) for no reasons (wanna be annoying? fine, i can do the same ya know? Call it karma but i HATE people that get away with toxic behavior and in my book they must pay for their actions)
- doing that require too many matches before i even notice the difference and i don't have all this patience. In the past i did 15 games in a row when i left everyone escaping on purpose and after doing that my 1st "normal" match was aganist a comp premade (i checked their profiles in the lobby, they were all friends and in their bio they claimed to have won certain tournaments)
anyway, i saw the things that they want to implement now and i can confirm that this game will be dead for good for me (they are literally incentivizing tunneling over protecting gens and going for mixed hooks) since as i stated in my post that i'm tired of seeing the same stuff/perks/gamplay every game, i'm just sorry to have wasted so much money on this game because i saw the potential of creating a good game with a good and non toxic playerbase (i would be hypocrite if i said that i didn't make some friendship through this game, but aside those few positive notes, everything else was/is filled with toxicity), but the devs are afraid (or just ignore it because even those people buy skins/battle pass/contents) to take actions toward those people
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378972#Comment_3378972
if survivors are good they'll give you an hard time even without the usual bs (but still they were a premade, with the map choosed by them and a brand new part and 2 dead hard aganist a NERFED wesker with only deadlock as gen defense)... those ones were extremely fast to do gen and they were decent at looping, but as i said before i won because at a certain point i didn't wasted time by hooking, just slugging everyone of them cause they were too much efficent with the genspeed
So they pulled out all the stops and you purposely held back and you still came out with a 4K where the survivors didn't stand much of a chance.
You're making a really good case for this stuff being OP as heck, dude.
Decent doesn't mean that they were at my level... They knew how to use loops but they weren't good at chaining them together and they were too much altruistic, this is the difference... I won but not because of my skills, nor because they were really good, but because they did a lot of mistakes in the end just to protect their mate (they ended slugged for that reason... Because they were OBSESSED to protect their mate).
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378976#Comment_3378976
1 as I said I'm trying to have chill matches so unlike the other people I'm using NON META STUFF (hence why this build with those addons), is that hard to understand?
You're not playing chill though! You're busting out whatever you need to pull out the win, that's not playing chill, that's sweating!
If you always sweat, the MMR isn't going to suddenly drop off a cliff just because you swapped Overcharge for Gift of Pain. It's going to take time for the score to recalibrate as it tries to estimate how competent you are -without- camping, tunnelling and slugging.
Once it does that, you'll have your chill matches.
Not to pull out the win, TO GET POINTS and the time needed to play this cursed game! Is that so hard to understand? Back in 2019 I could do those kind of matches without resorting to those tactics, but nowdays I can't anymore, and I'm tired of all the UNFAIR chances (especially if we consider the awful map design) that survivors bring with them...
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378804#Comment_3378804
just like killers aren't complaining about getting tot kills par match, but the fact that they are FORCED to play in that way if they want reach their goal
What IS your goal?
Because if your goal is anything that's not 'win literally as much as possible, no matter what', you are absolutely not forced to tunnel or camp or anything of the sort.
Did you ever consider the possibility that your reliance on an overly powerful tactic has inflated your MMR to a rank where you aren't supposed to be?
No because I usually don't do those tactics, but if you don't, you can bet that survivors will have an easy time to finish all the gens (the killer is only 1 while survivors are 4: if you are busy with a survivor, there will be 3 of them free of doing generators, but even in the case you have 2 survivors always busy due to keeping them busy to do saves, 2 survivors will finish all the generators in less than 4 minutes... This is pure and simple math) while you'll end the match with few points/hooks...
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@Trollinmon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378804#Comment_3378804
No actual good killers are complaining about how op survivor is or how they need to camp and tunnel to win games. Hexy is a good killer that sweats on lower tier killers and is complaining that they need to nerf killer because the role is disgustingly overpowered. He basically wins every game he plays as killer. He even wins games that he shouldn't but gets the 4k because he camps and tunnels. Even talks about how the game is boring right now because soloq is bad and killer is too easy.
Lets go over the picture. First off the team in the picture looks to either be a 4 soloq or 2 solo and a duo. Can infer this by looking at the survivor perks and see the top 2 scoring survivors running a more soloq build. I would call your build just bad. If you play at the soft cap you would know deadlock by itself is not a very good perk. This is because smart survivor teams will 99 a gen and have your deadlock always proc on that gen. You either run deadlock to camp or pair it with a regression perk like PR to counter the 99 strat. If you find DL to be strong as a solo game delay then you are just not facing good survivors. Lightborn is just XD why would you run that perk and enfury I find to not be worth the perk slots outside of m1 killers.
1 as I said I'm trying to have chill matches so unlike the other people I'm using NON META STUFF (hence why this build with those addons), is that hard to understand?
2 just because a streamer say something doesn't mean that the streamer speak the absolute truth, quite the contrary... Also see my previous supposition about streamers mmr...
3 did I say that deadlock is strong? Never said that, but it's the only perk that killer have that's GRANTED unlike the scourge hooks (can be denied by simple map rng, placing them in places that you'll never go or by simply Sabo the hook) or overcharge/cob combo (a single skill check will completely counter 2 perks, think how much is strong /s)
4 in certain loops wesker IS a m1 killer, there's no way that you can play around certain loops due to being too much safe or having messed up hitboxes...
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378804#Comment_3378804
What exactly is this supposed to show?
We have no idea how good or bad the Survivors were. I'd wager on bad, considering they didn't get many points and are running some pretty meh stuff.
that was an example: if survivors are good they'll give you an hard time even without the usual bs (but still they were a premade, with the map choosed by them and a brand new part and 2 dead hard aganist a NERFED wesker with only deadlock as gen defense)... those ones were extremely fast to do gen and they were decent at looping, but as i said before i won because at a certain point i didn't wasted time by hooking, just slugging everyone of them cause they were too much efficent with the genspeed (this explain why everyone here made few points, me included). If i wanted to put a screenshot about survivors that were bad but they were EXTREMELY annoying due to all the BS that they used, then i've another screenshot that will tell you without doubt that those survivors were bad just by looking at the killer that i was using and the map that they putted
(nerfed trickster with a build that was made for the purpose of farming together with the others btw)
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377693#Comment_3377693
The 50:50 rule is simple on survivor's side. 50 escape and 50 death.
On killer's side is more complicating. If apply 50:50 from survivor's side, it would be 50 kill and 50 escape.
Though many killers think its 50 win and 50 lose, and to each of their own, win conditions are different, some only see 4K as winning. Means two match, having 3K each match considered 2 loses. But to Devs they're already far exceed the kill rate that they should be (75%).
Survivors are getting use to 40% escape, what makes them complain is tunneling,camping, and recently with new found 3 Gens.
just like killers aren't complaining about getting tot kills par match, but the fact that they are FORCED to play in that way if they want reach their goal, not to mention that some people should be punished for the toxicity showed in matches but since we know that devs on that matter won't ever punish someone for this (i did so MANY reports with screenshots as proofs, where people were using slurs, death threats and even some of them admitting that they were cheating... all of them unanswered obviously). The perfect examples was the 2 matches that i did 2 days ago with Wesker and another 2 that i did yesterday: one in rpd where i played with the survivor's rules (going for mixed hooks, not camping and not tunneling), got a 0/4 despite short chases (would have been shorter if wasn't for the usual dead hard that all the survivors in that match had) because they actually played to be optimal (finishing gens almost completed despite i was at 2 meters from them, bodyblocking for denying a successful chase, etc etc)... they had fun, but for me it was only frustrating seeing people tryharding so much and having their asses saved by perks (put also adrenaline into the equation)... 2nd day i still was rather annoyed for being punished for playing well so i went again for the usual playstyle that survivors hate (occasional proxicamping and focusing on tunneling the 1st survivor out from the game asap...). Perks, survivor's skills and items/addons were similar to the previous matches, but wanna know what changed? i actually had a better result on everything, both in kills (3/4 and 4/4) and in hooks (11/12 hooks and 6 hooks for the 2nd one cause in that match i wasn't giving importance to hooking people due to their speed at doing generators aganist the 6 and 4 hooks of the 1st day) by playing in a way that i DON'T ENJOY (but generally speaking i doubt that people enjoy this playstyle generally speaking) than by playing in the way that this game is "supposed" to be played.
P.s: this is another reason why i made this thread: if developers are giving tools for countering the unfun tactics that killer can use it could be ABSOLUTELY fine IF they'll compensate by making viable the GOOD GAMEPLAY, but this is not the case unfortunately and personally speaking i'm tired to being forced to play in that way in order to keep up the pace aganist good survivors... i play for having fun, not for work like streamers do... i should have also a screenshot of one of those matches...
for those that think that i'm not a good killer btw mind you that i was playing with a nerfing addon since usually i play with those ones for chilling (few people on this forum will probably have the guts to do those things btw)... a pity that the survivors that i'm aganist won't EVER do the same thing (especially since they'll abuse map offering whenever they had the chance)
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@KingFieldShipper said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378355#Comment_3378355
It was never confirmed, and it wasn't a different mmr, it was supposedly them not being matched with players that had high reports of cheating. I can tell you right now, most, if not all of them would be pissed if they were getting easier matches. Hell, ohtofu says that constantly and is partially why he's burnt out. And if that were the case, why is otz struggling to get a dredge streak going?
I've also said this before and I'll say it again, you can't judge either side's players just by watching a stream - we all have games where we are not on top of things or make stupid decisions. It doesn't mean they are bad quality survivors or killers they just had a bad match.
Mmr just barely functions because it is too lenient. It has the slight edge above ranks, but I wouldn't say it's perfect by any means, because at least this is somewhat consistent. I don't want seperate queues, but what I'd like to see is at least have an option of being strict on mmr because I want these sweaty seal team 6 squads constantly like people on here love to chatter about. I shouldn't have to consider scrimming and joining a baby comp team to even get challenged in this game. Queue times are good and all but I just feel like ######### most of the time because I am constantly going against survivors that don't even have a chance the moment they load into my lobby. From my own experience I get the same quality of matches on par with <insert streamer here>. And I spend a lot of time in this game playing killer, maybe 80 hours+ every few weeks, and win most of my matches. And yet, I'm here, thinking, why the hell am I getting survivors that have significantly less hours than me constantly in my lobby.
for me it's the inverse situation: i've come to a point where i ALWAYS have smurf accounts, people with 3 times my playtime or people who have vac bans/game bans registered... at this point i'm starting to think that i'm going aganist cheaters all the time because there are too many things in my matches that don't seems right (for example 3 gen pop while i'm chasing someone despite i've deadlock active, people that seems/ARE faster to run after turning a corner that have no LoS, people that won't miss a SINGLE dead hard, etc etc)... at this point no one can be sure about the MMR system, but i'm sure of 1 thing: it's PURE gargbage and it's making my matches unplayable (and the few ones that aren't suspitious aren't funny either because you get potatoes, making chases boring for how much easy those will be, or complete SWF that will require the same unfunny gameplay in order to keep up the pace with their efficiency)
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@Rizzo said:
Let's try to tone it down a notch and keep it civil, please.
Aye. Fair enough
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378359#Comment_3378359
I've literally played in beginner comp and Community Cups.
If it takes you a MINUTE and a half to down Survivors in pubs, that is entirely on you. Unless you're playing a set-up Killer.
And in those matches there are certain rules about perks/items/skins used... Say what you want, but "comp" plays is definitely EASIER compared to pub matches IF survivors have more or less THE SAME skill since there are no rules in pub matches that deny the use of the strongest stuff... (not to mention that in pub there are also a lot of hidden cheaters)
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377343#Comment_3377343
It only carries the game if killers can't counter it and simply swing into it constantly which is avoidable. And you do realise for a game with any balance killers are going to have "bad games" 40-50% of the time.
If a surv is good at chase they are a nightmare but again if you can counterplay them it's easy enough to win. I went against a team with 2 focussed on bullying one genrushing and one flipping between the two tactics. bodyblocking, head on playing and flashlighting constantly. And I got still got a 4k. And all this with a subpar build on demo. Not a particularly strong killer. And the funny thing? I only had 2 useful perks, pain res and nowhere to hide. Nothing to help in chase. Aside from that I was running distressing and thrill of the hunt. All were running DH and I swung into it once. And I was just M1ing, maybe hit like 1 shred.
Still one gen left and practically untouched by the time I killed the other 3 hunted down the gen rusher.
Tell me then, how can you counter it near pallets? That's right, YOU CAN'T. Please, we both know that the main issue of this perk is that in certain situations it can't be countered at all... In the open? A joke to counter. Near windows? A lot more tricky but still doable. Near pallets? You eat the pallet or took the dead hard with the consequences that it brings (pallet saved for another future chase and the hit survivor gaining another health state that will essentially reset the chase)
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378172#Comment_3378172
First off, the Killers in that hypothetical tournament are real. That tournament was real, it had no restrictions.
Guess what? The most meta Killers do fine against the most meta Survivors. They had a 2.16 Kill rate.
Likewise, if it takes you 90 seconds to get a down, that's unfortunately a skill issue. Everybody saying DH scripts are common is coping imo.
All your rant did was solidify that you need some solid coaching, but you could end up being a very good player. You certainly seem like you have the drive to do so.
It isn't super hard to keep a winrate of well over 80% in pubs.
Again, BOLD OF YOU (and mostly arrogant) to assume my skills without even seeing one of my matches... If you think that's doable searching a survivor, chasing and down a survivor who play safe and throw pallets or that can links loops without troubles (all this paired with an awful map rng, dead hard and other bs stuff) in less than 90 seconds with a killer that isn't the blight or the nurse then I've a news for you: you are facing bad survivors. Period
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378182#Comment_3378182
How do you know Fog Whisperers have their own MMR? When BHVR did their MMR testing last year, the Fog Whisperers I watched had the same long wait times that everyone else did. Plus when they play survivor they don't seem to escape more than anyone else
They said it once (they even indirectly admit it when there was the huge wave of cheaters that were plaguing dbd and they said that they were doing something to protect the streamers because they were the most targeted ones...), also I keep repeating myself: look at the average skills that survivors have in most of their matches, if they can even do win streaks this should tell you the level of survivors that they get in their lobbies...
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@philward1953 said:
This is EXTREMELY telling in regards to the community's perception on tunneling on BOTH sides.
While Otz obviously isn't an "average" DBD player, I think he is still comparable enough to be an efficient look at the player base.
Also, for further reading, Otz says he played around 60 games, with different killers, mostly using non-meta perks/addons. He also set a rule that prevented him from hooking a survivor twice in a row, which fully prevents him from tunneling.
- His 80% win rate is mostly indicative of his own skill, but this does have some weight when it comes to showing how killers do not have to tunnel EVERY game, specifically right off the bat at 5/4 gens. It's not like killers get sh*t-stomped if they don't tunnel for every game. Sometimes, it is a skill issue, and not the fault of the survivors if a killer is put into a position where they must tunnel to get ahead. There is a time and a place for tunneling, but its not like you'll 100% loose a 4k if you don't (at least in scenarios where a killer isn't at extreme risk like at 5 gens remaining and such).
- The fact that survivors still told him he "tunneled" after he specifically did not hook the same person two hooks in a row is absurd, and is something a chunk survivor player base needs to wake up to. If a killer does not go for, down, and hook a survivor who just got unhooked immediately, they did NOT tunnel. That is not what tunneling is, and it's insane that people think that what Otz did in a lot of scenarios is tunneling. I see the accusations of tunneling as sheer copium.
- As for people who want to be tunneled, that's fine, as some people just want chase interaction. Considering how boring gens are, I think that's understandable. I also don't think there's anything wrong with a killer giving what that survivor wants, or not. When a survivor begs to be tunneled and enter chase, its up to the killer to say yes or no, but the survivor can't turn around an sh*t on the killer for "tunneling" if they then go down. It's their fault they were the killer's next target.
- I have no thoughts on a team trying to prevent a killer from tunneling. Makes sense. 👍️
I mainly take issue with the first two points, as they poke holes in very prevalent opinions the community has. By "take issue" I don't mean I take issue with Otz's conclusions, I think they are apt based on his experiences, I mean I take issue with the opinions of the community.
cough cough different mmr reserved to steamers (or to be precise fog whisperers) cough cough... those experiment are simply trash: it's sufficient to look at the survivors that he was facing to understand that something is wrong...
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@C3Tooth said:
Imaging this, there are 2 people, a good person and a bad person. You have 2 choice:
- Give a candy to each of them.
- Or punch to the face to each of them.
A candy will not make the bad person happy. But a punch would hurt the good one.
in the doubt i'll punch everyone since they ARE a team (their goal is the same: escape from the trial) and if i wanna make the bad ones pay for their actions i need to play for the win, the only difference will be that the bad ones will also see me nodding and hitting them on the hook just to get more salt as possible while the good ones will be limited only to the unfun gameplay... the one that weren't toxic can always stay in the end chat and chilling with a conversation... as survivor i already met killers that were toxic or played in a certain way, but once i talked with them in the endchat they were even sorry for playing like this because they saw that i'm not the classic survivor that will blame without even thinking WHY the killer played in that way (for instance i had people flaming me for playing fair so at this point it's perfectly understandable) while as a killer i still have to see a survivor that will do something like that if you want to try to have a civil discussion with them
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377557#Comment_3377557
So, you think that the most meta Killers would lose horribly to the most meta Survivors?
Or are you saying something different?
In a scenario where survivors have everything at their disposal (from map offerings, to perks and items/addons) and know what they are doing? Probably, but that's not the point, the point is that you simply cannot play the game aganist people who play in a certain way unless you are using the 2 killers that i've mentioned and even then it will be impossible to get a result that will exceed the 2k (i had matches that despite i was using the nurse with her best addons and i didn't miss a single blink, the genspeed was FASTER than my chases, partially cause also for the 2nd chances perks and partially cause they were using broken items/addons)... i had matches aganist premades that despite the broken stuff that they had i had somewhat the time to do something (clearly i was FORCED to tunnel/camp from the beginning if i was using weak killers), but the matches that i did yesterday were SO FAST that i couldn't do literally nothing about it (predrop and chaining loops that cannot be mindgamed): a single down that require at least 90 seconds (the time to start the trial, walk through the map, find and chase a survivor, pick him up and hook him) and 3 gen already pop, start a new chase and in the meantime another gen is completed and another one is already half repaired, hook the 2nd survivor and all the gens are already repaired, add also the fact that now adrenaline is pretty much granted because gens will be ALL repaired most of the times and they can even rush while injured, they have dead hard that grant them another health state (in high mmr this perk CAN'T be baited, you like it or not this is the truth since people will use it near pallets, not to mention that dead hard script user are MORE common that you can think), and you'll get whay playing killer rn is MISERABLE
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@philward1953 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377553#Comment_3377553
And you're not seeing the matches others are playing. If I win 10 games as Sadako, and you lose 10 games, that does not mean Sadako isn't viable. You just had a bad 10 games.
Oh quite the contrary, I'm still perplexed about some streamers getting bad survivors that allows them to play even with meme builds... If they found tryharder on 3 matches out of 10, for me it's the inverse
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3377500#Comment_3377500
So, if there was a tournament with no restrictions, what would you expect to happen?
There's a reason if certain perks/items/addons/maps are forbidden in those "tournaments"... The game isn't balanced around that level of bs... Which brings us the hilarious fact that "comp" dbd is more balanced (and probably even funnier) than pub matches for that reason alone...
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Another funny thing that I found funny is that the killer is EXPECTED to do ALWAYS well for the community's standards, no matter what the survivors are, no matter the addons/items/perks/offerings used, the killer MUST always do at least a 2k because muh stats (which btw I don't even took those into the equation since they are FLAWED and don't take into account how the match is played)
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Most of the answers here show how much arrogant and blunt is the community of dbd: you are judging a player WITHOUT even seeing the matches that I did... Another reason to ignore people who don't even bother to have a civil chat (I appreciate the FEW people in this thread who are trying to explain their point of view without being pricks tho)
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@C3Tooth said:
Killers with 3K every match is viable too, not just Killers with 4K every match.
you know, it's funny that you think that playing killer is easy (this statement it's a hint that you aren't playing aganist decent survivors) since you think this then keep play the game, i personally won't since i'm not masochist... you are also deliberately IGNORING the points that i made, thinking that only kills matter is another problem with the mentality that the community has: i can do 0 hooks but kill everyone in the end with a single hook thanks to blood warden... this isn't a valid point since you are ignoring EVERYTHING else (gameplay wise)
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@HoodedWildKard said:
So many threads complaining about this recently. And it mystifies me, I'm no killer main for sure, but not a surv main either. I play both rolls roughly equally. For a start it isn't easy to hit, you can force a trigger by running at killer but it only works against players who M1 at the earliest possible second.
Killer is the easiest roll by a longshot. My mmr has been throwing lots of extremely good teams at me recently. I see DH a lot, but I rarely struggle against it. Baiting it out is pretty easy in most situations, really the only time I lose decent time becuase of it is when it's forced on a pallet. You literally get within swing distance and hold off for one second, watch the dab then drop the surv. It isn't hard. This strategy has worked against players with 100days plus solid play time. My record being one who has played the game for over 300 days.
But the way I see a lot of posts on here complain about it makes lt sound like they swing into it constantly and lose a lot of their games solely due to this perk. So it's either a wider skill issue or just killer main mentality bias, hating on whichever perk irritates them the most.
Tbh from my experience the perk is an important one for game balance, it's probably the best (if high risk) exhaustion perk in the game. Game balance already tips in the killer's favour, without DH, or if it gets nerfed into the ground that gap will only widen and kill rates will spike.
if a single perk will carry survivors so much, then for default it should be COMPLETELY changed... also game killer side? don't make me laugh, i'll gladly give you the match that i did yesterday, then we can talk again if you feel that this game is killer side...
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@Grum said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3376317#Comment_3376317
I literally did not say "just bait it out".
You can time your lunge to hit at the end of the DH. Or lunge through the pallet while looking up so that you don't hit them, and likely end up blocking the prompt. Or you can follow them through the DH without lunging, do a basic M1 and take advantage of the lingering hitbox.
And if none of that works, well, sorry there was a very small chance you couldn't do anything about it. Be thankful it wasn't any of the other exhaustion perks that you literally can't do anything about.
You didn't say it, but judging what you wrote it's essentially this phrase in a nutshell (easy to outplay)... You can still do something (even if the window's time is extremely small) if you are right behind the survivor and hit him without doing lunges, but in case you are close enough to reach him with a short lunge but without enough time to hit without the lunge cause he'll be essentially safe under the pallet and drop it, this is a lose/lose situation (if you lunge the survivor will see it and press e, gaining distance without even using the pallet, if you don't he will drop the pallet on your face, gaining distance and saving the dead hard for another loop)
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@BenOfMilam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3376321#Comment_3376321
to be fair, I don't play Knight much. But just looking at his add-ons tells you that a lot of them are very strong, or they change the game significantly.
They are all situational most of the times, but noone of those is even remotely viable without the brown addon that I said
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I would be happy if they will finally add new game modes, mechanics and fix all the bugged stuff present in the game rather than having ANOTHER (mediocre probably) killer alongside with other survivors... But of course this won't aid them to earn money so it's only a dream that will never come to life...
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@BenOfMilam said:
I would actually say most killers have really good add-ons. There's just a handful that don't have a lot of good ones. Namely Pyramid Head, Freddy, and Nemesis. You can make an argument for Deathslinger, but the good ones he does have are VERY good.
Kind of funny that you mention Sadako and Knight, since they both have a lot of really good add-ons.
you are forced to use an addon slot for map of the realm if you want to make the knight VIABLE... not strong, not broken, VIABLE...
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@Wexton said:
Just curious, some people say that killers shouldn't give hatch because survivors aren't going to give you a mercy kill if you lose, which is a statement that I tend to agree with. But I wanted to ask around a bit, how many mercy kills have you gotten in your time playing killer? Or if you're a survivor player, how often do you let the killer get a free kill? You can give context, or just a number, or even a rough estimate since I doubt people would remember the exact number, I just wanna know.
I have only been handed a mercy kill once in my time playing DBD, it was my very first match as dredge after I purchased him, and as you can imagine I didn't do very well, went against good survivors, I didn't know how he worked, and I was afk for a little bit into the match because I had to use the bathroom, ended up getting one kill somehow, gens were finished and everybody left except for the feng, I guess she felt bad because she new I was a newer player. So she chilled with me until the match ran out, it was wholesome.
if i count the times that i was farming on purpose 5 times... if i count the times that i was playing normally only once (at least they tried, but my pride forced them out of the game since i don't want mercy kills... if i found something extremely ENRAGING is that kind of behavior, even if with good intent... i want to EARN my kills)
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@Grum said:
Dead Hard isn't a second chance. It's an exhaustion perk that you can easily outplay (unlike virtually every other exhaustion perk).
ahhhhh, the "jUst b41t 1t 4h34d!1!" classic phrase...
How much time has passed and people still ignore that dead hard CAN'T BE BAITED NEAR PALLETS...
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3374291#Comment_3374291
Adrenaline requires all five gens to be done under specific circumstances to count as a 'second chance' perk, if that's your concern, you have nothing to complain about.
Exhaustion perks aren't 'second chance', they're all part of the first chance, with the exception of Dead Hard.
Power Struggle and Mettle of Man are both unbelievably garbage.
BT, Off the Record, DS and Unbreakable are all only there to try and make sure that one down isn't the end of the game for survivors. If these are your 'second chance' problem perks, quit the game. Survivors get three hook states for a reason, if you can't deal with a second chance, just quit.
did i said that i have problems with those perks? i never mentioned that... i just stated a FACT that can't be denied: all of them are 2nd chances perks, you like it or not this is the truth (i never said that they are always granted, quite the contrary, you must have certain situations in order to trigger them, but this won't make them different, those are still 2nd chances)... please, READ what i wrote before throwing tantrums...
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371859#Comment_3371859
No, that's very obviously not the intent. No player would sign onto a game where they're just plain helpless and lack any kind of agency.
Also, everyone needs to stop whinging about 'an abundance of second chance perks'. It's literally just Dead Hard.
Ehm ehm *clear throat*... Adrenaline, basekit BT, off the records, DS, unbreakable, any kind of exhaustion perk, power struggle and (despite being a niche perk) mettle of man... One thing is saying that survivors have some situational perks that maybe couldn't be considered true 2nd chances because there are some events that must happen in order to trigger them, another one is saying that survivors have only dead hard as a 2nd chance...
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@Smoe said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3374060#Comment_3374060
Except people were complaining about Deathslinger's quickscope on the forum rather frequently back then because Deathslinger players could just scope in and out constantly to force Survivors into a lose lose situation no matter what.
Also map rework being worse or better aesthetically will always be a subjectivity case.
The only thing that deathslinger has was that quickscope, and they erased the only feature that make him unique... Without nothing in change to be considered worth of mention... Regarding maps it's subjective as you said, true, but you can't deny that the atmospheres of the maps now are a lot more brighter than once
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nothing, i'm just becoming tired/upset of this game/company generally speaking since:
1 map rewok are even worse than their previous version, both aesthetically (the new maps doesn't even have a grim look like the old ones which were darker and more close to the horror atmosphere) and in terms of gameplay (they worsened the situations of the maps by adding stuff that wasn't necessary like breakable doors and despite they have SLIGHTLY nerfed some of the most broken loops in the game, they compensate by adding more pallets and window generally speaking)
2 nerfs to killers/perks that were without logic and no one asked (billy, deathslinger, selfcare, pharmacy, etc etc)
3 the blatant hypocrisy of the devs on certain arguments, both in game stuff and other things that i won't mention here for obvious reasons (you can easily guess tho)
4 they are more concerned about releasing skins than invest some of their resources into new mechanics/game mode and stuff for fighting cheaters (they did something, but that wasn't enough to be considered worth of mention, also do not forget that they opened the gates of hell when they released for free dbd on epic games store) and toxicity (all the proofs that i send to them via screenshots of people who were awfully mean by writing insults, slurs and death threats
wereare ignored and left unpunished)5 NFT stuff and other debatable decisions...
i wonder how people can still defend/appreciate a company like this one despite all those issues...
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and here is where things can get toxic: the problem aren't those actions that you mentioned (they are frustrating, especially if done from the beginning, i won't deny this, but they aren't toxic par se), but HOW people react to them (and even if you don't do those things), i lost the count for how many times i received insults, slurs and death threaths just because yes... and mind you, when i'm getting angry it's not because people want to play optimally, but because the LACK of respect that people have toward the others both in endchat (keyboard lions) and in game (tbags and flashlight spam) and the fact that usually those idiots aren't punished (i stopped sending screenshots of the endchat as proof to bhvr cause they essencially ignored those reports...)
i'll make a match more miserable as possible if i ever get those kind of people in my lobby since they are the cause of why dbd has a nasty community and it's generally becoming unfun
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372471#Comment_3372471
Because its still a good perk? Something can be good but not OP. The advantage of DH is the satisfaction of hitting a successful DH, it feels and is much more rewarding as well than any other Exhaustion perk which are probably the strongest perks a Survivor can run
If were talking viability, Sprint Burst is hands down the most powerful option. Sure it nets less distance per activation but it also activates much more frequently and is MUCH more consistent. A good SB user is much scarier than a good DH user.
I personally disagree since sprint burst will aid you to gain more ground in the beginning, but the thing ends here, while dead hard is essentially a 3rd health state with most of the killer (only exceptions are legion IF he hit you 1st with a feral slash and deathslinger IF the walls of certain loops are low)
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@AMOGUS said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372471#Comment_3372471
What other people have said. This community actively refuses to let any perk or perk combo compete with DH, citing copium like "balance" and "no counterplay" and citing streamers that agree with them, anything they can use to justify failing to adapt.
People run DH because you are most likely going to get value of it BECAUSE basically every perk is weak, unnecessary, too niche, too hard to get value out of or just has mediocre effects.
Replies like this are an excellent example of why the devs don't listen to these forums, or take this community with a grain of salt. Opinions like this are super duper popular, which is excellent grounds for ignoring.
Then for your same logic they should have left untouched the spirit, the nurse, the huntress/clown addons, old noed, etc etc because they were extremely popular... Please before spitting out statements at least try to use some valid logic/arguments to sustain your points instead of saying nonsense... I could wrote why dead hard isn't healthy for the game and why it should be changed, but I wrote it so many times that I'm tired to say the same things everytime (especially if people tend to refuse to aknowledge that in certain situations YOU CAN'T BAIT IT)
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372396#Comment_3372396
False lol. It will simply force blight mains to strictly use bump logic, which is stronger than going for hugtechs.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372400#Comment_3372400
Using my mouse combined with my keys to significantly increase my spinning velocity past the normal max turning rate? What does that sound like to you?
Counterpoint: wanna try to do a match in the new red forest without that tech? I can assure you that you will suffer because you won't even be able to bump as you want due to the awful object's hitboxes
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372471#Comment_3372471
Idk, why do people still insist on using Self-Care
Is selfcare popular? I don't see it much often and when I see it, it's often on meme/healing builds... Dead hard on the other hand it's in EVERY. SINGLE. MATCH that I play
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@Gamall said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372402#Comment_3372402
Seeing it so often you have a greater chance of adapting to it. See it as an opportunity
No need to adapt to it, I'm perfectly able to counter it when I have the right opportunity (aka they aren't near a pallet). Also did you know that the best counter to that perk is hard tunneling? You are indirectly telling to people to tunnel more in order to counter that perk right now...
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372402#Comment_3372402
I dont think anyone is saying DH is useless
Its just not this godly perk many people claim it to be
Then why it's so popular? This is the main question: if there are better perks out there, why most of the survivors out there will take this perk instead of choosing another exhaustion perk?
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Until I see people that have vac bans, game bans registered or private profiles, I'll dodge. Not gonna play against potential cheaters
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30 DH in 10 matches done until now, not bad for a perk that for certain people here on the forum was deemed as useless...
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@Wexton said:
If you could report players for "abusing" the hug tech then every single blight player would be banned from this game.
Except me
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@HugTechLover said:
Man I loveeeee abusing the hug tech EVERY. SINGLE. GAME.
Seriously though, survivor 360’s are technically a bug. Should they be reported too?
To be honest both should be looked at imo... But then again, blight would become a b tier killer at best if you remove that "tech" (but still I personally agree to fix both things once and for all if this means a more healthy gameplay)
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@hiken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372205#Comment_3372205
Literally u dont understand nothing about the game to say what u said. 3 gens can spown very close eachother despite map offerings or not. in fact i just played in garden of joy she had a hard 3 gen in one of the biggest maps in the game in the forest she camped that from 5 gens. the rest not even gonna bother. im just losing my time with you.
however im gonna say this im quite sure about my arguments, she is gonan get tuned very soon, youll see.
As expected you ignored my valid counterpoints... Not surprised at all honesty... If you scroll up you'll see that I'm favorable for changing this situation since it's boring/annoying as hell, I'm not defending it, but saying that you don't have tools at your disposal in order to counter it it's just a lie. I'm done talking with you
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@Halloulle said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372205#Comment_3372205
You must be a very wise player we can all learn from. - Please, the next time you face a 3genning Skully, could you record your superior survivor strats upload the match and link it here so we can all learn from you?
No, really tho, if you found a reliable way to break Dead Dawg, RPD, Midwich, all the rectangular maps that can spawn a four gen on one side or 2level gens, where the gen upstairs is in nearly the same place as the one downstairs I would be very curious to know.
i don't record my games and i'm not interested to doing so (i don't do this even when i'm facing blatant cheaters)
i gave you the solutions, it's up to you to use them (or you can wait until this "problem" would be adressed by the devs, it's your choice)
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@Tsulan said:
Issue has been going on for over 2 years. So... turn the penalty off forever?
that would be problematic because of the entitlement of the people who are playing this game: to make an example yesterday i did a match with the wraith with meme addons and a meme build centered around chasing only the obsession (i had furtive chase paired with rancor for a "russian roulette" game). In that match 2 survivors were particularly annoying since they were toxic af, one of them was killed before the last gen popped (fully deserved) and the other one dc on purpose because she was the obsession and i had rancor while she was opening the exit gate (endchat she even told me that i was a loser... hard to say this when she was essencially at her last hook and died to a killer with that kind of build without slowdown perks).
Anyway the point is that people will tend to ABUSE it whenever they'll found something that they'll consider unfunny: oh the killer is a blight? dc. Oh the killer has some strong and unfun addons/perks? dc. Oh the killer is tunneling/camping/slugging? dc. Oh the survivors aren't bad and i won't get an easy win? dc
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371334#Comment_3371334
You're bound to go down eventually since she can have a hard 3 gen and can drop chase at any time if a drone detects someone or is disabled, she knows exactly when its fine to keep chasing or when to drop and go defend
we are talking about a 4.6 killer without mobility and without a antiloop power... if the killer will go in the interested zone in order to activate a drone that was disabled by a survivor, the others can do the same and start working on generators... it's not funny, it will require patience and a lot of time, but t's doable... and as i said to another guy in this post, the maps were you can do this tactic are only a couple because in the other maps the distance between each gen is enough to allow survivors to repair gens (it will require an absurd amount of time, but it's doable)
I want to be clear about that matter: i'm not saying that it won't require changes, i'm not saying that this is funny, i'm not saying that this is usually counterable in soloq (unless you have smart people as teammates), i just stated a fact: it's doable breaking the 3 gen situation, but it require a HUGE amount of time and people who are able to use their brains...
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@hiken said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371339#Comment_3371339
As i said u didnt verse her yet.U dont understand that none of that works against a skull merchant that camps 3 gens at arm reach AND IS NEVER GONNA LEAVE IT doesnt care if survs finish 4 gens she is gonna spown and quickly find that ez 3 gen to camp all game and stick around. Not gonna waste more of my time if u cant understand that
you PRETEND that i didn't verse her in that situation, but facts are others... also in order to found those 3 gen so close the killer must pick up a specific map offering for a certain realm that i won't mention here cause the game is already boring enough with those kind of tactics without being incentivized... usually the gens have enough distance between each other and can't be defended if all survivors are still alive, even with that kind of killer
As i said you have a plethora of things to use at your disposal to counter that situation, if you don't understand (or better, if you REFUSE to understand) then our debate can end here since you can't talk to people who refuse to listen/learn from their mistakes...
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQ7HT0QnUdY@TragicSolitude said:
The game is designed so that either one side is happy or the other side is happy, not both.
Survivors are rewarded for having a well-rounded match. Pipping requires doing well under each emblem, which means the survivor needs to work on gens, perform altruistic acts, be in chase, and survive for a bit of time (at least 9 minutes to earn a silver Unbroken emblem, and gold requires actually escaping). Each Bloodpoint category has a 10k cap, so if a survivor only does one thing all match, they're not going to earn many Bloodpoints. Again, a well-rounded match is necessary for a survivor to feel rewarded.
That's by BHVR's design, it's not the fault of us players.
yep, decisely not the dev's fault /s