TWiXT
TWiXT
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@dallasmedicbag said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2657180#Comment_2657180
think you're the only killer in this game? killer/survivor queues are only dependent on the time of day my man - instant killer queues at night, and instant survivor queues by day.
@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2657184#Comment_2657184
Well i don´t see killers asking survivors to play more, soooo.
@ThiccBudhha said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2657186#Comment_2657186
They really should play more survivor during the day. I shouldn't be forced to play at night just because I want to kill survivor mains...
Oh, I'm not denying the time of day as much as I'm embellishing it. The real factor that makes playing in the evening as killer, especially passed midnight (in my area at least), vs. playing as survivor is not just limited to the wonderful queue times, but also the quality of the players still playing the game. At these hours I get the least toxic people to play against when playing the killer role... Let that sink in a bit. I don't know why this happens, but overall, I enjoy it far more than when I play in the daytime hours and have to put up with:
The most toxic people who either equip the most broken things, but bemoan me for doing adapting in kind against them.
Rage Quit/DC at the drop of a hat.
Bully or attempt to Bully me when I play killer or worse, play survivor.
Longer Queue times,
And overall, the endgame messages are uniquely in the spirit of the game, and far less toxic or malevolent.
(TBH, I'm a sadist IRL, and this used to please me immensely, since knowing I've bruised an ego or 2 when playing via their messages, made me tingle with excitement, but recently this has gotten stale, old, and less enticing. I used to think that making them vomit out their frustrations against me on their keyboards really meant I hurt them IRL and did my job right, which thrilled me, but after too many times of getting these kinds of responses over 1.5k hours... the thrill is gone, and now I'm stuck with finding other outlets for my tendencies as in all honesty... DbD is just too easy to elicit such responses.)
Even I can't say why this is the case, but I can say that the people who are playing this game during the late hours are far better than those who play during the day, and that's something to be admired. Sure you still get a game with a toxic as hell SWF squad, here and there, but the frequency of that experience is minimal in the evening vs. the day.
I Guess what I'm trying to say is that, playing killer in the late hours is far more rewarding and appreciated than it is during the day, and while can't explain why that is... I still love it.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2657141#Comment_2657141
Because normally when somebody in this forum talks about crybabies, they seem to mean "people who don't like the teabag/clicky clicky brigade". It was hard to tell what you meant.
I edited my previous reply with a list of "unwritten Rules" I believe in, not only because i wrote them, but because i wanted them to be as unbiased as possible, and practically follow them to the letter when playing myself. Give em a read if you want (admittedly it's an exhaustive post) or don't, the fact remains,: I never begrudge anyone using the tools the game gives them for any advantages, regardless of what side they are on. To me, that is what it means to be a sportsman, and anyone who disagrees are just littering these forums with banal whining.
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@RainehDaze said:
You think true sportsmen are the people who aren't sportsmanlike? What a strange world you live in.
IDK what the hell you mean, but what I mean is Killers or Survivors who will stick it out till the end, and accept their loss when it comes without Rage Quitting/complaining. You know, someone who uses a loss as a learning experience, and tries to adapt instead of someone who quits the moment things don't go their way, and doesn't give a damn about their team. No matter their tactics, you can't blame them for doing what they can with what they are given to achieve their goals.
How is that UNSPORSTSMAN like?
For further insight, HERE IS WHAT I BELIEVE:
@TWiXT said:
Due to the new Resident Evil Chapter release, we have received an influx of new players, and so I must start this post by saying:
Welcome to Dead by Daylight, and I hope you are all having fun so far (despite how rough this chapters release has been)!
That being said, you're likely to see a whole lot of forum posts, and/or chat messages citing "Made up Rules" Killers and Survivors should follow. Most, if not all of these are based on individual experiences, and are heavily biased for what ever side (Killer or Survivor) the posting member primarily plays, so before you comment or "side" with anyone, here is a list of unbiased "rules" that I believe everyone can get behind as a foundation to enjoying your experience in DbD:
1 - Play how you want to play and enjoy the game.
2 - If you show no respect... don't expect any.
3 - The Killers role is to kill, the Survivors is to survive... Both by any means necessary. This is the Hearts-blood Core reality of how this game is played! No matter how a killer or survivor(s) win the match, it's all part of the games design, and no one should waste any time or energy complaining about it as long as they've gained their victory using the legal mechanics, or tactics the game provides/allows them to achieve it!
In other words ALL IS FAIR when it comes to playing the role you've chosen (unless cheating/hacking, but we'll get into that further down the list in rule 7). If there's anything you feel is unfair about either side:
- Reflect upon your own side and what tactics and builds you/your team are using to achieve your goal.
- Compare it to what your opponent(s) used to achieve theirs.
- If possible, strive to experience the other side FIRST before you post any complaints on the forums about your experience against your opposition.
- Ask yourself if there is something inherently broken in the games mechanics that needs to be addressed before you resort to posting your complaint (e.g. Encountering perks, items, add-ons, mechanics, or abilities that absolutely provide too much of an advantage to your opposition, and are un-counterable by anything you do. If there is a counter to these things, either discovered by yourself or researched, save your complaint and learn/employ said counter the next time you face it, if not... then by all means let the devs know by posting your complaint).
Always remember, if your opponent won a match/trial while using the legal mechanics the game provides, it's not really their fault for taking advantage of it, is it? In other words, if you have a complaint you're just itching to express on the forums, you should first ensure that you're Legitimately Hating the game, not the player. As anything else will be seen as nothing more than a post filled with "banal whining" by the majority of the community.
4 - When the gates are powered... Anything goes!
Don't kid yourself by thinking otherwise! Neither side is gonna roll over and just "let you win" when this happens, and not only do both sides know this... Realistically at that point the only job the killer role has is to secure kills since there aren't any gens left for them to protect, and the only job the survivors have is to escape with as many alive as possible.
So, No matter what tactics or skills you employ at this period in the match/trial... The gloves are off! Recall rule 3, and feel free to do whatever it takes to achieve your goal. No one can blame you for whatever you do in the endgame, and if they do, for the most part they're just being sore sports.
Enjoy your victory, or embrace your defeat. Either way, "When the gates are powered" is, more often than not, the most intense part of the trial, and you should take whatever advantages you can against your opposition as they (mostly) won't show any mercy towards you.
5 - You paid money for a multiplayer experience, and thus aren't entitled to win every match. Anyone who takes umbrage to this should stick to single-player games where-in you are entitled to eventually win for the money you paid. Being salty because of a lost match is unbecoming, embarrassingly juvenile, and toxic to the communities reputation. We're all people pitting our skills, strategies, builds and knowledge against each-other. If you lose and have nothing good to say in the post game chat or over the console chat system: Either Leave a "gg," or no message at all, and then calm down/lick your wounds, and move onto the next match. This is just a game after all.
6 - For PC players: Post game chat can be closed using the ">>" in the lower right of the chat box, and will remain closed until you open it again. No one deserves abuse, so if you find yourself frustrated over excessive endgame chat toxicity: Feel Free to Report the most egregious offenders, or otherwise Just close it, and continue enjoying the game in peace.
For Console Players: I understand that many other players can/will attempt to contact you via the consoles messaging service, and that this can't always be ignored or shut off. None the less, you do not deserve abuse, and if anyone is violating that via text or voice messages, then they are violating the policies the consoles communication service stands for! Feel free to let your consoles administrators know that your rights to enjoy this game are being infringed upon by other players, or otherwise, if possible, try to simply ignore the messages they send you, and continue playing at your leisure.
7 - This is a 4v1 Lobby and Match style, or Asymmetrical Multiplayer game. When you queue up to play a match you are committing to seeing it through so that everyone can enjoy the game, and everyone else who queued up is depending on your commitment to the match in order to experience said enjoyment. The acceptable reasons for Intentionally Disconnecting from a match are as follows:
A Game breaking bug rendering you incapable of playing a normal match.
A Player(s) taking the game hostage/hacking/exploiting bugs or unintentional game mechanics, or bullying/griefing you. (Record if possible, and Report them after leaving the match.
Influences and situations outside of the game that make your disconnection unavoidable in order to deal with said circumstance(s).
Disconnecting from a match intentionally for any other reason is a practice in bad sportsmanship that Ruins the experience for all other players, Disconnecting over petty reasons doesn't do anything other than piss off everyone else, and makes you a worse player for it since you don't learn how to play any better by quitting. Disconnecting is currently being punished for a good reason: Too many DC's from too many players results in leaving the community as a whole with a sour experience, and could eventually kill the game we love. If you are frustrated with how a match is going; Take it in stride as a learning experience, see it through to the end, take a break if you need to, and decide if you want to queue up for another match. We all bought this game in order to play it with others despite how each match goes, and the majority of the fun this game offers is in the variation of each individual match.
Don't be a petty DC'er.
8 - For survivors: Rage Quitting via suicide on the hook is a unique option available to the survivor side of this game and is your choice, but If your suicide on the hook isn't advantageous to your team, as with rule 7, all it does is ruin the experience for the rest of your team, and piss everyone off. While it's not likely to ever be punished, it's still regarded by the community as a show of bad sportsmanship. If you don't at least try to play through until the end, regardless of the results, you are only hurting the experience for all other players both new and old, but it's with the new players where this hurts their game experience the most.
Bad matches happen, we understand, but that's no reason "throw a game", especially over petty reasoning. Matches can turn around at the drop of a hat as long as everyone's still playing, and often do, but you won't experience that if you RQ on the hook, and by doing so you drastically affect the teams ability to pull off said "turn around". On top of this, it does nothing for your personal skill growth as a player, or your Blood Point/Experience gains, so there aren't really any reasons to do this other than petty/selfish ones.
9 - Regarding "Toxic" behavior: Killers have a limited but impactful set of behaviors that are, by and large, considered "Toxic" by the community, but survivors have far more of these "Toxic" behaviors available to them. The reason for this is because... while killers can only be "Toxic" towards survivors, Survivors can be "Toxic" to either the killers or their fellow survivors.
I'm certain many of you have either experienced these behaviors, or have seen them reported/complained about on the forums, and While a decent amount of them don't fit the "spirit" of the game... a surprising amount of them do!
Please refer to this article:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/kb/articles/139-game-rules
This outlines the basics of what is considered Reportable amounts of player Toxicity, but also defines what many consider to be "Toxic" behavior, as simply part of the game.
That being said, there's still a lot of behaviors that, while not ban-able offenses, are ultimately considered "Toxic" by the community: Leaving a survivor to die on their first hook even though the killer isn't "Face-camping" them, Purposely "Sandbagging" another survivor so that they will get hit or downed by the killer, Face-camping in general, Slugging the Entire Survivor team until they bleed out, etc... While none of these behaviors are considered ban-able offenses, none of them are any fun for the victims, and They will let Behavior/the Devs know about it!
I Urge all players to Recall Rule 2 when making these choices, and Have some common decency when you play! We're all players, and we all want to enjoy the game together, but when any Player(s) repetitively engage in these kinds of "Toxic Behavior" to the point that the community picks up on it, they have been known to outright Mercilessly attack/target these players, and with enough community pressure/collected evidence, some "toxic" players have been banned by the Devs due to enough community backlash over their antics (look up Ochido if you aren't convinced).
There's only so much "Toxicity" this Community and the Devs CAN or WILL tolerate, as should be expected of any gaming community, so while it's "Okay" to have a little "Toxic" fun at others expenses from time to time, PLEASE, for your own sake... DON'T MAKE A HABIT OF IT!
Consider yourselves Fairly Warned.
10 - If it's a legal mechanic in the game, don't be afraid to use it...No matter what side you play. Half the fun is discovering new strategies, counters, and synergies using the tools the game provides, so no matter how effective or overpowered you feel they are, there's nothing wrong with using them to your advantage.
11 - Take the good with the bad in stride, rise to meet the challenge every new match presents, but overall...
have fun!
Honestly, this is just a list of Common Sense spelled out for everyone to see. The inherent problem of "unwritten" or "Made up rules" is that they're more of guidelines that nobody is obligated to follow. I know that this list won't change everyone's minds, much less their playstyles, but I felt that if I expressed the rules I follow when playing this game for all to see, maybe others might have them in mind when playing, whether they choose to use them or not.
To all you new players, again Welcome to DbD, I hope this was helpful for you, and if you are going to follow any "Made up Rules", I believe this is a good set to start off with.
Any Praise, condemnation, Creative Criticisms or suggested additions to this list of rules are welcome! Please comment if you have anything to add or say.
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@themoobs1984 said:
This is a video game, not a battlefield. Nothing wrong with playing to win but we aren't swinging axes at each other.
Other than Queue Times, I'm not saying that there's anything different in how one plays the game, simply that in the midnight hours, the game just flows more smoothly with quicker queue times and less toxic behavior for some reason, Dunno why, but it just feels like people who play at these hours have accepted the game for what it is, and play either side to both have fun and see if they can outsmart you, instead of the normal BS you get during the daytime.
IDK... I just feel like, for the most part, People at these hours have a better respect for the game than those who play during the daytime hours.
Is that weird? Is this just my own personal experience?
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@Labrac said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2656787#Comment_2656787
Otz video has now 157k views with 12k likes. DBD has a daily average of 50k thousand players on Steam. If we estimate console has around ~150k more, his video reaches way, way more than 1/1000th of the community.
He's by far the most popular DBD content creator. His community might not even come close to the entirety of the DBD playerbase, but it's safe to assume he represents the average player very well.
The most popular DbD content provider still isn't enough to elicit an actual response from the Devs. Otzdarva may not represent 1/1000th of the players, but he still represents only a small fraction of it compared to those who play the game or follow other streamers/youtubers and especially forum members, no matter their notoriety.
Look, All I'm saying is that First of all, the OP should've posted a link to the video, which would really get things in the forums going as it would draw the attention of Otz's followers, as well as inspire newer players to follow him. Second... by encouraging other Fog whisperers/Streamers/Youtubers to ask the same question of their own fanbases, we and BHVR would get a more accurate assessment concerning the overall feedback over the SBMM/MMR situation. More importantly, if the majority of players turn out to hate it, then it would need a change in order to make the devs money, wouldn't it?
Basically all I'm Bitching about is that the OP dives in on Otz's diving board without knowing how deep the pool goes and assumes everyone follows Otz, without giving the avg player a frame of reference, and yet still demands change when they themselves haven't shown an ounce of responsibility, or provided evidence of getting any of the other Fog Whisperers to agree to follow and ask their followers the same logical question Otzdarva has asked.
Stuff like this doesn't spread unless people want it to, and as far as I've seen from the OP, they haven't even tried to spread the message other than merely "mentioning" it, and THAT never gains anyone any favor; much less an acknowlegement from the creators of the game.
"The great sin in business is the failure to make a dollar, but the unforgivable sin, is to lose a dollar over a stupid decision."
In other words, the only way the devs are gonna make any changes is IF the cries/complaints/dissatisfaction of the majority of players affect their ability to earn money. if 50% of the community is saying its ok, they go with it, but if 51% say something is wrong, they correct it... BALANCE BE DAMNED, with 1 exception... If less than the majority agree something is broken and an almost equal amount of thos opposing them agree, then that something needs to be changed.
THIS is where the power of the Influencers comes from, and only IF they actually all agree on something and present enough user based evidence/testimony to back it up. Alone Otzdarva is nothing, even with his followers, but without others like him asking the same questions, we won't have an army that demand to be heard, and the Devs won't ######### listen to anything we say.
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No doubts about the collective insanity here.
Suggest a change for balance... get riddled with replies about how OP or Unfair that is.
Recommend a change to a Perk... Get torn apart by the opposition to it and accused of being an x/MAIN.
Recommend a Decent change in strategy/Tactics Vs. the opposition... Get bitched out by everyone comfortable in their own method of playing.
Say you like a specific color... Get Ripped a new one by the LGBT and Colorblind Communities for "Whatever Reasons" that means.
I'm not even gonna mention what happens when asking others to "play nice"
Basically, no matter what side you take, or don't, the bottom line is that anything that you say in this community has an opposition of some kind. Some are predictable, a few are outright offensive, and others just want to change the narrative of your post. Despite all of this, there are "some" that may debate or agree with you rationally, but these are few and far between.
Regardless the Devs have to make their choices to appease the "Mob" over actually attempting to balance the game. Unfortunately the aforementioned "Mob" is the majority of the games players, i.e. Casual and New Survivors. They simply can't take into account any survivor or killer with over 700 hours of playtime, since they just don't represent the majority, and with Each new chapter, especially the licensed ones, bringing in new players by the droves... It's impossible for this game to ever achieve any semblance of actual "balance", and truth be told, they don't want that, they only want what makes the majority of players claim they are having "fun".
In other words, to HELL with your Opinions or Suggestions! If they don't conform to the insanity of the majority of players, you amount to little more than a Fart: The pathetic cry of a little turd, Desperate to escape!
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First of all, Link the video... Second, While he is asking the community for their input, and his opinion is that he and others aren't happy with it, the Youtube/Streaming community doesn't represent all of us. While DbD players may view his channel, his followers only represent a fraction of the amount of DbD players, So unless he gets ALL of the other Fog Whisperer/DbD Streamers/Youtubers to ask their own followers the exact same question... The results of his inquiry amounts to little more than 1/1000th of the overall community.
Otz's video may be striking the right mark on this by honestly asking the community how much they love or hate SBMM/MMR in DbD, but unless his question is asked by At least 51% of the streamers/youtubers that play this game, it won't amount to anything, much like a fart in the wind: smelled by maybe the 1 person closest to it, but ultimately doesn't phase anyone.
Link the Vid if you want to get his point/message to others quickly, but that alone will only affect those in the Forums as much as they are willing to actually view it, which is admittedly a small percentage, but not worth the effort, so by all means express and link this in Reddit, and any other social media you can think of to increase viewership and responses. Then of course, Suggest to OTHER streamers/youtubers to ask the same question, because while 1 voice with 100 followers is not enough to move a town, 100,000 voices with 10,000,000 followers is enough to move a nation!
EDIT:
Only AFTER this is accomplished, can we actually see any real results from the Developers at Behavior.
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I believe that, Like how the devs keep those "Black Circles" around for Hooks and Finished Gens, and among other unnecessary seeming downsides to perks/add-on's/powers, The whispers Plague gets after gaining Corrupt Purge is meant to nerf your ability to track survivors via sound on purpose. Why would they do that you ask? Simply because the benefit of having to put up with it is Arguably the most powerful ranged attack in the game. Sure you can't track survivors footsteps at all, and can barely hear injured grunts of pain, but if you get any of them in your sight and range, it's practically a guaranteed down, at least it is against new-decent survivors.
Against Very Decent-Skilled/Veteran survivors however, it's very unnecessary, but the devs don't "balance" the game around the higher skilled players, as they don't make up the majority, and instead choose to try and focus on how a new player would feel going up against the killers mechanics, or playing as the killer in question. It's just their way of trying to make it fun for both, but in all honesty, having a downside to using Plagues power, such as the lack of ability to keep track of the survivors whereabouts via sound, is much more frustrating than "balanced" feeling, and as many have said already, it's also much too loud.
When they initially put Spirit and Ghost Face on their PTB's, their downsides to using powers were insanely overblown. Not only couldn't spirit NOT even see survivors, but her Vacuum noise while phasing completely took over your ears when you were playing as her, making it impossible to hear survivors as well. Ghost Face's stands out as the worst offender though, as when he was in his Night Shroud, survivors could hear a ghostly wind sound, directionally pointing out his whereabouts, when he was within 24 meters of them... which completely defeated the purpose of going into stealth at all.
While those downsides were removed because of how laughably stupid/counter intuitive they were, Plagues whispers just weren't considered too high of a downside to warrant removal, but they could've at least lowered the volume a bit.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2645736#Comment_2645736
Your suggestion is to make crows noiser and that is less helpful to me. I like it right now because it's visual tracking and very loud. I've tried using stridor and that did not help at all.
Pre or Post Stridor nerf? Because honestly, Pre nerf Stridor was the best perk for Spirit Players since it allowed them to use their ears better to track injured survivors. Post nerf however, it became utterly useless for the only killer that actually used it, so basically useless to all killers.
The crows sounding out their Caw's more audibly within 36 meters is actually useful, and the signal flare auras of them jumping into the sky is also just as effective for tracking. You also don't get a loud explosion sound every 5 seconds a survivor disturbs crows, and thus don't become desensitized to it when it actually matters (aka when a survivor fails a skill check, Vaults a window, jumps in a locker, or a perk like Discordance or Tinkerer procs), so I'm REALLY having trouble seeing as to why you believe any of my suggestion is a bad thing.
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@[Deleted User] said:
Your suggested rework makes the perk less annoying but less effective in my opinion. I personally like using spies of the shadows because it makes visual tracking way easier.
I can't really understand what you're saying. The big black Crow circles + the annoying as hell explosion sound every 5 seconds, just isn't that appealing to me. Honestly the way Spies from the Shadows currently works is more annoying than it's helpful IMO. Can you argue that if my changes were made, it would become more annoying and less helpful than the current version?
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@Mooks said:
Hopefully something like this in the mid-chapter?
At the least... this poor perk has been thrown in the trash tier for too long, and now that we actually have a crow based killer, it would be a shame if they pass up this opportunity to fix/enhance Spies from the Shadows, as I've suggested. TBH, everyone I've said this to over the years seems to agree with my changes, so idk, maybe for once, BHVR will listen.
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Big NAHHH... I would also put in a "git Gud" but tbh, it's actually a fairly balanced perk and deserves some respect. You may hate it all you want, but in the current survivor meta, it doesn't do much. Against noob players it's definitely a travesty, but against decent-good-god survivors, it's not even worth equipping. So, does it deserve a nerf?... NAHHHHHH, IMO. 😘
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Tapping gens to stop regression. In all honesty, this mechanic pisses me off more than anything, as it's utterly an unfair mechanic! Survivors should have to spend, at the minimum, 1 second on a gen to stop it from regressing. Nuff said.
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Part 2 of my defense of the perks I submitted here (which will likely never be seen in game, but what the hell, why not?).
Camp Light:
Basically, this applies the strength of detection of Victor from the Twins, but without the crushing counter-play, and instead forces the killer to sacrifice precious seconds in order to set it. Originally this was a 10/8/6 second perk, which required sacrificing even more seconds of the killers time, but in the current survivor meta, that seemed a bit too lenient for them. Yes, you can use this to gain info on a hooked survivor, and yes you can use it the same to keep watch over a generator, but overall, this only works for 1 area at a time, and can be defeated by survivors simply crouch-walking. Killer instinct has a delay of .5 seconds per pulse, so in the event a survivor goes for a rescue, by the time a survivor enters the radius and unhooks, the KI notification won't do much good unless the killer is within 24 meters. I could go into the fact that all this does is reveal a survivor in an area for about 2 seconds, and has a maximum usefulness of revealing how long a survivor has been on a gen, but overall, you honestly won't see any better gameplay than what current gen protection and information perks like Surveillance and Tinkerer already provide. Especially considering that one of the recent updates made it so that a survivor working on a gen counts as being crouched, and thus unaffected by this perk while working on a gen. Sure this has it's advantages, but honestly i never thought that anyone would consider it an OP perk, much less one that deserves a flat out NO from the community.
Tunnel Network:
The devs were the first to introduce the idea of a "Keep Away" mechanic when they altered The Executioners Cage mechanic to put survivors as far away from the killer if he is within x meters of the caged survivor for x time. All I'm doing here is giving this mechanic a bit of focus, and direction. Instead of sending a hooked survivor to the opposite side of the map, I've given the killer the ability to move them to the nearest hook to them. The main problem with this is that: first in order to get the most out of this perk you have to select an area that is free from other survivors, and second, no one can rescue the currently hooked survivor in the time you are going to said place. TBH, the likelihood of a killer crossing the map and actually transferring a survivor to it before they are unhooked is... highly improbable, and at best they will do it just to keep a survivor on the hook for a few seconds longer while they are chasing another survivor. Which, in all honesty, puts the hooked survivor in the path of other survivors more often than not, and with it's long cooldown, kind of defeats its purpose.
Hard Slugger:
This was meant to throw survivors off their normal pathing, and have to adapt on the fly. The extra 30 seconds before they can start to recover was also mean to defeat perks like no mither and unbreakable, but with the new boon: Exponential soon to come out, I really don't see how this is something that is so OP, both of you give it a hard "Nope". The Shoving mechanic was an Idea I've had for a long time, and I felt that it deserved a special mechanic around it, so it doesn't affect lunges, but if you attempt it on a regular swing and miss, you get double the slowdown on recovery. TBH I thought that those downsides made it pretty useless in most builds, despite the advantages it gives if it's pulled off.
BTW, Camp light, Tunnel Network and Hard Slugger, were purposely designed to put Camping, Tunneling, and Slugging into perk form. It was my way of mocking survivors complaints against them, despite the fact that most of the perks are designed to both discourage these tactics, while granting them some usefulness. So, there's that... and I have already defended them, so... What is your opinion on that?
Painful Neglect:
This perk is as easily countered as it is effective. It takes a survivor all of .5-1 seconds to scan their surroundings while working on a generator, at which time they are hit with a higher possibility of skillchecks that have a smaller success zone, and a slower gen progress rate. Otherwise repairing a gen is normal speed. This works extremely well for stealth killers, of which there are few, as well as the killer concept this was originally designed for:
Overall, I believe this perk has a fun mechanic that has a good chance against solo survivors, but as you've mentioned, is easily defeated by SWF, but honestly almost HALF of the killer perks are already easily defeated by SWF anyways, so I don't really see the problem here. The point/purpose of it is simple: if survivors don't watch the gen they are working on, then their progress on it will suffer. I felt that was necessary in the current meta because it changes up the dynamic, and allows the few stealth based killers an even better chance to shine.
Hide N' Seek:
Designed for the aforementioned killer concept: The Dolls (see above). This perk however has a whole lot of inverted stealth capability. It simply makes the heart beat rate stay at a distance despite how close you are to survivors, which gives killers with a normal to big TR a decisive edge. In practice though, it's the same thing as the Doctors Calm Add-ons, which already do the same thing, but at random, and makes it accessible for all killers. Obviously this is useless to stealth killers, or killers with a lower than average TR, but what this does overall is create a better feeling of tension among the survivors, as the killer might be closer than what they've come to know, but is as easily adapted to as most other perks/killer powers. In the hands of the right killer, it could be a really good thing, but it won't take long until survivors realize the killers using it, and they start countering. Again, I don't see why you guys hate it so much.
Mind Numbing Mist:
This is one of my favorites as it takes off the "Training Wheels" of survivors and forces them to pay attention to when things are affecting them using their well earned gamer instincts. Survivors no longer receive mention of hexes, statuses, and killer specific effects like madness levels, infection, trapped, Lacerated, Deep Wounds, or Dream state, but the game itself still gives the survivors plenty of visual or audio feedback for all of these things and more. Basically, all this does is remove the notification messages that, in all honesty, feel condescending to our gamer instincts, and encourages survivors to pay more attention to their in game effects instead of relying on the HUD to hold their hands. While this can be a bit mean to newcomers, I highly doubt it will be a problem after a few games or for any seasoned player, but will overall be respected by them as well because it acknowledges their ability to read the game without relying on the devs "HUD coddling".
Part 3 is coming but as of right now, I have to go to work. Again I hope you guys can understand where I'm coming from, and hope that you'll debate my defense of these perks or accept them as they are. Either way, I eagerly await your replies.
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@Firellius said:
Hunger of the Entity: This would be a nasty perk by itself, but as I understand from one of your later replies, this is intended to also injure healthy survivors, at which point the perk is downright bull. This is the facecamper's wet dream, since it makes it impossible to get an unhook under a killer's nose, while outside of that, it still punishes unhooking people. Aside from the fact that this just plays into the absolute worst the game has to offer, what is your idea behind this perk, exactly? Why punish altruism that way?
And in the context of the threat title: Unhooking an ally isn't 'meta', it's baseline game functionality.
Chilling Presence: The puff of breath is a nice idea, but the chattering teeth suggestion is just because of the change to Stridor, isn't it? The thing to note about the Stridor change is that it is actually pretty logical and fair. It's not fun when a perk completely invalidates another, and before you say 'Iron Will invalidates Stridor!', remember that there's three other survivors still affected by Stridor.
Friendly Fire: Troll central. It's also a categorically bad idea to just turn survivor's tools into killer's tools. They're -supposed- to benefit the survivors, and having a chance to just completely invert that is an awful and rather unfair idea. Flashlights are bad enough as it is.
Hex: Torment: This seems like a fun hex.
Hex: Griefs Due: Imagine this thing godspawning, and your perks just get randomly disabled all the time. It's also just not an interesting interaction, or fun for either side.
Used and Abused: The idea's fine, but this is going to be completely useless. As someone who occasionally picks up a treasure hunting build, whatever is in the chest is hardly ever worth the time it takes to open them.
Blood Rush: This is just bloodlust, but slower, weaker and more conditional. I also don't see a way you can improve on this without making it a better Bloodlust, at which point it would be kinda broken.
Head of the House: Nope. Just randomly cutting into the pallet budget by turning pallets into 'kill survivor' tools isn't good, especially without any counterplay. Yes, there's illusory pallets, but Freddy's dreampallets can be identified if a survivor catches him placing them, and even then, they're part of his very power and balanced accordingly, AND they don't take away from existing pallets. -At random-.
Special Treatment: Again, RANDOM, permanent disadvantages for simply hitting a survivor would be godawful to play against and probably quite broken for that one survivor. The randomness would also utterly destroy this, as there's some status effects that are rather mild (Haemorrhage, Blindness) and some that would utterly demolish the game. Imagine slapping your obsession and they become PERMANENTLY hindered or incapacitated. Game would be over immediately.
Draining Touch: Hindered by how much? 15 seconds is an awful long time to be hindered, and since it would immediately cut into the injury rush, this'd probably make it way too easy to get downs for characters that don't have any trouble getting their first hit in, like stealth killers.
Bloodbath: Seems fine.
Hex: Domination: Nope, palletbuster extraordinaire means that you're creating dead zones left, right and center. Survivors have to just hope that map generation spawns a ton of LT walls, or else they're just screwed.
Pulsating Fear: Again, seems motivated by the Stridor change, considering this is the exact same thing but worded in a way to try and get it to circumvent Iron Will.
Camp Light: Too much intel for a single perk, for no effort, with no counterplay. Also, camper's and tunneller's delight, since if you drop the camp light on the hook, you get a heads-up warning whenever anyone tries to go for an unhook, allowing you to just disallow rescues.
Tunnel Network: What is your hatred for people getting unhooks? This is another tool for campers and not much else. Pair this with Camp Light, you'll be wasting fucktons of time for survivors that just want to get their friend some playtime.
Hard Slugger: No. After beefing up camping and tunnelling, now you turn your attention to slugging. Completely disabling a survivor for 30 seconds is just a bad idea. The shove thing is a fair idea in and of itself, but a bad idea code-wise, because that is going to cause SO many glitches.
Painful Neglect: This is the first one that actually tries to tackle how fast gens get done and it still misses the mark somewhat. Painful Neglect means survivors can't keep an eye on their surroundings (Part of the gameplay while holding M1, so thanks for that) in an effort to make them more vulnerable. Problem is that this perk will work on solos but not swiffers (Since swiffers are likely up-to-date on the killer's whereabouts), widening that gap again.
Hide'n'Seek: This is either completely irrelevant or completely busted, with little room inbetween.
Mind Numbing Mist: What exactly would this affect?
Intimidating Presence: Interrupting heals is already a solid 'maybe', but interrupting the gate is a hard no. Bad map-spawn RNG, Distressing, plus this would make it physically impossible to actually exit. Also, Coulrophobia is a thing, which steps on the whole 'interrupting healing' thing.
Painful Presence: A 100% higher chance from what? The base chance for a 'difficult' skill check is 0. If you mean to say that it goes up by 100% of the original value, then it's still zero. If you mean it gets set to 100%, then healing just becomes flat impossible. This one would completely invalidate Coulrophobia.
Sadistic Rush: This perk I actually really like, this is a good one! Could use a slight increase to base duration at lower perk levels, since you'd still be in the attack wind-down animation for part of it.
Hex: Sheep's Clothing: Why does this get Haunted Grounds added on top of what it does? On steroids, to boot. Also, would that trigger off of cleansing an ACTUAL Hex totem (IE: Appears as dull to survivor) or a FAKE hex totem?
Tragic Loss: Tunnel the obsession really, really hard to make everyone permanently broken. This is busted as all hell.
Malicious Invigoration: Completely nullifies Lithe, Adrenaline, Sprint Burst and Balanced Landing, so that gets a no from me, lads.
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Part of the issue with this massive list of perks is that you've only considered the killer's perspective, another part is that you've grotesquely misidentified the meta. Survivors getting unhooked isn't the 'meta', it's the game's baseline design. The actual meta is doing the primary objective as fast as possible, and there's been, what, one or two perks in there that do that? You've also put forth an anti-exhaustion-perk one all the way at the end in Malicious Invigoration, which blocks four perks, when the real meta exhaustion perk is exempt.
A LOT of this is just hardline boosting camping and tunnelling as strategies, and that's the opposite of what this game needs. I'm sorry, but this list is pretty awful, in my opinion.
@Bran said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2632278#Comment_2632278
whenever i look into perk ideas of players and the devs in general, i usually look at them from both sides and from different skill levels. even the new exhaustion perk has me off put.
my judgement could be off and upon a second look i might change my mind on somethings, but i try to be consistent at least. i should really spend more time into explaining why yes or no, but honestly idk i just didnt.
just for example of some:
hunger of the entity: one of my biggest concerns was what if a killer face camped that survivor hooked? if a survivor is injured and interrupted how can they be unhooked?
hex: domination: a big thing was i don't think that a pallet should be able to broken if it isn't thrown down. i've thought about what if a killer could break a single pallet that wasn't thrown down? i still wouldn't want that to be possible. regarding activation, yeah i guess destroying on a down would be okay looking back.
special treatment: i think my problem with this would be it would be a pretty terrible experience for the obsession.
Ok, both of you have given me some thought into re-thinking this, and encouraged me to, Sigh, defend my decisions, That's not to say that I'm not crediting your input, as I admit that while these perks have their OP potential, I also just want you guys to understand where I'm coming from.
Hunger of the Entity:
Both of you were correct on the Face camping problem, and so, I have altered it to include a range requirement for the killer. While only 24 meters, that's more than ample distance for most hook rushers, but might actually encourage hook rushing if I'm being honest. Yeah it discourages camping, but if a survivor hook rushes as soon as you're only 24+ meters away, they don't get the entities punishment. The reason I originally made it this way was to discourage hook rushing on any survivor in the 2nd phase, because, unless you have BT, that usually leads to tunneling and death of the recently rescued survivor. By hook rushing near the killer you give them the option of 2 injured survivors to take down, the one who was just unhooked and probably has BT or DS, or the other who has nothing to stop you from downing/hooking them... which of these do you think most killers will go for? Also this can only occur 4x per match, so you have to take that into account as well. Regardless, if there wasn't a range restriction, then this would be the Face Campers Dream perk, so By your recommendations, I have altered it.
Chilling Presence:
I'm Glad both of you like it, except for the "Chattering Teeth" sound, but hear me out, because we also currently have: Iron Will, Lucky Break, Shadow Step, Calm Spirit, Dance With Me, Deception, Distortion, Off the Record, Poised, and I'm sure I've missed a few more here, but the BOTTOM LINE is that all of these perks defeat the core mechanics ways that a killer has to track survivors... Sounds, Scratch marks, and Aura. The whole reason this perk was made was to counter 2 of the 3 ways to track them by giving both a visual (visible breath) and an audio queue (chattering Teeth) to killers in order to have a chance against anyone running any of the plethora of anti-tracking perks. Currently the ONLY killer who does this by design is Plague (aka one of the least played, even after her buff), as she can track them from the sounds of their sickness, and from the visual green tufts of stinky fog surrounding them and their items. Basically all this does is give every killer Plagues ability to track survivors, but with a 16 meter restriction to sounds, and a TR restriction to Visual. Despite the perks survivors can bring in to counter the more common tracking methods, Does this really seem that OP?
Friendly Fire:
Yes, Survivors have the capacity to troll others even worse than before with this perk, and yes there will be those who do so to screw over their teammates as much as the ones who sandbag you on purpose, but... it still has its main drawback that all killers already know: if you're being blinded... look away. While the perk was originally designed to counter flashlight saves by blinding the rescued as well as the killer, at worst you end up with a killer and survivor fumbling around blind for a bit, and more likely you'll end up with a killer who doesn't get blinded, and a survivor realizing that this perk is active, not getting blinded either. TBH, I thought this could be a fun perk for turning a survivors tools against them, but the reality is that it will likely be trash tier, with exception to some unexpected situations likely involving flashbangs. Either way it's a niche perk that's as easily avoided as it is used effectively. IDK, admittedly I should have Probably left it out, but wanted some feedback on it.
Hex: Torment:
Really glad you both like this perk! When I originally suggested it in a previous post, people thought it was broken as hell since it could potentially grant you undetectable all game, but with the recent anti-totem perks added, and the boons, I feel this could be a lot of fun in the current meta.
Hex: Griefs Due
At maximum this only Disables 2 perks at random from each survivor, 1 for each hook they receive, as long as it remains standing. The more survivors affected, the more totems light up and have to be cleansed, with a maximum of 5 but only after 2 survivors have been sacrificed, and the more hex perks the killer brings in the less possible Hex: GD totems can spawn. We're talking about a game that has 16 perks spread out among 4 survivors vs. 4 perks on 1 killer. The concept behind this was simple: Reward the killer by temporarily nerfing the survivors ability to escape them by lowering the amount of perks available. Considering the Current Boon meta, current totem spawns, Anti-totem perks available, and the fact that it still only counters 2 perks per survivor before they die... is this really something so horrible that it doesn't deserve a chance? IMO, a Hex should be OP from the get go, and enough to force survivors to search for and cleanse/bless it ASAP. This one can just as easily be cleansed before it's affected anyone more than 1 time, as quickly as a Hex: Ruin totem. How often are you gonna experience a game where all 4 survivors are on death hook AND have only 2 perks remaining, and have to cleanse 4 hexes to get their perks back? If anything, I feel my pursuit of balancing this perk lead it to being more underpowered than I expected.
Used and Abused:
Not gonna lie, this was originally created as a direct response to Appraisal. Given that All chest looting perks have been buffed by the devs recently, I felt the killers needed at least SOMETHING to keep the survivors from grabbing the most powerful items in the game from chests, at full charges, during a match. While this is rather Niche, it's still a decent way of countering the surprise Purple or Red Keys at the endgame, and considering that Built To Last recently got updated so that only killers using Franklin's Demise have any chance of countering them... I felt this could see at least some usage.
Blood Rush:
A Slightly better, Slightly worse version of Bloodlust. This concept originated from the infamous "no bloodlust weekend" that only proved that the game still needs the mechanic. In the event that bloodlust is no longer needed, then this perk will be. It has the restriction that you must be within 2 meters of a non faded blood spot to keep it going, and is lost after not following a trail for 5 seconds, or picking up a survivor. However, it does grant you a much better speed boost than bloodlust, but with some caveats... You need to follow them for 20 seconds instead of 15, you don't need to be in a chase, but still have to follow bloodspots, You gain a better than bloodlust speed bonus over more time, and the only way to improve it is to use arguably useless Hemorrhage granting perks or add-ons. For the time Being I'm willing to add a "removes your ability to gain bloodlust" effect to the perk, due to the gains it can grant, but lets be real, no killer ever comes out on top simply by following a survivors path. While this perk has a 5 second leniency, it does nothing against perks like Lucky Break, No Mither, etc. I wouldn't say it's unnecessary considering that the devs have expressed their desire to remove bloodlust from the game, but for what it's worth, it could also help against many of the Exhaustion perks that give the Hold W meta it's power, if only by a little.
Head of the House:
6 out of a possible 20-30 pallets spawning in on a map that will break the moment they are thrown down, is NOT broken! Unlike Freddy's dream pallets, Not only do these pallets still have the power to stun the killer, but the choice for their placement is completely random. Yeah you may get a few games wherein 1 or 2 god pallets are affected, but overall that's very unlikely. All this perk does is give the killer knowledge on where a pallet is and to respect it if they want the hit, or reduce the amount of useful pallets on the map by 6, otherwise it's not that big of a deal for most maps... Especially where The Game, or Blood Lodge are concerned. Come on guys, I like you, but lets be realistic about this. I don't feel that 6 is too much, but I'm willing to go down to 4, just give me a good enough reason to.
Special Treatment:
By design this is intended to make the survivor HATE being the obsession as much as possible, instead of how this status is currently treated. Regardless it still gives them an out to pass part of their suffering onto others. Think about the game "Hot Potato" or "Tag", while you have the obsession status, you can receive a multitude of downsides, but it's all dependent on how often the killer hits you vs. how often you rescue another survivor. If you go the whole game as the Obsession, never rescue anyone, and get hooked 2x and hit once, at most you'll have 5 negative status effects (depending upon the healing meta), of which a few can be removed by survivor actions (Mangled, Hemorrhage) or by being hooked (Exhaustion). When you unhook another survivor however, you give them 3 randomly picked negative status effects as well as the Obsession status, and free yourself from them. There are only 11 negative status perks that can be acquired, and 2 of them, Exposed and Broken, might as well be the same thing, while most of the others are negligible to you, so overall 10 possible, 3 that can be solved with survivor intervention or the hooked status, and 7 that are only mild annoyances. Also, as with all Obsession Perks, the effects leave the moment the obsession dies, so adding in the fact that you can reset all of this punishment by unhooking someone else and letting them deal with the problem, AND disappears completely once the current obsession is dead... I don't see how this is bad enough to deserve a complete "NOPE" from both of you.
Draining Touch:
This only affects healthy survivors, and only for 15 seconds for the Hindered status which follows the default of -15% movement speed or 3.85 m/s for survivors for 15 seconds. Exhausted can last longer of course and will be the highlight of the perk as it prevents Dead Hard, and most other exhaustion perks from activating, but again, only on the very first hit. Already injured survivors can do as they please with their Exhaustion perks, and when it comes to the new Overcome perk... I don't know if this should defeat it or not. On one hand Overcome needs you to be injured in order to activate, on the other, that's also the same requirement for this perk, except this also requires you injure the healthy survivor with a BASIC ATTACK, so that means no Huntress, Trickster, Trapper, Plague, Artist, etc. Power attacks are affected, and thus they don't get much use out of it. Overall I'll say that Overcome shouldn't defeat it just because of the Basic Attack requirement. Otherwise, all it does is help slower movement speed killers who strike with a basic attack, get a follow up hit easier than they would otherwise.
Bloodbath:
A high requirement that has an equally high reward in the mid-endgame based upon how often the survivors heal vs. staying injured. In a build designed to cause Hemorrhaging and keep survivors from healing for as long as possible this could be pretty damn decent, and even become the new "Machine Gun" build when paired with Unrelenting and Save the Best for Last, but overall, that's a TON of work to achieve this reward by the endgame... just the way I designed it. I'm glad you're both fine with it.
Hex: Domination:
Originally I planned for this to only affect downed pallets, but that just didn't feel useful enough to deserve a Hex status, much less a regular perk status because of how underpowered it would be (oh wow, a perk that saves me time on kicking pallets in a chase... after the chase has ended... yeah, that's "useful"🙄). Regardless, the likelyhood of destroying only 1 pallet per survivor downed is around 60%, 2 pallets per survivor downed within 24 meters is less than 30%, and the possibility of breaking a full 3 is about 10%, and only on multi level maps like the Game and Midwitch. So, even with it's Hex status, the chances of it decimating the pallet population on the map is honestly pretty damn low. Still, a 30% chance to wipe out 2 pallets, un-dropped or not, per survivor downed was just barely enough to make it a vulnerable Hex status perk. Again, considering the current Boon/Anti-totem meta... how long do you think this one will actually last in a match before it's blessed/cleansed?
Pulsating Fear:
This was directly made to add a Sound queue for killers to follow in the event a survivor brings in perks like Lucky Break and Iron Will. Again, like with Chilling Presence, this was made to counter the many anti-tracking perks the survivors have available, but unlike CP, it only has the audio queue, affects a 16 meter range, requires you to be in a chase, and only lingers for 6 seconds within that range after a chase has ended. Overall, this perk is meant for anyone with a headset going up against survivors equipped with anti-tracking perks. It's not the best, but at least it would have some advantage where none currently exist against such builds. TBH, Chilling Presence is better in every way, but I figured if the devs wouldn't go for that, they might at least consider this underpowered alternative.
Sigh... Part 2 is coming, I just need to go to bed at this point. Regardless, please read and think about what I've currently rebutted before responding. There is a method to my madness, and I just feel that you guys, while insightful, also just judged them based on a first glance without really considering the current environment for killers vs survivors. I'm only trying to give the killers a better fighting chance to balance things out a bit, be it in circumstantial, or spread out ways when it comes to facing the current survivor meta.
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I believe it would only be fair, if a hex relights only after stomping out a boon. For Example, say you cleansed Ruin, and then lit up a boon, if the killer stomps out the boon it relights as Hex: Ruin. Of course for certain hexes like NOED or Plaything the rules are pretty strict for their activation: if there are no dull totems available at the time they are supposed to activate, this simply means they don't activate, so stomping out a boon AFTER the gates have powered doesn't light up NOED, and doing the same after you've hooked a survivor for the first time doesn't activate a Plaything totem. Also 1 Use hexes like Undying or Haunted Grounds wouldn't be able to be relit after they activate, because Undying simply takes the place of another hex that was supposed to be cleansed, and Haunted grounds only affects 2 totems. The reason HG works with Undying is because the survivors actually originally cleansed an HG totem and undying took the hit for it instead. Otherwise if they cleanse the undying totem first, HG only gets 1 activation per trial. The reason HG or Undying can't be reactivated is because once they're cleansed, that's it for them, since their effects rely on survivors cleansing/blessing totems.
Edit: As for Hex: Pentimento, once a totem is re-kindled, the only option a survivor has is to cleanse it, which removes it entirely from the map, so there's no chance this upcoming hex will be re-re-kindled by stomping out a boon.
What this does is create a power struggle for who has control over the bones in the map, and this wouldn't really be broken for the killer because whatever boon they stomp out is replaced with a hex, so as a survivor, you already know where that totem is since it was a boon, and can go over to it to either cleanse it or bless it again depending upon how much time you want to spend on it, or how crucial controlling that territory is.
This way boons have better risk and reward for using them. You are rewarded with the boon's effects as long as they stand, but risk giving the killer back any number of hexes they brought in that have been cleansed/blessed. In Ruins case this isn't really a problem, because you'll automatically know where it is after the killer stomps it out bringing back ruin, but for something like Devour Hope, it can be very dangerous using Boons because no one wants that back, even if its only around for a short time.
I think this is the only feasible way to allow killers to relight hexes in that it requires survivors to allow it via their own choice of blessing a totem in the first place.
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@Bran said:
now i gotta go down the list
hunger of entity: no, i might even call this overpowered.
chilling presence: i'd delete the chattering sound. the breath seems okay. i don't think the breath would crash peoples games.
friendly fire: nah, big troll energy.
hex: torment: great idea for a perk, i think there is maybe 1 perk that is similar? plague perk? idk. still a idea.
hex: griefs due: not a chance.
used and abused: i'll go with a no, just because it pretty unneeded.
blood rush: so like bloodlust, but perk form...so unnecessary?
head of the house: in theory this could be good and not broken.
special treatment: could be implemented in a different way, but as is now. no.
draining touch: get rid of hindered, keep exhausted.
hex domination: no. maybe a single pallet within x meters that has been thrown down is destroyed after picking up a survivor with a cool down.
pulsating fear: could work.
camp light: i could see some ways that this would not work or would be difficult keeping up. it could be changed to work, but i'd go with no though.
tunnel network: no. not much else to say.
hard slugger: this perk would definitely be broken (as in actually broken, not working). also i don't think it'd work.
painful neglect: cool idea. is it implemented cool? idk...maybe not.
hide n' seek: terror radius of killers seem broken as is, so i dont think this is even needed.
mind numbing mist: i just dont know bout this one, so ill pass.
intimidating presense: very strong with not allowing surv to escape i not making it impossible in some situations. also seems unnecessary.
painful presense: i'd pass on this perk.
sadistic rush: this seems like a mash of other perks thrown into one.
hex: sheeps clothing: had me in the first half not gonna lie. it'd be a small perk. once one totem is cleansed it's donzo. could work ith people who rarely cleanse otherwise though.
tragic loss: i'll go with no.
malicious invigoration: cool idea. seems okay-ish?
Wow, I can respect and honor your opinion of the "ideas" and yeah, at times, I feel they are broken, But... and that's a BIG BUT, for the sake of balance/fairness/argument, I can also say that the ones you are flat out saying "No" to, are also the ones that can be currently countered by the survivors roster of perks and the current games mechanics.
Take Hex: Domination for example... how often is a killer going to actually down a survivor within 24 meters of 3 freaking pallets? While the perk has the Power to destroy that many, regardless of if they are up or down, in practice the most they will ever destroy is 2... if it's a small map. I could've written it to destroy 3 pallets map wide, chosen at random, for every survivor knocked down, but I felt THAT would've been genuinely "OP". The advantage it gains against un-dropped pallets is what makes it a scary HEX perk to go up against and a good reason to cleanse it asap.
Likewise Hunger of the Entity still gives survivors the option to save an ally at the cost of a health state and having to mend. To be fair, none of the current killer perks inflict the Deep Wound status, and only certain killer power or survivor perks do because it's really not that big of a deal. I made it so that it only does this when rescuing a survivor in the struggle phase for this reason... you/you're teammates can only be affected by it 4 times. How is that "Overpowered"?
sigh... I worked hard to make all of these perks not only reasonable but also balanced in the current meta. Taking that consideration into account... I ask you:
"Considering what the survivors are currently capable of, do these killer perks really seem to "break the game" against them?"
I know this response seems harsh, and for that I apologize, but it just feels to me that, the only way killers are gonna be able to keep up with survivors and be competitive at this point, is if they are given the right tools to do so. Hell, freaking Malicious Invigoration was created as a direct response to the new survivor perk Overcome which doubles a survivors burst of speed if they are hit and basically lets them get an easy escape via the "Hold W" meta... I gave it double the cooldown of the survivors normal exhaustion cooldown times on purpose to balance it, but at the moment, personally, I wish I didn't. That's just one example of how much effort I put into these things, how much I take the other side into consideration, to make them as balanced as I can.
I can go on and on defending my decisions for each perk, but, I don't have the energy to do it atm, and I hope you understand better now as to why I made them this way, so that I don't have to. However, if you have any grievances against any of the perks I've listed, and have also considered the killer vs. survivor side of things in the current meta, I'll be happy to listen and maybe we can work together to re-write them, as long as you give me the chance to explain why I wrote them this way in the first place.
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Entitlement and Ego... 'nuff said.
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Give his throwing knives 1 ricochet bounce as base kit.
Set him back to requiring 8 blades to injure/down if direct hits, and 6 if hits from ricochets.
Change his Trick knives add-on by buffing it to increases damage 50% after ricocheting 1 time, and 100% after ricocheting 2.
Change the "Main event" mechanic to give him 10 knives, all have up to 3 ricochets, and can insta down if a survivor is struck after 2-3 bounces.
Survivors have to do a "remove knives" animation with 1 second per knife stuck in them if they want to get rid of their laceration meter.
The guy is called the "Trickster" and while basic knife throwing skills are technically a trick, you'd think that ricochet knives would be a much better spectacle that would make him and his showmanship very unique. Having ricochet knives as base kit is a no brainer, and Using trick shots by default should be encouraged and rewarded.
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@Rey_512 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2624378#Comment_2624378
So does Fang no longer injure healthy survivors? If so, why is it an iridescent?
no, it still injures survivors, but now when you hit the injured survivor with a follow up possessed chain to slow them down so you can catch up to them, it only spawns 1 slowing chain instead of the normal 3. in other words, they traded his ability to slowdown injured survivors for his ability to injure them, making his chase and downing potential after using the engineers fang to injure them... completely useless.
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I hear Plague is really good against the current boon meta, because she's very anti-healing which takes care of B:CoH, and all the infected survivor noises make for an excellent tracking tool since you can't rely on scratchmarks or auras with B:SS up.
While I won't tell OP to only play Plague, she is an option for if you find yourself frustrated with the Boon meta, as she doesn't suffer from it as much as the other killers do.
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Here ya go OP:
3 - The Killers role is to kill, the Survivors is to survive... Both by any means necessary. This is the Hearts-blood Core reality of how this game is played! No matter how a killer or survivor(s) win the match, it's all part of the games design, and no one should waste any time or energy complaining about it as long as they've gained their victory using the legal mechanics, or tactics the game provides/allows them to achieve it!
In other words ALL IS FAIR when it comes to playing the role you've chosen (unless cheating/hacking, but we'll get into that further down the list in rule 7). If there's anything you feel is unfair about either side:
- Reflect upon your own side, and what tactics and builds you/your team are using to achieve your goal.
- Compare it to what your opponent(s) used to achieve theirs.
- If possible, strive to experience the other side FIRST before you post any complaints on the forums about your experience against your opposition.
- Ask yourself if there is something inherently broken in the games mechanics that needs to be addressed before you resort to posting your complaint (e.g. Encountering perks, items, add-ons, mechanics, or abilities that absolutely provide too much of an advantage to your opposition, and are un-counterable by anything you do. If there is a counter to these things, either discovered by yourself or researched, save your complaint and learn/employ said counter the next time you face it, if not... then by all means let the devs know by posting your complaint).
Always remember, if your opponent won a match/trial while using the legal mechanics the game provides, it's not really their fault for taking advantage of it, is it? In other words, if you have a complaint you're just itching to express on the forums, you should first ensure that you're Legitimately Hating the game, not the player. As anything else will be seen as nothing more than a post filled with "banal whining" by the majority of the community.
TL;DR: If its a legal mechanic, feel free to use it, after all... if your opponent(s) aren't going to hold back on any of their builds or tactics, then why should you? If you want to complain about it, be sure you check your own builds and tactics you/your team used, As well as strive to experience the other role first, and only complain if there is a legitimate problem with the game's mechanics instead of mindlessly venting about how you got outplayed.
This is an excerpt from my "List of Unbiased rules" that I've been working on for about 2 years, and update to repost when we're expecting a surge of new players, just as a courtesy reminder that no one should follow any Biased rules posted by one side or the other, and just have fun with the game. It's a LONG read, but if interested you can read more here:
@TWiXT said:
Due to the new Resident Evil Chapter release, we have received an influx of new players, and so I must start this post by saying:
Welcome to Dead by Daylight, and I hope you are all having fun so far (despite how rough this chapters release has been)!
That being said, you're likely to see a whole lot of forum posts, and/or chat messages citing "Made up Rules" Killers and Survivors should follow. Most, if not all of these are based on individual experiences, and are heavily biased for what ever side (Killer or Survivor) the posting member primarily plays, so before you comment or "side" with anyone, here is a list of unbiased "rules" that I believe everyone can get behind as a foundation to enjoying your experience in DbD:
1 - Play how you want to play and enjoy the game.
2 - If you show no respect... don't expect any.
3 - The Killers role is to kill, the Survivors is to survive... Both by any means necessary. This is the Hearts-blood Core reality of how this game is played! No matter how a killer or survivor(s) win the match, it's all part of the games design, and no one should waste any time or energy complaining about it as long as they've gained their victory using the legal mechanics, or tactics the game provides/allows them to achieve it!
In other words ALL IS FAIR when it comes to playing the role you've chosen (unless cheating/hacking, but we'll get into that further down the list in rule 7). If there's anything you feel is unfair about either side:
- Reflect upon your own side and what tactics and builds you/your team are using to achieve your goal.
- Compare it to what your opponent(s) used to achieve theirs.
- If possible, strive to experience the other side FIRST before you post any complaints on the forums about your experience against your opposition.
- Ask yourself if there is something inherently broken in the games mechanics that needs to be addressed before you resort to posting your complaint (e.g. Encountering perks, items, add-ons, mechanics, or abilities that absolutely provide too much of an advantage to your opposition, and are un-counterable by anything you do. If there is a counter to these things, either discovered by yourself or researched, save your complaint and learn/employ said counter the next time you face it, if not... then by all means let the devs know by posting your complaint).
Always remember, if your opponent won a match/trial while using the legal mechanics the game provides, it's not really their fault for taking advantage of it, is it? In other words, if you have a complaint you're just itching to express on the forums, you should first ensure that you're Legitimately Hating the game, not the player. As anything else will be seen as nothing more than a post filled with "banal whining" by the majority of the community.
4 - When the gates are powered... Anything goes!
Don't kid yourself by thinking otherwise! Neither side is gonna roll over and just "let you win" when this happens, and not only do both sides know this... Realistically at that point the only job the killer role has is to secure kills since there aren't any gens left for them to protect, and the only job the survivors have is to escape with as many alive as possible.
So, No matter what tactics or skills you employ at this period in the match/trial... The gloves are off! Recall rule 3, and feel free to do whatever it takes to achieve your goal. No one can blame you for whatever you do in the endgame, and if they do, for the most part they're just being sore sports.
Enjoy your victory, or embrace your defeat. Either way, "When the gates are powered" is, more often than not, the most intense part of the trial, and you should take whatever advantages you can against your opposition as they (mostly) won't show any mercy towards you.
5 - You paid money for a multiplayer experience, and thus aren't entitled to win every match. Anyone who takes umbrage to this should stick to single-player games where-in you are entitled to eventually win for the money you paid. Being salty because of a lost match is unbecoming, embarrassingly juvenile, and toxic to the communities reputation. We're all people pitting our skills, strategies, builds and knowledge against each-other. If you lose and have nothing good to say in the post game chat or over the console chat system: Either Leave a "gg," or no message at all, and then calm down/lick your wounds, and move onto the next match. This is just a game after all.
6 - For PC players: Post game chat can be closed using the ">>" in the lower right of the chat box, and will remain closed until you open it again. No one deserves abuse, so if you find yourself frustrated over excessive endgame chat toxicity: Feel Free to Report the most egregious offenders, or otherwise Just close it, and continue enjoying the game in peace.
For Console Players: I understand that many other players can/will attempt to contact you via the consoles messaging service, and that this can't always be ignored or shut off. None the less, you do not deserve abuse, and if anyone is violating that via text or voice messages, then they are violating the policies the consoles communication service stands for! Feel free to let your consoles administrators know that your rights to enjoy this game are being infringed upon by other players, or otherwise, if possible, try to simply ignore the messages they send you, and continue playing at your leisure.
7 - This is a 4v1 Lobby and Match style, or Asymmetrical Multiplayer game. When you queue up to play a match you are committing to seeing it through so that everyone can enjoy the game, and everyone else who queued up is depending on your commitment to the match in order to experience said enjoyment. The acceptable reasons for Intentionally Disconnecting from a match are as follows:
A Game breaking bug rendering you incapable of playing a normal match.
A Player(s) taking the game hostage/hacking/exploiting bugs or unintentional game mechanics, or bullying/griefing you. (Record if possible, and Report them after leaving the match.
Influences and situations outside of the game that make your disconnection unavoidable in order to deal with said circumstance(s).
Disconnecting from a match intentionally for any other reason is a practice in bad sportsmanship that Ruins the experience for all other players, Disconnecting over petty reasons doesn't do anything other than piss off everyone else, and makes you a worse player for it since you don't learn how to play any better by quitting. Disconnecting is currently being punished for a good reason: Too many DC's from too many players results in leaving the community as a whole with a sour experience, and could eventually kill the game we love. If you are frustrated with how a match is going; Take it in stride as a learning experience, see it through to the end, take a break if you need to, and decide if you want to queue up for another match. We all bought this game in order to play it with others despite how each match goes, and the majority of the fun this game offers is in the variation of each individual match.
Don't be a petty DC'er.
8 - For survivors: Rage Quitting via suicide on the hook is a unique option available to the survivor side of this game and is your choice, but If your suicide on the hook isn't advantageous to your team, as with rule 7, all it does is ruin the experience for the rest of your team, and piss everyone off. While it's not likely to ever be punished, it's still regarded by the community as a show of bad sportsmanship. If you don't at least try to play through until the end, regardless of the results, you are only hurting the experience for all other players both new and old, but it's with the new players where this hurts their game experience the most.
Bad matches happen, we understand, but that's no reason "throw a game", especially over petty reasoning. Matches can turn around at the drop of a hat as long as everyone's still playing, and often do, but you won't experience that if you RQ on the hook, and by doing so you drastically affect the teams ability to pull off said "turn around". On top of this, it does nothing for your personal skill growth as a player, or your Blood Point/Experience gains, so there aren't really any reasons to do this other than petty/selfish ones.
9 - Regarding "Toxic" behavior: Killers have a limited but impactful set of behaviors that are, by and large, considered "Toxic" by the community, but survivors have far more of these "Toxic" behaviors available to them. The reason for this is because... while killers can only be "Toxic" towards survivors, Survivors can be "Toxic" to either the killers or their fellow survivors.
I'm certain many of you have either experienced these behaviors, or have seen them reported/complained about on the forums, and While a decent amount of them don't fit the "spirit" of the game... a surprising amount of them do!
Please refer to this article:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/kb/articles/139-game-rules
This outlines the basics of what is considered Reportable amounts of player Toxicity, but also defines what many consider to be "Toxic" behavior, as simply part of the game.
That being said, there's still a lot of behaviors that, while not ban-able offenses, are ultimately considered "Toxic" by the community: Leaving a survivor to die on their first hook even though the killer isn't "Face-camping" them, Purposely "Sandbagging" another survivor so that they will get hit or downed by the killer, Face-camping in general, Slugging the Entire Survivor team until they bleed out, etc... While none of these behaviors are considered ban-able offenses, none of them are any fun for the victims, and They will let Behavior/the Devs know about it!
I Urge all players to Recall Rule 2 when making these choices, and Have some common decency when you play! We're all players, and we all want to enjoy the game together, but when any Player(s) repetitively engage in these kinds of "Toxic Behavior" to the point that the community picks up on it, they have been known to outright Mercilessly attack/target these players, and with enough community pressure/collected evidence, some "toxic" players have been banned by the Devs due to enough community backlash over their antics (look up Ochido if you aren't convinced).
There's only so much "Toxicity" this Community and the Devs CAN or WILL tolerate, as should be expected of any gaming community, so while it's "Okay" to have a little "Toxic" fun at others expenses from time to time, PLEASE, for your own sake... DON'T MAKE A HABIT OF IT!
Consider yourselves Fairly Warned.
10 - If it's a legal mechanic in the game, don't be afraid to use it...No matter what side you play. Half the fun is discovering new strategies, counters, and synergies using the tools the game provides, so no matter how effective or overpowered you feel they are, there's nothing wrong with using them to your advantage.
11 - Take the good with the bad in stride, rise to meet the challenge every new match presents, but overall...
have fun!
Honestly, this is just a list of Common Sense spelled out for everyone to see. The inherent problem of "unwritten" or "Made up rules" is that they're more of guidelines that nobody is obligated to follow. I know that this list won't change everyone's minds, much less their playstyles, but I felt that if I expressed the rules I follow when playing this game for all to see, maybe others might have them in mind when playing, whether they choose to use them or not.
To all you new players, again Welcome to DbD, I hope this was helpful for you, and if you are going to follow any "Made up Rules", I believe this is a good set to start off with.
Any Praise, condemnation, Creative Criticisms or suggested additions to this list of rules are welcome! Please comment if you have anything to add or say.
These are the only rules I play by, and they haven't let me down yet.
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This is a post I made back in April 2019, long before the devs updated the game with a DC penalty system in late January 2020, and there was a DC "epidemic" going on that made the game practically unplayable:
@TWiXT said:
Rewind the clock to 4 months ago when DC's were rare and I looked forward to getting off of work for an evening of good multiplayer experiences with lots of epic moments, teamwork, friends, and challenges. Now however, I can't help but feel like its dying due to excessive DC's, and no one's doing anything to prevent it. The Devs haven't even responded with an acknowledgement of the problem, much less a plan to deal with it (not that I've seen anyway). I love this game, but out of all the ways it could die, this is by far the worst, and the frustration of this realization is exhausting. I'll hang in there for as long as I can, and even try to get used to this as the new "norm", but this isn't my only multiplayer game, just my favorite, and if the devs don't do a live stream soon with a plan to get this DC epidemic under control... I don't know how much more patience I have left to give. This is heartbreaking for me, and is leaving me weary and depressed to see the game I adore withering away like a loved one afflicted with terminal cancer. Is anyone else feeling this way?
I'm not giving up yet. I've gone through the Shock, Denial, and Anger stages long enough, now I'm at the Bargaining and Depression part and I Hate this feeling. I want to hold on to hope that better days are ahead, and my faith in the devs will be rewarded, however, It's getting more difficult to do so every day. Please Dev's, don't forsake us, and give us a response with a plan for stopping this disease in your next live stream.
TL;DR - Dev's, Please give us a response with a plan to get the DC epidemic under control in a live stream soon, or (as much as it pains me) I'm out until you do... and I wonder how many more people are feeling this way?
The only things that kept people coming back to DbD back then were the DLC's and updates, but with DC's being so Rampant, it was a very rare experience for anyone to actually finish a match with all players present. I want OP to picture this as it was the average at the height of the "Epidemic": 8 out of every 10 matches, 1 or more players DC, and over the most petty or asinine reasons.
It was honestly feeling like the game was dying since people were becoming increasingly frustrated by it, and due to the level of DC'ing we began questioning if we were actually even playing the game at all? Fortunately, the devs play tested the DC penalty system in December 2019 before it was released, which finally allowed us to enjoy full matches again and restored much of our faith in them (Why it took them so damn long to institute it in the first place is anyone's guess). After releasing the Penalty system Live, the feeling was a euphoric sense of relief for all but a few players who whined and tried to defend their rights to DC without consequences.
If you think I'm exaggerating those DC numbers, while this isn't as High as it was during the "Epidemic" levels of DC'ing in the Spring-Summer of 2019, here's a guy/gal that tracked all of their stats, including how often players DC'ed, over the span of 100 killer games, literally a week or so before they released the DC penalty system:
in that post you should note that out of 100 games, he experienced 61 DC's.
OP, That's the kind of experience you get when the DC penalties are off... does that honestly sound like fun to you?
TL;DR: The DC Penalty system helped save this game from dying due to too many DC's, and I've provided posts with evidence of that.
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@Nos37 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2615159#Comment_2615159
Maybe it should only show the auras of disturbed crows instead.
sorry, I have another version of this suggestion in a comment I left that reflects this sentiment a few months after i made this post. I have updated the description to match that ideal. Crows auras are only revealed upon being disturbed, this was always my intention, but i failed to put it in this post back in april, so... my bad.
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@RaSavage42 said:
I can agree with those changes
Then how about:
Dying Light- Increase the debuff from 3% to 6 % on the first three hooks... then lower that to the 3% after... Also have to healing and saving increase from 0% to 33% for each hook on the non obsessions... and the obsession should be affected by the debuff as well
Doing that will encourage Killers to get hooks on the Non Obsession at first (maybe)
Brutal Strength- Increase the speed buff to 50% and add Hindered to Survivors within 3-4m of a pallet being broken for IDK 10 or so seconds
Doing this will make chases more interesting
Pop Goes The Weasel- add stacks to this perk... and you lose the stacks by kicking a gen
1) nothing extra happens
2) Gen progress is slower by 5% for 30 or so seconds
3) The ability to kick a completed Gen and have it regress at 200% of normal
4) Kick a completed Gen and have 25% of progress removed but normal regression
Doing this will give a choice to Killers (but might be OP)
Good Ideas! I wonder what everyone else will say though.
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@Bennett_They1Them said:
I like all of these except for insidious, since there are better stealth options that you have to work that fill that buff's role.
great ideas overall, though!
I also really like the "not alerting crows thing" for it's stealth value, although considering how many crows there are on some maps, it may be irritating to see crow auras.
You only see the crows aura's when they get disturbed. Also the insidious idea was to reward you for stealthy survivor play, basically making it easier to find them the longer you don't sight, injure or chase one, which in the early game is great, but in the mid-end game... not so useful. Admittedly it's rather niche and not as good as the other stealth perks, but in comparison to how Insidious works right now, I feel it's a drastic improvement.
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This is part of my suggestions post for fixing old, bad, or outdated killer perks:
Surge/Jolt:
Remove the cooldown and the Basic Attack requirement.
Explanation - Honestly this has been hotly debated in the forums since Surge/jolt came out because the fact remains that in order to activate it at all, you have to successfully down a survivor while within range of a gen. Chasing and downing a survivor with Basic attacks takes enough time as it is, especially if they were healthy when the chase started, and the minor 8% damage Surge does if it activates is hardly consequential since it would take 12 survivor downs in order to achieve a stacked 96% damage to 1 or more gens. PGTW does 300% damage to gens in the same amount of hooks, and Ruin Does more damage per second without needing to down or hook a survivor. On average it takes a decent m1 killer 20 seconds to down a survivor, and that's not counting the time to find the survivor to chase and down in the first place, but say you snowballed survivors 1 after the other within 20 seconds per chase, that's a maximum of 4 downs in 80 seconds, and a total of 32% damage between multiple gens since survivors won't stay around a downed survivor, much less a gen if getting chased, so overall... you spread the damage out over a possible 4 gens at most over 80 seconds, and that's the best case scenario if this change was implemented. While this won't improve the overall damage Surge can do, removing the basic attack requirement will at least allow killers with damaging powers to get some use out of it making it more universal to the killer roster, and removing the cooldown will allow it to become a slightly more consistent annoyance to survivors. It won't make it any more powerful than any other existing gen defense perks, but at least it would be more useful.
You can find the original post here:
@TWiXT said:
Suggested changes:
Monstrous Shrine:
Buff the perk to - Survivors have 3 less escape attempts, and sacrifice progresses 25% faster when hooked in the basement.
Explanation - 25% of 2 mins is 30 seconds, or subtracting 15 seconds from each hook phase so 45 seconds per hook phase total, adding in the fact that unless the survivors bring in Slippery Meat, they'll have to be rescued by their teammates... This makes being hooked in the basement a much more dire situation than current Monstrous Shrine.
Sometime after Hag came out the devs doubled the hook time from 1 min to 2 meaning survivors used to only have 30 seconds per hook phase, And current monstrous Shrine was designed with these the old timings in mind but was still underwhelming even back then. This suggestion is a sort of middle ground between how hooking used to be in the early days of the game, and how it is now, while only applying to the basement hooks, and finally giving Monstrous Shrine the buff it needs to be a threat that creates urgency for the survivor team.
Spies From the Shadows:
Overhaul the perk to - The Crows no longer respond to your presence, you see the auras of all crows within 36 meters of you, and disturbed crows are 100% louder to you within that range.
Explanation - This proposal gets rid of the confusing/annoying explosion sound notifications and replaces it by making the crows noisier so you can differentiate between them and a gen popping, you get no false signals since crows no longer respond to you, and they basically become little signal flares to tell you where survivors are. If this change were to happen, Spies would become an overall better tracking tool, and really fit the description of the perk which says: "The Crows found in the world can communicate directly with you." Besides, survivors still have 2 perks that defeat this: Calm Spirit & Urban Evasion, as well as the crouching mechanic, so it's not like this would be an un-counterable or broken change for the perk. If they also put some more crows in dead zones, that would be nice for helping this perk gain a better level of consistency and usefulness (Seriously, Rotten fields features no Scarecrows, but the crows completely avoid the corn field... #########?).
Surge:
Remove the cooldown and the Basic Attack requirement.
Explanation - Honestly this has been hotly debated in the forums since Surge came out because the fact remains that in order to activate Surge at all, you have to successfully down a survivor while within range of a gen. Chasing and downing a survivor with Basic attacks takes enough time as it is, especially if they were healthy when the chase started, and the minor 8% damage Surge does if it activates is hardly consequential since it would take 12 survivor downs in order to achieve a stacked 96% damage to 1 or more gens. PGTW does 300% damage to gens in the same amount of hooks, and Ruin Does more damage per second without needing to down or hook a survivor. While this won't improve the overall damage Surge can do, removing the basic attack requirement will at least allow killers with damaging powers to get some use out of it making it more universal to the killer roster, and removing the cooldown will allow it to become a slightly more consistent annoyance to survivors. It won't make it any more powerful than any other existing gen defense perks, but at least it would be more useful.
Oppression:
Remove or significantly lower the cooldown.
Explanation - This perk doesn't even add extra damage to the gens it affects (unless survivors fail the "Difficult" skill check), only applies the base regression rate, and can randomly target gens that have 0 progress on them, but for some awful reason the devs decided that it was so powerful that it deserved DOUBLE the cooldown time (80 seconds) of Surge? At least Surge won't activate on gens that have 0 progress... Why does Oppression deserve such an excessive cooldown time? If it's because of the skill check, that's a laughable annoyance more than anything that could be considered a threat to any decent-good survivors, and only becomes a problem against noobs, who honestly rank up and gain skill fast enough that it's pretty much a moot point to keep it so laughably underpowered.
Fire Up:
Buff the perk- Increase it from 4% to 5%.
Explanation - This is a ridiculously underpowered perk because in order to gain any benefit from it, the killer has to sacrifice the objectives they are supposed to protect, in other words "lose the game". It's designed to give killers a slight edge in chases in order to try and protect the last gens from completing. The overall problem however is that 4% amounts to 12% when 3 gens are completed, and 20% when all 5 are done, meaning that they gain Brutal Strengths chase advantage on pallet breaking only after the survivors have completed all of the gens when there's not many unused pallets left in the map, and Bamboozles vault speed advantage when there is only 1 gen remaining. This doesn't help the killers in their desperate attempts to stop the final gens from completion at all, and by the time it's reached its maximum potential, the survivors are already rushing out the gate.
However, if you bump it up just 1%... now we have a perk that gains Bamboozles advantage at 2 gens remaining, and Brutal Strengths at 1 gen remaining, with an added bonus to both if 0 gens remain. This would actually help the killers defend the final gens, and give them enough of a chase advantage if all gens are completed to try and stop the survivors from escaping. Suddenly this goes from an "underpowered" perk to a "Decent" one, and all it takes is a simple 1% boost in strength.
Insidious:
Overhaul the perk to - Reduces your Terror Radius and Red Stains Brightness by 5% for every 4/3/2 seconds you refrain from chasing or injuring survivors, upon reaching 100% reduction, you gain the Undetectable Status. Initiating a chase or injuring a survivor regains your TR and Red stain at a rate of 20% per second, once this has returned Insidious has a 40 second cooldown.
Explanation - This perk has been a bane on the game since it came out since it seems to have been specifically designed for the sole purpose of camping hooks. With this change however, a killer loses half their TR for spending 10 seconds away from a chase or injuring a survivor, and becomes Undetectable at 20 seconds. This is mostly meant for anti-stealth play, or for gaining a slight advantage in the early game wherein the killer is initially searching the map for survivors. Ultimately, it changes the perk from one encouraging camping, to one that rewards the killer with an advantage if the survivors are being too sneaky/evasive, and allows them to get the drop on survivors more often. The cooldown is necessary for this one because otherwise it would be heavily abuseable.
As for the survivors going up against this updated version, Premonition or Spine Chill still proc on stealth killers, so relying solely on the TR reduction is still no guarantee against those kinds of perks, and gives the survivors an advantage. Up until then, unless the killer has spent 20 seconds avoiding survivors, Aura reading perks like OoO, Alert, and Kindred still have an advantage for tracking the killer.
That's my list so far. Anyone else want to contribute your own ideas, or criticize the concepts I've listed? Feel free to speak up!
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2598810#Comment_2598810
It's not a matter of forgiveness or forgetfulness.
It's a matter of practicing what we preach as a society. It's all well and good to say 'I believe people can change' or 'it should be about rehabilitation as well as punishment' - but too few people actually adhere to this in their own lives.
Of the crimes or slights against others I'm willing to forgive, ######### and Pedophilia aren't among them...I guess I should have lead with that. Honestly, I'm willing to forgive many actors, directors, and members of the entertainment industry for their crimes, but those 2 and premeditated murder are by and far ones I cannot let pass.
Point of fact, where pedophilia in particular is concerned, due to personal reasons, I can no longer see those convicted of it as anything that classifies as "human". The definition of a "Monster" is a creature that traditionally and intentionally preys upon the innocent, and what is more innocent than a child? When Victor Salva first started directing, he was a person, but when he took advantage of the innocence and naivety of his minor actors to satisfy his own perverse needs, he became a monster. Try as he might to reclaim his human status, be it through repentance or time served, I still can't regard him as such due to my own experiences and hatred for this kind of monster.
Child predators and Rapists are known to take advantage of the court systems, and more often than not, become repeat offenders regardless of how much they've "paid to society", and I just can't bring myself to trust, much less endorse/fund someone like that. While he may not have re-offended to this date, that little voice of doubt rings in my head that says "that we know of" or "yet", especially after that information from the Jeepers Creepers 2 set emerged.
I admit, I may be in the wrong on this, and he may finally have earned his 2nd chance, and doesn't deserve the hate everyone gives him... but if these forums here are having THIS much of a difficult time of it over his past just from a simple post asking if it would be possible to get one of his creations established in DbD... do you honestly think any company, like BHVR, would ever want to associate themselves with him or any of his Properties?
The Creeper is a great character and idea, I'll grant him that, but unfortunately the source of it is outright destroying the chances of it ever becoming part of DbD due to his infamy. Honestly that's actually kind of ironic, considering that they are willing to put a character that is, by cannon, a pedophile in the game. I guess when it's a pretend one, it's not as bad as the real deal.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2598526#Comment_2598526
Probably. And that's their call.
However, as to the last thing you said:
It is damned right now, and that's a bad thing. It's why Harry Potter is considered 'problematic' within progressive circles and people are trying to ban The Jungle Book and Lovecraft's books.
EDIT: And perfectly timed, the person below me just mentioned Minecraft, another perfect example.
If I restricted my media to only people I agreed with politically or had done nothing wrong in my eyes, I'd be stuck watching about 10 movies. Good movies to be sure, but that would be silly.
I'm not the kind of person that bullies or instigates a mob of sjw's against people for their opinions, nor do I like the idea of ruining someone's life over them (cancel culture) as I believe that they have the right to say whatever they want, just as much as we have the right to debate, argue, bemoan or ignore them for it... but not the right to attack them. I'm more of a "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." kind of guy.
However, I DO hold people accountable for things they've done, and through their actions, have caused others painful consequences, especially if what they did created victims of innocent people, and said consequences still linger to this day. Victor Salva falls under this category of people. Creative though he may be, paying him for his art feels dirty upon learning/knowing what he's done. Even on the set of Jeepers Creepers 2, the staff had to keep him at a distance from all of the young boys in the cast as he was apparently overly friendly with them, and when he couldn't get close to them he started making unnecessary demands that there needed to be more scenes of the Minor aged male actors showing off more skin (shuddering in discomfort here). He may have never re-offended, that we know of, but considering that information from the JC2 set, I would argue that it's not because he's a changed man, and more because no one was stupid enough to let him.
While you do raise valid points about "forgive and forget", some things are just too hard to forgive, and no one will ever let him forget it. If that means boycotting his art as a way of informing him his work is unwelcome due to his infamous past, as nothing else will hit as hard as a loss in his bank account, then I'm all for it.
@Midori_21 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2598526#Comment_2598526
He's already gained money from the new movie since Screen media had to pay him for the rights to jeepers creepers. They had to pay him upfront to make the the movie.
So they paid him for the rights to make the movie, but the question is... will he still get royalties from the movie sales? or do the makers of the new movie now own all the rights, and are the only ones who will make a profit on the franchise from here on out?
If it's the former, then BHVR will not likely bring the character to the table for licensing negotiations.
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IF Victor Salva doesn't own the license or franchise anymore, and IF he can't get any monetary gain from the new movie or from BHVR introducing the character, then Maybe we'll see the Creeper in DbD... but those are some big IF's. Otherwise, there's not a snowballs chance in hell that BHVR would make a deal to be associated with Victor Salva in any way, much less pay him for usage of the character license.
"Separate the art from the artist" be damned!
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It's also absolutely broken on Plague, or at least it would be if survivors weren't suddenly interested in locating totems (gee, I wonder what changed?), still, while it lasts it makes her a VERY punishing killer.
Why you ask? Because once a survivor reaches full infection and becomes injured/broken, Blood Favor activates! Pair that with the fact that Plague is the only killer who doesn't give survivors a sprint burst when dropping them a health state with her power (unless using corrupt purge), and you've got one hell of a golden synergy! My jaw freaking dropped the first time I saw this happen, and I haven't had the heart to take it off of her since.
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Oh no, they should stop right there! So far any asymmetrical game dies almost immediately after introducing a spider character! Evolve introduced the Gorgon (seen above), and the game devs stop development and updating it like 2 months later because of the massive drop in popularity and players... The last Year introduced their Spider in December 2019, and the game practically Died as of March 2020!
BHVR needs to see the pattern here and avoid the same fatal mistake: Spider = Death to asymmetrical games!
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Hit someone with FF 1 time = avg 3 seconds,
hit again with FF = avg 7 seconds,
stun after 2nd hit = 4 seconds,
cooldown = 20 seconds,
Avg time to down a survivor with m1 attack after a 1 FF hit = 15 seconds,
total avg time to secure a down with 3 FF hits: 3+7+4+20+3 = 37 seconds (but low counter-play for survivor)
total avg time to down a survivor with m1 attack after 1 ff hit: 3+4+15 = 22 seconds.
Yeah, I'm with OP, because obviously the Franks mix tape + Stab Wounds study tech is the "better choice" here... it guarantees a down and saves you SOOOOOO much time!
/s
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A hotfix dropped today, it only "tentatively" fixes the infinite loading screen bug, so while it's not a confirmed complete fix, at least it shows they're working on stuff and trying to get fixes out asap.
So... hopefully sooner than we're expecting.
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My favorite build I call the "Rock & Hard Place":
Thana, Dying Light,
SurgeJolt, and either Pop Goes the Weasel, BBQ, Ruin, Surveillance, Corrupt Intervention, or my recent addition because it's proven to be amazing, Hex: Blood Favor.Add-ons: 1 Vile Purge enhancer, 1 Corrupt Purge enhancer or both iridescents.
The point of this is to give survivors a hard choice: Either they don't cleanse and suffer heavily from massive gen slowdown, or they cleanse and give you the best ranged attack in the game. Rock, meet Hard Place.
The first 3 perks are practically a given because 2 of them slowdown gen progress for each sick person and hook you get, which stacks up very quickly totaling to 28% slowdown if all 4 are sick and you've gained only 4 DL tokens. Add in the fact that plague almost exclusively knocks down survivors with basic attacks, and Jolt becomes one of your best friends as it not only damages the gens, it saves you time on kicking them as well. Naturally by about the time 2 gens are done the progress for survivors slows to a crawl, and they are forced to start cleansing, at which point you can start snowballing them with corrupt purge frenzy's. Just remember, the only survivor who doesn't suffer from the DL slowdown is the obsession, so don't kill them, but don't ignore them either, Hook em twice, and if you haven't killed anyone else or there's only 1 gen left, slug em! Only feel free to kill the obsession if you've already killed 1 other survivor and there are at least 2 gens left, otherwise keep em on the ground and off of gens as much as possible. Their team suffers as long as they exist in the match, so you want to hold onto them for as long as you can in order to get the most benefits from the Thana+DL combo.
Honestly the 4th perk can be just about anything, but the ones I picked here for the build work very well:
PGTW because with the heavy slowdown from Thana and DL, a 25% chunk of progress off a gen is agonizing to repair.
BBQ for points and info
Ruin because... yeah, who doesn't love Ruin? also its exceptionally effective against survivors who wont risk getting sick by working on an infected gen, these types are rare, but its funny to barf on a gen and watch them lose all that progress simply because they don't want to get sick.
Surveillance: Synergizes Beautifully with Jolt, and gives you a heads up on which gens survivors are at, what's not to like?
Corrupt Intervention: Faster early game pressure = more survivors sick and more hooks before gens start popping, which really amps up the slowdown perks effectiveness by mid game.
H:BF: This one caught me off guard with my playtesting yesterday. I didn't expect Freaking Blood Favor of all things to win me over this quick for the time being, and here's why: When you are vomiting on a survivor and they get fully sick/broken, H:BF activates!
For some reason, you have to be vomiting on them for this to trigger because if they simply go from coughing to fully infected while you aren't vomiting on them, H:BF won't activate, which is weird. However, to me Plagues greatest strength has always been that she's the only killer who can put survivors into the injured state without giving them a sprint burst... let that sink in a bit... ok, and now imagine that you are chasing a survivor at a loop, just barfing on them, and bam! they drop one health state, gain no speed burst enhanced distance AND all the pallets in 32m are blocked! My Jaw freaking dropped the first time this happened! I don't think people realize just how POWERFUL the new H:BF is in Plagues arsenal, so enjoy it while you can before everyone starts complaining about it, and it gets nerfed again.
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Survivor:
Whether I escape or not, as long as I out-earn everyone else in BP, that proves I was the MVP of the match and thus = a complete win. Also if I was the only survivor who doesn't DC over petty reasons... I really hate poor sportsmanship.
Killer:
... When I hear the Lamentations of their women!
(instant upvote for anyone who replies and gets this reference 😋)
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@EntitySpawn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2573284#Comment_2573284
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2573300#Comment_2573300
Isnt blood favour the one that blocks pallets? Because I dont see the point in it tbh, people get a sprint burst and can outrun the small distance it covers plus it's a hex.. my hex RNG is rubbish to begin with lol, always next to a gen in the open
Sad no killer perks got buffed to be worthy, I guess it's nice trapper is abit better
Blood Favor got buffed to have a 32 meter range now instead of its old/useless 16m, and on top of that they took away the basic attack requirement and the cooldown. This doesn't mean much for most killers, but on ranged ones its a godsend! Now, if only everyone wasn't focused on doing bones...
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Hex: Blood Favor is pretty good right now actually, even after they changed it to activate only when a survivor is injured by either a strike or the killers power... or at least that's what I would be saying if every little turd and their Dwight wasn't suddenly interested finding "bones".
Sigh, they do something good with a few hexes, only to take away the reason to use them in the first place... this game....
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I believe it would only be fair, if a hex relights only after stomping out a boon. For Example, say you cleansed Ruin, and then lit up a boon, if the killer stomps out the boon it relights as Hex: Ruin. Of course for certain hexes like NOED or Plaything the rules are pretty strict for their activation: if there are no dull totems available at the time they are supposed to activate, this simply means they don't activate, so stomping out a boon AFTER the gates have powered doesn't light up NOED, and doing the same after you've hooked a survivor for the first time doesn't activate a Plaything totem.
What this does is create a power struggle for who has control over the bones in the map, and this wouldn't really be broken for the killer because whatever boon they stomp out is replaced with a hex, so as a survivor, you already know where that totem is since it was a boon, and can go over to it to either cleanse it or bless it again depending upon how much time you want to spend on it, or how crucial controlling that territory is.
This way boons have better risk and reward for using them. You are rewarded with the boon's effects as long as they stand, but risk giving the killer back any number of hexes they brought in that have been cleansed/blessed. In Ruins case this isn't really a problem, because you'll automatically know where it is after the killer stomps it out bringing back ruin, but for something like Devour Hope, it can be very dangerous using Boons because no one wants that back, even if its only around for a short time.
I think this is the only feasible way to allow killers to relight hexes in that it requires survivors to allow it via their own choice of blessing a totem in the first place.
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If I see a Feng Min or a David, I immediately target them. Not because I feel the players who play those characters are toxic or anything, but because David's howls of pain are hilarious, and I'm addicted to smacking Feng for Squeaks.
It's like, every time I see a Feng Min, I say to myself "Squeaker!" and ignore the others to go after her.
IDK, it's become one of the Guilty pleasures of this game for me I guess...
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Well... if not Chucky, a Doll killer is a must, and I created a concept for one back in 2019-ish, and updated it in 2020 as an alternative OC for a doll based killer. You're welcome to read that here:
@TWiXT said:
This is an updated version of a concept I came up with over a year ago as an original killer alternative for those out there wanting to see a doll killer like Chucky in the game. I have Many changes but the most notable are the refined backstory, and reworks to the perks and power for better balance in today's current game environment and meta. I hope you guys like it.
The Dolls
Appearance/Mannerism: Alabaster porcelain Dolls dressed in different era or environment specific outfits of both male and female varieties. The Dolls move at 6m/s, and have a 24 meter Terror radius
Back-story:
Agnes Cartwright was a resident of a small town a few Km outside of Suffolk England from 1896-1923. In her early years she was seen as a peculiar child to others in the schoolhouse, but none could’ve known what torture she endured at her secluded home outside of town under the care of her vicious stepmother. Her father had passed away when she was 4 years old, leaving her at the mercy of her cruel and mentally unstable stepmom who demanded she come home immediately from school with no guests allowed, and regularly abused her verbally, physically and mentally over petty reasons like coming home 20 seconds late, talking out of turn or behaving childishly. Often locked in the cellar for hours, barely fed, and disallowed contact with others outside of school led Agnes to take comfort in the only fragment of her loving father she had: a large sized porcelain doll named Lucy, whom she regularly whispered to as her only friend. Eventually mercury poisoning from her stepmothers job as a Hatter made her too unpredictable, difficult to understand, and sickly to the point of being bedridden. Those last months of her stepmother’s life were the happiest Agnes had been in a long time. Agnes learned to use the machine in her stepmoms sewing room to make new outfits for Lucy, but the cracks and wear on Lucy were getting too problematic and Agnes could hear Lucy crying out to make her better. Her eye’s had fallen out and broken, and Agnes desperately needed new ones to replace them. At 13 years old Agnes trekked the distance into Suffolk to learn everything she could about doll-making, and while a social odd-ball, one shop owner took pity and started her off on a trial basis as an intern, but quickly came to realize that Agnes had a gift for fine details as well as clever innovation with all she was taught.
After learning enough about doll repair from the shop’s owner, Agnes slowly restored Lucy while tending to her sick stepmothers gibberish orders and violent outbursts, often Agnes had to calm her down with medicated powder dissolved in boiling water and inhaled through the steam as her doctor ordered. While the medication worked well, it left her stepmother in a confused stupor unable to remember things or accurately process new information, which was fine for Agnes since it ensured a lower chance of interruptions while she worked on Lucy. The biggest problem was always with the eyes, as nothing she tried made Lucy happy. While tending to her bedridden stepmother, Lucy spoke to Agnes about how pretty her stepmothers’ eyes were, and what a shame it would be if she carried them to the grave with her to rot. Agnes felt her blood run cold as the epiphany occurred to her, and she collected her tools for the task ahead.
It was harder than she was ready for, and even though her step mother had to be strapped down to the bed for her own good so she could be medicated without resistance, she still struggled against Agnes’s effort. All the blood made her slippery and hard to hold down, but after enough bleeding and eventual slip into shock, her stepmother stopped moving, and she extracted the eyes with care. Agnes gently removed the nerve cords, drained them and slipped in marbles to hold their structure, but fearing the eventual decay she ingeniously soaked them in transparent adhesive overnight before letting them dry, polished and lacquered them to a pristine shine, and with that Lucy finally had the eyes she always wanted.
As Agnes grew better at doll making and more astute with the finer details, the Doll Shop became much more successful, as everyone wanted one of Agnes’s original designs, earning her the title of “The Doll Lady” from the local children. It was always tough for Agnes, making new friends day in and day out, only to have to let them go home with little boys and girls once they were sold by the store owner, but in her mind, none of them could ever compare to Lucy. At home Lucy began asking Agnes to make more friends for her to play Stop ‘n Go and Hide n' Seek with while Agnes was away from home (The first game is now called Red light, Green Light). Agnes had always wanted to play those games with her classmates after school but was never allowed to, and she was delighted to take up the task. She worked hard to convert the sewing room into a full blown doll workshop. Sometimes stealing but otherwise buying supplies from her employer at a discount for her home shop; she dedicated herself to the craft of making new friends for hours every evening she could spare at home. Again however, Lucy disliked her new friend’s eyes, and eventually got them to beg Agnes for better ones like hers, a request which Agnes initially resisted.
In her mid 20’s however, upon returning home she found that a local boy had broken into her house and discovered her friends. Startled by Agnes, the boy threw a doll at her and leaped out the window. Agnes dodged it, but her mind broke as her beloved Lucy’s brief scream for help was silenced when she shattered against the wall. Agnes’s grief over the sudden loss of Lucy was overpowered by her fury as all of her friends cried out for her to punish the interloper in kind for murdering Lucy. Without hesitation she took up her shears, chased down the boy in the nearby woods, and ended his life. She took boy’s eyes as compensation and used them to give Lucy’s boyfriend Clay the eyes he always wanted. Agnes held a memorial for Lucy, burying her remains in her favorite spot of the meadow on their property overlooking the pond, marked the grave with a single candle and a small photo of her holding Lucy when she was 3, and hid the boy’s body in her basement alongside her stepmothers’ desiccated corpse. With the money she had earned, Agnes had a large, spike tipped, iron rod fence put in around her estate to keep out further transgressors, and by Clays persuasion, from that point on obnoxious children with pretty eyes started disappearing in her home town and Suffolk.
Agnes had mastered preserving the eyes, and giving them to her friends as gifts, sometimes taking a friend into town or Suffolk to pick and choose the eyes they liked best, and Agnes soon became an expert at luring, capturing, and killing the children and young teenagers to extract their eyes for her friends, as well as transporting and hiding their bodies in the woods. However, after a week long storm had caused mudslides, a few of her victims bodies were discovered floating down rivers, prompting authorities to search the wooded areas on the outskirts of Suffolk where more were discovered.
Everyone was on high alert for suspicious behavior, as any information leading to the arrest of “The Gouger,” now linked to the missing children, had become top priority. Agnes’s peculiarities and shift in personality became more troubling to her boss, and her insistence on walking home without an escort every evening while a killer was on the loose only drew further suspicion her way. She feigned ignorance as best she could until a constable visited her estate, discovered the desiccated bodies in her cellar and drew his revolver. Panicking about how she would never be allowed to play with her friends again, Agnes drew her shears and attacked the constable, taking a shot in the lower abdomen from his revolver, but managed to cut his jugular artery and send him tumbling down the cellar stairs. Agnes knew she didn’t have much time before more constables would be on her doorstep and had to move fast. After patching herself up haphazardly, she could hear all of her friends cry out begging to go with her, but she could only pack up a few with promises to return for the rest later.
Tears freely running down her cheeks, and dragging 2 travel trunks full of her friends while bleeding from her crudely stitched wound, she hastily limped off into the woods as a thick fog rolled in during the twilight hour. Despite the horrific discovery of the dolls she left behind featuring preserved children’s eyes, and an exhaustive manhunt lasting for months, Agnes was never found.
Weapon:
Knives, scissors, ice picks, box cutters etc. Anything small enough for the dolls to wield that could be found in any home or store. (Possibly themed per realm in weapon cosmetic packs) They have a higher than average lunge range but the shortest reach of all killers.
Power: Possession
Passive:
Up to 10-16 dolls appear on the trial grounds based upon map size, and are eager to play a lethal game of “Red light, Green light” with survivors. A possessed doll within 16 meters of a survivor can be transfixed and unable to move or attack (unless touching the survivor) as long as a survivor is looking at it with their inner 30 degree cone of vision, but will be able to move and attack again once the survivor breaks their inner 30 degree line of sight with it or gets more than 16 meters away. Hooked survivors or survivors in the dying state can’t transfix a doll. Similar to how tall reeds and corn affects killers using line of sight abilities (Shape, Ghost Face), vegetation counts as broken line of sight to a survivor looking in a dolls direction restricting the transfixion range to 8 meters. Possessed Dolls make movement sounds and periodic child giggling noises that can be heard within 12 meters, and their Terror Radius, giggling, and red stain persists for 6 seconds for a recently possessed doll after transferring to a new one. The Dolls can’t vault windows, or destroy pallets while transfixed. Breaking, Grabbing, Carrying, Vaulting and Hooking actions are performed by the invisible spirit of Agnes Cartwright who possesses the Dolls and can’t be body blocked, and after it’s hooked a survivor, it possesses the nearest doll.
(Possible balance change if needed due to The Dolls size)
This is the only killer with a 3rd person perspective.
OR,
Fog and Vegetation renders 90% transparent in a 20m radius for the killer when in a dolls perspective. (if going this rout I suggest it also applies to Pig and Ghost Face when they crouch)
Active:
Activating this power transfers your perspective to the nearest Doll, or to the Doll whose aura you target over the span of .3-3 seconds depending upon distance. After possessing another doll if the doll you left behind was transfixed by a survivors gaze, that survivors aura is revealed to you until they get far enough away or break line of sight with it.
Mori:
Four dolls run in and hold the survivors limbs down while the fifth eyeless doll gouges out the survivors eyes with its hands, eats them, and blinks revealing the newly acquired eyes in its sockets, after which the dolls scatter and your perspective returns to the last used doll.
Map: The “Doll Lady’s” House.
In the middle of a large meadow overrun with chest high grass, and on the edge of some woods with a small pond, lies a run down one story home with a living room, bedroom, small bathroom, kitchen and dining area, a doll making workshop room, and a basement accessible from a cellar door outside. Aside from the base of a few mid-sized boulders and trees there is barely a bald spot of earth on the grounds of this map. The entire estate is surrounded by a large, rusty, spike tipped, iron rod fence. Hooks on this map are wood framed and feature stitched together patches of fabric wrapping around them, dangling doll body parts, and a small black and white memorial photo of a of a 3 year old girl holding a doll at the base lit by a single candle.
Unique Perks:
Painful Neglect: Survivors who lose focus on their goals incur hefty penalties. Survivors who take their inner 30 degree cone of vision off of a generator they are repairing experience a 5/10/15% reduced progress speed, increased odds of triggering skill checks, and reduced skill check success zones.
Hide n’ Seek: Innate Control over your terrifying presence conceals your whereabouts from survivors. When within 8/16/24 meters of a survivor, the Terror Radius’s heartbeat sound no longer increases its Rate the closer you are to them.
Mind Numbing Mist: Your intense desire to kill transgressors has saturated the fog of the trial grounds, dulling and suppressing the Survivors sense of situational awareness. Up to 2/3/4 Survivors no longer receive Status Effect, Perk and Teammate condition notifications during the trial. Injured, Dying, Hooked and Exhaustion notifications are exempt from this effect.
Survivor: Wei Ying
A bit malnourished but professional to the core, Wei Ying is a clever man in his 30’s who has over 15 years of experience as an electrical technician. In his youth he always took apart every toy and electronic in his possession; intrigued by how they worked, and as an adult he’s a master of electronics and an artist with his tools and ingenuity having created multiple patented devices that are mass produced today. Cocky, condescending to others, but intense when he commits to a task; having him as an ally ensures objectives will be completed more smoothly than you’re accustomed.
Unique Perks:
Tools of the Trade: When supplies are low you have a keen instinct for finding the right tools for the job. While carrying a Flashlight or Toolbox item of common/uncommon/rare or lower quality during a trial, the first chest you open will be a guaranteed Match or Upgraded rarity item of the same type.
Safety First: Your knowledge of working around electrical devices outmatches others who tend to ignore the basic rules of repairing. When you start repairing a generator it powers down over the span of 8/6/4 seconds and remains powered down while you work on it. Leaving an affected generator for more than 6 seconds, failed skill checks, and damage from the killer will immediately power it back up at its current level of progress.
Delay Resistors: Experience has rewarded you with an advantage against the Killer’s situational awareness. After you completely repair a generator, the generators full power up and notifying alert to the killer is delayed for 3/4/5 seconds or until another survivor begins working on it. The generator can be damaged by the killer within this window of time.
TL;DR Version:
The Dolls
Appearance/Mannerism: Alabaster porcelain dolls the size of totems of male and female variety with differing outfits (possibly in themed outfit packs of 4, e.g. creepy dolls made to look like small versions of the other killers/survivors), they have a 24m terror radius and a 6m\s movement speed.
Weapon: Small weapons such as knives, scissors, screwdrivers, ice picks, claw hammers etc. basically anything small enough for a Doll to wield that can be found anywhere (possibly in themed cosmetic weapon packs of 4, e.g. Realm themed small farm tools, medical tools, metal shop tools, hunting tools…). They have a larger than average lunge range but the shortest reach of all killers.
Power: Possession
Passive: Up to 10-16 dolls appear on the trial grounds based upon map size, and are eager to play a lethal game of “Red light, Green light” with survivors. A possessed doll within 16 meters of a survivor can be transfixed and unable to move or attack (unless touching the survivor) as long as a survivor is looking at it with their inner 30 degree cone of vision, but will be able to move and attack again once the survivor breaks thier inner 30 degree line of sight with it or gets more than 16 meters away. Hooked survivors or survivors in the dying state can’t transfix a doll. Similar to how tall reeds and corn affects killers using line of sight abilities (Shape, Ghost Face), vegetation counts as broken line of sight to a survivor looking in a dolls direction restricting the transfixion range to 8 meters. Possessed Dolls make movement sounds and periodic child giggling noises that can be heard within 12 meters, and Terror Radius, giggling, and red stain persists for 6 seconds for a recently possessed doll after transferring to a new one. The Dolls can’t vault windows, or destroy pallets while transfixed. Breaking, Grabbing, Carrying, Vaulting and Hooking actions are performed by the invisible spirit of Agnes Cartwright who possesses the Dolls and can’t be body blocked, and after it’s hooked a survivor, it possesses the nearest doll.
(Possible balance change if needed due to The Dolls size)
This is the only killer with a 3rd person perspective.
Or,
Fog and Vegetation renders 90% transparent in a 20m radius for the killer when in a dolls perspective. (if going this rout I suggest it also applies to Pig and Ghost Face when they crouch)
Active: Activating this power transfers your perspective to the nearest Doll, or to the Doll whose aura you target over .3-3 seconds depending on distance. After possessing another doll if the doll you left behind was transfixed by a survivors gaze, that survivors aura is revealed to you until they get far enough away or break line of sight with it.
Mori: Four dolls run in and hold the survivors limbs down while the fifth eyeless doll gouges out the survivors eyes with its hands, eats them, and blinks revealing the newly acquired eyes in its sockets, after which the dolls scatter and your perspective returns to the last used doll.
Map: The “Doll Lady’s” House
A small 5 room run down home with a basement accessible by a cellar door on the outside in the middle of a large and very grassy meadow. On the edges of this meadow are young woods, and a small pond. The grounds are surrounded by a spike tipped, rusty, Iron rod fence, and the hooks are wood framed and feature stitched together patches of fabric wrapping around them, dangling doll body parts, and a small black and white memorial photo of a of a 3 year old girl holding a doll at the base lit by a single candle.
Unique Perks:
Painful Neglect: At Max, Survivors who take their inner 30 degree cone of vision off of a generator they are repairing experience a 15% reduced progress speed, increased odds of triggering skill checks, and reduced skill check success zones.
Hide n’ Seek – At Max, When within 24 meters of a survivor, the Terror Radius’s heartbeat sound no longer increases its Rate the closer you are to them.
Mind Numbing Mist – At Max, Up to 4 Survivors no longer receive Status effect, Perk and Teammate condition notifications during the trial. Injured, Down, Hooked and Exhaustion status notifications are exempt from this effect.
Survivor: Wei Ying
A malnourished electrical technician with a cocky attitude, and condescending demeanor towards others. Never the less his expertise at repairing and tinkering with items makes having him as an ally a great benefit to the team when focused on primary objectives.
Unique Perks:
Tools of the Trade: At Max, While carrying a Flashlight or Toolbox item of Rare or lower quality during a trial, the first chest you open will be a guaranteed Match or Upgraded rarity item of the same type.
Safety First – At Max, When you start repairing a generator it powers down over the span of 4 seconds and remains powered down while you work on it. Leaving an affected generator for more than 6 seconds, failed skill checks, and damage from the killer will immediately power it back up at its current level of progress.
Delay Resistors – At Max, After you completely repair a generator, the generators full power up and notifying alert to the killer is delayed by 5 seconds or until another survivor begins working on it. The generator can be damaged by the killer within this window of time.
All creative criticism is welcome.
Note that the killers power is all about jumping from doll to doll in order to ambush survivors which predates the Twins by a long shot, and unlike the twins, their Red Light, Green Light mechanic actually makes it impossible to camp hooks with them. Also the Possession mechanic itself solves all the problems a Doll based killer would have such as: breaking pallets, grabbing, hooking, and vaulting. Overall, I kinda feel like the devs drew inspiration from this concept for the Twins, but didn't pay enough attention to what would make them balanced... Personal feelings aside, I still feel that this is a solid Concept, and actually want to work on a 3rd and final version of The Dolls with all the bells and whistles to really flesh them out as a Viable candidate for DbD.
It's a long read mind you, but I included a TL;DR in the end of the post to sum up what the killer is, how it works, and of course the perks for both the killer and survivor. If you like this concept as an alternative to Chucky, please feel free to comment in the original post, as that will help me in forming the final version.
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Executioner you say? Equip Franklin's Demise (perk) + Mannequin's Foot (add-on), Proceed to Knock the key out of their hands with FD, and Draw a trail over it with M2/Power button.
Mannequin's foot makes the trail last for 90 seconds + FD completely drains the charges from an item in 90 seconds + Survivors don't like to get tormented = Sadistic Choice! Survivors wanting their key back Either Have to get tormented, Or it loses all of its charges. More fun, unlike other items which hover above the trails, Keys get completely covered up by them, so sometimes you'll catch a survivor crouching along a trail looking for their key.
While this isn't a guarantee against keys overall, especially in the High MMR games wherein some of them are smart enough to hide their keys somewhere in the corner of the map to keep em safe from FD, It's still very fun and effective against most while playing Executioner, or just against items in general. Also Fun fact: if a survivor Dies in a Cage with an item, it will fall under the cage, and out of survivors reach to be picked back up (they can't squeeze past the cages model). This won't happen nearly as often as a fully drained item will, but it's still funny when it does.
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My totem Killer build uses Detectives Hunch and Inner Strength, but I have been playing around with Counter Force instead of Detectives Hunch because of how much faster you cleanse the totems; making it so you spend less time on them and can get back to gens quicker. Nothing makes me happier than finishing a match only to see that my totem fixation paid off since the killer brought in NOED, but it never activated. Honestly, If everyone just cleansed every totem they find, no one would have to spend much time doing them before they all get wiped out, but sadly, most players won't take the extra 12 seconds to do bones before hitting up a gen, and that's exactly why NOED is so Effective.
Many people say NOED is a Crutch for killers that rewards them for playing poorly, but I've come to the conclusion that because it's normally so easy to avoid (badham, RPD, and Midwitch excluded), and survivors generally tend to avoid taking that 12 second extra step in doing so... It's a crutch no doubt, but it doesn't reward the killer for playing poorly, it rewards them for the survivors laziness. After coming to that conclusion, I don't really blame killers for bringing it in anymore. After all, Killers benefit most from survivors mistakes, and ignoring something so easy to avoid most of the time until the endgame when it bites you in the ass... is definitely a survivor mistake.
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The DbD Community changed the Definitions of a few words and phrases used on these forums a long time ago:
Fun = Easy, or casual experience
Boring = Challenging
Broken = Annoying
Meta = Predictable/Overused
Non-Meta = Meme
Over Powered/OP = "I don't get how to play around it, won't bother trying, so I'm gonna complain."
NOED = 1. A Vulgar word uttered to elicit attention from others, but its overuse only draws anger from them, and its usage is often seen as showing a lack of intelligence in the poster/commenter. 2. Often used in the title as an initiator of "Baiting" posts.
Toxic = A general community player
OP, Learn these altered definitions and it will enlighten you as to what most of the posters and commenters mean when they say stuff like:
"I just wanted a fun game with my friends, but ended up against a broken ass Pig player who was so boring to go up against, yet somehow still won. I mean WTAF, how have the devs left this OP PoS remain unchanged in the game for so long? It doesn't help how Toxic they were either."
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@Adeloo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2495993#Comment_2495993
Well you all put them at the same level than Devour Hope, with no actual work needed from the survivors to power up (doing gens for example) and they could spam up to 5 totems, 4 of them which could be the same one. We saw how it was with old Undying and honestly no one wants to go back this way. I can't imagine how miserable the killer experience would be if one after the other, survivors uses New Building Materials.
Because let's face it, how many killers actually run the Enduring/Spirit Fury/Brutal strengh combo now ? probably 10 if not 5%
I did put in the stipulation that only 1 boon totem of the same type can be active, so if 4 survivors came in with the same boon, it would only apply to 1 boon totem. The way I see it, the devs are either going to go similarly in the way the OP has stated, or the devs will make Boons their own object that spawns in depending upon how many are used, with that stipulation I've mentioned.
Honestly, the easiest way for them to do this is to apply it by reusing the Lunar Event lanterns, 1 spawning for each unique boon, and just like in the lunar event, all the killer has to do is smash them with an attack, but until then, like with Ruin or Devour Hope, the boons will be quite crippling to the opposing side. I'd even go so far as to think that there'll be a boon in which survivors won't be able to get downed by the killer at all until it's been destroyed. Still, the possibility of 16 boons spawning in a map (1 for each survivor perk slot) isn't an impossibility, especially if all the killer has to do is smack em with a basic attack. Basically it would be seen as a way to distract the killer from pursuing survivors in the early-mid game, and give survivors more time to cleanse hexes or do gens, because "obviously, survivors need all the help they can get!" /s
I have this nagging feeling that the devs might do it this way, and If this is the way it actually goes, then I am OUT.
I made that list of Boons overpowered as a joke, but considering the devs, now feel like I'm probably not too far off from being correct. Sigh... at least I had fun coming up with them... Lets hope the devs don't take any inspiration from that list.
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I'm surprised that this is even up for discussion. Lets just consider how the Lament configuration even works when it comes to survivors vs Pinhead:
- Survivors see the Lament Configurations aura as soon as it spawns, with the only exception being if The Cenobite brings in an Ultra Rare add-on, which still reveals it's aura when the survivors get within 16 meters of it.
- When a Survivor Simply picks up the LC, that ends any active chain hunt for their entire team.
- If a Survivor Solves the LC, it respawns in 45 seconds, but if The Cenobite picks it up the respawn time is 10 seconds.
- It takes 90 seconds by default for the LC to trigger a chain hunt IF no one picks it up, which can only be reduced to 75 seconds with the aid of add-on's.
So, we have an Aspect of the Killers power that the survivors can not only take control over, can even see at all times whenever it spawns, can also delay the chain hunts by a maximum of 135 seconds (90 + 45 seconds or 2 min 15 seconds) before the next chain hunt can commence every time they solve it, and if the killer gets it, the ensuing chain hunt will last a little over 10 seconds before a survivor picks up the box again.
OP is ACTUALLY SUGGESTING that the killer shouldn't be able to use a perk combo to activate AN ASPECT OF HIS POWER more often, and instead give survivors complete control over whether or not it's ALLOWED?
...
While we're at it, we might as well make it so that Blinding the Shape with a Flashlight removes his Stalking Progress, Billy's Chainsaw needs to be refueled with gas cans all over the map that survivors can tip over, Nurse needs an inhaler in order to blink that the survivors can pick up to keep away from her, and why don't we re-instate permanent Sabotage for Trappers Bear Traps.
Also all killers can no longer use the same perks 2 games in a row, and any that synergize with a killers power are unavailable.
That sounds like a "fun" game to me, what do you guys think? I would play the HELL out of that game!
/s
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@Impose said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2495597#Comment_2495597
Some of these are so bananas overpowered I can't even believe I'm reading them lol
@Adeloo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2495597#Comment_2495597
well as much as i like the effort you put into those, they just sounds OP af especially when the killer already don't have the time to pressure both gens and totems.
That's the point... I was tempted to add a /s indicating sarcasm at the end of the comment, but I got this crawling suspicion that the devs have already thought of all of these. No one likes NOED? Boon: Protection, 4th chance, and Daylight will take care of that. Killer using the Enduring/Spirit Fury/Brutal Strength Combo? Boon: New Building Materials! Are they using the Ruin/Undying/Tinkerer Combo? Boon: Aura of Purification and Third Eye gotcha covered, etc...
Basically Totems in the game were meant to be OP because they represent a perk that your enemy has the power to destroy, and some Hex perks like Ruin, and Devour Hope actually live up to that ideal, but for the most part they don't since the devs don't want the killers to be too oppressive. However, you just KNOW that the devs won't hold back as much when it comes to the survivors "Boon" version, as it will appease the majority of the player base.
Of course these are OP af, and while I can already hear Killer mains everywhere crying out for nerfs to them on these forums, I can also expect a whole lot of "Just Do Bone's/Boons" comments as well. Hell My prediction of there being a maximum of 16 boons on the trial grounds, while very tongue in cheek, is probably something else the devs have considered as we don't know if the Boon Totems will actually take over the current Skull Pile model, or be given their own little Totem pole/Lantern models. I can totally see the devs pulling this stunt, and I can also guess it may only take the killer 1 second to destroy a Boon Totem to compensate for the time they spent searching for them while hunting down survivors (like smashing the lanterns during the Lunar event).
I've just learned the hard way not to put anything past these Devs when it comes to appeasing the survivor player base (majority), and sadly, as much as I hate to think about it, I expect those "boon predictions" to likely be not too far off from what they'll actually do.
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Or, they could just spawn in a new type of totem on the trial grounds, if that's the case, here are my Predictions:
Boon: Protection
Whenever you are struck by the killers basic attacks while under the Exposed status effect, the strike will instead trigger the Endurance status effect, and you will be inflicted with a Deep Wound. Survivors struck while under the effect of Deep Wound will be put into the dying state. This effect lasts as long as Boon: Protection remains in the trial grounds.
Boon: New Building Materials
Dropped pallets take 10/15/20% longer for a killer to destroy when using the basic "Break Pallet" interaction, and Pallet stun duration takes 40/45/50% longer for the killer to recover. These effects are removed if Boon: New Building Materials is destroyed.
Boon: Athletic Prowess
Running and Vault speeds are increased by 1% for every other active boon totem in the trial grounds. Every time another Boon totem is destroyed your team is affected by the exhaustion status for 20/15/10 seconds. This effect ends immediately if Boon: Athletic Prowess is destroyed.
Boon: Alternative Rout
If the killer shuts the hatch, another open hatch will spawn in the trial grounds for 35/55/75 seconds. If Boon: Alterative Rout is destroyed, both hatches disappear from the trial grounds.
Boon: Fair Trade
Whenever the killer hooks a survivor, up to 1/2/3 previously broken pallets will repair in the down state on the trial grounds. This effect remains active as long as Boon: Fair Trade remains standing.
Boon: Shared Vision
Whenever the killer moves within 8/12/16 meters of a Boon totem their aura is revealed. While Boon: Shared Vision remains active, any time the killers aura is revealed to you it is also revealed to your teammates. This effect lasts as long as Boon: Shared Vision remains active on the trial grounds.
Boon: Third Eye
Whenever the killer triggers the Undetectable Status, Boon: Third Eye Reveals their location to your team for 2/3/4 seconds. This effect lasts as long as Boon: Third Eye remains active on the trial grounds.
Boon: Aura of Purification
Once Boon: Aura of Purification is Active Up to 1/2/3 Hex totems cannot activate and will remain dull. If Boon: Purification is destroyed, all inactive Hexes will activate on any remaining dull totems.
Boon: Silence Is Golden
For as long as Boon: Silence is Golden remains active in the trial grounds, all survivors Footsteps, Breathing, Injured Grunts, and Screams are reduced by 50/75/100% in volume.
Boon: Suppressed Presence
Whenever any survivors auras are revealed to the killer, they are instead suppressed, and can only be seen by the killer if they are within 24/16/8 meters of the revealed survivor(s). If Boon: Suppressed Presence is Destroyed, all survivors auras are revealed to the killer for 10 seconds.
Boon: 4th Chance
Any survivor on their Death Hook/Final Hook Phase will trigger a Second Struggle phase upon either becoming hooked again, or ending the initial struggle phase without being rescued. This Second struggle phase will last for 10/20/30 seconds, and the killer may kill any survivor rescued from this phase with their own hands. This effect lasts for as long as Boon 4th chance remains standing.
Boon: Daylight
Once the gates are powered, Boon: Daylight Activates and the gates will automatically open within 40/30/20 seconds. If any Survivors are hooked or in the dying state when the gates open, they will automatically free themselves from the hook or recover to the injured state. Any survivor Struck by the killer within 16 meters of an exit gates threshold will be granted the Endurance Status effect, and suffer Deep Wounds instead. Any survivor suffering Deep Wounds will enter the dying state if Struck by the killer. Boon: Daylights Effect lasts as long as it remains standing.
Only 1 boon of each type may be active on the trial grounds at any given time (max 16).
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He's weak.
The benefit of such a hard skill shot to land with his possessed chains should be far more rewarding, but survivors break out of them so easily that it barely slows them down at all, much less lands him a hit most of the time. Add in the stupid as hell Range add-ons that increase how far you can spawn a portal or the distance the chain can travel, and you've got wasted BP whenever you purchase them. I mean, come on! Why would I want to extend the reach of his power, if the only chance I'll ever get at being rewarded for it with a hit can only happen within less than 12 meters? It would be different if they changed it so that the chains become harder to break based upon how far away you land the shot, but that's simply not the case here. At best, these add-ons only serve the purpose of interrupting survivors actions from further away, and while that can be a handy tool, it still doesn't do much in the long run.
Easily breakable Chains and Stupid/useless range add-ons aside, My biggest gripe has always been about the Lament Configuration box's mechanic itself. The chain hunt is the only thing that turns Pinhead into a 1v4 focused killer instead of a 1v1, as it has the potential to distract the entire survivor team and slow down their progress. The big Issue I have is that:
- Survivors always see the box's aura as soon as it spawns.
- If a survivor simply picks up the box, that ends the chain hunt for everyone but them, and all they have to do is solve it to get rid of that.
- it take 45 seconds for the box to respawn after being solved by a survivor, and 90 seconds after that for a chain hunt to initiate, IF no one bothers to pick it up. That's 135 seconds or 2mins 15 seconds between chain hunts in matches that, on average, take 10 minutes to finish!
- Whenever a Chain hunt actually does initiate, if ever, it only lasts for like 10 seconds at most before someone picks up the box and ends it.
- Basically, survivors have to ALLOW it to happen, via ignorance of how much time they have, or on purpose.
- if there are 2 survivors left in the match, the chain hunt doesn't spawn any chains to harass them.
I've gone so many rounds without a chain hunt ever initiating, because the devs haven't learned their lesson with Plague, Trapper, or the Twins, and have once again given survivors complete control over an aspect of a killers power... hell they even highlighted and gift wrapped it for them!
If I were a dev for this game, and due to how costly it is to the killer for a survivor to solve the box/how costly it is to teleport to it (45 second respawn + 90 seconds before the next chain hunt, or 2 mins 15 seconds between chain hunts in a game that has an average of 10 mins per match), I'd simply change it so that:
- Survivors don't see the box's aura at all until AFTER a chain hunt begins
- Picking up the box doesn't stop a chain hunt, pause it, or prevent its progress for anyone until AFTER it has been solved
- Change the iridescent add-on that reduces the boxes aura range to 16 meters to apply only AFTER a chain hunt initiates, when the box's aura is revealed.
- Change the chain hunt to spawn 3 chains per survivor if all survivors are present, and reduce it by 1 chain per survivor killed, that way if there is only 1 survivor left the chain hunt wont affect them while they run around, but allow it to spawn a chain to attack them if they do any actions like repair a gen, heal, loot chests, cleanse totems, sabo hooks, or if they just hold still for too long... opening gates is exempt.
- taking the box from a survivor via downing/grabbing them extends the respawn time to 30 seconds. currently no matter when Pinhead picks up the box it always respawns in 10 seconds, so with this change you are rewarded with a longer chain hunt for taking the box from a survivor, obviously FD won't help with this as the spawn time from picking up the box from the ground will remain the same, but rewarding you with 3x the time before it respawns because you downed a survivor with it will encourage them to try and solve it sooner.
With 4 survivors constantly running around, and the box spawning in wide open places while emitting a very noticeable sound, it's not like it's so difficult to find that they need game long aura reading on it in the first place. That, and Solving the box to prevent or stop a chain hunt for your team while risking Pinhead teleporting to you himself, seems like a much more worthwhile and rewarding trade off. While this change won't help with how weak the chains are, it could at least allow pinheads 1v4 mechanic more of a chance to activate instead of being denied from ever happening at all due to too much information on the survivors side.
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While I would rebuke this by simply saying
"we have such sights to show you"I'm afraid that would be something the devs would find... oh what is the phrase... a "Complication in my comment" and have it removed.Creepy as hell as the Chatterer is, NOTHING beats that deep baritone voice oozing with both command and threat in its presence. Who cares how often he said "I Came"... That line was just as intensely delivered as it was in the movies (albeit in the movies he said "We came" but since there's only 1 killer... I'm fine with the change).
Sigh, I'm saddened that for the first time a couple of Legendary skins actually got their own voices, but the MAIN cosmetic skin, had theirs removed, for what I can only ascertain as asinine reasons considering the devs are keeping a firm silence concerning the matter when asked. Unless it's something of a Legal nature, like changing "we came" to "I came" when quoting the movie franchise Pinhead comes from, and someone among the franchise holders is just REALLY ANAL about that, the only conclusion we can come to is that his lines sounded "embarrassing" for some reason... as if no one on the Q&A team could have caught that, and it took an internet full of juvenile memers to point it out to them.
Regardless, I am heartbroken, and hope to once again hear Pinhead speak; quoting famous lines while educating survivors in the ecstasy of all forms of pain, while reveling in their exquisite agony.