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Why wouldn't I just level up Huntress?
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Why would you put a Reverse Bear Trap on someone?
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We should buff both those Killers. Asleep Survivors have a 50% action speed penalty. Stalked Survivors are hindered and their auras are revealed for the duration.
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@nononono said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863603#Comment_863603
Well excessive DCing sure.. but you know BHVR, they have a tendency to overkill things and I feel like they will make this DCing punishment too much.
and as for games not caring about DC, most don’t do anything about it. I can play COD and keep leaving and rejoining different games without punishment. Cod zombies is a good example, 4 people join a match so they get 4x the zombies and then 2 people leave so that leaves 2 people with 4x the zombies. That’s unfair for those 2 people. In overwatch I can leave a couple matches and not get a ban, and those people are now screwed, especially if 2 of us leave. And one was a healer or something. In rainbow 6 siege you can leave a lot of games and still not get a temporary ban from matchmaking. In fortnite you can leave as many games and still not get banned..
each time screwing over your teammates every time. And these are popular games which are more popular than dbd! If BHVR is going to cater to the killers that cry about DC bans then they don’t know what they’re doing.
the only time you get a temporary ban from leaving or killing a teammate is when it’s in a game that has a “competitive” gamemode. And ONLY in that game mode. But this game doesn’t have 2 separate game modes and isn’t competitive.
This whole issue is about excessively DCing/leaving the game, so when you say "sure", what exactly is there left to argue? I'm not advocating for banning people for DCing/leaving once or twice.
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@nononono said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863264#Comment_863264
almost every other game doesn’t care about DCs. Leaving early in overwatch puts your team in a bad spot. Same with COD, r6, fortnite, etc. and those are way more competive. It better be a fair amount of DCs before a temporary ban. And this ban better be like 30 min. Simple way to change this would be to give the killer a little more bloodpoints and subtract a gen from the total amount of gens the other survivors have to do, like it does if they dc before the game starts
What? Punishing people for excessive DCing is a thing in video games. What makes you think that most games don't care about DCs?
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@Nhekii said:
You need to understand that DS is not an anti-tunnel perk. It's a perk designed to grant a survivor 60 seconds of immunity after getting unhooked, not for punishing killers that are tunnelling.
@PatBrutal said:
Decisive Strike Q&A with Horvath | February 22, 2019
Today we did a Q&A session on discord with Stefan Horvath about the upcoming changes on Decisive Strike.
So here are below the answers given by our Game Designer/Stefan Horvath.Question: What led to the decision to put the timer on Decisive Strike?
Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed
Question: Are these changes final?
Horvath: We are constantly looking at feedback from out players as well as in respect to the new content that we create, for now you will see this version of Decisive Strike on the PTB
Question: Why the timer? Doesn’t that just encourage the survivor to get downed again just to have a perk?
Horvath: Well, it depends on how you see it. You only disable Decisive Strike if you've successfully hit the skill check, or if you tried to hit the skill check and failed. Therefore the timer serves as a window to use the perk, but not to lose the perk.
Question: Doesn’t the change to DS make it very similar to borrowed time and kind of redundant in purpose?
Horvath: I feel like borrowed time and Decisive Strike serve a similar purpose, but DS is controlled by the person on the hook, whereas Borrowed Time requires a teammate to run it and unhook you. I believe there is place for both perks
Question: Have you considered making it so Enduring doesn't apply to DS stun, now that the stun lasts 3 seconds?
Horvath: There has been a lot of feedback regarding the 3 second stun for Decisive Strike, previously the stun has been 4 seconds for a long time, once upon a time it used to be 5 seconds. We are currently revising and investigating what we will do regarding enduring and the Decisive Strike timer, it may end up being 4 seconds, but I believe we will try 3 seconds in the PTB. I look forward to your feedback
Question: About the DS changes, wouldn’t these changes punish killers if they find the same survivor and or during a killer's snowball?
Horvath: There is definitely a possibility that this happens, I deliberately ran to the killer and was downed/ picked up to just get my DS off and it definitely affected the tide of the game. But ultimately, we have tried to mitigate the amount of time DS wastes in respect to the killer, having the skillcheck occur during pick up and no longer having the non-obsession wiggling out at 35% will save a lot of time.
Question: Thanks again for being here it's really nice that you take the time to be closer to the community. When you started the discussion about DS, what did you have in mind ? Did you wanted to straight up nerf it or just change/adjust it ?
Horvath: Decisive Strike has been a topic of conversation for a long time, we have entertained several iterations in the past. I will see if I can go into the interations. Ultimately, when we look at balancing the game we try and offer an experience that is fun for everyone, while understanding that one side is trying to kill the other :P. There are definitely frustrations, and we are constantly looking to make this more fun and enjoyable for everyone.
Question: Should the stun not be longer (original 5 sec) if the Survivor who used DS was already the Obsession to give them extra time against like for example a black box Freddy?
Horvath: Definitely a possibility, I don’t know if we will go to 5 seconds though
Question: Isn't this DS change a nerf to Dying Light? Since the obsession changes and is therefore alive when a new obsession is chosen?
Horvath: This will definitely affect Dying Light if survivors choose to proc DS at the right moments. Depending on the gameplay and decisions made a survivor team could reverse the effects of Dying Light, until another obsession dies. I think the new obsession interaction should be quite interesting, and I look forward to how you guys use it.
Question: Could you confirm that rancor won’t be an insane perk because of the new changes?
Horvath: Rancor will be quite interesting, the edge case to be able to achieve 4 mori's with Rancor will be very hard to achieve. Considering the time it takes to mori someone, and that the last person still needs to get off the hook and have time left on their Decisive Strike. It may happen though, and I hope it's clipped when it does
Question: i personally think it’s almost impossible to do it as by that time survivors will either win or simply use the ds early so you only get 1 rancor kill
Horvath: You may have to try and put more chance on your side with Blood Warden
Question: Why doesn't the timer only progress when you're in a hunt? I mean, wouldn't that be balanced?
Horvath: We chose to keep 60 seconds as the window of opportunity to limit the situations where you can use DS. Feedback that we have received from the community and evidence of how our games play out indicate that being able to DS out of the killers grasp at any time in the match can have a major effect on the killers efficiency. With the timer now, players should feel more rewarded when hitting their DS and hopefully killers won’t feel that the DS stun was out of place under the current conditions
Question: Will the size of DS' skill check remain the same? or will we be seeing a bigger chance due to the change to it?
Horvath: The skill check is going to be slightly larger than the first tier overcharge skillcheck.
Question: Does it feel good to make a change to a perk that has plagued both sides of the community, killers and survivors, for so long?
Horvath: We will see how it works out in the wild, I believe we as a team enjoy to work at making this game more pleasant and interesting for everyone.
Question: I have very interesting question to you and your team but i don’t know you want to say that to us. We will get Decisive in PTB, so there is my question - PTB will come to us in Tuesday?
Horvath: I unfortunately cannot tease you with the date! But I am excited for you guys to try it out.
Question: What do you think about all killers perks like "play with your food", "rancor" or even "remember me"? Isn't the new DS a kinda huge nerf for them?
Horvath: It depends on which perk you are running, Rancor could end up with multiple moris on multiple survivors, Play With Your Food may change your mentality, and you may lose the chase with the survivor to gain a token to chase someone else down. Remember Me will allow you to trigger more time on the door if you have not reached maximum stacks.
Question: There are a lot of bugs in the game, and you guys think about changing perks…
Horvath: I think it's an interesting question, I focus on many aspects not just improving perks, perks can sometimes be easier to adjust in comparison to large components of the game and they definitely add value to replayability and keeping things fresh.
Question: Does this mean dribbling a survivor serves no purpose? Good on BHVR to remove that.
Horvath: Yes dribbling should no longer be a thing, I do not believe this was mentioned in the blogpost but there is now a 0.5 second delay before a killer can drop a survivor after picking them up. This should avoid dribbling and flashlight dodging right after a pick up. (flashlights can still be avoided by facing away from them)
Question: With how short game time is if survivors choose to optimally complete their objective, isn't DS still a perk that grants too much ground, and now encourages 4 people to run it in a game since everyone gets the same effect regardless of obsession status?
Horvath: I am quite excited to see how we behave with the new Decisive strike Changes, I am not sure everyone will run it, I am also wondering if some killers will even see DS proc if they do not tunnel. The 60 seconds does allow for enough time to find a killer after being unhooked, but I believe it will come down to a smart strategy in that case.
Question: Do you have any plans at the moment to adjust the other Obsession perks, since the obsession-switching has such a drastic effect on that mechanic?
Horvath: All perks can possibly change depending on what ideas we have for them, if they fit and depending on how the community views them. The Obsession mechanic hasn't had many updates so far, so it is possible more changes will come for them.
Question: Out of curiosity, What has been the general reaction to the new decisive strike changes?Question: Out of curiosity, What has been the general reaction to the new decisive strike changes?
Horvath: There have been a lot of emotions, I believe there have been more than a few people who have wanted DS changes and even more who are unsure whether they like or dislike the changes. I am personally excited to see what happens when it is released.
Question: Has it been asked yet if the DS timer will continue to count if BT is applied? I'm assuming both timers will run simultaneously?
Horvath: I am not 100% sure, they should be both running simultaneously imo.
Question: Does the 60 Second timer introduced with the rework still run when in the dying state? Meaning can a killer just slug the suspected DS user to wait the DS out?
Horvath: Absolutely, from what I've gathered from the community feedback so far and internal talk, there may be some slug metas incoming, and obviously anti slugging perks will probably come out to play as well. time will tell though
Question: So you can no longer save DS? once you miss it, it's a wrap right?
Horvath: If you succeed or fail the skill check it's gone. But if you let the skillcheck go by it will be active again when you are unhooked the next time
Question: Why does DS have to make the survivor the obsession? Am I missing something?
Horvath: We thought it would be an interaction that the players would enjoy, it was not necessary.
Question: Is the timer still something that BHVR will be looking into? DS's effective time zone seems incredibly small as of right now and easily countered by simply slugging for a minute.
Horvath: Timer can be subject to change, it will be 40/50/60 seconds on the PTB though for you guys to try it out and offer your feedback
"Question: What led to the decision to put the timer on Decisive Strike?
Horvath: We decided to put a timer on Decisive Strike as one of the solutions to Decisive Strike being used too often, we tried 2 minutes internally and found that players were able to use DS a long time after being unhooked, where it no longer serves the purpose to protect you from being tunneled/ farmed"
Bolded the relevant part for emphasis.
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@nononono said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861844#Comment_861844
They just simply can not/should not punish or care about this. The only reason they are punishing for DC is because killer mains can’t stop crying. I really hope it’s at least 3 or 4 times before you can’t play for like 30 minutes
Leaving the game early affects both Killers and fellow Survivors negatively. Obviously, you shouldn't punish someone for leaving the game once because there are very valid reasons to leave the game suddenly. Someone who does it with a level of consistency, however, is ruining the game for the other players and should be reprimanded.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863206#Comment_863206
Then you get into the murky waters of proving that is what they are doing. How do you prove it's intentional and not they are just really bad in chases? Like I said there will always be a way around these things. No matter what is tried.
Patterns. If it happens once in a while, that doesn't mean much. If someone is just consistently dying first hook or consistently idling (or running into a wall, as you point out) or constantly running right to the Killer to die, one can make a pretty safe judgement call.
If someone is actively just trying to pretend to look bad to avoid getting busted, at that point, they're kinda just playing the game anyways, so...mission accomplished?
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@xChaosXAnge1x said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863206#Comment_863206
If someone is purposely losing then report them and if they continue then the Devs will decide to punish or not the whole idea of changing the game tho to stop this is stupid imo as it's a mechanic the killer still gets the kill and points
...I don't know if I'm misinterpreting things, but you are pretty much just agreeing with me at this point. If someone is purposefully losing the game, report them, and if they continue, the devs will make the decision of whether or not to punish. That is what I am saying.
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@xChaosXAnge1x said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863147#Comment_863147
I think the fact your comparing 2 mechanics one that punishes people for greifing the other for people wanting to leave by a legit way is silly players have the right to leave if they want to it's a game there's no way stating THEY HAVE TO stay as long as they can let's say they just don't like the killer or map then ok they run to killer die and surrender so what dcing however gives 0 points to killer 1 u get pints maybe not as much but points the other u get 0 and if it screws over team who cares they shouldn't have to sit there hanging if they just wanna die
Both would be instances of punishing people for repeatedly screwing over their teammates. It's not about "Oh, I have to do something outside of the game, so I'm going to die once." You don't get in trouble for that. It's "I'm going to frequently/repeatedly leave the game early at the expense of my teammates."
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863155#Comment_863155
I'm saying if it was tracked by you taking an action like moving it would be easily avoidable. Hell all crows would require is you periodically move to another spot and go back to what you were doing. Even if those two things failed they'd just run at the killer and get hooked. Then run at them again if they got unhooked. There will always be a way around this.
As I said before, one of the things listed as a reportable offense under "Unsportsmanlike Conduct" is "Purposefully losing the game". It's not the sort of thing where you get in trouble for doing it once or twice (same with stuff like DCing or hook suicide), but if you make a habit out of it at the expense of your fellow teammates, they can certainly take notice.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863054#Comment_863054
The goal was to avoid getting dinged for not moving. If they tracked it by if you had crows that would take more thought to avoid. I'm not sure if you'd gather crows while running into something. I never tested it because why would I.
The goal is to avoid getting dinged for being "away from keyboard". Just getting stillness crows isn't going to mean anything by itself, but if they notice you getting crows repeatedly, it would at least warrant them looking into your circumstances, seeing that you are just constantly moving in one direction and not actually playing the game, and making a judgement call from there.
From my understanding, stillness crows happen when you stay in the same area for too long without doing something like working on gens or something.
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@xChaosXAnge1x said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/863137#Comment_863137
The true is tho there is no punishment for suicidieing on hooks as they are using a mechanic in the game that's been there since release and they could be doing it for multiple reasons and we don't know all the reasons either with dcing the killer loses the points for killing them and anything building up at least with suicide on hook they get something I honestly dealt they will change it at all
I have to refer back to an earlier response I made where I argued that it is possible to punish someone who repeatedly griefs their own teammates by intentionally wasting pallets left and right, which is using an in-game mechanic. So this argument that excessive hook suicides can't be punished because it is technically using in-game mechanics doesn't add up to me.
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@xChaosXAnge1x said:
@TAG you gotta think about the fact it's there choice to make like if they wanna struggle they have that right 2 if they don't wanna spam they have that right to now let's say there's 2 survivers left one on hook one at hatch so it's ok for the person on hook to rush for them ? But any other time it's not allowed and should be punished ? Like @Outland said they should try to solve the reasons y they rush hook instead of punishing them as it is a thing u can do in the game so it's allowed and yes if they use offers or items that they spent points on and time to get it is ######### if they lose them but at the end of the day it's a game with pros and cons and I doubt there force people to sit through that
It's not "do it any other time and get punished." It's "leave the game early excessively and get punished." Whether it be DCing or hook suicide.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/862463#Comment_862463
I assume they'd track afk people by them not moving. Position the left stick forward. Or for PC have w held down.
Once you start running into a wall, stillness crows can still get you for staying in the same area, so just finding a way to have your character automatically move in one direction wouldn't work.
@BagelLord said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/862463#Comment_862463
I feel like you're really just grasping for straws here. At the end of the day, survivors have invested time and money into this game, so you're just going to have to suck it up if one guy feels the need to die early. And the whole "oh it's unfair for killers" thing doesn't work, because you know exactly what you're getting yourself into when you choose to play. If it's truly such a horrible thing, then switch to survivor.
I don't feel like I am. That person's argument was that Survivors would always find a way to get around whatever punishment measures devs could put into place to avoid having to play a game. But I am thoroughly unconvinced. There's only so much a Survivor can do before their only options are "eat the punishment," "stop excessively leaving the game," or "stop playing altogether."
Also, I would argue that this is more unfair for Survivors than Killers, as it makes a Killer's game easier (though the higher rank you are, the more you are penalized in the emblem score) but a Survivor's game more difficult.
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@thrawn3054 said:
Jesus. This again. If they first hook suicide it sucks. Get over it. There is nothing to be done about this. If you managed to get first hook suicides banned they'd just go afk. If going afk became banned they'd find a way around that. There is nothing you can do to stop people from getting out of a match they don't want to play.
You didn't actually specify how they'd get around punishing AFK. :P
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@joker7997 said:
What is the rover experiment? Someone was going on about no rewards for the experiment. I had no clue what they meant
There was a social experiment on DBD that people were selected to participate in. There was a reward in the form of blood points and iridescent shards after the experiment was over. They recently put out an email saying that the rewards have been sent out to the participants (who followed the directives), but it seems multiple people are reporting not having received the reward even though they allegedly followed directions.
(I was one of the participants, and I'm pretty sure I have not received my reward despite receiving the email.)
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/862187#Comment_862187
Talk about your impossible to punish rules. Everyone at some point in this game has broken that rule. A killer that gives a survivor the hatch or walks them to the edge of the exit. Anyone who hasn't struggled on the hook to give another survivor a chance at the hatch. People who are just plain tired of trying to finish one gen of a three gen situation.
People WILL NOT play a round where they are not having any fun. They will always bow out via the hook.
Would you face it, BHVR IS NOT GOING TO PUNISH hook suicide. No matter how much you feel its warranted.
Very easy to punish, actually. You just punish the ones who do it excessively. Same as with DCing.
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/862069#Comment_862069
That's not what I said. Who knows what BHVR will ultimately find punishable. But right now there exists a mechanic where if I no longer wish to play the trial. I can without breaking any game mechanics choose to leave early without wasting any more time in a match I deem unfun.
CURRENTLY there is no punishment for using that route out. If they change that then yeah it can be punished.
My point is that BHVR in my opinion will never chase that kind of behaviour. The are punishing Dc's and I do not see it going any further.
You obviously feel that another human should be forced to continue to play to make YOU happy.
And they better play hard too, no just going with the flow.
I've played where people die quickly and I agree , the game gets harder and most of the time unless the Killer goes easy, it ends in my death. So I know what you are saying.
My point is that those people whether they suicided or just failed to struggle accidentally, played the game the way they like, and I don't feel they should be punished for making my game a bit harder.
Just checked the report section. "Purposefully losing the game" is a reportable offense under "Unsportsmanlike conduct."
SO...........
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/862055#Comment_862055
They CAN but WONT.
"Can" in this case means "is a punishable offense."
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861998#Comment_861998
And I agreed that using up pallets can be bad. That's why I made the same argument about getting found using lockers, that don't use up a resource.
Some people can't take "you're right" for an answer.
It's not just about using up pallets being bad. It's about being punished for technically using a legitimate game mechanic. The way I see it, if that can apply to repeated trolling/griefing through wasting pallets, it can also apply to excessive hook suicides.
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@[Deleted User] said:
Geez.
I get why DCing needs penalties, but if I decide on my first hook I don’t want to play anymore and let myself die, I shouldn’t be penalised for that other than a likely depip.
People seem to forget that this is just a game and not a term of employment. Oh and this is NOT definitively a team game. Some teamwork helps, some teamwork does NOT help. Survivors are ALWAYS meant to be wary and ready to rely only on themselves at a moments notice.
If someone else dies on the hook early in a match, you shouldn’t throw your hands in the air exclaiming “now how am I going to win and escape?!”
Let me ask you this then: When the devs incorporate the husk system, what reason would there be to punish Survivors who DC?
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861954#Comment_861954
OK I'll give you that pallet misuse can be trolly. But there is always just jumping in and out of a locker to get noticed. And there is always just running around and looking for the Killer.
Gets the job done without using up resources.
I'm not talking about ways to get the Killer's attention without using up pallets. I'm talking about people who knowingly and deliberately screw their team over by using up pallets.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861923#Comment_861923
Never said I didn't have skeletons in the closet. If it helps that was literal years ago. Now I don't even bother trying to kobe. Rarely have ever just suicided because of what was happening in game. I remember doing it a couple of times because I was on a team where someone was following me around throwing down palettes and pulling on lockers I was hiding in or purposely blowing up a gen repeatedly as long as I was touching it. You know, typical antisocial meathead antics that I just refused to put up with.
I mean, it's hindsight and in the past, so c'est la vie, but I'd say that you were actively creating a negative experience for your teammates.
@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861930#Comment_861930
You've strayed from my original point, and have moved on to my supporting points.
So I'll just take that as you seeing my point.
I highly doubt there will be any PUNISHMENTS given out once, people move from DCing to hook suicide.
I maintain that people will always take the "L" when they believe that the trial is going to be an unfun crap show.
The devs need to look more into why people Dc/Hook Suicide, and fix it at that level, not just punishing this and that game behaviour because some people see it as unfair that their trial just got harder.
Time will tell, but I'm pretty confident I'm right.
No I haven't? Your point is that you can't punish people for hook suiciding because they are using legitimate game mechanics to do so, but you can punish someone who is legitimately dropping pallets left and right just to be a troll to their teammates, which is using legitimate methods. So that argument doesn't really work for me.
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861903#Comment_861903
I never implied any such thing.
I only said people leaving by legit game mechanincs, has NO ROOM for punishment.
You mistook pallet dropping for griefing, its not, its a way for the Survivor to alert the Killer so they can be rehooked and killed if they are forced to continue playing.
Drop a pallet and jump over it until desired effect happens.
So hook suicides are legit game play, what are you not getting here?
"The Killer dcing caused loss of offerings, things people spend points to aquire, and survivors dcing, robs the Killer of earning points. Both of these had bad impact on actual player economy.
A survivor dying on the hook early, at least awards the Killer the points they earned."
You most certainly did.
Also, I am talking about punishing actual griefers who just run around dropping pallets for the lulz.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861903#Comment_861903
I did. It was the fastest way to get into another game to try and kobe again. At the time I thought I would just plow through the achievements. I'm not gonna say it was the greatest thing to do, but I also didn't have a particularly strong attachment to the game at the either.
That in my eyes is not a good look, then.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861871#Comment_861871
I used to try and kobe with running any of the kobe perks all the time. No one is really going to monitor such a mundane occurrence with punishment in mind. If they did that they could just disable the attempt prompt unless you had the proper perks.
Were you repeatedly dying on the same hook after attempting to kobe?
@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861871#Comment_861871
Never said it didn't impact the game.
I only said that as long as people use the mechanincs of the game to leave a match (ie, via self dehooking, and struggle) then there is nothing to punish. They played by the rules and got out. Sure it leaves an easier Killer game and a much harder Survivor game but that's how it is sometimes.
You cannot force someone to continue playing a round to the best of their ability, if they just want to get out. Everyones ability differs and its very tough to compare playing styles. You are asking BHVR to basically have a human double check all the data points and decide if someone was throwing the game or not. That is a tall order. And then there is always the false positives and the appeal process, again a nightmare.
All you can hope is that BHVR then looks at the under lying causes of people self removing. Whether it be unfun Killers/Maps/Tactics/Perks, and attempt to fix it on that level.
You certainly implied the impact was minimal.
If you can punish someone who repeatedly wastes pallets to grief teammates, you can punish someone who excessively hook suicides.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861866#Comment_861866
You should try to maybe approach things in a less arrogant view.
4 gens in 2 mins means that gens were being repaired at a faster rate than normal. You can easily lose two minutes between finding and chasing the first survivor you encounter unless the survivor is a potato. A game being able to be ended in a sub 6min time is fundamentally flawed imo. 2 mins isn't enough time for any killer to succeed nor should it ever be that way. I don't understand why people think it is ok for survivors to be able to muscle down their win condition so quickly. At that speed neither said is really playing the game much at all.
I'd keep an eye on post history before responding.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861756#Comment_861756
You would assume incorrectly. You are given the option to try and unhook yourself or let someone else do it. What if you're just a person who wants to try and kobe? What if your grinding for the achievement for hopping of the hook on your own? You're gonna go through a lot of games until you get the right roll of the dice.
Honestly, I think it is much better for someone to suicide on hook than just dc. At the very least they hopefully have done something before going down or ran the killer long enough for us to at least get gens going a decent bit. As to killers having to suffer through games? You don't. Just go afk or dc. They can't get anything out of you if you just don't play into their garbage.
Life is too short to waste any energy on garbage survivors or garbage killers in a trial. If devs wanted to they could solve a lot of these problems, but they aren't priority unless the game starts to suffer on a large scale. If enough start dcing or afking in the basement then eventually something will happen.
I imagine people trying to do such things would use builds dedicated to such, which can easily be noticed and dismissed as such. So unless you're going to start running Slippery Meat and Luck offerings repeatedly to mask Hook Suicides, that isn't something I'd worry about.
@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861844#Comment_861844
The Killer dcing caused loss of offerings, things people spend points to aquire, and survivors dcing, robs the Killer of earning points. Both of these had bad impact on actual player economy.
A survivor dying on the hook early, at least awards the Killer the points they earned.
Trust me friend , punishing Dc's is the end of it, they will not chase that any further.
How do you qualify how serious a player is taking the game? What if the player only wants to stealth around the map and not contribute to the game at all? Are they still playing? And so what if they are, isn't that kind of play legit? Some people like to play stealth challenges where they don't see the killer at all and escape through the hatch, are those kind of games going to now be FORBIDDEN?
And what if the player is just plain bad at the game it it appears they are throwing, when in fact they just suck?
A Survivor deliberately dying early denies Killer points and emblem progress, and it actively lowers the Survivors' chances of winning by a lot. It is not without consequences. Not by a long shot.
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861813#Comment_861813
They can monitor who tries to dehook themselves for sure, and yeah someone who doesn't even try on struggle is easy to track as well.
My point is why would they care? The player used in game tactics to leave a match, they didn't do anything sketching or forbidden. Then just didn't want to play that trial anymore and they got out as soon as possible.
I'm sorry you think that player owes you a good time, perhaps you'd prefer someone who doesn't give a crap about the game running around, throwing pallets to gather attention from the Killer trying to get hooked a second time? Or make just gathering up all the items from chests and dropping them in the basement? Maybe slamming lockers it get found and hooked?
If you TRY AND FORCE people to keep playing a round they want out of, they will lash out.
So yeah you are right BHVR can tell who is doing it, but they would be silly to do it.
They care because they are trying to disincentivize leaving a match early. Otherwise, what is the point in punishing DCing?
If they lash out by griefing, there is a simple solution.
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@Jejune said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861813#Comment_861813
They can do it when killers get punished for tunneling and camping.
Thanks for listening to my TED talk.
Camping and tunneling isn't a means to get around something punishable. Hook suicide is.
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@Outland said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861756#Comment_861756
So now BHVR is going to monitor who is playing half arsed, nah man, a DC will be punished, dieing early is just something you are going to have to live with.
You cannot force people to play in a round they don't want to. As long as they are using the game mechanics to leave fairly, then that's it.
Trying to Kobi is a legit game play mechaninc, and struggling is a second chance for a survivors to make up some BPs before being out of the game. If a player doesn't want those points then they have the right to die and leave.
Trying to force someone to continue to give a crap about a trial when they hate Tactic/map/killer is an impossible task and thinking they can punish people in to playing like they care is ridiculous.
I don't believe that it would be difficult to monitor who is dying suspiciously frequently on first hook.
Also, considering that they are punishing DCing, this idea of "you can't force people to not leave" does not hold much water.
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I imagine devs have the means to tell who is just intentionally suiciding on first-hook and who is not, so with them taking a seemingly tougher stance on DCing, they should look into this as well IMO.
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@oxygen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861606#Comment_861606
I'd like a clarification what exactly counts as an "extended period of time" but other than that it basically answers what I was unsure about myself 😄
I think this is the sort of thing where you use your best judgement. Did the game grind to a screeching halt with no progress made on either side despite you (as the Killer) clearly still trying to find the Survivors? That would almost definitely be hostage holding.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/171/W47N2RF1AZ9Y.png
I basically had the same thing happen to me, but much worse.
Anyway, if they basically admit to doing it which I see that they did, you can use that as proof of intent as well, which would help your report. I don't know if 9 minutes would be enough, but I would do it anyways. If they do it multiple times and multiple people report about it, then I would assume they would eventually be punished; especially when they basically boast about doing it.
This basically answers the question pretty cleanly.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861318#Comment_861318
Im not disagreeing with you. From an individual perspective though, you still get the feeling of "I died because of THAT guy" no matter if Myers uses Tuft of hair or just 99% off a teammate. Against a Ghostface, you rely on your individual skill in a chase while against a Myers, your teammate being a potato can directly affect YOU. Not saying anything about balance, just that you can feel cheated out of half of your chase time because the last guy Myers chased fed too much.
This is just me, but unless I could clearly see that the fault lies with someone else being a potato, I'm not going to assume that my death was because of someone else.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861309#Comment_861309
Yes, your teammates can straight up sandbag you with ANY killer, lol. Assuming thats not the case though, Myers is one of the only killers that can make use of one chase to bolster the next chase against a completely different survivor. You could make a similar argument about Plague and Oni atm. Im not saying thats OP or anything, just that its annoying to know your chase was cut short because of the stalk they gained from the guy before you.
The thing is that when a Survivor is potato enough to feed Fragrant Tuft Myers enough to screw over your team, that is far more an issue of "potato screwed over their team" than "the add-on unfairly punishes people for mistakes someone else made".
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861301#Comment_861301
Me nailing hatchet throws against your teammate isnt likely to have an effect on YOU when its time I chase YOU for example. Me getting stalk off your teammate however is likely to result in a MUCH shorter chase when I pop that 99% stalk off on you afterward. This is a rare instance where your teammates chase affects YOUR chase outside of just things like wasting pallets.
That isn't really what I'm referring to, though. I'm talking more, like, Survivor going to unhook someone without BT with Leatherface still within spitting distance.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861197#Comment_861197
I think @thesuicidefox 's issue is that its on a team lvl instead of an individual one. Against other killers, you as an individual can counter their powers. Against Myers, If one of your teammates doesnt counter it, you could be the one paying for it.
How is that different from one Survivor potatoing it up and making the team suffer overall in general?
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@thesuicidefox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861162#Comment_861162
Exactly. It is POSSIBLE for it to be difficult, but that requires all 4 survivors to play smart. More often that will be far from the case. It's way more likely that you will get it earlier because SOMEONE fed you. And that is beyond the control of other survivors. If some random feeds you EW I get punished for it. How is that fair?
17 seconds of stalk is not at all that much if you focus on it. I really can't believe how people can say it takes so long. It really doesn't.
If someone just carelessly feeds you with Fragrant Tuft, that's on them for doing so, not on the add-on for being an issue.
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@Peanits said:
How do you suggest we detect who's in voice chat and who's not? Scanning through someone's PC to see what programs they're using or monitoring their microphone is usually frowned upon, and it wouldn't stop you from whipping out your phone to voice chat or sitting in the same room as someone.
"For the next Dead By Daylight Chapter, we are requiring that all Survivors play with a web cam so we can see what they are doing while playing and catch them maybe using voice comms. Rule breakers will have the Entity brick your system."
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@thesuicidefox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/861041#Comment_861041
Again it's not about counter play. You can counter play Prayer Beads by playing smart. Does that make it any less stupid? Does that mean it should be in the game? No and no.
Infinite one shots, no matter how effective, is stupid. PERIOD.
And every time I see "Scream for Myers" it's most likely a infinite EW3 build too. So yea, that's even more stupid because then he just goes around and slugs everyone.
Gotta love how people can defend one stupid thing in the game and denounce another.
Maybe it's because one of those things is not actually that stupid. :P
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@VincentRedfield said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/856901#Comment_856901
Just like survivors have every right to bring 4 green toolboxes and 4 DS and teabag at the exit gates.
Good. Glad we agree.
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I wanna say Doctor.
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/857062#Comment_857062
Probably DS? It depends on what strategy they were planning on abusing, but essentially whatever perk is the weakest in the group can be replaced with the pebble.
I'm not saying it's going to be gamebreaking overpowered levels, but do survivors really need more ways to bully and annoying killers? I can get
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/857113#Comment_857113
I can agree it could be bumped up a little, but if they do a "slight change" to it, it might end up like the old DS and be seen almost every game.
DS? As in Decisive Strike? You believe would be replaced by this theoretical pebble?
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/857046#Comment_857046
Right now, sure.
I actually like using the pebble when I play survivor, and I've had matches against killers where I was able to save multiple teammates with the rock. You can argue these weren't good killers or it was a rare case, but the fact is you can already use it in game multiple times to not only distract but save someone.
Now imagine it is way more consistent and available most of the game. Are you gonna use 1 off perks that have more impact but limited use, or something that is infinite and is less powerful but still capable?
What sort of one-off perks are you suggesting a death squad would replace with this theoretical better pebble?
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/857034#Comment_857034
And I think you greatly underestimate how strong anything can be with a deathsquad x4 group.
A death squad would laugh at the idea of using pebble. There are substantially better ways to extend a chase than a perk that kinda maybe sorta will distract a Killer a little bit.
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/857004#Comment_857004
Against a killer like Nurse you might never even get a hook if they break LOS and throw a pebble on demand.
Or against other killers window vaulting and breaking LOS can lead to a great opportunity to use pebble and get away. But this should be EARNED, not given to you because you wait X amount of time. Having it on a cooldown isn't a risk:reward kind of mechanic, and it would be simply too strong if it can be used willy nilly by all 4 survivors.
I think you strongly overestimate how useful the pebble is against a competent Killer, especially once the Killer catches on to the fact that someone may have pebble.
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/856966#Comment_856966
But they would be interested in looping the killer for as long as possible, getting hit and extending the chase off of that, and right before they go down have someone come over and use a rock to distract/hide where they went.
And you're right; it is the purpose of the perk. But it also wasn't intended to be used often. That's the reason it is hard to charge up.
If someone throws a pebble right when a teammate is about to go down, in what way is the Killer going to fall for it? Are they going to suddenly miss the hit or something? What you're describing does not seem like anything more than a meme tactic.
It wasn't intended to be used that often, but that does not mean it would be problematic if it was.
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/856920#Comment_856920
Because it can completely throw off the killer. If everyone played with a ninja build you could chuck a rock and save your friend a good portion of the time.
I know it doesn't seem strong in a solo situation, or even maybe a casual group one. But in death squads they would be able to loop and then ditch the killer far more often and for way less risk than they do now.
That is literally the purpose of the perk.
A death squad is not interested in throwing rocks at the Killer.