Seraphor
Seraphor
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@[Deleted User] said:
They said they are going to change memento mori offerings, not remove them.
They said they're going to make mori's a basekit feature. Most likely last survivor if they're on death hook.
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I wouldn't say he has a strong anti-loop, not if survivors know even slightly how it works.
It's kinda like a heavily watered down version of Spirit's anti-loop, in a similar way that Freddie's is a weak AF version of Clown's anti-loop.
But if you know how to play around with locker teleports, using them frequently (faster nightfall) for both info and map traversal, then you can apply a lot of pressure with him.
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"Such as response curve and deadzone settings for controller?"
Request no. 68,879 noted and discarded.
But seriously, response and deadzone settings, or at least more fine tuned basic values, is an essential quality of life and accessibility option that is LONG overdue.
As it stands, console players have to make a choice between speed, and control, meanwhile PC players get both as needed through virtue of having a wrist.
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On paper, sure. But in practice, I think this would just lead to more survivors running boons, because there would be no drawback to stacking them up anymore.
Boons would be better if Shattered Hope was a basekit feature.
CoH for example is already multitudes more effective than Inner healing, and it would still be better than Inner Healing even if it was only one use per totem.
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BBQ has a 42% use rate
WGLF has a 11% use rate
Using either of them doesnt guarantee you get a full 4 stacks, in my experience, I'd say that happens about 75% of the time for BBQ and less for WGLF.
So globally, that means BBQ is only providing an avg. of about +30%, and WGLF only about +5%, bonus BP.
The new role incentive bonus will provide a minimum of +25% for one role or the other, and rise to +100% as the queue discrepancy rises. Particularly during peak hours as most will be playing survivor due to SWF availability, essentially giving killers a basekit +100% BP bonus during peak times.
This won't simply "balance out" queues until there's no bonus, because most players will still play their preferred role, not the role with the biggest bonus. Otherwise, if players were so concerned with their bonus BP, WGLF would have more than an 11% use rate.
So you'll probably find that these role bonuses will be more or less comparable to the BBQ/WGLF bonuses. They'll disproportionately favour killers, frequently give +100%, and to top it off, they won't be wasting a perk slot.
Sure it's a drawback if you don't actually play both sides and won't take advantage of the difference in incentive bonus. But I'd much rather play the role in need without wasting a perk slot on a BP bonus.
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Because it's not meant to be a reward, there's not meant to be any incentive for P3ing before the update, because it's fundamentally worse to lose all of your items and add-ons.
It's not a prize, it's a consolation. "I'm sorry you had something inferior before we improved things, take this token as our apology."
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The event community challenge? You needed to click on the next node that actually had the pants in order to unlock it.
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For a new player, getting started and set up isn't going to be any easier at all.
But in the long run, if you're aiming for many perks on many characters, then you'll feel the benefit. Each successive P3 you unlock will reduce the grind for the next character, and the next, and so on. Instead of it taking 1,000 hours, it might take you 800 hours instead. And this is generally how it works for killers, you want all killers to have a decent perk library, particularly the perks that work well with their powers.
It also eliminates bloodweb RNG. Instead of grinding through 200 bloodwebs to get the perk you want on the character you want it on, you just P1 the character who's teachable it is. You have more control, and more control leads to greater efficiency in setting up your desired builds.
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Getting salty when you win is a pretty ugly look, and sure the term 'camping' when applied to survivors is surely a bit of a nonsequitur.
However, there are situations similar.
For example, locker-flashlight saves: If a survivor you're chasing jumps into a locker, and you grab them out of it, if another survivor is hiding nearby ready with a flashlight, they can guarantee a flashlight save and there's nothing you can do about it because you're locked in the animation of pulling the survivor out of the locker.
Not saying that's what you did, but that could feasibly be called 'camping' in a sense.
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@Sheridan_LT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3043066#Comment_3043066
It's just not fun when people play to make a joke out of you instead of for fun. I like decently long games where a lot of chases and a lot of hooks happen, I don't like waiting out a guy's hook from first stage to death hook. A really good, fun game is if Survivors get over 3 generators and I get 12 hooks and that lasts 20 minutes. Everyone wins, everyone doublepips, everyone gets max bloodpoints, no one loses.
Providing there's enough interaction between both sides, not even that is required.
Most of my best games are 8 or 9 hooks, 0-1 kills, and the rest escape, usually on purpose. But in securing those 2 hooks on each survivor, everyone gets chase points, everyone gets unhook points, and with all gens getting done, everyone gets objectives too. Top scores all round, at least 28k each, and it's possible to max out the killers score with 9-hooks:1-kill.
And thanks @Laluzi but I didn't feel the need to dignify their hypocritical rant with a serious response.
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@lauraa said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3043169#Comment_3043169
it's because of the undetectable, right? that's how he gets infinitely looped
If you're looping at all then you're playing Mirror Myers all wrong. Just leave and find the next oblivious survivor.
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@Ethromel said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3039557#Comment_3039557
I escape most of my matches, but my OP still stands true. The algorithm matches players to the countermeasure of whatever perk they are using. If there is no killer with a counter to whatever perk you are using, it takes a long time to find a match.
Ooh I wondered where the tinfoil would show itself.
Overall, your entire issue is an overreaction. Yes there are some imbalances in the game, certain strong killers benefit more from certain effects that others. But Killer is the power role. You would not be saying Killers having the ability to: "see through walls, control and see in the darkness, move super fast, have super strength, become invisible, float, lunge very far, be an expert marksman with weapons, become undetectable, projectile vomit that can contaminate ANYTHING (including machines), and did I mention it's contagious plus you have the ability to spread a terrifying aura over a large expanse that can debilitate you, accelerate the usefulness of your property, and telekinetically explode aforementioned machinery just by touching you, on top of being impervious, and cast curses on you." was overpowered in the slightest, if you had sufficient experience with those killers.
"I need a break from this game, it's just not fun. And the devs have said it themselves, "There aren't enough survivors dying." So they want this lop-sided gameplay."
You're complaining that killers are too strong, when you "escape most of your matches" and even the devs are admitting that survivors are escaping far too often. I'm sorry winning all the time is so 'not fun' for you. It kinda sounds like what you want is to play as Killer for once.
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Wait til reset on the 13th.
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@Icaurs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3041401#Comment_3041401
Absolutely beautiful, fantastic example of what I am talking about.
You are right, I did mispresent you, I apologise. For some reason I had this insane idea that killers are not inherently entitled and gave you the benefit of the doubt and didn't accuse you of saying ridiculous like anything a survivor does is unfair but killers can do no wrong and everything if fair because the devs said so. My own fault for treating you like a person and not generalising you into a stereotype, that was my fault and you have greatly embarrassed me.
But seriously your entitlement is astounding. Its amazing how people on the forum will rush to the defence of camping/ tunnelling, slugging. There is always an excuse.
I'm not camping I'm patrolling
I'm not tunnelling, their team didn't body block
slugging is fine because I'm just applying pressure cause the gens are going to fast
Its end game
Then you just get the more toxic excuses
Camping at 5 gens is a legitimate strategy cause the devs said it is
There is nothing wrong with infectious fright slugging nurse
Killer is hard which is why I focus one survivor out of the game then I play properly
Its not my job to ensure everybody is having fun
All of it is the same. you're just coming up with excuses to justify your toxic behaviour. I mean look at what you are saying???
"tunnelling is highly subjective. " It really isn't. Some matches people have bad luck and it happens. But we're talking about hard focusing survivors out of the match. Would it have really been to hard to make basekit BT at least 15 seconds? "Oh well survivors will use it to body block." Well I'm going apply the killer logic, used to justify the buffs with new update. "Now that killer is stronger and matches take longer, killers won't abuse this because it just made camping even more viable then it was, because killers have integrity." Well that's my justification for buffing survivors.
Then you defend slugging? Slugging is a legitimate strategy. Dragging a match out, slowing it down to a crawl or not even engaging in the actual objective of killer "getting hooks." but survivors coordinating to save a teammate isn't? What you pick and choose is astonishing. You are just as much a part of the poor sportsmanship you refer to. you are just not as bad as the worse. Its the equivalent of tripping somebody in soccer and then saying "It's fine cause it only kind of bad, I don't elbow people in the face." No, you are a toxic person, where you sit on the toxic, entitled player ladder irrelevant.
But I could forgive all of this, if you didn't say this. " Facecamping at 5 gens is most certainly an extreme example and definitely bad sportsmanship, but you can't penalise it without also penalising the legit strategies above." You can't even call out the worst aspect of the entire game, and say "OK, yes this awful, and massive game changes need to be fix it." Your first response to defend it? The first thing you think when somebody stands in front a hook for 5 minutes is, "This needs to exits, because proxy camping needs to exist." The worst aspect of DBD needs to exist, because otherwise the second worst aspect of DBD would be weaker, amazing logic.
The more I read the more broken you logic is.
"All of these things are legit strategies, except when they're used by a killer in an already dominant position, to bully survivors who are clearly already being outplayed."
Who the F... gets to determine that? I feel like I'm no I'm no longer in the dominant position so I get to use these cheap miserable strategies. Even more astonishing in this post you call tunnelling "Subjective." But now you have ability to determine a match outcome with complete accuracy to justify how toxic you get to be this match. Oh I'm sure you would never abuse that.
Here is the issue, with you and every entitled killer in DBD. This is modern killer logic.
"Killer's want survivors to play in extremely strict ways, and never deviate from this, so they can predict and apply counters. But they don't want it to be effective because otherwise the killer feels bullied."
I hate to be blunt, but I could not care less about somebody "feeling bullied." Its extremally easy and unproductive to "feel bullied." Body blocking is not bullying, doing your objective is not "bullying." Camping isn't even bullying. DBD is has 18+ ratting. You need to be 18 years or older to play this game. If you are younger then 18 and you feel "bullied." Maybe that has do with the fact you are a kid, who should not even be playing this game. You clearly do not have the emotional maturity to engage in this game and its best for you mental development to put DBD on hold until you mature a little. If you are over 18 and you are being "bullied," in an online game cause they did gens really fast or because they blocked the hook. Or even if they camped. "I have never felt bullied because a killer camped me." Its frustrating, boring, but not bullying. But if you seriously feel this way, you have much bigger issues then the balance of DBD.
Holy #########, you really doubled down on twisting and misrepresenting huh?
Everything I just just was entirely balanced and reasonable. I play both sides, I know how both sides feel.
But you're so far gone to "killer bad, survivor good" that you can't even perceive your own hypocrisy.
This is unhinged...
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@Laluzi said:
The impression I'm getting from the choices they've made in this prestige overhaul, and their reluctance to address any of other the concerns being brought up (chiefly 'why is there a forced prestige tax', 'this makes good items harder to access', 'why is there still a 1m bloodpoint cap', and 'this is still really bad for brand new players'), is that they're still stuck on this idea of a bloodpoint economy and think bad things would happen if people were allowed to accumulate comfortable amounts of bloodpoints.
There's a few reasons why they could want this - they don't want people to be able to play good addons very often, or they think the grind helps with the longevity of the game - but it doesn't change the apparent fact that they're not that interested in reducing the grind.
There is something to be said for making add-ons more costly, while simultaneously reducing the perk grind, which is what they've done.
I'm not personally happy with it because I struggle to find the add-ons I want as it is (I pretty much only play Doctor with Calm add-ons for example, and I love me my Scratched Mirror Myers games)
However, it seems to be that many long time players simply do not care about BP anymore. They've unlocked all perks on all characters, P3's everyone, and can catch up each new patch because they bank their challenge prizes for a neat 1.2m-ish BP on patch day. This results in them having stacks upon stacks of every add-on, and therefore their end-game score means nothing to them. Instead of worrying about their score, or emblems, or anything tangible, all they're concerned about is their nebulous MMR.
Caring about BP leads to healthy playstyles in my opinion. You want to spread out your different actions, do a bit of everything, and your priority is maxing out your score, not necessarily getting a 4K.
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The way cap-breaking BP dumps work is honestly quite confusing.
It could be that something funky has happened after you got one BP dump (like a daily bonus or a reset bonus or something) and you didn't spend all of that bonus. So say you got 200k from a code, then you spent 198,896 BP, then you waited a week and played a few games and broke the cap again.
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You'll have their perks at tier 1 automatically on all characters. Unless you already have them at higher tiers on certain characters, which will stay the same.
As for characters you've leveled further but have not prestiged. If you have 4 pages of purple perks on a character, they'll be P3 automatically, and therefore provide their perks to all other characters at tier 3 automatically.
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Gift of Pain? On Plague?
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@Ronaldo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3041096#Comment_3041096
What is gen rushing?
Survivors completing their main objective as quickly as possible.
Very similar to tunneling; killers completing their main objective as quickly as possible.
If you still haven't understood the contextual difference between good and bad sportsmanship and how these can be performed to vastly different effects to the opposing side, you should re-read my post.
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@Icaurs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3041096#Comment_3041096
Right... the difference is when survivors say "Slugging, tunelling, camping are ruining the game and there needs to be massive changes to fix it." The response generally goes "Slugging, tunelling, camping are legit strategies and perfectly fine. cause the devs said so"
While at the same time saying focusing entirely on generators is unfun for killers and the devs need to fix this. I'm not saying you specifically have said this, but lets be honest that's the usual response.
Also body blocking is hard, and requires teamwork. Shouldn't something that requires coordination form all players be extremely rewarding? You would think in a game, things that are harder would yield greater results. Also let's say they "fixed body blocking." So now survivors have even less strategies to attempt. Its this mindset that has resulted in gen speeds becoming so fast. Nothing is really worth bothering with, and the few things that are, not only are hard, but killers take issue with.
Complete misrepresentation of the arguments here. Camping and tunnelling can be legit strategies. On their own, they're are very broad concepts that cover a range of circumstances.
During the EGC anything goes, because the killer has no other objectives to defend besides the hooked survivor, or the survivor could be hooked right next to a near completed gen, and can see another survivor approaching, so the killer has no incentive to leave the area. Facecamping at 5 gens is most certainly an extreme example and definitely bad sportsmanship, but you can't penalise it without also penalising the legit strategies above.
Meanwhile tunnelling is highly subjective. Maybe the killer is intentionally singling you out to eliminate you as fast as possible, and ignoring all other survivors regardless of how much of a target they're making of themselves. Again, bad sportsmanship, unfun gameplay. But most of the time, a killer "tunnels" because the unhooked survivor misplays and makes themselves a target, while the other survivors are overcautious and keeping out of sight. So how do you 'protect' an 'innocent' survivor from aggressive, malicious targeting, while not also giving poor survivor plays an unwarranted free escape?
Slugging is 100% a legit strategy, survivors even have a whole host of perks to deal with it, and a core mechanic (the ability to recover yourself/others from the dying state) built around this specific circumstance. How are you supposed to get any use out of recovering in the dying state, picking up other survivors in the dying state, Unbreakable, Tenacity, Flip Flop, No Mither, Soul Guard, For the People, We're Gonna Live Forever, etc. if the killer couldn't slug? The times slugging is bad sportsmanship are usually the minority of cases, typically slugging for the 4K when the 4th survivor is nowhere near anyway, but the killer wants the 4K at any cost.
All of these things are legit strategies, except when they're used by a killer in an already dominant position, to bully survivors who are clearly already being outplayed, in a way that they can't do anything to retaliate against it. And exactly the same is true for genrushing, and bodyblocking.
When the killer has been chasing one survivor for 2 minutes but the other three have stacked rare toolboxes and repair perks and have finished 3 gens before the first chase is over. You know you're significantly outplaying that killer. Maybe there's not so much you can do about it at that point, but you know that's an incredibly unfun game for that killer, and you know that you're all going to walk away with terrible scores. So you shouldn't be surprised that the killer feels that was an unfair game.
Likewise, if you have two survivors body blocking the killer, crouching directly in front but out of sight, and combining that with flashlight saves, sabotage, or Boil Over, etc. to the point where you've denied 3-4 hooks in a row and wasted 5 minutes of chases with several downs but no hooks to show for it. At that point you know you're dominating, and despite only have one survivor on gens, you're giving that one survivor all the time they need to repair them all anyway, because the killer can't make any ground. So what is the killer supposed to feel? "fair game guys you win"?
Yet, just because genrushing and bodyblocking can result in incredibly unfair, unfun games for the killer, doesn't mean that there's inherently anything wrong with repairing gens or blocking a hook.
This topic isn't about fixing imbalances in the game, it's about "why are killers getting upset when I bully them?"
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@Mondhirsch said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3034124#Comment_3034124
Actually someone on this Screenshot HAS iron will. Maybe everyone escaped because she chased the one with Iron Will the whole match?
No she chased me a fair amount, and I duped her on several occasions, even when injured.
Like all killers, you still need to play the Spirit well, it's not as easy as just "wearing headphones = win".
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3041229#Comment_3041229
This is not abuse.
And personally, when the Boon is on the other side of the Map, I dont really have a problem with it as Killer. Because at least the Survivor has to spend a lot of time getting there. Would be different if it is in the middle of the Map on another Floor.
However, Perks or Perk Combinations are not abused. Like, nobody said that Ruin/Undying/Tinkerer is abusing something, despite this combo being quite oppressive.
Same if you look for Grab-Builds with old Prayer Beads (for Gens and Totems). Strong. But no abuse at all.
Can you give me an example of something that would be abuse?
Seems to me that a blanket statement of "nothing is ever abuse if it involves any perks whatsoever" is fairly disingenuous.
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@Gamall said:
Another lazy unskilled killer here, nothing new
Another lazy argument, writing off any counter opinion as "lul killer main" / "lul survivor main"
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@brokedownpalace said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3041229#Comment_3041229
"Is that 'abuse'?"
No.
What would you allow the definition of 'abuse' to apply to then?
What about the crawling to the corner to prevent any hook example I gave? Is that not "abusing Boil Over"?
I don't see that anything that is permissible by a game should necessarily be classed as 'not abuse', simply because it could be a deisgn oversight.
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@Mandy said:
Nobody running a perk (on either side) is abusing a perk. Lets stop that rhetoric right now - it doesn't help with discussion and is completely inaccurate.
Nobody is abusing a perk just by virtue of using it, no.
But that does not mean perks cannot be abused.
Sticking CoH at a distant safe loop, and then running to that safe space after every hit while another team mate takes aggro and repeats that process, puts the game in a stalemate that the killer cannot resolve. Only by committing to an unwinnable chase, in order to snuff out that totem, and thereby guarantee they lose the final gen. After which the illusive booner can just rebless and repeat.
With sufficiently coordinated survivors, this is as unplayable for the killer as a Boil Over in the corner with no hooks within 50m, and is tantamount to taking the game hostage.
Is that 'abuse'? I suppose it depends on the intentions of the survivors, which isn't possible to confirm, but fairly easy to infer.
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@Slowpeach said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3041157#Comment_3041157
I think that's probably because you are used to tier 3 where as tier 1 and 2 are very rarely used. You'll get used to the new tier 3 I'm pretty sure.
In any case yeah, the Otz vid for testing seems to be that Iron Will is still solid but if you really want Iron will back just use bite the bullet and a med kit and/or self care if you are paranoid of franklin's. That'll shut you up ;).
I do think though that crouching still should still be 100%/no sound as though focusing on suppressing it.
100% would be too much, that's just basekit old Iron Will. But it would be nice to know what the noise reduction of crouching actually is.
Is it 25%? if so is it additive or multiplicative? Additive would make crouching with Iron Will silent again.
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@Morgadox said:
More context: The killer was a Myers (t2 at the moment), didn't have whispers or any other tracking perk/addon, i'm quite sure i didn't activate any crow and I also don't believe it was luck because he went straight for my locker(there is dozens on every map and this one wasn't particularly well placed) without even checking the surroundings, i wasn't injured, the map was Temple of Purgation and he was camping&slugging the guy in the other side of the map with the building between us, so there is not any chance that he saw me enter the locker. There is no way he knew i was in that location since i walked a lot while he was camping and he was kinda looking for me/crow movement while patrolling the slug to kill me right away, it really looked like he only saw me after hooking, but how is that possible since i entered the locker when he picked the guy up, and he didn't have bbq anyway? I even thought it was Hangman's Trick but he seriously didn't had any tracking perks.
There was not any streamer on the match, i guess he could have sniped me if someone sent him a stream msg, but why would my teammate rat me if he was being camped/slugged for the 4k? Very suspicious situation...
So what perks/add-ons DID he have?
There are a number of perks that could have revealed you as you were getting into the locker.
Undying: if there was a dull totem next to that locker
Darkness Revealed: the killer opened a locker after he downed the other survivor but before picking them up to hook.
Thrilling Tremors or maybe Surveillance: you were on a gen as the killed picked up the other survivor before you let go and jumped in the locker.
Bitter Murmur or Rancor: you completed a gen just before the killer picked up the other survivor.
Then there's the possibility of killer instinct, which works through lockers.
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/332465/why-is-sadako-so-weak-but-so-fun-to-play
Maybe she should be able to go throught pallets while demanifest as she is ghost.
This would be a brilliant and fitting addition to her powers, but it would be very strong, maybe nearly on par with Blight and Nurse.
As a draw back, I could see it being impossible to manifest within 1 second of phasing through a pallet (2.5s once you add on the 1.5s to manifest) or something like that. This would make it less useful on small, safer loops, but very effective against god pallets.
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As a killer main, there's a lot of confirmation bias going on here.
Yes there are SWF groups that can wreck a killer with coordinated builds and a hook-deny playstyle.
But there are just as many, probably more, SWF groups that dont, and who play the same way as solo survivor.
You just don't notice them, because they're not ruining your games.
You don't come out of a great game where you got a 3K and genuinely outplayed by the last survinor and think "that must have been a SWF". You only think that when you've been chain blinded, bodyblocked and then teabagged at the exit.
Not all SWFs are this unstoppable bully squad, and you can't penalise those who are without ruining the game for those who arent.
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Why don't you try playing killer and find out for yourself?
Genrushing isn't fun.
Denying hooks isnt fun.
Being tunneled isn't fun.
Being camped isn't fun.
These are all extremes, there's a lot of middle ground if you just play the game normally.
Imagine if the killer downed you all and slugged for a 4K within the first 2 minutes, before any gens were repaired. That's how genrushing feels.
Imagine the killer facecamping, instantly grabbing everone who attempted a hook rescue, denying you any chance of making the save. That's what the hook-denying build feels like.
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@Chewy102 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3037878#Comment_3037878
That was my original thought, but in the end that doesn't do anything to help with the issue of chaining several hits together.
1 single extra hit is often MASSIVE. DH alone proves this. Being able to take 2 extra hits, 3, 4(!) extra hits is game breaking no matter how rare it can be. It's the exact reason MoM got it's nerf. Extra hits are far too strong to allow them to be stacked or chained.
Not 2 extra hits, just 2 hits.
You get hit once under OtR, and go into Deep Wound.
You get hit a 2nd time with say DH, and your Deep Wound goes down to 10s.
The next hit, Endurance or otherwise, will still knock you down. 10s off of 10s is a flat 0, aka, dead.
It's exactly the same as your suggestion, except it gives the survivor 10s of leeway after a 2nd Endurance hit, instead of 0.5s.
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@Laluzi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3037806#Comment_3037806
I'm going to have to press X to doubt on that one simply because that was the case for 5 years. If anything, we'd just gotten to the point where DS wasn't mandatory on every survivor loadout.
I'm also pretty sure they actually cited this as one of the reasons for removing the BP bonus from BBQ, so that players weren't pressured to buy a licensed killer just to grind BP effectively.
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@Chewy102 said:
Here's a suggestion.
The issue isn't endurance stacking, it's the chaining of endurance allowing a Survivor to take several hits in a row.
What if each endurance hit you take while already in Deep Wound reduced your mend timer?
Example. OTR puts you into Deep Wound and need to mend within 20 seconds. If you then get hit under DH while still within that same Deep Wound, your mend timer is now 0.5 seconds. Meaning the moment you stop running without instantly mending you fall on the ground.
This still gives a Survivor a chance to get away as both perks are intended to be used for. But makes using them in an aggressive way adds some risk as if you do then you're almost certain to be downed right after.
I like this idea, but I think a better way to balance it would be to make it so taking an Endurance hit while under the effect of Deepwound reduced your Deepwound timer by 10 seconds.
This essentially allows you to chain up to two Endurance hits, e.g. OtR + DH, or OtR + MoM, or BT + Styptic, etc. which is basically the state of the game before this patch.
While also giving you the time to stand still for a few seconds without immediately going down to deepwound.
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The fact that many killers are reliant on rare and very rare add-ons is of course a balancing issue and not an issue with the add-on economy.
But fixing the add-on economy without addressing the underlying balance problems first or at the same time, is an issue in itself.
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@Sheridan_LT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3037806#Comment_3037806
That is the weirdest logic and definitely something a dev wouldn't do, if anything they want people to spend as much time and money as possible in this game.
Why? This is why all licensed killers are weak. They don't want accusations of the game being pay-to-win.
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I would assume that they don't want to have a meta perk on a licensed character, as it makes the game pay-to-win. Instead, they've replaced it with a similar meta perk on an original survivor.
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There was nothing to stop the survivors from repairing all 5 gens and leaving. So it's absolutely fine.
They just wanted to bully you, and you said nope.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3037318#Comment_3037318
Yep, exactly. Mettle of Man active at the same time as Off the Record, one hit cancels both. Mettle of Man activating because you took a protection hit with Off the Record, it is expected that you would get two Endurance hits.
Is this really intended to work this way?
MoM is an incredibly powerful effect, that's why it has a high cost, 3 protection hits.
It woukd typically take several encounters to rack up 3 protection hits, with breaks between to stop and heal.
But with all of these endurance effects now, it's not only possible, but common, to rack up 3 protection hits in a single chase encounter, which then extends that to 4 potential safe hits.
MoM doesn't seem like it was built for this, and is being abused by aggressive bodyblockers who can harass the killer with no fear of ever going down.
You guys keep saying that patch was meant to address tunneling/camping, while increasing kill rates and making killers something to be feared.
Instead, it's making tunneling unavoidable, because unhooked survivors are invulnerable and have no fear of the killer.
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@Bwsted said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3036800#Comment_3036800
I didn't say it was going to solve anything. I said what I think they're gonna do, given precedents.
And they already said they're not adding recovering a health state to conspicuous actions. Which lead me to believe I'm reading their intentions correctly.
@MandyTalk said they're not adding "being healed" to conspicious actions, because as a survivor you have no control over if another survivors taps the heal button. But you absolutely have control over sitting there for 16 seconds while they heal you to healthy.
"But For The People..."
Doesn't matter, you've still gained an extra health state, which is the point of OtR, it's no longer needed.
This is like running Unbreakable, and then complaining that it's not fair you don't get to use Unbreakable as an extra health state when another survivor picks you up instead. You've acheived the same result either way.
Survivors now have a very easy way of getting 3-5 additional health states, that are in no way niche scenarios, but a very common occurence when survivors decide to bodyblock off the hook, which is every damn game.
They always said they didn't want to make it impossible for killers to camp, as it's a legitimate tactic. Well that's exactly what they've accomplished. Killers can no longer come within 32m of a freshly unhooked survivor for up to 80s as they wil be completely invulnerable and will not hesitate to harass the killer and take repeated bodyblock hits.
The killer now has to actively avoid 2 of the 4 survivors.
Literally running away from the scary survivors.
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@Bwsted said:
Down to 60 sec, probably.
Which will do nothing to solve the problem.
They need to add "recovering a full health state" to conspicious actions.
They also need to make it so endurance effects of DH and MoM cannot be used while in deep wound.
DH causes deepwound itself anyway so it already shouldn't be exempt.
MoM doesnt inflict deepwound because its seen as a niche perk with a high cost. This is not the case anymore, now that various endurance effects make it incredibly easy to score 3 protection hits in rapid succession.
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The counterplay is getting there first.
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@DY86 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3035657#Comment_3035657
Because MoM is very niche its requirements are too many, therefore it is not endurance. Its another effect altogether
That's not the case any more.
MoM requires you to take 3 protection hits, which could not be accomplished quickly or easily.
But with the many endurance effects we now have, it is now possible to score 3 protection hits in quick succession and survive, under common hook trade conditions. Turning MoM from an awkward niche perk into a powerful meta perk that's very easy to use.
You go for an unhook, and get hit once. You then complete the unhook and get hit again and go down. 1 protection hit.
You get hooked, then rescued. You bodyblock with OtR and score a 2nd protection hit. You continue to bodyblock and DH to take your 3rd protection hit.
You now have MoM and can continue to bodyblock for a fourth hit without going down.
All the while the killer is trying NOT to tunnel, but you're not allowing them to go after your unhooker.
Additionally, the survivor running OtRn DH and MoM can put WGLF in the fourth perk slot, as the safe unhook plus 3 protection hits will get them the stacks needed to pick up a dying survivor and give them yet another endurance effect.
I have to say this does well and truly prevent any form of camping, proxy camping or accidental tunneling. You cannot be within 32m of any hook for 80s after a survivor has been unhooked, because now the unhooked and unhooker are completely invulnerable.
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@Uotsumi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3036336#Comment_3036336
Pig has poor stealth and chase power. There is no reason not to control the Jigsaw Box.
I'm absolutely in favour of improving her stealth and chase powers. All I'm saying is that the changes to her boxes were not a nerf.
Personally I think her movement speed should remain 4.6m/s when crouched, so she can utilise her stealth and have regular map pressure. Being forced to choose between the two is a bad design. The trade off is the lower point of view.
Secondly there should be a less telegraphing of her ambush, or a shorter wind up. Instead of growling 2 seconds before the dash, have the sound start 1s before and play as she's dashing.
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@Uotsumi said:
Any addons associated with Crouch and Ambush should be base-kit.
Then adjust the first person camera position of the crouching Pig higher.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3035270#Comment_3035270
Now that there are five Jigsaw boxes, they are generated more closely spaced in the map; this is a loose nerf for the pigs, since RBT is always unlocked by examining four boxes.
SO loose it doesn't even begin to touch the difference in removal chance.
It's only a nerf if your playstyle is camping boxes.
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@DY86 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3035409#Comment_3035409
Just a quick psa, u cant use the endurance status effect while in the deep wound status. So its either OtR OR DH, not both, at least until u mend first.
Nope, just tested in the PTB. Other endurance effects seem to follow this rule, but DH always works when used, even if already in deepwound. MoM also seems to always work too, because it doesn't relate to deepwound at all.
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@VikingDragonXii said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3035401#Comment_3035401
Good for you but we are not with your amazing skill level and some of us didn't find them so easily.
I'm not an amazing killer. I suck at most of them. I just used MYC on Dredge.
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@Aurelle said:
Off The Record is fine, don't tunnel and it won't activate. Besides, it disabled whenever you progress the game. Overcharge is the real problem here.
In any game with half-decent survivors, they will ONLY use OtR to bodyblock, just as BT is only used now to bodyblock. This significant increases the chances of those survivors also running DH and the now broken MoM for the sweet 5 hit deny combo.
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@Friendly_Blendette said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3035374#Comment_3035374
Well the alternatives is slugging and useless teammates. That isn't a common enough issue and really isnt a massive issue at all imo. If you are killer who doesnt want crowns you have to gamble whether survivors want a crown badly enough to go there rather than just going to a gen and if you are a killer who wants the crown after you find whatever survivor it is and injure them you are still trying to get the crown. Its by no means impossible odds of a killer hooking a survivor as a gen pops off and both the killer and a survivor goes and then the killer gets a free down but the killer is after crossing the map applying little to no pressure on the other 3 survivors working on gens. Also if they do find the survivor the crowns generally spawn inside loops and structure so unless all the pallets were thrown the survivor can still loop.
That's the alternative is it?
How did I get all 12 masks on the second day by playing killer, while letting all survivors escape with 30k BP all round, myself included?
You just have to play killer well, I would 2-hook all survivors, and control the pace of the game to the point where everyone was on death hook, I could walk away while they finished the rest of the gens (usually multiples remaining) and have plenty of time to find the pedestal.
I'm still finding pedestals now? I completed all the invitation related challenges AFTER I already had all the masks, and still pick one up nearly every game for the extra 750 BP. I've probably picked up around 30 invitations by this point, and I only play for a couple hours in the evenings.
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@nicnc82 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3035364#Comment_3035364
As a killer main who patrols end game and I've had matches where the killer camps hard end game, the survivors should have counters to end game camping. So no, it should not deactivate. You shouldn't be guaranteed a kill end game
I agree, this would give OtR an edge over DS, while DS would apply to grabs while OtR wouldn't. Two different tools for different scenarios.
It should however deactivate upon recovering a health state, regardless of how you do that. As it is, if you can recover a health state first, either via other survivors, Second Wind or Inner Healing, then you can tank 3 direct hits with OtR and DH, those 3 hits can then grant you a fourth via MoM. FIVE health states is insane. If it deactivated upon recovering a health state, you'd be limited to three health states.
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And if a killer hooks someone at roughly the same time as a gen is repaired (within 20 seconds or so) all players flock to the pedestal and the killer gets a free lunch.
"Killers are gatekeeping the event!"
"Toxic killers ruining the event for everyone!"