Ryuhi
Ryuhi
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3179601#Comment_3179601
I believe you when you say you don't play killer.
I didn't say that either, but good try?
Edit: I just realized I am now Schrodinger's killer. :)
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3179584#Comment_3179584
I'm not supposed to lose anything if I win the chase. Just like, I'm sorry you have to hear this, you shouldn't be winning chases against survivors that are better than you. I know this is what's been like lately, this is what Behaviour has allowed a few entitled killer mains to believe, that they deserve a kill no matter what.
No you don't.This is gonna sound like an old person ranting, but *back in my day* in 2016 and 2017, you actually had to be better than the survivor you downed. Now anyone can freshly start a killer game and stomp 99% of randoms. Killers have been given so many in built mechanics, crutches and buffed them in power so much that you would have to try to lose on purpose to get a 0k.
When have i said that I'm the killer you're going againt? When have I said I even play killer? I'm strictly talking about how asymmetrical balancing works.
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3179564#Comment_3179564
If I triggered Bloodlust 3 without getting hit, I won the chase indeed, and I shouldn't have to get hit just because "Behaviour, this survivor is better, intervene and down them for me. I'm entitled to win"
You're 1 of 4, so yes you're supposed to lose chases eventually if the killer focuses on you. They are sacrificing pressure on 3 other people to do so, its not because of whatever pity take you want to put on it. My point is that you have tools to use to prevent it from happening but you're complacent with complaining when you get caught for not using them, or bemoaning the inevitable if they cared more about singling you out than even trying to win the game. Drop the pride for five seconds and either learn from the L or take the W and move on.
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@Sumnox said:
Bloodlust should have never been a thing to begin with. It exclusively rewards the potatoes. Full stop.
It's as if we gave potato survivors permanent Hope. These forums would explode with killer mains crying.
Its funny you mention that, because non-potato survivors can force bloodlust to reset by forcing killers to break pallets (or even doors.)
Its almost like the people complaining about it might be either projecting or flatout ignorant to how the mechanic works. Getting a killer to t2 or t3 bloodlust basically already won you the chase, its just a matter of how much they're after that sunk cost: Meanwhile most survivors don't even bother keeping a mental timer to have an idea of what tier they might be at, nor routing so that they will be at a strong pallet they can force a break at once past the tier 1 threshold.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3179533#Comment_3179533
Literally
Just give us client-sided options like colourblind mode. An optional photosensitivity mode would do wonders for the experience of photosensitive people.
Hard of hearing features have, thankfully, been confirmed after the whole Spine Chill debauchle, so I'm interested to see how they'll be implemented. Hopefully a similar vein of DBD mobile.
People are so against option accessibility features with the feat of it granting an "advantage" or being "unnecessary" without realising it wouldn't impact them at all while helping to not only improve the playerbase but the reputation of BHVR as a whole
This is a community where both killers and survivors could get equal buffs, but they would sooner complain about their opponent getting a buff than appreciate their own. If something doesn't reward them personally, they don't want it to happen. Its kinda sad if I'm honest, we're just crabs in a bucket.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3179246#Comment_3179246
Now imagine someone has invested lots of time and energy into the game before it was given a photosensitivity warning. Doctor was a rare enough occurance that despite the danger it was manageable. Hell, they may not have even faced a Doctor before putting in time and money, because he's so rare. The devs even seemed like they cared after removing mori spamming due to both the ability to hold people hostage and the photosensitivity dangers.
And then they come out with new Haddonfield, Sadako, don't fix LOD issues, and slap on a warning and call it a day.
All the time and money has now been completely wasted.
Accessibility is all about making sure as many people as possible can play a game. This needs, you guessed it, the developers to change things.
At this point I'm convinced people just aren't going to understand. Most of the these issues could be fixed and they wouldn't even notice, but they'd rather tell players who have been playing the game for years with little to no issue to just stop playing it. One of the worst events in the game for anyone with photosensitivity is flashlight macros, so it makes the posts admonishing people for having reactions ignorant at best, dubious at worst. Everything else can easily be fixed by just changing the overlays that can cause issues, or even just having an alternate that can be toggled locally. Its really not a difficult or invasive thing to accommodate, unlike the portable harding tests players can carry around because the devs refuse to put a sanity check on even their flashlights.
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Nope. The best way to do well in solo queue is to always play for the team, because you have absolutely no control over how good or bad they are, but gens take zero skill. If they're bad you don't want them in chase, and you dont want them anywhere near the killer. If they're good, they'll be buying you plenty of time in chase or taking advantage of the time you buy if you're the one in chase. As a bonus, you even get to improve your own play by getting more interactions to learn from, instead of just hiding in lockers for 30 minutes waiting for that 3rd survivor to die while making forum posts about how they will be sandbagging you if you don't survive.
Weak links break chains, and selfish players are the weakest link in dbd.
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Hatch players really are somethin else.
Edit, guess I should contribute: Nah, those auras, I guarantee that people who actually play the game get more use out of them than hatch players fearing retribution
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He's basically talking about why a lack of sanity checks is making the game harder to balance, and predictably causing players to focus more on damage control than playstyle variety. If you balance around X factor, you need to make sure X has minimal variance: Otherwise you increase the likelihood of unfair outcomes and make it inherently less balanced. Most balance discussions with the game turn into "Oh yeah well what about [insert other side] having [insert other problem]!" for this exact reason, its balanced by averages while selectively ignoring extreme outliers, and they're generally likely to nerf a mediocre thing due to its extreme usage than actually address why said extreme usage is a thing.
It's been an issue since day one with balance for no comms vs allowing them, and having that variance create a blatant unknown to apply to various core mechanics. Most people have made peace with the fact they're never going to remove it, but there is a very important lesson to be leaned about it: There are going to be both casual groups of friends who want to talk while playing, and there are going to be people who press that advantage as much as possible because it's in the game. They could easily make changes to how the system works that hurts the latter without affecting the former, but those types of meaningful changes require more than throwing a perk on top and calling it a day.
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@Grum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3170073#Comment_3170073
Please don't describe a killer that can harass nearly every gen on the map from anywhere, attack from four different directions at once, attack through walls, and immediately shut down every loop, as "fair but strong".
I can't imagine what would possess them to design a killer where every interaction that survivors could possibly have with them is "I guess I'll just crank out gens in between getting harassed by birds every five seconds; until I hear their terror radius, then it's time to start holding W and predropping pallets until I inevitably die, because she's impossible to loop."
Artist doesn't need to be nerfed. She needs to be deleted and redesigned from scratch. What a god awful way to design a killer.
The amount of hyperbole in this post tells me you are not very experienced at using her, because you'd realize how silly things like "attack from four different directions at once" sounds. If nothing else, you might find yourself less frustrated going against her when you learn how many nuances her power actually has. here's a free one: You know those little hills that usually have a hook on them, and are a saving grace for balanced landing enjoyers? They murder her power :D
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Pips are supposed to be designed around encouraging fair play, with the original idea being that you needed to do stuff like not camp/tunnel/etc in order to pip at higher ranks. Unfortunately there has been an ongoing war between multiple emblems for multiple killers for a while, where they generally have to decide between deviousness and brutality (but can rarely get both evenly) which at least thankfully doesn't apply to all of them. There also absolutely needs to be a reevaluation on scoring events contributions to them, as someone like legion can double pip by accident while not even getting many kills, especially compared to someone like plague or the instadown killers who straight up gimp their own emblems and score categories. Its like the same problem on survivor side with both avenues, the survival emblem requires not going down, not dying, or surviving for a while to get their maximums, with anything short of escape being no more than a silver at best (and the points relying heavily on that escape bonus.)
The requirements basically havent been updated to address the game, and still work as if Rank was what determined matchmaking. Since its basically just a determination for your monthly BP bonus, they should be adjusted to reflect that.
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This is going to be an extremely hard pill to swallow, but its always much easier to focus on bad teammates as a way to excuse bad play from ourselves. Bad teammates can and will ruin games regularly, its the nature of teams in PVP in genreal, but thats something we all have to deal with. Even if meg stood in front of myers poking him in the chest waiting for him to get T3, that one dwight keeps leading chases vs bubba right back to a hooked survivor, nea's urban evading in a corner somewhere, all that means is that you aren't able to carry them. **which is perfectly ok.**
The most important thing is whether you can get out of that game and honestly answer yourself if you could have done anything better, and use that as your point of evaluation. You might have played great but made a pretty big mistake at one point, which might have even been the catalyst to the loss even if the rest of your play was very good. Thats the kind of thing you want to focus on with those kinds of losses. If there isn't anything, just go next.
I just honestly feel like a lot of people's frustration with solo queue is a combination of being upset with bad plays from teammates, but also from their teammates not carrying them. And many can't tell the difference, which then causes them to have the same effect on other survivors, and so on.
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@deKlaw_04 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3171528#Comment_3171528
Yeah it sucks. I have said it many times but I really wish he would get buffed significantly so that these addons could get reworked or something. If your in solo que you are not getting off the hook with a tombstone myers. This was just a miserable match and a waste of time
That very last part is where I understand and sympathize, but I don't think it justifies the former (even though i do agree mikey needs better basekit and to have the peak of his tombstone addons capped.) Killers can have absolutely bad games that are wastes of time and drag out far longer, but as survivor at least we can gg next a lot faster, even naturally. You would have gotten out of that match faster than the ones who caused it to get that bad, so in a way you're kinda being rewarded not having to keep playing out a doomed game. Its the kind of thing that people use to justify their ragequits, but you're being given a pass without needing to be the one ruining the game for the rest. Its definitely a less frustrating take.
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Tbh i've only ever been hit by a double up snipe from artist twice, and both times all i could say was wp. I know the setup involved in that with having to stagger two birbs to hit far enough apart, and i know that most people get tagged by one and just get rid of the swarm before she can land a second, especially far away. Both times it was purely because i didn't respect the second one and thought she was just trying to find people at gens, which is the only thing its actually good at when firing them off like that (aside from DMS synergy at least.) Without that insight i probably would have thought it a lot more annoying than it was, let alone all the other quirks like elevation changes.
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@deKlaw_04 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3171495#Comment_3171495
Well i jumped into a locker when he started to chase me off the gen. I think he had his stalked 99ed thus camping to bait someone out
Oh he almost definitely did, or he understood how much a threat it would be if he did. Thats part of where that kinda of deductive reasoning i mentioned earlier comes into play, that scenario happening as it did to that point should be impossible, but was made possible because of how badly one (or more) players didn't respect his addon or his stalk. Or were just entirely clueless and reading twitch chat or something. But even then his knife is back down, meaning he does not have unlimited T3, and he can't stalk someone on the hook. So either he had enough time to get a full 99% again AFTER he pulled you out of the locker and didn't use it, left to stalk more and came back, or he doesn't have it and wouldn't have enough time to get it while someone unhooked in front of him.
Thats the type of deductive reasoning that everyone needs to do more of, especially solo survivors. You did the right thing with your locker play, but the other survivors let you get a whole stage and still haven't finished a gen nor made the save because they are too afraid to understand how his power actually works. The unfortunate thing in solo play isn't as much your lack of power in the 1v1, its that you have to rely on the average player being able to make these types of deductions. All we can do is find ways to improve individually and hope the others have been doing the same.
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@deKlaw_04 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3171482#Comment_3171482
Not sure, i was working on a gen and that person got moried quick. And i got facecamped to death. Solo que
I get it, but its hard to just shrug it off as solo queue when you could have gotten one done by the time those events played out. Logistically it should have taken well more than 90 seconds for events to play out that way, and the game is a map where gen locations are pretty easy to discern quickly. Again, I can't say exactly how your play was, but it might be worth considering everything that happened up to that point as well.
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@deKlaw_04 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3171340#Comment_3171340
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/3308LKN0X47M/8ba01663-8ebf-4260-8eee-e896579674e2.jpeg
Tombstone piece myers is so fun to play against. Its so fun to have the game already over 🫤
not even to try to discredit your stance or anything, but how the hell did he get a grab kill and a hook on a map with very bad stalk angles and a metric ton of pallets before you guys did a single gen? I don't think his addon was the issue there, just that he was able to get an extreme value from it due to extremely poor play from his opponents (the whole team, not directed at you)
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@OjomoTheWraith said:
It's interesting and.unique in itself.. But gameplay wise?? Boring af. That guy never chases, just stalks all the time. Until.hes 99
Sounds like a perfect description of killers in slasher flicks, imo. They end up doing nothing half the time then instant killing people one by one, until the last few get chased for their life. Its like they accidentally got that perfect :D
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@WeakestNurseMain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3171342#Comment_3171342
I find it funny how I'm always debating killer and survivor mains at the same time in my threads, for some reason people really struggle to understand that both sides have problems that need fixing.
Its understandable to a degree, people will always value their own perspective over another. Unfortunately they tend to consider their perspective infallible and anything that exists outside of it (even when not directly contradictory) feels like an attack on their logic. The issue is that it turns into arguing rather than discussing, and nobody really takes anything away from the exchange. Just makes you appreciate when you see open-mindedness, i guess.
Like this very topic has people jumping to argue "the other side can't have nice things" and ignoring that they got an equally nice thing. If thats because they don't believe they are evenly valued, its understandable, but they're ignoring that their appraisal might not be correct. They might not have the insight to even accurately appraise the entire suggestion.
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@WeakestNurseMain said:
why not just make DS basekit and automatically happen, and reward killers for spreading out hooks, I was think a +5 percent bonus to gen kicking regression for each unique survivor hooked as well as adding back BBQ's bp bonus as a basekit mechanic, that would be more than enough to get me to start playing nice again.
Actually considering a reasonable improvement to the situation for both sides, equal parts carrot and stick. I like it. Dunno if its exactly what i'd go with, but it'd absolutely be an improvement for everyone vs how things are now, and how they continue to address them.
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@TheArbiter said:
Tombstone piece is insane, I couldn't tell you the last time I lost a match using it, being able to eliminate a survivor within the first 90 seconds of the game is very strong
Bingo. Being able to make the game a 1v3 asagdp is arguably the biggest strength of the addon.
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@PBsamichShoe said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3171322#Comment_3171322
No, you literally said that killers, in particular clown and myers, have less tools available to win and so they're forced to use poopy tactics to secure a win when that is in fact not the case at all. I've won tons of matches (3k or 4k) with both of those killers over the last several years without using busted addons or tunneling and camping other players.
It sounded very much like a plea for pity and screamed of victim mentality. Like the game purposely has it out for you. Which it doesn't, it's just got so many flaws in its design. One of which is myers addons lol
Clown and Myers were examples, stop missing the forest for the trees. They're relevant since Clown was already a weak killer and pinky finger became popular since it was something that made him viable to most people, same with tombstone and myers. Many killers have been getting indirectly hurt by other changes for years now when they were never even strong to begin with. Your personal anecdotes mean absolutely nothing outside of your personal experience and why you feel the way you do. Kinda like how you started out the gate with a strawman and would rather justify it to yourself out loud when being called out for it.
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@PBsamichShoe said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3171267#Comment_3171267
Such a victim mentality lol
If any of this was true killers wouldn't be camping at all after all of the 6.1 changes.
If anything we've learned that even if you change the game so that they dont have to camp or tunnel or run 4 gen slowdowns but still allow them to then they will still camp and tunnel and run 4 slowdowns lol
And if anything clown became more skillful after his changes. It takes some serious skill and dedication to learn how to use his yellow bottles effectively to end chases. But it's challenging and so people would rather hold and release m2 to win with blight and nurse.
Myers is also way fun to play with different addons and builds but that takes thought and strategy and people are lazy. Unlocking all the perks to use so you can try all the different builds with him is a major grind too but the same can be said for many killers. Although the grind is definitely not what it used to be.
How is that a victim mentality when I'm focusing on the issue rather than the symptoms? You're acting like i'm claiming lowest common denominator strategies would go away entirely if the inverse were more viable, which is something I've never claimed, just that they would be less necessary to many players. People will just be less shoehorned into being required to use them. You yourself even go on about how there is an excessive difference in skill between them and other strategies, ignoring the fact that many people either don't have the loadout/resouces for those, and that they are much less guaranteed to be successful. You even kinda acknowledge the obstructions to it at the end of the post, then just dismiss it as a problem all killers face.
We're talking about simple "odds adjustments." Currently the lowest common denominator strats have a disproportionate effectiveness vs their alternatives. Enough so that people generally don't even consider them. If you have 80% odds of getting at least a 2k with one strat, but a 20% chance with a more fun/varied strat, people are going to gravitate to the 80% much more often. There is no "woe is the side I play" in that assertion, its pretty damn simple and straightforward. The point of discussing the ways to counterplay tombstone builds is because thats kinda what the topic is about, and its advice that people who get frustrated by the addons can use to maybe learn how to apply them and be less frustrated in the future.
Essentially I'm addressing the floor and the lower end more than the ceiling. Both sides reacted very poorly to recent skill floor adjustments across the board for both sides, which then makes it important to understand why. That insight is what is supposed to be used going forward, but seems like it never is. People would rather argue in favor of things they want than understand why things they don't like happen, and what causes them.
Also why do people need to start their posts with rude pointless assumptions like that? Kinda makes the other person less likely to care what the rest of the post even says, and baits people into arguments more than discussions.
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@OrangeBear said:
I don't believe anyone over reacts to them at all. When tombstone myers is played optimal, it's truly unbeatable.
Whenever i see these add-ons when playing survivor they are not using a good build for it.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/WYL5U1VUNKU8/image.png
I use this build after a string of bad matches and it never fails. Sometimes i use the infinite combo but tp + jmm is way better and quicker.
The synergy that these add-ons have with Play With Your Food is extremely strong. There's no counter play to it because survivors don't have control over starting and ending chases.
The reason why this playstyle is not common i think is because you barely get any points out of it, and you always depip.
I mean there is still counterplay to it, you just hop in a locker if he gets anywhere near you and then wait until you either get thrown on a hook (and not mori'd) or he leaves you. People always complain that isn't counterplay, but it is a play that literally denies his outcome so I don't know what else i could call it. If he doesn't have infinite, 2 or 3 people doing this should result in him never landing a single grab. His TR is massive so its kinda on the survivor for being caught out in the open or trying to ignore it and rush gens when he's nearby, there are few situations where you shouldn't be able to get to one (or make enough time to get to one) even on maps with awful locker placement. Believe it or not being in the right place at the right time before a chase starts is absolutely something survivors have control over, and countering Mikey's tombstone is one of the things that made people realize (and have to learn) that over the years.
that is a good build tho, moreso just explaining what people can do to fight against it. tinkerer probably helps with catching better players unaware if they're not expecting it.
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@YOURFRIEND said:
It feels really really bad to just not be able to play the game because your teammates let a tall dude in a jumpsuit stare at them for too long.
These forums are full of gross exaggerations, however 4/5 Myers are playing with tombstone for me. I don't blame them, he's very awful without it, but the fact remains.
This post encapsulates the cause of most "unfair" killer strategies. They are using the tools they have left to try to win. The more that number diminishes, the less variety you get in matches. It sucks, but its a direct result of death by a thousand cuts: Mikey and clown are good examples of killers who just flat out lost all of their more fun and more skillful ways to play, so it shouldn't be surprising that they are more likely to put efficiency in the way of fun if its their only way to be viable.
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@AtraXis said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3166920#Comment_3166920
The fun part about the terror radius is that they increased it to avoid the synergy with MnA, but they also nerfed his ADS. Survivors can hear the ringing noise when he aims on them now, rendering the terror radius nerf completely useless as they would still be alerted outside of it anyway.
As for the quickscope, I don't think it was really the problem. I mean he still can prevent anybody from playing the game despite that nerf but somehow people think it's more fun now. Now, I wouldn't ask for a revert considering how drastically this has affected his gameplay, but the real problem was the lack of cooldown when cancelling ADS, which means you could just bait survivors into getting in a bad position and immediately shoot them without penalty. The worst part about it is that they literally buffed this aspect of the killer by buffing his movement speed while aiming. Since shooting is more difficult than before, people tend to zone a lot rather than committing to a shot, which is lame.
Absolutely agree with the ADS nerf's impact, it was one of bhvr's patented "don't address the problem, do a blanket nerf to it and hope it doesn't make other things worse" responses. They wanted to get rid of slinger being able to zone people with his ability like Demo and other killers, instead they weakened its correct usage and made that zoning ironically stronger. Why take the shot and risk missing when you can just ads shuffle to convince them to more inefficiently and catch up faster? tbh if they had just done like you suggested and gave aiming more of a cooldown instead of making it less responsive at the start i think everyone would have liked that more. Isn't that basically how they handled it with pyramid head?
Come to think of it, i think that might be part of why a lot of his changes feel so bad, you could compare his and pyramid head's m2s in a lot of ways (having to start up a separate stance, medium ranged attack, large cooldown for missing, able to option select at windows, etc) but pyramid head's (which is only part of his overall powers) Is kinda better at everything slinger's wants to do. Only thing it's really missing is inflicting deep wounds instead of just hits and the fact it has a short travel time instead of a (near) instant one... but otherwise it definitely makes slinger's whole kit feel weaker by comparison.
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@AtraXis said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3166883#Comment_3166883
Yeah I think you are absolutely right, it's just that my point was more around the fact that people often blame slinger more for being weak than unresponsive, two different things that are mixed up too many times. But I agree that core mechanics that define a good chunk of the gameplay of a character shouldn't be the one being nerfed.
I definitively see why people would drop this killer just because his ADS was changed, he went from being a fast paced killer to a slower, more mechanical one. However, I still don't think he is unresponsive now. Compared to his former version, yes, but he is still in my opinion one of the few killers in DBD with a power that works correctly without any awkward gimmicks once you can use it well. His power still feels really smooth when you adjust to the new timing, however it's definitely not the same gameplay as old deathslinger.
It wouldn't matter if his chain wasn't so easy to break with environment, and it actually gave him something if he trades at pallet drops. Its possible to get the hit around very short loops if you start going around the side preemptively instead of waiting for the hit and reacting, but it takes extremely good positioning and compensation to even have a chance of making it around. He's one of the few killers where trading at pallets is extremely survivor sided, and can lead to his power being nullified by a bad survivor play.
Him being able to hit through windows is cool, but the way his power interacts with pallets (and loops in general) was a downside big enough to not need these kinds of nerfs. Since he's already a 110 with a large TR (now) its not very difficult to be in position before he gets LoS in most scenarios, which basically allows you to zone him at loops with pallets exceptionally well.
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@OrangeBear said:
Yeah i hated that event.
Survivors would literally jump in snowmen instead of mending against legion, jump in snowmen if they got marked by ghost face, jump in against tombstone myers, against victor and immediately crush him afterwards.
Killers literally got nothing, they couldn't use the snowmen themselves. The event was just a few weeks where survivors got an advantage.
That would have actually been really cool if the killers could get in them too. Don't know if it would have made up for how people could use them to tank hits for free or nullify half the powers in the game, but it would have at least made it less biased if that random snowman could suddenly turn into a bubba halfway through his charge or something. Of course knowing bhvr they'd probably screw it up and make it so that blight could dash while still having it on or freddy would accidentally be able to teleport to them or something equally stupid and broken.
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@SirCracken said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3167882#Comment_3167882
Maybe other killers would be played more if they had more powerful perks to use?
You're definitely not wrong, but its a bit of a chicken and the egg situation. If the game was designed in a way that its extreme variables were contained, it would be more viable to balance everything to be as even as possible. Their core design is based on balancing by averages, they let things go unchecked for one side because there are equally bad issues unchecked on the other. Its extremely lazy design, and a big part of why every argument on here turns into people whatabouting the worst case scenario in every argument, even when the other person is doing the same. You can't fix extremes without either putting in sanity checks and limiting how bad they can get (read, ALL of them, not just certain ones) or evenly and dilgently normalizing the extremes for both sides simultaneously (which is more difficult, since it involves fixing core issues instead of applying fixes on bad foundations.)
most of the time people complain about how bad things can get, they're usually right. What they're missing is that this problem isn't even remotely unique to the situation, unfortunately. The ironic part about nurse is that her strengths mostly stem from her ability to deny survivor strengths, which are what prevent the rest of the killers from being better. Likewise, survivors feel like their defenses are diminished against nurse, simply because she requires more adaptation in playstyle than any other killer in the game. That was also the case with spirit, and was a big part of why she got nerfed, people just refused to adapt, and they refused to take a bite out of the "you can do everything right and still lose" pie that most of the killer roster has to eat regularly. Not nurse tho, and thats why her popularity is generally relative to the viability of other killers.
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@CluelessWanderer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3169236#Comment_3169236
I disagree with you. Moving right along....
How are you moving right along when you edited this post to try to get the last word in? Try actually moving on and discussing the topic. like this!
@GoshJosh said:
Yep! Empathy has remained one of the most solid aura reading perks in the game over all the years. Also not mentioned, for sabo attempts.
Didn’t do much for my solo queue teammate running it today, though. Somehow with Empathy equipped, they sandbagged me while I was being chased on my death hook. I was going up one of the smaller platforms with a vault and drop on Dead Dawg Saloon. Don’t even know why they were hanging around up there, all the gens were repaired in the area. They also had Autodidact, so maybe they’re not all there. (Oops.. I’m not being very empathetic, am I? 😅)
I honestly never even thought about using it with sabo, thats a good idea. I'm not a fan of the mechanic of saboing in the first place, but I can absolutely see how you could pair empathy with the aura reveal of sabo for some good synergy. Half of why people discount sabo's aura reading is because they don't have enough time to run across the map to intercept the killer's path to the hook, so it could definitely help with that (especially if scourge hooks are in play.) Could also synergize with perks that recharge or gain value while inside the killer's TR as well, since you would be able to have an idea of how to remain at the edge of it and have a point of reference for whether the killer is disengaging and heading your way (similar to how spine chill was often used.)
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Fun idea, terrible execution and multiple oversights for one side. Almost like there was a lesson that could have been learned but wasn't.
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@CluelessWanderer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3169213#Comment_3169213
It has nothing to do with post history. In this case, it's my personal memory, knowledge, and being fully aware that further exploration will be futile for both parties.
I can signal whatever I want to end a conversation even if you don't like it.
I mean you're not wrong, but you're also implying you're too important to care and proving you're too ignorant to get insight from opinions you disagree with. It's taking your ball and going home in conversation form.
Even people who rant about the most biased perspective in the universe can accidentally give you good insight unintentionally, this game is pretty much designed around it. Its very easy to lose the forest for the trees if you just echochamber yourself.
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@ThiccBudhha said:
I had to sign the agreement before unlocking him, on console. Not sure if PC players got the same tunneling terms of service notice or not, but I literally couldn't buy him until I accepted it. I did not read it, naturally, but I definitely signed it.
I heard they can legally sue you if you don't say "Poor performance indeed!" out loud every time you get a down.
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@CluelessWanderer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3169167#Comment_3169167
Ah yes. Stacked with items from the Blood web where we now start from ground zero and get less decent shite. Anyways, I've seen you enough in the forum that I wont bother engaging with you anymore.
Whats with this new trend of using people's post histories to dismiss them? You don't have to agree with someone to learn something from them, the entire point of discussion is supposed to be exposing yourself to different perspectives on a topic. Like even if you're going to do it, at least keep it to yourself and just leave the conversation quietly lmao
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@CluelessWanderer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3169148#Comment_3169148
Oh good, so I have to dedicate 2-3 perk slots for ONE perk rather than the previous form of BK, where it took up just one slot.
God that is so efficient and balanced for Solo Q. I can't imagine needing perks for anything else. But you're right. I just don't think enough.
well, yeah. If the previous affect was too strong by itself, it should require multiple commitments to get to that previously strong level? BK's stipulation was added as a sanity check, to provent people from being able to get unintended value through combining with other factors. Its the same as the thana, AA, ruin, corrupt, etc changes in that it was made in an attempt to address "how bad things can get" and disproportionately affects "how bad they normally are." They're just bad at balancing in general, but their intention wasn't as bad as you might think.
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@DredgeyEdgey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3168851#Comment_3168851
I'm pretty sure
They have been changing their old code updated at a time so they might have the frame of a old car but the engine and parts of modern car
Not a good comparison, there are many core bugs that have been in the game for years, including those updates. It would be more akin to saying to keep replacing parts but not fixing the issue that breaks said parts, just throwing more new parts at it each time it breaks again. Its a big part of why performance has always had issues at so many levels, they're extremely bad at balancing legacy support with improving the efficiency of their code. They're too (rightfully) afraid of breaking things unintentionally with every fix, and stuff like the Garden House is a perfect example. Honestly the game is more like a damn Jenga tower at this point.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3169109#Comment_3169109
Empathy is still unlimited Range. Because no Map is big enough at any point to not see the other Survivor with Empathy. They just made the Range consistent at some point with other Perks, because they all display the exact meters.
@Topic:
Personally, I think that Empathy is not that good. It is way better than many other Perks in the game, but I dont really see the reason to use it when Bond exists. Yes, Bond is a lower Range, but do you really need map-wide Range?
I'm pretty sure you can go past its range on maps like Eyrie of Crows that both long and are not square by design. Granted you pretty much have to do it on purpose, but its absolutely possible. As for Empathy vs Bond, both OP and I have discussed exactly why that range is important, it gives you information on what is happening that you can use to rule out other information at the same time. Its basically the same effect as clown bottle screams being global: If you hear more than one without a survivor being injured, the liklihood of pinky finger being in play increases. Then you can either see an instadown or a relatively long chase with no downs but plenty of screams and start to figure out whether its in play and you've got your answer (rather than having to be in chase and get instadowned to find out.) There is a slew of info in this game that can be predicted with deductive reasoning, which is arguibly the biggest strength of a lot of aura reading perks.
Its not even to downplay bond, I think thats a great perk as well. But there is absolutely value to be found in empathy comparatively, even if it seems like its trading a distance limitation for its injury conditions.
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@Grandpa_Crack_Pipe said:
It allows you to treat your fellow survivors and killers like actual people, even on forums-- and we all know how tough that one is.
Oh, and also the perk is awesome.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/SXBQTN6CQ6RW/iconperks-empathy.png
I switched Iron Will out with it a while ago (before the IW nerf), and I was shocked to see how much work it's done. Empathy gives you multiple hefty bonuses that aren't immediately obvious just from the description:
- It's radius is huge, and I don't think there's any map it doesn't fully cover. You have eyes on every injured survivor, at all times.
- You can roughly pinpoint the location of a killer if a survivor is being chased, whether via watching them get injured or by studying their movements. This info lets you know where you need to be and what's safe to work on.
- It synergizes incredibly with healing perks like Botany and We'll Make it, of course. Being a heat-seeking healing station to survivors close by has saved many, many of my teammates.
- It gives an early warning if a survivor who's obviously being chased is sprinting straight at the gen you're working on.
- If a survivor is about to need a bodyblock or a flashlight save, you don't need to scramble to find them and the killer-- you can see them clearly, and get to where they're going to be instead of flying blind.
It's up to you to put this info to good use, of course. If you spend the whole game running to the opposite side of the map just to heal Claudette, you're probably just wasting your time.
But damn has it been treating me good, and I encourage you all to give it a shot, too.
It used to not have any range restrictions, but its current ones are extremely generous like you mentioned. It covers the vast majority of most maps, and usually only loses range in "end-to-end" situations where the distance is as far as it can be: if you're working on a gen somewhere on the map, it might as well not have a max range basically. I'm also glad you see the value in the secondary information it gives, I honestly think thats the best part about the perk. Being able to track an injured survivors movements across the map that clearly show them in a chase lets you basically follow along from a distance without needing to even actually see the killer. The stuff like finding people to heal is nice little bonuses compared to the other information it gives.
I think people undervalue it because they literally use it just to find people to heal, while ignoring all of its strongest applications in the process. Just like the other two similar perks Kindred and Windows. I usually run one or the other, but kindred and empathy are extremely strong solo perks when used correctly, and i consider running at least 1 of the 2 more important than even OTR.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3165225#Comment_3165225
I seldom see killers face camp at 1st hook with 4-5 gens left, but it's mentioned so often here that I can believe it common practice.
I noticed you didn't answer the question I asked. I won't consider a thing you say until you do.
So which pidgeonholded argument do you want me to fight? Because I'm not going to list every single variable that makes your assessment of the time wastes involved with the perk relevant, things like chase start time/time to down/time to reach a hook are all going to be diferent but they are all going to be more than zero, which was the point I was trying to get through to you. I've never even implied that the perk doesn't have any of the time wastes your mentioned, and havent disagreed with you about any of them. I've just stated that you are purposely ignoring that its something that affects both sides and trying to weigh your outlook to only focus on the negatives for your side. This game is absolutely full of worthless time wastes, but at least those ones are to get value out of a perk rather than a core mechanic.
If you mean "What other takes do you feel hurt camping?" thats a kinda weird question. I think there are many base factors in the game that have been there and also others that have been included to weaken camping, tunneling, and slugging alike. They have also only made those strategies situationally worse, but have not brought them down below all of the other strategies that have been minimized by other choices, like CoH's existence: There is an extremely large issue with the game's balance about efficiency caps, and thats a major part of why tunneling and camping will always be a thing. You have no idea what level of player youre going against, or even how coordinated they are, yet they are at their absolute strongest at the time you need to figure that out. Most of the things that gave the killer time to judge those factorss and use less oppressive strategies at the start are at an extremely low point right now, so its basically damage control right from the start. I've been seeing a lot of people "tunnel 2" more often now, where they will juggle two survivors and only go after the other 2 if there is little to no time commitment involved, it honestly seems like the best compromise given the numbers game involved. Basically every change like making Corrupt and Ruin super niche, killing thana because two killers got too much value out of them (and then doing it again with AA like a month later because of nurse) all of those types of things have all done their part to hurt X thing but accidentally impact Y too much indirectly. Its been a growing trend since CoH was introduced and they keep trying to throw numbers adjustments at it instead of actually addressing how much it hurt the core mechanics of the game by existing.
Basically we are at a point in the game's health that lowest common denominators are ok, since their alternatives are not viable enough or consistent enough for people to be expected to leave their outcomes to chance, and its a result of a lot of the nerfs indirectly removing value from things that they were not put in place to do. It happens with survivor as well, but generally only on a perk level rather than a core mechanical one, which is a pretty big distinction. BHVR is just really, really bad at making balance chances without considering what gets affected as a result, and following their "meta shakeup" from first announcement through to today is a very clear indication of that. Even our individual perspectives can do the same oversights without us knowing, which is why I'd rather educate than argue.
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This is the weirdest attempt at asking for BHVR to fix bloodweb QoL I've seen yet.
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I see people use it at pallets a lot, which I like. They'll basically try to force the killer to commit to either lunging and risking the DH, or try to wait it out and risk having the pallet dropped on them. Killer doesn't swing, the survivor needs to make the read and put down the pallet before the quicker normal m1 comes out or end up getting downed (or worse, getting downed and dropping the pallet as well.) It creates a mindgame while still giving the killer a full risk/reward read to make, which was a big part of what made the perk strong before (granted, it was never necessarily with dead harding for distance)
The perk had a skill floor adjustment, but its ceiling feels relatively untouched. In some ways the speed bonus and blade wipe is more valuable than what it lost, just a lot harder to maximize on. You obviously need to be very good at midchase routing and judging distances, as well as being able to both force reads and commit to them yourself.
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@Trickstom said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3167273#Comment_3167273
Honestly, it's easier to hit him now with Shadowborn for me. I don't know why but after seeing these images I can easily "see" the hitbox when using Shadowborn.
Since the Fov expands, the visual representation of the area has to shrink even though the actual area doesn't. If you're really used to using shadowborn and/or how awkward hurtbox representation is in this game, i can see it being something you can subconsciously adapt to much more easily than others. Its just klinda like how some people are actually worse with stuff like nurse blinks (or even just falling short with lunges on killers in general) when using shadowborn because they have a harder time with compensating for distance with their timings, their muscle memory gets "lied to" if you will.
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@MommyHunktress said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3167437#Comment_3167437
Ik but must buy others for better perks
How are they better perks if this one specifically helps you get better at a thing you clearly hate encountering? Every tools value is dependent on what you can get out of it, what it accomplishes, and how much it improves your odds when it would be applicable. Windows is designed literally to address your frustration and help you learn to adapt, it even came out in the same chapter as bamboozle. You're refusing to take it out of pride, and that is holding you back as a player.
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@MommyHunktress said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3167419#Comment_3167419
nah too much money to spend
...its a perk on an original character. You don't even need to spend money to unlock it.
And with the changes to progression, you can just p3 Kate and get it on everyone. This isn't even as bad as needing to buy sadako to get call of brine or anything like that, it requires zero financial investment for a very useful perk that most importantly helps you improve as a player.
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@MommyHunktress said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3167377#Comment_3167377
well windows wont help me find a window if its 32 meters away seeming as how i wont make it there
Just run the perk and see how often there is always another window or pallet nearby. Its generally by design, and deadzones are a lot less common than you might think. You don't even need windows to know when things are nearby, but its extremely helpful to learn the tiles themselves, and even when you do it helps speed up your reactions and routing (and even keeping track of resources spent by teammates previous.) Its one of the best thought out perks in that it gives value to all skill levels, but people refuse to use it because they call it a beginner perk. I could easily imply "you must be terrible at looping and need it" or some other assumption, but I'm simply offering you a tool that can help improve your experience. Take it or leave it.
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@AVoiceOfReason said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3167368#Comment_3167368
I have never seen anyone complain about Bamboozle before. Its only good for jungle gyms. You still vault slower than a survivor. Just run away if you hear the weird crunching noise. Its there to shorten super long loops that would take ages to force a pallet drop on. Its more of a band-aid fix but a necessary one.
I hate to be blunt, but most of the time people get caught by bamboozle its because they overcommit and blindly run around corners right into the killer's vaulting animation. In that scenario you have basically trapped yourself, but some people refuse to accept their own blame for that happening.
Most learn from mistakes like that, others don't. They'll just continue to get caught until they adapt.
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why not just run windows of opportunity and find another window nearby? Its a really good perk even outside of that situation, but its a straight up bamboozle killer.
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@Chilli_man2400 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3167187#Comment_3167187
But to be fair when you release something they didn’t intentionally release him to be broken when something releases something will break that’s out of your control.
Every game that has come out always will have a issue. This happens with every live service game there will always be a bug
The way they handle and react to the PTB is a very clear indication that they do not plan their releases properly from a gameplay standpoint, but more a purely commercial one. You can't give a short period of time just before release, let people find issues, then make changes that can cause other core issues at the same time. And if you do, you need to be ready to have a bugflix update very shortly after to fix any further issues you missed, or ones you just caused. They do bugfix things after patches, but sometimes they take much longer than they should, and they can't killswitch something during its own release.
They need better playtesting so that the PTB doesn't become their first experience with these types of issues, and they need to do better about allocating resources to react to them after they hit live.
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@Nexuiz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3167225#Comment_3167225
I understant that, but why would they take away Progressione I had already earned before the grind reduction.
they're not supposed to be removed for any reason, thats a bug that they're kinda forcing people to verify and make a ticket for. Usually with progress lost issues they reimburse you with BP to spend to rebuy your progress, but i have no idea how they are handling that with the progression system being completely different now.
But yeah, make a ticket and they should be able to work with you on fixing it hopefully.
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@Malkhrim said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3166953#Comment_3166953
On the ocasion I mentioned, yes, I waited until after the second bounce. However, I had a match a few minutes ago where I sucessfully vaulted right after a survivor droped it, before the second bounce. So yeah, it's inconsistent.
That sounds more like latency issues, particularly the server resolving the pallet's state with how it is currently displayed on your side. Not to dismiss it or anything, but thats the same kinda thing that happens when you hit someone vaulting but on their screen they already cleared the vault and got hit. Considering wesker can hit a survivor, slam them against a wall and infect them, but decide not to register damage is a similar validation issue, hopefully fixing one fixes the other as well.