Rogue11
Rogue11
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- Rogue11
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@TheSingleQuentinMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/453668/why-are-these-pallets-in-the-game
To quote my dad after I was born, "Well, better than nothing." It's a weak pallet, but I think it allows you to have something. I rather they populate the map with a couple of almost useless pallets that maybe you could surprise the killer by using cleverly, than just have it be nothing. Then again, Killer main here, so don't trust me too much.
The problem is that's the whole map and thats every coldwind variant.
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@TheGoone said:
Pallet chaining is too strong and these should exist to stop long stalls
Yea chaining this tile into empty corn, a harvester, or a useless coldwind tile would be too strong
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3981893#Comment_3981893
I mean, i literally showed you one that was right in between the 2 strongest structures on the map, and that was just t he first one i loaded in with.
Maybe in your case, not in mine. But it doesn't matter where they are. they could be next to shack and they would still be useless. You're ignoring that this realm more than any of the original 3, consistently has the worst "filler" pallets, the worst maze tiles, the worst LT walls, and nothing to justify it in terms of other structures. Even the damn CORN got nerfed. The lighting is the brightest of nearly any map so stealth (lol) isn't an option. There's no excuse for how awful these maps are in their current state.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3981885#Comment_3981885
Couldn't get the bots to cooperate and start a chase there, but here is at least an example of the distances:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOg6d55wK_E
You can see that if i do afull lunge on either side of the box, i can almost lunge all the way through the pallet. But, on the cone side, i can barely get to that side of the pallet. This is showing that the cone side is actually the longer side. The cone thing looks a lot smaller as a survivor because it is. Remember survivors have a smaller hitbox than killers. So a perfect circle is actually the best "loop" you can do in the game, because that hitbox difference is at its maximum effect.
And yeah, these pallets aren't exactly the best pallets, but its a filler tile. You can see right in the video its right in between 2 structures, the killer shack in the middle, a long wall jungle gym, that has another filler on one side, and an LT wall on the other. So again, this is a fillter tile, but its not compeltely useless. The point with fillter tiles like this is you often can't just predrop the pallet, because the killer can just go around and hit you while you are in the drop animation.
You need to actually loop a bit and play the pallet to either bait the stun, or get the killer to back off while you drop the pallet, forcing them to either kick it while you run to the next thing, or to go back around. If they go back around, with the pallet dropped, you have a decent loop that creates basically a 50/50 of "do you vault" or "do you not vault"
These are way too common on Cowshed to be called fillers. They aren't filling gaps between strong tiles. They're just in the middle of empty corn.
Even in places where they're near what is supposed to be a strong tile, for some reason Coldwind just doesn't get decent tiles, nearly ever. Most of the time its either the weakest LT walls of any realm, or one of those garbage new tiles that has nowhere near the strength of a normal jungle gym. What structure on these maps justifies every tile being horrible? Main on Cowshed has ONE pallet and ONE window, neither of which are too strong. The carts near main are usually just empty. Harvester is an easy win unless you have Balanced to run somewhere else. Every one of these maps, aside from maybe Torment Creek is just "shack & cow tree: the map"
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I realized you're calling the hay cone the long side. There's no way you think this is a balanced tile. You can play this tile with literally every killer on the roster and get a hit and/or down every time.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/453668/why-are-these-pallets-in-the-game
The loop on the left there around that cone thing is deceptively long for a killer due to hitbox differences. The box side is pretty short yeah, but lots of loops have longer and shorter sides.
you can't be serious. you could tank the stun and still get a hit with how far any other tile would be.
the "long side"
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What's your mmr?
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3981386#Comment_3981386
If the priority was on killers we wouldn't be waiting months/years for bug fixes, reworks and adjustments.
They already have your money for those older killers. They want you to buy the new broken cash grab killer until they decide in 6 months whether to:
A. Balance it properly (Wesker)
B. Nerf it into the ground (Skull Merchant)C. Leave it in a broken overpowered state forever (Blight).
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3981378#Comment_3981378
"Dont forget how they got Reassurance nuked under the guise of "a 3 man swf could keep using it to bm the random" as if that actually happens"
Ill add that the video in question was a custom game between 5 friends (so including the killer, who stood by watching). It didnt even happen in a public match. It highlighted to me how content creators can just set up the perfect circumstances to make something happen purely for view$. And how influential it can be. As a consumer of DBD content myself, the Reassurance debacle was actually what made me a lot more sceptical and critical of content being pushed in the community.
I wasn't actually aware of that. That's even worse. Right up there with the mythical "bm prevention" where you can't pump fake an unhook anymore. Thousands of hours and I never saw that outside of lightly trolling someone who was trying to go next on hook.
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@Jacknalls_Paw said:
The state of DBD for the past few years has been as follows:
Is a new perk/item released for survivors? Are any changes made to the survivor side?
All of this must first be approved by the pool of killers, who have never touched the survivor side, before it can be implemented in the game after countless nerfs until it becomes unusable.
It's been more than two years since survivors got a semi-decent perk from MFT, namely Finesse, which isn't even that great. Everything else is just useless junk that will never see the light of day in the meta.
The substance doesn't change with items, and Fog Vials are an example of this. At this rate, in a few years, people will be totally fed up with it all, and I don't blame them.
The developers are not exempt from blame. I think it's time they started listening to the other side of the argument and ignored the constant whining of these people before making hasty decisions.
Dont forget how they got Reassurance nuked under the guise of "a 3 man swf could keep using it to bm the random" as if that actually happens.
Also the portals on vecna's map (the only remotely loopable part of the entire map) were made completely useless in chase within a couple weeks with no compensation in terms of other pallets/loops. So that map has been a guaranteed win for killer ever since.
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We already have it. Most new killers have map mobility, anti-loop (sometimes multiple versions), tracking, and side quests, usually combining primary elements from multiple previous killers.
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seems similar to the same bug with Nemesis's tentacle wind up
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Played hours of survivor with/without friends. Maybe got 3 escapes. Switched to no-brain Lightning McClown. Won all 8 matches (3-4k). The state of the game is getting so ridiculously lopsided.
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They were not great before and now they're worse.
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As long as the stupid wall hacks add on gets nuked she could get some tweaks. She's pretty strong already though
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Demo and I would remove all the anti-fun blocks on using his shreds from high elevation to get some distance.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3979575#Comment_3979575
Ghoul did not get an immediate grace period. BHVR literally gave Ghoul 25 nerfs before starting the grace period.
Likewise, it's absolutely fine for Fog Vials to get nerfs, before starting the grace period.
It's literally the same thing. The grace period for EVERYTHING IN THE GAME should start when BHVR is ready for it.
Ah yes he got so many nerfs on the PTB….and then got the sliding add on basekit that made him an absolute scourge to deal with. But lets leave that part out right? Consistent with the rest of the changes he got. Minor nerfs around the edges while ignoring the actual problems.
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@PuddleOfBludd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3979645#Comment_3979645
What I am saying is that I don’t believe the fog itself was ever bugged. It’s the maps themselves. Because the very same thing can be said about the way that killer powers work differently or better on certain maps. The fog vials should’ve never been touched because now they are completely useless. It should have been handled no differently than killer powers. You just have to adapt to the fact that they work differently on some maps.
So unless they are going to overhaul every single map in the game, then no there is no nerfs that should’ve ever been done to fog vials opacity based on this.
Trappers beartraps are impossible to see on some maps and very easy to spot on maps like coldwind and eyrie. I demand his traps be brightened to be easily visible on every map until all maps have the exact same lighting!
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@PuddleOfBludd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/453168/rip-fog-vials
Yeah, I was waiting on the Lara skins. But I won’t be buying them, or anything else from them for that matter. Several of my friends are of the same mindset. Not giving money to people that don’t value their customers. None of us are touching survivor at all. Some of us won’t play whatsoever. I’m doing another BG3 play through.
Lots of great mods available for a new playthrough!
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@Araphex said:
Here is a video comparison of the fog vials before and after the patch. Thoughts?
As awful as expected, and matches how useless they were when I played killer tonight. Just delete them so they stop wasting my bloodpoints. I'll definitely remember this the next time we're told we have to "wait and see" or "just learn and adapt" when a new busted killer like Ghoul releases.
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Might as well delete them entirely. They're just bloodweb clutter at this point. Same for "buffed" maps and keys for that matter.
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@Metagamer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3977948#Comment_3977948
Are we pretending that they weren't severely over-tuned? Nobody asked for them to be nuked, people complained because they were too much. There are many videos over the internet already explaining the issues with them and how brainlessly easy it was to use fog vial + iri addon and either break chase entirely or extend chase dramatically.
I don't understand this idea of
Group A: Has something overpowered
Group B: This is overpowered and is making the game unfun, this needs to be changed/fixed
BHVR: Drops the sun on whatever it is
Group A: "This is all your fault, Group B!!!"
Be upset at BHVR's inability to gradually adjust things instead of just annihilating it like the million times before.It was brainlessly easy to see through them prior to the nerf. Now they might as well not exist and the iri add on will be worse than Oni's. If you would like to see brainless I suggest you check out current Clown (wasn't nerfed at all in the hotfix despite far more negative feedback from both sides both on PTB and live).
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@cburton311 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3978071#Comment_3978071
unfortunately no one is using them now, so either the perception of the nerf is too great and killed the item OR double nerfing it was actually too much, aaannd no one will use them. Medkits and toolboxes will continue to be the best items to bring
Pretty sure it was the change to make the LOS blocker item…not block LOS…
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@Brimp said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3978204#Comment_3978204
I mean I don't really like current blight. I believe they made him extremely boring to play as all the fun stuff got taken out while also making his collision boring since 7.7.0. But you cannot claim this item was "weak" when it can cause so many chases so start upwards of 20 seconds later.
Even then I've yet to see a good argument as to why these items are weak other than the survivor using them wrong.When I set up a build around it, dropped a flashbang to blind the killer first, then dropped fog, left the loop, took a hard 90 degree turn, and the killer was STILL on my ass within seconds (was just a pinhead, no dashes), yes the item is already weak.
I braced myself to play killer when they came out and equipped Predator expecting to be losing chases left and right. Only to laugh at how useless they were most of the time as I continued chasing survivors through them with no issue.
Nerfing these immediately while Kaneki is still being "evaluated" and Lightning McClown is left untouched, just WOW.
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@Brimp said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3977948#Comment_3977948
There was definitely a better way to make fog vials rather than "lmao robbing you of almost all your senses in a large area". The recharge was stupid and sound muffling was stupid. It's still gonna be good against killers that are walking to your area which has always been its best use case. It's still gonna be very good on indoor maps even mid chase.
There's something hilarious about someone with a blight pfp asking for nerfs to an already weak survivor item.
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3 out of 4 teammates get hooked quickly vs busted ass haste clown (well done ignoring PTB feedback once again devs), killer is chasing the last teammate when we realize someone brought a luck offering. We try to 4% to save the match but no dice.
"SUSPICIOUS BEHAVIOR DETECTED"
What an absolute joke..
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Played against one yesterday with STBLF + Rapid and it felt like cheating. Granted it was on the new garbage map but Im thinking something needs to be adjusted.
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I like lobby voicelines and wish I could hear other players when they join a lobby (like everyone used to hear Ash if someone was playing him). I find in game voicelines very distracting and annoying and I hope they never add them to my mains.
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@DPootis said:
hes fine, yes he can get a free injure but he has no true anti loop. You have to play extremely safe, and adapt your playstyle
"no anti-loop"
https://www.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/comments/1m6odsd/ghoul_is_just_an_m1_killer_compilation/ -
@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3971772#Comment_3971772
Please stop repeating this "forums math".
No matter what the escape rate percentage is, it's descriptive of the state of an average game, and not predictive. This isn't like flipping a fair coin: survivors fall like dominoes because snowballing exists, among other factors.
For example, the first survivor to be chosen to die (by the killer) only escapes about 20% of the time, since 0k is the most rare outcome for a match. And if the first kill happens fast enough (say, with 3 or more gens remaining), the killer has almost guaranteed at least a 3k, barring some extreme set of circumstances. None of that is captured in what you're saying here.
As it is right now, killers "win" (3k or 4k) roughly 50% of the time, and survivors "win" (0k or 1k) about 36% of the time, with the remaining 14% or so being draws (2k).
In an actually fair game, it would be more similar to about 43% for each, with draws taken from the center.
I've personally never seen any other competitive PVP game where not only does your chance of winning really so heavily on whether you're "attacking" or "defending", but you can also choose "always attack" to make sure you are playing on the team designed to win more and never have to "defend".
It's the one (and possibly only) thing that comp DbD tends to get right, which is that each group has to play both as killer and survivor and come out on top to actually beat the other.
Deja vu once again xD
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@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3971574#Comment_3971574
Yes, but then I had to guess if the second one had DH. And the third. And the fourth. And then I had to remember which specific survivors had DH, and sometimes I would be wrong because they simply misused it in the first chase and actually ended up having it for the second.
DMS + PR makes itself known after one hook. If you get hit by it after that, then that's on you.
Actually no, if PR doesnt pop on the first hook, it could be because the killer didn't have a scourge hook within range or chose to save it for later. Then if it is PR I have to remember which specific survivors had their PR used and sometimes I would be wrong because it wasn't used on their first hook and the killer ended up having it for the second.
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@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3971561#Comment_3971561
Every time? You couldn't tell the first time if they had DMS/Pain Res?
You couldn't tell in the first chase if someone had dead hard?
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@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3971506#Comment_3971506
If by "used to it," you mean "was forced to alter their entire playstyle to account for a perk that the survivor may or may not have," then yes.
Oh you mean like how every time a teammate gets picked up, everyone has to alter their entire playstyle by letting go of all gens being worked on to account for a perk that the killer may or may not have?
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@jedimaster505 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3971271#Comment_3971271
I keep hearing this "asymmetry" excuse so I will refute it once again. The game has been asymmetrical since 2016, even when it was supposedly survivor-sided and everything in between. Asymmetry has nothing to do with one side being easier or harder to play. It has always referred to the difference in gameplay style between killer role and survivor role, not difficulty imbalance. Even if the game is balanced 50/50, it's still an asymmetrical PvP because one side players killer, and the other side plays 4 survivors.
Releasing new survivor cosmetics is a band-aid for survivor side. If you want a PvP to be fun, you need fairly balanced matches, which means bringing the average kill rates down to 50%, the average escape rates up to 50%, and updating the MMR system so that you get reliable teammates based on an accurate assessment of player skill. Survivors will still struggle against skilled killers. The difference is, skill expression will remain in tact for survivor side, which is what makes any good PvP feel rewarding to play in the first place.
Be prepared for the inevitable arguments that "winning vs 50% of my opponents isn't fair because I might not reach the arbitrary win condition I made up in my head in half of my matches. Therefore you have to lose 60% or more of the time or else you're entitled."
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@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3970564#Comment_3970564
I don't know why you are surprised. Blight and Nurse are the only S tier killers allowed. Any new killer that accidentally ends up in S tier will be nerfed to A or B tier shortly after release.
Being consistently steamroll 4k'd by a variety of killers isn't really better than it being done by 2. It's the losing every match part not the lack of variety.
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We love making exploits basekit and fine tuning them to remove what little counterplay is available.
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These two hairstyles are still the wrong color as of the current patch..
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@Nazzzak said:
Mine haven't been that bad. Probably 5min on weekdays (tolerable) and 10min (I'm not patient enough) on weekends. Over 15min is nuts.
They're planning to do a feature in the next 2v8 where you queue up as killer but can play survivor while you wait. It saves your spot in the killer queue. Could possibly be a trial for future normal matches if they can't get things to improve.
Ah yes, anything to continue not making playing survivor more appealing.
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PC players play an online game without using 3rd party software for advantages challenge (impossible)
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if every killer gets teleports and map mobility we can revert to old map sizes instead of trying to shove 7 gens in the wendy's parking lot, right? because the whole rationale for making maps tiny and terrible was "muh m1 killers".
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@Stibfa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3967013#Comment_3967013
Nice strawman! Claim ghoul doesnt have a high skill ceilling, i show you an example of his skill ceilling "it doesnt matter" yeah okay dude, i guess blight doesnt have a high skill ceilling either just brute force the pallet! Guess huntress doesnt have a high skill ceilling either, just zone with your hatchets
You could argue removing hug tech and j flick was a nerf to blights skill ceiling. I would argue there's more skill in understanding and working within the limitations of a killers power.
Autoaim free hit into leap cancel m1 is by far the most common tactic and requires no skill to perform. No amount of triple leap 360 no scope body block clips will change that.
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@Stibfa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3967007#Comment_3967007
Yeah you want to back that claim up?
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/8Q1G2BNEFIBS/1000025923.gif
If ghouls skill ceilling is so low please Post a clip of you bodyblocking survivors mid loop like this. Hes easy right? So it wouldnt be an issue. Just play a game and get a clip!
in his current iteration there's literally no reason to make it that complicated. just force the pallet and either vault→ m1 or break pallet → catch up cancel → m1
SKILL
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@Stibfa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966794#Comment_3966794
Horrible changes. Im sorry but have you played ghoul at all yourself? You want to make his cancel longer and remove its usefullness. Congrats you killed any skill ceilling the killer has. How about we keep ghouls skill ceilling and nerf the mindless parts of his kit like enrage vault and grab attack?
Ghoul's current skill ceiling
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@Virtualguy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3965656#Comment_3965656
That's not really a viable solution since survivors don't know someone is being camped until they see it. If they made kindred basekit I think this would be better but it still has the issue of killers should not be able to just ruin someone's game with no counterplay.
kindred isn't needed, just show the anti-camp meter in the survivor UI.
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@PatchNoir said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3965015#Comment_3965015
I dont wanna say youre bad at the game but its looking like that in this comment, same thinking as wraith op because he bodyblocked the pallet or the window.
Ghoul is actually easy to loop for a long time, he jumps windows slow enough for you to go around it and fast vault.
His power fully recharges every pallet broken so W key away.
If he dashes you just look to WHERE he is going, its for you or the pallet/window? IF its YOU its safe to jump window/pallet or drop pallet, if its WINDOW/PALLET just run away from it (like we do when nurse charges tp for too long running into her), because he will be stuck going the other way and cancelling power.
Other than that just watch competitive players looping him, hens posted a video today holding a ghoul EASILY for 2 gens and escaping, you need to learn how to loop every killer as survivor, loop a nurse like its a trapper and it will be a bad time….
Nothing I love more than someone lecturing me about skill while defending a character with literal AUTOAIM.
"If he dashes you just look to WHERE he is going, its for you or the pallet/window? IF its YOU its safe to jump window/pallet or drop pallet, if its WINDOW/PALLET just run away from it (like we do when nurse charges tp for too long running into her), because he will be stuck going the other way and cancelling power."
Wow this all sounds so much like looping a M1 killer and not a killer with multiple anti-loop abilities that are better than many characters that lack all his other strengths (stupid mobility, free injure) while being easier to play than all of them.
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@PatchNoir said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/451334/piling-on-the-anti-ghoul-discussion
people are mad that it feels cheap to lose a healthy state and i feel that too, the first hit is so dumbly free. But if you really look into it he is just a better legion since after the first hit he is m1…
Another thing is people dont like rush chars that can apply pressure and he can travel fast in the map, the hate is that and the players will grow up to accept it, changing ghoul is basically merchant 2
Calling a character who leaps across the map in 2 seconds, cancels power on a dime and hits you a "m1" is not remotely accurate.
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@Rudjohns said:
I had a game where I was on the hook and the teammate died just by the exit gates
And the killer had picked them up before, which means they would struggle out
Because of this change they diedAnother killer sided change, of course
Same, I've had several situations where I forced the killer to drop near an exit gate and then had to try and stay in the match while the teammate crawls out just to get around the stupid mori system.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3962027#Comment_3962027
Honestly, my friend, it is really interesting how different our approaches are to one killer, who is either at the best tier possible, or the worst.
Skull Merchant is an interesting case because I wasn't really here for most of the 3 gen mess… well, I was, but only in the very last one or two days, so I don't have the "release bias" like others do, and like I have for Legion (very obvious reasons, my dear friend, you were there you know how bad it was).
The only time I ever disliked her was like, the first ten or so matches I played against her after the rework where my teammates would DC for no reason, but I moved past that. Skull Merchant 2.0 was, in my honest opinion, perfect. Not a single thing I would change about her. Quickly became one of my favorite killers to go against and, as of this moment, she is my favorite killer to play as, despite the nerfs.
That will remain as long as the design previews do not, under any circumstances, go live. That would be horrible.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3962025#Comment_3962025
If I may ask, old friend, what caused Singularity to be placed at the bottom tier?
Primarily being held in stalemate 3 gen situations for upwards of half an hour in what is the closest we have in the current game to old "chess merchant". Having as many as 3 cameras on each of the last 3 gens, and spaced in such a way that you need multiple EPMs to even start repairing. On top of other toxic strategies of cameras on top of slugs or recent exit gate strategies.
Then there's the autoaim shots, the fact he's never punished for getting outplayed at a tile. It doesn't matter how well you loop, he can always autoaim back on top of you in seconds. I also don't find his voicelines or general design scary or interesting at all.
I think if he hadn't directly followed the most hated killer of all time, he would have taken a lot more heat.
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