Rogue11
Rogue11
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- Rogue11
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@Chiky said:
as a killer it feels misserable. Like 10 mins in queue to get genrushed basically... if I dont play like a sweatlor and try to be friendly and farm points, the match lasts 3 minutes...
"Survivors hate how unfair the event is so they stopped playing: killers most affected"
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3960239#Comment_3960239
I mean this comment sort of highlights what im talking about.
First off stop it, it wouldnt be "uncounterable" it would just solve the problem the power having a counterplay of
"Gee golly willickers scoob, lets run away I heard a roar"
Second: Her slowdown is only powerful if she can →
Down someone.
Which if you are any decent at this game. Ambush sure is not going to accomplish that, so you are relying so heavily on stealth and m1ing that you are wondering why the power even exists in the first place. (my whole thing on faking)And that is WITH addons. Ambush is completely useless without grease or last will.
If you dont have grease or last will, you're not hitting ambush. Unless the survivors are brand new to the game/dont know what pigs roar/crouching means.
Other killers that have stealth and m1?
They have expose, they have traversal, they have tools to help them seal off vaults. Pig does not.https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3960245#Comment_3960245
The power still has the same issues as far as the PTB is concerned. Nothing changed, same counterplay.
hear roar see crouch at loop = run away = horray pig nice m2 there buddy, missed me by about 20 feet.Maps are barren tiny deadzones now. If you can't get a down as a M1 killer and can't be bothered to learn to use her still-useful ambush, idk what to tell you. Survivors should have agency in chase too.
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she has more basekit slowdown than any other killer. she shouldn't have uncounterable basekit anti-loop too. ambush was already decent in the hands of a good pig player.
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@Metagamer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3954966#Comment_3954966
I still find it crazy how people were losing their mind over the most mediocre perk of all time.
Yea i loved playing marco polo with the debuff icon trying to figure out where Timmy dropped his medkit, all the while giving the killer aura reading. And by the time I've found it and moved it away from shack, Timmy has looted something else and dropped it near another important area.
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did the winners from the previous contest ever come out?
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@Shirtless_Myers said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3957757#Comment_3957757
It happened to me in the game multiple times, but here's a video I found on Reddit that is also showcasing it: https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadByDaylightRAGE/comments/1lrfb2i/pallet_stuns_ii_the_sequel/
The one bug I can tell for sure from that vid is the RPD stairs pallet. That's definitely worth reporting. But killers have always been able to buttblock the pallet from one side like that Bubba did. Do you have some clips of other maps/pallet locations where this happens? The one I thought I timed up correctly was just one of the log pallets on Temple of Purgation.
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Do you have any evidence of this? I missed a pallet save yesterday so I'd love to have an excuse…
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@HeroLives said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3957069#Comment_3957069
wydm? Killers that would dc when the exit gates are powered or a chase that didn’t go their way are eating the penalties now too, the system isn’t biased. They just never had the luxury of going next on hook bc there’s no option like that for killer other than the leave button. Seems balanced now to me. Killers catch heat on here all the time so idk what you’re talking about.
No you missed the point entirely. There is a large segment of killer players that do nothing but "winstreak" with the most broken killers and builds, far beyond what any swf achieves. Yet the 97th time I load in to see lethal pursuer blight with double speed add ons, neon filters, and a hand cam rushing to down someone 20 seconds into the match I'm supposed to think "gee I wonder what went wrong. better practice because i'm sure the 98th time will be different! Let me just play guess the coin toss correctly 5 times every 10 seconds or die again".
Map tiles, survivor perks, and items get nuked based on whatever the top percentage of swfs can achieve. That's why even the best swfs can't get anywhere near the level of winstreaks of above average killer players. Survivor skill ceiling has been nerfed drastically. Yet we can't balance any of the killers that have been completely busted at the high end for YEARS. From the last stat release we got, high mmr 4 man swfs still weren't even escaping half the time. How is it fair in any way for killers to be winning hundreds of matches in a row on one side vs the best a good survivor team can manage is 50/50?
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@HeroLives said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3954998#Comment_3954998
Sounds like something a quitter would say honestly.
Never challenging yourself with adversity because you can tab out or go next, it doesn’t make anyone a better player. Staying in is always practice to learn more or figure out what went wrong and how to do it better next time. Difference in perspectives. Naturally you can only be held accountable for your own performance, but I think there’s usually almost always something someone can learn.
I'd love to hear this mentality applied to the segment of the killer community that thinks the definition of facing adversity is losing 1/100 Blight matches. Really seems like the expectation of overcoming challenges only applied to one side.
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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3953702#Comment_3953702
Nope, I'm saying if high level survivor skill is going to be capped, so should killer. In other words, I can't run a killer for 5 gens because after 35 seconds the game says "there there buddy its ok, here have a free hit with this 20% speed boost. its ok you don't need to learn how to run a LT wall as killer". That being the case, your above average sweaty blight main shouldn't regularly go weeks without losing a match.
Bloodlust your reason for a skillcap or is it just an example? Because it's a poor one. Yes after chasing a survivor for 35 seconds a killer may get a single hit. May, because that hit is not guarantee like you are claiming. Your scenario is based on running a single tile and not chaining tiles like, you know, an experienced survivor would.
I'd like to know where you're getting your escape rate stats since the last time they were shown, SWF barely made any difference. Or are you saying since a "high mmr" 4 man still escapes less than half the time, its perfectly fine for high mmr killers to regularly win 100's of matches?
The same place as you get them but it seems you are not reading them in the same way. Take what I've stated earlier, the killer role you only have yourself while with survivor you have to rely on others. When it comes to playing DBD for the first time, with zero knowledge of the game, who will win? The killer or survivor? Anybody with real experience with this game will say the killer will win more times than not. Why? Because new survivors don't know how to use the resources available to them. They run without looking behind thinking the killer only takes the same path they take. The game used to be balanced with these players in mind. Pallets and windows just a stones throw from each other. Survivors could be as wasteful as they want. Looping wasn't necessary because you could just run to the next pallet and be safe. This wasn't skill, this wasn't managing resources, this was run to pallet run to pallet. Now give that survivor a brain and see how someone with skill could run a killer for 5 gens. Give all four survivors a brain and see how even switching targets becomes a huge time sink.
Let's look at those stats. I will just look at the High MMR ones as the overall stats includes new players where, as stated before, will die more often due to not knowing the game. High MMR can reasonably be assumed the survivors are skilled in escaping as that is how you gain MMR as survivor.
Solo 40.4%, 2xSWF 40.0%, 3xSWF 42.3%, and 4xSWF 48.2%. Solo and 2xSWF are statistically the same. 3xSWF slightly above the means and 4xSWF a huge outlier. As in my other post, I've stated the survivor role is not based solely on the individual survivor skill. It is based on the overall skill and cooperation of the team that determines if they escape or die. Does the numbers not follow this logic? As a solo survivor you are at the mercy of match making to provide you will evenly skilled teammates. *(Maybe when SBMM was strict but it's very loose right now.) If those teammate don't pull their wait or "go next" by not doing anything, your chances of surviving that match becomes very low.
You cannot 1v1 the killer and complete 5 gens.
As a duel SWF you have one other person you can rely on but two randoms can still throw the entire match away. A three man SWF though has the highest chance of survival outside 4xSWF as one random survivor being bad doesn't completely destroy your chances. A bad survivor can still hold M1 on a gen.
A 4xSWF, where you try to dismiss, has a much higher escape rate than the other three. Why is that? These are supposedly good survivors at all four categories. What does a 4x group bring that 2x or 3x does not? A team that won't give up on each other. A team where 1 or 2 randoms don't throw 2 seconds into the match.
'* I also want to point out that SBMM was at one point very strict when it came to the High MMR experience. But you would have content creators complaining everyday that all their matches were sweat after sweat. Kill streaks were much rarer and many didn't attempt them. It wasn't until BHVR caved and loosen the SBMM that content creators began their kill streak sagas again. What does that tell you? It should tell you that they are taking advantage of a looser standard in match making and preying on survivors less skilled than they.
"Just chain tiles!" Never mind that every map has been reworked to put any strong tile next to a resource wasteland to prevent exactly that. That's exactly what im referring to when I say survivors skill expression is currently hard capped. Anything in the game that high skill survivors can leverage gets nuked.
And you're lying through your teeth pretending like 80% of the current garbage loops aren't a free hit by the time bloodlust 2 is reached. I acknowledged that 4 man swf at high mmr has a slightly better performance and yet they are still losing more than they win. How does that compare to the results high tier killers are having? Right. Not remotely in the same ballpark.
So the same killers that currently blame matchmaking for the ridiculous winstreaks are the ones who whined to get matchmaking changed to begin with? And we cant nerf their favorite broken killers because they might face a team capable of giving them a fair match once per hundred games? Wow its almost like all roads lead back to killers should continue being allowed to win 95% of their matches.
if we're not going to allow high skill survivors to express skill and we also want to continue balancing as a comp vs party game, we're left with:
1. Nerf S tier killers
2. Unnerf maps so high skill survivors have a chance
3. Make matchmaking actually work
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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3953305#Comment_3953305
So you should be able to run a killer for 5 gens, is what your saying. 3 other survivirs can play M1 sim.
Because something isn't broken like before doesn't make them useless. The same argument was said when infinites and double pallets were removed.
Still said nothing about having to rely on three other players to survive. Killers only have themselves and their skill. Survivors, no matter how good, cannot 1v1 the killer and do all 5 gens. That's the difference. The escape rate for SWF overall is much higher than average. That's because playing the solo lottery will bite you.
Nope, I'm saying if high level survivor skill is going to be capped, so should killer. In other words, I can't run a killer for 5 gens because after 35 seconds the game says "there there buddy its ok, here have a free hit with this 20% speed boost. its ok you don't need to learn how to run a LT wall as killer". That being the case, your above average sweaty blight main shouldn't regularly go weeks without losing a match.
I'd like to know where you're getting your escape rate stats since the last time they were shown, SWF barely made any difference. Or are you saying since a "high mmr" 4 man still escapes less than half the time, its perfectly fine for high mmr killers to regularly win 100's of matches?
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Hard not to notice they all died..
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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3953258#Comment_3953258
Maybe because it is not your own? Gone are the days of running a killer for 5 gens and escaping. (3 get out without ever seeing the killer) If you have bad teammates or get into matches where someone DCs, that becomes outside your control and skill. That is why we see higher escape rates with SWFs. Playing with three other survivors that you know and they know you really helps when it comes to working together and escaping.
SWF escape rates were barely higher than solo queue last time they showed the stats. Yes its helpful but not if you get a competent killer playing one of the several overtuned characters currently on the roster. A 4 man SWF just won't give you nearly the results of putting some hours into a S tier killer and going on 100's long winstreaks.
The last random blight with 4 slowdown perks and strong add ons I faced, I asked what his winstreak was. He said 105. I'm lucky to get 5 escapes in a night on survivor. This extreme level of disparity when it comes to rewarding experience with one role over the other is ridiculous.
You say 5 gen chases are no longer possible, meaning the maps are so worthless now, most of the time you're guaranteed to get hit once you are forced to use a strong pallet (the distance to the next is too far). In other words, survivor skill ceiling is consistently hammered down. Why then, is it always the fault of a survivor for "being outplayed" by being tunneled the moment the match starts? It's really a poor state of the game when the culmination of 1000's of hours of survivor experience has been reduced to "well you get to decide which corner of the map to die in".
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@nikodemo said:
it should come back ONLY for the LAST TWO survivors. that is the ONLY time suicide on hook is justifiable, to spawn hatch for the other survivor.
There are many end game situations where I'd rather take my attempts and die quickly on hook vs my team throwing to give more kills. There's no reason this should be active during end game. Same goes for when everyone is downed or hooked. We should be able to attempt to unhook in those otherwise lost cause situations.
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@DarKStaR350z said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3953064#Comment_3953064
Why when talking about balance are you expecting killers to play like full time streamers who are the top 1% of players, but when talking about survivors we are never looking at Hens or Aryun and expecting survivors to play like them but arguing about balancing for the average player?
Killers it’s always get better this streamer can do it, survivors it’s always it’s hard for average players who think Lich/Dracula have to many abilities to learn counterplay to so the game should hand hold them instead of expecting them to get better as they can’t be expected to put the time in to improve.
Probably because as killer with 10k hours you'll easily have a 80%+ kill rate while playing survivor you'll likely still have around 40% escape rate at best. If experience and dedication mean you're supposed to win all your matches, why is that only the case for one side?
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@I_CAME said:
My first game was a P100 Blight who tunneled someone that was clearly brand new at five gens. Four slowdowns too. Great matchmaking. This match was basically everything wrong with DBD on the survivor side.
Gotta keep up that 70%+ Blight kill rate! (still can't balance him after 4+ years of being broken)
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3951776#Comment_3951776
The crows are currently so lenient, that I don’t understand why BHVR still has it in the game.
Why are we pretending to have an AFK crow mechanic, when survivors can hide for over 20 minutes, if they open 1 chest during that timeframe?
Probably because hiding in a game about avoiding being killed with no way of directly fighting back is an intuitive choice. Also because hiding or not being on a gen for a bit isn't the same as being afk. I'd also be perfectly fine with them removing this overly complicated system though.
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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3950847#Comment_3950847
Absolutely not and thats what the reply was about. What is the point of the penalty if you can just skip it?
No one is skipping anything. You think its a good idea to demand to sit and watch the penalty count down with the game running? What purpose does that serve other just wasting computer resources?
What if i tab out of the game and watch a YouTube video or play a game on my phone? Do you want the timer to pause for that too? Should the game monitor our eye movement to make sure we're watching the timer and thinking about what we've done?
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@paranoidmad80 said:
I'd like blood on clothing for each hit and maybe more different moris for killers and as a survivor I'd like different generator repair sounds with the function to turn them on and off in the options. Other than that, I can't comment much yet because I haven't been playing too long, but I shared a post here on the forums from earlier about the DBD alpha and I liked that window grab animation for survivors
They tested a blood decals on clothing feature in a PTB years ago and then never implemented it. No explanation or anything. I really dont understand this dev team..
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Well he's basically 115 Huntress with the cooldown after hatchet throw add on appearing right next to a gen and double tapping the survivor repairing it. Hes not as stupid as kaneki so far but sometimes there's no way to have a chance without maybe sprint burst ready.
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@ad19970 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3948600#Comment_3948600
Just out of curiosity, what maps would you say have these problems?
For the no fog, all of them.
For being too small/not enough usable resources, Haddonfield, Borgo, every Coldwind map, Swamp, Wreckers yard, Wretched shop, Coal Tower, Yamaoka, RPD, Dead Sands, Toba, Nostromo, Ormond Lake Mine.
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@Abbzy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3949768#Comment_3949768
Faster yes but he is slower than wesker recovering after vault, when he is trying to cut you of you have two options just bait him like nurrse and run back from where he rushed or other direction or if there are many view blockers like on indoormap then run them an force him follow just with base speed. When he vault and you arent on the window palett you have plenty time to make atleast another round on loop. Idk why you are so fed up with him he does something better than wesker thats fact but overall he is still much weaker than blight who can do more all kaneki can and more, take shack yes ghoul can cut you of with power but same can do blight and his counterplay is very small and limited when he does it. Just think when you loop him and dont try same thing block point of view on your locations and hold shift+W that wont work on him much.
If he's doing things at loops better than wesker then he's not m1 chasing and doesnt deserve those abilities if he gets mobility and free auto aim injures.
Blight isn't a good standard for balance either.
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Its coded that way to prevent you dropping the pallet on the unintended side. Let go of the sprint key/button if you want to drop it on your side.
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I like the idea. please no more bright daylight maps though. would need to be dark/stormy
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@Abbzy said:
This post is another kaneki rage bait form someone who cant loop killer while being injure, quite sad ghoul is strong but after all he has to hit you with m1. Looping blight or billy is much harder than looping ghoul even nemesis is harder to loop than ghoul.
vaults windows and pallets with power into m1 faster than wesker. non-existent cancel into m1 after dashing to you from 20m away. 3 rushes to cut off windows and pallets at longer tiles. i don't think you understand what m1 chasing means.
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For stealth pvp specifically i don't think there is really another option with a horror theme. I would guess the closest thing might be the looter shooter genre, maybe Hunt Showdown for a bit of a horror vibe too.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
If you're looking for PvP, I'm afraid your options are very limited.
If you don't mind PvE, The Outlast Trials, or maybe even R.E.P.O might be more up your alley?
another single player option would be the Plague Tale games. very stealth focused and I enjoyed them.
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Just got 2 crows from running back to back Knight guards. Pretty good job! Another "suspicious behavior" identified by another flawless new gameplay system.
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Maps that weren't tiny empty dead zones with no fog with occasional pallets that are so weak they're only useful for dying under to hope your teammate can use for a save.
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I wish the window drops that look like they should activate Balanced Landing actually..would
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3946318#Comment_3946318
The mechanic isn’t trying to detect if someone is AFK, it’s trying to detect if the player is committing to meaningful interactions.
Yes, “AFK Crows” was a poor naming choice, because it implies it’s supposed to happen to AFK survivors.
I think a lot of the confusion is happening because they are called AFK crows, and people are expecting to only get them if they are AFK.
They probably called it "AFK Crows" because if they had called it "Draconian Normal Gameplay Compliance Crows" people would have immediately recognized it for the nonsense that it is.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3946303#Comment_3946303
- Like I said before, we're still missing a large part of the video. The video should have started when the person first started gaining AFK points. But we're missing that entire section of the video.
- Do you really think tapping a generator should reset AFK points to 0?
I think being arbitrarily marked afk mid match while clearly not afk and traversing the map, while the entire team is still alive is a problem.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3946274#Comment_3946274
Just so we're on the same page here…
- Before the video started, the person in the video spent a large amount of time not committing to any interactions that would remove AFK crows.
- Then the person went to a generator, but decided not to commit to repairing it.
- Then the person went to a teammate, but decided not to commit to healing them.
- Then the person ran to a hook, but stopped before getting to the hook, even though they only had 1 crow, and they still could have unhooked and healed their teammate, because loud noise notifications don't happen at 1 crow.
What part of this video are we supposed to be angry at? Are we really supposed to believe the killer was going to interrupt them repairing a generator, AND the killer was going to interrupt them healing a teammate, AND the killer was going to interrupt them unhooking and healing the other teammate?
And why is the first half of the video missing? This person started getting AFK points a while before the video started, and that is important too.
So at no point were they afk and were at worst playing mildly inefficiently. And you think this is a successful system that should be punishing the player? Just wow...
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@Mandy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3946220#Comment_3946220
Not trying to sound argumentative, but as yet we've not seen one video where players have received crows through normal gameplay - we've not replicated in our tests, nor on our own games on Live, nor have our Creators. That's why we need this video , we need to see the lead up to when crows were gotten. Without having some hard evidence that there is a problem here, we are very limited in what we can do.
Why was it deemed necessary to begin marking players as "AFK" when they are actively playing the game? There are myriad reasons why someone wouldn't be on a gen for a minute at a time (multiple expose perks, killer instadown powers, traveling across the map to unhook, slugging for the 4k, just to name a few).
Why is this intrusive system considered an improvement when 99% of the time, the only situation where "excessive hiding" occurs is when 2 survivors are left alive with multiple gens uncompleted? Why not have this system active only in that situation and disabled once either survivor is slugged/hooked (to avoid further encouraging slugging for the 4k)?
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@Elan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3945249#Comment_3945249
This will prevent survivors from avoiding killer, which is good. Untill Nowhere To Hide killers couldn't waste time earching around gen and finally now they don't need to run this perk as much. Along with it will prevent people from following with flashlight saves or bully killer with head on.
Killer sided? Now, just healthy for game. Survivors got massive buffs this patch - less teammates will give up, meaning much higher escape rate. Absurd buff to healing builds. Healing perks should not stack! You want to heal yourself? Ok you have self care and take 50s to do so, you want to heal others faster? Bring We'll make it, do no harm or something. Don't understand how it's fair that survivors can heal others in 6s and themselves in 20s. It's absolutely unfair and need to be removed so only highest boost value is applied.
"Healing perks shouldn't stack" says the killer while hitting a gen with surge, followed by pain res, followed by pop.
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Choose your fate survivors
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@Mikeyboi1225 said:
All they needed to do was remove self-unhooking without perks. Hell, they could even remove the struggle phase skill checks too to fix the problem. Everything else is unnecessary.
Letting go during struggle is actually important sometimes, especially in solo queue. If I see my team coming to save and I know the killer is camping/has some type of build to potentially snowball im letting go so the rest of the team leaves. Same goes for when the last teammate could get hatch. This is a dumb change and ruins many tactical options for survivors.
Potential to self unhook during end game/slugging situations is also gone. Anything to secure those 4ks i guess?
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Not to be confused with the "Remember Who You Are" achievement.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3942099#Comment_3942099
I agree with you mostly but not about Oni taking no skill. I'm a p100 Oni main and he still requires a lot of skill. All they did was give us console players the full 180 flick that PC users had all along. He is definitely a high skill killer
Yea making an exploit that removes his only counterplay basekit surely makes him require more skill to play. /s
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Yea lets just 100% guarantee every killer runs Lethal Pursuer. Who's ready for the whole team spawning in a dead zone and being hit by Billy / Blight / Ken within 5 seconds??
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3941851#Comment_3941851
You can't just ignore math and game balance. Clear and coherent evidence, and "Nooo, ignore the evidence!" just isn't going to cut it.
There's a reason BHVR shoots for a 60% kill rate, and…now I hope you're sitting down for this, it's because of math. :O
Theirs is slightly off of an exact hit of 62.5% to make room for various variables which imho is acceptable. I'd say +-3% is a good range.
Anyway, here is the statistics of balance. The team with single player is what we shoot for on a 50% win rate when they have to face multiple opponents. In other words, a 50% win rate for a killer would be balanced, a 50% win rate for each member of the team with multiple opponents would effectively crush the single player. That's why in game design, you balance around the lowest common denominator - in this case, the killer. Here comes the scary math, look out!
Here is the baseline statistics ranging from if the Survivors had a single member all the way up to 10, just for fun. You'll notice something quite interesting.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/I54MAYXVE3Q3/image.png
It might be hard to spot, so here it is in another form (the number on top of each dot shows how many kills are required to kill the majority of the survivors):
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/Q27KBI5HQ3D0/image.png
This is for the killer to have a 50% chance to win. The Per-Point win % for killer is kill rate. The survivor Per-Point is escape rate.
You'll notice that the more survivors there are, the closer to a 50% win rate the survivors should get. This seems backwards, and I made the same incorrect assumption that it seems backwards previously before diving in deeper. The key here is, the number of survivors changes the required amount of kills that is needed to get a majority. For example, in our 1 v 4, the killers needs a 75%+ kill rate (a 3K+) to win. However, let's say it was 1 v 1,000. The killer would only need to kill 501 survivors to get a majority for a win. This leaves roughly 50% of the survivors who lost, but 50% of the survivors who won! That's because the more survivors there are (with one exception I'm about to cover), the EASIER the killer can earn a majority. You'll notice a lot of up and down on the chart, but that's because of the number of kills required to win. For example, with 4 survivors, the killer needs 3 kills…but with 5 survivors, he still only needs 3 kills - but he has more people to go after which means him getting victory is easier - this means that with 5 survivors, with it being easier for the killer, the survivors would need their chance to win to go up. This is a repeating pattern. The more survivors there are, the target majority requirement changes. On the first case where the kill count needed has less survivors in the game, survivors need a lower chance, but on the second case where the same kill count is needed but survivors are in a larger number, they need a higher chance to win since the killer will have an easier time getting that required kill count.
Now to clarify, this is all around balancing the killer around a kill rate giving them a ~50% chance to win (which is what the 60% kill rate roughly achieves, though 62.5% would be a perfect 50%). Essentially, the devs got to the 62.5% number, but reduced it down to 60% to give survivors some breathing room. Let's just stick to BHVR's 60%. The problem is when killers have a kill rate above that 60%, it becomes very problematic for survivors. These cases absolutely should be addressed. On the flipside, when the killer has under a 60% kill rate, then it's very problematic for the killer which also should be addressed.
At the end of the day, BHVR pretty much nailed their 60% kill requirement if we're giving survivors wiggle room. The problem about just boosting survivor escape rates individually is that it will drop 60% kill rate killers below the 50% win rate balance. Inherently, in an asymmetric game, the individual player who has multiple "allies" must have a lower personal win rate than the player who is completely alone and facing off against multiple opponents all against him. That's the nature of asymmetric games. Buffing those individual win rates of people with allies would make it unfair for the player who is entirely alone. If you're on the side who have allies, you have the numbers, and in turn, you'd need to deal with a lower personal win chance than the player who is entirely alone with no allies who have multiple opponents.
Now, all that being said, this is a top level look at this. One could say, once a killer eliminates a survivor, his per point chance to kill a survivor should change since now he has less opponents. That's a fair statement! However, in order to accomplish this, the match would need to dynamically change once a player is eliminated. BHVR actually attempted this in the recent 2v8 mode where generator repair speeds would increase or decrease dynamically depending on how well or poor the killers were doing. That's a completely different discussion, but I'd be fascinated with that discussion. It makes me wonder if BHVR is testing the possibility of dynamically changing repair speeds depending on how well the killer is performing on standard matches…perhaps a response to tunneling? One counter-argument one might say is that it is punishing a player for doing their objective, or doing it too well. Also a valid argument, but nonetheless, BHVR clearly has this on their mind.
Interestingly enough, all players would have an individual similar win chance if BHVR went with an odd number of survivors.
Edit - clarified the chart titles.
No one is ignoring math. You just post the same incorrect "math" 20 times across different threads ignoring criticism until everyone gets tired of replying.
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@Malkhrim said:
Today I noticed a bus loop in Azarov's Resting Place that had no window at all, both possible window spawns were closed… was that always possible and I never noticed? Or is it new? Usually the bus loops in any Autohaven map have a window either in the middle or on the rear end.
That's the first time I've heard of that. Somehow im not surprised though 🙄
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I'm amazed people are actually arguing against this.
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@NarkoTri1er said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3941170#Comment_3941170
no, nobody is talking about "dozen of comp players" (which aren't really just a dozen, gotta disappoint you) but about poor matchmaking yall are constantly weaponizing to talk nonsense about balance when the problem is literally MMR mismatching <3
I said "dozens" as in plural. If you're going to quote me at least do it accurately. It could be a couple hundred and it wouldn't matter. It's an insignificant fraction of a fraction of the playerbase that doesn't represent anything positive for the culture of the game and shouldn't be looked to for guidance on balance. Winstreaks and comp mentality are killing the game for the average player that just wants to have a fun semi-competitive match.
When we had somewhat accurate matchmaking winstreak killer streamers whined until they got what we have now. That is, 95% matches where they don't have to break a sweat while reading chat and 4k'ing at 5 gens some poor players that just wanted to hop on for a couple matches after a long day of work.
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@NarkoTri1er said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3940811#Comment_3940811
highest MMR? Are you literally aware that the "highest MMR we are talking about is so easy to achieve that you can reach it with 200h only? This is like saying Gold-Platinum players in League of Legends are PRO players
Let me guess, it only counts as high mmr if its the dozens of cOmP dBd pLaYeRs that no one watches or cares about?
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@terumisan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3940030#Comment_3940030
new chapters bring in new people and the new people generally want to play the new killers
also if you're in high elo or at least played killer a lot in high mmr the game is heavily in the survivors favor
Mmm yes heavily in the survivors favor
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Just encountered this. Had to turn on the visual heartbeat for the first time ever just to have a chance at knowing she was nearby. Maxed out volume and the lullaby was barely audible. How has this not been addressed? Killers are exploiting this bug for a massive advantage.
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Coldwind maps are close to an auto-loss when every gym tile ends up spawning that crap with the extremely unsafe pallet in the middle of the loop and a barely usable window that may or may not spawn
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I noticed the same for Claire