Rey_512
Rey_512
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@xenotimebong said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1441113#Comment_1441113
This thread isn’t about what’s OP or game breaking or unwinnable, just what things people find unfun. A lot of people find facing SWF unfun. I don’t always agree, like I don’t agree with people who find Huntress unfun, but they’re entitled to their opinion.
Yes, we are entitled to opinions... but making false statements such as SWF “literally breaks the game” is where I’m going to speak up. That’s not an opinion because it’s simply not true.
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@coppersly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1440950#Comment_1440950
It doesn't matter if you're a swat team or not. It gives you an advantage over survivors who don't communicate via comms. With no downside, at all.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1440953#Comment_1440953
I love hearing "Rico Suavez" periodically while I'm powered up. It makes me feel stronger somehow.
10.) Survivors running to areas in a map where they know the killers power doesn't work because of bugs.
Yes, it gives you an advantage. Does it break the game? Not even close. I’ve watched tournaments of killers going against very good, strong teams and they can 4K, so it’s not something that makes the game unplayable/unwinnable for killers.
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@PerkyPerky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1440950#Comment_1440950
10-15% sure.
You play on xbox (which is a crappy console with no playerbase) and I have yet to see you stream live.
Crappy console with no playerbase? Ok, man... like you have data on that. I’m saying 10-15% for teams that I consider good because I feel that at least 4/5 games I go against mostly potato squads.
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Funny, I play SWF all the time and they usually suck despite being on comms. Or are you referring to that 10-15% of the playerbase that are SWAT teams?
But I’ll add to the topic:
6) 3 survivors escaping with a key when there is still 1 gen left.
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@NekoTorvic said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1440926#Comment_1440926
I honestly like the idea of her shards lighting up. It's subtle enough that you have to pay attention. It just needs to be a bit more noticeable and consistent across all cosmetics.
Agreed. Something subtle enough where you HAVE to be paying attention, but not so obvious that you can be running around like a headless chicken and still realize she’s phasing.
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@Snowbawlzzz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1440798#Comment_1440798
That last paragraph is a large part of my point. When Scott talks about why he finds deathslinger unfun, he paints deathslinger as having an assault rifle "he can just keep taking shots over and over again" when that's just not the case. Deathslinger has to slow down and reload after every single shot, and has plenty of counterplay in that you can bait out many shots around pallets. People also find being harpooned off a gen another example of him being "unfun" but if survivors had warning ahead of time he wouldn't be very good.
Deathslinger is fine because he’s slow as a turtle, has limited range and can’t damage you through safe pallets. Depending on where you get speared, he can’t damage you on mediocre pallets either.
Scott is entitled to his opinion, but Gunslinger is just tough to go against in chase. However, you CAN loop him around certain tiles and people pumping gens can offset his chase pressure.
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@NekoTorvic said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1440798#Comment_1440798
OMG finally someone who is sensible in this discussion XD
I'm so tired of people complaining about killers with "no counterplay" just because they refuse to learn their counterplay. I agree with everything you said. I do think spirit could use a visual queue when she starts phasing. However I wonder how many survivors will stand still at a pallet when they know she is phasing? like is it a good mind game for them to have but not a good mind game for her to have? But then again she can have a different mind game where the survivor will either vault or not vault so it could be interesting.
I don't think there's a single killer that has no counterplay right now. They just vary in difficulty.
Yeah, she just needs some kind of visual cue when starting phase (maybe a noticeable stance animation, not simply the animation “resetting” like some people claim). No further nerfs are needed.
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I agree that you can’t ONLY balance for the highest level of play - it’s easy enough to 4K all the casual SWF teams as it is.
The devs do have a tough job trying to find that sweet spot where the majority of the playerbase (casuals) can have fun and for one side (survivor or killer) of the higher skilled players to not get demolished.
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You’re both right and wrong, OP.
Fun should absolutely be considered when balancing a game like this. For example, nobody reasonable finds mechanics with ZERO counterplay (infinite mending Legion, deep wound timer going down DURING chase, etc.) fun. Before anyone says DS doesn’t have counterplay, yes it does - slugging and/or going for someone else. When you have absolutely zero options against a certain tactic then it becomes both unfun and unhealthy for the game. For example, camping Leatherface is not fun and I think that should be considered when balancing this killer (hopefully his new “charge mechanic” prevents this, but doesn’t seem likely).
However, Spirit is not an unfun killer just because she is difficult to play against. In fact, her stupidly good addons were nerfed to even the playing field. I think she’s in a good place right now, except for maybe giving her a more reliable visual tell when she’s phasing (I think we all agree that her Stand Still at Pallet “mindgame” is ridiculous as it requires no skill to do). Gunslinger is a great chase killer but, like Spirit, is 110% and map pressure starts lacking.
In conclusion, fun should be taken into account but for the right reasons. If a killer is unfun because a power/addon doesn’t have counterplay then it should be looked at. If a survivor just doesn’t want to learn how to face a certain killer because they require different counterplay, then NO - the killer is fine.
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I think some kind of overheat was needed, but my train of thought was around how he could camp indefinitely without a drawback. Same for Leatherface.
Addons absolutely needed to be reworked, no question.
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There’s no benefit to keeping Surveillance at Tier 1, unlike Discordance.
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It really gets annoying seeing the same topic across various threads... Everyone wants to make sure THEIR opinion is heard like if we haven’t heard it already.
Bring something new to the table or stick to the existing thread, please.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1438983#Comment_1438983
You were referring to outcry over not having explicitly LGBT characters in the game, which that person was not complaining about. Their complaint was about you.
I'll repeat myself ad nauseam if I must, until it really sinks in: there was no outcry about the lack of LGBT characters in the game. The only outcry came from people who don't want explicitly LGBT characters in the game.
So since you said this:
I don’t have a problem what gets added, just the unnecessary outcry if it doesn’t.
you must have no issue with anything that's actually happened.
Bro, are you reading the same posts I am? There’s people saying it’s WRONG if we don’t ALL push for equality in DBD.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1438879#Comment_1438879
The outcry came from people who don't want it, why are you ignoring that? There was no outcry to out the already-present LGBT characters. Mathieu had one conversation with one dude and that was it. Meanwhile, dozens of threads were opened from the people who're against the idea, usually with "unsavory" comments sprinkled in, yet nobody ever acknowledges that. I'll say again: the outcry came from people who don't want the devs to out already-present LGBT characters, not due to the lack of confirmation of which characters are LGBT and which aren't.
I’m not denying that happened, but I’m not a part of that group. I don’t even know who the existing gay character is or that it was hinted at, because the lore doesn’t matter to me enough to notice every detail.
The post I responded to in your quote of me seems like an outcry - saying we ALL should be pushing for something.
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@Netherstorm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437999#Comment_1437999
Again, what you are saying is so dumb. Everybody should care. Everybody should be making an effort to lift up the marginalized and to do their part to end oppression.
Honestly this comes off like you're mad that there's gay stuff in the game and, because you wouldn't include it, you think nobody else really wants it in there either. It's as if it's beyond your comprehension that some people care about other people.
This is why I can’t take some of you seriously... resorting to name calling to try and act like your opinion or thought process is superior to someone else’s.
And NO, not everyone needs to push for a “marginalized group” to be added to the game. IT’S A VIDEO GAME. Lore adds no value to the gameplay itself. You’re making this seem like if DBD doesn’t add an openly gay character then that group is being “oppressed “. Reality check, the game would continue just fine because DBD is about 4 survivors trying to escape a bloodthirsty killer, not to push agendas.
You can assume what you want of me - I’ve already said I don’t have a problem what gets added, just the unnecessary outcry if it doesn’t.
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@kate_best_girl said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1438164#Comment_1438164
I mean I really can't cause theres not that many videos of youtubers going against actually good Spirits
Well it wouldn’t matter what the skill of the Spirit it, this is simply a visual mechanic that you claim is easy to spot. Just post a random video of someone going against Spirit and timestamp a section of the video and what I should look for.
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@kate_best_girl said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1438075#Comment_1438075
Its perfectly reliable. Console doesn't stop animations trust me I literally used to mainly play on Xbox which is where I learned her counters.
Please show me video evidence of this perfectly reliable tell.
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@kate_best_girl said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1438053#Comment_1438053
I mean she already has a tell you just need to be attentive.
Yeah, not a reliable one - especially on console where the graphics and framerates are inferior to PC.
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The only tweak she needs is a bigger visual tell when she’s phasing. Nothing crazy, but enough to prevent the stupid “standing still mindgame” at pallets for attentive survivors.
NOTHING else needs to be nerfed. She already has a cooldown on phasing and she’s 110% movement speed.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437999#Comment_1437999
There is no agenda being pushed, just more lore being added with fewer self-imposed restrictions.
And I find no issue with that in itself.
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@Morfedel said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437840#Comment_1437840
I forgot about nurse's history and I didnt know about frank and julie; but even then, thats a fairly small number considering the number of characters in the game.
And really, people, I think its called "shipping" others, fans fabricating relationships between characters, irritate me. A horror survival game seems like a place where focusing on relationships isn't really important one way or the other.
But I dont know. I dont really care one way or the other either, it just seems strange to me.
Spot on. This game isn’t improved in any way by adding heterosexual or homosexual relationships to the lore or future characters. Hopefully the devs put more thought into future perks and making them fun and good rather than backstory of a new character and their sexual orientation.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437929#Comment_1437929
You didn't read the OP, did you? OP didn't even provide an answer to the question, it's a thread for discussing the subject. For the record, there have been way more threads complaining about this than supporting it. I would know, I posted in pretty much every single one.
It already happened naturally. There's at least one LGBT character already in the roster, according to the devs, whom they're going to "out". Note how nobody even noticed.
He asked the question “What do you think guys, why LGBT is so important for the devs...?”
I just replying that I don’t think they have a personal investment in pushing an LGBT agenda, just that they can make money off of a demographic so of course it’s important in that sense.
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@Netherstorm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437898#Comment_1437898
It is so weird to me that you would question their motives. What monetary gain?! "Our new killer is so gay!! Buy them now for just $5.99!"
I see a ton of gamers who seem to resent the inclusion of LGBT stuff in games. If anything, publishers probably lose money because of it.
I’m not questioning BHVR’s motives. Please re-read the context and what I’m replying to then come back if you have a question.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437898#Comment_1437898
Monetary gain and being inclusive are not mutually exclusive goals. You can do both.
I did mention monetary gain being the “primary goal” in one of posts, I understand both can be achieved simultaneously.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437828#Comment_1437828
Yup, just like the Spirit and Oni being Asian, it doesn't impact the game in any way, positively or negatively, except for those minorities that enjoy it. So overall, it's a good thing because it has no downside and makes some people happy.
Exactly. It just needs to happen naturally, not become an agenda with a million threads claiming why it’s important. One or two were cool but it’s becoming a repetitive back and forth affair.
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@Netherstorm said:
I feel like the premise here is so dumb that I shouldn't waste time answering it, but I'm going to assume some of you are really young and don't know any better.
The entire world is coming to a better understanding of what it is like to be LGBT, and the entire world has realized that LGBT people have been marginalized (at best) in so many ways throughout history. Now the entire world is trying to finally erase the stigma attached to LGBT persons - giving them the right to marry, educating people on what it means to be LGBT, and incorporating them into media. There are plenty of LGBT folks in real life, and therefore there should be plenty of LGBT folks in media.
The very idea that BHVR is going "Ooh let's make this guy gay, we;re gonna be rich!" is utterly ridiculous. Evidenced by this very thread, where quite a few people are seething with resentment over it.
This is not a trend. This is a step forward in world culture.
I didn’t read each comment so I can’t speak for others. Starting off by saying any kind of hate towards people who are gay is not right, although everyone is entitled to their disagreement with it due to religion or whatever. Obviously a lot of people would be mad if someone was creating threads about excluding gay content from the game, but I’m sure the people who say they are “seething with resentment” would be quick to attack them, call them names, etc.
Not sure who you directed your specific post to, but I’ll address the second to last paragraph. I don’t think anyone (at least not me) is saying BHVR will get rich by adding gay content, just that adding said content is for monetary gain - not because it’s important to be inclusive.
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@Volfawott said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437770#Comment_1437770
But it's not important to the game that's what I'm saying if it gets added it literally effects nothing.
If they add a sentence in the archives about whichever character being LGBT it doesn't really do much. People who wants the inclusion or care about that specific character get some insight into them. Because for them it is actually important.
People who don't care will look at that sentence in the archives and move on with the game because it's not important to them.
Ok, I agree with this - it’s not important to everyone, which means it’s not important to the game... just those who would like to see their small demographic represented.
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@Volfawott said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437707#Comment_1437707
It's a charity case of course they're not going to make money off it.
You can't sell people a charity in fact most of the time people have charity outfit it's usually just to entice people into actually supporting the charity.
Again, I’m still right. Unless there’s “Charity Pride Case” then any gay content means supporting that demographic isn’t the primary goal, money is. And there’s nothing wrong with that, but it doesn’t make LGBT “important to the game”.
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@PerkyPerky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437715#Comment_1437715
If that's you then congratz, I saw results of like 5 games only though, and I am a PC player so have no clue who DbD is on consoles, but those survivors look nothing like the once we usually go against.
Also, Otz plays 10 hours a day for like 5-6 days a week, is he really a good example?
My point still stands though: survivors are rewarded for being casuals and the game carries them a lot, to win survivors have to make mistakes, does not seem balanced and is totally survivor-sided.
I stream casually for friends, hence the lack of recent DBD content. I was also testing Pyramid Head and Nurse, 2 killers I have a combined 10 games experience with, but I also had a Doctor, Freddy, Plague and no-power Oni game in there. I agree the survivors weren’t the best but it was a full session of 4Ks.
Otz is a good example because practice makes perfect, or close to it. You can’t expect to be consistently good if you don’t play a lot.
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@PerkyPerky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437606#Comment_1437606
Oh yes I get it, everyone is rank 1 killer who 4ks every game, sure sure... Yet no one ever streams it to show me.
How are survivors uncounterable? Second chance perks are uncounterable as in example DS and Unbreakable which you admitted "Eat a ds" hence, uncounterable.
Super safe structures and god windows/vaults/loops that still exist are uncounterable.
Et cetra., that every killer player knows what I am talking about and does not have to ask.
Finally yes, I also manage to get 4ks a lot but it's because I outplay the survivors, not because the game is balanced (at all!). Like I said million times, survivors with no skills? No problem, they are casuals, perks play the game for them and gen speeds. Killer with good skills who actually spend the time to get them? Spit at his face. To also see how the game is survivor sided, try to play non-strong killer and see how it goes, I mean sure some killers are viable but the majority....?
I’m happy to stream for you to show what I’m talking about (ttv/majesticrey). Or you can watch guys like Otzdarva that destroy strong SWF squads daily.
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@Volfawott said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437673#Comment_1437673
Whether it's for profit purposes on night why does it matter if there's inclusion and people are happy with it just let it be.
They could say a character is LGBT or introduce a new LGBT character just for the Brownie points but if people are happy with the inclusion then it shouldn't be a problem people get the representation they want people who don't care about it won't be affected
My post is still accurate. If they release gay content it’s to make money, not because it’s “important” to be inclusive and appease a small demographic. Because it certainly won’t be free.
Charity Case is a good example of a DLC that actually reflects something BHVR actually cares about. Yes, we pay for it but BHVR isn’t making profit from it (I think).
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This topic again... Lol. This is a VIDEO GAME, not a political/ideology movement. Gay content isn’t critical or important to this game, just like heterosexual content isn’t important. Money is important, however.
Even if BHVR has LGBT employees themselves, releasing gay content is MOSTLY for profit purposes as it will likely involve pride clothing that a certain demographic will be quick to purchase it.
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@PerkyPerky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1435328#Comment_1435328
DS slug, unbreakable don't slug... Okay.. If you played any killer you would know one survivor uses them both.
If you also played killer you would know when you hit the unhooker, the unhooke gets aim-priority and so therefor he gets hit (game is survivor sided what can we do?).
Lots of survivors gameplay is uncounterable, give me one killer gameplay that can not be countered?
Edit: kill all survivors before all gens are complete. Good luck doing that against a non-potato team. Play some killer maybe?
I play a lot of killer and survivor, as killer I 4K a majority of the time. Yes, sometimes a combo of strong perks can screw me against good teams but I find that it tends to be more on unbalanced maps like Ormond or Fractured Cowshed with a million strong loops.
You also know DS and Unbreakable can only be used once. Even though Unbreakable has the secondary effect of quicker recovery, it still requires someone to get off a gen to save them. Hate DS and don’t want to slug? Eat it after first hook then tunnel them later.
How is “lots of survivor gameplay uncounterable”? What about mindgaming the survivors at loops? Using a killer’s power can be considered uncounterable as well... Spirit’s phasing, accurate hatchets/spear gun shots, etc. Both sides have stuff that can be tough to outplay based on each other’s skill.
It’s about knowing various things that can’t be explained in one post: game management, when to drop chases, keep a mental picture of where survivors are based on last known location, understanding how survivors think and what pathing they’ll take or where they’ll go. A comprehensive understanding of the game’s psychology can help you overcome even strong survivor perks.
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@PerkyPerky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1433489#Comment_1433489
Little child with absolutely no clue how to discuss like an adult. Typical survivor main.
Why even post if you don't want people to respond? Oh wait, you want people to say "yeah you are right!" just like you want killers to use perks you want, play the way you want, and let you escape all games? Entitled selfish spoiled kids with no consideration to the killer as a human being and his fun, no wonder daddy BHVR caters to them.
It has nothing to do with being a survivor main, there petulant children (or adults who act childish) on both sides.
@ZtarShot Killers get mad because they don’t know how to counter them, even though it’s simple:
1) DS - slug, go for rescuer
2) BT - don’t camp, go for rescuer
3) Unbreakable - don’t slug
4) Adrenaline - run NOED, kill survivors before all gens are completed
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@Seiko300 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1424791#Comment_1424791
Alright, so as one of the (probably rare few) people on this forums who took the time to at least watch the beginning of that second video, I want to point out that second video ironically highlights the exact reasons why Fnaf shouldn't be in the game despite the fact that it's so often ironically tossed around these forums as "proof" it's "a good game" and a "Scary game" that fits into Dead By Daylight.
Here are the following quotes that I'll be using -
"It's all so spooky! It is you just feel helpless"
"Something about the elements of this particular version of the game was all in the unknown, you can't see it, you don't get a good look at em, like you know he's coming but you don't really know what's going on there."
"Just look at the angles that were chosen for this game. God, the first one is a masterpiece, it really is, it really is, it's so efficiently made. It is such an efficient experience, it is exactly what it needs to be and no more, period."
These are honest to god reasons why Fnaf shouldn't be in the game, from the mouth of "The King Of Five Night's At Freddy's" himself.
- "You just feel helpless"
- This is one of the primary reasons that people (specifically Fnaf's target audience) are captivated by and afraid when they play the game. You are locked in one position, you can't run, you can't hide, your back is against the wall and all you have are some lights, some doors and some cameras. This does not fit with the tone and gameplay of Dead By Daylight, it is in fact directly contradictory of it, while fnaf may be a "revolutionary indie horror game" Dead By Daylight is a classic slasher experience. You both run and hide from a killer who is hunting you down. Sometimes, in rare cases (although not so rare in today's meta) you can even fight back with perks like Decisive Strike, Head On, etc. something that clearly and blatantly goes against fnaf's core gameplay.
- So if you like fnaf, play fnaf, it's an entirely different and unique experience from Dead by Daylight it doesn't have to join Dead by Daylight for you to enjoy it. In fact it will likely do the exact opposite of what people who are fans would think it would do, instead of liking it more you'll probably end up liking it less.
- "Something about the elements of this particular version of the game was all in the unknown"
- There is no unknown here in Dead By Daylight, at least not for Fnaf. Fnaf might be creepy because of it's setting, it proposes the hypothetical of a real life serial killer who murdered children and stuffed their bodies into suits. In this way the story of Fnaf is kind of grounded (if you ignore all the parts about spirits, robots becoming sentient and coming to life, conspiracy theories that run deep etc.) and as a player you're wondering "what is going on" but in Dead by Daylight we know exactly what's going on. Roughly. The killer, springtrap in this case, would have been taken by the entity to do it's bidding and that's it, you're not an "average security guard working a night shift stuck in a supernatural nightmare" you're a survivor who's been stuck in a purgatory-like cycle of death for an unspecified amount of time . You know what to expect, you know what's happening, there's no unknown to scare you here.
- "you can't see it, you don't get a good look at em, like you know he's coming but you don't really know what's going on there."
- This is another reason why Fnaf doesn't work with Dead By Daylight. Fnaf relies heavily on the obscured vision you're given through the security cameras to heighten the tension of the game. You can't quite clearly make out the shadowy figures that stand in the hallway through the darkness and the static on the screen, and that makes the game scarier. In Dead By Daylight, there are no such restrictions to your view, the maps aren't impossibly dark and in fact most of them are brightly moonlit, one even has the sun just barely beginning to crest at Twilight shining over the map.
- Because of this you would see springtrap or whatever fuzzy animatronic it is, in broad moonlight. And unlike what mark says that makes the game scary, you would get a good look at them, you would know they're coming and you would know exactly what's going on. Fnaf is supposed to be scary because of the unnatural and unknown way that the animatronics slowly or quickly approach you, how are they moving that fast between rooms and cameras? You don't know, the game doesn't answer that, it's part of the horror aspect. But in Dead By Daylight you would know, and you would very clearly see these fuzzy robots running around in circles after you at your average loop.
- "you can't see it, you don't get a good look at em, like you know he's coming but you don't really know what's going on there."
- There is no unknown here in Dead By Daylight, at least not for Fnaf. Fnaf might be creepy because of it's setting, it proposes the hypothetical of a real life serial killer who murdered children and stuffed their bodies into suits. In this way the story of Fnaf is kind of grounded (if you ignore all the parts about spirits, robots becoming sentient and coming to life, conspiracy theories that run deep etc.) and as a player you're wondering "what is going on" but in Dead by Daylight we know exactly what's going on. Roughly. The killer, springtrap in this case, would have been taken by the entity to do it's bidding and that's it, you're not an "average security guard working a night shift stuck in a supernatural nightmare" you're a survivor who's been stuck in a purgatory-like cycle of death for an unspecified amount of time . You know what to expect, you know what's happening, there's no unknown to scare you here.
- "Just look at the angles that were chosen"
- This goes hand in hand with the previous point, it's not just the poor lighting or the obstructed view caused by static that makes Fnaf what it is. The fixed angles from which the cameras are placed that provide a limited view of your surroundings also adds to the mystery and tension of what may or may not be taking place beyond the views of the cameras. This will not be so in Dead By Daylight, you will be looking directly at springtrap or whoever else as you loop the killer.
- "It is such an efficient experience, it is exactly what it needs to be and no more, period."
- This is the end all be all of the possibility of Fnaf getting into Dead By Daylight. At the end of the day these two titles are far to dissimilar to be even remotely compatible and if Fnaf ever were introduced into Dead By Daylight it would at the cost of literally everything that the fans fell in love with about the game in the first place. You would have to sacrifice all it's tension, mystery, jumpscares, and theme to integrate it into Dead By Daylight simply because Dead By Daylight does each of these things in a far more different way than Fnaf. It's tense in other aspects, it has it's own mysteries and lore that make it interesting, the fear in the game isn't always reliant on jumpscares, and the general theme and tone of the game is so drastically different it amazes me that there's a push for the integration of such a chapter in the first place.
- This is one of the primary reasons that people (specifically Fnaf's target audience) are captivated by and afraid when they play the game. You are locked in one position, you can't run, you can't hide, your back is against the wall and all you have are some lights, some doors and some cameras. This does not fit with the tone and gameplay of Dead By Daylight, it is in fact directly contradictory of it, while fnaf may be a "revolutionary indie horror game" Dead By Daylight is a classic slasher experience. You both run and hide from a killer who is hunting you down. Sometimes, in rare cases (although not so rare in today's meta) you can even fight back with perks like Decisive Strike, Head On, etc. something that clearly and blatantly goes against fnaf's core gameplay.
This is the analysis I wanted to do, but don’t have time for. +1 Vote Up.
- "You just feel helpless"
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@NightmareReborn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1425133#Comment_1425133
I think that Scott has an amazing story going for FNaF. He just intentionally doesn't spoon feed it to the fans because, well, that's for them to figure out. Yes, it can lead to things being somewhat convoluted, but Scott always makes sure to steer people to the right track.
As for the retcon, I feel like it also would have been a good idea to mention that Scott also said this: "To be clear, the one retcon mentioned was integrated pretty seamlessly, and most people didn't notice. If it had caused problems or confusion then I would have addressed it here [in a reddit post]."
I'm not saying FNaF is some Shakespearean literary masterpiece by any means, but it has a lot more of a story that what people give it credit for.
The story is basically a guy that murdered some kids and now the spirits of said kids possess the animatronics. And I think the original murder possesses one too (Springtrap)?
I personally don’t see that as an “amazing story”. If the developer has to come out and steer his audience, that’s poor storytelling.
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@NursesBootie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1424703#Comment_1424703
And if it's a 58 second DS that i can't predict, because i downed and hooked two other people in that time? DS is definitly NOT fine until situations where it gets clearly used offensively are patched out by additional conditions.
If you’ve hooked 2 people within 60 seconds then you’re doing great and DS is the least of your problems. I don’t see what the issue is.
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@bredbeddle said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1424380#Comment_1424380
I think that the whole point of FNAF's lore is that it's not explained in game. Having to piece it together through a blend of in-game content and ARG-style clue hunting lends the lore a certain character that is, in my opinion, fascinating. But that's neither here nor there, I suppose. We're talking about springtrap, not FNAF as a whole.
If putting together the lore yourself is what you find exciting and makes the game more fun that’s great! However that doesn’t change the fact that the “established” lore is half-assed. Leaving it to the audience in the manner FNAF does is not a masterpiece, it’s lazy. But lazy doesn’t mean boring, as I’ve already stated - it just means that you can enjoy the game for what it is: a jumpscare/strategy game with enough backstory to keep you hooked.
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@NightmareReborn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1423948#Comment_1423948
I'm going to copy and paste an older response I had to another comment because I feel like it could also address something here.
If I were to guess, when you think of cringey let's players, I bet one of the first ones that came to mind was Markiplier. This was Markiplier's first ever let's play on FNaF:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOztnsBPrAA
Many people criticize him here for acting immature and child like, and faking his reactions while being scared. This video was posted almost 6 full years ago, and people still largely credit it today for the child like audience that FNaF supposedly has, but I think there's a HUGE chunk of information that people tend to leave out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UADsp88ZW14
Copied and pasted: "Linked here is Markiplier's video where he plays FNaF 1 in 2020, about 2 months ago. I have no clue if you actually watched the video already, but if you haven't already, I want you to think about what you expect to see. In his first playthrough, people see mark act more childlike, and get scared easily (which made people think he was faking being scared). Now watch this video, does any of that hold up today?
No, not in any capacity. In this video, he takes a deeper look at the game, viewing it through more of a nostalgic and objective light. He's not screaming. He's not faking being scared. He's enjoying the game for the experience it provides, while talking about how far the franchise as a whole has come. This is actual proof of how the fanbase has matured over time, and I know that Markiplier doesn't exemplify absolutely everyone, but it's definitely representative of a good chunk of the FNaF community, atleast according to the people that hold Markiplier accountable for creating FNaF's, supposedly, childlike demographic.
It's sad to see how much unjustified hate FNaF gets, and I'm not talking about the people who simply don't like it, but rather the people who rehash the same reasons why FNaF is bad to them, then refuse to listen to criticisms."
Again, I am not bashing the game itself nor its fans/players/streamers... I am simply stating that the “lore” is not anything to write home about.
What I am against are the claims that there is a “rich” lore behind the half-assed stories that Scott is trying to tell, which has gone through at least ONE retcon. Scott Cawthorn’s OWN words:
“The truth is that I've done one actual retcon in the series (although I'm not going to say where it was).“
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@NursesBootie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1422280#Comment_1422280
What if the rescuer got actuve DS too? Well, ggwp huh?
Smack him to the ground and now you’ve got a slug next to a hook. Perfect situation. If he already got the unhook then slug him until it’s been 60 seconds.
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@Citrusfruit said:
The problem with this is that it would create a higher queue time for survivors and killers which is a huge negative for both sides. It's also important to note that not every swf group is full of pros. I'd bet that half the groups you suspect to be solos is just inexperienced swfs.
I understand the frustration and where you're coming from. It's not fun to play killer against survivors that understand the structures and how safe maps are against killers that aren't top tier. You're not going to win every game as killer or survivor, but every loss is a learning experience. You should...
- Find what you could've done better without beating yourself up over it.
- Spread pressure early. You can't afford to find one survivor with most killers and immediately dedicate to that single survivor in most situations. Get a hit and move on. Try to locate at least the two other teammates and try to get them injured so the others have to spend time healing while you chase and down a survivor
- Just keep trying and with time you'll become more experienced and better equipped to deal with the few top tier swfs out there.
Perfect response.
And what a horrible idea, OP. Get better at the game because not all killers are losing the majority of their games to SWF.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1424380#Comment_1424380
Can't argue with you there. It does feel that Fnaf let their fans write the lore and just went with it
Dark Souls could be seen similarly but it actually has cutscenes, dialog with the main NPCs, and item descriptions that help piece just enough for you to get an idea of what’s going on in the world.
Yes, there’s tons of fan theories in DS but unlike FNAF it has in-game facts to help support some of those.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1423948#Comment_1423948
I mean you could say the same about DbD. Streamer publicity happens with every game these days.
I'm not an avid fnaf player myself and i would much rather see killers like chucky or jason in the game, you know the actual slasher horror classics.
But what i've heard from other people there is an entire story of a child murderer in there with Scott hiding clue's in the source code of teaser pictures of upcoming games and whatsnot.
I'm sure someone else here that actually played it could explain it better then me but from my understanding there was an entire easteregg hunt to uncover the story behind it.
You don't have to like the games but saying it has no lore is like saying dark souls had no challenge. It's just plain wrong.
No amount of streamer publicity would make what's bassicly the same jumpscare simulator over and over again this popular if there wasen't something more to it
The thing is I never claimed DBD has a great lore or deep backstory. It has enough to explain certain killer’s powers, which is acceptable to me. I don’t like DBD for the lore, I like it for the gameplay.
You’re right, FNAF has “lore” but it’s poorly put together since it depends massively on fan theories without in-game textual descriptions or cutscenes to help piece it together.
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@Honkerton said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1423941#Comment_1423941
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1423948#Comment_1423948
Rey gets it. Fnaf got famous because of lets players and their gaggle of 11 year old followers. I'm not trying to take away from you FNaF if you like it but you can't deny the majority of people who like it are in the age group between 7 and 13.
Thanks, @Honkerton!
Same - I have nothing against people that like that game... it’s just not a game that is know for great lore/storytelling. If you’re a fan, accept it for what it is... a cheap jumpscare game with enough backstory to explain the setting. Kind of like Emily Wants to Play meets Chuck E Cheese’s.
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@Sonzaishinai said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1423920#Comment_1423920
Lore is like the only thing that Fnaf has...
It's the whole treasure hunt and lore discussions that made it popular in the first place.
How did you think it got popular? It's stellar gameplay?
It got popular because of people flocking to Lets Play channels of adults exaggerating the jumpscares in order to seem “funny” and attract viewers.
From what I’ve seen, there is no established/consistent lore. A purple 8-bit man walking around? What a great way to explain a backstory.
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Realistically? Trapper 100%. BHVR would definitely use their banner character for a movie.
My preference would be for Hag, as her backstory, setting and power would be great for a typical horror movie.
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People still claim FNAF has “lore”? 😂
I also have no idea who Baldi is but he has my vote over Springtrap.
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@Ghost_Face_Main said:
Clown is my first main, so he holds sentimental value to me. He's not that weak either, you just need to know how to pressure chases, as Clown can dominate in chases already. Plus Clown naturally has a bigger area of effect with his bottles (depending on his throw) compared to Freddy. Freddy can kiss it with his tiny snares.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/L1JZXKENKJCB/img-20200430-222058.jpg
Careful @Ghost_Face_Main. The devs said on stream that Clown is “underrated” and received a ton of backlash.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1422323#Comment_1422323
I like how you start with "It's impossible to have a civil discussion (...)" and ends with "(...) you're probably just bad."
I like how I word my posts as well, glad someone is on the same page.
And when I say “you”, I’m not directing that at the OP.
My last statement is true. If you’re a bad killer you will lose to even potato SWFs. If you’re decent, you’ll win most of your games. SWF isn’t as big of a problem... skill is a bigger factor.
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@Paciel said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1422323#Comment_1422323
I don't agree that it is cheating, and I fully acknowledge I'm not good at the game! That's why I want a separation of casual and competitive. It is possible to have civil discussion, I'm having it right now with you!
Unfortunately a separation of casual and competitive would result in longer queue times.