RainehDaze
RainehDaze
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@Raptorrotas said:
Well, we could simply remove the option of NOT having items in a round. Removing brown items from the bloodweb and giving all survivors a infinitely useable version in the inventory basekit. Technically we could go a step further and remove all different versions of an item and move the lost power into addons: 1 "power/items", multiple addon rarities. This would turn survivor item balancing somewhat similiar to killer addons, except survivors having multiple "powers" which would need to be shown to newbs so they dont get confused at the start.
When survivors have to bring an item into the trial, the trial can be balanced around survivors having items. Obviously, the addon gap would still exist but thats the same on the killer side.
to be fair, the gap between 'brown item' and 'purple item with two addons', multiplied through four times, does (provided it's not the incompetent flashlight squad) work out to considerably more significant than the effects of two killer addons. BHVR has been really insistent about trying to make newer iri ones more gameplay-changing and less "here is a massive numerical buff" (MDR really needs looking at from that perspective); but then you still have BNP going around, and the syringe wanders into the same camp. Or ye old gap between 'brown toolbox, no addons' and 'engineer's toolbox, double charge increase'.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3296208#Comment_3296208
THIS THREAD IS LITERALLY ASKING FOR CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM
no ask, only give!
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@TheMruczek said:
Yes but it won't be easy for sure.
Like take MDR. How can you effectivly nerf this add-on and then keep it's ridiculous speed.
And medkits as well. The game could die if Devs would nerf them too hard
The obvious nerf is to make the downside a cost elsewhere in the ability, rather than relying on blinding the Spirit a little bit more as a tradeoff. It's not really a complicated thing.
And I don't think 'yes' really addresses the issue. What would it look like, if no items and pimped-out items were in a somewhat balanced state?
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@Cassiopeiae said:
As killer you only depend on yourself. As a survivor other people's bs can screw you over. Of course killer is easier.
Also contrary to other people, I play killer to destress, really have no idea why so many people find it stressful.
A couple of reasons. The first is, obviously, that the entire time you're playing, there's no downtime. It's hard to think of any other game (multiplayer or not) where you can't stop to catch your breath and assess what's going on for even a few seconds. There's no real period in the Killer gameplay loop that consists of just doing without having to think--even in the Hold W situation, you're still required to pay attention to surroundings and survivor position (never mind all the various notifications that might come up).
So--every match is done without pause, that's a level of intensity that's more stressful.
Everything resting on you tends to lead to a more stressful experience for most, just because all failure is therefore your fault. And see above about how there's no time to catch your breath? Failure in a chase doesn't give you chance to reset and think; you're not a Survivor sitting on the ground or hook and waiting for a rescue. Lack of breathing space can really compound it when things are going badly.
And then there's just the obvious: there are four people on the other team. The odds that any one of the other players in the game is going to start being toxic towards you shoots way up.
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@versacefeng said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3292388#Comment_3292388
Please stop going back and forth. You continuing on with an argument you already lost hurts my brain.
I wouldn't say he lost the argument.
The only reason OP can claim that the person wasn't trying to win is because of postgame stuff, not because of in-game actions. Because, and this is the entire point, intentionally not killing and extremely defensive and unconfident gameplay look identical.
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@StarLost said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291845#Comment_3291845
Bingo.
There are, and have been perks/items that are completely, brokenly OP or just so unfun to play against that they may as well have been (prenerf OoO, DH, post buff Thana and BO, keys, moris) but with a few minor outliers, this game isn't bad balance wise now.
I'd much rather see bad perks be improved or reworked at this point.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291852#Comment_3291852
PR was good because of the way it synergized with DMS and because it gave info. It's still very good with DMS, and pretty mediocre without due to the removal of the info aspect. I still use it on slower/setup killers as I need the time, but exclusively with DMS.
Right now though, we're back in a kicky meta. And that's fine. People complained endlessly about PR too back when it was meta.
Yeah, the DMS reliance to get value out of it is why I don't use it; haven't gotten around to doing Deathslinger yet.
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It's funny how many suggestions about nerfing eruption's timer want to make it worse than the pre-buff eruption.
(I'm also not sure PR is fine; it has better regression than Jolt, but it's now finicky to activate, has limited uses per-match, and is most likely to only add ~10s to the gen that's already being worked on, which often barely covers getting to said gen if you know where it is. I feel like it's only used that much because the number of consistent options has steadily been whittled down.)
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291736#Comment_3291736
Entity blocking would also work, though that still kind of just leaves survivors hit by it with the singular option of "don't repair". Still, I suppose they could go find an unaffected generator, so that's still an improvement.
Personally, I think making it more of an information perk is more thematic to Nemesis and gives far more direct use than only stalling, but I'd be okay with entity blocking or even an entirely different effect. I just think the Incapacitated has to go in order for this perk to be balanced right- just making that timer shorter risks making it never run again, I'd like to see the troublesome part excised and replaced with something healthier.
Yeah, they can't repair that gen, but they're able to repair other gens, and don't run into incapacitated's "no healing, no totems, no nothing" aspect.
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Entity blocking instead of incapacitation would be more in-keeping with what it does, and not turn its secondary effect into a really weirdly timed aura reveal--you down someone, then find out people are working on a generator half the map away? That's only of use for slugging.
Plus, this way it equalises solo queue and SWF in a different way: neither of them can dodge or immediately negate the regression, but it's not also an information perk (and it doesn't doubly punish solos with extra regression).
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@bm33 said:
Snowmen seem unnecessary this year. Way people are playing can't really enjoy them. Try to go give a high five and you get hit out of them. Killers just seem super angry seeing them even though they can injure survivors in them and the can get BP for giving high fives in them.
Wish the gens gave everyone BP when they are finished so those stuck in a chase unable to touch a gen weren't losing out on event BP. Bummer missing out on BP and it just encourages people to chose staying on a gen instead of rescuing someone so they don't miss out on bonus BP.
Barely getting any event items in the bloodwebs.
Wish the challenges encouraged more relaxed attitudes for both sides like "hop in X snowmen" or "give x high fives" but instead "finish x gens" requires Survivors to be more gen focused which makes killers play more sweaty.
Overall pretty disappointing/meh event. I'm just going to get my challenges done for cosmetics and then play holiday event in different game.
is that what the snowflakes are?
I was wondering why we were spinning around.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3291356#Comment_3291356
I also play on headphones, but the 3d positional works just fine for me. For what it's worth, they are 7.1 surround sound headphones. Up and down doesn't work obviously...surround sound setups don't really do vertical.
Uh... not doing up and down immediately disqualifies you from 3d positioning. Headphone stereo can tell you exactly what direction a sound is coming from.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
It just started doing that for me this past patch for global audio such as music or menu sound effects. Really throws me off. Usually it feels "fuller" through all my 3d drivers, but for whatever reason now they are only playing from the stereo drivers.
I play with headphones, and I'm referring to the fact that people who are literally right above you give audio cues as if adjacent.
I really don't get why this is a thing when there are entire multi-layered maps.
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It doesn't really help that there's only, like, one direct non-ignorable slowdown perk that isn't focused around regression and downing survivors to even come into play. And that's Deadlock (corrupt intervention is now on the 'I delete myself' train).
I don't want to play slowdown, particularly, but I do want to have fewer potential games that are 'survivors split up efficiently, no 3gen happens, the game has been decided after two minutes unless the rescuers lose their brains'. It isn't super common, but it feels common enough to encourage running brakes to have chance to actually have chases.
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it's fun to have wesker slowly amble after people in a snowman
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Am I the only person who ran into people playing around with the snowmen? Also doing the game, but snowmen.
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Are the old links going to be turned into redirects?
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It'd be nice if there was an option for someone I play more, or at least a related perk.
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Hm, Shadowborn has a decent effect, but the fact it's a perk might make it the worst just by being something that should be in the options menu instead.
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@Nazzzak said:
Looking at this from a different perspective - BHVR, like other companies, are about making money. To date, they have had these older cosmetics readily available to make money from all year around. Yet they've still decided to make them seasonal only. Any chance that their data shows that the only time anyone really purchases these Christmas themed cosmetics is during the Christmas month? So rather than clutter the store with cosmetics that don't sell for 11 months of the year, they've simply decided to make them special and exclusive to that one month where they actually sell anyway?
the eternal question that raises is how various pyjama costumes become christmas themed
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@sulaiman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288381#Comment_3288381
And yet, she has higher kill rates in high mmr than in low mmr. So what do you think why that might be?
because dbd doesn't actually have the most granular MMR ever, and bizarre things like the condemned build are effective, but they're also not the way the Killer is actually designed to be played so it's really a matter of time (maybe a long time, but a matter of time).
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288553#Comment_3288553
its part of her skill-cap. Its just at base-kit, the duration of invis for both periodic invisibility and the manifest invisibility is non-existent. As a result, the skill-cap for her ability barely exists without add-on's. It is little bit like spirit phase-walk without the spirit phase-walk speed. Once again, Lots of potential for interesting survivor gameplay. All wasted though as always.
There are good and bad ways to introduce skill caps.
A bad way is 'the only cue we put in for you to use this thing in mind-games is some subtle visuals in your peripheral vision'. Using this flickering is good.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288485#Comment_3288485
onepumpwillies is sadako main that recently discovered that iri-tape is so strong that you can use her TV only and not slug at all but still condemn survivors more reliably with bloody finger nails with iri tape. Its interesting because I used to use bloody finger nails+ring drawing because I would run out of iri tapes to play her. so in truth, you can actually play her without slugging.
I found it to be unrewarding because I felt like I was killing survivors using in-animate objects(TV exclusively) where the hits meant nothing and condemn stacks meant everything. Its my pet-peeve with playing Michael Myer's tombstone and head-pop pig. I dislike how other two killers have so little agency on how well they play and how much agency is put into staring at survivors & automatic instant kill system of jigsaw boxes. I like the act of hunting for my power to be super effective through my smart play instead of letting the power do everything for me automatically. Sadako is closest thing to earning an over-time mori in the game.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288439#Comment_3288439
the dev balance off kill-rates. sadako in all-mmr chart has 63% kill-rate which is among top 3 killers in the game. in top 5% mmr chart, she was in top 9 killers(61%). dev do balance exclusively off kill-rate, hence why sadako is not getting any changes.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288456#Comment_3288456
She has timed flickering at loops. Its just not very good at base-kit. I somewhat showcase a image when she was released about this strength. Otz made a video about where he talks about Reiko's watch. If you use Reiko's watch+News paper add-on, you can time your flicker in a loop and just as flicker ends, you can briefly extend it by manifesting(de-cloaking) to get one long string of invisibility. Its pretty gimmick anti-loop because her invisibility has directional ringing which tells you which way sadako went but less attentive survivors(lesser skilled) will get confused. Otz made video about Reiko's watch but I cannot find it for some reason. She does have potential chase power, but as usual, her base-kit balance is not very good.
The flickering is also a complete pain to keep track of when playing. You have... hands to look at. Hands. That's all you have to go on, at the edge of your screen, in a chase.
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@Regulus47 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288542#Comment_3288542
I wouldn't mind if they changed up condemned a little bit, because it's definitely the weakest part of her power, but I've seen so many people suggest outrageous buffs to it that honestly I wonder if it's worth the hassle. Like, people suggesting you should gain a stack of condemned after getting hit when sadako manifests, or that you get status effects like exhausted and exposed for having even a few condemned stacks, or the worst of all, letting her SEE your stacks and know when to TV-tunnel you out by spamming teleports when you're close to being condemned. It's a volatile mechanic.
Not so sure about the other aspects of her kit though. You buff her teleport cooldowns and not only does she instantly become incredibly oppressive and the best mobility killer in the game by far, but her ability to spam teleports to force condemned becomes almost unstoppable. And the lullaby is barely audible anyway over gen sounds, never understood why people make such a fuss over it. It's there because she enters stealth instantly with no cooldown of limitations, unlike ghostface, with no speed penalty, unlike pig, and has no loud sound cue, like wraith. She needs some limitation on it or she's the best stealth killer on top of all her other strengths.
Cooldown of "longer than it takes to do a gen from 0 with no speed boosts" is way too far on the other side of cooldown problems. And ties in to why Condemned only normally comes into play when built around with weird healing builds.
It's supposed to be a slowdown effect and only rarely lead to kills, but it just seems to exist in a land of being totally ignored because the best way to stop Sadako from teleporting is to let her teleport and be screwed by her own power. Except for the iri addon, which would be a great incentive for hit and run if the TVs didn't also lean so much into "actually better for intercepting in chase than getting over to gens".
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I don't know if it's necessarily a buff, but she needs some sort of QoL pass on the actual teleport side of her powers. Super long cooldowns if you use them, facing away from the objectives, Survivors can create a huge deadzone if they care (and honestly, I only ever see them do that when there's a big open space between the gen they're working on and the TV) and don't want to just have you use them up yourself, etc.
And I really don't get why she has a lullaby.
Oh, and all the addons that are fixated on Survivors interacting with TVs, which they really don't. There needs to be more incentive to do that aside from the occasional teleport shutdown. Slugging and ring drawing tactics aren't a good way to have condemned come into play.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288460#Comment_3288460
Iri Tape doesn't even fix that issue though. It turns on the last 4 TVs that were teleported to- any turned off by survivors don't (or shouldn't, anyway) turn back on.
Oh yeah, forgot it was just the ones you teleported to. Does help her a little if she teleports around before someone goes around deactivating half her power set for the next minute, though.
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@MadEyePopo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288439#Comment_3288439
I may not be a good survivor but I rarely escape Sadako and most games end up being a 4K. I have never played her as killer but to me she seems really strong. I have never watched vids on how to counter Sadako so maybe that could help me.
hold w
Oh, and if you get one tape, you can go around turning off as many TVs as you like to build up condemned, then deposit your tape to reduce it. Creating a deadzone where she can't teleport in chase or even get over is entirely possible (and thus her reliance on the iri tape offering)
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@indieeden7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288429#Comment_3288429
I have to strongly disagree, the only thing stopping Sadako being the second most infuriating killer to play against is the fact that Iri Tape isn't basekit. If anything I'd be happy for them to just reduce the cooldown of each TV to like 60 seconds instead.
Then she'd need something to do in chase, because "I can get into chases in an area but after that I'm just an M1 killer who has the worst vision over loops of everyone" is not a functional powerset.
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@DragonMasterDarren said:
Don't get me wrong, as someone who doesn't care about the skins being made limited, i do understand where people are coming from (skins that have existed in the store for over a year should not suddenly be changed to be limited, that's just being a dick for the sake of being a dick), but at the same time, BHVR are a corporation, a corporation that is significantly nicer to both its employees and its customers sure, but a corporation nonetheless, and corporations exist for one reason and one reason only, to make money, and they will do so in any way they see fit that isn't explicitly illegal, and yelling about this on a public forum or Twitter will not change that
It's best to save your energy when it comes to stuff like this, hurt their bottom line in whatever way possible and they might change their minds
I can't not spend money I wasn't going to spend in the first place, so the best I can do is criticise it in public and hope it changes somebody else's mind.
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@indieeden7 said:
I'd be happy to see her buffed if Iri Tape was removed, that add-on is insane reward for literally 0 risk
Honestly, the thing should be basekit. I dunno, remove the TVs automatically coming on? If your entire thing is teleporting near to people and doing hit and run, it shouldn't come with a 100s timer even if people don't bother turning the bloody things off.
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@fogdonkey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288021#Comment_3288021
Most people who complain just say that they don't like the change, explain that it was not time limited and now it is, explain all the shard changes etc.
One thing that they don't tell is why does it particularly matter to them. So why???
Do all of you have FOMO issues? Or you just know a friend who has a friend who has a FOMO issue and you are very worried about them?
I've had bad experiences in other games, and while that's not a problem for me here, it does mean having sympathy for people that this change in tactic is going to negatively impact.
And, y'know, disappointment with BHVR for this change in course.
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@HoodedWildKard said:
She has literally the highest killrate across all MMRs. And every time I come up againstbone they are mad good, stealth killer with teleportation. And a very small profile, plus flickering in and out causes survs to make a lot of mistakes in chase.
And Nurse has basically the lowest. Looking at killrates in isolation is meaningless without looking at why that might be.
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@scenekiller said:
Tell that to all the people who play her and all the survivors from her killrate
People like to pretend she's bad because they treat this game like esports and lost to a couple of SWFs with her - but the truth is, she's fun to play and very good against most casuals (which is a majority of the survivor playerbase)
But... she is bad? Played 'normally', Condemned won't even come into it because the only way it builds up is that slow†. Her stealth is amongst the worst of all stealth killers, because she still has a lullaby to announce her presence and is intermittently visible even before she very slowly manifests.
Her primary ability is some minor ability to mindgame loops a little more (which doesn't even entirely make up for the manifestation), and arguably the worst teleport power of everyone in the game that has one, because the targets always point away from generators and can be entirely disabled (and will stay off for up to 100s if she dares touch it). Although she's able to chain them unlike Freddy, but the per-spot cooldown is worse than his overall cooldown, so...
For the overwhelming majority of her gameplay, she's a barebones M1 Killer that's expected to do hit and run but can have all her map pressure turned off.
† Someone basically needs to run from TV to TV without ever addressing it and having Sadako teleport to all of them. Otherwise, if the cooldown cycles and player locations sync up wrong, you get it taking 12+ minutes to possibly come into it, by which point the game is almost definitely over.
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"The gist of it is, is that I just don't understand how a lot of people on the forums feel such incredible mental anguish over an ultimately trivial item in a game."
Pretty simple: it's not really anguish over the in-game item, it's anger at BHVR for constantly moving towards a less player-friendly, more freemium-like model. This is the same company that once gave out a few items saying that they weren't happy with the idea of exclusives, and all rift cosmetics would eventually be in the shop...
And now the rift cosmetics still aren't, there were Prime exclusives, they're running limited time events, they're making previously unlimited skins limited, and employing the least palatable sales tactics to do so.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288190#Comment_3288190
Doesnt matter. My point still stands.
I mean, I don't think it does? We can perfectly well make an argument about how FOMO as a tactic is used for sales when there are literally sites devoted to explaining how to take advantage of this:
This article delves deeper into the 'fear of missing out', the effect this has on consumer psychology, and how to implement FOMO marketing.And how FoMO has a lot of relationships with negative factors, including low self esteem etc. (just one article of many): https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0265407520945394
So we can say, pretty conclusively, that as a sales tactic it's one designed to target the vulnerable. And then be annoyed at that and all the other cosmetic stuff.
All whilst also being critical of how the game itself has a lot of problematic elements, like the rampant toxicity and seeming lack of moderation on that front.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288167#Comment_3288167
Honestly people shouldn’t try to make an argument of how FOMO affects someone else’s mental health when a) they are not a doctor b) not everyone suffers from the same mental health problems.
Also I feel like this is cherry picking considering that there are MANY other factors that this game has that are not tied to a skin that one could also say are problematic when it comes to mental health. Like the fact that people are telling others to end their lives on the daily in post chat. Or the fact that people are getting BM’d for absolutely no reason other than someone else wants to be a jerk. I could go on and on.
Got it backwards; the point isn't how FOMO affects mental health, it's how mental health affects FOMO. So FOMO takes advantage of mental health to boost sales.
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@WalterBlack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3288050#Comment_3288050
If you could link some of these studies, that would be nice. I'd be interested. I understand that this situation is irritating to people, but I don't understand why people claim this is some sort of huge assault on their mental health. They're skins.
Most FOMO studies focus on social media, at least the ones that I've found. Plenty of correlations between the strength of FOMO effects and things like negative self esteem, isolation, etc. (which are all comorbid with other mental issues), but if you're after a why of how FOMO exists, I haven't seen that.
I could link a study (if I can find it again) which relates impulse control etc. to excessive video game playing, and then the stuff on FOMO as a marketing tactic. But I haven't seen any direct studies (they've only really started investigating FOMO in scholarly circles in the last ten or so years and this is not my usual field of study, so finding things is rather slow and very specific studies like that either haven't been completed or are hard to find).
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@Superbeasto1974 said:
The biggest issue for me is that the level of outrage simply isn't warranted here. At the end of the day, this is a minor business decision, a cash grab that will only net them a brief surge of revenue, and yet people are acting like this is some villainous plot concocted for the sole purpose of making everybody miserable. Not only that, but as they go to greater depths to argue their case, going so far as to invoking mental health issues, they become completely oblivious to just how entitled, narcissistic, and superficial their grievances sound, which does nothing to help their cause, and absolutely invites all manner of pushback. I've tried very hard not to be insulting to anyone while discussing this, but I can't pretend to hide the fact that I find this level of indignation appalling. I've already said in other forums, it's okay to be mildly disappointed. But this level of anger? Does anybody know what is going on outside of this community, and outside of this game, and ultimately how pedestrian and insignificant this issue really is?
Incidentally, with regards to the "misinformation": Mandy said that because numerous individuals were going about stating with assumed authority that the outfits would not be available for shards next season. The truth is, no one knows, but if folks are running around flatly claiming "the skins won't be available for shards next season," that IS spreading misinformation.
Who are you to dictate that it's not warranted?
And it's been stated repeatedly, by multiple people, across like a dozen threads, that the way this sort of marketing exploits certain mental health is well studied and taught. Why, exactly, do you (and so many other people) keep dismissing this point? Do you automatically assume that anything you disagree with in a conversation has been fabricated?
Because holy #########, the regularity with which a few people jump to saying others are sounding narcissistic and entitled for explaining a well known phenomenon and how a marketing technique works and is taught is ridiculous. 'Common sense' is not a substitute for actual subject matter knowledge, which is what this keeps coming down to: "from my perspective this is minor and unimportant, so I'm going to ignore anything that involves knowledge I don't have".
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I only played after the changes, but I moved on for the most part in the end because it was getting tiring playing a Killer who has more ways to outplay and counter her ability than you can to use it. Survivors have infinitely more control over what information you get than you have over them, and there's way more tricks and things you can do than ways to exploit 'move really fast but be half blind'
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3287915#Comment_3287915
Yes, only look to the down side.
Simply not lit until a down would go better, surely? Presumably, we're trying to avoid 'Survivor spawns next to lit totem so the perk is going away as soon as possible'.
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@C3Tooth said:
My ideas for the Hex rework:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/8JFW3MNBKUOL/image.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/2OM8MTSJKQR9/image.png
Killer can pick between Destroy Boon or Snuff Boon without perk.
Shattered hope now cause the blesser Exposed for 60sec and cause them to scream.
Survivor can pick between Cleanse or Bless without perk. Survivor without Boon perk when Blessing a Hex will de-Hex the totem.
I do think there should be 1 Hex perk "activated on Hook" as basekit to make 2nd objective for survivors, in return drop Gen time from 90 to 80sec.
Block until down would be nearly meaningless. It stops instant cleansing, but if anyone knows where it is, it's still going immediately once there's a down.
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@kcwolf1975 said:
Are they really creating artificial scarcity, or are they just selling holiday skins during said holiday?
There are too many skins available now anyways, they should go into some type of rotation.
Not having Christmas skins available in July does not make BHVR an evil company like you are portraying them.
let's see, they're making something scarce and unobtainable during the rest of the year when it would otherwise not be, so... yes. Artificial scarcity by definition.
Also, pyjamas are now a christmas thing?
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@MrPeanutbutter said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3287353#Comment_3287353
I’ve been trying to figure out how this is a “scummy” business practice and so far I’ve had no success. Someone is going to have to explain to me how this is “scummy”.
Is every company that has ever discontinued a product also engaging in “scummy” business practices?
Creating artificial scarcity by releasing limited-time exclusives is a way of extracting the maximum amount of money from a minority of players, and a disproportionate amount of that falls on those with various forms of mental illness.
And this is a very well known and studied topic, to the point there's lectures on how to pull it off, so it's not an accident when it happens.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3287426#Comment_3287426
I never thought I'd use 'In this economy' without a pinch of salt, but here I am...
This is a horrible business model, and they ought to know that. Cause good heavens, those people are not going to please the investors, especially seeing how many content creators are PISSED. (I don't wanna imagine the fallout if bhvr does even more wrong and removes those that rightfully criticise them as Content Creators... what is this? twitter?)
Oh, I'm certain someone did the maths before proposing it and looked at market conditions and usual spending. There's no way they authorised this on a whim of just thinking it might make more money.
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@kcwolf1975 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3287418#Comment_3287418
I personally do not think they would target such a small market. You market to the masses, not the minority.
I just don't like seeing BHVR attacked when they have managed to keep the game relevant for six years and you never had to spend a dime if you didn't want to. Even crossing console generations with no extra fee.
They are not the scummy company that you are trying to make them out to be.
No, you market to whoever's going to pay you the most for your product.
If you think you'll get more money out of fewer people, and are more concerned with the money than the ethical implications of why this is, you get this outcome.
There are entire games that are completely free to play across their entire lifespan, if you're patient and are willing to accept you won't get everything they release for it--most of them mobile games. Some have been running even longer than DbD. And this tactic is exactly how they remain profitable: make as much money as possible off the small number of people who can and will spend a ton.
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@MeltingPenguins said:
I'm still trying to understand the logic of bhvr here:
'hey, we are making the most money with cosmetics, so instead of making sure rift cosmetics get put into the store asap and at a steady pace, and the new non-rift cosmetics are worth it, and generally make sure cosmetics are exciting, let's make sure to piss people off even more than usual by randomly taking away cosmetics from the store and declare them 'limited edition' because verily our players are stupid enough to buy them deeming them superspecial them'
like... what? c'mon, bhvr, it's one thing to make the game as frustrating as possible on purpose through bugs and badly planned out chapters, but this is a new low as so many people now pointed out.
Most people will probably buy one or two skins. They're after the people who'll still do that sort of limited purchase, but also particularly the types who'll now buy... what, the 30+ they're going to remove? And who will consequently buy every set they put out in full going forward.
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@kcwolf1975 said:
Do you really think BHVR is targeting this extremely small market you speak of?
Or is it more likely that they simply decided to have holiday skins be made available during those holidays?
Or maybe they just don't want every skin available at any time because it clutters up the store?
I see no problem with them rotating skins and only having a dozen or so available per character.
Yes, I do think BHVR is targeting this small market, because they are a company interested in making money, and as a company interested in making money, they would not knowingly make a decision that makes them less money.
Ergo, if they're changing how skins are made available in the shop, then someone whose job it is to do sales and marketing has concluded that this change will bring them more money.
Assuming that said person or group is as aware of marketing tactics and trends as some of the people posting on this very forum, then it is an intentional choice to move to a model of seasonal exclusives and removing old content to make that a seasonal exclusive, in order to capitalise on the market who will overspend.
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@kcwolf1975 said:
Guyfawx is right, there is nothing scummy about this. It is extremely common, nothing shady about it. What is the point of having 20+ skins for one character to be available at any given time? Who cares if they put them in some type of rotation so there is only 10 available. Plus this is all about skins which have zero impact anyways.
The commonness of a tactic doesn't make it less scummy. It just proves that businesses can get away with it.
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The hex that wins the achievement of 'should least be a hex' is Huntress' Lullaby. Or it should start at max power.
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They really should rework the notifications to actually have something event-oriented. Like an actual... calendar.
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@Malkhrim said:
TL;DR: the hex mechanic is bad on most perks and needs to change. Totem locations are still terrible and should be adressed again.
Back in the day, one hex perk was meta: Ruin. Other hex perks were used from time to time, NOED being probably the second most popular, strong but still an endgame perk. No other hex had an immediate strong effect like these two, but aways had a chance of being cleansed early and leaving you with an empty perk slot without doing anything. Even Haunted Grounds could end up being cleansed when you had no healthy survivor near you and and so not doing much. Ruin had this problem too but was used a lot due to being the best regression perk and to the lack of alternatives (for a long time, Pop was the only viable alternative to Ruin).
I've commented before on this forums how I liked the Ruin nerf, since I hated the fact the best perk for slowing down the insanely quick gens had a chance of deactivating permanently in the first 30 seconds, and now we finally have alternatives. HOWEVER, after Ruin and NOED got nerfed, Hex Perks became extremely rare, and the first reason is obvious: it's not worth to take a perk that will probably be gone in the first few minutes instead of one that lasts for the whole match. The mechanic is underwhelming by default. No wonder why the better two at the moment are Plaything and Pentimento: the way their totems are created and their effects cleansed are different. They don't use the same mechanic that makes other hexes so weak. The other hex perks need an overhaul to change the way they work too.
Of course, other things made hexes become so unpopular: with Boon Totems, survivors seem to be more aware than ever of totem locations and look for them even before knowing there is a hex in play. And then there's the downside that plagued totems for years: many totem locations are just terrible, being either extremely visible or taking place right beside survivor's main objective, the generators.
I remember devs changed a few totem locations back in 2018... but I wonder when and why they decided they were fine and needed no more improvement. I leave a few examples below of totems I've seen in my matches in 2022. Even though some are months old, I haven't seen a single patch note or dev update talking about totem spawn changes.
Clearly visible in front of a high spot where a gen is located.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ZMRMIEQFDJX1/bad-totem-spot-9.jpg
To think I hoped the rework would fix the totem spawns on this map...
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/PE7NPEYOYPJM/bad-totem-spot-6.jpg
This is from february, but right below there's a more recent screenshot. It's still there!
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/0S1ENPM6JX32/bad-totem-spot-7.jpg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/CF90IQ9Z00DN/bad-totem-spot-8.jpg
Just imagine, if you go to the shack in a chase or to look for a gen there, you'll find a totem for free!
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/DY2FANJ79LNQ/bad-totem-spot-5.jpg
Just a reminder: this was one of the latest reworked maps.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/2YL2QPLI925K/bad-totem-spot-4.jpg
Well, it can't get worse than this.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ND4CF8AK0CF9/bad-totem-spot-3.jpg
Come on, the corn is not hiding this. It's near a gen too!
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/W314OIASX06N/bad-totem-spot-2.jpg
Yeah, there's tall grass, but just imagine for a second if this was lit. It would be hard not to spot a shining flame in the middle of the grass.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/8ROH7DZ0J8YH/bad-totem-spot-1.jpg
FInally, these two are fresh from today:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/J2ZZC1ZT11ZY/bad-totem-spot-10.jpg
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/GJ6GBBES5DYR/bad-totem-spot-11.jpg
My favourite is that you can WALK INTO the one in the corn or the grass. It actually gets in the way.
Although the Ruin nerf's doubly funny: if Survivors DON'T cleanse it, it's gonna go bye-bye anyway if someone dies. That's great, perks that delete themselves on top of being removable before they do anything. And being slow and easily worked through.