Orion
Orion
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@blue4zion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368464#Comment_368464
With the recent buff increasing the base speed of this it wouldn’t be much of an issue. I was simply stating it could be either way. Some people crouch right at the start while other don’t. This would be equal if she started crouched because some would uncrouch right at the start while others would stay crouched
If it's the same either way, then we might as well keep it the way it is now.
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@Bongbingbing said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368458#Comment_368458
Well that's their opinion I guess, I personally am okay with it.
It is a very strong perk, but again as long as NOED stays the way it is it can be countered most of the time. It can be OP in situations but same can be said for NOED.
Which is the point. OP opened a thread asking for opinions on why Adrenaline is OP (note the wording; they weren't asking for opinions about Adrenaline, they were specifically asking for justification on why it's OP), and now they're trying to make it look like there's a massive killer conspiracy to "target" Adrenaline.
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@Arroz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368455#Comment_368455
If you check this thread open by me https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/51960/how-is-adrenaline-op#latest
You can see the lot of killer complaining about adrenaline is op
You literally asked people to say why they think Adrenaline is OP. With this thread, it almost makes it look like bait.
There's one thread actually saying Adrenaline is OP, and that's it.
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@blue4zion said:
It still wouldn’t be a bad thing for her to start crouched tho
How? She'd just have to stand up again to actually move around.
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Because she's slowed while crouched and that would be a detriment to her. She also doesn't signal her presence or existence by crouching. The Wraith, on the other hand, used to signal his presence by banging on the bell to become invisible so he could traverse the map more quickly.
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@Arroz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368457#Comment_368457
Not everyone should be able to apply pressure, everyone have disanvantage and there's 2 killer who are the more powerful in the game that can just bassicaly counter adrenaline.
So you think it's acceptable that if you want to play killer and actually kill, you're pigeonholed into playing two characters perfectly, while survivors don't have to do anything of significance to escape?
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@Arroz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368319#Comment_368319
Just understand, adrenaline rewards player for doing their objective, you need to apply pressure if you want to counter this perk, and this is a huge disavantage because you only play with 3 slot during all the match.. and that slot can be used by iron will, alert etc..
In conclusion: Adrenaline rewards player for doing their objective or stay in chase by 5 generators and the reward should be huge because you only played with 3 perks..
I take it you missed the part where generator repair is fast and easy and that some characters simply cannot apply enough map pressure to do jack #########, not to mention where I already pointed out that survivors aren't giving up anything they actually need, since their stale meta consists of 3 staple perks+random perk number 4.
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@Sharmarko said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368404#Comment_368404
No, because their perks work on 4 people. They work 4x as much. And really, survivor and killer perks are so different its hard to compare them. How did you compare empathy and brutal strength? They do nothing in common. Did you just see one had a small number so you went "hurr durr survivor op".
What about "Wake Up!"? It makes you open the exit gates 15% faster, so lets make Blood Warden last 15 seconds so its fair.
Except survivors are not meant to be able to 1v1 the killer. This is an asymmetrical game, do you have any idea what that means?
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@Sharmarko said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368401#Comment_368401
You need to start playing both sides of the game.
If a survivor DCs and its a 3v1, then the killer will get loads of easy points because guess what - its a 3v1. Match will be over in less than 10 minutes and will end in a 3k.
If a killer DCs, the game is done.
If a survivor DCs, the game continues and is now heavily in the killer's favour, allowing them to take advantage of this and get loads of easy points and a free pip.
I already play both sides. Any more false assumptions you'd care to make based on absolutely nothing?
More often than not, if one survivor DCs, at least one more will as well, at least in my experience. Hell, I had a trial where three DC'd simultaneously after I hooked one survivor (note that it was my first chase and hook, right at the start of the trial). Often, they kill themselves on the hook. But even that doesn't change the fact that survivor DCs are disproportionately bad for killers. 3v1 is easily winnable, sure, but what's the point if the killer gets very few points out of it?
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@Apoch said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368393#Comment_368393
1 Survivor quits does not mean the match ends
1 Killer quits means the match ends
Big difference there.
That's not the point. A single survivor is potentially worth at least 2500 points, not including the chase. When they DC, the killer gets a quarter of that. If all survivors DC, it's not even enough to cover the costs for a single common add-on.
On the other hand, a killer DCing (which is the same as giving up) awards survivors what they should get - the escape bonus.
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@Apoch said:
Just so you know each Survivor has a player behind it. 4 Survivors does not equal 4 quarters of 1 person. (I mean surely you knew that but just for driving the point home, there it is)
Killer dc's the entire match ends, depriving all players from a fair chance at completing the game = equivalent of a match where all survivors quit so 2500 quitters bonus per survivor is fair
Survivor dc's the match is just 1 less survivor so 625 quitters bonus is fair
If you think about it that way it's fair and balanced.
2500 is not enough to cover a single common add-on, and nearly every killer relies on add-ons.
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Let's do the math here. I'm going to completely disregard the BP from the chase because that varies wildly:
400 (survivor found) + 1000 (two hits) + 1100 (hook+sacrifice) = 2500 BP. Instead, killers get 625. That's 25% of the value of a survivor. If all survivors DC, killers get the same BP that a single survivor is worth. Again, does that seem fair to you?
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@Sharmarko said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368323#Comment_368323
@Orion that's because if the killer DC's, the survivors have lost all potential points they could ever get in that match. If the survivor DCs then that just means an easy 3k for the killer, giving them more points. I've seen your posts alot around here and tbh you just look like the most biased killer main ever.
I don't care that survivors get 5k BP, I think it's only fair that they do.
I do care that killers get a pittance by comparison. A single survivor is worth a lot more than 625 BP. A single hit is 500 BP, FFS. Do you think that's fair? I sure don't. And you can call me biased all you'd like, but the fact is, DCing bonuses are fair for survivors, but not for killers.
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@Chi said:
You don't lose by giving last survivor the hatch, you do lose by dying to the killer, and if the killer has had a bad match, they will not pip and not get a lot of blood points out of you dying. While as killer you will still double pip while giving the last one the hatch.
You don't know that. And let's not forget, killers usually play for kills, not pips (cue everyone who doesn't play for kills).
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@fluffybunny said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368023#Comment_368023
@Aven_Fallen I don't think Orion is the type to make bait threads.
I'm really not. Everyone may not agree with all my comments all the time (there's over 8000 by now, so it's not surprising), but I don't make bait threads.
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@NoShinyPony said:
@Orion I'd say it happened to me as a killer less than 10 times since I started playing DbD.
And how many free hatches?
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@BACKSTABBER said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368317#Comment_368317
I think is illegal an underage plays DBD since it's licensed for +18 o +21
Nope. Those numbers are a recommendation, it's not actually illegal for children to play them.
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@Milo said:
Better question is: Who voted this up?
I did it now because you asked. That way, I can give you 1/3 of the answer.
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8% cooldown reduction is worthless. Break the totems and NOED is gone.
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5000, actually. Welcome to DbD, where it's considered balanced that the numbers role gets better ######### than the power role.
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@PigNRun said:
I do it from time to time if I notice map RNG was crap against them. Every single time though, the Killers will always refuse to hook me and gently carry me to the hatch.
As Killer, I have never experienced it actually.
I've never experienced it either, but many people here swear vehemently that it's happened to them. Being let go through the hatch, on the other hand, has happened to me several times. Given that there are four survivors to every killer, I can only conclude survivors in my area are particularly undeserving of the hatch, since they won't repay the favor. That's why I'm gonna stop giving any of them the hatch.
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@RepliCant said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367968#Comment_367968
I'll elaborate more to make it more relevant to what the OP asked.
Adrenaline is not Overpowered despite all that it does - and here is why I think so.
- It has conditions.
-The condition being, all 5 generators must be repaired. You must also be injured/dying state to make value of the heal
- Due to this condition, it is not always going to proc every game
-Meaning, if you prevent the 5 generators from being repaired, it will never be something you encounter anyway.
- Having Adrenaline proc when you complete the last generator, fully healed, and not actively in a chase
-Feels like a waste of a perk slot. Back to the condition argument; for full value of the perk you must be at risk (in the injured/dying state)
While I agree that the 5 second sprint is a bit oppressive, I do not find it too powerful. It is detrimental to a Killer when chasing a Survivor and Adrenaline procs saving them completely. I can acknowledge such - but it's fair to say it has conditions placed on it, and it's a high reward when that condition is met.
Mind you, like No One Escapes Death, you're essentially without a perk for the majority of the game. That does also have an effect. It being a one-time use, especially at the end game, seems fair for what it does.
*cough* imo, tho.
The conditions are easy to achieve. It's been mathematically proven that generator repair is easy and fast. Some killers (characters) simply lack the map presence to stop survivors from repairing all the generators. If the conditions are easy to achieve, then they shouldn't provide a massive benefit.
As an example of conditions that are nigh-impossible to achieve, just look at any hex perk. Let's go with DH, since it allows you to kill survivors. You have to allow for five free unhooks, while simultaneously making sure your totem is never found (which is almost impossible, especially with SWF). And when the stars align, you can kill survivors.
Survivors' fourth perk slot has been empty for quite some time. The stale meta is SC+SB+DS+perk number 4. So no, they're not without a perk during the trial, since they never really cared about that slot in the first place. NOED, on the other hand, actually matters for killers, since the only (arguably) meta perk is Ruin, and the rest are part of a build. Survivors don't have builds, they just stuff safety net after safety net in their slots and call it a day.
That sprint alone makes it all but impossible for 110% killers to catch them, and the heal makes it pointless to even try. Again, not wasted even if you're fully healed. Oh, and let's not forget, even if you're on the hook when it's supposed to trigger, it'll just activate when you're unhooked (which is absurdly easy to do, even in the killer's face), and you'll be fully healed.
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@makayla said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/368244#Comment_368244
You're like talking to a brick wall, Jesus. The point was sexualizing minors is weird and predatory. Your age doesn't factor into it.
I'm not wasting any more time with you.
16 is legal in the majority of countries.
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@Kagrenac said:
Because I dont have to do what you want? What kind of ######### argument is this
"Why don't you just not win?" I've never heard anything more entitled.
Let me know when you've read the OP.
@Warlock_2020 said:
@Orion On the occasion where I can convince my family to dare play survivor and face the deluge of camping and tunneling, we are always willing to reward a cool killer who got wrecked. Just Friday night we played 7 games together. We were blown away that 4 of them had a killer who neither camped, nor tunneled.
Match breakdown:
- Camper, 3 of us escaped - very boring match.
- Really good Huntress with little to no camping. Owned us, but one of the most fun matches of the night, and a lot of laughs after match. (I say owned, but dammit, we got the gens done..and died before opening gates.)
- Tunneled me for the first 3 gens. I got unhooked, he tunneled me again. We all escaped.
- Nurse - he was clearly learning how to play nurse. We lost him pretty easily several times. He got no hooks by the time the 5th gen was done. So, we "accidently" ran into him and ran around a few minutes. Then two of us ran to hooks and gave him kills. He was very thankful afterwards and we agreed to play KYF with him so he could learn how to manage his ports.
- Camper - 2 of us escaped. My son is never willing to let him mother just die on hook. Fed LF his second kill.
- Spirit - He was running prayer beads, and gave us some good jump scares. Hatch escape. Was fun.
- Hag - scary, and a lot of fun. But failed to score a kill before 5th gen. Two of us ran to hooks again (different 2 than last time) and gave him 2 kills.
Most of the time I play killer, I find plenty of toxic survivors. Friday was the first time in month where I found the majority (out of 7) killers to not be campers or tunnelers. It was the most fun my wife and kids have had in DbD in a long time. Hoping they agree to play more.
Not all survivors/killers are azzhats. Try not to lump them all together.
After three years, I've seen more survivors send out death threats and general vitriol than I have survivors be nice. Sorry if I don't buy it.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
If the Killer decides to let the Survivors farm (because of a DC or a 3 man game for example), I usually let him hook me. Some refuse to do it, tho and I dont want to waste anybodys time by running to a hook again and again.
So yeah, if the Killer is nice, why not.
If the Killer does not any Kills, I do not let him hook me, because I think I earned it to escape, when I did well. Of course the Killer earns it to hook me, when he got me, so I am not mad if a Killer does not give the Hatch in a 3 man game or when somebody DCed early.
But well, might be another Bait-Thread.
Not a bait thread, I just wanted to point out the hypocritical attitudes of survivors who expect the hatch under certain circumstances, but aren't willing to do something equivalent for killers. However, according to some of the people here, some survivors do actually do it once in a blue moon.
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@Brady I'll address your comment tomorrow, since it's getting late where I live. However, I'll say right away that I appreciate you explaining your PoV in more detail.
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Yes, it is. It was in the shrine before, without any changes to it, so why would now be any different? You're seeing a pattern that doesn't exist.
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@NuclearBurrito said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367979#Comment_367979
Similar in effect. Not similar in power
But that's my point, they're only similar in that they both give movement speed buffs. Other than that, they have different effects. You might say they have complimentary effects, since one heals and the other exposes, but complimentary is almost the opposite of similar.
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@NMCKE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367929#Comment_367929
You're obviously talking about NOED, it gives the killer a speed boost and does double damage on attacks. The perk was nerfed because it had no counter play back in beta besides stealth. Stealth wasn't good enough to counter it if you had to eventually get someone to open the exit gates. That's why it got nerfed and then buffed until we got the perfect balance between counter plays! The current NOED is really good in my opinion, especially in this "Adrenawin" meta. If you have a problem with Adrenaline, the simple solution is to use NOED perk because it does the opposite of what Adrenaline does, plus extra salt! 😋
I'm really not. See my reply to NuclearBurrito.
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@NuclearBurrito said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367929#Comment_367929
Kinda like NOED.
Which was indeed nerfed to hell (compared to what it was before)
NOED gives you a pitiful movement speed boost, doesn't guarantee you'll actually catch anyone, and won't prevent stuns or blinds (arguably the only equivalents killers have to "damage"). And yes, as you said, it was indeed nerfed to hell, having become the first perk that can be permanently disabled before it ever activates as part of its base functionality.
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@RepliCant said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367929#Comment_367929
Don't let all 5 generators pop?
I re-read the thread, but I can't seem to find how your comment is relevant to whether or not Adrenaline is OP.
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@Eveline said:
OMG the way you named the thread confused me. I was thinking of why don't survivor not surrender after they themself had bad trial.
Yeah I only met one guy who tried to give me a hook after I only got 1k and gens were powered. I left him, killed the other two and let him go afterwards. It was so funny. He tried to help me but everything changed in the end.
That's why you should always read the OP. Anyway, I changed the title a bit to be clearer.
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@Arroz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367929#Comment_367929
Actually is a reward, if you are a solo player it's so weird to be in the end game, actually is a reward for survive to me.
Doesn't change the fact that it's a perk that has multiple effects that, by themselves, are already fairly powerful. You're talking about an insta-heal, long-duration Sprint Burst that activates when you're already winning (as if you'd need a bigger advantage at that point) and ignores Exhaustion, the very mechanic the devs introduced to prevent people from stacking multiple movement speed buffs together.
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@KingSavageGaming said:
Didn't they say on a dev stream that farming isn't bannable or did they change their mind on that too?
Farming is bannable if it's done to the detriment of a minority of survivors, since it's technically griefing.
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Killer:
Frenzy - The more you hurt them, the bigger your bloodlust. Every time you hook a survivor, gain a 50% movement speed bonus for 30 seconds. During this time, all your attacks deal double damage.
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It ignores Exhaustion, guarantees an escape (it's 5 seconds of SB, which gives a 30-meter head start), and oh yeah, heals you. If killers had a similar perk, it'd have been nerfed to hell already.
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367864#Comment_367864
I never said you should ignore the killer as a threat? I said that bodyblocking the basement so that they cant even go for an unhook is a bullshot strategy. That should be bannable. Simply because someone is hooked doesnt change that standing still is preventing 3 other people from playing the game to its fullest by being able to save teammates. If they get hit on their attempt, that's fair.
But my point as originally stated remains. It's stopping the game, for any amount of time. They gave 360 hooks to prevent the exact thing on hooks. The fact that they're standing atop the stairs and not on the hook doesnt change that its preventing gameplay.
It should be bannable.
You are, in essence, ignoring the killer as a threat since you're saying that the killer should not be able to stop you from doing what you want to do (unhook). In a balanced asymmetrical game, the power role should be able to stop any one element of the numbers role from doing any one thing. They should be threatening enough that the elements of the numbers role feel that what they want to do is not possible, and thus change their attitudes.
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@Warlock_2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/51945/are-chases-fun-for-survivors-or-not
Very lazy logic. Most people enjoy the chase, but if you are coming at them right after the hook and they have not even had the time to try and heal or move out of the area, that is the opposite of fun. Especially right off the hook. That is fishing in a barrel with explosives. Too easy for the killer, no chance for the survivor.
The evasion and the chase are fun. I don't consider any "downing" from an even starting point (any point in which I was not just getting off the hook when immediately tunneled down) to be a fun, and fair event. I am usually laughing my arse off by the time the killer downs me, whether it is seconds or minutes into the chase. (All of this does not apply to Legion, whom does not have chases, just barrel fishing.)
Problem is, those are few and far between anymore. I don't play survivor much anymore, but when I do, it is mostly killers who hard camp and tunnel, or Legion. Very boring, thus why I prefer killer now, by a long shot!
I didn't say anything about the hook, did I? In fact, in the trial I was thinking about when I opened this thread, the survivor was only hooked once, at the end, and still survived. I'd been chasing her throughout the entire trial, which she and the others claimed had "ruined" her game.
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@Red_Beard said:
I play survivor and killer equally and I do feel I am more likely to let survivors go at the end when playing killer than I am to let the killer kill me. I think for me it comes down to bloodpoints. I have over 700 hours in the game, but I only have two characters at P3, I have all killers at level 50 but not all survivors and I don't have any characters with all of the perks.
I get more points as the killer so letting one or two go doesn't hurt as much points wise as when I don't survive as a survivor because I am still grinding out the perks and prestige.
That's fair enough.
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367860#Comment_367860
They are, but did they not put in 360 hooks because blocking unhooking was not intended? Because it prevented any attempt?
Indeed. Arguably, the basement is different, since it's meant to be more dangerous, but the point remains - why should you, as a survivor, be able to ignore the killer as a threat?
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367762#Comment_367762
Preventing team from being able to unhook.
Is it preventing intended game mechanics?
Is it not akin to face camping to prevent the unhook?
It's literally preventing the other 3 from even ATTEMPTING to unhook. Its bullshit and we all know it.
Why should the killer be unable to prevent the survivors from unhooking? Is the killer not supposed to be a threat?
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@NuclearBurrito said:
I've had a trial where the Killer spent the entire game letting me win after crushing 2 of the survivors. Like he downed me an the other last survivor and let us wiggle off him right in front of the ruin totem.
I got far enough to open the door (I had a daily to do) but then I found the killer, and signaled him under a hook because he deserved the kill and I didn't deserve the escape
That's different. I mean when the killer is the one being crushed.
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@Eveline said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367834#Comment_367834
I mean not in every game but it happens more often than not. I don't give everyone the hatch tho. If they had flashlight or ds and not wiggle, they meet Bubba in his chambers.
I'm really meeting the wrong survivors. I have never seen any other survivor do this, as mentioned in the OP, while playing either side. Usually, as PhantomMask20763 said, they just troll around and insult the killer in the post-game chat.
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@brokedownpalace said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367828#Comment_367828
Sorry but that doesn't make sense. I did not say he was biased for asking a question and in fact you can see in my response that I have no problem with the question itself. My issue was with how he phrased it and what else he included in his OP.
I'm not really sure what point you're trying to make here. No.. Nobody is biased for asking survivors if they find chases fun.
So you disagree that survivors as individuals have bizarre conditions about what constitutes tunneling? Keep in mind, I have said nothing about killers' bizarre conditions for other aspects of the game because this is a survivor-centered thread. It's not biased to focus on the matter at hand without making it into an "us vs. them" issue.
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@Eveline said:
They do actually. At least in my games.
I guess I'm just meeting the wrong survivors, then.
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@brokedownpalace said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/367801#Comment_367801
Because you're being needlessly divisive. If you don't want a response like mine then you should probably just ask a straightforward question without injecting your bias.
"With that out of the way, if you can't win chases, it's not on the killer to let you go, is it?"
Did I say it was? It doesn't mean I have to enjoy being tunneled. Did I say "killers need to stop tunneling it's ruining my game!!" or did I say "I don't enjoy being tunneled 3 hooks in a row?"
Killers can do whatever they want as long as it's within the rules. Most survivors are capable of understanding that tunneling is sometimes effective and at the same time not like when it happens to them (or if it happens multiple trials in a row).
I'm being needlessly divisive by asking a question about survivors without talking about killers simultaneously? Does everything have to be a survivors vs. killers issue to you? If so, I opened up a new thread where that's actually true, so you can take that attitude in there.
No, you didn't say it was, but the OP focuses on the idea that the killer is to blame for chasing a survivor for too long.
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@HavelmomDaS1 said:
What do you mean exactly? (editing)
For example, a few months ago, I went up against a noob Nurse who didn't get anyone. They were so bad, they couldn't even get a hit and ended up facing the wall and going AFK. Out of pity, so they wouldn't give up on playing the Nurse and could get at least some BP, I let myself get hooked and died there. That Nurse was having a very ######### trial, so I gave them that one kill and whatever measly amount of BP it gave them.
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@brokedownpalace said:
It would be cool if you stopped acting like only one side has their "bizarre conditions" they'd like their opponents to follow.
You can like chases but not enjoy being tunneled 3 hooks in a row. They're not mutually exclusive things. Considering you need to do objectives and altruism too, if you spend your whole match being chased then you'll probably max out on boldness and depip.
This thread is about survivors (it's right there in the title), so I'm not sure why you thought I'd be talking about killers as well.
With that out of the way, if you can't win chases, it's not on the killer to let you go, is it?
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@[Deleted User] said:
Wiggle Meter progress should carry over the next time you are picked up and carried but gets setback ×% whenever you get hooked.
This change would make both killers and survivors more mindful of hook proximaty the longer the game progresses
This change could possibly prevent the zeroing in on certain particular survivors.
Wiggling is not supposed to guarantee your escape. That's not its function, so it'll never work like that.
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@Poweas said:
It's a strange thing, but when I used to play survivor I found chases fun, but also they got boring if you're getting tunnelled since your instadown. I still think secondary objectives are needed.
@Poweas Would you rather hold M1 for 3 minutes? It's one or the other if you can't lose the killer.