NullEXE
NullEXE
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@LordGlint said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1027815#Comment_1027815
Survivors-Just apply pressure
Also survivors- NOT THAT MUCH PRESSURE!!!
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@Dokta_Carter said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1026789#Comment_1026789
Can i ask for some insight, i havent watched and cant atm. Did they really never say anything about it out of the context of "if gen speeds increase?"
When asked about if they were doing anything about Gen speeds, they said that they are reading the discussions about it, but they don't want to increase the time it takes to repair a gen, because that will make it boring to hold m1 longer. Which btw as a person who plays both killer and survivor (mainly killer), I can agree. 20-80 seconds on a gen already feels like a long time.
So instead they are looking at working on Toolboxes (which i'm sure we all can agree is a band aid solution - when the problem isn't even the toolboxes, that's just a symptom of the problem), and overtime they are going to be making the larger maps better. Which changing the maps into Killer favor gives so many buffs to killers that isn't only gen speeds.
When really the whole issue with gen speeds has always been with map size.
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@FootMan2893 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1026958#Comment_1026958
That's still biased as ######### though. They're perfectly fine giving killers the raw end of the deal and letting them figure out how to continue playing as long as it means survivors don't have to hold M1.
Here you go; https://lmgtfy.com/?q=define+biased
It's not biased at all. Making the maps smaller a huge killer buff to all the killer's aspects including dealing with the problem with gen speed.
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@FootMan2893 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1026789#Comment_1026789
They're trying to get cut out perk synergy so that people don't run several different percentage slow down perks at once. They said they don't want people just running gen slow down builds every game, all the while they're paying no attention to why people do that in the first place.
Though they did talk about the game speed being an issue, that's the whole reason why they are looking into Map reworks. Even the map team commented that with the plans to change large maps is disappointing because with smaller map sizes means the maps become less unique.
They understand that gen speed is an issue, but they don't want to increase the time it takes to repair a gen because it will become mind numbly boring to hold m1 much longer than it is now - and they are right.
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They probably increased the chances of it since it's the new release, and they want to collect Data. Sucks for when I play killer though - I liked the old lery's when you needed skill to perform loops.
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It's hilarious, especially when they do it wrong, but even if they do it right. I end up getting a free hook, and free slug. Goodluck saving your team now Dwight and Nea - you can thank Meg.
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Not gonna lie, it was pretty funny when they said that. I laughed and said "What we gonna do? Use Discordance? So that we can see which generator is going to power up before we have the time to walk over there?"
But fixing large maps is going to fix that.
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They didn't say they plan to nerf Thana, Dying Light, or Pop. That was in response to the idea of increasing Gen speeds, because if you use a build of only gen regression perks, and a generator already takes 120 seconds to repair then that makes for a very slow, very boring game.
Don't just pick a sentence out of one of their answers, and then spread it like fact like a lie.
At the same time, they plan on updating the large maps to be more in Killer's favor, which is the main problem with gen speed. It isn't the how quick you can repair a gen, but rather how fast the killer has a chance to find you.
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Now, a lot of people are going to cry "JUNGLE GYMS!" or "INFINITE LOOPS!", but we can't always use them. Not every Survivor is a running god with map knowledge over every variation of the maps. Some are more easy to mind game out of their hiding spots, or cut off loops.
I'm not sure if this is a "nerfy billy" thread or a "Buff other killers thread", but I came in here to say that Billy is easy to counter if you know how to, and then you mentioned this line. Which confirms it. So yeah. Billy is easy to counter if you know how to. I know that OhTofu on his stream will play billy for 1 match to squash a whole team of potato's then gloat around like as if he's good, or that everyone's right billy is too strong, but that's the problem. He squashed potato's. Billy is easy to learn, and is strong when you play him well, but a good survivor knows how to counter him. Starting with getting out of the way when they hear the chainsaw - you lose a few seconds on a gen moving off to make sure he's not charging at you, but that's the first step to countering him. Then it's just tight corners, and good looping skills.
I agree entirely that Killer's need buffs to be as strong as Billy in the right hands though. Like Clown, or Bubba (that's right I said Cannibal don't @ me).
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1026490#Comment_1026490
Um ok...glad to see you too :)
We're best friends now.
0.0
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1026414#Comment_1026414
Okay...name them all. I'll top you without even looking at the official perk list.
Oh it's you, I think we finally agree on something for once x'D. Glad to see you here :p
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They may have said the word "Survivor" more, and talked more about things that survivors have, but it's more about nerfing survivors - which in turn is making the game better for Killers.
It's very clear that this recent patch, and update came knowing the blow it was gonna have on Killers, but they made it even more clear that they planned to remedy it as soon as possible afterwards.
It does look bad that they didn't just hold off on all these recent buffs/nerfs and release them at the same time, but in the end we get the same result. I am not about to throw my hat down on the belief that Dev's are strictly survivor sided yet.
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I'm on the dev's side with this one. From my own observations, and how I play. I do use a bigger variety of perks across the 4 Killers I play mainly, but then as Survivor I use usually the same 6-8 perks (going on estimates from the top of my head).
Killer I use a much different scheme of perks for Clown, than I do, Freddy. But when it comes to survivor the only difference they have is their perks, so I usually run Meta, and then Pebble, and Head On for fun sometimes.
By this observation alone, I would imagine that there are many more Survivor perks not being used than there are Killer perks.
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@Hopesfall said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1025859#Comment_1025859
it's not always about the emblem.. killers want long matches so we can have a decent amount of chases (more than 3 before EGC).
"as long as you recover" ... why even have that caveat? you're saying that like playing killer has an immediate, known disadvantage.
@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1026256#Comment_1026256
The OP specifically mentioned emblems.
Yeah even I find chases fun - as both Survivor and Killer, it's probably the most engaging part of the game. However my larger concern is that the scoring system rewards players for playing well first.
I see it as when the scoring system is more balanced, and you pip when you normally get 2 or more sac's/kills, as the objective is described. Then it would be easier to balance parts of the game like chases, and more interaction between killers and survivors.
Right now when I play, so by my own observations the only emblem I have trouble with is the Gatekeeper emblem, because as Killer I play in a playstyle where I will sacrifice generators to ensure another hook, or to take out a Survivor entirely. When there is 5 generators left in the trial with 3 survivors it becomes a lot easier to keep survivors off generators. Though if the game starts and I lose 2 gens before I even walk to the other side of the map, that's less hooks I have at that point, and therefore less ability to get that 3 man to actually survive the mid to late game.
I hope I described that right. TL:DR. Fixing gatekeeper emblem. I believe, will lead to an easier time fixing other parts of the game.
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@BigFudge said:
I know there are so many threads about this topic already but just thought id throw my two pence in aswell and ask the devs please for the love of god stop pushing for money at every single turn and fix what needs to be fixed first.
Doesnt matter what rank im at, EVERY SINGLE MATCH is like this and im not gonna lie, it makes me want to stop playing the game. Im an ok killer but being matched with these ranks every game combined with the sounds being broken just makes every trial not fun to play regardless of result.
I do try to play survivor too but in the 1 hour per evening i manage to get online, ill only get maybe 1 or 2 matches due to lobby wait times.
Please please please, devote your resources into making the game playable for everyone before trying to sqeeze every last penny you can out of the playerbase.
I'm not entirely sure why, and I don't know if you do, but have you tried playing a different Killer for 10 matches. Yes that's right 10 matches in a row.
I've noticed this when I switch between my Freddy and my Legion. When I play Freddy I'll play against survivors within my ranks, and as I keep playing, and keep stomping they progressively get harder (with very little gain to my own rank), until I am in que for about 4-6 minutes and then get back to back top red rank - most of which swf.
Then if I switch to Legion my level 50, not p3, and not all the perks unlocked. My matches start to progressively go down. I don't do much different play wise, and still pip here and there (I try to remain in Purple ranks, because it feels like I face less red rank swf there, so i'll de rank via farming if I get to rank 6 just before 5 - then go to rank 4 before rank reset). Anyways, while playing Legion who isn't even finished being optimized I start to get closer to playing against purple ranks, and then even into playing against purple and green ranks.
Which i'm sure there are games where someone is SWF with ranks above or below them that also skew my observations.
It's too bad we don't have the technicality's of how the match making works, so that we are not just making random assumption on how matchmaking works, or how bad it is, but this observation seems consistent enough, that there must be something coinciding how far you progressed a Killer, or have played a Killer back to back.
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Also since the update I do more often get Silver Gatekeeper - which is good, so i'm seeing the update is working as intended, but I Rarely go over that, which I imagine is because the first 2 generators go so quickly, and the Killer having very little ability to do anything about it. Even when I play Legion. Big maps are still a nightmare.
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@Peanits said:
This actually goes hand in hand with the recent Gatekeeper change. Previously it was very punishing if you let one or two generators go early on. Now, it's not the end of the world if a few go off early as long as you recover and keep the match going afterwards. We made sure to keep Gatekeeper in mind when changing Ruin.
Can you elaborate on that update though, it's confusing because it doesn't sound like it impacts a lot on the early game as opposed to the endgame.
Gatekeeper Emblem: Flattened score value of all remaining generators so now all generators are worth the same amount (1 point per minute) regardless of the duration that they remain in the match. Also added an additional score for both gate remaining unopened at the end of the match.
Like with the slow killers walking across the map at the start of the match. 1-2 generators can (and do) explode in the first 40-80 seconds of the match. By taking that update by word you would get 0-2 points for either of those generators, and then only 3 points per minute the rest of the match - it doesn't sound like much of a difference from before at all. How many points do you get for the doors? Sorry i'm not trying to nit-pick, but just confused.
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Not really, but I did anyways. I bought the first rift, then used the 1000 AC's from the same rift to finish it when I was near the end.
Like I get the whole "Don't put your money into a game to tell the dev's they are making bad updates" thing, but at the same time. I want the cosmetics, and it's free technically as you get the AC's back in the rift if you wanted to keep them.
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@AAAAA said:
Ruin and NOED were opposite sides of the same coin. They both addressed gens going too fast, but in different ways. Old Ruin forced the game to go slower by making survivors either find the totem or suffer through the skill checks. NOED punishes survivors who go too fast and don't take the time to do totems.
You're telling me people wasted time finding the totem before the update?
Sips tea in No Mither and This Is Not Happening -
@toxicmegg said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1024364#Comment_1024364
thanks, that's pretty helpful. though i can't avoid loops with snares because he can place them anywhere i try to run him
It's pretty difficult, a big part of facing Freddy is being aware. Check areas as you go up to gen's before working on gens so you know where to loop (if your asleep). If you see him placing snares when looping, just run for the next loop. It takes him time, and out positions him to place snares while in chase.
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I thought it would be a buff for legion, however no dice. All it ends up being is a other objective to try and defend. Which is impossible if you put less pressure on gens they go up so fast.
Thsts speaking of the times when it isn't immediatky cleansed as a result spawning next to survivors.
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There are 3 kinds of loops:
Unsafe Loop: A loop with a pallet, that has bo nearby window, and two short walls surrounding. Making it easy for the killer to just walk around to hit you regardless if you use the pallet or not.
Basic Loop: A loop with a pallet, that has a small wall and a window, or a long wall and a small wall. Making it difficult for the killer to catch you if you loop smart, and keep winning the mindgame.
Safe Loop: A loop with a window and/or pallet, with long wall that makes it very difficult for the killer to catch you if you keep running in a circle, or until the killer breaks the pallet.
God Pallets: Are pallets that need to be broken immediately by killer else they will make survivors immune. These are found at safe loops.
Jungle Gyms: Are loopable areas usually of 3 walls, 1 window, and 1 pallet. They also house a safe loop.
L Windows: A type of jungle gym with no pallet, rather its two L shaped walls each with a Window. Known as the most balanced loop as it takes knowledge from either side to win this mind game.
Then there are different structures on each map with their own unique looping patterns.
Vaults:
Slow Vault: Not holding run button when vaulting a window.
Medium Vault: taking a window very tightly, or without enough distance for a Fast Vault.
Fast Vault: When vaulting a window unimpeded from running at a window at least 2ft towards the window.
I would suggest looking up loops for different maps, but first go on youtube and look up how to do the L loop (sometimes called the T loop, or 2 Window loop). Its common on most maps, and the jungle gyms changes on some maps. Practice getting the fast vault in every vault, because the killer is trying to force you to make medium vaults.
As for Perks: I would drop all of those, as Urban slows you down, Adrenaline is useless till the end of the match, Kindred is nice to ensure getting unhooked but won't save you from campers and your goal should be to never get hooked, resistance is only good when you get hit - you don't want to ever get hit, and you often want to be healed to full health state.
I would suggest taking Decisive Strike, Dead Hard, Spine Chill, and Inner Strength.
Decisive Strike: Mainly to counter tunneling, but more for when your team pulls unsafe saves. When your very good at the game it turns into a 60 second invulnerability, which means a free gen, or escaping at the end of the match if injured.
Dead Hard: Very good for dodging attacks. Mostly used to reach another loop or get another chance around a basic or unsafe loop. When you are good, you can use it as a breif invulnerability to ignore attacks, and avoid traps.
Spine Chill: Counters Stealth Killers. Best used to know exactly when the killer is close enough to leave a generator, or if the Killer is near an area of a totem, chest, or survivor that needs to be saved. It ignores Terror Radius perks/addons/abilities, so you will know if the Killer is actually nearby even if your in it's terror radius.
Inner Strength; 8 second heal, faster than self care, counters noed, counters hex: totems, counters nurses calling, pairs well with decisive strike, and locker based perks. (After being unhooked if Inner Stength is active, immediatly hiding in a locker you get healed, or the killer pulls you out activating your DS).
However use whatever you find most comfortable. Just prioritize gens above all else. Your own survival above anyone else.
This is all you really need. I got to rank 1 in 2 days alone with only knowing as little as this.
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Stay awake. You can stay awake several ways. Fail a skill check on a generator, go and collect your alarm clock, get hooked, or have someone else wake you up.
Do it smart. Don't fail a skill check unless the gen is almost complete, if Freddys projection is on cooldown, or when Freddy is moving a body. Don't run across the map to get your clock, if Freddy finds you, loop him to your clock, or when you complete a generator on this side first, then run across the map to your clock and start working on the nearest gen. The best way to wake up is by staying asleep till the first unhook, then have that person wake people up. Then from then on trade waking each other up.
As far as countering his strong loop potential. When you are awake it doesn't matter. Asleep - Avoid loops with snares, and don't run directly into generators.
All of his abilities have sound and visual notifications, so he is very easy to counter when you learn how to stay awake.
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@Regionlock said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1023963#Comment_1023963
If you actually believe that's my connection you are beyond convincing. My recorder is dodoo, it's not my connection. Everyone in those videos had the same experience with the killers. It's like trying to convince the hackers or lagswitchers themselves in these forums, lol.
What do you guys want to see endgame discussion of all of us discussing how toxic the hacker is as well? You guys are delusional and beyond convincing if you think I was the only one experiencing the fucken 20 mile away kobe swings. Get real kid.
Its this exact response thst tells me you don't know what your talking about on how latency works in games. But yeah, keep getting hostile instead of learning how something works.
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@Regionlock said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_WhBf6HJEg
In this one I lost the footage where he teleported me to him from mid map and hit me after a chase. My Geoforce experience is a laggy unreliable recorder.
Omg, fix your connection.
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Civ 5 is a good game, had a lot of fun playing it on my recent vacation.
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How to counter Doc: Lockers.
PSA to Docs: Don't take Iron Maiden
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Yes. I've had to block comments on my steam because of this game. A lot of the time I have to close the in game chat, because of the people in this game.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1023520#Comment_1023520
I just ran a killer for 4 gens on the new map by using that counter area because there is literally no way you can get a survivor there if they have resilience until the entity blocks the vault.
Thing is you just time it and on the last one jump to another pallet loop, then come back and do it again, I did this till 4 gens were done. It was very easy, took minimal skill, just seeing a very safe spot and abusing it.
Don't even get me started on the new Lery's map. UGH. It looks great, the attention to detail is amazing beyond belief. But they didn't need to turn the map into a second Iron Works. Before you actually needed skill to run the loops as survivor. Now it's just "Oh I know these god loops spawn here, so I will just run there first any time the killer even shows their face". Even then if ya'll run low on pallets (because you never run out of pallets - ever, that was and will always be a lie). You can always just run to the office, which is always conveniently near the center of the map, so you may have to take a hit, but you're gonna get there anyways.
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Rarely. I put a disgusting amount of hours into learning the game, all the loops, all the tips and tricks. Just to be good at Killer and to rank up. I rarely ever lose mind games, and even measured the distance of my attacks, speed, and falls on all my Killers. Then I lose to potato's who teabag and harass you in end game chat, because they got away when I grabbed them, or they were saved by their 4 "get out of jail free card" perks. Like nothing is more unfun than watching 4 people run around like chickens with their heads cut off, and then just get to make so many mistakes for free and because of servers and bugs you lose because of it.
I literally had a match where a Meg anytime she went into a chase, that was too hard on her computer, there would be a half a second. Then she would just be gone. No where to be seen, and her scratch marks disappeared. Probably because she just rubber-banded back behind me, and is now taking off on a different route with a second helping of Sprint burst.
After that I had a match where a David dropped a pallet on the same side as me, and as I went to take the hit. I got stunned, and he got to jump the pallet for free. Why does a pallet stun me, when there is a survivor between me and the pallet?
Then directly after that I tried to grab a David off a generator that was near completion. Half way through the grab animation it was straight up canceled, and the David ran away. WHILE MY KILLER WAS STILL RECOVERING FROM THE GRAB ANIMATION.
Don't even get me started on the stupid hook tech that THEY LITERALLY ADDED BACK IN, being able to crouch and hide behind people hanging on hook, or simply crouching next to a hook to avoid an attack, because for some reason the dev's think it's a good idea to have an auto aim feature that always prioritizes the hook, and hooked survivor over the one directly in front of you. It's not. That's a dumb idea.
Then when I play Survivor. I hold m1 on a few generators, get them done in no time because of the easy af skill check. If my team is doing bad, I got loop the killer through easy af safe loops. Then either take the hatch, or the exit gate. Depending on IF I got hit at all. Omg so boring. I'm not surprised Killers are leaving.
These were literally my first three matches today, and i'm already done playing Killer for the day. So good job, you just gave yourself that much of an even longer waiting time for Survivor games.
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@AsePlayer said:
I mean what's with a huntress hatchet being thrown next to you and counting as a hit?
DBD is hitbox and latency city.
And grab's. Halfway through a grab animation it just ends and the survivor gets away with basically a half time stun on the killer. Feels great that the survivor makes a mistake as to sit on a generator too long, and just gets away for free.
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@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1021944#Comment_1021944
It has the highest kill rate of all of the maps (around 70% if I remember correctly). I find it to be an incredibly un-fun and frustrating experience as a survivor. It definitely needs some major balance changes IMO.
Learn the map then. The first big change for me when it came to Hawkins is when I stopped looking at every pallet and going "wow that mass of random garbage and metal is very unsafe", into "If I loop around the wall through this room, through these two doors. I got my self a safe loop". In addition don't be afraid to use two pallets as a safe loop. Get creative.
The part I love most playing survivor on Hawkins is that it doesn't feel the same boring safe loops over and over again, the rng actually makes it new and exciting every time. Taking actual skill rather than just knowing the most basic loops.
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@Freki said:
@Pythonheir lol repeating what was said does not make it any clearer. if a killer dc's they don't keep the sac achievement in the tome as they don't get anything added in. I don't know if i should shake my head or to laugh.
@GhostofYharnam I'm not here to argue but you wanted to.
The idea that you feel you need to keep explaining yourself is the funny part, this entire time I have only agreed with you, and implied killers won't leave game so long as they get their archive.
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@HellDescent said:
they probably got something in terms and conditions, to which you agree by playing the game. Imagine how many people would be getting their money back right now, including myself.
Could you imagine how much money I could get back from something like League of Legends.
OH DAMN.
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Hawkins Lab is very balanced. I win just as often on that map as Killer as I do Survivor.
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More safe loops, and more distance between hooks?
None.
Better lighting, looks more mysterious, and menacing.
All. Every single one.
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@Freki said:
sigh.... @GhostofYharnam I was being sarcastic but your original comment is this: "Can't even play a match without some entitled brat dcing because they hate the map, the killer found them first, or some other dumb crap. Please just do something this is getting way out of hand." guess what that doesn't say anything about annoying on both sides TILL a later response. I end up agreeing with your later statements.
@Yung_Slug yes it's GREAT to go on to another match when you were almost to get the challege that says complete 1 gen with poised AND make it out, then the killer DC's... I'd love to hear you be the one that happens on. moving to the next match doesn't matter in these cases
@Pythonheir just what? I was talking about the KILLER dc'ing! lol
And. I'm. Gonna. Get. The. Sac. Archieve. If. You. Like. It. Or. Not!
Lol, so i'm glad you do like it :D
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@ShadowRain said:
Matches finish too fast now, SWF kills red rank killers.
Even increasing gen times by 15 seconds each would be decent
We all should agree that the maps need to be reworked. No one wants to sit on a generator for longer than 20-80 seconds holding m1.
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@Freki said:
It's great to know that you're upset by dc's because others are too.. but it's just perfect that when survivors have the upper hand and are escaping the killer can dc and deny survivors blood points, completed challenges etc... so sorry it only affects you.
Really the dc issue is a pain yes. but it's not just one sided.
I'm gonna complete that sac archieve if all your teamates dc or not.
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They are working on a DC penalty. It's just buggy right now
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Surveillance.
Yeah that's what I've been doing. If I can't have a perk to apply pressure for me. Than I will just have to do it - MYSELF
*Cries in smokers cough*
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Pachydermophobia, and also this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcZUPDMXzJ8
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Clown
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Hag.
Freddy is Balanced
Nurse is Balanced
Spirit is Balanced
Hillbilly why are people even talking about him is Balanced
The only reason that people are not tearing Hag apart is because not enough people play her that she dodges statistic's, but I know of the godly builds you can do on her that ensures the 4k every game - no matter the skill of the survivors.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1021183#Comment_1021183
Seems pretty easy to search one box that is near a gen to guarantee that you only need to do two more in at the absolute minimum two minutes. Rather than searching all the boxes in one lump sum, you break it up into smaller bites before and after the timer starts so you can maximize gen efficiency.
My point is that I personally believe taking away the fourth box is a hefty nerf that would hamper the Pig's stalling more than some people seem to realize.
To be honest I don't even think she needs to be nerfed, She's good where she's at. I just would rather if she was less RNG based. It's laughable when you get a hat, and then the first box you go to you immediately get it off your head and your on gens again.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1021166#Comment_1021166
Search one box, then do a gen because from there I only need to search two boxes once the Timer starts?
Wait there are people who actually search boxes before doing a gen? I don't see a point in finding the key till after the timer starts.
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Instead of the RNG on head traps, the key is always in the third box. This can be changed via the use of Add On's.
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Resident Evil is coming out with an asymmetrical game.
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Have you played on the new lery's map against doctor?
It's like the first time playing on Lery's map, for the first time playing against doctor, like you just started playing the game for the first time.
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"My Turn To Be Survivor" or "Why Won't Anyone Heal Me?" - Meme Build
Legion w/ Stab Wounds Study, Stolen Sketch Book
Dark Devotion, Play With Your Food, Dying Light, Discordance
"I'm Turtle You're Hare" - Meme Build
Legion w/ Iridescent Button, Stab Wounds Study
NOED, Blood Warden, Blood Echo, Rancor (or Remember Me / Fire Up)
"Red Legion" - Competitive Build
Legion w/ Stolen Sketch Book, Iridescent Button (or Legion Pin)
Thanatophobia, Nurses Calling, Pop Goes the Weasel, Surveillance (or Discordance)
I'm still working on my sweaty build for Legion. I'm not sure which is better Discordance or Surveillance, and if I should just drop Nurses for something else. I've been testing the new Ruin on them, but the totem still get's cleansed in the first 20 seconds of the game 9 times out of 10. So yeah play around with it if you want, go with whatever makes you feel most comfortable running. Thana, and Pop are really the only ones I would guarantee to take on Legion in a sweaty build.