LordRegal
LordRegal
About
- Username
- LordRegal
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Comments
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A removable perk doesn’t feel OP to me. None of the things you mentioned in your first post are removable by the killer. Ruin can be completely removed, making it useless for the rest of the game. One of a few reasons why I refuse to run it. It’s also completely counterable by hitting great skill checks - another thing your above mentions don’t have (a way to hit their trigger condition without actually being impacted by it). So, I’m inclined to say it’s not OP.
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I feel like the whole “streamer says Nurse is still viable” argument ignores what people who play her more frequently have been saying, which is “yes we can still 4k with her, but we aren’t having fun anymore.” Otz and Tru3 are both excellent killers, but neither of them play Nurse much at all. So they’re going to approach it from a viability point, which is, yes, she’s still viable. I as a former Nurse main won’t argue that at all.
What I will argue is she’s extremely unfun to play now. Every. Single. Time. I want to use my power as Nurse I am punished twice over for it. First by the fatigue, which was expected, and then the cooldown period, which is new. It’s made me legitimately not want to blink in games with her because I don’t want to use them and then be stuck in a waiting simulator watching my prey getting away. I played her seriously...3 games, post rework. 4ked all 3. But I remember just being so done with the game by the end of each one because I was just frustrated and not having fun. Fun is more important to me than winning. Had an Ace trolling me today as Trapper. He messed up finally and stepped in a random trap, I mocked him back (spinning camera around) and laughed as he DCed before giving the fourth player the hatch. That was fun. 4king as Nurse is extremely unfun and it’s why I’ve dropped the character.
I know I’m not the only one who feels that way. Multiple people who loved playing Nurse have said more or less this. She has too many glaring weaknesses now that top level nurses can mitigate relatively well, but doing so is stressful and not at all fun. So if 7% of good Nurses dropped her for not having fun anymore, and no one new picked her up, we’d see her kill rate go down about that percent. And that’s more or less what’s happened, or at least it’s what I believe has happened so long as we don’t have updated pick rates for killers. I’m willing to bet Nurse had a pretty hard drop off in pick rate after people saw and tried out the changes, and that explains her new stats.
Viability isn’t where Nurse is hurting. Fun is.
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The only time a perk is "mandatory" is when you get to the teachable perks. They will show up every level until you take them because the game assumes you want them asap (and they're tied to reaching certain levels so it does make some sense). Otherwise it's down to luck, though I've definitely felt like certain perks I didn't want were following me every single level on the level 50 bloodwebs (have 4 perks per web, you can get 2). Just RNG hating you, unfortunately.
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@DwightOP said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/937617#Comment_937617
Leave alone already, I don't want to discuss with you if you don't understand the basic ground of the topic.
Feel free to not respond to this if you don’t want to. I simply want to point out you gave half of the dev reason for not making Kindred basekit (too strong) and ignored the other half (would buff swf too). I came into the thread predominately to point that out. I then directed my other question from your first thread to the world, and no one was willing to answer. So, since I directly opened with the other half of the argument you used to start the thread. I think it’s safe to say I understand the base of the argument you’re trying to make.
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Long queue times are one thing...you can always read a book while you wait or do something else (I oftentimes have a different game I'll be working on while in queue for DbD). This...this is bad. No one should have to go against someone that much more experienced than them...
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@Perelie said:
Hmm interesting how you all argue against ruin as basekit but want kindred in survivor's basekit. Really makes ya think...
I’ve argued quite strenuously against Kindred basekit as well. So I guess my stance is “perks are perks for a reason, making them basekit is not a good balance move”
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Hard disagree. Ruin is a perk I actively avoid using because I come to rely on it, and that makes me play sloppily and blame it on ruin going too fast as opposed to anything I did. I don’t think making it basekit would do anything positive. If gens are too fast by default then the problem are gens, not that ruin takes a perk slot.
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@knell said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/937622#Comment_937622
If Kindred is such an extremely valuable perk that is worth the perk slot, then what people should be asking themselves is, 'What entitles SWF to gain pretty much this same extreme advantage without having to use that perk slot?'
I have used the perk in SWF and have not used it in SWF. The games I had it were smoother than the ones I did not. So while I will agree that SWF get something akin to Kindred, I will not agree that it’s the same, nor that Kindred does not help SWF.
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@Zhavorsaria said:
I don't really get the feeling the devs are reading this anyway.
So many people have been complaining about the killer adept achievements. You used to only have to kill all four survivors, meanwhile they changed that but survivors still only have to walk out.
Seriously, search "killer adept achievement" or just "adept achievement" on this forum and be ready to read a whole damn book. They're not doing anything about it and for me the most frustrating part is that they're either ignoring it or don't care.
Everyone is obviously entitled to their own opinion, mine is that I'd wish they would reverse it to just killing all survivors.
I mean, if you go back even farther the adepts were "get 20k points, 5k in each category" ...keep in mind I agree it should be a 4k, but the argument "it used to be like this" isn't always a good one.
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@Dreamnomad said:
If you want Kindred then use Kindred. Either it's worth a perk slot to you or it isn't. Don't expect everything for free.
Seriously though. It earned its spot on my survivor builds. Extremely valuable perk, worth the slot. No idea why people aren't willing to let go of a single one of their perks for it...
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@DwightOP said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/937445#Comment_937445
Buddy, stay in your bubble and stop annoying me. Thanks.
What a truly enlightening argument that counteracts my points. Just because I disagree doesn't mean I'm not allowed to have an opinion. Nor does it mean your argument is more solid when you refuse to refute me.
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It's definitely the most balanced level in archive 1. Nothing stupidly grindy, only one that feels too hard (Dark Sense)...it's really solid. Nice middle ground on level of challenge.
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I still have yet to see anyone say what four perks are so important, so core to the survivor experience, that no one is willing to trade ONE of them for Kindred. Because ultimately that's what you're saying if you want it basekit. "I am unwilling to change a perk off for Kindred, but I also REALLY like what Kindred does and would like to be able to have and use it."
The devs have said that a second reason they don't want to make it basekit is it would buff SWF too. Which it would. No need to waste time telling each other where everyone is if you can...you know, spin your camera and see it all yourself in a fraction of the time. I've run it in a 4 man SWF in 2017, long before the buff, and it was genuinely beneficial to do so. So I'm sorry, but I'm really not seeing the part where SWF isn't impacted by making it basekit.
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The devs have to my knowledge not said anything about looking at Moris or keys. Whether or not they are is another story, but at least publicly we have no word on this.
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I would like to point out that the devs ALSO said that it would buff SWF as well if they made Kindred basekit, which was the point I made the whole time in your first thread about this. And you never did answer my question about what four perks you find so important a survivor cannot possibly perform as well with Kindred in one of their place, because that's the only reason to be this determined to get Kindred basekit I can think of - it's an extremely powerful perk, so what four perks are so important you can't live without all of them?
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Ghostface trades height for a standard TR, but can mask it on command, while Myers is stuck with what his tier gives him. It’s a good tradeoff and makes them unique despite sharing stalking.
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I mean, powerful or not, I as a former Nurse main find her straight up unfun to play now. I don't enjoy having to wait twice after using my power every time. I've completely dropped the character since I just don't enjoy her anymore. I can still 4k with her without add ons, just like I used to, but it's extremely frustrating and just not rewarding anymore. I know I'm not the only one who feels that way either as there'e been multiple people saying more or less the same thing I have around here. So, if even a small percent of the "good nurse" population have stopped playing her, we'd see the numbers fall...like we have.
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Keeping the structured order helps showcase what level you are, so I think it should stay. Otherwise you have no idea if they took the face as their P1 or their P3.
Also you didn’t justify or otherwise explain where the 2000 shards came from so I can’t say yes outside of greed which would be a justification.
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Bill and...pretty much how I did things before, except leave Nurse at 40 instead of P3ing her.
I don’t use survivor teachables so Bill is the only one I need still, and I enjoy playing pretty much every killer so I’d get my teachables eventually.
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Trapper: I love strategic gameplay and he was the first killer to offer that.
Wraith: out of the original killers he was always the most interesting to me, so I made myself use him well and I love him to this day.
Nurse: the high skill ceiling and precision gameplay fascinated me and kept me learning for a long time. Plus you don’t need add ons at all ever so as an economy player she’s excellent- no longer find her fun post rework.Hag: See Trapper.
Legion: I find their power extremely fun to use even if it ends up not being super effective.
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The art team really does do an amazing job almost every time. Elf Dwight is another excellent one, and it’s hilarious seeing him run past. Love it.
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Good to see Legion’s in a better place than we thought.
...what about Nurse though? Her rework was out in November, surely there’s enough stats to show if she was impacted as severely as many Nurse players have said. Specifically I’m extremely interested in her pick rate before and after rework...if I’m not wrong, I’m expecting her pick rate to have dropped significantly.
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They need to take out the bug that times people out for crashing while loading. Do that and I’m happy to see it come back for good.
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The ONLY one I want to see gone is dark sense. The rest are actually pretty reasonable. So I’m close to saying #getgudkid, but that one challenge is stopping me.
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Did you do all four of them in a single game? And did they go into the stagger animation every time? (As in, you didn’t drop a pallet on a killer picking up a survivor too soon or something similar)
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@Elvenmonk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/934500#Comment_934500
I've never seen another adam player:(
I relate to him. Moving to a foreign country and all that jazz.
I definitely see more Adams than Tapp and Quentin as well, but Nancy is more common than Adam I think. I want to blame the fact his default outfits are extremely visible, and people who don’t pay for cosmetics or grind the prestige outfits won’t want to be at an obvious disadvantage insofar as stealth.
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@SpookyJeff said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/934468#Comment_934468
To me, low rank survivors have three main reasons they'll be off gens most of the match: 1) Immersion: they hide behind a tree, hit a locker, or sit on the edges of the map any time they hear the faintest heartbeat. They are inefficient because even if the killer is chasing someone else and can be seen traveling in another direction than they are in, they still hop off the gen and lose that time/progress. These are also usually your hatch campers, so toward the end of the match that could be a reason those last few gens aren't popping. 2) Inefficient/unsuccessful hook save attempts. This one also happens to decent solo survivors sometimes, but in general, a lot of newer players will hop off of a gen full map away and run in for a save when there was someone halfway there already who also ran in. That can be 30s+/almost half of a gen wasted. 3) Can't hit ruin skillchecks. These are usually your real low-scorers at the end of a match because they maybe get 2-3k on gens and 2-3k on totems if they luck out and find a few.
I would personally say #1 and #2 are symptoms of the same problem - too afraid of the killer. #3 is the one that super new players would struggle with, but ultimately the average player improves there quite quickly.
My point was that, because I see more of 1 and 2 than 3 when I get matched into low rank games, gen speed doesn’t matter in low ranks because survivors don’t repair anyway. Which ultimately means that you could increase the time it takes and a lot of newer players wouldn’t notice because they’re too afraid to expose themselves on a gen for a while.
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I’ve seen way more Nancy players than Quentin or Tapp players, so she is out there.
That being said, Steve has more comical outfits and the most interesting scream in the game (good or bad is your choice there) while Nancy is a lot more of a serious character that fits in better with the cast so she doesn’t attract the memelords. That being said, I’ve seen a lot of red jacket Nancy players so there’s at least some appeal to her cosmetics as well.
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Do gens not get done in low ranks because they take too long or do they not get done because survivors are too scared to go to a place they know the killer could easily come and realize by the gen progress someone was there? Because if it’s the former then I agree at least at a conceptual level, but if it’s the latter then gens could pop in 20 seconds and low ranks wouldn’t finish them. As is from my own experience coming back to the game a few months ago, the low rank meta is hiding in a corner, not doing gens, so I’m inclined to believe the problem is that as opposed to gen speed.
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I believe the smallest skill check would be unnerving presence + overcharge...+spine chill (unsure if spine chill affects skill check size) but I'm not 100% sure on that
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...I hate that I'm now expecting the bait at this point...
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They're skins in the sense that you can play every survivor with the same perks and get the fundamentally same experience. That being said, you're correct that models and voices do make some differences in how they play. I do consider them skins though because of what I said, while if you ran the same perks on every killer you'd still get a fundamentally different experience playing each of them because of how different their powers are.
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@Peanits said:
By other survivors? Mostly because people have had bad experiences with that guy that Urban Evades across the entire map while they're on the hook, only unhooking them after they hit second stage.
In terms of emblems, mostly because there's not a whole lot of skill involved in staying hidden. But that's a whole debate. Should someone who can't survive in a chase rank up and get even harder chases, or should they stay where they are where they have a better chance if they do get caught?
That's not to say that stealth is bad, but there's a time and place for it, and there's some people out there who can't tell when it's time to sprint in, and that tends to sour other people's opinions.
I'm not contesting the majority of what you said, as most of it makes sense and I can definitely accept the logic, but could you not also say that a survivor who's extremely stealthy but also does objectives and saves should have an equal chance to rank up and go against killers who are harder to stealth against? I have never been able to loop. Been to rank 1 a few times as survivor, and I still can't loop for #########. What I'm good at is not being easily found, even while I'm helping the team. My emblem for chases is usually terrible because I'm bad at them, but I find success in the stealth and intelligent play gameplay...even if there's no emblem that gives me anything resembling a reward for "was only in the killer's terror radius twice all game"
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I'll be honest, every SINGLE time that thread came back to the top I read the entire title, except replaced "heck" with something that would get [BAD WORD] in its place. So that was amusing when I was tuning out during a meeting I didn't need to be in...
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I say no mostly because it would be too tempting to buy often and that’s not healthy for me.
Also would make the game more P2W since you could pay for less grind. Generally not something I want to support.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/930507#Comment_930507
Add-ons, at least for the time being. The Doctor is a bit of an oddball here because he's sorta' based on the idea that you can "build your own madness" and pick the effects you want with add-ons, with the base madness being somewhat of a blank slate.
Ugh. I love Doctor, don’t get me wrong, but I do wish his madness was more interesting at base. I hate using add ons because they’re limited, and I don’t want to rely on them because I won’t always have them. Same reason why I don’t use items as a survivor. The changes to his kit sound fantastic but if his base kit madness is still a “blank slate”...that makes me a bit less enthused.
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@Peanits said:
I'd say try it first. You've only heard part of the changes, jumping to a conclusion now is silly.
For those who missed it:
- Treatment mode is gone. You no longer need to switch modes to shock survivors. (Shock and then hit people quicker.)
- The Static Field has been replaced with a Static Blast. This shocks your full terror radius and gives any survivor hit by it a full tier's worth of madness. Cooldown of 60 seconds.
- Various add-on improvements.
- Backwards skill checks in madness.
And there will be a PTB first, of course, which means it could change before going live.
Also he'll be getting his own unique chase music. That doesn't really affect balance, but it's cool and I figured I should mention it.
Oh? That actually sounds really nice. I’m glad I didn’t grease my pitchfork.
Are backwards skill checks basekit or only add ons? I ask because I prefer to run killers without add ons, so madness being more threatening at base would be a huge thing for me.
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Before I go grease up my pitchfork, can we get a list of changes for those of us who couldn’t watch the stream?
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@Boosted_Dwight said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/930396#Comment_930396
We've gotta keep the Christmas spirit alive! Send in the Elf Dwights!
Is...is that locker...jingling?
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@Boosted_Dwight said:
Well at least we got Christmas cosmetics.... :(
we can bring the Christmas bells to the trials with the new Dwight outfit at least...
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please note this is me commenting based on how the challenges in previous chapters worked, not firsthand knowledge of this one.
I believe the gen and heal state ones are watching for the equivalent of 10 full gens. So if you did 1 gen yourself and helped with the back 1/3 of two more, you’ll be at 1 and 2/3 gens. Think of it like the daily for saboing hooks. If you 99% three hooks you’ll be counted for saboing two hooks.
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I’ll be honest, outside the dark sense one this is my favorite level of the Tome. Nice mix of doable and challenging without being completely bonkers. No stupid levels of grind either. I’m going to enjoy doing these
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In game reports do help, I’m pretty sure. At the very least it raises a flag. If you follow that up with a forum report with video evidence, it doubles down on the report.
Things like hostile and inappropriate chat messages are viewable just through an ingame report as well so that does work even without a follow up.
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It’s a bug in the system right now I’m pretty sure. Thus why this is a test rather than the full release. Doesn’t mean it isn’t annoying and frustrating, but at the very least I’m pretty sure it’s not intended.
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I do think this round of challenges is the best balance of “oh hell this is going to be hard” and “simple enough” that we’ve had. There’s a few in there I’m concerned about getting in a reasonable number of games, but I’m not looking at any of them and thinking “I will never get this, ever.” So, all things considered, I’m pretty content with them.
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It’s a good thing they’re testing it before it going live for real, that’s for sure.
what I find interesting is the bug for server side disconnects always imposes a harsher dc than the first few penalties. I’d love to take a look at the code doing that...
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@Peanits said:
But wait, these forums have only been around since about June 2018.I was going to say, Steam was still the place to talk when I stopped playing for a while...
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I was super active on the Steam forums back when that was the place to get info to the devs. Hard to believe this place has been around long enough to get there, jeeze.
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Have a good break!
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@innocentguy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/929725#Comment_929725
I would rather not either but my point is that this game is a casual game. Not something Everybody takes serious. Stuff happens. People have lives. To penalty first and second time offenders is ridiculous. (Not even talking about the DC bugs that cause you to get a penalty, which is even more ridiculous) they need to be a little bit more loose with the penalties is what I’m saying.
but once I start going around slugging everybody every game watching them bleed out I’m sure more people will realize
Except that’s not the point you were arguing though? You were saying you’re not happy that if you go find the killer immediately and let them down you they might slug you to not let you suicide and go to another game. That’s a totally different scenario than slugging everyone just because.
Also the intended first penalty is 1 minute. Anything else is a bug and unintended for first time offenders. It an emergency happens you won’t be queuing up within a minute anyway.