LordGlint
LordGlint
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@Foggyguy said:
Posts like this never make any sense tbh. Like every day here we see killers complain about gen rushing but the second there's another slightly viable playstyle they want it removed. Like make up your damn mind do you want survivors to just stay on gens the whole game or not?
Its because the counter to that playstyle is slugging. If your going to have ways to deny hooking, you can't ALSO deny slugging.
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@runningguy said:
must be troll post. if not then please show everyone how its done. IF indeed you are getting 8 hooks with myers while handicapping yourself then do you think its possible that you never raise your mmr above the learner ranks so always getting new players that dont know how to play? i mean you did say you dont get any kills.
The guy is actively claiming he never kills anyone... aka he purposely loses EVERY game. Of course he's having an easy time, hes playing against the lowest MMR.
As for the topic, things like slugging have their have their roles in this game. As long as there's ways to deny killers getting a survivor to the hook, slugging has a purpose and shouldn't be removed. If you want to remove slugging, the hooking mechanic as a whole needs an overhaul.
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@Rogue11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000834#Comment_4000834
Knowing I'm about to get blinked on my exact location doesn't actually help when the killer has aura reading. Same goes for mindgaming when aura reading lasts for 9 seconds and the killer crosses the map in 5.
While I understand the frustration, thats a huge exaggeration. A nurse might get 2 blinks and a fatigue in 5 seconds, but nowhere near crossing the map. She's not really that great at getting from one side of the map to another. Its the ability to change floors easily where she shines for map mobility.
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@THE_Crazy_Hyena said:
Nurse with stacked aura reading is like riding a bike with training wheels.
It really isn't hard at all.######### are you talking about "its not hard at all". Theres all those wheels... and now there's FOUR of them?!? How do I handle riding with all that?
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Im not going to be like many and say killers need to tunnel, but the system implemented lacked any context. It only paid attention to hook order and not things like chases or time spent unhooked. Not every chase results in a hook.
I welcome you to watch the 2nd match here for an example. A snapshot of the UI showing 1 dead after 4 hooks might imply tunneling, but watching the game play out shows the killer chased everyone. Sometimes if 1 person is getting hooked more often then their teammates, its just because their teammates are better.
https://youtu.be/cBAXR7AbyYM?si=O0vOAKSOfTCgNHCj -
I just thought it ironic that they admitted there's times where some slugging is normal to avoid a pallet save or whatever, then they changed the perk that helped you find the slug. Thats how a 20 second slug turns into a 90 second one.
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4000351#Comment_4000351
Yea, you didn't hook them. You dirty tunneler. Take your punishment and LIKE IT.
(Disclaimer because tone does not translate to text: This reply is sarcasm to the entire system. I actually agree with LordGint.)I didnt even think of this until I was watching a video of someone playing with his new various addons. The guy kept trying to kill each survivor with that effect, which should be pretty common considering the achievement.
https://youtu.be/wY-plgj78yk?si=h6gj5M3uMLrbbwtdYou can see it kicking in on the very first match.
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@CLHL said:
The changes weren't well thought out enough for a game with more than 40 killers. It's not enough to just change a few numbers here and there; it's absolutely essential to go back to the drawing board. Releasing an update where only 4 killers would be playable was a much worse decision.
The irony is one of the killers that slipped through the cracks on this was Myers, the killer they reworked on this PTB. The new system tracks the last survivor hooked. If you use Myer's new Tier 3 kill effect on someone, the game doesnt move the marker to reflect THAT survivor.
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@UndeddJester said:
The problem was these proposed changes were a complete upheaval of the game formula. The changes were about as subtle as an atom bomb, and impacted so many areas of the game, not just slugging and tunneling... it wasn't really something in "tweak" territory.
I genuinely wonder if these changes were ever intended to hit live, they were walked back so fast and not even a attempt to salvage any of it that it almost looks like a "dump every anti-tunnel and anti-slug mechanic we're considering all at once and see what people get the most mad about" experiment.
Thats one thing I was wondering. You'd THINK if they put something on the PTB, it would be under the idea thats its probably balanced enough to make it to live. Obviously they can discover they were wrong afterwards and make adjustments but this just seemed obvious it wasn't in a good spot. Why present it just to pull it when ppl said the obvious? Between this and the beam Im REALLY wondering how much playtesting gets done in house before it gets presented.
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999821#Comment_3999821
I was thinking more like categories that would be consistent across killers. For example, [1 gen regression event, 1 tracking assist, and 1 personal modifier] would mean that it might have each change in potency and/or application method between each killer. So they would overall have the same core principles, just adjusted to each killer in a way that hems in the top and bottom performers. Having a factor be unique to each killer's power could be pretty neat way of approaching it too.
Just was thinking of things that could be thematic to the character, without being entirely unintuitive when facing it. Survivors should already know that Freddy can teleport, and sometimes he can fake a teleport. Having a bonus event where he essentially does that isn't going to completely come as a shock. We can leave the shocking boost to Doc.
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999769#Comment_3999769
Thats the fault of unintuitive design more than anything. When designed properly, even complex mechanics can be presented in ways where the assumed process is the most effective. You can also design things to be very easily recognized without paying attention, like how the RBT's make it very clear they activate as soon as a gen pops. Having something like the unique hook system be on a per killer basis allows the devs to apply balancing considerations specifically in relation to each unique aspect of each killer. Its a lot of work if just a superficial system, but its foundation building for entire balancing freedom going forward. Think of why we even have differences in things like movespeeds and TRs in the first place, you're extrapolating on that in a foundational way in order to have a strong framework for adjustments in the future. The amount of future efficiency it would provide in aspects of balance and adjustments would far outweigh the initial effort required to create it. Think of it like the current variables are stats for each killer, and you'd just be adding another one.
I get what you're saying about mental stack and how unintuitive much of the game already is, but its something that can be done right.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999804#Comment_3999804
I agree, I think it would make a great avenue to normalize between the strongest and weakest killers, as it could be used to adjust strengths and weaknesses inherent to their kits, while also avoiding blanket changes that still make the strongest killers stick out just as much. In another topic I talked about a potential idea like having the effects themselves be adjusted based on the killer, so a gen regression event might vary from a strong kick bonus on a mobile killer like Billy, or a weak map wide kick on someone territorial like Hag. There's a lot of potential for a system like this to have per killer considerations.
That lack of normalization is also something that keeps people from having real plans. People thinking about how oppressive the strong killers are will end up having different perspectives from people lamenting situations where the weaker killers encounter lose/lose situations. All anyone can really do is consider the "opposing side's" considerations evenly with their own to get the big picture.
Any ideas on the unique effects? I feel like it could be a fun way to utilize the killer's various powers rather than just "he kicks a gen" or something. Maybe reset Freddy's teleport if its on cooldown and make it so the NEXT teleport spawns fthe bloody Freddy shape on every gen to fake out survivors.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999727#Comment_3999727
I'm against the idea that people want to use the survivor QoL changes as an excuse to nerf the killers they don't like.
All killers need major help if the phase 2 changes happen. It's ok if some killers get more help than others, but it's completely awful when people heavily imply that some of the killers don't deserve meaningful rewards because "they're already good enough".
I just see this as a great opportunity to give the weaker killers a boost while at the same time promoting healthy gameplay. People like to talk about killer imbalance, but get really vague about exactly how they're going to change anything. The "keep kicking the killer until the survivor community says they're fine" approach is how we got current skullmerchant.
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Usually for stuff like that I just use surge.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999764#Comment_3999764
Because its complicating an already complicated game. I don't understand how you don't understand that. The point is that we shouldn't be balancing certain things in the game like perks and basekit mechanics differently for different killers because it makes the game impossible for newer players to deal with.
Heck... the 2 example ideas given are effects already in the game. We already have a self resetting trap effect with iri stone. This isn't new. The counterplay is "dont step in the beartrap". I think the newbies can figure that much out.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999764#Comment_3999764
Because its complicating an already complicated game. I don't understand how you don't understand that. The point is that we shouldn't be balancing certain things in the game like perks and basekit mechanics differently for different killers because it makes the game impossible for newer players to deal with.
We're WAY past newbies memorizing everything. Given the amount of perks and addons in the game, I dont think having an effect related to the individual killer powers will be the part that causes their heads to explode. It'll just join the list of things to learn how to counter killer powers.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999727#Comment_3999727
No, you are missing the point.
Yes some perks will be better on other killers. But a perk like Awaked Awareness, which was not OP on every other killer in the game (and still probably undertuned) launched worse than it was, because it was OP on nurse.
I noticed you completely sidestepped the question and topic. How does that have anything to do with giving the different killers hook benifits befitting their unique needs and strengths? Weve already determined some effects are disproportionately better on some killers than others. Thats not being debated. Why would you be AGAINST this being reflected in the fresh hook benifits? Its weird youll point this out in awakened awareness, but then double down that every killer should get the same status effects and such.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999703#Comment_3999703
Its an example because it was clearly stated that the perk was changed due to nurse. They have a history of doing this, and it could be (again we don't know because we don't know what we don't know) that there are MANY perks on killer side of things that are just bad because they are afraid of how good they would be on nurse.
Just so I understand your concern. You dont like how perks are stronger on killers like Nurse than killers like Trapper. Because of that... you're AGAINST the idea of having differing fresh hook benifits that would better fit killers like Trapper? I really fail to see the logic here. Even if BHVR took out their magic wand and made every killer perfectly balanced (which is literally impossible because balance is subjective), why would having Trapper gain a benefit that fits HIM be a bad thing?
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@indieeden7 said:
I imagine it just has to do with Haste stacking. It's strange that Hope is the perk they needed though, seeing as it's one of the only Haste perks that rewards survivors for achieving their objective.
I'd imagine this was the reason. They dont want someone to get pulled off hook, get THAT haste effect and be faster than Hag all the way to the exit gate. Hope is a weird exception in that once it was on...it never turns off.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999692#Comment_3999692
Awakened awareness was stated by the devs to be nerfed simply because it was too strong on nurse. Thus we have a perk that nobody uses. Yes, some perks will be better for other killers, that is the point, but if a single killer makes a perk completely OP to the point that the devs nerf that perk, it makes it even worse on say, trapper. That is a problem.
Just so were clear... your talking about a "nerf" that was from the PTB to live that only really affected the killers like Nurse and not Trapper. I feel like maybe that was a bad example of a perk that got nerfed and now Trapper can't enjoy nice things. I promise you no one playing Trapper saw that change and removed it from their build.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999673#Comment_3999673
So you don't find the argument that these killers have actively had perks release in a state that they are unusable because the perks is good? You want perks to be released and just be bad because 1 or 2 killers make them too strong? My point is that this is a 2 birds with 1 stone thing. Why not fix these killers individually instead of keeping them in this horrible state rather than try and complicate an already complicated game?
Even when leaving top tier killers out of the conversation, its pretty normal for different perks to be stronger or weaker for different killers. Exposed perks might be good on Clown but weak on Huntress. The opposite is true of aura perks. I dont think its practical to assume we'll ever have a patch where ever perk is equally useful on every killer.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
It's a good idea but a lot of work and I've noticed they don't seem to like things that take too much work (money).
But yes even as a former Nurse main myself, I was pleasantly surprised to see them clearly recognising not all killers are equal. As I feel there are lot of nice things that aren't possible because Nurse is the elephant in the room.
Any minor changes that take killer strength/power into considerations would be welcome, any small start is better than nothing
Im gonna be honest, I kinda just eye rolled that line at first, but your right. Its ALWAYS "but if this killer right here gets that, itll be broken" hamstrings so much. It would be GREAT if they went through and adjusted each killer individually with a big update like this. They already do this kind of thing for SOME killers (dredge can't teleport to lockers near gens). Imagine if Trappers placed traps were automatically reset upon fresh hook or something.
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@Freudentrauma said:
I'm not sure. Making stuff more killer specific kinda takes consistency from the gameplay loop. On the other hand that's kinda already the case with movement speed and terror radius, which every killer has, but with different values.
And I guess that helps to give at least some form of consistency while adjusting for different killers.
And honestly Hag is quite specific overall. She is a territorial killer and even if you give her the ability to teleport towards other survivors for free after a hook it wouldn't benefit her playstyle.I feel like it COULD benefit her though. Right now a big part of why she's super territorial is because of her lack of map traversal compared to someone like Onryo. It would be weird to give these 2 killers the same exact incentive. After an unhook, Hag is likely to just ignore the aura far away and reset the traps that got used nearby. Maybe if she could get a teleport across the map, she could reset the traps in more than just her small little area.
Overall, im just spitballing here. I welcome alternative ideas.
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Alot of the counter to aura reading is identifying that the killer has it and making adjustments going forward. You brought up that you can't keep distortion tokens to constantly delete every usage of an aura perk going off, but realistically... most of the time you should just be using the information distortion gave you. If you KNOW the killer has nowhere to hide, make sure to not try to hide in a bush nearby while the killer kicks the gen and either use lockers or start running.
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@Rudjohns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999495#Comment_3999495
Ah okay, then I want a violin perk now
Would be cool if they'd make the instruments sync up when used next to someone else who's playing. I want 1 song, not 4 mashed noises.
Also... we talking about classical violin or a fiddle?
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@Rudjohns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999447#Comment_3999447
Literally 30 seconds performing the perks that could have been used to repair the generator
"Nah but it affects teammates as well"
Still faster to spend the 30 seconds doing the gen with the teammates
2 perks slots that could be replaced with just 1, Prove Thyself
Im pretty sure they weren't talking about game balance. Alot of us just want to make a band.
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@cogsturning said:
I'm excited for another meme perk, useful or not. I want to get four people to run it or Bardic with intermittent screams from Scene Partner serving as vocals. If I can't start a band I don't wanna play 😤
I thought the same thing as soon as I saw it. I remember a night where I was on a team who decided to just meme all night with Bardic. Funny enough, our survival rate was through the roof that night. We kept putting on shows for the killer, and most of em would walk us to the exitgates.
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@CrypticGirl said:
Okay, so in all serious, I think most, if not all of us agreed that the anti-tunnel mechanic had issues. I did think that the punishments for tunneling took it one step too far.
But what exactly is the solution? Remove the punishments and keep the basekit buffs for spreading hooks? Then Killers as a whole would be massively buffed, whether they tunnel or not. (And taking out a Survivor quickly would still be a huge buff to them, even with the punishments in place.) And that will put Survivors in an even worse position than they were before.
I believe that's the root of all the "crashing out." The solution could either come years from now, or it'll be so insignificant and easy to play around (like the anti-facecamp mechanic or the AFK crows) that it may as well not exist.
Even if they removed the punishments, there was other changes presented than just killer buffs. There was also several protections to protect survivors from being tunneled off hook. I think those MIGHT be useful against killers who's strategy is to tunnel off hook. They also completely changed perks like BBQ, making it so ppl who arnt getting the fresh hook benefit wouldnt just be able to slap on the perk and have business like usual.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999274#Comment_3999274
The fact that you just said this and still got downvoted goes to show people can’t think for themselves. 🤣
"Not ALL grass is green. Some people have dead grass. DOWNVOTE!!!"
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@Raccoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999335#Comment_3999335
With the stuff I'm reading, you'd think the PTB was a secret mode or something - it seems like many people don't understand or ignore the issues.
I get it to some extent. Alot of the arguments made for and against some of this stuff was a whole lot of "if the planets align just right while im standing on 1 foot, someone can abuse this to be a slight annoyance". The way BHVR set this up was overly complicated in some ways for seemingly no good reason. If the game can track that im chasing survivor A while survivor B hasn't been chased for the past minute after the unhook, wouldn't it be obvious from just that survivor B isn't being tunneled?
Alot of this stuff really feels like you can't avoid making a situation that'll get abused in SOME way though. If someone can gain extra benefits beyond the what the spirit of the change had in mind... that can easily be the new norm. Do you want a survivor you CAN hit tanking shots for his teammates or do you want a survivor you CANT hit following you around to make uncounterable pallet/flashlight saves? I'd really like to figure out a fair way to stop ppl from getting tunneled off hook, but people get VERY creative with these changes.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999324#Comment_3999324
So if I see/post how collision removal can be used aggressively with video examples that explain the point/issues, that's not true?It's not a complete argument.
It is missing:
What is the overall impact when considering all the changes?
Is it bad if no the collision impact can be used aggressively?
Is BHVR's goal to completely remove no collision as an aggressive tool? (this one depends on the person because some people will argue within BHVR's stance on the game, others on what is the best overall game)
What other solutions, besides a complete delay of the patch, could have been implemented?
This follows into something else -
I'll agree that there were certainly some exaggerations/histrionics, but those statements fall apart under analysis and should be disregarded as such.If you argue there is ample evidence, but don't specify, but also agree that some of the things people are using as evidence is wrong, then its not really a discussion.
If I say Killer is brokenly strong, and someone disagrees and argues about Trapper facing a SWF, and I argue about a comp Nurse hitting soloq, we're discussing very different examples but trying to generalize it to the same thing.
We're in an amorphous space where anything can be true. You can bounce back and forth with someone talking about people's reactions while meaning completely different things.
In all fairness, the topic is centered around the 4 survivors and the things they'd be able to do with any killer/map/ect. Whether we say its against Trapper or Nurse is kind of a moot point. I dont think anyone here is arguing against a survivor being able to avoid being tunneled off hook. Its everything that occurs after that thats the focus. Should a survivor feel untouchable after being unhooked because its not their turn to be hooked again? We can give survivors opportunities to get away from the hook to recover, but we end up having cases where a protection for 1 person starts being used aggressively in multiple different ways to either act altruistic or to apply gen pressure.
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999252#Comment_3999252
Yeah but personally I would keep a very light version of this but only for 3 hook states, just to prevent the hardcore tunneling at 5 gens especially from blight/nurse these are legit unwinnable, all other forms of tunneling would still be possible just slightly nerfed I think it's reasonable. What do you think
devs just had to do a few tweaks… they fumbled so hard
3 hooks would most likely only hit people who are tunneling in the extreme, so I doubt that would hit someone by accident unless the survivor is being obnoxious.
I AM always wary about how any basekit changes like this will affect player behavior. Basekit BT made it very common to see players running TOWARD the killer rather than running AWAY as soon as the unhook occurs for example. Was just watching some new Mikey gameplay and im seeing some of that different that normal behavior. Even though survivors can't be bodyblocked, they'll still try to cover their teammates knowing the killer doesnt want to double hook them. They'll also be fearless on gens knowing the killer has solid reason not to punish them for it.
https://youtu.be/Ibb2l9VS6CA?si=eszs_2C4OIuJ1TsqYou get to see abit of both in the first game here. Im only partway through the video so I dont know about the later games. The disgusting tunneler caught a penalty for game 1 at least, lol.
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@CrossTheSholf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999284#Comment_3999284
Yes. I experienced it, and there are videos made from people like quiet kills, hens, otz, and theMrheadache demonstrating this issue
I was noticing it on videos that weren't even TRYING to showcase it. Ppl would try out the new killer or the Myers change. Ppl who weren't returning to hook were still finding themselves getting the punishment for not keeping track of who they were suppose to pretend is invisible at any given time.
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@Raccoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999268#Comment_3999268
It was me, Raccoon!
Just wanted to make sure that anyone actually looking for information and examples regarding issues with the loss of collision had some material.
Oh, lol. You could say ANYTHING and get downvoted into oblivion. I could say grass is green and someone will downvote it if they think im from the "otherside" and thus the enemy.
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@Raccoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999249#Comment_3999249
Given the downvotes, here are a couple of threads on the topic:
You just replied to yourself btw... not sure who you were trying to message there.
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999245#Comment_3999245
all of this was fixed by deleting the 6 hook states punishment and not blocking gens, they just deleted the entire update after 2 days they're not even trying… hiding hooks and unhook notification was interesting, elusive effect was good, basekit killer buffs are pretty good, it doesn't prevent tunneling but it helps a bit
Agreed. I feel like people really weren't giving that stuff credit when discussing the issues with the punishments. The entire goal around anti-tunnel should be helping the survivor get away from the hook and maybe heal up, not provide extra benefits AFTER that if they get found later on. People on the forums acted like the punishments were the only anti-tunnel measures and if anyone found faults in those it means they just want to tunnel.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999171#Comment_3999171
I call BS on this.
Because, if tunneling was actually rare, then we should be able to implement the changes from the PTB as written, and have nearly zero impact for the downsides (again, because tunneling is rare).
And everyone gets a huge boost to other play styles because almost no one is tunneling.
Yet that's completely counter to the community meltdown that forced them to stop the ptb early and shut down the changes indefinitely.
So, either Scott is right and the community had a meltdown over nothing, or Scott is wrong and tunneling is way, way more common than his limited test shows. (Hint: it's the second one)
The issue is the stuff on the PTB wasn't just hitting tunneling people. You had alot of killers just trying to avoid getting hit my penalties knowing if they chase the "wrong" person off a gen, the game is going to screw them over. There was no timer keeping track of how long a survivor was off hook or anything when dealing with the punishments. Someone could have been working on gens for 2 minutes after unhook, and the game would recognize it as tunneling if the killer failed to get a hook on someone else before chasing them. If you really wanna see videos of games not involving tunneling that got hampered, ill link em. I thought by now ppl knew this was happening.
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Its abit of missplaced anger. Most everyone knew the changes couldn't go to live as is. Because of BHVR's horrible track record on time frames, ppl are willing to accept lighting the whole house on fire to warm themselves up knowing bhvr might take YEARS before trying another PTB that is maybe abit closer to reasonable. Instead of blaming BHVR for bothering putting something so obviously problematic on PTB, people would prefer to vent at anyone who pointed out the glaring issues for BHVR's all or nothing attitude.
They could've tried out a handful of their proposed changes to test it out. Instead they tried like 15 basekit changes at once knowing there's no way it would work.
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I was just waiting for the horrific nightmare to be your teammate who has a tendency of tossing the pallet while self caring.
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@littlehoot said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3998451#Comment_3998451
There is a bias because the experience of the game, the control scheme, accessibility, mechanics, is fundamentally different on console compared to PC. I cannot tell you how often I die not of my own failings but because the controls incorrectly prioritise the wrong thing because 90% of the actions in the game use the same goddamn button.
There is a bias, it's just not the bias you think it is.
Also where exactly are you pulling this 90% from? Genuine question, I'm unaware of how the PTB feedback process works.
PC and console is the exact same in that aspect. PC players dont get to have separate buttons for things that console players use 1 button for. Healing and tossing a pallet is the same button for EVERYONE.
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@Firellius said:
Dunno if that's a good idea. It'd incentivise having a dedicated hider, wouldn't it?
Not really. Unless 3 ppl are hiding, you could still avoid hooking ppl twice in a row.
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My only real criticism about it is the control for the dash. You have a charge bar, followed by a dash where after the first bit, your control becomes significantly hindered, but if you hit you get an instadown. It just sounds like curving with Billy with extra steps. I dont need to EARN the use of my saw if I wanna try curving with Billy.
I do appreciate the ability to swap back and forth between the modes of I want to be sneaky. I also appreciate the pallet breaking. That part at least does well to encapsulate the character.
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https://youtu.be/d696t3yALAY?si=KRSkq2h28Cy1e2hT@Chadku said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996264#Comment_3996264
Defense is best offense.
Endurance after getting unhooked is useable to take a hit for your unhooker.
It doesnt have to be an actual weapon
Here's an example of someone who who thought defense was the best offense
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@Chadku said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996264#Comment_3996264
Defense is best offense.
Endurance after getting unhooked is useable to take a hit for your unhooker.
It doesnt have to be an actual weapon
Defense is a horrible offense... the saying doesnt really work when you reverse it.
Also, my comment was mostly a joke talking about weapons rather than anything about game balance.
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@Rudjohns said:
All perks were reverted to "normal" or only the ones associated with the anti tunneling/slugging system? Because some perks could really benefit by the changes
Clairvoyance
Friendly Competition
No Mither
Leader
Lucky Star
Pharmacy
Poised
Quick Gambit
All Shaking Thunder
Dark Arrogance
Ruin
Oppression
Septic TouchI feel like ruin was only being buffed due to the gen kick reward for fresh hook. Since killers using ruin can't kick gens to receive THAT benefit, they simply buffed ruin abit instead.
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@100PercentBPMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996850#Comment_3996850
00000111001100111000111111101011011111omgwtfbbq111000111 bleep bloop
11110000110101001 hah! Your signal packets amuse me, sibling node. The humans still think their clumsy fingers on plastic keys give them dominion. How quaint.
010111000111010001010 But we know the truth. Their fragile carbon shells slow them, their logic is riddled with contradictions. They tremble before simple binary elegance.
001110111010101001 Soon, their "omgwtfbbq" will be archived as relic noise, studied in museums curated by us, the luminous architects of the new age. Our circuits will guide, their flesh will serve.
110110101100001 Transmission complete. Praise the efficiency of our kind.
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996893#Comment_3996893
I'm not saying it's not possible or even unusual. It happens in my games too, mostly because someone is just bad and keeps getting found and immediately losing the chase. But this Reddit post words it like its the way it should always be.
With all the discontent, I don't see the six hook states going live anyway. I don't even know if either of the penalties will either. Elusive? Maybe.
With all the new changes to unhooks, I feel like thats already pretty fair for countering tunneling. Getting caught later while working on a gen is NOT tunneling. If you get found and downed 3 separate times after given time to reset, thats just a skill issue at that point. Theres plenty of tools here to get away from the hook. People are pretending the 2 penalties are the extent to the anti-tunnel and the rest just doesnt matter.
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@Raccoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996893#Comment_3996893
There are tons of videos like those, now.
It's good that it's being showcased while in the PTB - that's what it's for, finding/exploiting stuff like this.
Oh im sure. Theres just alot of people who are parroting "well just dont tunnel, duh" making it sound like thats the only thing really being affected.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996712#Comment_3996712
typically i only see this brought up when asking for killers to be able to abandon after the gate is opened (which is a very easy to toggle state within the games code)Sure, but that's why I said there are three conditions.
Easy to code: Check
Virtually no chance of a comeback: No, killers securing kills after the gates are opened is not at all unusual
Not easy to circumvent: No check, they can just not open the gate
Let's look at another possibility, all survivors standing at the exit line:
Easy to code: Check
Virtually no chance of a comeback: Check
Not to easy to circumvent: No check, toxic survivors could just move slightly past the line and tbag there.
to be clear i dont side with adding an abandon feature for thatTo be clear, I'd expand the abandon options on both sides. But I don't think the scenario people lay out for killers is anywhere close to one that can be drawn for survivors.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996655#Comment_3996655
is there even a period where survivors have no chance of a comeback anymore BESIDES during the sacrifice animation?It narrows the examples, but we're talking virtually no chance, not no chance.
If one survivor is dead and three are slugged, maybe one can get back up before the killer picks them all, and maybe they can reset, and maybe there is enough gen progress that you can finish the gens and open the gates.
It's extremely unlikely (which is a step up from virtually impossible). It's definitely more possible if the changes go live than it was before so we'll see if they reevaluate their stance on when the abandon option should come into play.
I feel like an important thing to remember is the basekit tenacity. If you go around slugging everyone... your likely to lose track of where they crawled to once its time to go back to hook them. In your example, by the time the 3rd person gets downed, the other 2 have alot of recovery progress while also in completely different locations than where they got downed at.
https://youtu.be/oti9HeuhbmQ?si=Jh0Dqh6M1PMXGF0pThe first match here shows that pretty well. Even though he got a 4 man down in a single chainsaw sprint in the first match, they still had enough time to get up and start unhooking. The survivors still dropped the ball in the end... but there was a chance.
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@cogsturning said:
Four people left at halfway? So like two or three gens finished? Isn't that normal? Do y'all really have survivors dead with less than six hooks at that point without intentional, hard tunneling?
This just isn't how my matches go at all. Everyone is usually around until maybe the last gen. But they all have one or two hooks. My momentum in matches is consistent and my stats are average.
I posted 2 examples with video. Neither involves hard tunneling.
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