Leonardo1ita
Leonardo1ita
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@Reshy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2790573#Comment_2790573
Killers camp specifically because they don't have map pressure aside from sitting on someone who's hooked.
That's not true always, things are not that simple, but in many situations that might be true
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@Reshy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2786444#Comment_2786444
I was being rhetorical, comparing the very high strength of circle of healing relative to other perks. It's got twice the benefit of most other perks, and if killer's healing slow down were doubled it'd be awful.
Oh ok
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@Reshy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2790554#Comment_2790554
Basically, and due to this survivors just slam out gens, which haven't had their timings touched since 2017 despite the addition of all the new second chance and healing perks.
Gens can't be touched until camping and especially facecamping doesn't get addressed in a systematical way
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@Katzengott said:
I don't think BHVR even thought about strechted / brighten screens when they enabled crossplay. Not really fair, isn't it?
Also i don't get why DBD doesn't have ingame brightness settings, like ANY OTHER game. Or a graphic/perfomance mode.
Exactly, they try to avoid players using filters in game just because the game is supposed to be dark, but this doesn't stand anymore, all maps almost are bright, especially Coldwind Farm.
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@Reshy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2777352#Comment_2777352
Imagine if Sloppy Butcher's slowdown on healing 50%, and make Hex Pentimento also reduce healing speeds by 50%. That's the kind of numbers COH does, but in reverse.
No, because then Self Care would become completely useless and take 64 seconds to heal. It's just circle of healing that should have -65% self healing speed, and honestly much less speed buff, maybe only 50%.
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@Marc_123 said:
CoH don´t nedd a speed boost at all. It would still be good as it is an unlimited free medkit for the team.
I agree, this could be a solution
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:)
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2773669#Comment_2773669
Circle of healing and all other healing boosting perks are inherently designed to counter sloppy butcher and other negative healing debuffs.
Instant downs and broken status effect(such as plague, bubba, etc.) are meant to counter healing.
The negative healing debuff perks are suppose keep survivor injured when healing perks are not in play. In the past, I used to use sloppy butcher and thanatophobia because I noticed that before COH was invented, survivors had poor healing options in regards to perks and their good healing options were limited, so the idea that I could equip two perks and keep entire team in instant down status was like amazing deal. Its in part to why survivor's complained about forever freddy because he would hit them once and from that point on, they were basically injured entire game vs a killer that had decent chase potential. hence they nerfed that to the ground.
from personal point of view, out of all killer aspects of playing killer, my most demised aspect of playing killer is bodyblocking. I hate body-block with a passion. Bodyblocking is probably the activity that makes you feel like your 5 cent killer with no power. its often the activity that survivors use stimulate to showcase their power-role complex. So negative healing perks was a way for me to deter survivors from bodyblocking. To explain why bodyblocking is effect. Killers get slowdown when they hit a survivor and survivor get speed boost so in cases like EGC, its free escape from exit gate and during normal gameplay, its great counter to tunneling. It can really hurt you in long run as killer vs strong teams as showcased in the whole tru3ta1ent vs Oracle wraith videos.
self-care does not need a nerf, so that never happening. Boon totems as a whole were suppose to be limited area effects that empower the survivor in limited area. In their words, boons were meant to be strategically placed. COH is not a limited area effect. its global ability that unlocks the ability for every player to self-care on the map at near med-kit level speeds. There is no real strategy to it. Its just strong bonus without much thought process that survivors run to when they're injured. survivors already cheat perk economy pretty hard from 16 vs 4, so COH really exaggerated perk economy even harder to like 18 vs 4. speed is definitely a strength of the perk. I would say that COH is like fake 5th survivor on the team that heals you for free. I think the defining strength though of the perk is that it disincentives the killer to injure multiple survivors because injuring as a whole lacks any reward/meaning with it active.
With med-kits, med-kits have limited charges and not every lobby is 4 med-kits, so not every survivor is pointless to injure and there is a point where the med-kit run out and injuring becomes rewarding. COH is not like that, it never run out so its global deterrent all the time. I think boon perks would be better off if they were global like killer perks and only affected individual user. At least than, many survivor would need to equip perk and spend time looking for totems and the perk is less of global deterrence and more of powerful individual bonus. Other suggestions regarding boons have been that the killer can break totem permanent so that COH has high risk/high reward element to it.
I think just that overall, decreasing healing speed is boring way to balance healing perks because they often just incentivize the survivor to not heal and push generators faster by utilizing pallets as second chance health states because doing generators becomes faster than healing itself which is why self-care is looked down upon as a perk.
Meant or not it doesn't matter, it's still super busted, that's why it's banned from competitive Dbd
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@DesignDad said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2777335#Comment_2777335
Simple answer: It can happen, but it is not intended.
As I mentioned in the Q&A: There's a major issue with the matchmaking system right now with how it handles backfilling lobbies. Specifically, it almost entirely disregards the MMR of the replacement player in favour of filling the empty spot as quickly as possible. This can and does result in inappropriate matchups, especially when it's the Killer who is replaced. This is not the fault of the MMR system itself, but rather the matchmaker not using the MMR value correctly.
To be clear: This is being actively worked on. No ETA on when it will be resolved, matchmaking systems are very complex.
There is another situation where this can occur, and it can be a touchy subject so please do not infer that I am talking about you or anyone specifically...
There are players who absolutely love playing DbD and who are not especially good at it from an MMR point of view. While there is a general correlation between time played and increased MMR, that is not a causal link. There are people with 1,000+ hours who happily live in the lower end of MMR. So long as these players are still "winning" about half the time against new players, then this isn't a problem. Rather, it's an intended feature of the system. They should be allowed to have fun, too!
All that in mind, I completely understand that this case is NOT what you mean when you ask "Can a brand new survivor get killers with thousands of hours as their first game?". The truthful answer to a literal interpretation of that question is "Yes", for the above reason.
However, I think a fair way to reword that to get closer to your intended meaning would be "Can a brand new survivor get killers who are extremely good as their first game?". And while the answer to this is still "Yes" right now, our intention is to eliminated these scenarios as much as possible. There are already a number of systems in place to prevent this: New players start at a very low MMR, currently I think it's around 900. The maximum search range cuts out a lot of the upper tier of players, currently I think it's +/- 400. This starts very low and increases up to 400 the longer you wait in the queue, so this also helps to reduce mismatches. (Note: These are dynamic values that we tune based on the current statistics, so don't presume they have always been this way or will always be this way.) These should cut out a lot of the mismatches, but unfortunately it is dramatically undermined by the Backfill issues I mentioned previously.
I hope that helps clear some things up!
Very helpful!
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@AngyKiller said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2778187#Comment_2778187
They have said they consider it cheating, and urged their Fog Whisperers to not do it.
But they have not fixed it. Because that would require at least 30 minutes of work. 🙃
I just hope the reason they aren't fixing stretched res RIGHT NOW is because the problem is somehow more complicated to code.
If it's just as described by this code, there's no reason not to do this ASAP, because you just need to copy past the code pretty much.
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@Prex91 said:
We need first devs to say their opinion on the topic. Have they said that is a problem? What is their position on it?
Almo, some devs and the mods have said that they don't support it and it's something they don't like.
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@drpynz said:
Sounds like you should be a dev with these guys. Maybe they are hiring?
They are hiring, but you gotta have experience, like you gotta know programming stuff and know other things.
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@konchok said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2773671#Comment_2773671
I really don't feel that that many killers can secure death like he can. It's very much just a Bubba problem.
It's not just a Bubba problem, and here's why:
@Leonardo1ita said:
https://youtu.be/Pz7f_WPutq8?t=5220
This video that Mandy put under a recent thread, plus, for those who remember, what Mathieu Côte said in the interview on the YouTube channel of The King, where he agreed when they asked whether basement should be removed from the game, should tell us good news!
As I said in this thread, Leatherface is the main example of why I think this is a giant problem, but even Doctor: if you keep shocking the rescuer in a camping situation, unless 2 people well organised come at the hook, you can't do anything, especially with 1 or both discipline add ons that reduce the delay of the shock.
Plus, you always have the option to grab the rescuer when healthy (this should straight up be removed, it's such a simple and nice change), which makes such an important part of the match always a GAMBLE, especially when you consider the lag and the grab validation.
And, whAt nobody EVER says:
With any killer, you can always bodyblock the hooked survivors: you just need to block with your body the rescuer, and unless another survivors comes, it's gg, if you're quick enough pressing A-D as killer the rescuer won't even have the option to initiate the unhook, EXACTLY like the old facecamp.
This not even considering all those spots in indoor maps, and outdoor maps like Eyrie of Crows where you can just bodyblock on door with your body and the survivors can't do anything to pass unless they're coordinated and another survivor comes. Which is, in solo Q, impossible unless all using Kindred.
Another thing maybe few noticed, that I haven't seen in the patch notes, is that they fixed the bug where you could evade the restrictions of deploying Victor/ switching characters with Twins if there was a height difference like on basement stairs or a hill. Thanks BHVR for fixing this bug!
In conclusion, other than being boring/frustrating, camping is a big problem for solos, especially in indoor maps because as the dev said it takes so much time to realise someone is camping, and there are killers that require an insane coordination to avoid a disaster:
-Bubba is just a death sentence literally, even against strong teams unless the first chase lasts a lot it's always 2k guaranteed with the correct build
-Clown with Pinky Finger
-Iridescent head huntress
-Doctor constantly shocking
-Hillbilly's insta down
-And, last but not least, Myers with infinite T3, or with Tombstone. It's even harder to save than it is vs Hillbilly, you just can not save vs an instadown killer unless you want to lose the match and have 1/2 survivors slugged and one hooked.
Plus, if you're using a mori, and you force the second stage, and hit borrowed time right off the hook, you can prevent DS in a locker because once the deep wound timer runs out the survivor is forced out of the locker, and you can mori.
Hopefully the devs will fix this problem that's been part of the game since the beginning, and make trials a healthier and funnier experience!
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@Zeb89 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2769723#Comment_2769723
No, it won't break anything at all unless they make a mistake. This is very clear to anyone familiar with Unreal Engine 4.
The posted solution would support "normal" resolutions while keeping certain constraints.
I agree, how can modifying this break the game lol, it's just visual stuff, screen ratio settings.
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@DesignDad said:
First off, amazing post and follow ups. Thank you for taking the time out of your day to help break down these very complex design challenges into a more readable and understandable form!
PS – Love Trueskill, I remember reading papers about it many years ago. It solved some problems with matchmaking that are unique to videogames (ie building a fresh team for every game) in interesting ways.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768500#Comment_2768500
It’s absolutely a challenge to communicated about this topic, as it is both extremely technical and complex. When doing a Q&A stream, I am trying to boil down years upon years of research and experience into a few sentences that are understandable, correct, and quick to deliver so that we can answer as many questions as possible. As much as I would love to talk to everyone for hours about Matchmaking, the mathematical nuance of Glicko-2, and how all of this needs to be modified to apply to an asymmetrical game… At some point I need to get back to working on the game. 😊
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768605#Comment_2768605
I’ll offer up a bit of clarification about this point: There is a “soft” cap for MMR as it is considered by the Matchmaking system. A player’s numerical MMR value is allowed to go as high (or as low) as the math says it should. However, when the Matchmaking system is looking at building matches from players in the queue it will effectively round down (or up) the extreme outliers to help them find a match. This was done in direct response to one of the MMR tests we ran last year: Some players were completely unable to find a match because they were such extreme outliers, no matches could actually be formed with them involved. The soft cap is a dynamic value that we can change at any time (and we have adjusted a few times already). Right now I think it’s around 2,000, so any players who have an MMR above that value are treated by the Matchmaker as though their MMR is 2,000 for the purposes of building a match. Post-match MMR adjustment is still based on their ACTUAL MMR, though.
It's worth noting that this isn’t done because there are tons of players above the cap, it’s actually the opposite! The vast majority of our players fall within our lower and upper soft caps. The caps exist to handle the rare, but still real, edge case of extreme outliers. They deserve to play the game, too!
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768229#Comment_2768229
Sadly, in practice, it’s much more similar to the worst-case scenario. It still weighs MMR a bit when backfilling, but not in a meaningful manner. This is partially a hold-over from the Rank-Based Matchmaking days. But, as mentioned, it has been identified and is something we are actively working on addressing!
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2768500#Comment_2768500
Improving the algorithm to take into account team results is also underway. Originally, we didn’t pursue this approach because Survivors can leave a game and start searching for their next one before the previous game had completed, meaning there were no results available for updating their MMR. This is one area where the solo-result system has an advantage, as soon as you are done in a game your MMR can be updated.
In reality, the MMR adjustment from a single game is small enough that you likely won’t notice a difference in opponent from match to match as MMR adjustments are meant to show impact over many games, not just 1 or 2. Our hope is that we can hybridize the system and use both team results and personal results to generate an even more accurate MMR that contains the benefits of both approaches!
As another note about the various posts talking about the 1v4 aspect of DbD as it pertains to the maths:
Our batch update logic (that’s what updating with multiple results simultaneously) is based on the Glicko algorithm. It (Glicko) was designed to handle situations where you’ve got multiple results in a short period of time where there’s unlikely to be much difference in the skill of the player between those games. To put it another way, think about someone going and playing in a one-day tournament: They win some and they lose some, but their skill level at the game was probably the same the entire time. In DbD, we use this for Killers to process the results of a single game: 4 matchups that all happened simultaneously are “batched” together to make use of this approach.
If you’re more curious about the maths, I encourage you to check out Mark Glickman’s website about it! He provides papers explaining the formula in detail. A quick search for “Glicko” on your search engine of choice should lead you there.
We have made many customizations to the formula to reflect the asymmetric nature of DbD, but the core mathematical concepts remain the same. 😊
Hello @DesignDad, I guess you're Patrick from your words right? Thank you for being open and sharing with us these very detailed informations, and listening to us on the forums, I wish you devs did it more, I can't express my happiness :D !
I wanted to ask a question: if you're above the MMR soft cap, and at the moment of the matchmaking survivors/killer that are on your same SBMM level are also searching for a match, does the system make you much more likely to be put against them or does it round up your MMR to the soft cap and that's it?
If not, imo it should, so the "outliers" have the chance to meet each other much more frequently and have more competitive matches!
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@DesignDad said:
Some good points in here! Having to do that 4 times is a bit much, especially against survivors who know how to play against Pyramid Head. It should be pretty easy to lower the number, we'll look into it! 🙂
Thanks!
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@konchok said:
I've made this suggestion before and I really think it would do wonders for Bubba. If Bubba uses his chainsaw from within 8 meters of a hooked survivor he goes into Tantrum. He would still have the instadown from the Tantrum, but with the loss of control I believe that hook saves could be coordinated and BT would be much more effective. Bubba would still be a monster around the basement by camping the stairs and he always has the option to use the mallet around hooks.
Edit: hooked survivor, not any hook.
Bad solution, there should be an overall solution to facecamping, not just Bubba with a not so great solution.
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@AngyKiller said:
Oh, they're well away the CoH nerf does nothing. The whole point was to make it LOOK big (A whole 25% sounds like allot!) but ensure it did nothing to weaken CoH.
This way, Survivors could claim 'The devs majorly nerfed CoH by 25%! Killers need to stop complaining!' while full knowing it was only 4 seconds of nerf, and in no way affected the perk's usability. This way, they could continue to enjoy a broken perk while telling Killers to stop being upset about it.
Exactly
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@dugman said:
Corrupt’s main weakness is if all the survivors decide to just hide until it ends. As soon as they see gens are locked they just sneak into random lockers immediately or whatever and do nothing for the duration. If that happens then unless the killer maybe has Lethal Pursuer they could simply be out of luck finding anybody before Corrupt ends.
Fortunately for killers a lot of survivors run around in the beginning and leave scratches or just don’t hide very well and get seen anyway. In which case the Bubba facecamping thing in the original post works. But on the occasion Bubba comes across a sneaky group that waits it out they’ll be down a perk before the action really starts.
I've heard that very skilled players and competitive players can find survivors hiding corrupt for 2 minutes. I don't know how consistent is that, but in some maps if you know the spawns it's doable.
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@Kalinikta said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2771226#Comment_2771226
Whether you are solo or not as a survivor, you are part of the team. The fact that you have difficultly coordination between the teammates is not the killers issue and they cannot be based on that either, they have to face SWFs as well. That is why BHVR is most likely adding the what people are doing icons to help out the solo coordination.
The argument that it is difficult to face, but you can do it applies to both sides. You cannot tell one side to get good, while not stating the same to the other side. Use information perks, run the killer and even solos can potentially win... it might be difficult but it is not impossible.
If you want to play as competitively as possible as a killer, just do it. As a survivor or killer you will meet people that play 'sweaty' and there is nothing wrong with it, you do your best, you win or lose and move on. Wanting to beat the most competitive setups and playstyles while being casual, relax, meme-ing about is unrealistic, either match them or know you will at times meet opponents that are very hard to beat.
What I mean is that there should be mechanics that from the very beginning are studied to be counterable with the same efficiency as a solo or as a premade group.
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@fulltonon said:
Ah yes, win win situation for killer, just like every perk for survivors!
Many perks in Dbd's history have been fixed, multiple times, such as DS and SB because they were too oppressive to play against.
Now we have to see how strong they are on these killers, especially Bubba that imo should get a complete facecamp denial mechanic, as I hope the devs will implement.
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@LeFennecFox said:
It's going to be unfun on artist and very strong on top 5 killers. People will run it with corrupt, deadlock, dms, pain resonance/tinkerer. You will apply a few PR and block a gen a the start and with good mobility block 1-2 gens ready to pop. All while you're chasing as well since you know a survivor is/was there so you can stall the game while you get your quick hook states.
It's a gigantic problem on those killers where you can not trade, such as Bubba. With that you just facecamp, maybe see 1/2 gens across the map getting blocked, and you stay there at the hook. No way for the killer not to get less than 2 kills if they play correctly.
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@fulltonon said:
It's not broken unlike boilover.
This is just whataboutism, if both were to be broken, we fix both.
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@Kalinikta said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2771099#Comment_2771099
Why is that an issue, it is just like facing a bully squad or a gen rush squad as a killer. Hopefully these groups will meet and have the competitive battle that they seek.
You do you man, if that is how you want to play there is nothing wrong with it. Have fun, it is a game.
As killer you're alone and "you're the entire team", so even if it'd difficult to face the most broken stuff, you could potentially do it, especially of you are not a E/F tier killer.
As survivor, if you're solo, you cannot do anything in that situation even if all teammates were competitive players, because there's no coordination, and by the time you realise what the killer is doing, the match is already lost.
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Ok then, it's declared your non constructive criticism
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@SuzuKR said:
lmao
Well there's nothing to laugh, because if you get that as a solo, other than the face that you'll die 100% if you're the one who gets facecamped, probably you won't win that match because of coordination issues. Even with kindred likely
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Dbd is not dying, he heard this a million times.
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@Zeb89 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2762611#Comment_2762611
Unsurprising. This is something which only a select few people care about and will probably never get fixed despite there being a solution available which would be able to accomodate all possible "normal" resolutions.
Quite sad when you think about it, considering how stretched is ruining the core of the game.
An aknowledgement from the devs would be at least decent, since there's been no answer to the stretched res problem ever, apart from 1/2 informal comunications, in all forum posts and devs communications I've ever checked.
Mandy pls tell us something about this, this is really good stuff that could help the game so much!
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@PlayTwink said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2760253#Comment_2760253
Okay and how you're gonna counter strong windows in main buildings, jungle gyms and shack without bamboozle or crowd control?
Doing mindgames, you don't need bamboozle or crowd control. Infinites in Dbd are super rare nowadays. Also I have godly mindgames that you can do at jungle gyms with any killer even when the pallet is down, that nobody does ever.
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@Mandy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2760214#Comment_2760214
We used to do that, then we get accused of cherry picking the questions.
We take the most upvoted questions, some of them we can not answer with a specific answer for sure because it's not things that we can discuss yet - we do clearly state in the QA section though that we probably won't be able to answer things on upcoming things.
I always prefer a soon ( or the level of how "soon" something is XD) a million times more than just random questions.
Btw if many thing are on the plate of being done, I'd be excited people!
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@Mandy said:
There is nothing further we can or will add to this, for reasons that have been explained above.
It's not our practice to discuss what actions we are taking to prevent cheating - we don't want the cheaters to get advance notice of things etc.
It's difficult, we are aware, of course we're aware but we're very limited on what we can say for the reason that I just explained.
I know that's not what many of you want to hear and I'm sorry about that, but I really cannot give further information.
Oh ok, completely understandable!
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2735761#Comment_2735761
I'll try to keep this shorter than my last post, but to touch upon a few of the points you've brought up:
1: On the subject of The Nurse, using pick rates as a determining factor is very shaky territory. First, you've gotta consider the fact that part of the reason she's picked less often is due in part to the bugs with her power. Even if someone likes The Nurse and is doing moderately well with her, it's totally within the realm of possibility that the bugs were too frustrating for them to continue playing. Secondly, pick rate is not a universal thing. While it stands it reason that she may not be picked at lower skill levels (owing to her higher learning curve), she becomes far more popular at higher skill levels. I won't speak for everyone, but I'm assuming at least some people would like to see more Killers pop up regularly in the higher skill levels.
But beyond this, The Nurse's bug fixes is also a prime example of something that has come up a lot over the years. Often times we're asked to focus on things like game health rather than content / balance, and The Nurse and her various bugs was often tied directly to that as a poster child of sorts. Fixing these issues did require a complete redo of her coding, but it's a prime example of us doing exactly that: Putting content / balance to the side to focus on fixing things. I totally understand if you're not pumped for this next Mid-Chapter, but it's a pretty shocking reaction to something that was asked of us very often (focusing on fixes/game health over content).
2: To think point of Circle of Healing, I just want to say that this is absolutely not something we're ignoring. We make a point out of letting things settle before making rash decisions these days. Between PTBs & live these days, the changes we make are almost always fairly minor. We've been burned in the past by making rash decisions when the initial feedback was rough. Nowadays, we try to let everything have some time to settle before we start thinking about how it should change. This gives us a better idea of where it actually sits rather than making a knee jerk reaction and hoping it works out. Circle of Healing is an even trickier scenario since it came bundled with an entirely new mechanic (boons), so it's very important that we see how things work before diving head first into changes.
That said, though, I can't reveal if/what will happen to Circle of Healing right here, just please keep in mind that there's always a cycle that looks like this:
- Something releases
- Wait for it to settle
- Determine if changes are needed
- Create changes
3: On the subject of Freddy, I feel like this something that often gets misconstrued as well. In reality, kill rates only play a small role. You compared him to The Nurse, and I'm really glad you did because she's the perfect example of why that's not the case. The Nurse overall has a fairly low kill rate (well below the rest of Killers), but that doesn't mean she's weak. She's tough to play, and in the right hands, she can be hands down the best. But that also isn't necessarily a problem because there's a ton of skill that goes into playing her extraordinarily well, and there's also a lot of skill that goes into playing against her well.
In the case of Freddy, on the other hand, you had a Killer that was very strong without needing much thought or skill. Dropping a couple traps at a loop would yield very strong results with very little risk or strategy. His slight tweaks aimed to make the strategy of spamming traps constantly while in a chase less viable.
On the point of lack of skill, I won't delve too far into this, but that is a very loaded point to make. Many developers play the game daily (typically not with BHVR tags in their name, they don't want to be recognized). I myself used to stream this game three times per week, and I was playing at the higher ranks just fine. Sure, not every game developer's going to be ready to jump on an eSports team, but expecting everyone working on a game to be able to play it at a competitive level is a frankly unrealistic standard, even if some of them are pretty good.
Ok, I believe you about this 100%, for real.
Just the fact that you came out in the open answering this post gives you so much credibility, I wish you did this more (you devs in general)!
On this you're far superior compared to those who only want destructive criticism and troll.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I think it's supposed to mean that everybody you fight has a weakness, even if they appear to be so much more powerful than you that you feel you have zero odds of defeating them (or in a more real life sense, someone is better than you at something, ends up being a cocky ######### about it, and then you become better at it because their arrogance makes them slip up).
What it means in relation to the Oni, I don't know. I'm not brushed up on the lore very well.
I think so, I though something similar like this.
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@Tr1nity said:
"Within the survivors' end-game teabags, there rests a blood warden." -- Renjiro's Doctrine 11:2
Lol
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@Chilli_man2400 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2733227#Comment_2733227
Basically what the bottom meant was is if you positioned correctly you could prevent unhooks by body blocking now you can’t
What? How? That was really possible? Maybe glitching inside the survivor or something? I suppose only with those killers with a bigger hitbox (do they have different hitboxes?), because you should in theory be able to unhook from both side of a hook.
Still it doesn't solve the problem of being able to bodyblock the hook if just 1 survivor comes, and the unhooking animation cannot even start if you're "good"
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Oh OK, this part 3 with big Nurse fixes is very very nice, much needed.
Also, some fixes on various bugs, nice.
Overall, decently good changes but some nerfs were unneeded and missed the point completely, but unsatisfied about the major problems like cheating and others.
I'm asking @MandyTalk , and @Peanits that wrote the thread, what does this mean
- Fixed some specific vulnerabilities that could be abused by cheaters
And especially this:
"Fixed an issue that caused some Killers to be able to prevent unhooking by standing close to a hooked Survivor" ?
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@talama said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2732101#Comment_2732101
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/LIK2N06DLKK0/ohno.jpg
(you also going to be back as soon as you realize how many people are streaming elden ring and how much your viewers are gonna drop)
Ehm no because Elden Ring will be such a massive and constantly updated open world game that views maybe will be almost the same.
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@Veinslay said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2732103#Comment_2732103
But that was Otz lol...
Ok, either you're ignoring on purpose all the problems the game has and writing passive aggressive comments to play with feelings in some way, or you're completely clueless on why some people that actually play the game are frustrated. Not just because of the game, but the atmosphere that got created around it. It's one of the two.
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@Pipefish said:
They'd probably leave regardless, Elden Ring has so much hype.
The question is who will leave FOREVER, with no going back.
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@ScottJund said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/303316/devs-you-broke-otzs-heart
for the record Otz tru3 and I are absolutely dropping DBD for Elden Ring. I doubt permanently though.
Oh #########, I just realised now you were Scott reading the name XD! Nice to see you here!
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2732080#Comment_2732080
why do you people always come up with smug rhetorical questions like this?
Because they just want ez upvotes, maybe so they get the forum achievement.
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@Adjatha said:
Your link doesn't seem to connect to anything
Yeah. I just put the link with no time, still doesn't direct to the livestream. If anyone could put on a functioning link to Otz's last livestream, it would be appreciated.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2732080#Comment_2732080
why do you people always come up with smug rhetorical questions like this?
Exactly
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Still, thinking about it, the changes overall are too little, and many things in the game that ABSOLUTELY needed to be addressed: cheaters, circle of healing, DH hit validation on some killers like Twins, flashlight macros, games held hostage by hackers, not a word about them. Very disappointing.
What has been said is very good, but God knows when they'll actually be implemented, if they will be implemented, etc.
Also SBMM still counts only kills and escapes, and nothing else. If you get facecamped by Bubba, that's it. If you do a 5 gen chase and you die because of Bubba facecamping it's the same of doing nothing all game and immediately escaping through exit gates.
Sadge.
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This has just gone down to a train of hate and actually few understood the big problem I was evidencing in the thread.
Dbd will always remain like this if people don't play both sides, killer mains (usually correct, but some expect every match to be always a competitive super strong swf team, and dislike every quality of life buff to survivors even when it fixes an unfun part of the game) vs survivor mains (don't understand why killers camp, tunnel and slug, and some are even toxic and tbag and flashlight macro the killer), both blindly not understanding the other side.
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@laucters said:
Sounds like you never play killer and you are just a subpar survivor on top of that. Sad.
Nope, I play a lot of killer, maybe even more killer than survivor, and I do scrims sometimes against comp players in KYF.
Listen better to what I wrote in the thread
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@KateMain86 said:
Face camping is something that simply ruins the game for me and from my experience a lot of other survivor players too. It happened to me again today and that fine thread that still has me attached to this game gets a little thinner every time it happens. A killer standing in front of you to face camp and even worse when they decide to hit you over and over on the hook is simply unsportsmanlike and it needs to be recognized as disrupting normal game play. Its toxic and something needs to be done to greatly discourage it from happening. Proximity camping is toxic too and I don't care what anyone says about that. If it happens in the end game collapse that is one thing but before that is just toxic.
In my opinion the simple solution to this is just to make it reportable with levels of punishment for doing it. The first can be a warning so they know not to do it again. The next can be a 1 day suspension, then 3 day, then a week and then if they still keep doing it then just keep adding time to it. It doesn't have to be a ban so there can always be that chance that they get it and stop doing it. If there is any concern that it would deter people from playing killer or the game then wouldn't that be a good thing to have less killer players doing this? If steps are being taken to address it then isn't it something that is seen as problematic in the game? I do hope something can finally be done soon to put an end to face camping and hopefully other things as well such as tunneling and slugging in hopeless situations for the survivors.
Punishing with bans is not the way at all, it has to be something in the gameplay itself, otherwise players will find every possible way to evade the system, over the fact that it's just a bad idea. Proxy camping can be countered, the real problem is the uncounterable part of facecamping
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@Rizzo said:
Let's keep the discussion in English, thank you.
Ok, I'm sorry!
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@Zozzy said:
Do you ever play killer? I find it so hard to believe you do beyond a random farm match for a daily where you let everyone live...
I do play killer in fact, vs very strong teams
@Dramzar_Myers said:
Camping is not problem. Camping - it is the strat to NOT let the hooked to escape. In other words - this is strat that allows killer secure his main objective in this game. Just like that
I'm talking about facecamping, which can be very unfair vs solo players, totally uncounterable vs some killers, especially Bubba.
@The_Medicine_Man said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2718487#Comment_2718487
Of course he doesn't, he thinks that getting a 2k consistently with Leatherface is a problem.
I think the game should be reworked totally on this point, and give killers a reason not to camp and tunnel
@Zozzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2718493#Comment_2718493
To be fair i would like camping gone. Its just op is all about the Yeah! Punish the killer they got it way to easy! bandwagon and don't mention or acknowledge the reason camping is a thing and why people feel forced to play like that.
I know the reason, which is that going for a lot of hooks is game losing, which can be corrected with fixing the facecamp problem
@Bwsted said:
I can't really watch the video right now. If anyone can post a tl;dw it'd be much appreciated.
For the rest, I think removing hook grabs and interrupts would probably solve 90% of the facecamping issue. If unhooks worked like fast vaults at windows (i.e. no channeling the action, they don't allow grabs and once the action is queued up it cannot be reset), then killers could still easily get the 1 for 1, but not free pressure by threatening the 2 for none or simply stalling the save.
It would be very much in line with what they said about nerfing facecamping but not proxy'ing.
Leatherface would still pose a problem, because he won't be able to stop the unhook anymore, but he can shred through BT. That would have to be addressed on the killer specifically.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2718487#Comment_2718487
OP is far from being a survivor main. They've been on the forum for quite some time and they've very much advocated for killer buffs for just about everything. This is actually the first subject I can remember where I see them taking the survivor side.
Exactly, thank you.
@Zozzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2718504#Comment_2718504
I am all for removing camping. But only if they fix the underlying cause and reason it happens. Do you really think people enjoy standing at a hook on killer?
You can't go for 12 hooks in the current state of the game. The survivors objective is unrealistically simple and fast in comparison to the killers vs the resources available.
They devs will hopefully change the game with movies and stuff, so more reasons not to camp, unless the devs have no brain at all.
@Dramzar_Myers said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2718504#Comment_2718504
Well. Remove hookgrasp...just no. It's useful even if not camping. If you chase someone and he decides to unhook during chase it the way to punish for mistake. As I said previously facecamping is a strat. For example if there is the gates open and EGC is started the camping is the most useful strat to not let escape as many people as possible. If you remove camping - 5 gens gone an EGC will be equal to let survivors escape without chasing them
A strat that cannot be countered at all in the specified cases
@Chordyceps said:
I dont think its gonna happen. That video is like 2 months old, and they talk about how theyve tried to do something about it in the past, but none of their ideas really worked out. Which is exactly what I was expecting tbh, cause Im of the belief that camping doesn't really have a solution that is healthy for the game. And it looks like the devs tooling around with ideas to solve it and none of them working out kinda reinforces that idea.
Mandy remembered this part if the video specifically in a thread, so I think she knows something about this is still valid since she's a BHVR member
@Marc_123 said:
I would not count on it.
I think they will try to change this silently with new perks - like the new killers which incetivises multiple survs to hook.
New perks are NOT the solution, I really hope after all the change that have been rumoured the devs aren't that stupid.
@Yatol said:
i dont think its going to be anything major, probably just the aura of killer is shown if he stays to the hook, regardless of insidious or not.
That doesn't solve the problem, a default kindred us VERY good, but still doesn't fix the problem for Bubba, Myers perma tier 3, insta huntress, Billy, Pinky Finger.
@BigSwanginRatnuts said:
The rise in hook camping is an issue bred from Gen speed. It's simple. There's no point in going out of my way to go find a chase when I can just make one come to me. With how fast gens go, I am actively losing the match anytime I'm not in a chase or securing a kill on hook.
Sure I could go out and look for a chase, maybe chase someone off a Gen, but strategically it doesn't make much sense. Hook states go about the same speed as a Gen could be done, so I know that if I stay by a survivor on hook I'm either getting a hook state or someone is going to leave their Gen and come to me to give me a chase. This becomes even more of a no-brainer if 2 survivors are injured, or if I have some ability to expose or 1 hit healthy survivors.
I'd leave the hook and patrol gens if I felt like I had a chance at protecting them. But they go so fast there's no point. It's a gamble to go out and look for chases, whereas a hook is guaranteed value.
It's not gens speed only, it's a problem of killers not being able to snowball enough. Nemesis for example: consistent but a bit slow chases sometimes, very good anti loop, but no momentum at all when going around the map.
@BigSwanginRatnuts said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719088#Comment_2719088
Tl;Dr We all want more chases. It's the most fun part of the game for both sides. So the key to making them happen more is to incentivise killers to pursue them more. Punishing camping will not make it happen less, and will only serve to make a lot of killers and perk builds a lot worse and give killers even less options in a match.
Not camping, just facecamping in general, and bodyblocking hooks with the killer's body.
@Marc_123 said:
As killer i don´t like chases.
I stopped more and more to do them if i see the surv is good at them.
Because this is boring - a good surv loops you 2-4 times - then drops the pallet and runs to the next loop.
In a map like game this lasts for the entire match.
Fun fact - just did the 25 pallets/walls/gen challenge in one play on the game.
4 loops is just bullshit, not even against Trapper if you're talking about a "common" single pallet loop where you can see over the pallet. 1,5/2 usually, 3 getting greedy and risking getting hit
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2712528#Comment_2712528
Yeah, it's just impossible to get everyone to deadhook first against decent squad.
So best you can do is either lose, or learn when is best moment to get someone out of the game, so it's still fair for both sides...
It's just boring to tunnel from first hook, so I usually want to give them a chance, but it often backfires :D
Yeah, and that time you played fair and in a fun way they start to tbag and flashlight macro you when you lose/win, and you wish you just facecamped everyone no mercy since the beginning