Kaitsja
Kaitsja
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@Biscuits said:
The most significant I have seen is that console players are limited in the amount of commands they can put on buttons. There are instances where they need to throw the pallet or rewove chains or heal or vault, but it's all the same button. So they end up slow vaulting over to you, or healing someone on the ground instead of throwing the pallet. If you ever see someone do something really silly at a pallet/window/locker, it's probably a console player.
I literally had to come up with the most dysfunctional controller layout to get around this situation. Sometimes someone would drop their item at a vault and I'd get screwed out of the fast vault.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3152218#Comment_3152218
What is “Gen rushing”? I feel like it’s avoiding the killer and just completing gens but there’s gotta be more to it.
Genrushing is running a build specifically built around completing gens as fast as possible while also prioritizing gens over literally everything else. If someone gets hooked, they'll be left on hook the entire game.
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@yeet said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3150362#Comment_3150362
tunneling is as real as gen rushing, which survivors tell me is not real all the time
so tunneling is not real
Both are very much real.
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@DredgeyEdgey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3151221#Comment_3151221
Surivors will be running at 110 for 10-20s if bt is unchanged with endurance the whole time
Making 110 killers allready out of the picture unless your deathslinger or spirit
And other killers without mobility like nemesis won't be able to catch them Because your only going 5% faster and they get a speed boost if you hot them because of endurance
Now you could say just don't go for them if they have endurance for 20s with bt their just gonna block a door way of someone to stop you from getting the person who was blocking them
If they get unhooked in your face, just wait for the unhook animation to finish and then hit the unhooked survivor. There goes their endurance.
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@Friendly_Blendette said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3151705#Comment_3151705
See the cause of tunneling isnt fast gens. The cause of tunneling is basic strategy and how effective it is. Abusing the weak link is always the best strategy if your VSing a team. You say it yourself it is flat out efficiency and effectiveness not "Gens too fast" "Chases too long". If the Devs made not tunneling more powerful then voila it is no longer the most effective way and people who complain about gens being too fast will now play in this new more effective way. The only way to make tunneling less prevelant through punishments is to either A) make it such a chore to do that no matter how effective people wont do it (However this is pretty flawed as there are still some people who will tryhard no matter how boring and unfun it is to do) or B) Punish it so ridiculously hard it is somehow worse than 2hooking everyone before a kill which would results in killers overall becoming much weaker and potentially even needing another 6.1.0.
Tunneling would be less prevalent with DS not only getting the 5 second stun back, but also being able to be used twice, once per hook state. Killers tunneled slightly less before DS got nerfed because the more gens you lose on one chase, the less efficient tunneling becomes.
Yes, you're right about the cause of tunneling being that it's effective, which is why it's a problem. It should be and could be more efficient to not tunnel, but BHVR is against outright punishing tunneling which creates this weird problem where every solution is just a bandaid.
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@OldIronKing said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3151142#Comment_3151142
I keep seeing survivors saying that they are being tunneled almost every game. Is this not an indication of said survivor-induced tunneling? You have three teammates why are you being tunneled every game?
Survivor-induced tunneling is when somebody makes a very obviously bad play such as abusing their endurance to take a protection hit/body block the killer, or when somebody unhooks before the killer's even had time to leave the hook.
I get tunneled almost every game for no reason other than I'm the first one found and hooked, which is usually a 2 and a half gen chase. I'm far from being the "weak link" of the team, and my teammates play well enough that I've been on hook for around 15 - 30 seconds before they rescue.
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@Friendly_Blendette said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3150773#Comment_3150773
Thing is nothing in that patch was an incentive not to tunnel as the changes were global. There was no benefit to not tunneling that didnt apply when you tunneled. Something like after hooking a random survivor screams and is exposed would be an incentive not to tunnel (not a suggestion just an example that is pretty miserably OP on many killers). Killers getting a buff overall gives 0 incentives not to tunnel it just makes tunneling more appealing since its easier.
It's a very simple cause and effect. If the cause of tunneling is that gens are too fast, then surely shorter chases for killers, and shorter basic attack cooldown alongside increased gen times and nerfs to survivors should reduce tunneling, no? It makes sense, logically, since that is in and of itself the proverbial carrot.
The stick is that survivors got 80 seconds of Endurance in the form of Off the Record. This brings us back to not tunneling, and having shorter chases. Going for the unhooker instead, you waste less time, which means more time to pressure gens.
Of course, while all of this makes sense logically, it did absolutely nothing to deter tunneling and only made it stronger because removing someone from the game early is efficient.
At least the people who claim they tunnel because it's efficient are being honest, which is in stark contrast to the ones who are constantly moving the goal posts. "Gens go too fast", "Chases take too long", "Regression perks got nerfed", etc.
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Don't know why the devs don't just remove it tbh. It doesn't exist on Console.
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@ausanimal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3150995#Comment_3150995
"As for survivors doing unsafe unhooks, those are bad players and they are always going to be present in the game. They also don't represent the bulk of the complaints against tunneling."
That's the problem us the players and devs have no way to tell when someone post on the forum about getting tunneled if it was a unsafe hook, Survivor-induced tunneling or the killer just went after them no matter what or they made the story up about how they got tunneled out of the game.
So say out of 100 post only 10 of them were legit tunneled out of the game the other 90 weren't but it puts the devs in a hard part do they buff something to help out survivors or do they draw the line and say sorry your not getting any more changes/help the only change will be soloq and how we can buff that.
The bulk of complaints are not about survivor-induced tunneling. Before BT was made basekit, it was not uncommon to have survivors farm their teammates by going for an unsafe rescue with no BT. Even back when BT required a terror radius, it wasn't uncommon for survivors to hook farm.
The majority of players who've been playing dbd for a long time know the difference between survivor-induced tunneling and actual tunneling. I personally get tunneled almost every match. The games where I'm not being tunneled are always the most surprising and the most fun.
@illNicola said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3150773#Comment_3150773
You know, survivors already do this. I don't know if I'm unlucky or what, but there isn't a match, when I play killer, without at least 2 prove thyself and very often bnp. So, it would never really change this in my opinion. But hey, my was only an idea, better than nothing no?
And you said that the killer got shorter chases. Yes, like when I play survivor I get longer chases thanks to dh, because this "dead perk" really save my ass thanks to my good timing, and when I play killer chases that were already slow don't reward me, because the chase is about 20 seconds, and pop one gen. If I don't use deadlock, time to hook the surv and another gen popped. Tunneling was born to face insane genrush team, so maybe if the Devs find a way to stop genrush then less killer will tunnel, also because it's really boring to tunnel every ######### game, before mmr I used to win every game, without tunneling, sometimes also with ######### tier killer without perks, I don't know why dbd arrived at this point.
Yes, I know survivors already bring toolboxes and prove thyself. An unfortunate side effect that everyone said would happen if the devs ever touched gen speeds. Generators are boring, and there's no getting around that.
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@Akumakaji said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3150929#Comment_3150929
Pain Res got a bit of a bad reputation because it was used by so many killers in so many builds, but frankly SH: PainRes was the single perk that saved playing killer for me during the killers dark days, when DH hold the game in its strangehold and the survivors were just sooo oppressive. With SH: PainRes I could regress gens on the fly, apply some pressure and gain at least a little breathing room. On the plus side it also gave this wonderful explosion and therefore a clear next opjection: go to this gen, its the one with the most progress!
Just like BBQ, the explosion of SH: PainRes made me nearly automatically leave the hook. Now it feels very empty and strange: you hook someone .. and nothing. Did it work? Which gen should I go to next? Is there some survivor around? What should I eat tonight? For now I will stay here and look around.
In the most recent patch they brought back the screaming, but that isn't accompanied by a notification, so for dumb me it brings nothing to the table. I know that the combo of SH: PainRes+DMS was very strong, so I don't really understand why they semi ressurected it. In my book it would have been way healthier if they had done away with the screaming and throwing off gens part of the perk, but kept the explosion. This way the killer would have a clear objective again, but didn't know if they would find a survivor at the other side. The survivors could stay and try to finish the gen or sneak away and hide or go for the rescue. All in all this would be much better then the current state of the perk.
Would've been better if they just nerfed DMS since the combo was the problem, and not pain res itself which I felt was fine. There were a lot of perk changes that just seem like the devs nerfed them simply because they were used a lot regardless of whether or not those perks were balanced on an individual level.
Much like how they reverted pain res only because of the Merciless Storm combo, which could've been completely avoidable by just failing the skill check.
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@Murgleïs said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3150929#Comment_3150929
They did not increase gen time to lower tunneling. They did it because killrates were too low. Survivors were escaping too much and too easily.
Pain res was good with DMS which got hard nerfed.
Killers have always tunneled because it is their objective : killing survivors. Do you stop repairing a generator once it is at 25% and go find another to spread pressure ? No you don’t, you finish it because it’s the fastest way to complete your objective.
The survivor equivalent of tunneling is called genrushing which is bringing toolboxes, prove thyself and BNP. If survivors only did 25% of a gen, then moved to another gen, they'd all be dead at 5 gens.
@ausanimal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3150929#Comment_3150929
Survivors don't adept when undying first came out did survivors adept to the posb of having to do all 5 totems nope they just bitched till it got nerfed, survivors got base kit BT and instead of adapting they still go for unsafe hooks i.e right after killer hooks a survivor, the killer take 10 steps and bam a unhook or the best one a survivor is in chase with the killer and is injured but runs to the hook to get the unhook.
There is so many survivors complaining about being tunneled or camped and its the killers fault, yet if a unsafe unhook happens like the ones i said above and you get tunneled who's fault it is it's your teammates fault not the killers, the killer has no obligation not to chase you and if they do don't blame the killer blame your teammates.
No matter how many buffs to base kit or perks if your team mates are going to unhook you when it's not safe then non of the perks or base kit changes will matter.
Old Undying was anything but balanced, and expecting survivors to cleanse all 5 totems every game is absurd. If you didn't know totem locations, you had to dedicate perks to finding totems and even then you had no way of knowing how many were done.
As for survivors doing unsafe unhooks, those are bad players and they are always going to be present in the game. They also don't represent the bulk of the complaints against tunneling.
Survivor-induced tunneling is fine. There's nobody who'll disagree that killers should punish mistakes. I'm talking about actual tunneling though, where the killer is trying to eliminate a survivor who has recently been unhooked so they can have an easy 3v1.
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Survivor - 6.5, maybe 7 at best.
Killer - I'm rusty from having not played killer in a very long time, so probably about a 4.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3150773#Comment_3150773
The carrot before that was Pop, Ruin/Undying, Pain Res, Thrill Of The Hunt, etc. Killers actually moved around the map a lot more. But now that they can't do that and still have a good chance of winning, because every one of those things was nerfed, here we are.
Pain Res got reverted though. Before the nerfs to those favourite perks, killers still tunneled. Killers claimed they had no choice but to tunnel because of gen speeds.
The devs increased gen times because of this claim, and nerfed regression perks because it would be rather unfair to only increase gen times. Then killers moved the goal posts and said it's because their regression perks got nerfed.
Killers are constantly harping on about how survivors need to adapt, but don't want to do so themselves, and are surprised when survivors actually do adapt. (Insert surprised pikachu face)
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@illNicola said:
With the next update, the basekit bt will be increased to 10 seconds, and 10% of haste, with bt this will be 20 seconds, that it is really unfun in my opinion. Devs want to punish killer for tunneling and camping, but they never asked themselves "Why killers camp and tunnel?".
The answer is easy: because in high MMR is the only tactics accepted to win against 90% of the survs, because the insane gen speed (caused also by prove thyself, that needs a huge nerf).
So I have a question: why Devs continue to find ways to punish killers for tunneling, instead of find ways to incentivize mixed hooks?
In my opinion, they could make that more survs alive, less gen speed, less survs alive, more gen speed. This will fix tunneling, because you don't want a surv dead early game, because it would mean giving survs more gen speed. At the same time, you don't want to camp for the same reason, if you kill someone early game you find yourself with survs that do gens quicker.
In the last major patch, killers got the carrot. The carrot was shorter chases thanks to basekit buffs, increased gen times, nerfs to popular survivor perks and a nerf to the post-hit speed boost survivors get.
The carrot did absolutely nothing to reduce tunneling, and in fact made it worse since now it was easier than ever to secure that first down.
But I'll humor your idea. Let's say they test that out. Do you know what survivors will do? They'll bring a full genrush build with toolboxes and BNP to offset the repair penalty, which will just prompt killers to tunnel even more.
But even if they don't do that, killers are still going to tunnel because the 3v1 is easier than the 4v1. In a 3v1 if you have one survivor slugged or hooked, and you're chasing another survivor, that leaves just one survivor who can get the rescue which also means there's nobody on gens. In a 2v1, any more than 1 gen remaining is a loss.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3149839#Comment_3149839
Thank you for letting me know you're low MMR, by suggesting perks like Grim Embrace and Monstrous Shrine.
With the way you're talking about how there's no incentive to leave the hook, you're hardly in any position to talk about anyone else's MMR.
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Sorry to say, but Nurse needs a rework. She's a relic from back when dbd was more of a hide-and-seek type game. Back when survivors didn't know how to do much of anything. Back when infinites and vacuums were a thing.
Map and perk design are both affected by Nurse because if you make the map too small, Nurse will dominate. Make a perk too strong, and you risk it being used on Nurse to create some disgustingly strong builds.
There's just no correct way to balance Nurse's power. Yes, there are other things that are a priority and those things should ideally happen around the same time as a Nurse rework. Nurse just doesn't fit with the direction the game is going.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
I'm good, hbu?
Pretty good, honestly. Can't complain.
@VikingDragonXii said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/342720/to-killer-mains
Well my bum is sore from a bug bite.....I want to do horrible things to my supervisor that might be considered war crimes because of how stupid they are....I'm losing faith in humanity by reading these forums everyday but other than that I'm dandy.
The bug bite part sounds horrible, but I am all for doing horrible things that might be considered war crimes.
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I'd like to improve your suggestion. All generators should be blocked for the first 30 seconds of the match, along with totems and a very lite version of Lethal. Shows you the auras of all survivors at the start of the trial for 5 seconds, after you've got control of your character.
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@yeet said:
Tunneling is not a real thing.
Bold claim. It doesn't matter the terminology you use, tunneling exists and it's boring.
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The cries of the many, actually. As for tunneling being due to toxicity, that's definitely not the case. It's more efficient for the killer to get someone out of the game early, since 3v1 is easier than 4v1.
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Since you're so upset, OP, here
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3148897#Comment_3148897
But then where's the fear? This game specifically is a horror game, so of all the games out there with this format, this game should have the 1 be a threat at all times, not just in the first 1/3 of the game. There have been too many matches where 2 or more of the 4 didn't pull their weight, but got out anyway just because their objective is so easy. That makes the 1 bullyable. The role that is mechanically harder should have an easier time through simple game balance, not be thrown into the deep end which is what these devs have done. Many people don't want to play killer because it requires time investment and skill development that, in 90% of scenarios, isn't gonna matter anyway.
Dead by Daylight is horror themed. It is not actual horror.
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@Khar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/342661/survivors-dont-deserve-free-escapes
It's not a free kill if the survivor had to he chased, downed, and hooked. With how BT is, an unhooked survivor can protect the person who made the unhook. In late game it really is a free escape.
By that logic it's not a free escape because someone had to risk the rescue.
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@TheSubstitute said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3148815#Comment_3148815
I had put in a suggestion before where basically as gens get done there's a debuff to repair speed that disappears over time and as survivors get killed there's an increase in repair speed that disappears over time. I think it's probably too complicated to code though or there's just not enough people that like the idea.
Some other people have suggested a Dying Light type effect that slows down gens with hooks but disappears when the survivor is killed.
I think the main issue, besides coding, with them is 2 and 3 person SWFs sometimes treat the solos like cannon fodder so I could see SWFs just deciding to let the rando one hook for the repair speed buff.
It's a tough question; that's for sure.
Touching gen speeds is pointless. Maps being too big are the problem, which I see BHVR is beginning to understand with how they've split up RPD.
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@ImNotBobDylan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3148661#Comment_3148661
OP is right though.
Even in tournament play, killers are consistently tunneling, also camping the hook quite commonly. Just watch this game:
https://youtu.be/fXlLWcQLufo?t=406
In the first 4 games of this tournament every time the killer would try very hard to tunnel only one person. And the only game where they didn't manage to tunnel was a 4-man escape:
- Game 1 : straight up facecamp, then tunneling despite DS, teammates body blocking, and even using For the People on Nea. Nea gets hooked 3 times in a row with only one person getting hooked in between. Result: 4 kills
- Game 2: straight up tunneling, Jake gets hooked 3 times in a row before anybody else gets hooked once. Result: 4K
- Game 3 : killer downs Adam but decides not to tunnel him for no apparent reason. Then decides to tunnel Claudette, who gets hooked 3 times in a row despite DS. Result: 2K
- Game 4 : No tunneling. Result: 0K
I didn't watch the other games but I imagine the trend doesn't change.
Keep in mind, this is not against random solo queue players who don't know how to counter tunneling, this is a SWF who all run DS and try to protect the tunneled person by body blocking / hiding him / even using For the People.
Literally nobody plays tournaments for fun.
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@BenOfMilam said:
If someone wants to suicide out of the match, let them. What the hell are you trying to prove by forcing them to play a game they obviously are done playin?
It's not about trying to prove anything. It's that if they don't at least try, the entire team loses as a result. It's fine if there's like 2 gens left, but at 5 gens (which is when it happens the most) the game is basically unsalvagable unless the remaining survivors all play perfectly and don't make a single mistake.
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@Thusly_Boned said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3146792#Comment_3146792
You can 4K consistently against poor/average survs while playing "nice", but against really strong teams, you're gonna have forget the rulebook sometimes if you want your kills.
I only rarely do it, and only in dire circumstances, but tunneling (provided you can quickly catch your target) is effective at every level. And since at higher levels most survs are good loopers, it does actually take some skill. If you're actually a no/low skill killer trying to tunnel against strong survs, you will lose.
Gonna clarify real quick here. Tunneling is targeting the same survivor repeatedly. It is not tunneling if you have hooked someone inbetween. It is also not tunneling if that survivor chooses to try to do anything other than getting out of there.
Not tunneling and playing nice are not synonymous.
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@RenRen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3148130#Comment_3148130
Why does endgame exist if you aren't suppose to be able to get a kill during it?
You aren't entitled to a free kill in the endgame. Endgame is the result of survivors finishing their objective. If they make it to that point and you haven't a secured a kill, it is 100% a skill issue. Rancor exists, NOED exists, Blood Warden exists, No Way Out exists. The tools are there, it's up to the individual to make use of them.
Your objective as the killer is to prevent the survivors from completing their objective by sacrificing them. The survivors objective is to avoid being sacrificed while repairing generators to power the gates that allow them to escape.
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@xni6_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3148130#Comment_3148130
but survivors ARE guaranteed escapes now. you get unhooked, the 4.4 movement and 20 seconds of endurance is 88m of distance where you just hold w with 0 risk. if the killer hits you, you get out, if the killer doesnt, you get out
If the killer hasn't secured a kill by that point, it's a skill issue.
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@Biscuits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3148149#Comment_3148149
What is the chance the killer will return to hook if they couldn't find anyone before you were unhooked? 100%.
Listen to me or don't, run OTR and just run to a safe loop after you get unhooked.
What is the chance the killer finds you healing nearby because you left scratchmarks, pools of blood and are moaning? Around 95%. 5% chance they're hard of hearing or not wearing a headset.
Has happened consistently for a very long time.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3147382#Comment_3147382
I mean that BBQ got nerfed to the point that it’s not worth using, pain res lost the info part, and now awakened awareness lost the lingering info part. Instead of giving killers motivation to leave a hook, they just want to keep punishing killers for camping instead.
So are we just not going to talk about Floods of Rage? Or Darkness Revealed? Or other informational perks like Thrilling Tremors or Discordance? How about Surveillance or Call of Brine? There are plenty of perks that motivate you to leave the hook.
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@Biscuits said:
Funny part is, half of tunneling could be prevented if people stopped healing under hook.
That definitely wouldn't help. It's faster to heal under the hook, you leave scratchmarks and pools of blood while moving away from the hook so the killer's gonna find you before you're healed anyway.
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@xni6_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3147347#Comment_3147347
if it does, it gives the survivor a free escape. how exactly is that fair? oh right, favours the side you play exclusively. got it
@RenRen said:
So what do you do during endgame now?
This reminds me of something someone once said: Survivors haven't earned their escape until they've actually escaped. The same is true of killers.
If you haven't secured a kill by the EGC and the survivors go out of their way to get that 4E and succeed, it means you got outplayed. Just as survivors are not guaranteed escape, killers are not guaranteed kills.
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@xni6_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3147219#Comment_3147219
the issue is theyre nerfing the solution to a problem they made. tunneling isnt fun, but its necessary.
unfortunately, instead of looking into why its necessary, they add more and more things to counter it, forcing killers to tunnel even harder, and then survivors complain more, and killer gets more nerfs, then they tunnel more, then they get nerfed more, and then the entire playerbase would be survivors complaining about long queues since all the killers would have left.
I have to disagree in that tunneling is necessary. You can win without tunneling, without camping, consistently. The more killers tunnel/camp, the more survivors are going to complain and the more it's going to become less and less viable.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3147206#Comment_3147206
That's like saying: "If Survivors never loop the saloon in DDS, it's a balanced main building". If the Killer isn't smart enough to use a potentially game winning situation, of course it isn't dangerous.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3147222#Comment_3147222
Nothing is safe,. Main buildings and shack are outdated mechanics.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3147272#Comment_3147272
Downing the unhooker is almost never better than getting a Survivor out of the game faster
Survivors not looping main building on DDS doesn't suddenly make it balanced. Basement is only dangerous against killers who can quickly get back to the basement in the first place.
Basement hasn't been truly dangerous for a long time and is outdated. Before Off the Record, Borrowed Time + DS made it so basement wasn't dangerous. Even without those perks, one person running We'll Make It is enough to offset the dangers of basement.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3147176#Comment_3147176
The basement is supposed to be dangerous. 5 seconds when coming out of the basement is fine.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/342521/bt-basekit-buffed-to-10-seconds
I think that's fine, but it should stay at 5 seconds when getting unhooked from the basement
So in instances where the killer doesn't come back to the basement, is basement still dangerous?
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I don't think anybody is out here asking killers to "play nice". I think the bulk of complaints are that tunneling and camping are boring tactics that require no skill and only serve to push your MMR to a point where you eventually get stomped back down to where you began.
You can 4k consistently without tunneling or camping, but that's not synonymous with playing nice.
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@Reinami said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3146173#Comment_3146173
That would make the game even more miserable, because SWF bully squads still exist.
And they will continue to exist, unfortunately. Off-topic, forum notifications are back (Yay! 🥳)
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@Carth said:
I don't get where the DBD communities obsession with letting survivors make the most of their resources comes from. In a shooter do you purposefully avoid/die to players with bad k/d to give them a chance to catch up? In Mobas do you give lanes away for free to the enemy to farm to catch back up? Name a single competitive pvp game where you actively go out of your way to maximize the opponents fun and risk your win so that people can "have a good time".
I do think camping and tunneling is too strong at the moment, but the idea of "killers should play 12 hooks and not kill anyone until hook #9" is bonkers.
In the same vein if survivors are smashing out gens and outplaying the killer do all they all suddenly stop to get every remaining gen to 99% before finishing the game or do they just slam out the remaining gens and leave ASAP? Do they go into deadzones on purpose to give killers downs/hooks if they are ahead?
I don't know where this "Don't kill anyone until hook #9" nonsense came from, but I assure you that it's not what is meant by "don't tunnel". Similarly, not tunneling has absolutely nothing to do with playing nice and allowing the survivors to make the most of their resources.
You can win without tunneling and camping, even against efficient teams.
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@Ayamir said:
First being able to see your teammates's perks in the lobby would be great info and could allow for more coordinated plays for solos survivors mobile already has that feature btw.
And next is some players just need to get better at the game start using common sense stop being so predictable and for the love of Jesus Christ stop going down every 20 seconds some survivors just need to get better at looping no matter how much you buff survs the majority of the playerbase is really bad nothing BHVR cant hold players's hands forever you have to play better.
I run Open Handed + Bond so I can see what my teammates are doing most of the time and there is ALWAYS that one braindead clueless survivor in the team that ends up screwing up the 3 others good survivors.
Stupid plays lots of mistakes giving the killer alot of pressure early in the game at 5/4 gens then end up getting tunneled beceause the surv in question is just terrible at looping and is the weak link,Killers tunnel bad survivors that get downed easily rarely the good ones who can loop them for 3 gens.
MMR is hardly working and we need two separate game mode ranked and casual beceause right now MMR is just a joke that's why I started dodging lobbys with very low prestige survs and it really made my SoloQ experience is way better and enjoyable while playing with decent competent survivors.
There's like 43k players playing DBD on steam rn I am sure that the current playerbase is large enough for two separate game modes plus we dont even know how many players are playing DBD on console/EGS.
So yes this is my idea on how to help SoloQ survs give us the ability to see our teammates's perks and create a new REAL ranked game mode with a working MMR system.
The problem with separate game modes is that there is no way to stop people from swapping between the two. It's part of why I could no longer enjoy Overwatch.
With Overwatch, Quickplay was dominated by smurfs, ranked folks practicing and people refusing to do the objective because "It's just quickplay". Ranked, or "Competitive", wasn't much better since it was all sweat.
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@ThePrizz said:
Looks like we would need an incentive for the killers to move away from the hook while also giving them something for the effort put into hooking someone.
How about we make survivors unhook themselves after like what, 10-15 (more or less) seconds of the killer being around the hook? This will force the killer away and also make him think his hooks better, cause if he hooks someone close to a gen, he can't defend the gen without letting the survivor eventually unhook himself.
But what does the killer get in return ? He needs to have an advantage too if he's forced to leave the hook so how about after an unhook happens, the other 2 survivors, have their auras revealed to the killer for x seconds, kind of like a bbq but it's way more efficient since it happens after you're away from the hook and presumably closer to them. That would impose a risk on the other 2 survivers as well, since it's usually 1 guy taking the risk of unhooking and the other 2 doing some random stuff or repairing a gen without a care in the world.
Now those kind of survivors can't just be like "Oh imma stay here on the furthest gen from the hook, being safe while someone else risks his life for the unhook", cause if they get the unhook you're probably the one in danger not them.
There are incentives for killers to move away from the hook. Floods of Rage being one of them.
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@bjorksnas said:
It was just to shake up the meta not change perk dependency
It was to do both. They said a lot of things in their June 2022 Developer Update, like how second chance perks should be nice to have and not feel like you have to run them.
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@Khelendrose2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3143606#Comment_3143606
Completely untrue. Never camp, never tunnel and don't run gen slowdown perks, which is also on the toxic list by survivors, and you will lose 95% of all matches. This is not even taking maps and killers into consideration. Don't forget, you can't play Nurse, Blight, Spirit, Artist or any other killer considered toxic or broken. Everyone basically has to play Trapper.
It's not completely untrue. It just depends on what they mean by playing nice. Killers should avoid tunneling, but that doesn't mean they need to play nice either. I would rather be slugged than put back on the hook.
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@HugTheHag said:
I do think there should be something done to make matchmaking more healthy (maybe an option to disable "fast vs relevant" matchmaking), and two modes would be a great idea.
However, there is no stopping cocky competitive players from going into the casual mode just to grief or have easy stomps... Though I guess there is no perfect solution, and that should not stop the devs from trying to make the game more healthy for casual players.
Overwatch has "Competitive" and "Quick Play". Prior to dbd, I played a lot of Overwatch and quick play, which was intended to just be for casuals, was filled with smurfs who just wanted to practice before their "competitive" matches.
This created a problem where casual players couldn't enjoy the game in quick play, but they also couldn't enjoy the game in competitive due to the fact that to win in competitive, you had to use what was meta and know how to counter every strat and team comp, while also not making mistakes yourself.
Splitting the queues would just make the game worse.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/341890/slugging-for-4k
Remember that, next time you stand at the exit gate and waste the killers time.
Not to object to the whole "just leave" thing, but I'd like to point out that slugging for the 4k and survivors teabagging in the exit gates are two different things as ultimately you can force them out. A slugged survivor cannot bleed out any faster, nor can they hook themselves.
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@Tostapane said:
the formula is simple:
SWF and broken map rng exist? = nurse
fix those things (SWF must be relegated ONLY in custom matches) then we can talk about reworking the nurse
You know what? SWF can be relegated to KYF only, but only if the following conditions are met: You can earn as much BP as you potentially could in a normal match, you can earn pips and progress your grades, you can progress archive challenges and you can progress the rift.
If that doesn't sound fair to you, then you should probably reflect on the idea of relegating swfs to KYF only.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3143022#Comment_3143022
One perk still being meta doesn't invalidate that the point of the update was to shake up the meta. The worst you could possibly conclude from that is that they failed, and I'd hardly consider one or two perks still being used an abject failure. At least Pain Res is a newer perk and not one that's been in the game and in the meta since release.
It was really hard to justify using it before, on account of it being a bad perk. As I've gone over above, it's my opinion that Self-Care wasn't even a viable self-heal tool without a build around it, let alone the most viable self-heal tool.
The point of the update was to shake up the meta, and it failed since all that happened was different perks that serve the same purpose were slotted in to take the place of the perks that were nerfed.
I wouldn't consider self-care to be viable, old or current, but I would consider it to be the most reliable. It has no activation requirements, unlike Inner Healing, isn't subject to Frankie's, unlike medkits, and doesn't require you to go to a specific area, unlike CoH.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3143123#Comment_3143123
Balancing around players is ruining the game*
Balancing is ruining the game*
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@Brokenbones said:
A lot of people are experiencing faster early gens likely due to perks like Corrupt not being ran as often
Pair this with spawn RNG, you could have 3 diff survs on 3 seperate gens even before you start your first chase. I don't sweat the early gens popping tbh - it is inevitable unless you have an insane start, like pressuring 3 survs who all spawned together kind of start
I'll never understand this. Even if all four survivors spawn on the same gen, and you push them off, you can only chase one survivor at a time and the remaining three are just gonna go back to that gen.
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@Man_of_triangles said:
SWF get about 20 information perks for free. That's a huge boost even if they're mediocre players.
Trust me, it's not the huge boost you think it is. Good players aren't reliant on comms, and comms don't make mediocre players better if they're bad at chase.