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Whilst I agree that people shouldn't really moan about camping and tunnelling (although I do think facecamping your first hook is problematic), I think your argument that if you've lost one chase, you've lost the game, is very incorrect.
Some Killers in particular are just always going to eventually win a chase, unless the player is completely inexperienced. So you are basically saying that anyone who plays against these Killers has lost the game simply by being found first.
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I want Nosferatu and Claire Redfield
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@wishwon said:
It's a different kind of toxicity, though another game might have toxicity in the form of verbal abuse and insults, DBD has less of that and more of in-game toxicity, and while someone pressing control a bunch of times sounds like something that should get you in a bad mood, knowing what they are saying by doing so does get you in a bad mood, it's not exactly just someone crouching a bunch, there's an actual meaning behind it that is pretty toxic and meant to make you mad.
I disagree that dbd has THE most toxic community, but I think it's still a pretty toxic one in general.
Agree, it kind of annoys me when people say "you are immature to get mad at someone pressing ctrl", as that is a ridiculously reductionist argument.
Someone "pressing ctrl" and tea-bagging, is actually using the limited controls at their disposal to send you a message, and it is usually one of asserting dominance, e.g. you got outplayed at that pallet, now I teabag, or you got outplayed that game (nothing to do with the balance of the game, ever) now I teabag at the exit gate for the longest possible time, whilst denying you points on a final hit, to add insult to injury. When you combine this with the absolute stress-fest which DBD gameplay can be, it can really make the game worse.
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@xenotimebong said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2212301#Comment_2212301
Could they not theoretically use the work the mobile team did on their killer AI? I’m a bit ignorant of how it all works and I’m sure it’s not that simple, but would they have to start from scratch if some of the same principles and logic they used in DBD mobile could be applied to this version?
That's a good point to be honest, I forgot the mobile had AI.
I've not played the mobile version so I'm not sure how similar the game is, if the game was engineered correctly, then ideally the PC and mobile versions would share much of the same systems, so yeah perhaps it could.
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@deckyr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2212460#Comment_2212460
i am way too relaxed to be tabbed in analysing the lobby.
Fair enough bro, more power to you! It's not much analysis on my side though, Key = Leave
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@deckyr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2207807#Comment_2207807
i don't bother thinking around keys. personally if survivors key out then it's a win for me and it gets me out of the lobby with the people who take the game seriously enough to bring a key.
Bruh you do know there is an even easier way to get out of the game with people who bring keys, just back out the lobby
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They're probably not going to add AI to a purely multiplayer game, AI development is a lot of work, and they'd essentially have to do it from scratch, in a game not designed for it. 0.1% chance!
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@Gnarly said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2212153#Comment_2212153
Mostly annoyed that it happens every match. Like honestly didn't care the first 4 matches. 5 got me bothered and 6th match got me so upset. Not even that good
If it's literally upsetting you then does that mean it is inconveniencing your play in some way? Does that imply that is it a good perk?
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I'd define toxic as someone who is intentionally playing the game in ways specifically to troll or anger the other players.
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@valvarez4 said:
As solo you can’t do Anything. Swf do gens and escape, and then these killers come here asking for nerfs for swf
Shhh. Nice Killer's who do not camp their very first hook also complain about SWF.
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It is always the Killer's fault
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How to beat someone with 23k hours DBD? Just tunnel their teammates I guess.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2210923#Comment_2210923
Disagree, personally. A quick down on the first chase of the game does absolute wonders for keeping gens down. There's also plenty of counterplay; a point-blank hatchet still requires the Huntress to get that close, which survivors have a big say in. That wasn't the issue before; it was having three instadown hatchets, because that would allow for poor Huntresses to still have success while playing sloppy, and for good Huntresses to snowball way harder than normal.
With the iri add-on combo she either has 115% speed or a consistent instadown, both of which Deathslinger doesn't have even with Iridescent Coin. She also still has no max range. I also prefer her over Deathslinger because she has enough counters in the 1v1 that I don't feel like I'm ruining four people's fun every time I play as her.
As for the long range instadown idea, that just seems like a recipe for tilting - it'd always either annoy one side or the other whenever a survivor is right around the range where it becomes an instadown; a consistent instadown removes this issue. A range-based instadown also seriously encourages camping; just hook a survivor on a hill (or near one) and you can basically remotely camp the hook with at least five hatchets. Not a bad idea either because survivors need to remain stationary for a second to unhook.
I agree in that I've found it very effective thus far, but like I said in the OP, I have not really played against any great teams with it, so who knows :)
On your range based encouraging camping, I would say that it's still hard to consistently hit unhook shots, depending on the map, and depending on how any given game is progressing. Being able to consistently hit unhooking survivors is still tough and has plenty of counterplay (don't run in a straight line, be unpredictable, make multiple feints for the unhook)
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@ALostPuppy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2210928#Comment_2210928
You know how you hold the chainsaw behind a survivor as Billy/Bubba and down them easily if you're right next to them and it makes it basically impossible to dodge it? Apply that same logic to Huntress with iri head. She can do it a bit further away too, because her hatchets travel at 1000%, not 230% like Billy's saw. With Billy, there's a pretty long wind-up and you have to be mindful of pallets and windows if you wanna backrev a survivor. As Huntress your windup is a lot faster and pallets and windows are hardly a concern for her.
Ah thanks for explaining. From "back" and "rev" I thought it would be something do with some sort of reverse spin, didn't realise back just meant the survivors back.
Yes, it certainly does feel uninteractive if you are in a dead zone and you know how to play around simple jukes.
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@El_Gingero said:
Actually there is counter-play to Spirit.
When she’s phasing the shards on her back light up. If you pause the video at the start when Scott first uses phase there is a frame where it’s clearly visible.
As for chase, you can no longer hear any sounds if you mute your game, and Spirit heavily relies on sound.
I’d happily take Scott up on his challenge to settle this once and for all.
Ah so the counter play to Spirit is to have remote access to the Killer's machine, so you can manually mute them and then they can't find you. Gotcha!
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@ALostPuppy said:
Addon-less is better than iri head now. All they had to do was give it a range requirement but that was apparently too hard and they took the easy route again. With 1 hatchet her snowballing is not nearly as good, which is the one main strength she has over Deathslinger.
And because there's still no range requirement you can just walk up to people and backrev them for a cheap down, so the lack of interaction there wasn't fixed with this change either, the main issue everyone had with it because it was way too easy to walk up to people and hit them from around 5m away because you couldn't dodge it. Now you can only do that once and then you have to waddle over to a locker to reload every time. Fun.
What is a backrev?
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threat*
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@Lycidas said:
It's a strong combo, no doubt
And it's what you would expect from combining two ultra-rare addons, nothing wrong with it imo
Yeah I agree, it feels strong but it doesn't feel excessive.
Iri Head with 1 shot feels more balanced as you can technically juke it and make fakes, etc.
Puttee is strong but at the end of the day all it does is bring Huntress up to par with the other Killers, and only when she has no ranged thread, I think it's great.
Interested to here how survivors who have played against it feel, as I haven't played against it myself yet!
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@RiskyKara Kudos to you for playing properly, usually if I see someone use a Haddonfield offering I'll just meme about, stand in a corner, or facecamp someone for the lulz
Why do I do that? Because the risk of them being a good SWF is quite high when see this offering, and I don't want to risk trying hard and still losing and just stressing myself out for no reason. Also usually I'm not playing an S-tier Killer.
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Infectious Fright is also really good on Blight, I feel he can use it better than most other Killers, as you can use your power to get into someone's face very, very quickly
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@snowflake102 said:
what does undying do?
It means that the first hex totem they cleanse will always be Undying, so it gives you an extra bit of value out of Ruin, as they need to cleanse a second totem, which might take them time to find it. Without Undying you will get games where Ruin is cleansed in less than a minute.
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It looks like you managed to body block it pretty well until you decided to move off it?
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@Marik13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2207245#Comment_2207245
You're completely missing what I am saying. I have barely played this game for over a month. I know that I am the farthest thing from a good player on this game. There is still a lot that I need to learn about when it comes to what are good loops, what are bad loops, when to tunnel, when not to tunnel, etc. Hell I just learned what slugging actually means this week, before I thought slugging was just when you run around and just smack survivors over and over, cus I thought slugging like a boxing match throwing punches, not slugging literally being on the floor like a slug. I know there is a lot that I can learn from this game. But when I am in a game where I am just getting rolled and toyed with by a rank 1 SWF team who are decked and kitted out to handle everything, what do I learn from that? In that scenario they have complete control of everything and the match ends on their terms when they want it. I would rather play people around or even slightly above my skill level so that I can at least learn something and have some fun in the process. The reverse is also true, and I have said this before, when I am paired against potato ranks who I end up steamrolling over. I don't like matches like that either, regardless of the easy 4k. I don't care about getting 4ks, I am fine with getting like 2ks or hell I'll be happy with 1k if the match was a really good one. My main goal is to have some fun because at the end of the day, this is a video game after all. Being in matches where you are being steamrolled or doing the steamrolling isn't fun, it's just a waste of time and good add-ons, which I don't have a lot of on most of my killers cus outside of 5 of them, they're all under lvl 40 and I'm still trying to learn most of them and unlock their perks.
No I'm pretty sure I get your point, I've only been playing this game for about half a year, so I've gone through the pain of being a new Killer and getting to red ranks.
The problem is we need 4 survivors for every 1 Killer, so already there is a pressure on getting games for survivors. On top of that, there is a widespread belief that Killer is no fun at high ranks (I wonder why?), so at the red ranks there is a big imbalance of available Killers for Survivors.
This leads to what you are observing, with red rank survivors being put into games with Killers they should not be. Literally the only other alternative to that is to have them wait 20+ minutes for every match, as there are simply not enough good Killers.
If you go watch streamers you will even see SWFs handing streamers their own arse quite often. The game is SWF sided, you are just discovering this now. There are mistakes you can minimize, but at the end of the day, if a SWF executes their gameplan perfectly, you are more than likely to lose. That's a problem with the game balance itself, and the sooner you realise this the better I suppose.
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@Marik13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2206727#Comment_2206727
Clearly you didn't read what I had said. When the match started I was still green. I actually don't know how the hell I managed to level up coming out of this because at no point was the power balance within my control. But even if I was a rank 8 going in to this, there's still 7 levels of difference between them and me, not counting the actual hours spent playing the game in which case I know I've lost on that front as well.
Again, what in the hell could I have come away learning from a match where rank 1 survivors who are potentially on comms, are literally bouncing between flashlight and body saves just because they could. I had all four of them surrounding me and jumping in and out of chases because they could. It's not like they were playing the actual objectives and working on gens or anything. No they were wasting time just screwing with me and then tossed a pity kill my way.
The only thing I learned from this match is that the matchmaking system is busted all to hell. The white belt vs black belt scenario is exactly what happened here because I was just outmatched in every way.
"What could I have come away learning from a match where rank 1 survivors potentially on comms are bounding between flashlight and body saves because they could"
So you are basically saying there is nothing you could learn in this match.
This means one of two things:
- You are already a perfect player at the game and didn't make a single mistake that match and just lost to a perfect SWF
- You did make mistakes but have not been able to recall them for whatever reason
If point 1, then this thread is really a complaint about SWF no? Because you couldn't have lost the game due to your own mistake. But it's obviously not point 1 as you are claiming these people are better than you, due to your complaint about the ranking system, so you musn't be a perfect DBD player just yet.
If point 2, then re-read my post, you missed the bit where I said with focus and a bit of patience you can learn something from every single defeat.
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@LilCrapper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2206858#Comment_2206858
thats not what you said first go around.... So i believe you are lying. Otherwise that how you would have started with that
Go watch more streamers. Make their stories your own more
What on earth are you talking about? You are saying what I just said contradicted what I first said? It really did not, please tell me how I contradicted myself, I'm listening.
You know it's a bit odd, you are complaining about people "bullying" you in game, but you've game to a forum and to be quite honest, the tone you are using to people responding to your thread is quite passive aggressive, and now you are outright accusing me of lying. Maybe you should calm down a bit, as you are perhaps still a bit mad from taking a beating in game.
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@LilCrapper to be clear I agree with you and if a player starts teabagging, quite often I will just alt tab out and allow them to enjoy finishing the rest of the gens and teabag at an AFK Killer, I'll do that rather than allow myself to get angry.
But still just trying to keep things realistic, some of the things are you are saying I disagree with, and I'm not sure how easy it would be to eliminate bullying behaviour from the game
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@LilCrapper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2206849#Comment_2206849
i do not play this game 20 hours a day 300 days a year. I do not do this for a job. So no....
AS THE ORGINAL POST SUGGESTS!!!!!!! i play this for fun!!!!! as majority people do in the world. Because video games are made to be FUN! i know..... shocker......
I'm also not a streamer. The other week I played against a Claudette 4 squad and they definitely knew how to play.
I was using a build which was not even particularly "meta" (Oni: Trail of Torment, Tinkerer, NOED, something else I forgot)
It was a close match and I still got a 3K.
If I play Blight I will literally get 2K+ in almost every game.
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@LilCrapper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2206845#Comment_2206845
no. lamest excuse ever. since the devs can rein in this crap
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2206839#Comment_2206839
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2206837#Comment_2206837
see, this is a troll post i will bite at, but barely........ as you can EASILY come up with these answers on your own
only doing infinite loops. soul guard. flashlights, body blocking. DS, dead hard... When all four survivors utilize every single resource at their disposal. The killer will NEVER get one hook even with tunneling
"the Killer will NEVER get one hook even with tunneling"
You are wrong, go watch streamers, you can see how it is possible for someone to get 2-4Ks the majority of the time in public games, even when against 4 decent players.
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@CatwalkLady said:
That’s be fine, if it weren’t for the fact I don’t have the perks nor addons available to handle it. Like I said, I’m rank 16. I’m basically a baby killer :c child abuse
Well.. yeah I can't really argue with that. Playing against these teams when you are inexperienced and also only have Adept perks + Sloppy Butcher is pretty tough. Would be nice to reduce that grind or offer some sort of free perk unlock system for new players
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Spoiler: at red ranks, the games consist of perma loops, flashlight saves, gen rushing, and people who know how to play. The earlier you are exposed to that the quicker you learn how the game is. At green ranks survivors hide in corners, don't do gens, and can hold a chase for 10 seconds max.
You are merely playing against people who have a slight idea how to play as a survivor, and discovering how imbalanced the game is.
It's the best way to learn I think, playing against good players. With a positive attitude and some effort you will learn lots of things in these games you get demolished, and you'll know how to hold your own soon enough.
The only real shame, in my opinion, is the reasonably large subset of players who seem to enjoy being toxic and taking advantage of less experienced players.
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Also, you are a purple rank playing red ranks, this kind of makes sense right, you want to move up out of purple into red, so you have to play reds. It's a different story if its a white, yellow, or maybe green rank killer against four rank 1s, but even then what I said above still applies, to an extent.
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The reason why I don't think this is much of a problem is, as long as you are approaching each game with a positive learning mindset, you will learn lots of things each game. When you are playing against someone with such a skill gap, there is no way you won't learn at least one new trick each game if you are focusing and paying attention. Eventually, you will know most of the tricks a survivor can pull, and at this point you might be able to start winning and enjoying the game.
It's not like Karate for example, where if you make a black belt fight a white belt, they could actually end up being injured or something. If you have the minor mental fortitude to not give up against superior and/or toxic players, then you can learn a lot.
Playing against good and bad survivors on this game, the difference is absolutely night and day. The sooner you get out of green ranks (which is far too easy as Killer), and play decent survivors, the sooner you realize how the game actually is.
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@Dimek said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2206687#Comment_2206687
You are forced to do 1 challenge so you HAVE TO play more games and devs wants us to play more and more and more
Yes I get that. I understand the limit is to increase the amount of grinding for the players and therefore increase the player numbers on the game.
It's just your comment pointing out more fragments appeared to me as if you were justifying it as if it was designed for more fragments (i.e. to benefit the player more), rather than to benefit the developers and keep gamers engaged.
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@Dimek said:
1 challange at the time = more games = more fragments
This doesn't justify it, if you want more fragments you could just continue playing games after you've done your challenges anyway.
And if you wanted your challenges to last a long time, then you could choose to just use one challenge at a time. So I don't think your argument justifies the limitation of 1 challenge per game.
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@PureHostility said:
Any player who do chooses to play her instantly loses any respect from me.
I don't feel bad if some Meghead uses Haddonfield on her anymore, I want her experience to be as miserable as it is for the survivor's who has to verse her.
I despise EVERYTHING about spirit, be it her gameplay, her looks and her sounds. Her unbalanced state, spilled a pure form of hatred that soaked all whole image of The Spirit making me hate ANYTHING regarding her.
#RemoveSpirit
That's one of the reasons it can be satisfying to play her sometimes, you feel like you actually have a chance no matter what team the game throws at you, if it's a SWF, people abusing offerings for very unfair maps, 4 items with the best add-ons, DS/UB. Bring it on.
If you are playing a weaker killer than red ranks is basically a nightmare as you are constantly going to come across teams like this and have to play unfair matches (not to mention all the fun trash talking you get to receive upon losing, or winning.
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"Killer: While everyone will say Bubba is the best camping killer I got a better result using Doctor when I tried camping for a few days. Why? Because with Bubba they respected the killer and did gens. With Doctor they tried to unhook instead and I almost got 4k in all games."
@DBD78 Nice! I like this sort of tactical thinking.
I was trying some new things with a basement Oni camping build, no one expects an Insidious Oni, if you play around Kindred well enough.
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@T2K said:
You can argue about the cheating part but it definitly gives you an advantage compared to not using it. If you think you can get the same consisten/fast shots with experience or lining up you are horribly mistaken. You just perform better with a crosshair
100%. If it didn't give you an advantage no one would use it or discuss it. But yeah not cheating though,
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@FrndlyChnswSalzmn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2174938#Comment_2174938
Oh really? Let's examine that claim.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2174922#Comment_2174922
Here's where I said 'let people play hard without getting shamed and insulted'
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2174933#Comment_2174933
And here's where you dismissed that idea with a backhanded insult. So what were you trying to say, since I misunderstood you. I'm not sure how else to take your post. Help me understand.
LOL man how is me saying what you are saying is close to saying something else even close to an insult. It's really not. If you think so, then you get easily offended, I'm afraid to tell you.
Also, you then proceeded to totally put an argument in my mouth (maybe that was aimed at OP) which I did not say at all, I mean is that also an insult then?
Also, btw perhaps you are not aware of the "play civilization" quote which sort of became a meme (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvRMd7aQ5v4), I was riffing off that.
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@FrndlyChnswSalzmn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2174933#Comment_2174933
It is not close to that in any way, shape or form. But what you are saying is that people who want to play hard don't deserve to have a fun game. You are dismissing those with different ideas of fun than you.
My point was you are saying not every game needs to be chill and casual, the next extension to that is, go and play a game that is chill and casual, or the classic "Go play civilization" quote.
I'm not at all saying anything what you just said I did, but OP listed a lot of valid reasons as to why DBDs game design can result in anger. He's not even saying he wants the game to be more casual necessarily, he's trying to start a conversation around the design of the game, and you are basically implying that the fact the game could cause anger and frustration is totally cool.
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@FrndlyChnswSalzmn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2174933#Comment_2174933
It is not close to that in any way, shape or form. But what you are saying is that people who want to play hard don't deserve to have a fun game. You are dismissing those with different ideas of fun than you.
I didn't say anything close to that
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@FrndlyChnswSalzmn said:
Maybe the solution is to stop playing games with the assumption that anyone who does their best to win is 'sweaty' or a 'tryhard'. There are people who do derive their enjoyment from playing their best. Not everyone wants to play chill.
I know, y'all ain't tryin to hear that. But it's true. Not every game needs to be chill and casual.
This is dangerously close to "just play Civilization" XD
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@DragonMasterDarren said:
It's a quality of life/training wheels thing, a good player won't need it but a inexperienced player would definitely appreciate it
I disagree with this, a crosshair on a Huntress can really unlock long distance shots that even a good or great Huntress player would struggle hitting.
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@SMitchell8 said:
Had I not picked Game offering, it would have sent me to Pale Rose or Red Forest.
I know it's not really scripted, but jeez it feels like it is sometimes. I got the demonstrike one recently and it sent me to Lery's ffs 🤣
This could just be a case of negativity bias, i.e. negative events tend to be more memorable, so you'll remember failing to get challenges easier than you will remember times when a challenge was easy to unlock due to a convenient killer, map, etc.
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BHVR cannot put together a system that can match players with other players who are vaguely similar in skill.
There is no way they are implementing matchmaking to find Killers who are convenient for your current challenge. Why would they even do that anyway, as everyone would have different and conflicting challenges, so you'd have slow matchmaking which would not work.
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coz people have different experiences and form different opinions
also it's a forum so I guess we gotta discuss something
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@TobeySK said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2173763#Comment_2173763
Unfortuneatly it feels like I get these types of games a lot. There are a few matches inbetween which are easiy for me as a killer but that's mostly because those players don't have many perks and seem to be unexperienced as well.
I think there are less SWFs then it feels like. Even solo players who are skilled and not communicating can sometimes have enough game knowledge and common sense to make the game tough for a Killer.
I believe the DBD community can be split roughly into casual and "hardcore" players. You get the casuals who come on occasionally, and you will probably demolish them, I found Killer very very easy up to around purple ranks. In fact I was 4K'ing a lot without perks when I started.
When you get to the hardened survivors though, i.e. people who play the game regularly, use optimal equipment (i.e. use a headset, play on a monitor etc.), and are actually playing the game to win or improve, it's a whole different game entirely, and the fundamental imbalance of the game begins to reveal itself.
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@TobeySK said:
Just got 2 matches in a row against 3 red-ranked people and 1 purple rank. They probably were in a group because of how coordinated they played.
I see why many killers seem to quit on the better ranks. They all use perks which makes it very hard to get 1 kill, even with camping. The latest scenario was that I hooked someone and the others 3 came to the rescue. 2 stood in front of me so I couldn't hit the guy unhooking the 4th player. When I tried to down the one again, I couldn't because the player who unhooked him got the perk that makes the hooked player "immortal" to a hit.
The devs really need to do something against such things. Like maybe giving the killer some kind of an advantage when people to swf or making the killers more deadly in general.
Unfortunately, when you are playing against a team of survivors who know the maps, all of the tricks, and all of the perk interactions, you will have a hard time beating them, unless they make mistakes.
If they are also on comms, well then you might as well just prepare for the L, unless you're playing a meta Nurse or Spirit build.
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@Pulsar said:
Sluzzy, aren't you are Nurse main?
Kinda hypocritical to decry OP Killers when you play the most OP Killer.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/S3FPHLASSQTA/20210424-191927.jpg
Sluzzy's stats for reference
Plays Nurse, complains Wraith is OP.
Just beyond satire at this point
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If survivors have strong builds, then a Killer also needs to have a strong build to stand a chance of winning, and vice-versa. It's not surprising at high ranks you will see the same perks 80% of the time.
Asking why do people run meta is a self-answering question. It's meta because people run it.