I_CAME
I_CAME
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They have to do a three gen solution because they are determined to keep making maps smaller. You can't keep three gen as a powerful strategy if all of the maps are going to be tiny going forward. Games would be unwinnable for survivors if killers chose to play for the three gen. IMO some of the new maps are too small to just place them far apart. You would need to make some of the maps larger than they currently are to make this work. Then people would complain that maps are too big. People are going to be mad no matter how they address it.
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@Gastongard said:
1: Skull Merchant
2: Skull Merchant
3: Skull Merchant
I dont even remember having a complete match against her, there is always someone giving up, unaliving themselves on hook. Nobody wants to play against her. Im always thinking at what could be his killrate because of this, it must be higher than any other killer at this point.
Also, while Nurse or Blight, Spirit (or wesker?) are super OP, at least they are pretty fun to go against, a lot of mindgames, 50/50 scenarios, I feel there is skill involved between the two sides when looping, with SkullMerchant I could play against a killer player, or an NPC and it would be the same, the same braindead gameplay, running from loop to loop because she instantly denies one place with the drones, hitting, debuffing to the ground to everyone who stays a few seconds in the drone zone with deep wound, or hindering you, at the same time that she becomes stealth. It feels so cheap man, you need zero skill with her. And im not even mentioning chess merchants that they are still out there and doing great at 3-gening.
It's currently 65% on nightlight which tends to be slightly lower than the official kill rate. She's probably at 70% in reality.
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Skull Merchant, Blight, Hag
Bonus : Sweaty Nurse
I initially didn't think so but I honestly believe that the new skull merchant is just as unfun to go against as the old one. It's just a miserable experience every time you get her. The games don't last 45 minute minutes anymore but they are just as unfun.
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@CrossTheSholf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3600096#Comment_3600096
We should limit how many gen/chase perks survivors can bring, maybe 2 max.
This is completely fine by me if it meant I didn't have to play against another 4 slowdown blight.
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No. I will happily tunnel people who bodyblock me when I play killer. I think the term entitled survivor is overused but it does apply in this case.
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Delete
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There's no excuse for it at this point. When I need to grind BPs I just hop on killer. Consistent BPs every single game. Why they haven't made any changes to this is beyond me. I still can't believe they killed prove thyself and didn't do anything to boost how many points you get for repairing a gen. No word on it from the devs either. Do they not realize how low BPs are for survivors in a game that already has a terrible grind? Imagine being a new player with no incentive and no offerings. You'd probably get 10-15k per game as an inexperienced solo player. Does this not seem silly to anyone else? I think one possible thing you could do is give every survivor 1k each time a gen is completed. It would make survivor scoring feel much better. It would also give the guy who looped the killer for five gens more points as well.
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They need to just limit how many slowdown/regression perks you can bring. Maybe two max. At least on higher tier killers. The devs have to know that all killers aren't created equal. If they aren't going to nerf nurse and blight significantly then at least make it so they can't stack four slowdown perks. It's basically a guaranteed loss unless the killer is exceptionally bad. They have to know that S tier killers running four slowdowns isn't fair. I don't think the issue is the perks as much as it is certain killers that Behavior is still stubbornly refusing to nerf. It's the same reason ultimate weapon is a big issue. At some point the devs have to acknowledge what the real problem is and make an actual effort to fix it.
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If you really want to punish tunneling then let it work multiple times like OTR does. That in addition to making it a five second stun again.
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Bloodpoint offerings should be universal at the very least. I have like 200 cakes on blight alone and I hate that I can't use them on other characters. I probably have 1500 on survivor overall and it'd be nice if I could use these on killer too.
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Yes. I don't know why they're so afraid to significantly nerf her. It's obvious to any unbiased player that she is way too strong. She's so strong that barely anyone actually tries to defend her as fair. Something that is incredibly rare in the DBD community. You can't even use the low kill rate excuse anymore if you go by nightlight stats. She currently has one of the highest kill rates in the game in spite of bad nurses dragging it down. Apparently killers like hag and trickster are more deserving of changes in Behavior's eyes. Nurse is a relic of the past and does not belong in the current game.
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I assume you're new to the game. It's interesting that you say basekit BT gives survivors free escapes but what you're proposing would give killers free kills with no counterplay. Survivors would be instantly downed upon being unhooked. You'd effectively be at the mercy of your random teammate. If they didn't bring BT then you just died. This was literally why they added basekit BT in the first place. Did you just not play survivor before basekit BT was added?
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Just make save stacks degrade when people stand by the hook. Easy fix to the biggest issue with the perk.
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Hopefully they make it 80 seconds so it can synergize with OTR. Can you imagine how mad people would be? That would be a true counter to hard tunneling. The amount of time you'd be able to waste would be incredible.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3594156#Comment_3594156
SM's killrates are feeding by hook suicides right now for sure. I don't remember single match against her without someone giving up.
I really don't see as many people giving up as people claim now that I have started keeping track. People swear it happens every game against certain killers but this is not my experience at all. I have seen a total of seven survivors give up in my last 103 solo queue games. It's not something that's happening every game. I will also point out 5/7 games where people gave up were lost causes where the killer was already decisively winning before the first gen was even completed. They were games the killer was going to win regardless. I don't think enough people give up in winnable matches to seriously influence the kill rates to the degree that people claim. Definitely not enough to give skull merchant a close to 70% kill rate.
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Something definitely needs to be done about Blights and Nurses stacking four slowdown perks. This is becoming increasingly common in today's game and is impossible to beat unless the person playing killer is completely incompetent. You just load into the game and it's immediately over. People whine about the 3% of four man survivor teams that sweat but never mention the fact that the strongest killers in the game are always the ones bringing the most busted builds imaginable. The latter is far more common. Every single blight/nurse I run into has pop, pain res, corrupt, and maybe an aura perk or another slowdown. Like you already can end chases within seconds and you need to stack slowdown on top of a favorable map offering + busted addons? Things like this tilt the match so far into the favor of one side and are bad for the game.
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As someone who actively plays both sides I would say yes. I really don't think it made bad survivors any better but it made already strong teams even worse to go against. Chasing as an M1 killer or a 110 is painful against MFT.
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In 4000 hours I have never seen anyone use this who wasn't playing for the sole purpose of being toxic.
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Yes it was nerfed. If you ever played killer against a strong SWF on the old haddonfield then you'd know. I had my share of awful killer matches on the old haddonfield and I never want to experience that again. I agree the windows are a problem for some killers but they would need to make other changes to the map if they removed those. The rest of the map is just a giant dead zone.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
I think this nerf is just another example as to why Haste stacking should be removed for both sides.
I don’t personally mind that it got nerfed, I didn’t want another strong haste perk anyway (I’m kinda tired of them at this point), but I think it’s really beginning to show that stacking movement speed is an issue. I can understand if they didn’t want this perk stacking with NOED or even with BFFs Legion in endgame, but MFT + Hope is another example of speed stacking that isn’t balanced either. The only reason that will mostly go away now is because MFT is getting a nerf anyways - that combo will still be unfair if a survivor is lucky enough to get them active at the same time, it just won’t happen nearly as often anymore (and MFT’s pick rate will surely decrease as well).
My point is: Allowing Haste to stack for either side makes it more difficult to balance those perks than it should be and we now have an example where a perk ended up getting nerfed partially because of that. It’s like when Awakened Awareness got nerfed because of Starstruck Nurse, the 2 second linger wasn’t an issue on any other killer, but it was for her so it got removed when Nurse should’ve been getting nerfed instead.
Haste perks should not exist on either side period. The haste effect is incredibly overused in general and it goes beyond just perks. I don't know why the devs think random haste effects do anything except for frustrate the other side. It's what I personally feel is a bad design choice and I hope they move on from it soon. I feel like the game would be more enjoyable for everyone if everyone wasn't running around at different speeds at various points of the match.
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What are you mad about exactly? They stopped a problematic perk before it ever released. Shouldn't this be a good thing? Like who wants to see 123% killers in the end game?
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My solo queue escape rate was near 40% before the MMR changes. That was with 4k hours and relatively sweaty builds. I played normally and didn't make any special effort to play for the hatch. I will keep track and see if this improves with the MMR changes. The games definitely feel closer so hopefully this translates into more wins. Before the change I was getting matched with P100 nurses and other killers who were way above the collective skill level of my teammates. I played against at least eight different P100 Oni mains that I can remember in the last 3 months. I don't feel like that has happened as much since the change.
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I sometimes wish the people who slowly walk around the map with sprint burst would just throw on overcome instead. They'd get a lot more value out of it and be less of a liability. It's a great perk for average MMR or lower. Especially good against mid tier killers and below. I personally just change it from time to time don't have a real preference. I've been using a lot of background player lately.
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Believe or not experienced players can play just fine without it. High level survivor teams don't even use this perk. It's mostly something people use because it's impossible to know where pallets were dropped in solo queue. All nerfing windows would do is make solo queue even weaker. It's not going to do anything to SWFs full of strong survivors. Really any survivor with 2000-3000+ hours already has all the maps memorized anyway. The kind of survivors who can run M1 killers for the entire game with no mistakes are not good because of windows. They're just good at the game in general. That's a whole other issue and has more to do with certain killers just being extremely weak.
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@pseudechis said:
I've never understood the tunnel = no skill argument, as to tunnel out a person you apply the same skills you would to catch any other survivor.
Do the mechanics of being chased magically change when chased a second time off hook? No.
To avoid early elimination try these simple tactics.
Don't get found, don't get caught, make smart unhooks.
Play less overtly/more cautiously at game start. Don't get found first
Put some time into map layouts and run with a plan. The goal is to escape from chase by losing the killer or sinking enough time that they drop chase.
Last one is on your teammates, so there is less you can do about it... but Make safe unhooks, the number of players who rush the hook before you even take 3 steps away and then cry foul for "tunneling" when the most logical target to chase is the injured one who's on second stage.
Demanding the killer not make advantageous decisions is just kinda silly. No one is asking survivors to only focus on one gen at a time please, that would be just as silly.
If you can remove a weak link early and pressure the players in 3v1 instead of 4v1 then its very advantageous to do so. You should expect it to happen and take the necessary steps to try and avoid it. That's DBD.
I can subjectively say that almost no killer I run into chases good survivors first. Smart move if all you care about is winning. I don't think it makes you good at the game though. I have not been successfully tunneled in my last 100 solo queue games because killers will usually drop chase with me when they realize I won't go down quickly. 90% of tunneling I encounter in my games is an experienced killer bullying a less experienced survivor. Usually the lowest hour count player. It doesn't mean you have no skill but it does mean you are taking the path of least resistance. The majority of killers I run into who tunnel at five gens are very mediocre in chase based on my interaction with them. They win solely because there is one survivor who is significantly worse than the other three. If you can't win consistently without having a bad survivor to tunnel out then are you really any good at the game? Probably not.
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@MikeStev said:
Do not expect too much, Blight is golden boy.
They can't ignore him forever. Especially as they continue to shrink maps and make them less safe. It gets harder and harder to justify any killer being this strong with zero weaknesses. Blight's lethality and mobility on some of these new maps is ridiculous.
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(not a survivor only player). I don't mind playing against any killer except for utterly broken ones like nurse and blight. Like I can respect it when I play against a good Wesker or Oni. Killers that are strong but fair for both sides. I don't really enjoy playing against things like Xeno, Skull Merchant, Tombstone Michael, etc but I don't HATE it.
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Still strong. Just not broken like he was before. I just don't like the design of the killer which is fairly subjective of course.
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@Triplehoo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/397470/did-bhvr-tweak-mmr
Who? I tried to search these streamers and info about this, but nothing came up. You made this up, didn't you?
Otz and Scott. I don't know who beyond this.
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The people who get upset over this sort of thing are... strange to say the least. It's like the people who got upset over Stranger Things returning. Oh no i'm not special in a video game anymore!
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I don't have a huge problem with the perk itself. We all know the real issue is how strong it is on overpowered killers. It's Behavior's stubborn refusal to significantly nerf Nurse and Blight that is the real issue.
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It's still a problem on certain maps if the killer intentionally plays for it. If the maps are going to continue getting smaller then they need to go through with their stated plans of deleting three gens entirely. I don't want to stay in a game 20 minutes longer than normal.
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Pennywise is the only one left that I really care about. I hope they can find a way to get him one day.
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The matchmaking has always been the biggest issue. You get sweaty killers who hard tunnel every match being put into games with casual teams. It's ridiculous and seriously hurts the quality of the matches. I get annoyed watching my solo queue teammates get tunneled out in half of my matches while being powerless to do anything about it. If you want to sweat for the 4K every game then you should expect to play against sweaty survivors exclusively. I don't understand the point of even having an MMR system if it works the way it currently does. Who exactly is benefitting from it? You can break the system even more by lobby shopping for easy matches. All the more reason to completely do away with the lobby. Matchmaking isn't perfect in any game but other games typically make more effort to separate people who play like their life is on the line from everyone else.
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I'm gonna be extremely rich regardless.
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I don't believe the lobby should exist at all. You should queue up and then go straight into a match. It'd result in faster matches for everyone since you wouldn't be able to dodge as you do now. It would also likely result in at least slightly better matchmaking. Just literally delete the lobby and all of the issues are solved. High prestige survivors just serve to make certain killers dodge the lobby. What exactly is the benefit of keeping it visible is a better question. How much you actually get dodged varies greatly from lobby to lobby but it definitely does exist in my experience. If prestige doesn't matter then why can't survivors see the prestige level of the killer? Oh that's right because we all know every survivor would dodge a P100 killer.
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Behavior's recent obsession with haste needs to stop in general. They just slap haste on everything and it makes the game way too confusing for everyone. Sometimes you will get hit simply because you had no idea that the killer had haste and it caused you to misjudge a situation. That doesn't make the game fresh or exciting. It's just frustrating more than anything else. It goes against all of the muscle memory you've built up over time. It's even worse for newer players who don't react as well to what the killer is doing. There's a reason why she has a 70% kill rate.
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There is no correlation in my games. I have tracked this very thing in close to 100 recent games. Only three killers seriously attempted to tunnel me during this time, and all three failed. Killers will typically avoid you if you have high prestige and/or high hours. Saying "killers target me because of high prestige" is more likely to be a cope that bad loopers use to rationalize why they get targeted so often. In the games I tracked, the survivors who get tunneled are almost always the worst players on the team. Killers will almost always drop the chase or even refuse to chase a survivor who is good or perceived to be good. I will keep tracking this until I reach 500 games, but I don't expect it to change much.
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Blight
Nurse
Map Offerings
Stacking Four slowdowns against 90% of teams
SWF stacking Endurance
Tunneling against solo queue
I think most things that are actually unfair were removed. There is just a handful more that Behavior stubbornly refuses to change for whatever reason.
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@FreddyVoorhees said:
What is stopping bhvr from creating advanced tutorials for new players ?
All mentioned plus everything else like :
99 the gates
Dont unhook right away but use time for gens
How to loop well
Avoiding 3 gen situation
Detailed status effects
Dragging out the game by using your own hookstates too
Detailed hex totem guide
Etc etc..
If this and much more was part of the main tutorial, soloq would be in far better state.
Same can be done for killers too.
Advanced guides aren't going to solve anything as long as tunneling is such an effective strategy. I'm closing in on 100 games of an experiment i'm doing. By far the biggest reason solo is miserable is because of tunneling. Newer players and casual players who have zero chance are ruthlessly tunneled in slightly over half of my games so far. It is an almost guaranteed win for the killer when this happens. No amount of guides is going to fix that. Experienced players can't "take chase" either because killers will almost always ignore you when they realize you can't be quickly deleted from the game. It will continue to be this way until Behavior makes killers chase everyone and not just the 1-2 terrible players on the team.
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Playing AGAINST them is boring more than anything else. They are predictable and easy to beat. The biggest issue from a survivor POV is how they refuse to rescue you. If the gates are powered then they aren't going to make any attempt to save you like most human players would. They will just leave. They also melt down when a terror radius is nearby. I had a bot going for a save awhile back. It literally ran RIGHT PAST ME and I went to stage two. This was because the terror radius showed up right as they were about to unhook. The killer was far enough away that the bot wasn't even at risk of being hit. They need a lot of work.
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@mca240 said:
I just don't understand, what the developers want. I am a decent survivor, not the best but definitely not the worst. Pre 6.1 my escape rate was about 50-70%. They wanted killers to be "stronger". Ok. Hence the buffs. They have progressively nerfed survivor since (mainly because of the premades, HUD was the only buff). My escape rate has dropped to around 25% over time, not because of my skills but because of increasingly worse teammates. My escape rate has been 10% since the PTB came out (I played a lot since time off). I mean, at this rate I just don't feel like playing survivor anymore. What is the point of playing a game, where you know you'll loose? I don't care waiting a couple of minutes more if I am getting decent teammates. Right now I'll only play to get the Tome done and then just abandon the game.
My escape is under 40% in solo queue since I started tracking about 80 games ago. This is as a 4000 hour survivor main mind you... I wonder how low the escape rate is for casual players in solo queue? It's just insane how hard hard solo queue is at the moment. On the other hand I have no issues winning the LARGE MAJORITY of my games as killer. I was a killer main for my first 1000 hours or so and I have gone back to that in the past few weeks. Killer is just braindead easy at the moment. All you do is slap on four meta perks and hard tunnel at five gens. You will consistently destroy the average survivor team you run into in pub matches. I have run into very few teams that actually stand a chance against me when I am sweating to win.
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I have the same issue. This happened to me in a game just now. It just doesn't work at all for me. I tried reselecting the challenge and it did nothing. If I go with no perks it still doesn't work. I can't progress the rift at all from this path.
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Pain Res pop combo is indeed too strong on high tier killers. I think as we balance the maps, buff killers, nerf survivor perks, etc it might be time to talk about stacking four gen perks being a bit much in the average match. Having some sort of hard limit on how many regression/slowdown perks someone can bring might be a good idea. There's no good reason a Nurse should be able to bring four slowdown perks. How are you even supposed to win against this if the killer is remotely competent? I think the right solution would just be to nerf Nurse and Blight but Behavior seems opposed to this at the present time for whatever reason. I do expect it will happen eventually but who knows how long that will be.
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@TeleportingTurkey said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3580067#Comment_3580067
not really because:
1) they softcapped it for a reason and it didnt work well: people complained because they got "unfair" (actually fair matches where they had to put effort) and matches took way longer to find.
2) making ranked remain obligatory rather than being arbitrary alternative gamemode would achieve nothing I suggest it would do - be pristine version of dbd, unaffected by events/challenges; gamemode where people are coming with one specific mindset rather than having all of them playing together and ruining fun for each other.
I don't think the wait was that big of a deal personally. At least not since I have experienced the current system and how poor the match quality currently is. They need to stop giving in to whiners in situation like this. If someone wants to sweat hard for the 4K every game then their "reward" should be playing against sweaty SWFs every game. They shouldn't be allowed to go into casual games and make everyone else miserable. Having these 6000 hour sweat lords being mixed in with everyone else is hurting the game a lot IMO.
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So glad it's not FNAF. Hopefully this is a well designed killer that is fun for everyone.
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@GolbezGarlandGabrant said:
Can you blame people though for want to SWF. SoloQ is a killer stomping ground.
Exactly. I don't know what some killers don't understand about this.
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@Paternalpark said:
Don't give up immediately. If the Blight you are facing is on your skill level he can fun to play against.
If not just bail. I do the same. I won't waste time because bhvr can't sort decent matchmaking.
Blight, Nurse, skull merchant and Knight are on my shortlist for giving up. Wesker if his ping is bad which is usually the case.
Your second line sums up why the first line is rarely the case. Have you ever heard of a blight called ArrayGamer? He's second in the world in blight rushes. I have been matched with this guy in solo queue on at least three separate occasions that I can remember. My win rate in solo queue can't be much higher than the average 39% escape rate that Behavior posted awhile back. Yet the game still feeds me killers like this. In solo queue you simply don't have a chance against a remotely competent blight player since the efficiency just isn't going to be there from your teammates. Very rarely do I run into a terrible Blight player. They're always players with thousands of hours and the standard sweaty blight build. I would have no issues with Blight if the game had strict matchmaking and these guys only got matched with the sweatiest SWFs around. I'm just sick of going against 5000 hour Blights in my solo queue games.
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Agreed. It shouldn't even be an option like some people suggest. The base bleedout time should just immediately speed up once there are only two survivors left. Many teammates would refuse to use a give up button just to spite their teammate for not picking them up. Even though doing so would result in both people dying. You already see the same thing when the 2nd to last person is hooked and refuses to give up out of spite.
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They never actually did anything to make the grind better. They made things 33% cheaper in the bloodweb but they also killed the BP bonus on perks like BBQ, WGLF, Prove Thyself, etc. These perks were heavily used by people who wanted to make the grind less awful. Prove was a guaranteed 10K bps nearly every match. These days you get maybe half of that due to how few BPs you get for doing generators. WGLF and BBQ effectively doubled your BPs in nearly every match. I enjoyed the game more when I could double my points whenever I felt like it. The incentives exist but they are not always on the role you want to play. Maybe you only like playing survivor and can only play during primetime when there is no incentive. The grind is absolutely insane in this sort of situation. Then you have to consider that new players don't have thousands of cakes, streamers, etc to make the grind less terrible like many veteran players do. Think of how many games it would take a new player to get just one prestige level.