Firellius
Firellius
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2837807#Comment_2837807
Aaaaand where did i say that i expect a 4k every match?
I mean, most of my matches as solo survivor, the killer gets barely 4 hooks by the time the gates are powered. This doesn´t look problematic to you?
When you call a killer that strings wins together 'viable', you're implying that that is the baseline to shoot for. Not a 50% winrate, but a 'watch the winrate pile up' winrate.
And no, your anecdote doesn't worry me.
@Veinslay said:
You guys remember when we used to complain how survivor sided the game is when you play against SWFs and everyone told us "it's okay that it's unbalanced, you hardly ever run into the death squads anyways! Just take the loss and move on!" and then SBMM came along and now you play against those teams like every game? Lol
Kind of like how survivors are told to suck it up in regards to camping and tunnelling, and then those became very commonplace too. In other words...
@JonahsTablet said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2838402#Comment_2838402
You're right, that's one of the biggest issues I have with the game, no matter which side you play, the most optimal way to play is also the most boring way to play. You can't say the game is killer or survivor biased, it's just varying degree's of BS, and maybe some killers deal with a bit more BS, but a few rounds of Nurse can change that.
This.
The game is 'sweat-sided'.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2837585#Comment_2837585
So thats it? Only 2 out of 26 killers are considered viable if they slap on 4 slowdown perks and the best addons?
If someone says 'watch the winrate pile up', the term 'viable' is an understatement.
If you're expecting to 4K every match, the issue is your perception of balance, not the actual balance.
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@Gamedozer7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2837286#Comment_2837286
There's also so many times I'll turn around after hooking a survivor and walk 2 steps and someone has already unhooked them.
And that's exactly what I don't want encouraged. Which is why BT shouldn't be baseline.
DS would be fine, hookbombing for that is way more punishable with a slug.
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@ukenicky said:
I wish it had an effect similar to Mettle of Man where you could tank a hit for a brief window of time instead of dashing forward, giving you deep wounds + the typical speed boost upon hit if you predict correctly and bait the killer into hitting you during the proposed super small window of activation.
I think this is the only way you can make DH an okay perk. You can fiddle with the hit window to make it more forgiving if it's too baitable, but this would make a DH play properly skill based.
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@SuzuKR said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2837259#Comment_2837259
BT isn't distance-based anymore.
Not technically. Any unhooked survivor will get the endurance effect when unhooked with BT.
But if the killer is six, seven seconds away from the hook, they're not catching up in time to trigger it. So in practice, BT still only works if the killer is close to the hook.
Still, BT baseline is pretty dumb, IMO. It's a perk that supports hook bombing, it shouldn't be baseline. DS would be a better pick.
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2835107#Comment_2835107
That's not what I said at all. Are you seriously trying a strawman here?
Read the words, try to understand their actual meaning, imagine the possibilities. I've already spent my patience quota for the day.
That is what you said. Maybe you didn't mean to say it, or you misread something I wrote when you agreed with it.
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@_AdamFrancis_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2835107#Comment_2835107
The game SHOULD be heavily killer sided.
The killers are the ones with weapons, correct?
So it makes no sense that the game heavily favors survivors.
The game should be heavily killer sided, to the point where survivors would need to use a lot of teamwork to win.
If you want to go with 'realism', four people can easily wrestle down one. Imagine David just punching Deathslinger and snapping his neck.
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2832377#Comment_2832377
Essentially, yes. Further tuning can be done after this step (if it can ever be done).
So what you want is to make it fully, completely and only the killer's game, on a loose suggestion that 'maybe we'll balance it again at some indeterminate point after'.
Sounds totally reasonable, and not like a stereotypical forum killer at all.
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2832170#Comment_2832170
Oh, I wouldn't want to limit options either. But with better alternatives, I believe these would be become fringe.
So what you want is for killers to have a fair shot when playing normally, but also just get to keep their tactics that are absolutely no fun and arguably too powerful.
"Listen, we can have a fair knife fight if YOU drop your gun. I'll be holding onto mine though. Just in case."
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2830806#Comment_2830806
The thing is, the kill rate is what it is because now killers mostly need to tunnel and camp. It's really not healthy for the game.
Not having to eat a DH after eating pallets in the Game or some other busted map would reduce the time pressure.
Be that as it may, neither BHVR nor most forum killers want to trade being able to tunnel and camp for a rebalance around not using those tactics. So those stay the norm.
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It's baffling to me that the devs want to preserve camping and tunnelling so badly. They're basically measuring two different killer types in their balancing: The sweats and the 'for fun' folks, and it's making their job harder.
The whole game needs to be less sweaty. A lot of bully tactics on the survivor side could easily get scrapped without hindering regular play too much, too.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2826096#Comment_2826096
"just swapping target" is extremely wasteful because, otherwise, those perks didn't need to exist from the beginning.
Without existence of DS and BT, killers would be able to kill a survivor one or two minutes faster, which is certainly more impactful than 20% progression loss of NOED (if you decide to do bones before gate is powered, anyway).
UB is not a problem though, I don't think anyone actually playing around that perk after all.
@Gamedozer7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2826096#Comment_2826096
1-2 gens left switching targets can be a huge disadvantage because you need to remove a player. If you down a survivor and the is one or more around or some one going for a save slugging is required. They remove crucial killer strategies were in one chase you can be down to 2 gens and have no way to build pressure because you have to respect said perks.
Noed punishes survivors who stay on gens and don't bother locating totems to cleanse or remember.
If you think it's that much of a waste of time to swap targets, just eat the DS.
But don't complain that when you tunnel, you get hit with the one anti-tunnelling perk survivors have.
Noed punishes survivors who stay on gens and don't bother locating totems to cleanse or remember.
It punishes survivors who did 4/5 totems much harder than those who did none.
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@Gamedozer7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2826078#Comment_2826078
Thats not what I mean like the counter to ds is slug if you think they have ds or bt I'd just wait it out and don't hit. My point is most of the counters involves assuming that they have said perk and playing around it and all 4 survivors can have all of them. Yet just do bones is normally countered by I'm not doing bones for something that might not even happen.
And my point is that you lose practically nothing. All it takes to counter BT and DS is just to swap targets, which takes legitimately zero seconds. All it takes to counter UB is to pick the target up, which doesn't cost you any time either, since that's already part of your objective progression.
Compared to NOED, which requires you to slow objective progression by around 20%, if not more.
The only thing I'll give you, and which I've been advocating for, is that BT should strip unit collision for the duration of the Endurance effect so they can't bodyblock you when you're trying to go for the unhooker.
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@Gamedozer7 said:
How come it's expected for the one Killer to expect and respect these perks ever game times 4 but 4 survivors can't do the same for NOED?
DS: Requires you to not pick up the survivor who was pulled off the hook the past 60 seconds, as long as they haven't done anything to progress survivor states.
BT: Requires you to either not be at the hook during an unhook, or simply not hit the unhooked target for 8 seconds.
DH: Can be uncounterable, so to what degree do you need to 'expect or respect' this perk?
UB: Just pick them up.
DS + UB: Leave them slugged and let them burn their one shot at UB, or let DS time out. Either way, they're on the ground for an extended period of time and cannot help their team.
NOED: Find and cleanse all five totems and hope the killer has NOED. Failure to clear even a single totem means all effort wasn't just wasted, it was actively detrimental to the survivors' chances of escape.
Seriously, DS is the perk with the most light-weight counterplay in the entire game, and you're trying to compare it to NOED, which has by far the most overweight counterplay in the entire game.
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2825855#Comment_2825855
You don't know the DbD charts? Have you ever watched a tournament?
Do I really need to state that it would be foolish to look the game from the point of view of beginners?
We don't need beginners. But we also don't need the absolute top. Strictly top-down balancing makes for an unplayable and unlikeable mess.
Imagine a game where one side wins by default, and the other side wins if they make a number of frame-perfect inputs in sequence. At the absolute top level, side A would probably lose, but everywhere else, side B would lose.
Is it reasonable to disregard all other levels of play and state that, at complete top performance, side B wins, and thus the game, as a whole, is B-sided?
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2825377#Comment_2825377
Yes, broad raw data doesn't mean anything. The devs have told so many times by the way. If this fact doesn't register, I cannot help you with this.
You look at the highest ranked players in the charts and listen what they say and their arguments.
Don't worry about it. You'll get it yourself in a couple thousand of hours I guess.
Again: How do you know they're the best players, since MMR is hidden?
Also again: Why only look at that level?
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I remember one match where I was getting frustrated with lack of progress. Then Kindred fired, and I noticed a Bill exiting and re-entering lockers. I got in a chase and led the killer to his locker, interacted with it to show the killer he was there, and she picked him up and hooked him.
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There's no point in going for boon-wide nerfs when only CoH is OP, and the rest of the boon perks range from mediocre to trash-tier.
CoH could do with a longer bless time, a shorter range, and a cooldown.
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No matter if you're a killer main or a survivor main
Dumbass challenge requirements make allies of us all.
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BT doesn't need its duration decreased, but its endurance effect should strip unit collision for the duration. I don't want to hit the person who just got unhooked, so don't make me.
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2825249#Comment_2825249
Some where, yes.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2825293#Comment_2825293
I'm not looking at this forum. I'm rarely here myself. I'm looking at the best players of the game who have played it for a long time.
So aggregate data does not qualify as evidence, but the opinion of select individuals does?
How do you know they're the best players, and why only look at that level?
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2825171#Comment_2825171
All the statistics are saying is that, in the grand scheme of things, there is some kind of balance. It may be heavily influenced by new players not staying long, or the opposite : it could mean anything and thus means nothing.
I'm not saying there were strong evidences presented for the other side of the argument. This is however the obvious conclusion anyone reaches after having played for a long time. Note that it doesn't matter to me anymore. I've given up on the game months ago. I use it as a party game while debating in Among Us (or any other game with action down-time) and that's all.
You are assuming bringing solo up to SWFs will not buff the SWFs too.
Meanwhile, the game is steadily bleeding players and the queues keep increasing. The trend will probably stop with the Ring release before resuming a month later. I doubt they'll ever fix high-MMR gameplay for killers. I don't think they can.
I'm not saying there were strong evidences presented for the other side of the argument. This is however the obvious conclusion anyone reaches after having played for a long time.
It's the conclusion anyone *on this forum* reaches. But these forums will also bend over backwards to discredit any evidence to the contrary, so it's not like these people are devoid of serious bias.
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I think I've used it once, in a custom game, as me and my friends were figuring out how it worked. And I think at that point, it didn't. As in: No one could see the marker. That was a long time ago though, so I might be misremembering.
It's just incredibly niche, and as a communication tool, it's very inadequate. It's just pointing at -something-, which no indication of intent or purpose.
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@drsoontm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2825089#Comment_2825089
Broad data is no evidence.
For this to have any meaning, it should be split by recent game time (as experience can drop) for both sides, SWF games, solo games (and all shades between them) and MMR brackets.
Distributing the games between all these categories can change the value and meaning of these numbers significantly.
Broad data is really weak evidence, but it is still evidence.
Again, it's more than the 'game is survivor-sided' theory has, which has never presented any evidence, weak or otherwise.
@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2825137#Comment_2825137
While I agree with this. I really wonder what's the devs plan with killers after they lifted up solos to the same information level as SWF.
Stats showed that SWF has a 15% higher escape rate. Now if solos reach the same level, the devs obviously need to do something for killers. At least when they want to continue with their 2 kills, 2 escapes balancing.
Stats showed that SWF has a 15% higher escape rate. Now if solos reach the same level, the devs obviously need to do something for killers.
Not necessarily. If Swiffers are at 50% escape rate and solos are at 35% escape rate, then bringing solos up to par with Swiffers wouldn't warrant any buff for the killer side.
Swiffers having a 15% higher escape rate does not immediately indicate them as being OP, since it's not benchmarked.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2825004#Comment_2825004
"statistics" kekw
Still more evidence than the 'game is survivor-sided' theory.
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I suspect it's because of engine limitations. The floor would have to be registered as an entity specifically for boons to be stopped by. They can't do a simple height or collision check, since that'd break them entirely.
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There is no evidence the game is survivor-sided. All statistics point to the game being balanced.
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@Reshy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2823910#Comment_2823910
How about if your boon gets snuffed you go into the dying state?
Way too harsh. Exposed is fine.
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@Reshy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2823646#Comment_2823646
Outside a SWF maybe, but I've seen them before and they can give some pretty good value when placed intelligently.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2823678#Comment_2823678
I mean that's nothing new? A survivor can unhook you in front of the killer, watch you get downed and hooked, and unhook you again and then you're out of the game. Either the perk needs a penalty for using it flippantly, or it needs to be weaker. What would you prefer?
I mean that's nothing new? A survivor can unhook you in front of the killer, watch you get downed and hooked, and unhook you again and then you're out of the game. Either the perk needs a penalty for using it flippantly, or it needs to be weaker. What would you prefer?
Yes, other survivors can screw you over. No reason to make it easier. I don't want to be saddled with a global disadvantage because someone else picked a bad perk. It's way better to localise it only to the survivor who took the perk.
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@APoipleTurtle said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2823325#Comment_2823325
Honestly, I think boons would be so much more fun if they could "backfire" when snuffed by the killer.
Imagine if boons inflicted some kind of minor penalty on the entire survivor team (since everyone could use the effect) and a more significant effect on the boon's owner. Plus they could also build in a natural "cooldown" where the afflicted boon player couldn't bless a new totem until their debuffs from the previous snuffing wore off.
@Reshy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2823514#Comment_2823514
I've suggested this before, the perks turning into penalizing hexes when kicked. It doesn't fix the problem of putting a boon in the corner of the map during a 3-gen but it solves the other issues with relighting it. Especially since if you kick it and it becomes a hex, it takes longer to boon it again so it's faster to cleanse.
My suggestion for kicked boons was:
Circle of Healing: Becomes a hex that gives a -25% healing speed to survivors in the trial while active, stacks up to 5 times at diminishing rates (25% -> 40% -> 50% -> 55% -> 60%).
Shadow Step: Becomes a hex that gives the killer aura reading on survivors within 6 meters, plus 2m per active shadow step hex.
Dark Theory: Becomes a hex that gives survivors a stacking 1% movement speed penalty.
Exponential: Becomes a hex that gives survivors slower recovery rates that stacks up to 5 times at similar numbers to Circle of Healing.
Gonna give both of you a very hard no on the concept of a snuffed boon setting up a team-wide penalty. We don't want a 2 hour Mikaela ruining the game for all the other players like that.
But I do like the idea of CoH carrying a risk penalty for getting snuffed, and I do like the idea of boons having cooldowns. At the very least, boons need to be individualised more to better balance risk/reward on an individual basis: Nerfs to boons as a mechanism are just going to cripple the bad boons more than CoH.
Boons should have individual ranges, bless times, cooldowns-upon-snuff, and possibly adverse effects upon snuff.
For example...
CoH
Now decreases boon radius to 16 from 24. Lowest boon radius affects all boons in your perk loadout.
Now increases bless time to 20 from 14. Highest bless time affects all boons in your perk loadout.
Snuff cooldown of 60 seconds. Highest snuff cooldown affects all boons in your perk loadout.
Survivor suffers from Exposed while CoH is on cooldown
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@Akumakaji said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2822783#Comment_2822783
Sorry for being a bit negative here, but this just sounds as theory-crafting of a person who never played the game. Not accusing you of that, but your whole comment reaks of just that: theory-crafting. You absolutely fail to mention the other perks you got at your disposal, if borrowed time, which is a staple in many survivors builds, or kindred, which many SWFs disregard as a soloQ perk. But I bet you haven't used in a very long time, kindred provides nearly flawless info on the killer, when he leaves the hook, in which direction, or where exactly he is at a given loop around a hook. But of course, kindred isn't as fancy as a lot of other stuff.
I don't consider DS a no-brainer or auto include perk. Its another second chance, and one that helps a lot when the killer actually tries to tunnel you, but I would much more run kindred and/or BT.
But I am STILL confused why we are both duking it out. Did I say anywhere that DS needs to be nerfed? And if offing a survivor in a dead zone was that easy, you would see a lot more high MMR games that ended with a 2k then a 4E.
BT isn't at anyone's disposal. You have to hope someone else has it, and even then, it is even weaker as an anti-tunnel perk than DS. BT's only strength is body blocking (which should be eliminated) and anti-camping, not anti-tunnelling.
And I have no idea how you came up with Kindred being anti-tunnelling. How does knowing where the killer is when he's not tunnelling help you when he -is- tunnelling?
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@AsherFrost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2823193#Comment_2823193
Noed has the exact same counter as every other hex perk. Boon/destroy the totem carrying the hex.
What you are talking about is the separate tactic for stopping it from activating at all. And yes, that takes some doing and is unique. Because NOED Is the only perk that can be removed from the match before it has the chance to activate at all.
Trying, as you continually do, to pretend the entire and only counter to noed is cleansing 5 totems, especially in the boon meta where there aren't ever 5 dull totems when the last gen is powered, is absolutely disingenuous and intellectually dishonest. I'm not going around this bush with you again, I'm just disappointed to see you clinging to the exact same fallacies week after week.
Noed has the exact same counter as every other hex perk.
Yes, but at this point, you have to compare it to other hexes, and NOED blows all of them out of the water in terms of power. This is like saying CoH isn't a problem because it has the same counter as Exponential, and Exponential isn't a problem, so...
Because NOED Is the only perk that can be removed from the match before it has the chance to activate at all.
This is also not true. In fact, NOED is probably the perk that this is the least likely to occur on.
Ruin can go down before it affects a single gen. Lullaby can go down before a single stack. Devour Hope can go down before a single stack. And then there's circumstantial perks that may never encounter their appropriate trigger condition. What if you run Lightborn into a team that doesn't use flashlights?
Lots of perks are perfectly able to be flat-out ignored, lots of perks can be brought down before they have a chance to activate. NOED is not one of them.
'But five totems!'
And at that point, the survivors have spent an absolute minimum of 70 seconds of work effort to clear those five totems out, making it almost on par with how effective Thanatophobia would be if all survivors were injured literally all the time. So at that point, is NOED really deactivated? Or did it just shift from being a permanent expose perk to one of the best slowdown perks in the game?
Trying, as you continually do, to pretend the entire and only counter to noed is cleansing 5 totems
Oh, I don't. I think it's even in this thread where I point out that doing 5 totems is objectively the wrong counter to NOED.
But the alternative is to go hunting for a totem that RNG could've dumped anywhere on the map while the killer is exerting the most pressure they ever will during the entire game with a 4% bonus movespeed, instadowns, and a pretty clear idea of where the survivors are going to be.
Flat-out comparing it to its closest relative, Devour Hope, shows NOED to have absolutely no build-up requirement, while being protected by four other totems.
Regardless of whether it's balanced or not, NOED is just flat garbage design and needs to be reworked.
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@pseudechis said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2823081#Comment_2823081
you can get away with being sloppy and ignoring game mechanics sounds less balanced to me that accounting for and being aware of what may happen in game.
Its not immaculate to have a bit of basic common sense in game, nothing I've said requires uber skills to achieve outside of some basic game sense. Thinking that basic common sense is immaculate is a shocking indictment of you as gamer I'd be caustious with that statement.
Its not rocket science, its just easier to cry foul blame everything but yourself and scream for nerfs than it is to learn a lil game sense. Moreso if you have steam rolled the killer due to inexperience/out play, as often people claim when railing against NOED.
You talk about gamesense, but you describe it as 'not a big deal' to have to stay off the killer's radar in the last segments of the game.
By the time NOED is about to pop, there's only three locations the survivors need to go, drastically increasing the likelihood he'll find a survivor. Then when NOED pops, it goes down to two locations. Add in the movespeed boost, and not getting caught during end-game is pretty damn unlikely. At least one sod is likely going to get into a chase at that point and will likely get smacked by the instadown.
At this point, the killer is also entirely within their right to facecamp whoever they get, so that one instadown is far more dangerous than it is at any earlier point.
'Just cleanse then!'
But that's RNG dependant due to the way it spawns, and RNG does not a fair perk make.
'Just cleanse 5 before repairing 5!'
That's a full extra gen of time spent working on countering a perk the killer might not even have. Which takes NOED from being an instadown in end-game to the best slowdown perk in the game, and an utterly broken one if the killer doesn't equip it.
NOED has by far the most involved counterplay of any perk in the entire game, but it doesn't pair this with a moderate effect. Its effect is the strongest in the game bar one, which is also the highest effort, highest risk perk in the game: Devour Hope. Comparatively, NOED has extremely low effort, extremely low risk, and really high reward.
Kind of like Dead Hard.
EDIT: And none of that is taking camping into consideration.
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@pseudechis said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2823035#Comment_2823035
They didn't lose, you died. They ran a strong perk that you failed to avoid and you died end of story.
Everything that happened prior to that event is irrelevant othetr than in the context of you being salty about your death. If you avoided the killer all game and smashed out the gens great but you also...
Failed to note totems and cleanse NOED
Failed to open exit gates or timed the exit gate poorly leaving not enough time to save someone on hook or cleanse NOED
Went for that bad save anyway even though its a really poor play and went down
Failed to avoid the killer in endgame
Failed to be far enough from death hook that NOED shouldn't really an issue and if you aren't on death hook then there is often plenty of time to find and cleanse it especially if the killer is camping leaving you free to search.
Failed to play cautiously, competently or in a coordinated manner meaning the whole team went down in the endgame together.
Couldn't effectively judge the cost of staying in game against NOED so was overly alturistic making you more suceptible to NOED
All of these points are a failure of the survivor team and nothing to do with whatever the killer is doing.
The killer hadn't lost, they had a strong endgame perk that the survivors failed to anticipate and counter. The perception that they had already won is part of the survivors failure to counter NOED.
Google the video of the cyclist who celebrates too soon raises his hands and slows down at the finish line and is then passed and beaten as a result... that's you in this scenario. Read the fable the Hare and the Tortoise the cockiness of being ahead is part of what makes up the higher impact of NOED for you.
Its a bitter pill to swallow but its not NOED's fault this is what I mean when I say, own your loss.
All of these points are a failure of the survivor team and nothing to do with whatever the killer is doing.
"You need to be immaculate, or else the killer gets a free kill"
Does that sound at all balanced?
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Maybe a Control chapter.
But also, a better response to the NFT situation. They just swept that one under the rug.
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I even found a super niche technique to prevent it from ever bothering you; just don't get bothered by it.
Don't enjoy the game? There's a super niche technique to prevent it from ever bothering you: Just don't get bothered by it!
Annoyed at anti-tunnelling and anti-camping measures? Just don't be annoyed!
Getting frustrated because survivors bully the crap out of you? Just don't get frustrated!
Worst 'excuse' ever.
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@anarchy753 said:
Because if noed isn't threatening then the entire concept of dull totems breaks down and other perks like Pentimento get nerfed as a consequence.
Noed exists to make survivors want to cleanse totems, not to give killers a one hit down.
The way NOED is designed achieves the exact opposite though. It is objectively better to leave dull totems up, if you want to counter NOED.
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@NemeanXIII said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2820634#Comment_2820634
Whatever perk that allows Ace to perform faster action on healing,that perk!
He doesn't have one. His perks are Up the Ante, which increases luck (IE: It does nothing), Open-handed, which increases aura reading range, and Ace in the Hole, which adds add-ons to items he finds in chests.
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@NemeanXIII said:
There are to many boons you have a boon that gives you unbreakable,you have a boon that heals you 45 % faster, you have a boon that hides noises, scratch marks, and blood
Not to mention cobbled by perks that not only increase healing but gen progression also bite the bullet, leader, spine chill, the Felix perk Desperate Measures
Ace's Ante Up,Lucky Break now the new perk parental guidance which has no cool down
Please that is enough do you realize how hard the killer job is.Its hard enough for the 1 v1 and now you have every survivor basically can reset any progression you make as killer.You need to now give every killer an expose addons to just to counter this
2 gens left every survivor resetted and you have to break off a chase on to start the same process over and guess the survivor you let go their fully healed you stand hardly no choice against high MMR survivors like this
Please consider to stop making healing perks and boons or give all killers and exposed addons star struck, make your choice is situational at best.
Ace's Ante Up
Okay, but on the flipside, killers have such mind-bogglingly OP perks as Monstrous Shrine and Territorial Imperative! Survivors need their Up the Ante to even stand a chance!
Seriously though, if you're complaining about Up the Ante, you're complaining about survivors having perks, period.
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I think it's a fair competitor to BBQ & Chili, without encouraging tunnelling or camping too much, if at all. Sure, BBQ & Chili gives you similar vision, but it only does so at a time when you are far away and unable to act on it, and it has plenty of counterplay for the survivors, as they can block it with a locker.
Floods of Rage, on the other hand, can highlight a survivor that's trying to hide just out of sight, right when you need it most. I think it can situationally exceed BBQ & Chili.
EDIT: In terms of gameplay health, BBQ & Chili also helps camping tremendously. Any missing outlines will encourage camping, as killers assume someone is nearby to go for the unhook.
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@SunsetSherbet said:
I firmly believe a large amount of survivors do not want a PVP game but a co-op PVE game, and they get angry when people play in a way that removes their PVE Co-op experience. They feel they should win because that's how it works in a co-op game. They feel they are supposed to win. The fact they expect the killer to play "just for the chase" and not try to win is further evidence they view the killer as an NPC, and not another player.
Specifically camping and tunnelling remove the PvP component and turn the game into PvE for the survivors that aren't being targeted. Camping also removes the PvP component for the person being targeted, since they can't do anything.
Not everything is survivors being a-holes, seriously.
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@SomberNokk said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2818500#Comment_2818500
The game is geared towards your side, let us have the forums.
The game is geared towards your side
Did the forums tell you that?
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I think the game would be better off if a bunch of meta perks were integrated into the baseline of the game. DS as an innate anti-tunnelling thing for example, and innate CI so killers don't spawn in, run to the other side of the map, just in time to see the gen be finished before they could do anything about it.
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This is why I don't like the idea of BT being picked to be baseline over DS.
Making a good hook save is a skill.
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@fulltonon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2816737#Comment_2816737
Average killer players are getting dunked on every two matches, it means survivors should be nerfed hard?
Are you pulling a 50% winrate out of thin air and saying that means it's UP?
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2816702#Comment_2816702
The average kill rate stats are useless. They take everything into account, from little Timmy who just got the game, to Hex: Virginity who played the game since beta non-stop and has over 12000 hours. Most players are around Timmy, somewhat higher, and people don't know how to counter tunneling and camping over there. We don't need the game to cater to the people who don't know how to play the game.
Camping and tunneling could get nerfed if Killers didn't need them, but the devs are never going to do that
The average kill rate stats are useless. They take everything into account, from little Timmy who just got the game, to Hex: Virginity who played the game since beta non-stop and has over 12000 hours. Most players are around Timmy, somewhat higher, and people don't know how to counter tunneling and camping over there. We don't need the game to cater to the people who don't know how to play the game.
All of that is conjecture though.
And it also isn't a solid argument against any balance decisions derived from it. Balancing decisions must take into account the average match that occurs when an average player hits 'play'. Top-down balancing can have crippling impacts on the game outside of that narrow niche of players.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2816682#Comment_2816682
I never said DS or BT need nerfs. I'm saying no player in their right mind will play Killer if tunneling and camping were impossible
I just really dislike the attitude of 'just buff killers to not need camping/tunnelling'. if killers don't need those tactics, they absolutely need to be gutted.
They're also possibly bad balance points, because overall statistics show a kill rate above 50%. If non-tunnelling and non-camping is so unviable, that means that tunnelling and camping are pulling the numbers up, which likely means they're overpowered.
Overall, the game needs a balancing reset by crippling unfun strategies on both sides, like flashlight save bullying, BNPs, tunnelling and camping.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
Do you want all Killers to leave? If he's then add new anti-camping and anti-tunneling Perks. If not, then buff Killers to not need to use camping and tunneling
"What we should do is nerf your OP tactics while leaving mine untouched, that'll make things balanced"
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Survivor gameplay is as difficult as the killer makes it.
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@Crowman said:
Idk why people are so insistent on keeping the unhealthy mechanic of boons being infinitely relightable just because currently only coh is a problem.
The fact that boons can be reapplied is why weaker boons cannot be buffed and why coh will remain a problem until it's useless. You can't just give survivors teamwide perks with no real counterplay and call it fine.
Because if you make them not infinitely relightable, they'd need a compensatory buff to stay relevant as an option. Adding a risk of permanently losing the perk, on top of the time investment of setting it up just makes too much drawback. Blanket nerfing boons also seems like an odd approach when only CoH is the problem.
The rest of the boons don't have sufficient pay-off to warrant tacking on such a risk. And both Exponential and Shadow Step are mechanical, not numerical, so both of those would need functional buffs that would balance out that added risk.
Which is overall way more work than adjusting CoH, and risks frustrating killers even more.