Blueberry
Blueberry
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I'd say 2 but that's before the gates are powered. Anything after the gates are powered to me doesn't count. First guy that gets hooked is getting face camped because he has nothing else to do since the doors are powered. Is that a kill because of balance? No, it's not. You get a bunch of kills at end game because of NOED. Were those because of balance? No, it was not. They all swarm the hook suiciding at end game. Are those kills because of balance? No, it was not.
The point is there are many, many scenarios after the gates get powered that give the killer kills that have nothing to do with balance or skill. This makes counting all kills very irrelevant in terms of measuring game balance.
You'd probably get a more accurate measure by looking at pips instead of kills. This is because the pip system would be taking into account things like 1st hook NOED kills rather than say someone you three hooked, which would reward you a lot more points. The pip system clearly has lots of flaws, but it is still much better than basing the balance on kills with the current system we have.
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With BBQ, a few hours maybe.
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The more and more stats people keep posting from their games all show DS as the number 1 used perk by far. I think this is pretty telling.
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Infectious Fright, Pop, Corrupt Intervention, Discordance/Monitor.
Last spot is my flex.
Ignoring Ultra Rares/Very Rares I like her apples the most.
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@Dreamnomad said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1130684#Comment_1130684
I don't know what you are talking about. It is unequivocally a buff.
I don't think he's being literal. What he means is that the buff isn't enough to fix her problems or is it addressing her core issues.
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Well seeing how crazy strong Unbreakable is, Flip Flop would make more sense if it had the % increase to recovery speed instead of Unbreakable. This would give them both decent strengths. Currently it's all stacked on Unbreakable making Flip Flop pointless outside of meme builds.
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"This is the price tag of 2 full $60 game with money left over, excluding taxes."
That's extremely cheap. What two $60 games are lasting you for 4 years?!
People come into this game and look at the full price to immediately buy everything and act like it's overpriced. This is 4 years of content!
"But the math, at the most lowest level of grinding, says that I can farm 1000 iridescent shards per 10 hour. With 13 survivors and 11 killers, to unlock at 9000 shards each, I would need to play this game for over 2,160 hours."
Of course it would take a lot of playing. If it was easier they would make zero money because everyone would just get them for free. They have too make a profit.
"There are, by my math, 72 teachable perks. 3 per survivor/killers. Total to unlock all perks via the shrine of secrets, 144,000 iridescent shards. With how much I farm per 10 hours. I need to play this game for 1,440 hours to unlock all the teachable perks in the store. Teachable perks with free survivors/killers will with with just the grind alone."
You wouldn't need to be buying all the teaching and the killers/survivors. If you unlocked the killers/survivors you would be able to get the perks and not need to buy the teachables out right. It's one of the other, not both.
It is a lot of content to purchase at once or to play to unlock it all through play time, we aren't disagreeing there. However, when you look at the fact that the content is 4 years worth it, that is pretty reasonable. If you're new to the game you shouldn't immediately be needing every single thing unlocked anyway. This gives you a goal to work towards and not just having everything immediately handed to you. I'm honestly even surprised they allowed any Chapters to be purchased through game time period as that is quite overly generous.
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Poor balance between killer and survivor sides.
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It looks pretty lackluster and memey to me.
The majority of Hex perks aren't good enough to be Hex perks. Taking another one of your perk slots to make the other Hex's worth their slot sounds like a bad plan.
They should at least not make Retribution a Hex so it guarantees you will get the aura reveal for all your Hex perks and not get unlucky to have this one cleansed first.
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@thesuicidefox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1128985#Comment_1128985
"I am NOT saying the game hasn't changed a lot. I AM saying the games balance hasn't changed much."
Yes the balance has change a LOT. Hence why I said that playing killer today is way way better than playing killer in the past. It is EASIER aside from the Ruin change which was a pretty big hit to that.
Survivors have far less super safe options. Exhaustion perks were nerfed, particularly Balanced which changed things a lot. There are fewer pallets, and less of the remaining pallets are safe.
Your statement is just flat out incorrect. Sorry.
It is way better than in the past, but not much better than when the depip squad took place.
"Survivors have far less super safe options. Exhaustion perks were nerfed, particularly Balanced which changed things a lot. There are fewer pallets, and less of the remaining pallets are safe."
Survivors have a myriad of second chance opions and are extremely safe. Marths expirement success had nothing to do with Balanced Landing. The amount of pallets has also not been lowered.
"Your statement is just flat out incorrect. Sorry."
Your statements are flat out incorrect. You have a skewed perception of the games current balance.
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@thesuicidefox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1128960#Comment_1128960
All the things I listed are pretty MAJOR changes to the game. Things are very different now than they were before. That was my point. Nothing that changed was minor. You especially can't argue the Ruin change was minor. That's a big massive change to the game right there.
"My post is pointing out there hasn't been any significant enough changes to better balance the game for killers specifically."
Oh yes there totally have. Pallet vacuum for one. Increased speed on hook/kicking pallets or gens. Buffs to killer perks to make them more meta (eg. Pop). Killer is way easier now than it ever has been. The only major nerf to killers has been the Ruin change, but overall they have been buffed quite a lot. DS change did not at all make it stronger. DS was obscene before. You literally couldn't even pick up the obsession unless a hook was 5 feet away. And you could be hit by DS at any time by any other survivor without any tell that they have it, so long as they wiggle enough. You can easily play around the current DS. Just don't tunnel a survivor off the hook, or slug them.
Or, if you are Spirit/Nurse, just eat the DS and catch them in 10 seconds. I literally just had a game the other day where a David, fresh off his hook, decides to jump into a rear locker in the basement. I had slugged his rescuer, and I was going to slug him but since he did that I just ate the DS, and then caught him in a single phase. He was dead at that point. It's really REALLY not that hard to play around given the circumstances (because yes, there are times it may SEEM overpowered if the gates are open and the guy was just on the hook, but that is a very specific circumstance and at this point you lost the game anyway, so it really is moot).
I can't take anyone seriously that argues new DS is better than old DS. It's not. You can play around it. You can't really play around old DS. You could juggle survivors, that was literally it and that was an AWFUL option to counter it.
"All the things I listed are pretty MAJOR changes to the game. Things are very different now than they were before. That was my point. Nothing that changed was minor. You especially can't argue the Ruin change was minor. That's a big massive change to the game right there."
You are missing my point again. I did NOT argue the Ruin change was minor at all.
I am NOT saying the game hasn't changed a lot. I AM saying the games balance hasn't changed much.
Those are two very different things.
"Increased speed on hook/kicking pallets or gens."
Extremely minor.
"Buffs to killer perks to make them more meta (eg. Pop)."
You mean literally just Pop, not etc.
"The only major nerf to killers has been the Ruin change, but overall they have been buffed quite a lot."
List the buffs, there aren't a lot.
"DS change did not at all make it stronger."
Also not what I said, at all. What I said was that it is still very strong and one of the best perks in the game. Those are two very different things.
"You can easily play around the current DS. Just don't tunnel a survivor off the hook, or slug them."
Wrong. Any killer playing regularly at rank 1 with many hours will tell you the amount of times they are hit with DS when not tunneling at all and how abused the perk is.
"Or, if you are Spirit/Nurse, just eat the DS and catch them in 10 seconds. I literally just had a game the other day where a David, fresh off his hook, decides to jump into a rear locker in the basement. I had slugged his rescuer, and I was going to slug him but since he did that I just ate the DS, and then caught him in a single phase. He was dead at that point. It's really REALLY not that hard to play around given the circumstances"
Yeah...on Nurse or Spirit...we are talking the average game with every other killer that is not able to do that.
"I can't take anyone seriously that argues new DS is better than old DS. It's not."
Because that isn't what I said at all. You aren't reading closely at what I am typing before you jump to responding.
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I don't see any of these things to any significant degree in my games.
Have you tried playing killer?
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@thesuicidefox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1128900#Comment_1128900
Minor?
Deep Wounds became a thing. DS was completely reworked. Freddy and Doc were completely reworked. Nurse and Spirit were changed slightly. Nurse had her add-ons reworked. Pallet vacuum was removed. Ruin was reworked. We have a new meta featuring Pop, Corrupt, Nemesis/PWYF, Spirit Fury/Enduring. And next update we are getting a sabo rework and toolbox nerf.
Things are VERY different now than they were then. Depip squad experiment isn't even relevant anymore. The only thing it still kind of proves is that 4 man SWF is very powerful and that gen speeds are too fast, which you really don't even need an experiment to prove.
Deep Wounds is laughable and not worth mentioning. DS is still way too strong and it's rework has it still sitting as the best perk in the game. Nurse and Spirit nerfs aren't weakening the survivors so that's pretty irrelevant to my base point about survivors still being near just as strong. Pallet Vacuum was probably the closest thing to being significant but still hasn't stopped the amount of loops a survivor can make. Ruin change just like Nurse and Spirit is an improvement for the survivor side not for killers so also irrelevant to my base point. Corrupt didn't get improved, it was just the next best option after Ruin. Pop being more relevant isn't negating the games balance. Nemesis/PWYF isn't significant enough to change balance. Spirit Fury/Enduring was already around back then. Sabo rework coming is a buff to survivors, not nerf, so again, irrelevant to my base point. Toolbox nerf is nice but irrelevant in terms of the Marth experiment as they didn't use any items for the challenge.
I think you are missing the entire premise of my post. My post is not that the game hasn't had many changes, which is what you keep going towards. My post is pointing out there hasn't been any significant enough changes to better balance the game for killers specifically, that would make Marths experiment less able to be repeated again. The point is that survivors are still near just as strong.
His experiment is currently completely repeatable and entirely relevant. The nerfs to killers or killer perks you mentioned have even made it easier to repeat as those top tier killers were the ones that came closest to giving them any challenge.
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There's been some minor balance changes since then but it's still pretty accurate for current times. None of the changes since then were significant enough to invalidate them yet.
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@csandman1977 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1128755#Comment_1128755
True but letting survivors bleed out gets you nothing. Im fine with slugging but pick em up at some point
I would also say though that games where they never pick up is extremely rare. The only times I ever see the killer fully let everyone bleed out is if they were very toxic.
Not to mention for the killer to be able to even pull that off and have everyone slugged at the same time with 4 of you up, the team had to be playing really bad in most cases.
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On paper he has everything a good killer would want, yet people still have trouble with him because he doesn't pan out as well as he looks. I think a big factor of this is the amount of information he gives survivors. He gives so many global sound notifications for everything to where survivors almost always know where he's at and what he's doing. Also as if his huge size wasn't bad enough for loops, he's also extremely loud so you can predict his movements easier. This also defeats the entire point of Undetectable from portals.
He needs to give less information to survivors and quiet his footsteps with Undetectable. I'd also like it if the radius on detecting survivors near his portals was much larger. You either put it close enough for them to be in detect range, but now the portal is close enough you will never sneak up on someone with it, or you put it far enough for a sneak up, but now it's too far to detect. This function is counter intuitive. Not to mention they've received a sound queue before this to know you are traveling OR the loud footsteps.
There is just way too much counter play built into his kit at base instead of making survivors adapt the counter play themselves. It's handed to them.
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I think you're missing the point of it.
"Some people just enjoy ruining other people’s match enjoyment."
This is not why people use Knock Out. They use Knock Out because it avoids many of the very strong and popular perks built around hooks like DS, BT, We'll Make It etc. It also makes them not waste time with pick ups, walking and hooking. It also avoids flashlights.
There are many, many upsides to not hooking whether that be perks or time.
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"The only time I truly consider it a wasted pallet is if you eat a hit AND drop the pallet."
That's honestly it.
Even if the survivors run straight to every pallet and drop it immediately with zero looping at all, there are still more than enough pallets to finish all 5 gens before you run out.
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When you're in range of the perk to get value from it you could have simply seen or heard the crows yourself making it pointless.
For it to compete against the other tracking perks it should be map wide.
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The survivors being terrible and getting outplayed at every loop but still winning because gens are too fast and they have an endless supply of second chances.
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Wraith
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There's no legitimate reason for them to hide it other than to hide the problems. If their new system was good there wouldn't be any reason to hide it.
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It's still. We've had this bug for months.
There are other sound issue as well.
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This is kind of a flawed poll as you didn't include enough options. Where's the "she's okay but still needs buffs" option?
She isn't even close to broken and not only does she needs the PTB change, she needs more.
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@BBQnDemogorgon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1125293#Comment_1125293
If they show it we'd be able to see when it goes up and down. We would be able to see matches that improve the rating. It's obvious they want to hide this. I think us not knowing anything is kind of the point it removes those spam threads showing pictures of rank disparity without actually making rank matching strict increasing queue times.
No emphasis/knowledge/ladder climb just the gameplay
"I think us not knowing anything is kind of the point it removes those spam threads showing pictures of rank disparity without actually making rank matching strict increasing queue times."
In other words, hide the problem. The issue isn't those spam threads showing rank disparity problems, the issue is the rank disparity in matching itself.
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@BBQnDemogorgon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1125272#Comment_1125272
He gave the reason.
"Showing it puts an emphasis on it, and naturally people want to make that number as high as possible."
They don't want people to know and grind their mmr.
That isn't really an answer. Putting an emphasis on it and people wanting to raise the number isn't an issue. Who cares if they put an emphasis on it and want to raise it? Without a good reason this just seems like a way to cover up the problem.
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@Peanits said:
We do not plan to show people their exact skill ratings. The idea is to give people fairer matches, not to try to raise that number as high as you can. Showing it puts an emphasis on it, and naturally people want to make that number as high as possible. You'll know it's working if you're having relatively easy matches (win about half of them, lose about half of them).
The emblem system will remain as the way to gain pips. What will happen to emblems and the old ranking system later on has yet to be determined.
As for an estimate, it's already being tested behind the scenes, but it has not yet started to be used for matchmaking purposes. We'll be sure to let everyone know when that does happen.
What reason is there for hiding it?
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I agree on stacking all the second chance perks being an issue. They need to add some permanent debuff like Exhaustion that limits each survivor to only 1 second chance perk use a game. Only 1 per survivor would be much more reasonable to deal with instead of what we have now.
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@Tactless_Ninja said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1125034#Comment_1125034
Perks originally did that, and it was op.
Not quite. It was 20% faster, IE it recovered at 20% faster than the normal speed while running. I'm talking 20% of the normal speed, IE it would recover while running at 20% the normal speed.
Those wordings mean very different outcomes.
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I was thinking to keep its current effect, but add that your Exhaustion will now recover at 25% of normal speed while running.
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Notice how low rank all the survivors he's playing against are and all the bad plays they did? I did.
Any killer is going to look strong against low ranks or people who play badly.
He lacks snowball, map pressure and is quite loopable once the pallet is thrown.
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Everyone's been telling them this. There are many perks, Surge included they aren't good enough to warrant their cooldowns at all.
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@underlord99 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1123510#Comment_1123510
that's the window I just got , after chasing 3 survivors to it and through it I just gave up and stood in a corner hoping they would finish the game soon
Yeah it's extremely abusable. If you chase them through all that you will lose.
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People were talking about it for a long time and just gave up when it never got fixed. When that god window is facing the mid map you are in for a terrible time. That's a good spot for a breakable wall for sure.
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Running Kindred will do wonders for playing solo queue. Try it out.
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Would be a nice QoL
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It's not worth running anymore imo. It's just not good enough to warrant being a hex perk.
It's only doing anything if it lasts till later in the game but that is hardly ever happening. Even in the off chance it does last to late game, then why are you even running it over Devour Hope? If it actually lasts that long DH would have been better.
It just doesn't make any sense to run it.
We need help with the early game, not late game anyway.
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Because you're then wasting 2 perks to make 1 function how it's supposed to. That would be such a wasted perk slot.
Iron Maiden is pretty much a meme perk at best.
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Keep this:
"You open lockers 50% faster."
Replace the other effect with, Anytime a survivor leaves a locker the killer gains Undetectable for 45 seconds. No cooldown.
This allows the perk to continuously be useful as the survivors will keep using lockers during the game since they will be unaware of the perks existence unless the see the killer open a locker faster. One of the issues with the current version is that as soon as they see the Exposed they are never using a locker again.
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@Rey_512 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1122770#Comment_1122770
This. Even if some perks have cooldowns, they shouldn’t be that excessive...
cough Thrilling, 60 SECONDS cough
Yeah Thrilling is the most blaring one that either shouldn't exist at all or be a massively lower cooldown but there are many more as well.
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I wouldn't really say cooldowns on killer powers, but there is an excessive and unnecessary level of cooldowns on many perks.
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They'll never implement this because of potential dodging.
However, I think they should at least put it in the after match info so you can know what you were up against.
Not ever showing it kinda just feels like they're hiding the games problems.
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They won't give it Mangled for the same reason the Thanata buff didn't go through. They don't want a perk countering its own counter. IE Mangled would make it harder to heal and healing is the counter to Blood Echo.
This said, the perk is quite bad and needs some changes I agree. I honestly think the cooldown needs to be removed and hooking another person before the timer ends should refresh it. Second, replace Hemorrhage with literally anything else. Honestly Hemorrhage as a status effect needs a rework itself to do more. Replace the Hemorrhage with Blindness maybe as it's the second most terrible status effect.
Those changes would probably make it a strong but reasonable perk.
EDIT: Bake the Blood Hound effect into the Hemorrhage status effect and now it would be decent at least.
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@ClickyClicky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1120904#Comment_1120904
And still no fix in sight nor is there even an acknowledgement of these bugs
They actually did acknowledge the issue generally speaking in their recent stream and that they are working on something to improve it. No details though.
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@Peanits said:
Nope, it goes perfectly straight. There's no curve to it.
What did ya'll think about ScottJunds video on the shot being a little off? Is it actually or was that related to server ping?
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It's effecting a lot of things. Plague vomits on people, they cough as if infected, but aren't infected. Myers stalks to 99% and then it jumps back down to 96%. Huntress hatchets are probably the most notable in hitting people when they look like they are far off.
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This doesn't match my solo queue experience at all.
I think a lot of people stretch the definition of "camping" and "tunneling" when it really isn't.
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I don't think most people believe NOED is unbalanced, it is balanced. What most people think is that it is unhealthy design for the game, of which I would agree. Those are very different things.
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I'd recommend Kindred in solo play. It helps organize the potatoes and makes it feel less like you're trying to herd cats.
You're seeing more potatoes because of the changed rank reset system and how it's currently too easy to pip as survivor. This means lots of survivors at ranks that they have no business being in.