Abbzy
Abbzy
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@Leon_van_Straken said:
This mode would not work as well as you think
Since many Survivors have complete a** perks while others are pretty decent
So you would see only the same Killer vs the same 4 Survivors all the time.
And I think this mode would be dead pretty fast
It would be tunnel out or get rushed mode most likely and as you said many have adepts done so no need for them to play it its not that fun doing adept more like challange but many dont wanna play unfun challange.
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@UnicornMedal said:
In my experience, it has to be a case by case basis. Often times you're spending more time running away and leaving a trail for the Killer to follow and getting no additional healing out of the way.
If the killer comes to hook and did it multiple times per match or is near and has no chase or has great mobility and can be there in few seconds because he has no one in chase and under preasure then its better to go few meters away unless you have perks that make you heal in few seconds.
Mayn people stay always under the hook and then have pikachu face wehn killer comes back but its not so hard to guess it when he will most likely come back. Like agains knight dont stay under hook because if he is close he will send assasin there and you arent moving so chances he will heit you pr second survivor are high.
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@EntityNea said:
Not overpowered or anything, but more tedious to go against.
It just gets boring that they give almost every killer a projectile/ranged attack nowadays.Just worse clowns chase like power with teleport and dream pallets that arent that great either only on few maps, overall solid killer.
The original was total joke unless you ran slowdown addons and back then forever freddy was a thing and second rework made him strong as hell.
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@Your_Dad_Playing_DbD said:
If it’s this prevalent, can you post a couple videos showing us what you’re talking about? I’ve seen plenty of cheaters but it’s not 9 out of 10 games.
He has no proof only words but due to my personal experience I believe him he can meet few cheaters per day.
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@cogsturning said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4077541#Comment_4077541
You're talking about false narratives while defending someone who's saying things that are factually untrue. But I guess that's fine as long as it's the side you prefer.
Same can be said for you here.
Nerfed healing builds? Yeah just from 3,xx something seconds to like plus few more like to 5 thats like best in speed healing build what you got next. If you dont believe and downt want to count it just find mintskulls vid where he covers 9.6 patch and he has it thee for ya as one of many exsamples of why dimishing returns arent bad as doomsday people claim.
Survivors learning counterplay? Oh please its truth but many new killers lately are just copy of powers the already existing killers or share many simularities with already exixting ones so its not so dam hard, whats harder is to know counter to killers that anobody almost plays like twins,artist,hag to these know counter is harder then new killer who is in top 5 picked like for 3+ moths but consistency sounds new to you if you cant believe it.
Gen speed was lately cooked by perk that gives you unremoveable progress while all that it takes is for killer to play how he is supposed to hook survivors, its been nerfed but you cant dennied this effected gen speed not to mention the ruin or COB buffs arent so good because these perks are just shadow of its self compare to their peak versions from past. Another thing is game is very old so meta of what to do to win fast and effective is already knew to all because vast majority of this game player base are just veteran players and newer ones are very few in % from total player base so this means people play more effective then 4 years ago etc.
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@Foodnt said:
I found a Youtuber who claims that the movement speed of killers are slower than they supposed to be.
do you feel the same?
i must say sometimes it feels of not catching up without them having ms perks or even missing your lunge when you think you are in range (this part is mostly mostly skill issue i guess)
i have 3 k hours in this game ( - 1k waiting for lobbies) but im still sometimes uncertain if this is subtle cheating or something else.
just wanna hear your opinion on this topic
Idk slight speeding is almost impossible to see and if survivor hugs well he can be way faster especialy now where on every god dam loop are some invisiable edges of texture hitbox that get you stuck as killer because of your wider character model its not as smooth as it was back then hugging loops as killer.
The we have things like bugs almost none ever knew like the first (netflix vecna) having shorter lunge on m1 then any other killer, this was fixed but things like this are super hard to spot.
Personaly I dont seem to see survivors faster but I bump more into invisiable hitbox of loop textures as killer way more then few years ago which is making me loose momentum and I not alone getting it I bet I heard few sttreamers said this too.
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I got it in 2v8 where I grabed people kinda through objects even when I was meant to colide with that object like chests for exsample and I got grabed as survivor too many times or even hit way behind the window which is sus because weskers hitbox on vaulting survivors is very survivor friendly and way more wont give you hit even when you dashed into survivor who just vaulted infront of your face.
Seems like they kinda gave him ghouls hitbox but thing is ghoul cant down you but wesker can and thats huge difference.
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@XDgamer018 said:
Yeah i wouldve loved to know why a survivor got endurance from x perk.. meanwhile the survivot knows if dissolutions is active...
Its not making sence that meh perk gets revealed way before its effect its even used but endurence stays hidden and only as killer you will know there was some if you damage survivor who is effected by it, its very unlogical.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4077366#Comment_4077366
No, the discussion was about 'aggressive use' of DS. What you're describing is you choosing to tunnel someone who has recently been unhooked, when any other target is free from DS.
It's you, as killer, that's making DS work here, because the perk itself is not usable. That survivor in the locker isn't wasting your time, -you- are.
Gaslighting again? Who said survivor with ds in locker is wasting my time as killer its logical, it was you who said survivor with locker is doing nothing for the team even when he has ds, short memory you have lately.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4077335#Comment_4077335
Except why is the killer focused on someone with active DS, again?
Still running from the topic arent we. The main why this happened is that you claimed that survivor in locker with ds does nothing for the team and I against that so ds now?
How do you know survivor who jumps into locker infront of you has ds?
You can guess it but theres not guarantee he has it, it can be bait and then when someone jumps into locker ifront the killer after unhook its either bait or most likely ds but thats on killer to decide if he commits or not because ds is not a wall its a choice of wanting someothing easy but risking having it hard because of perk.
I think we done here its clear you are kicking all around you with anything to provew some point but main thing was totaly something different.
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@supersonic853 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4077338#Comment_4077338
Looks at pyramid head,billy,freddy,trickster Right...
But how long it took before they got them done and right, freddy 2 reworks, billy 2 reworks and many addon changes, trickster two reworks and addon changes and pyramidhead full addon pass but the time it took them to do it.
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@Langweilig said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4077315#Comment_4077315
I still don‘t get the reason why they don‘t make the most used addons of weaker killers fully basekit when they are as weak as they are. Instead they always make the addon partially basekit and repeat the same process 20 times, only to make the same addon more and more pointless to run.
Because they dont like to create new addons or make new effects, same with killer power reworks I get it takes time and doesnt produce money but its something that has to be done unless they want people to play few killers or only use two addons on each killer because they are the best in every category.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4077235#Comment_4077235
So your problem here is that if killers massively misplay, they lose?
Again changing the topic arent we. Who said its bad that killer/survvior looses when they missplay, you kinda manipulating the topic but all I said its when survivor bothers killer he is doing something you claim otherwise which is bs becuase if you were right then being in long chase with killer is pointless but in reality it isnt. So theres where you version crumbles.
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076801#Comment_4076801
I do know what happened. The people who play strategically (most of us) are the ones who end up losing out because of basekit changes caused by people like yourself. If you think the devs are more likely to spend time, resources, and money overhauling every perk you object to, instead of just implementing a mechanic they've already developed, coded, and almost implemented just months ago, then i have a bridge to sell you.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076906#Comment_4076906
What feelings? What are you even on about?
Feelings? You claim to play somehow because of others feel bad if you dont. So what you missing here?
Its anyones decision how he will play just dont yap about it, slugging is part of the killers playstyle that isnt banned and there are perks to make builds around it so its legit strat even if you like it or not.
If slugging was not intended it would end up as close hook camping or facecamping. Do you see any perks for facecamping or close camping? I only see one very old thats garbage since anticamp meter is thing its called insidious, but I see multiple perks that are make for slugging aka getting more downs as killer at one time.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076907#Comment_4076907
If survivor in locker has killers attention he is doing something for the team
Right, what do you call it when the killer's attention is focused on a freshly unhooked target, again?
Doesnt matter whats it called, you have still some agency to effect the game the part its not nice for someone doesnt change the fact that survivor who has killers attention is still making huge gain for other 3. He may die but his play can change the game all you want to get here is the give up movement but thats on everyone to decide how will to face this.
You lack arguments to change the fact that having killer attention and taking his time is part of survivor gameplqy and huge part for getting something done by others. Tunneling or not few long chases can compleatly change the outcome of the game you just mainly focus on emotion part but this is pointless in grant scheme of things, thats why good teams even run one guy who has whole build to get killers attention and perks to deal with him like ds, deah hard, shoulder the burden and its very effective thats why even comp teams use this sacrifice strat.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076708#Comment_4076708
You can either go for grab or leave it but still doesnt change the fact its loose scenario
Except for the part where a survivor holing up in a locker isn't doing anything for their team. You're gaining, they're losing. You win by not pressing spacebar.
You're not entitled to negate DS just because you feel you should be allowed to tunnel.
If survivor in locker has killers attention he is doing something for the team same if stealth based survivor is taking killers time by hiding.
Taking killers time is part of the teamplay and main jobs survivor can do which is something you miss here.
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076713#Comment_4076713
I'm not sure what your point is. Play any way you like, just don't be surprised when your little temper tantrum winds up, yet again, limiting the game for everyone else.
And your seems to limit yourself because of others feelings, this isnt adult playing with kids in kindergarten situation but online game.
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Thats his main power un 2v8 he just harrasses survivors with zombies and has poor chase ability there which levls up slow, his 3 needs to hit survivor to take him down is slow as hell in 2v8 he is just one of weakest killers now still after buff.
Only thing that makes him stronger at moment is the fact that wesker is killswitched because nemi doesnt work with him there.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076708#Comment_4076708
You can either go for grab or leave it but still doesnt change the fact its loose scenario
Except for the part where a survivor holing up in a locker isn't doing anything for their team. You're gaining, they're losing. You win by not pressing spacebar.
You're not entitled to negate DS just because you feel you should be allowed to tunnel.
He is still staling the killer and forcing him into making big choice where it either slows him for few seconds but he leaves with nothing or takes his time in tens of seconds if you see this as nothing then its your blindness but I see every second took from killer by even one survivor gsin for team because when these seconds are added up they create huge sum which benefits team especialy here where he gets either slowed less but gsins absolutely nothing or proceeds to continue preasuring that survivor but risk tens of seconds wasted.
I Im allowed to tunnel because its intended play in this game and if you dont think so its like claiming bodyblocking as survivor is unintended, if it was unintended it would be dealt with as with to close camping or facecamping but sadly miss this. Your feeling are one thing but facts are the ones that are more important.
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076610#Comment_4076610
Because hooking is part of the intended play. And we know from past experience (ie 3 gen meta, going next, etc) that when too much of the playerbase deviates from the intended path of play, the devs address it via base-kit mechanics. For 3 gen, we got the 8 regression limit. For going next, we got 4% removed. People think they're taking a stand and making a point, but history has shown us all you lot are going to do is cause an anti-slug mechanic to be implemented.
Since I'm seeing alot of the same words coming from multiple people, I'm going to assume there's content creators behind this (as per usual) and I think this is one of those instances where people need to have some common sense.
When intended play becomes more punished and less rewarding then alternative play do you think everyone is obligeted to play it? (The intended way)
If you want slu, slug its intended strategy and slugging whole team is high risk play that doesnt need to work especsly when survivors are good or run some antislug perks.
The negative of slugging instead hooking is less points compare to dealing with less top meta survivor perks and having more chase oriented play that feels more active andless areal control based/ procy camp style of play. Slugging isnt banned as face camping so ots legit strategy with its cons and pros, in these days same as hooking.
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@cogsturning said:
The value of the tonics for killer is more to keep them out of survivors' hands. Taking a green one off the board is big.
Taking green out as killer makes difference in getting kill or not many times but even then its better to eat gen speed buff for survivors with kill or nearly dead survivof then leave green tonic.
The imortance of destroying green tonic as killer is high, by not doing so is same as picking up survivor infront of flashlight user knowlingly without lightborn :)
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076636#Comment_4076636
I want you to do me a favour and spend at least 5 seconds thinking of what a killer could possibly do against a survivor with DS, sitting in a locker.
You can either go for grab or leave it but still doesnt change the fact its loose scenario where you give either free escape if you leave or you give survivor 20 meters head start from ds stun.
Your argument doesnt change the fact ds can be weponised and used agressively and theres another great perk that makes it even more usesbld in team play and its called shoulder the burden.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076594#Comment_4076594
DS can't be used aggressively since you cannot force a killer to pick up.
Ehm, lockers still do exist.
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@Langweilig said:
In 2vs8 she is fine, but in 1vs4 she needs some nerfs. My biggest problem with her right now is her pay to win skin from the battlepass
Thing is if they nerf her in 1v4 these nerfs will carry to 2v8 as did with blight who is still viable due to his speed and map mobility but classic chase is pain because theres quadrillion of pallets and class that cna build them back from few woode scraps and air which isnt fun, but he is still viable there atleast.
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@Rick1998 said:
doctors need alot more then a shack delay buff . Really bad killer with bad chase and no mobility
He has good info with big shock, meh antiloop when compared to freddy and realy terrible slowdown probably one of worst like madness tier 3 slows survivors less then mending on legion and has not so good effects because skillchecks after 50-100 hours will hit even trained ape tbh and them apearing on screen randomly only makes them hard when its hard skillchect like from merciless storm, overcharge oroppression but normal ones are nothing.
He would need more help in buffing his antiloop and slowdown with his madness tier 3 so theres more hallucinations like of pallets that are broken etc.
But he is annoying to face for survivors and isnt popular so no money grab so I dont think he will get more love from devs who are more playing survivors.
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@Royval said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076220#Comment_4076220
I think her main problem is she doesn’t have counterplay. For years it’s just double back and lose LOS is so nonengaging for dbd standards.
In 2v8 theres more conterplay then in 1v4 to her like theres so many los blockers, sprintburst on command or map being more huge compare to 1v4 and all these things have effect on her.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076083#Comment_4076083
I see your logic but you comparing car vs bike here (in terms of exsample both speed up your travel speed from just walking or running), thats how accurate your exsample is here.Except if someone said 'no one should ever travel faster than their own feet can carry them' as an argument to ban cars, and someone asked 'what about bikes?' and the first person said bikes were fine, but they kept using the original reasoning, its hypocritical.
The game is filled with examples of one side getting stronger when the other side does well. Despite this getting called out not just in this thread, but many threads, people opposed to old Fast Track continue to use it as their argument ( @TamaraLatte is an exception in being consistent on both sides).
People have tried to shortcut the more difficult argument of perk strength with this absolute principle that they are selectively applying. Unfortunately, as @cogsturning points out, BHVR has pursued the same line of reasoning.
Just for the record - I'm fine with the idea that Fast Track might have been too strong and needed changed, I think the permanent nature of the gen progress was mostly a non-issue, and I think perks that activate upon the other side advancing their objective are not just fine, I think many of them are healthier for the game than the alternative of win more perks.
So its stupid to use this
I see your logic but you comparing car vs bike here (in terms of exsample both speed up your travel speed from just walking or running), thats how accurate your exsample is here.when comparing prenerfed fast track to coup degre or mostly fire up, which are arguments people make here a lot and it has only one thing simular to fast track and thats how the perks power is obtained but in terms of power crep these two are nowhere near.
Sorry but pernament gen progress is very strong thing that isnt wise to just throw around like devs did on prenerfed fast track especialy when BNP is 10% or sables perk does same, on all gens but same % number but 18% like thats different especialy when its so easily aquireable and every survivor can run this.
Other part is many acknowledge (even when some people said this since 2020 I believe or 22 trutalent said this before he was kicked from fog whisperer program) over time that spreading hooks is way they want to killers objective go instead of tunneling or slugging but this perk is gutting this playstyle and pushes others into play like tunneling isnt so friendly nowdays because theres lot of perks to make it way harder so builds like this came into light
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuhrKMdGF68&t=625sso deffinitely good perk desing indeed. One thing is requirement for unlocking perks effect, other is the power of its effect (the main one obviously) so even when some perks are quite passively unlocked like fire up their power is mid at best and they arent problematic but gen speed is problematic thing by itself which anyone whos been around for few years should know that and messing with it isnt good idea, same with gen regression but that has been nerfed quite lot past years and mayn strong perks that did damage to gens from total base progress meaning 15% form 90 seconds were switched to current gen progress.
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@AGM said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076069#Comment_4076069
I suspect that the only people still following this thread are irrationally angry at the Fast Track nerf and are downvoting completely rational takes. If there's no good faith discussion to be had then why is this thread even open?
It look more so, its like og ruin or imaginig pain res that gives each gen not only regression but makes it base time longer by these 15% thats what was fast track for killer only thing is pain res requires down and fresh hook to get value from so its not tunnelers perk and then theres rng factor of dealing with having scourge hooks in one corner or bs like that so even if pain res was same as today and just add base time to gens it would require more effort from killer to use and it would be more base game healhty then prenerfed fast track which game survivor stacks just for being hooked and only skill there was hitting skill check requirement and that was it.
If some simulary broken killer perk existed I wouldnt be for it to exist in that form like eruption from gen kick meta that made survivor unable to do gens and regress them so in total they had like 40 seconds of regression time and this was stupid to deal with just from single perk not to mention srong nature of other simular perks at that time.
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@BorisDDAA said:
I guess Bubba's getting the same treatment with engravings. I'd be surprised if not. So basically the buff in the end doesn't matter at all when using the addons.
It wasnt in patch notes but i think its matter of time tbh.
Still better to have stronger basekit then addon dependent or must run this addon or it sucks but then numbers should be same as before at worst then weaker.
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@TicTac said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075979#Comment_4075979
Did it really? I play since 2018 and it was always a wild mix of matchmaking. There were always a lot of free wins, where playing serious felt unfair.
Its still the same. Against good survivor you need to play seriously to have a chance. It was always rare bc of matchmaking.
Back then matchmaking wasnt so hard like its now, no mmr so you could face pro nurse who 4k you all on 4-5 gens or you got nurse that couldnt use blinks and chased you with just holding W which was easy win.
I would say killers got some basekit buffs in 6.1. but survivors got many buffs too in forms of more info on their teammates like hud info or now new tab info or antitunnel got buffed and anticamp features, matchmaking is more "tight" compare to before so matches feel harder naturaly. Pallet density because nowdays dead zones almost dont exist whichwasnt a thing before etc.
Back then both sides had broken stuf but matchmaking being more friendly and survivors not having basekit features like anticamp meter or anhook protection made killer more deadly like look at hag back then you could trap under hook and when the guy got saved and trap wasnt trigered or burned and triggered you could tp and instantly whack down the unhooked guy and hook him again but this is impossible nowdays.
I have harder times nowdays more when I compare back then when I played mostly killer in what its considered hardest time to be killer like 2017-2020, gens were easier to do back then but nowdays they are done faster then back then when I compare it.
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@Anniehere said:
Always take all the information you have and report them. One less troll is better.
I havent seen anyone for this nerfed and the amonth of evindence you need for devs to take some action even give him few minutes/hours/days ban isnt worth the time.
Unfortunately trols like this exist.
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@TamaraLatte said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076083#Comment_4076083
My point originally was that neither side should be punished for doing their objectives. Fast Track and Fire Up both punish (or published in the case of Fast Track) the other side just for doing their objectives. I'm not and never have been a Fast Track user, so I don't care about the perk. It's the activation of the perk and the double standards that bother me.
I shouldnt problem is that this narrative is there since 2016 and then it depends on what this perk does like fire up is mid perk at best and totaly dimished by dimishing returns feature, coup degre is lost pretty fast because killer must lunge almost every time to get hit with m1 and even when it gives higher chance to give killer hit it still isnt lasting long and 10 lunges thats like 5 downs if we exclude bodyblocks and endurence effects from perks so 5 downs isnt going to win the game for the killer especialy when he is getting 2 tokes per gen which is through all game.
Fast track interacts with gen speed which is problem since beginning in this game and on top its totaly inacive passive perk that gives gen progress but unremoveable one like BNP so you get more powerfull effect from single perk then from iri addon and if you combine these two then its lot of saved time for sngle gen pernamently. So its execution is way more problematic than any exsample you threw here.
I get your logic but perks like this came since 2016 and theres lot of them in the game today, perks that reward you passively without doing anything or loosing or doing just your objective, what more matters is what they do because at this point I dont think they all will change.
Fast track is (prenerfed) to killer like perk that regresses gen and adds time to it so its base time is more than 90 seconds after it was hit by this perk, or perk that reduces survivors time on hook by every down killer gets something stupid like this shouldnt exist for both sides things like prenerfed fast track or og ruin, og noed.
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@TamaraLatte said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076068#Comment_4076068
Fast Track speeds up a survivor's objective, and Fire Up speeds up a killer's objective. What exactly are you missing?
So fire up speeds up what?
- Increases the Action speeds for the following interactions by a stack-able 4/5/6 % per Token, up to a maximum of 20/25/30 %:
- Picking up and dropping Survivors.
- breaking pallets and walls and vaulting
- kicking gen
Survivors objective is to survive and do gens, killers is win chases and hook or kill survivors.
This perk works more in late game and its not winning chases that fast as fast track reduces gen time, fire up isnt even top tier perk which cant be said about fast track before its last nerf.
I see your logic but you comparing car vs bike here (in terms of exsample both speed up your travel speed from just walking or running), thats how accurate your exsample is here.
- Increases the Action speeds for the following interactions by a stack-able 4/5/6 % per Token, up to a maximum of 20/25/30 %:
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/466800/bhvr-nerfed-the-doctor-to-compensate
That's odd. Doesn't make any sense. Why would they do that? (Not denying your statement..I am genuinely confused.)
They did same to ghostface even when it was 2 seconds of almighty buff, that will help this d-tier killer deffinitely.
They always nerf addons that are conected to that power in terms of buff even when its sometimes not that needed classic thing they do since 2017.
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@MichaelTheBlimpedFox said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4076025#Comment_4076025
Yes I do remember the overheat mechanic. It was implemented to prevent using constant power spamming. Though it was clearly unpopular, but I understand why they did it. His chainsaw back then and today is by definition power creep being able to use it non stop with no downside. That’s a problem… imagine having Oni’s demon dash all game long. Thats pretty much what Billy is essentially. Just maybe slightly harder to use.
It was met by high praise because most killer players nowadays only find things “enjoyable” if they’re clearly very strong and if it’s not their excuse it’s “boring”
I’m not asking for the overheat mechanic to come back, but chainsaw charges to tame the amount of times people just spam chainsaw everyone microsecond.Oh yes cooldowns
- Walking during the Chainsaw's Cool-down: 1.84 m/s
Chainsaw Cool-downs:
- Hitting Survivors: 2.7 seconds
- Hitting obstacles: 2.5 seconds
- Hitting nothing (miss): 2.7 seconds
- Breaking Breakable Walls/Pallets: 1 second
So he makes 4,6 meters distance in 2,5 seconds or almost 5 meters in 2,7 seconds now give it to survivors base running speed which is 4m/s and thats 10 meters of distance when he bumps into something and 10,8 meters when he swings into nothing meaning he just cancels his chainsaw.
Thats is huge distance indeed.
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@random1543 said:
Billy is fine. This is coming from a surviour main. He is fun to play as is my favroute killer to verse.
Excatly he is what "S-tier " should look like (meaning s-tiere here because if he would be strongest killer in the game ofcourse he would be in s-tier even if he would not be broken as nurse or prenerfed blight was). Billy requires lot of mechanicl skill and its not easy to curve, he has build in counter and its just hold crouch button, he must be very direct with his saw hit compare to many other killers. he is one of most map effected higher tier killers where his mobility is map dependent and windows counter him simulary as leather face but his speed is what makes him be able to play them, still bamboozle is needed perk lot of times.
There arent many addons used on him like lopro got nerfed and isnt worth it so his mains only use iri carborator for speed (same as bestmarks in its effect for his power which bubba mains use speed > charge time) plus boots for his turn rate not being so bad.
Billy is what high tier killer should look like be strong but hard at the same time and fair you cant just say he isnt fair because the skill player needs to be good with him and landing shot isnt small is one of highest in this game and he has plenty of counters.
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@TamaraLatte said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075974#Comment_4075974
How do we counter fire up or coup?
I get your worry about coup because unless killer lunges super far and you arent sharp enough to see it nothing will tell you, but fire up? seriously that perk does very little unless its stacked with other chase perks and even then its not huge deal right now with dimishing return.
Fire up is strong on one gen left and at this point there isnt much time killer will use it and get value from it compare to brutal strenght or bamboozle.
@TamaraLatte said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075963#Comment_4075963
For me it's not what the perks do, but the double standard. Neither side should be punished for doing their objectives.
There are far more bigger double standarts but something that pernamently removes time needed for survivors to do gen and its automiticaly given to them when killer player "nice" or how he should is more worse then deadlock or noed at this point.
For comparison we talk about effects like of the first ruin where even when you hit good skillchect you get 5% regression and when you hit great you got 0% of gen progress but even then this broken effect had two counters firts was gen taping and second was ability to remove the totem but fast track you cant counter it much only way is hardcore tunneling which is nowdays way harder then before do to many existing perks for antitunnel protection and ds being free so almost every survivor runs some perk to counter tunneling nowdays and as killer you have no other way to counter it no counter build in the perk like ruin has or noed have (even shows you totem aura nowdays up to 24 meters so unless killer hooks near that totem its very possible to break it and counter it). Thats fast track problem unless you play as turnament hungry competive jack and bite through untitunnel protection you have no other counter to it, you play normaly you are against yourself and I had last weeks many teams where fast track with BNP was used and it was very noticiable especialy on few gens left.
I dont denny deadlock isnt well desinged compare to grim or deadmans switch which reward killer for doinmg objective, but deadlocks effects arent so destructive for survivor side compare to 4 survviors running fast track, sometimes deadlock is even against killer because he doesnt effect when gen gets done that much, compare to old eruption if you remember.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075644#Comment_4075644
And Deadlock permanently slows down Gen Progression by doing nothing. And this is fine?
I guess someone who is proud of having chases which "only" last 90 seconds should know that…
@Topic:
We even have Basekit mechanics which reward failing. Bloodlust. Just get run around an unsafe Pallet, even if you miss a few times, after you reach Bloodlust 2 you will be guaranteed to get a Hit.
Deadlock is 4x25 seconds, fast track is at max 18% of gen progress pernamently which is 16,2 seconds x4 which is less but its pernament progress meaning nothing will put it back and only thing that did that before and needed nerfs was BNP which gives now 10% so fast track on all survivors gives then all togeather 64,8 seconds of pernament progress on gen thats more then 66% of one gen and combining it with BNP each is 25,2 x4 which is 100,8 seconds pernament progress which is like 1 minute and 40,8 seconds so thats not small time and its pernament.
Bare in mind that deadlock doesnt effect all survivors just the ones that are on most progressed gen right after other gen was done but this pernament progress effects killer a lot especialy the more he hooks the worse his fates gets because of single perks.
I had teams like this where fast track and toolbox with BNP of each survivor was common thing and these games were one of fastest in my life around 5-6 minutes even when I played good without huge mistakes so it changes the game alot only cheaters made my games faster.
Not to mention deadlock bloks that gen but other perks cant damage it.
For record pain res causes 20% damage 4 times per unique hook, its 18 seconds of gen damage per stack and it makes the killer go out of his way and spread hooks so even when its very strong perk it actualy pushes killer to play more nice and healty to earn this perks rewards. But fast track gave survivors passively stacks when killer hooked someone which is against this healthy playstyle of spreading hooks everyone wants to have instead of tunnel vision and on top survivor doesnt get 18% of gen progress but 18% of pernament gen progress so its makes that gen take less time to do even when its regressed to 0%.
Healthy perk indeed.
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@TheTom20 said:
A lot of people who don't play killer normally only play killer in 2v8
The wait while you play is good feature and if you dont use it theres huge chance you loose server connection on 20-30 minutes killers queue time which is devasteting for mental health so no wonder when people play both roles.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075926#Comment_4075926
"One shot oni is earned" Except it literally isn't, if the other killer uses their power to injure survivors Oni benefits, then it's all a snowball from there. Again people talk about killers like its 1v4. Any smart oni would go with their co killer and get their blood that way.
Oni cant cage 3 people in one use if the other one isnt teaming or they were super close when he downed them remember slugging in 2v8 isnt best thing to do and its easy to get out of as survivors.
Billys oneshot is earned he is same as in 1v4 only diference is hes go boots addon and the one that reduces bump penalty stun but he is actualy weaker then 1v4 because there he has his carborator engravings that gave him speed.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075622#Comment_4075622
The problem is more that Legions Power just does not work with 2v8. Legions Power is built around getting fast injuries, but having to be a M1-Killer to get downs (aside from the rare occasions where you get 5 Frenzy Hits). But if you add another Killer who then gets to down the Survivors who got injured by an easy first Hit does not work.
They honestly should have never added Legion in 2v8 in the first place.
Thats no surprise for me when you add killer that can spread fast injures in chains better than any other killer especialy when multiple survivors are cluttered in one location and then that same killer can be combined with other killer who has very strong power like nurse,blight or easier first hit requirement in 2v8 like wraith.
Everyone wet when 2v8 wernt out and people had duos on their minds like huntress+slinger or bubba+billy or mayers+ghostface but I always wondered what about legion+oni or legion+nurse/blight I thought this combo would be nuts and him being added due to resident evel skin prooved it I just hope they dont add plague at this point.
Fact is legion was so popular that at time killers like nemesis or ghostface were playable much more then today because he took one hit and they could do the rest alone but now its hell especialy with sprint on command so only viable killers are the ones with power to catch up to the survivors fast and which have funnily some antiloop which all of them that can catch up here have.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075913#Comment_4075913
"tank hits" Yeah that's swell but when you have a killer in a one shot power thats easy to land constantly, yeah it's kind of a problem can't really use that tanking hits idea there.
She doesn't get crapped on by sprint burst, sure if you are trying to throw during the sprint, but she makes up for her slow speed with range, which there is a lot of open maps in 2v8, I love zoning with my hatchets while the co-killer capitalises on it. Try working with the other killer more, I'd rather have fun chases than play gen defence all game, it's not what she is good at she is too slow for map control.
It has nothing to do with not healing, survivors IN CHASE drop blood and there are 2 killers, so twice the amount of blood than 1v4, then there is the blood from downs/hooks he gets too. It's not that simple, again people forget how different 2v8 is.One shot on oni is earnerd and doesnt last forever while slugging isnt that great on him there either, if he playes down-pick up then he will have small cage numbers and its not hard to focus on gens I have beat oni+ other strong killer so many times even one game oni plus nurse we began bad and got first gen on 6 cages and still beat then to 4 survivors out almost 5 but one guy got entitled and didnt kept on exit line so its not so hard as survivors this mode is for them, billy isnt much played how hard he is and even with oneshot he isnt that op.
She is beaten by distance and on maps wheres lot of high clutter and objects sprint makes survivors super safe against her, she is one of most easy to loop alone killers in whole 2v8 tbh even ghostface can be harder to loop due to 5% haste on higher loops where revealing him isnt easy or possible. Huntress is super vanila in 2v8 she has just bit speed and more axes but on so big maps with lot of clutter and high wall loops where her axes doesnt do much she is left behind a lot, I had more success with prebuffed slinger or pyramidhead than her and I wasnt even that bad so she realy isnt that great people forget she fell off a lot since 2018 and for me kille with no mobility isnt worth of 20+ minutes queue time unless you are maniac who mains that killer and goes through this time waste and pain then latter in match because of the love to that killer.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075894#Comment_4075894
I don't play with Sprint Burst, I literally say earlier I understand why people don't like it
And people can have fun as killer, I play Huntress a lot in 2v8 or Dracula and have no issue. No on in their right mind would play Solo Trapper in 2v8, which I see too many streamers do then complain.I have grat games as medic and Im alone not with friend which is main part how to medic to tank hits with your buddy and use both power to heal instantly and take another two bodyblocks unless killer can hit multiple survivors or instadown but even then this isnt happening often.
I dont play huntress the amonth of crap on she takes in this mode with sprintburst its no worth it especialy when there are often tall loops that are rounded and she can be looped there alone for very long time, drac is fun I get it but still my best is with nurse or billy.
I dont have problem with oni he is strong if he gets power often due to survivors no healing and giving him hits but gens are flying here so its just matter of time and teams effort before gates are on and oni cant do much, even when looping him I dont have problems with him.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
Almost like you should have done something about them, lmao
Like how is it so hard to listen to your survivor playerbase atm, Fast track gets nerfed which is whatever at this point but just ignoring Ghoul so you can shovel more dash slop chapters. I can't wait.
Sorry for the emotional post but I was really looking forward to playing against the buffed killers.Sorry for the emotional post but I was really looking forward to playing against the buffed killers.Thats main part of this post plus your disappointment devs dont listen twitter people which have merchants fall on their hands.
Funs isnt something all share its subjective some love blight while others hate him to the core of their bones yet its something you cant change or do right same with all killers other crave for bubba and its honer to be tunneled and camped by him while others hate him as pile of camping crap which makes sounds when swinging.
Ghoul got nerfed near trickster patch where his antiloop was nefed by solid part and some bug become feature (just like on knight with his guards) and devs stated they will watch him.
So if I take all these facts this is mainly emocional post.
Edit: 2v8 just droped and many fun killers are there so its no surprise ghoul enjoyers stayed mostly in 1v4 because they cant ghoul around in 2v8 its just what it is and Im not surprised they stick to ghoul even when killers like bubba,dreadge,wesker got very nice buffs.
Like it or not it is what it is and even devs wont change it instantly, if they did the preasure they would need to take isnt worth the money or effort thats just reality.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
Oni is still boring as all heck in this mode, the change did nothing. Still always has power. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
IDK what it is about this game but its just not fun facing killers who have high mobility and damage coz the hit always reads badly on the recieving end. Your servers are awful, show killer ping in lobby.Theres class with sprintburst on command with 30 seconds cooldown if you dont run and it counters all killers even powered oni unless you run straight.
Logicaly people want to have some fun as killer too in 30 minutes cue time so they logicaly pick killers that are fun and worth that cue time and tbh all without mobility are craped on by single sprinburst user using single key so I get why everyone plays someone with mobility especialy when maps are way more bigger and gens go fast the more hookes/ cages killer have.
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075399#Comment_4075399
That's why i suggested that she get a base speed buff since she relies on her power so much. It just seems odd to me that so many other killers have built in ways to counter them, When nurse has arguably the most broken power in the game and no inbuilt way to counter it. Hence why she is sat in the top spot for killers and why so many people complain about playing against her
Lets compare her to xeno and nemesis since their powers do similar things. All 3 allow hits outside of the killer's normal melee reach within a small range.
A high wall totally stops nemesis and xeno from hitting, it does a little against nurse, she goes through the wall and can still hit if she is good or is using aura ready. On a short wall nemesis and xeno can hit over the wall but it's hard to do, survivor can duck to avoid the hit, against nurse a short wall means literally nothing, she can see the survivor, blink through and get an easy hit. Next pallets and vaults, survs can fake a pallet or vault against nemi/xeno, bait the attack and during the cooldown throw the pallet/jump the vault to make time. Nurse gets a second blink to readjust and addons that allow her a third reposition. Same applies on open ground, nemi and xeno get one shot to hit and if they miss they lose distance. Nurse gets a second chance to redjust and is almost guarenteed to get a hit in open ground unless the player is really bad. Even if she misses and gets fatigued, survs are usually still in blink range after.
Nurse's power wins out in every situation. And yet the weaker killers have built in drawbacks. nemesis has to infect survivors before he can damage them with the tentacle and there are a bunch of vaccines to cure the infection. Xeno has the turrets that survivors have to place to remove crawler mode briefly and make them have to m1 for damage. Nurse has no such in built counter AND her power is harder to avoid normally. The only disadvantage she has is a move speed slower than survivors, which doesn't mean much with her, because the makes up the distance easily by blinking through solid objects.
She is objectively broken and needs a way to counterplay her. The only way that can be done currently is by mindgaming, which is dreadfully unreliable, and against a good/aura reading nurse almost useless. I don't want to see her gutted or dropped to B/C tier. I just don't want to hear that blink at the start of the match and know that, unless the nurse is really bad, that I've already lost. She is a relic from very early in the game that hasn't been changed very much, her blink attacks no longer count as basic attacks, which isn't a huge debuff, just locks her put of a few perks. And she actually recieved a buff when bhvr removed the lightburn mechanic from her and wraith.
That's why i suggested that she get a base speed buff since she relies on her power so much. It just seems odd to me that so many other killers have built in ways to counter them, When nurse has arguably the most broken power in the game and no inbuilt way to counter it. Hence why she is sat in the top spot for killers and why so many people complain about playing against herWell going through walls is broken on its own but there are two killers with simular thing henry and pyramidhead, they can hit people through walls with their projectile and still do you think the are Op or broken?
I dont and for nurse buffing base speed its logical no offence but if you take away or make weaker only thing she relys on then you must give jher something in exchange.
Lets compare her to xeno and nemesis since their powers do similar things. All 3 allow hits outside of the killer's normal melee reach within a small range.Not realy nurse after teleport/blink has normal lunge buddy, she only has longer lunge on second blink with certain addon but thats 10% now so not so compareable its like comparing pigs dash to billies in terms of mobility.
A
hi gh wall totally stops nemesis and xeno from hitting, it does a little against nurse, she goes through the wall and can still hit if she is good or is using aura ready. On a short wall nemesis and xeno can hit over the wall but it's hard to do, survivor can duck to avoid the hit, against nurse a short wall means literally nothing, she can see the survivor, blink through and get an easy hit. Next pallets and vaults, survs can fake a pallet or vault against nemi/xeno, bait the attack and during the cooldown throw the pallet/jump the vault to make time. Nurse gets a second blink to readjust and addons that allow her a third reposition. Same applies on open ground, nemi and xeno get one shot to hit and if they miss they lose distance. Nurse gets a second chance to redjust and is almost guarenteed to get a hit in open ground unless the player is really bad. Even if she misses and gets fatigued, survs are usually still in blink range after.High wall loops make nurse loose line of sight which is like half of her counter or main part of her counter plus holding distance but ofcourse it does very little when its just one normal wall that is super thin and she has two blinks.
Nurse's power wins out in every situation. And yet the weaker killers have built in drawbacks. nemesis has to infect survivors before he can damage them with the tentacle and there are a bunch of vaccines to cure the infection. Xeno has the turrets that survivors have to place to remove crawler mode briefly and make them have to m1 for damage. Nurse has no such in built counter AND her power is harder to avoid normally. The only disadvantage she has is a move speed slower than survivors, which doesn't mean much with her, because the makes up the distance easily by blinking through solid objects.Drawbacks or limitations how you call it, nurse has some too but her power is very strong and can power through it (especialy when its nurse player who is realy good) which other killers you mentioned cant.
She is objectively broken and needs a way to counterplay her. The only way that can be done currently is by mindgaming, which is dreadfully unreliable, and against a good/aura reading nurse almost useless. I don't want to see her gutted or dropped to B/C tier. I just don't want to hear that blink at the start of the match and know that, unless the nurse is really bad, that I've already lost. She is a relic from very early in the game that hasn't been changed very much, her blink attacks no longer count as basic attacks, which isn't a huge debuff, just locks her put of a few perks. And she actually recieved a buff when bhvr removed the lightburn mechanic from her and wraith.She is broken you know why????
She was created to fight one thing that maked old DBD super survivor sided ……. infinites, loops that were infinite to run and other killers (except trapper if trap was there in way) couldnt do a thing so devs answeard and gave us nurse to beat it, she was nerfed a lot but her core power is still very strong even when it kinda functions on same mentality as pyramidhead or henry she is still better then they are and has less drawbacks. Nurse in this setting needs logicaly best power because she cant get survivors otherwise due to her speed being slower than survivors running speed so she is for rework Idk how but somehow they could make her 110% speed and still keep her power in some way but with seeing how reworks go meant in speed it will take at best two years I guess because now we have to witness trappers and skullmerchants reworks and merchants rework is on the menu for very long time so Idk whne it will be time for nurses.
I would end it here that we objectively agree.
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@BongoBoys said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075385#Comment_4075385
Myers dash is better then Chuckys. Unrestricted turning, is an insta down, Faster, can break pallets, he's pretty much just the Oni. Also isn't Chucky 110% move speed? I geuss just him being small means he has to be slow af
Oni? what you cooking oni has more range and speed, mayers has massive slowdown when he is charging dash and even when he doesnt have turn rate limit he still needs charge more when using it around obstackles because of killers thick character model which is a thing chucky doesnt suffere from and doesnt loose distance as mayers, only thing that makes mayers better are some addons but without them he isnt busted juts mediocre or high b-tier at best.
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@BongoBoys said:
I was on the fence about it for most iterations but after experiencing enough of it in this 2v8 it has finally reached a breaking point. Gen speeds has gotten ridiculous in 2v8 Devs need to look at adding more progress required on gens and also look at the comeback mechanic and increase the slowdown percentage side of it.
Devs clearly stated its supposed to be survivors mode and mainly be fun for survivors so more expectations for killers getting anything better.
Sprint is pain so playonly killersthat cover chase and catch up mobility like wesker,wraith,billy,nurse,spirit, dracula and oni who has all things when he has power because theres realy no point in playing other killers that get deleted by survivors pressing one button that gives them sprint and all other survivors sround them that arent exhausted and it has super low cooldown compare to all other survivor classes powers.
Its not worth waiting 25-30 minutes for killer match thats pain, theres no shame in not wanting to have fun either like the opposite side.
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@BongoBoys said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4075594#Comment_4075594
Plus no mori you should not be able to charge 15$ if I doesn't come with a mori slash that down to a 10$ skin
Just naughty bear is the best one no loud sonds of breathing or his steps plus unique mori.
And you can get it with shards and its cheapest cosmetic of its tier its basicaly same in qualities as wereelk unique mori,skin but its cheaper.
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@katoptris said:
That killer is for those who are learning the basic. What do you expect???
Trapper isnt best basics because he will slowly teach you one thing and thats be ok with loosing even when you did everything right.
Better options are killers like wraith,legion even doctor they give you more info on survivors and let you be more in chase and active compare to trapper.
Now trapper isnt that worthof playing, not until his rework is out same with merchant because there are more better low killers.