Neyar
Neyar
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3292120#Comment_3292120
And yet you say nothing that will not combine this bonus with tunneling. There's no reason to not tunnel. The best thing you can do to deter tunneling is make it hard. There used to be 1 thing that did pretty good job at that. But unfortunatelly they nerfed it, because killer players did not like this and survivors used it offensively. As DS is now 3s instead of 5s, no killer is afraid of it which means no killer is afraid to tunnel. OTR did awful job in replacing DS so there's no reason why tunnel should not be 1st choise (that goes even if devs implemented your solution)
This suggestion changes the game so that tunneling is no longer the most efficient way to win.
With shared hooks, if you tunnel your first survivor, that person will need to be either hooked 6 times, or camped on hook for 6 minutes before they are out of the game. That is a losing game every time. The mechanic encourages killers to play differently in order to win without telling them how to play explicitly.
Killers can still camp and tunnel as much as they want. They'll just lose the game for doing so at 5 gens. As a matter of fact, once you burn through the 4 shared hooks, it's technically easier to camp and tunnel late game... as long as you have used up all of the shared hooks already.
The tradeoff with his suggestion is that a strategy of tunneling early gains you literally nothing. You lose gen pressure (and gens) because you're only keeping one survivor busy, and you don't even get that survivor out of the game easily doing so. By the time that first person is dead, the other three are out the exit gate. Tunneling stops being an "always, all the time, winning strategy", which by definition means it's "harder" to pull off.
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@DBDVulture said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3292043#Comment_3292043
"I think reducing the reward you get by tunelling is a better strategy."
Punishment behavior has been shown to be ineffective.
Your solution does not address the root cause of tunneling : Killers feel they need to tunnel to catch up to gen speed completion.
Your idea might work if the game had some kind of basekit lockout where if a "free hook" got used up then one gen stayed locked until that survivor were freed (only one at a time).
Punishment would be slowing down a hook or removing killer BP if they stay too close to a hook too long.
This solution changes the core game so that camping and tunneling is no longer the most efficient strategy to win. Core game changes imo, are the only way to resolve the problem.
Changing gen times do absolutely nothing to deter tunneling and camping, as we saw in 6.0. You could add 4 minutes per gen and it would reward camping hooks, and making gens any faster means killers will 'tunnel because they have no choice'.
The only solution to gen speeds, is to severely limit items. Survivor items should provide no more than 10% increased speed, regardless of add-ons. Ideally, both gen progress and regression should have a hard cap that can't be overcome even if you stack every perk for it.
But even limiting gen speeds won't change the fact that tunneling is the most efficient way to win. It always will be, until something like shared hooks is implemented too.
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@TeabaggingGhostface said:
People were using it to keep people hostage
Do you have a source for this? A clip, video, anything?
I get that it would be possible, in theory, for two survivors to work together with a killer to keep one person on hook indefinitely, but I have yet to have seen any evidence that this occurred.
And, for the record, if two survivors and a killer work together to body block a survivor in a corner indefinitely, they can do so now. But that seems to not be a concern for some reason. It's almost like a killer coming across two survivors tethered to a tiny space is gong to default to taking their free kills.
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@Leguś said:
2 people could troll 3rd person on Hook forever if they wanted to do.
And in end-game it basically felt like old Hatch stand-off. Either one side gives in or we reach a stalemate.
There's a reason we have a Bleed-out timer even though long slugging doesn't feel "fun".
This has never been correct.
Two survivors and the killer would all have to work together to 'troll someone on hook forever'. The perk only works within 6 meters, so you'd have to have the killer standing there allowing it to happen.
Which is exactly the same scenario if two survivors body block a third in a corner indefinitely. If the killer just stands there nodding you're still just as screwed for however long until they all get bored. Wait, that doesn't happen?
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@StarLost said:
Unfortunately, I don't think that this game can be balanced in terms of both the SWF and solo versus killer matchups.
Yes, solos could have more tools to communicate - but I'm not sure how much that would actually do.
It's a situation where either SWF, solo or killers are getting the greasy end of things.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3145193#Comment_3145193
My killer queues are between 30 seconds and about 2 minutes now at worst.
Survivor queues are between instant and 2 minutes now.
However...if I think back even 6 months, my survivor queues were in the region of 5 minutes and my killer queues were instant.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3145223#Comment_3145223
Camping is getting a nerf in the next patch, via Reassurance.
That endurance effect is also a big nerf to tunneling, as is OTR.
Yes, you can still tunnel and camp, but they definitely aren't as effective as they once were.
Outside of communication/icons, what help could you give solos that would be a net zero buff for SWFs?
Camping is getting a perk that requires you to have equipped and be within 6m of the hook. After a number of huge base kit buffs to gaming inn 6.1.0. Anyone who wants to camp will still use the hooked person as bait and at minimum force hook trades. Let's not pretend that reassurance creates any additional pressure to leave a hook and go elsewhere when you still have two survivors occupied and possibly two survivors downed/hooked as a result.
Tunneling also got base kit buffs in the same patch. Endurance isn't even close to a deterrent to tunneling, since with the deep wound change they added with it, so you have to do is hit them once and all protection is disabled. And if you happen to be chasing someone on deep wound, there's no incentive or reason to let that survivor recover. What are they gonna to, send more survivors off gens to take hits and reward you with even more free pressure? At least the old DS would have killers waiting it out camping a slug and wasting their own time. Endurance is always instant pick up, every time. The only thing endurance accomplishes is keeping someone from getting immediately farmed to the ground off hook, and hook trading is always an option if you think endurance is 'effective.'
The only way to actually nerf to camping and tunneling is to incentivize the killer to leave the hook and not immediately return. This will take some kind of major change to the core game, probably bigger than the 6.1 patch. I'm not sure the devs see camping and tunneling at 5 gens as a big enough issue to even want to try tackling it at that scope.
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My problem with nightfall isn't the darkness, it's the screaming and crying ambiance being too loud. Especially toward the end of nightfall it ramps up a lot.
Blind me as the player or deafen me, but not both at once. It's a video game, the only sensory inputs we get are video and sound.
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It's 100% reliant on the killer's ping again, at least that's what it seems like. I can have 40 ms in lobby and in game and still not have it work for me. It feels like before they added hit validation tbh, a while back.
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The game relies on survivors players believing that they actually have a chance of escaping if they play their cards right. The state of the game right now is that an even reasonably quick down at the start can be game deciding. You get one person hooked in the basement at five gens in solo q, and the amount of coordination it can take to recover from that is unrecoverable in a lot of cases. More so if that person disconnects or gives up on hook.
That and efficiency is the only thing that matters for survivors right now. Even one person screwing around and not holding m1 can cost you enough progress to throw some games, and that's a death sentence for solos. Challenges, chests, even just wandering aimlessly seems to still be the priority for some people.
Even with no disconnects or giving up/free hook stages, I can generally tell in my games when the game is lost. I'll keep working on gens and going for saves rather than disconnecting, but I had several games even yesterday where we're three hooks into the game at four gens and the game is already over.
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@blue4zion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3137990#Comment_3137990
And the basement is supposed to be a dangerous place.
I won't lie, I don't like the 5 seconds but using the basement as an argument seems wack.
The basement is an example in every single map that counters the argument that '5 seconds is enough to get you to any loop.' Same with dead zones that exist in many areas of maps. Just about the only loops you can consistently reach in five seconds is if your hook is in a jungle gym. And a lot of killers you have to break line of sight to avoid.
5 seconds is probably enough without going overboard, but let's not pretend that it's a get out of jail free card. Tunneling hasn't been this healthy in this game for a long time.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3131135#Comment_3131135
It's not different. "Points" has nothing to do with it.
Doing a generator until it is done is a Survivor game objective.
Targeting a Survivor until it is dead is a Killer game objective.
Killers are expected to stop and spread it around to other Survivors but Survivors are never expected to stop and spread it around to other generators. This is a double standard, and a very blatant and obvious one at that.
So you want survivors to be able to be able to regress hook stages is what I'm hearing, because that 33% of a generator isn't permanent just because it hit a threshhold, it's only secure when the gen is 100% finished. Just touch a hook that someone was hooked on, and the killer loses a hash mark if they don't hook on it again fast enough. Cause that's the equivalent to generator progress. Until that survivor is dead (100% objective completion), you're arguing that it should be possible to completely regress all sacrifice progress back down to zero. What? No? You don't want that? weird.
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@FridayNightPizza said:
Boil over. I groan everytime I see it.
Boil over is good for identifying who brought the Ormond, Glenvale, or RPD map offering tho. It's 100% the boil over survivor every time. They get special attention until they die.
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You can't have a balanced, asymmetrical game.
Let's say, I can perfectly assess every player's skill level: 500 being the lowest skill and 1900 being the highest, just to have numbers.
The most challenging game I can give a 1900 killer is to give them a lobby of four 1900 survivors.
The most challenging game I can give a 1900 survivor is to give them a 1900 killer and three teammates who are 500. Better teammates only make the game easier for the one we're focusing on.
These can't be the same match.
This doesn't even take into account perks, abilities, or even the game mechanics. There just isn't a single match that presents a 'balanced' game for both sides. Not competitively at least, which is likely why people generally preferred the days before MMR.
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Probably depends. What I expect to happen is something like this:
New chapter is released with Reassurance as is. It probably becomes popular at minimum and maybe meta for solo q. But tremendous amounts of sales of the chapter.
There will be varying degrees of complaints from killers about camping not being as effective. Many will adapt, others will struggle.
Reassurance will get nerfed in the mid chapter and probably only be allowed once per hook stage or something. Official reason will be something like 'kill rates too low' or a killer and three survivors stream snipe one victim to grief with it. But in reality the perk probably drove sales for some people, so it's already done its job.
Usually BHVR has a pretty good track record of keeping the more powerful/meta killers and perks in non-licensed chapters, to be completely fair. But it's also become the norm in the gaming industry to have paid content that is strong and desirable on release, but nerf the ######### out of it after initial sales.
I wouldn't be nearly as concerned if this perk wasn't a much requested and needed, if still band aid, fix to a core game issue locked behind a pay wall.
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@Sandt21 said:
Two Honest questions incoming regarding to camping and tunneling
1) Do you believe that each survivor is entitled to three hooks per game?
2) Do you believe that each survivor, after being unhooked, is entitled to a reset in their game, meaning that after being unhooked, they should get some time to regroup and whatnot without having the killer come after them, since they were the last one the killer came after?
These are easy.
1) Survivors and killers aren't entitled to anything. Survivors have three hook stages as resources to use/lose to off set the five gen resources the killer can use/lose. Survivors aren't entitled to being unhooked, but neither is the killer entitled to a kill just because there's a survivor on a hook at any stage.
2) I would prefer the game be balanced in a way that makes it possible for 5 players to participate in most of the game. If the most efficient way to play the game is to eliminate a player immediately, that's a core game problem. If the 'best' play for a killer is always 'never let the first survivor recover' rather than creating map/gen pressure, then that is also a core game issue. The answer here isn't that survivors are entitled to a reset, but killers should absolutely have a more meaningful choice in whether to focus on one person, or create map pressure. Currently, tunneling one person out early gives nearly infinite map pressure for the rest of the game, so there's no choice to be made here. The killer always sees removing a survivor by any means necessary as 'the best play', and that's a problem with the core game.
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@VikingDragonXii said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3126874#Comment_3126874
The thing is that it won't it actually encourages it because how the perk is set up. Remember it notifies the Killer when the hook timer is paused by the perk. That will tell the Killer that there is a Survivor in the area and they will patrol around the Hook.
This then will set up for the part of it that can be abused by Survivors. While the Killer chases the Survivor they will be looped around the hooked Survivor. Here comes Survivor #2 who then uses the perk again to pause the timer. Survivors 1 and 2 will keep going back and forth using the perk while Survivor 4 works on Gens.
The perk itself has a hard cap of 60 mins.....that's just a stupid place to put a hard cap. I have been a part of that so nice 60 min hostage negotiation on both sides when a few Survivors and I tested it out with a Killer using Weaker and we all wanted to do a few tests.
It will need a rework before live servers by either increased cool down or limit how many times it can pause the timer for any one Survivor.
What you just described is camping being potentially a strategy that doesn't just automatically guarantee a kill. Which is what any camping need is going to do.
On top of that, if you have one survivor on hook doing literally nothing to progress the game, then you've already lost in this scenario. If survivors decide to have two players keep you occupied while a third does gens, and that is enough to lose you the game, then it doesn't matter if the last survivor is on hook with reassurance or dead.
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@AVoiceOfReason said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3124359#Comment_3124359
Wait, wait, wait. If survivors' 3-gen themselves, its fine and its on them for making that mistake but if a KILLER breaks 2-3 hooks in an area, making it impossible to hook a survivor then its not fair and needs to be changed? What kind of crap is that? You can choose where to hook. Got perks for that, too. Choose better hook options and don't camp. Survivors' don't owe you a free hook, just the same as killers' don't owe you a free hatch just because you did most of the work in the match for your team.
I agree with you. And as sarcastically as I can muster via text,
I think he just wants to make sure that once the killer completes their objective and sacrifices a survivor, they can complete their next objective using the same map resource.
So I'm completely certain he will have zero issues allowing survivors to complete the same generator five times in a row to power the exit gates.
Same energy.
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If you're trying to get kills with the trap, that's not its primary purpose. The purpose is slowdown.
You want that survivor to have a trap on their head as long as possible. The longer they spend running around looking for jigsaw boxes, the more time they aren't touching a generator, healing, or really doing much else to progress the game.
On top of that, less confident groups will try not to complete gens if any survivor has a hat on. So you can sometimes get the entire game to grind to a halt if the survivors are nervous (typically solo q groups tbh).
In a 'perfect' game, I want to put one new trap on every time a gen pops. I want every gen completion to be a decision they make to potentially kill their own teammate. Make your choice, gens or friends.
Don't chase the person with a hat. They should be busy with the boxes and you can focus on the other three. The only time I ever harass a trapped survivor is if I stumble across them on a box or someone chases me to them on a box. Even then, I'll just get them to cancel their search so they have to start over and move on. Maybe down them if they're injured for more pressure. More than a couple seconds out of my way and it's not worth it to invest in a 'busy' survivor when there are three more happily doing their objective.
Getting a nice head pop is great, but I almost never play for that specifically unless I've essentially already won. Sometimes harassing the unlucky person who had to search four boxes is enough to get the head pop.
Or if you really want to play for trap kills, run tampered timer and crate of gears. It does exactly what you mentioned, where traps take 130 seconds and boxes take a few seconds longer to search. Large or confusing maps like red forest or rpd usually can get you at least one trap kill.
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@Laurie268 said:
Same here, I always end up exhausted on the ground if I DH the moment the killer swings. I have 35 ping so it isn’t due to my ping either. DH needs its hit validation back which they removed after the perk rework or else the perk won’t work properly
Exhausted in the ground was the reason I stopped using DH until they added validation. I can check my ping, and I know anything higher than about 60 is going to be a problem and can swap build in the lobby. Usually it's fine, but some servers/lobbies are just crap. But the killer's ping is hidden. DH is back to unreliable for me as well.
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@Ikalx said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3118650#Comment_3118650
I didn't quite understand everything in your post. The second point is something really good to know, and I hadn't thought about that, so thanks. The first though...I don't really understand, healing happens at anytime, no? It's not something that comes with thana, and thana actually doesn't affect those speeds either, so...it feels like a constant for most situations, I would expect anyway.
Also I don't really understand the numbers between it being 25% slower? 90+9.45s isn't 25%. I also don't understand the 40% either.
I am completely not arguing for 115s (base kit? you mean after four worked for hits, no?), but current is 108s for 4, and 95.4s for 3. In comparison the 3.5% is 102.6s for 4, 99.45s for 3, etc.
True, healing is always an option, but Thana encourages survivors to prioritize healing. There are some times where it's better to stay injured, and perks that only work while you're injured (Resilience and DH). Even the psychological idea of seeing a "red slow" gen bar will cause some people to spend 16 seconds healing themselves to save maybe 10 seconds added by that Thana stack on a generator.
The 25% slower isn't an actual "slowdown," but an effect of tunneling. If one survivor dies, then the survivor team only has 3 players to progress the game instead of 4.
Put another way, let's say you have three injured survivors and one is tunneled out immediately. With the 6.1.0 Thana,
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@FrostyEyesSusie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3119276#Comment_3119276
Why is it on the killer, though? The 4th survivor can always come out and take the L too if he doesn't want the game dragged out. The killer's objective is to kill everyone, and he has better chances of killing everyone by slugging the 3rd survivor than hooking them, so that's what they do. Or the devs could remove the stupid participation trophy mechanic. Blamming the killer for not giving the 4th survivor a free win is peak entitlement.
This is a funny sentiment currently. 'Why doesn't the survivor just give up on what they consider an unwinnable waste of time?'
Because when many survivors take that mindset, you get the current 'disconnect crisis' where any subjective reason for giving up becomes valid in the players mind, that's why.
Slugging for the 4k is an annoying issue with game design. The game should avoid putting any player into a basically dead end scenario like this. Because when you start putting players into unwinnable, yet inescapable scenarios, the best option becomes 'the only winning move is not to play.' Some players take a break from the game, while others throw games. One is healthy, the other isn't.
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There are a couple options, unbreakable might work, but just delays the inevitable, and hiding is the best bet.
Personally I find slugging for the 4k to be the most mind numbingly boring experience in the game. I don't bother as killer, and I'd rather eat glass as the survivor in either spot. I want the option to just chew my wrists once I hit 'find help' if there is only one survivor standing. Make it count as three hook stages, just let me move on.
Had a game recently where our Nancy d/c'd at the start of the game, and bubba face camped nea. Unwinnable game for survivors, but of course he had to try and slug for the 4k. So I used my only available strategy of giving up all 5k of my BP that match and disconnecting so Haddie could get hatch.
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@Ikalx said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3109478#Comment_3109478
I mean, like yeah I appreciate that breakdown (though I was doing my own to try to figure it out), but my comment was more about the roundness of numbers in general in dbd, and also like...2% is less than half of 5.5%, which is a pretty big balance change and forced them to compensate for the situation in other ways, introducing new gameplay (though that isn't always a bad thing).
Also from that breakdown, level 4 only shaves 3 seconds off with this balance, which feels negligible, but also level 1 adds 1.8s, level 2 adds 3.7s, and level 3 adds 5.7s. That's not a lot, just taking the merits of the perk by itself. I mean I know they did this to nerf very difficult times for survivors (which I appreciate, since I mostly play survivor), but like let's look at somewhere in the middle, 3.5%.
If my calculations are correct, and there's no reason why they would be, at 3.5%:
1 injury = 3.15s extra
2 injuries = 6.3s extra
3 injuries = 9.45s extra
4 injuries = 12.6s extra.
This nerfs the top level significantly to 102.6s (which I assume is the least used case) while providing more utility for killers and also not adding a crazily heavy burden on survivors. And that's a 2% decrease. 3% looks even better and more tame, while still providing value on lesser hits.
All I'm saying is, I know the devs have the facts and numbers, but I've seen many people jump from large to small and then finally (years later) settle on a middle ground, and I'm just curious what makes people do that, because on paper, it looks like a pretty significant change.
Two things to keep in mind about the new version of Thana. The gen speed isn't the only slowdown the perk is based around, but also healing time. Taking one person off a gen for 16 seconds to heal is time that gen doesn't progress at all. And that assumes there's already a boon/medkit at hand. Booning or finding a second survivor or med kit takes even more time on top of that.
Second is that the current Thana introduces a game design choice that encourages the killer not to tunnel one player out as fast as possible. As soon as someone dies, you lose out on the maximum strength of the perk. I think this is a healthy design decision for the game.
Alternately, having the penalty be linear, like 5.5% per or in your example a flat number of seconds, is far less noticeable between 3 and 4 survivors remaining. But literally everything in the game is 25% slower once one person is dead. So tunneling one survivor an out and then keeping the remaining three injured alone takes one perk slot for effectively 40% slowdown.
The new version is much healthier overall. Thana only works of it's a niche perk. If everyone runs (the old version of) it, then they effectively made gens take 115 seconds base kit, which is what we saw for two weeks. At that point, either Thana gets nerfed, or base gen speeds get reduced. Even for killers, this is the better option.
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My complaint with DMS is the same as its always been since the bug that removed the obsession requirement: the cooldown needs to be longer than the duration.
In solo q, people just brainless hook trade on scourge hooks as is, but hook trading with DMS basically ensures it has 100% uptime.
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The only way to resolve it is to make tunneling/camping less efficient than other methods. I don't believe you can accomplish this with any punishment or incentives though, and it would require a complete overhaul of core game systems. Which isn't impossible, just harder.
Take, for example, a system where survivors are treated more as a team for resources. So instead of 3 hook stages each, it's only first hook and then death hook, skipping struggle. However, now there are 4 collective hook stages for any survivor to use, that are used before their individual ones. Same number of hooks, 12 hooks and everyone is dead.
This nukes camping. You can technically still face camp one survivor, but they won't die until all of the communal hooks and their own hooks are gone: 6 hook stages. By then the other three survivors are already into their next match and you've died of boredom at the hook.
It also discourages tunneling. Until you have at least 4 hooks, it doesn't matter one bit who you chase next. In fact, if you aren't hunting your next down right away you are losing pressure. It becomes more efficient to leave hook immediately and chase someone off a gen to ideally get another hook before the rescue. Hook trading still works, but why only have two survivors off gens when you can chase a third?
This isn't a perfect system, but this is the kind of change that would reduce the 'efficiency' of camping and tunneling but still let people 'strategically' do whatever they want without implementing a punishment or disincentive.
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@Raptorrotas said:
So why isnt the 4th picking up the 3rd?
Boom slugging solved and the 3rd "can still play the game"
Because the slug is bait.
Had a game the other day where Jake was slugged across the map and I was hiding for hatch. Killer was Myers with tier 3 99'd and I already knew if I went anywhere near Jake we were both dead.
My only chance at an escape play in that situation is to either wait for Myers to hook him, or hide until he bleeds out. Killer got bored of camping the slug after three minutes and finally hooked him.
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Aside from now being worded oddly, the base mechanic is fine. IMO it should read 'see survivor auras for 11 seconds at the start of the match and increase *other* aura reading abilities by 2 seconds' but that's just nit picking.
The one area I'm on the fence about is that it buffs add-ons with aura reading. Perks make sense, sure, but things like Compound 21 don't need buffed.
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@Belzher said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3108012#Comment_3108012
Yes it is easier to activate it but you can't save it for later anymore, that's my problem with the change. You either have to go for the hit after activating or let it deactivate.
Yeah it's in a weird spot. You could easily end up in a situation where your second protection hit is immediately after you are unhooked. So now you're injured, and MoM is active, but its effect is disabled because you have deep wound from BT. Doing anything other than mending turns it off, so you have to be 'that guy' and go run right back to the killer off hook. Or you just go down because you get tunneled off hook and can't mend.
From a killer perspective, MoM is just a free aura read for a survivor who can't do anything useful for a while. It's a problem that literally just goes away if you ignore it because eventually they have to progress the game.
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Does it show this awful of ping in the lobby? Or is it only once you get into the map?
I usually just lobby dodge as survivor or killer if I see ping higher than around 60.
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@ThatOneDemoPlayer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3107340#Comment_3107340
How are CoB and Overcharge bugged? How is Nurse bugged?
Overcharge (with or without Call of Brine) is bugged in that hitting the difficult Overcharge skill check doesn't stop the gen from regressing. You can hit that OC skill check, work on the gen for a bit, then walk away. The gen doesn't spark, but the progress bar decays from the OC regression anyway. The only way to get the gen to stop regressing after an OC kick is to deliberately (or accidentally) miss any skill check, which costs you up to 10% progress.
If the killer has OC and CoB together, the total regression from both perks continues after the survivor walks away. It's free regression at minimum, and most people have referred to it as "free ruin" with both perks.
It was reported like the day after the 6.1 patch on the bug forums, and several times since, but it continues to be an issue that hasn't been kill-switched. Same with the Devour Hope bug.
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@DredgeyEdgey said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3106376#Comment_3106376
True but people experience motion sickness from the fixed fov so that's why I wanted to change shadowborn as well as make it a slider for both sides. Killer allready has it behind a perk but surivor dosent. We would have to be careful with the surivor but it should be a thing
I don't understand why Shadowborn isn't a slider bar in the settings menu, personally. I feel the same way about Spine Chill as a visual indicator for the hard of hearing. With the Spine Chill thing, you could easily make a visual indicator HUD option in the settings that does the same thing. If you're really worried that it'll get abused, then make the visual setting also force-disable game audio.
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@squbax said:
How hard is it to look for the aura of a survivor being hooked, like is it really complex?
It's not.
But the number of times my idiot solo q teammates decide (or are forced) to hook trade at that scourge hook is annoyingly large. Because now DMS is still active and the counter of letting go to avoid the second PMS proc blocks the gen. There's no avoiding the DMS block for the second hook in that situation, and I was glad it was gone.
I still have the muscle memory of letting go of gens when someone is getting hooked, so I guess I don't have to think about it when they patch that crap back in.
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@AnchorTea said:
Punishing the tunnel broke chases at 5 seconds. 3 seconds just extends them.
Tunneling and camping got indirectly buffed this patch.
Tunneling got indirectly buffed. Camping got directly buffed. There isn't a single change that negatively impacted camping, but nearly everything from shorter chases, longer gen times, BBQ incentive to leave the hook removed, monstrous shrine making the basement stronger, etc. all contribute to a huge buff to camping.
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@rydiafan said:
Super cool that the killer knows they can safely ignore you until your aura goes away, and then knows that you no longer have endurance.
The perk that, if you ignore it long enough, the problem literally resolves itself.
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@zarr said:
As before, survivors can simply let go of their gen during the hooking animation, then Resonance won't activate Switch, meaning the killer still won't see which gen it affected.
But the change doesn't make a lot of sense for a different reason, or two reasons:
- Since the recent update, Resonance happening in the middle of Merciless Storm led to the survivor facing a lot of skill checks, which if they were to miss one, would cause Storm to block the gen... Now Resonance happening in the middle of Storm will simply block the gen instantly, no matter what. I don't see how this is not a buff for the Resonance-Storm interaction.
- Resonance happening in the middle of Storm is a pretty rare occurrence, and Storm is an underpowered perk because experienced survivors can pretty reliably complete all of its checks. If anything, the existence of this combo is one of the few things Storm's got going for it. That said, given that I argue that this change is actually a buff for the combo, I guess this is a sensible change, only for the opposite reason the devs think.
Personally I'm not happy with the Switch nerf, I think due to the ability to let go of a gen before the hooking animation finishes, the Resonance-Switch combo wasn't all that oppressive. Granted, I think they should get rid of the "mechanic" whereby gens explode if a survivor lets go during a skill check, since that does make the combo obnoxious and is a bad mechanic in general. Mindbreaker/Fearmonger can be used to counter the tactic of letting go of a gen during the hooking animation, and it has gotten better now that Dead Hard isn't the #1 most prevalent Exhaustion perk anymore... but that's already a 3-perk combo, plus people can still let go when the survivor gets picked up.
If they really want to kill the Resonance-Switch combo, I would suggest they rework Switch to only activate if a survivor lets go of their gen while in the killer's terror radius. However, if they let go and trigger Switch this way, it will then block that gen for the entire 30 seconds (the time window within which Switch remains activate after hooking a survivor could still be 45 seconds, or even increased to 60). This not only solves the "issue" with the Resonance interaction, but also the much larger issue that is Artist + Switch.
Add to this that Pain Res isn't the only perk that can interact with Merciless Storm on an active gen. Technically Jolt does the exact same thing that Pain Res does now: instant regression with no (visual) notification and no generator interrupt.
So at best this kicks the can down the road, since you can get the exact same scenario having one or more of your teammates going down near your gen while Merciless Storm is running. I guess time for Jolt to make survivors scream as well, for no reason.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3105669#Comment_3105669
Wat.
Survivors absolutely can still win. I've been watching HCS streams today, and survivors are smashing faces right now, especially with the new OTR.
The issue is that I...think you're misunderstanding your win state.
You escaping is not a win.
You dying is not a loss. It's about how many people escape.
What you are describing sounds like you want the majority of games to be a 0k. Would that be fair to killers?
So, you're watching people who play DBD for a living, who each have thousands of hours in the game, have encyclopedic knowledge of the game, are playing literally like a comp team, and using perfect communication and callouts, and wondering why this isn't the typical solo q survivor experience? Really? That's essentially the killers worst possible nightmare scenario, and the definition of seal team SWF.
I get that it's a team based game for survivors, and sometimes you take one for the team. But there is literally zero incentive besides being a 'team player' for doing so. If you get tunneled and face camped for five gens, but still die while the other three escape (which is best case scenario and completely unrealistic), you can still get less than 10k BP at the end of the game. There's no shared BP reward for that, you got unlucky and only get boldness points and nothing else. Sometimes you get a high five from someone in end game chat.
And more likely you get tunneled and camped for more like 1-2 gens while your soloq teammates crouch in a corner with a gen allergy.
The game doesn't have to be 0k or 4k to be fun. Some of my more memorable games ever are ones where I died, but had great moments with a killer who wasn't a jerk and teammates who weren't brain dead. They're memorable because they're rare.
Personally, I want there to be a chance at winning. But lately it feels like survivors get one mistake per match. More than one mistake and the game is very difficult to come back from without communication, and, unlike killer, you don't have to be the one to make those mistakes. First chase is a basement hook at 5 gens? Well, I don't get Dowsey and Otz to get them out. I get 'guy who wants to self care under the basement hook for some reason' and 'guy who loops the killer back to hook'.
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The only winning move is not to play.
Not in the sense of DCing or giving up on hook, cause that's #########. But I've been taking a break from the game and it's been a good strategy when the games were mind numbingly boring like you described.
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@mustdogen said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3105657#Comment_3105657
They promised to buff anti camping /tunnel.
And they did.
So i am really confused about why are you complaining and said "they deleted every tool survivors had "
And because the only perk nerf is dh,so i guess you are mad at dh nerf ,am i wrong?
I'm genuinely curious how you think they did anything except straight up buff camping.
The few perks that are even useful in that position would be kindred and kinship, which were completely unchanged.
But they added: 10 seconds to base gen times for less pressure to leave the hook, every base kit killer buff directly makes camping easier or more efficient, monstrous shrine now guarantees you can hook trade on scourge hooks if you camp the basement (and if you can proxy camp from farther than 24m, you are rewarded with faster hook stages).
There are changes to tunneling that could be debated, but camping was objectively buffed from multiple angles.
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@mustdogen said:
They buff Bt, rework a new op NT tunnel perk, make an in game bt and speed boost.
Why you stillcomplaing?
None of those stack. One hit from the killer disables all three, even if you and your team bring them all. The only thing you're left with is, at best, 15 seconds of a 'speed boost' that still has you moving slower than the killer.
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@Ghostofsnow said:
Like if they did balance MMR to work for a 2k/2e average or even a 3k/1e all the changes they added would be pointless outside of how the game feels match to match. which speaks volumes given the big negative reception and level of mostly valid complaints
Well, one way the kills/escapes ratio 'works' is that the demographics and statistics aren't based on two groups (killer and survivor) but instead on at least 3: killer, solos, and SWF.
So let's take an extreme example and assume 75% of all players are solos, and the other 25% are exclusively 4 man SWF. Since averages are over the entire player base, if the SWF players never die/lose and the solos never escape/win then as a whole the player base has achieved a ratio that, on average, looks like 3k/1e every game.
As far as MMR, this extreme example also puts solo q survivors at minimum MMR, and SWF at the soft cap. For the killers in this situation, they will stomp solos until they hit a certain MMR break point then lose to a SWF or two. But since we're assuming there are 3 times as many solo survivors, eventually killers will hit soft cap as well.
The only way to match a killer with a solo q squad with this extreme example is to just accept that your solo q group had been in queue too long and match them with any killer.
So you answer your question, MMR doesn't really work as more than a guideline in the best circumstances.
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3100320#Comment_3100320
You use the 5 seconds to reach one or you get hit and use the speed boost.
You do realize that, even with haste, 5 seconds isn't enough time to get to the top of the basement stairs.
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I had it happen in a game last night whee the killer was only running overcharge. I'm not sure what causes the bug, but imo the perk should be disabled until they figure out what's causing it and fix it.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3097629#Comment_3097629
Its not like there was a dbd event in the last 30 days or something like that...
Even over the past week or so since the patch it's been dropping daily. There are three main peaks in player count every day, I'm assuming oceanic, EU, and NA each spike the count at their respective peak times.
Last Wednesday was the biggest day since the patch for each of these, the highest was the first peak at a little over 55k. That same time period yesterday was 43k. Every region seems to be dropping daily since the patch launched, and each one is about 12k fewer players than a week ago.
It's the game dead? Nah. But I think enough players are taking a healthy break to notice in the metrics, myself included. And I recommend a break as being healthier than taking out frustrations on other players, regardless of which role you queue into.
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@WesCravenFan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/337451/the-new-patch-is-not-a-fun-experience
Less than 3K IS a loss, though.
That is not Killer mentality, that is BHVR's own decree in the way they made the MMR system.
In hockey, a tie occurs when both sides have an equal score at the end of regular game time. It requires an additional tie-breaking round to be added beyond the regular game in order to resolve, or else the match is considered a draw in most contexts.
Not sure why this came to mind, but it seems relevant for some reason.
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This isn't exclusive to just using this combo. Even with Overcharge as the only regression perk, the regression continues after successfully hitting the skill check for the perk.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3096573#Comment_3096573
Im largely referring to one consoles stability over the others. But it's irrelevant to the larger point I was making.
Severe DC penalties are bad for game health, doubly so when the penalty will catch innocent players.
Ideally, the devs will eventually make it so that DCs become bots. It's already a feature present in mobile and soon to be custom matches.
Introducing bots into live matches is the worst idea. Ask any nemesis player how useful it is sometimes to have two AI on your team, who get stuck on everything and nothing and are complete RNG.
I'd rather have no teammate as it is now than have a bot Meg feed Myers tier 3 for free, or a literally brainless down for a nurse to trigger starstruck for free with zero chance at mind games or counter play.
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@Marc_go_solo said:
One amendment I'd make would be to not impliment the collision suggestion, and instead give the unhooked survivor a 3 second Sprint Burst. That way, the survivor can really punish a tunnelling killer, should they be daft enough to try. It also doesn't remove that survivor's chance to bodyblock if they wish to use it, but of course then they don't get the sprint burst benefit, so it's a toss up for them.
Other than that, it's what I'd do, so yeah it's pretty decent!
This is the only way removing body blocking would work. While it sounds good on paper to just remove collision, the survivor with 7% haste still moves slower than every single killer in the game except nurse and tombstone Myers, which arguably still don't matter here.
Moving slower than the killer is a death sentence, since any killer who wants to tunnel you doesn't even have to count anymore. Just wait until you have collision back and it's guaranteed you have no BT left.
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@PNgamer said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3090901#Comment_3090901
Wrong. If you go into games with such a bad attitude, you might as well play something else
Let's put it another way: giving up is a strategy.
Played one game tonight for the first time in a few days. CoB, Overcharge, Thana, Dying Light legion. Tunneled out Kate at 4 gens, slugged Nea and she dc'd. It's me and Claud at 4 gens. I get hooked and try to die to give Claud hatch and accidentally Kobe first try. I get chased and slugged, so I dc to let Claud get hatch. She ended up winning the gate game to escape after hatch was closed.
My best play at that moment was to let her have a chance at hatch, and I got unlucky. I'm also back to taking a break from the game indefinitely.
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What he said, but also you get 'Opening' points for doing a door as survivor. 99-100% on a single door is enough to max the 'Opening' category.
So if one survivor opens both doors fully, it's actually wasting one door's worth of points because they're already capped in that category.
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@darksouls3600 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/337198/stacking-slowdown-is-too-much
And every single game I see this
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/FN25CQKKW8S3/images-2816-29.jpeg
With this new prestige mechanic, every one is using prove
It's almost like there's a gen speed "arms race" of sorts. Where killers have a dozen or so options to slow, regress, or block gens, and survivors have one reliable perk that can offset that.
Deja Vu is only 5% buff on specific gens, so is pretty situational for a marginal buff. The other option is Overzealous, which unfortunately is not worth running. It takes 14 seconds to cleanse a dull totem for an 8% buff, but even doing an entire 90 second gen without being hit saves you 12.5 seconds of time. You finish the gen faster without cleansing the totem, if you aren't hit, and have at most 5 charges in a match. Meanwhile Thana is highly popular and even at 1-2 stacks overpowers these buffs.
Or you can run prove, get a better buff than these two combined, and work on a gen with someone else for an even faster gen. There's no contest.
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@WesCravenFan said:
When was the last time you seriously used a mist offering?
I'm using up my clear reagents right now, cause I'm sure as hell not wasting any bp offerings on some of these matches.