Deadeye
Deadeye
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DBD released 14th June 2016. Why should anything happen so early in May? 4 weeks after midchapter patch would be even close to start PTB this week, I think if anything, we will get info earliest late this month
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@StarLost said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302008#Comment_3302008
...Insane...pickrate...what?
Dude, it was at 18% last I checked. That's perfectly in-line for what the 'meta' perks are.
Eruption is probably going to get gutted, because that does seem to be the pattern when it comes to killer perks (wish they made more of an effort to keep them viable, like Survivor perks - see Dead Hard versus Thana) but 18% is pretty meh.
last time you checked? where pls? In your own games?
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301623#Comment_3301623
This is not how Eruption works. The Cooldown starts once a Survivor is put into the Dying State. So you can kick multiple Gens and all of them will be affected by Eruption once a Survivor is downed. And THEN the Cooldown starts. So in the end, the Cooldown is only 5 seconds longer than the time the Survivors are incapacitated.
Furthermore, the Gen keeps regressing while the Survivor is incapacitated, so there is a bit more progress lost than 10%.
@Topic:
I think old Ruin/Undying was worse, because paired with Tinkerer, it took ages to get it cleansed and being able to work on Gens AND finish them.
But Eruption is more obnoxious, since you cannot do anything for 25 seconds. With Ruin/Undying you at least were able to cleanse the Totems eventually. It was stronger overall, but less annoying to deal with IMO.
"less annyoing to deal with" I'd think you say this now, but probably didn't back then. Pretty sure I hated it back then especially when you had to find 4 totems. This new Eruption basically targets all reasons now why they nerfed Ruin back then. Annoying to go against, hard to counter expecially for new players and the insane pickrate. Eruption is probably not at 80% but still noticeably high to call it an unbalanced/unfair advantage
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@Xernoton said:
The killer meta changed massively. Instead of Ruin + Undying, Pop, Corrupt Intervention and Pain Res + DMS you see a lot more Eruption, Overcharge, Call of Brine etc. Slowdown is the new slowdown. Also BBQ got nuked back to stone age because we can't have a game health perk in the meta (probably the worst decision in this process).
Honestly though, its hardly surprising slowdown is still the go to for most killers. Gens now take 90 seconds in theory but with all the gen perks and other tools survivors have at their disposal to progress faster in a match this really doesn't do much.
Personally, I've never been to keen about slowdown perks but seeing how regularly I lose a match as killer in under 3 minutes, I'm questioning how long I can compete with more chase oriented builds.
Was already posted in here several times. You can talk about specific perks of course, but the "meta" kinda is "gen slowdown". And this is the same as before. Different perks picked to acuire the same result: gens taking longer. And also said that on survivor side, survivor meta is second chances. DS replaced by OTR for example. Same thing, different perks for the same result
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There were changes in meta, perkwise. Pain Res became less prominent, Eruption was a dead perk before, now is kinda meta.
There are no changes in meta, purposewise. And same on survivor side tbh. Killers still run slowdown and regression meta, survivors are still using second chance meta. There is almost no survivor playing without exhaustion perk, there is just less DH (although I noticed that there is more DH during the last weeks again). Also Unbreakable is like same pickrate, instead of DS there is now Off the Record. The only thing on survivor side that was not that common before is that now almost every team has 1-2 Prove or hyperfocus equipped.
There will never be a shakeup in meta, regarding playstyle, as long as the objectives and hook distribution keeps the same as is. It will always be slowdown vs second chance.
@RakimSockem said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3293387#Comment_3293387
Maybe it's just a mindset thing, but me and my friends DON'T bring the best. And I know that isn't representative of the community as a whole, but in general, I see a wide variety of non sweaty perks in use when I play both as survivor AND killer. When I say non-sweaty, I mean I run We'll Make, Any Means Necessary, Diversion, and Saboteur as my MAIN build. My back up build is Sabo, We'll Make It, For the People, WGLF.
But when I play killer and I main Huntress, I play BBQ, Iron Maiden, Darkness Revealed, and Lethal. And I do fine. Some games end in 2ks, the majority of them end with 3. You don't HAVE to play the most meta perks at all times is my point and while yes, those perks all work well for Huntress specifically, there's no gen regression in my build. My gameplay is reliant solely upon my skill in chase and my ability to find people quickly and get those hits. If I lose, I know it's because of my lack of skill and if I win, I know it's because I played well. Not because some perks carried me and stopped people from getting their objectives done FOR me
tbh your Huntress build IS kinda meta on her ^^ having good aura reading allows fast chases and crossmap downs which is equally good as slowdown like bringing slowdown perks.
@ByeByeQ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3293423#Comment_3293423
"All you can do is shake it up from time to time."
What a horribly flawed way to look at maintaining game. Sadly I think BHVR agrees with you.
But they do have another, better option. The can try to balance the game. I know it's a shocking idea, but hear me out.
They could divide perks into categories and then try to balance the perks in those categories. In the slowdown category they could have easily done this in 6.1.0 but not overnerfing Ruin and Pop and not overbuffing Eruption, Overcharge and Call of Brine. For Exhaustion perks they could buff Balanced Landing, Smash Hit, etc to bring them in line with Dead Hard and Sprint Burst.
We'd see much more varied loadouts if BHVR took this approach. Unfortunately they appear to be controlling the meta so players have to buy licensed DLC to get meta perks. This is especially evident when it comes to slowdown perks.
I played this game yesterday:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/TWOONDYUKSWF/image.png
It certainly didn't feel like the survivor meta has changed much.
I dont think that this would change a lot. If you talk about balance, then there is this vanilla game, without perks and items/addons, that needs to be the base. And NO additional equipment should artificially increase gen time nor chase time, because that is where the imbalance happens. bring better perks to pull time to your favor and that is what switches the outcome. Every perk would have to be a niche perk, not giving value in every game but in certain situations, that you probably need to setup by a certain playstyle. but in a balanced game there should be no meta perks like that, because these increase your chances of winning, no matter what. that's why they are meta.
@Blueberry said:
You see more variety in survivor perks because there's actually a lot of decent survivor perks and survivors aren't under a time crunch like killers so they have the flexibility to run "fun" perks for flavor.
Killers don't have that privilege against good survivors. They are on a time crunch. They have to run time efficient perks because they are on the clock. Also, most killer perks are just bad.
TLDR: What you're seeing is a symptom of bad map design which makes gens go too fast and forces killers to run certain things. Most killer perks are also just quite bad and undertuned.
Disagree a bit here, survivors are on a time crunch as well. If you don't have the first gen finished after the first hook and eat the Scourge hook + DMS, then you know already that this match might be pretty rough for survivors. Vs good killers I often notice that the first chase is the most important. If you get 2 gens done first chase, you have a chance. Otherwise it is most likely stalling at 2-3 gens left when you are more busy getting the unhooks/heals rather than working on gens, while eating all the slowdown
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Even more. Once I saw how Kindred revealed a shrouded Wraith to me. Also Wiretap showed me a killer aura while I was in a locker. There are several aura issues atm
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@Gorik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246858#Comment_3246858
The locker blinds I understand but it wasn't nearly as impactful as say medkits, people have seen the YT vids and tried to do it to me and I just slugged the heck out of them for it which worked fine. Again I understand though that it is somewhat and exploit that needs addressing, it just isn't something that was needed to be address by the Devs before other things that really need attention.
My group of friends is small as I started playing years before them, but playing with them has shown me how fast saves can be learnt.
Other then that my sample size is solo que experience and talking to people in end game chat and on forums.
Duo lockers are majorly broken. If you talk about what needs to be adressed, then you have 2 factors: frequency and impact. Impact is definitely a 10 out of 10 and as bad as other things like the infinite Reassurance which HAVE to go. If it has an impact of 1/10 but frequency of 10/10 then in all environments I know, the more impactful thing has the higher priority. The only things that are at a higher priority are things with also a 10 of 10 impact and a higher frequency, like the bug when survivors got stuck at the corner of the hill or when killers were glitched and not able to hook survivors.
Things like unbalanced maps are a well known and huge issue in the game, which means it has a frequency like 10/10. But the game is still playable even with unbalanced maps. The double locker scenario is simply a dead end for the killer. I would agree that map balancing is actually the higher priority, but especially in this case I guess the effort to solve this issue is like x100 compared to fixing locker abuse.
We can continue the list of validity/sample size arguments, like your post game chats only spread around your specific MMR and region. The thing I wanted to point out is, that you may surely have and say your opinion, but you can't rely on it and state it as fact. Which you didnt. I just wanted to say "different opinion here" and make clear that you might not have seen the whole picture yet. And BHVR probably has it, as they have stats to look at (surely discussable if their fixing priorities and stats analysis is good or bad, but they definitely have a bigger picture than we have)
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@Archol123 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246801#Comment_3246801
There are even rare sights of people pulling off a full heal during a chase and not just a syringe... I'm pretty sure using a syringe in chase is possible in most games against M1 killers...
Like I said not a complete loss, of course it is bad... but at least you get something out of it...
No we should not... We should never accept unfun things in games and always try to improve the game itself as well as the mentality while playing it... And one of the most boring things in the game is just getting tunneled off the hook, so no matter what behaviour thinks about it I would still say it is an issue... They even adressed it in some patches, just because it is not a reportable offense does not mean they themselves think it is a healthy game mechanic...
Ok good for them, I still don't think that's the point but whatever grinds their gears I guess... Like I said before if it could only be used outside of chase it would still not be entirely fine but better than it is right now.
Im not talking about "possible". I said in my experience it is like 1 of 5. If you waste 4 chases by losing too much distance and wasting your ultra rare addon to get one good effect, then this is not really a problem. And as I said, I get also other responses that the "free heal" is the problem.
I'm not saying this is not strong, Im just saying that I think syringe hate is legacy and the current item is far from "it has to go". If we discuss about "unfun" things, then killers are not allowed to kill and survivors are not allowed to escape. This is extremely subjective. Unbalanced and unfair things have to go, as well as majorly flawed design as FL locker abuse, mori spamming or Reassurance hostage, which all disappeared. If we talk about unfun, we would have to remove DH, DS, boons, NOED, latency hits, Nurse and Blight, teabagging, hook beating and nodding, body blocking...
How do you want to adress tunneling? As long as the game is as it is, it will ALWAYS be the best thing to do, as a 3v1 is much easier to handle than a 4v1. You need to change the core of the game (which will not happen) or need an incentive/reward for hooking everyone once that is equally strong to the killer as playing a 3v1
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@Gorik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246403#Comment_3246403
I hear you, but it is still not necessary in my opinion, most people that I play with, including Randoms, seem to be getting the blinds just fine even with the correction click gone.
Is the group of people you know and play with big enbough of an example size to say that it is valid to call out such a thing?
I think learning flashlight saves is a pretty rough thing to learn, if not the hardest on survivor side. I think even looping is easier to learn (excluding having to learn every killer power to know appropriate counterplay).
And locker saves were necessary to go. The pure existence of double lockers giving immunity to 2 survivors with a flashlight each is pretty much the definition of a design flaw. Giving complete locker blind immunity might be a bit over the top, but in my opinion still better than having double locker abuse in the game
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I like the idea. I like running calm spirit as well, there is so much in the game now so that Calm Spirit is useful in many games (killer powers like Freddy snares, doc as you mentioned, Clown gas, , as well as perks like Infectious Fright, Iron Maiden, Dragons Grip, Eruption, Pain Res, Deathbound and even addons on plague, nurse, onryo, again doc...)
I ran it several times before prestige update, when I prestiged my survivors and didn't have all my comfy perks ready at new level 50. Made me run some lowpick perks just to try something new and Calm Spirit was one of the highlights :D equal to Urban Evasion which has less noticeable value in most games but is godlike when you go against Hag, or versus ranged Killers (Trickster, Huntress, Nemi) to allow you fast crouching around corners and staying hidden until you leave the hip-high area of some loops.
Giving these perks an extra effect seems nice to shake up the meta a bit more. And first sight I would say it is not too harsh to steal the information part on these perks.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246719#Comment_3246719
Oftentimes you will have the time to do exactly that, as some tiles offer you the time to wait and look what the killer is doing. Usually the people use it either after dropping a pallet or when they loose line of sight in a tile. I think it is almost always possible to use a styptic mid chase without much trouble...
When you come back to the hook and go for the same person again you kind of deserve to get hit by stuff like that... You have 10 seconds of BT with 110% ms in which you should not really get hit anyway unless the killer was right next to you during the unhook, and if he hits you during the bt time you'll just get rid of the deep wound... If people would complain that it is too hard to effectively tunnel people off of the hook they kind of deserved to be made fun of...
Besides I find the styptic also annoying but at least I can somewhat ignore it... For once its duration does not get affected by anything and also even if you find a window in time the only reason you might want to hit the survivor in that case is because you think it might be a syringe... And even if i hit into it at least the survivor has to mend, so even if it works it is not a complete loss for me...
Well, my experience is that neither survs against me nor I can pull midchase heals that often, feels more like every 5th time.
And it IS a complete loss for you, at least I wouldn't define a 12 second mend compared to a lost chase + hook state as "not a loss". Or do you consider a successful DH as "not a loss" when you could have outplayed it instead?
And while I kinda agree with Second Wind helping out in situations like that, I disagree with calling it "deserved". I think with the current meta (and age of the game) we should be over the point of blaming officially accepted strategies.
Btw on another thread where I said that mid chase heals are more difficult, I got multiple responses that the problem is the free heal, allowing survviors to instantly hop on gens and save 16 seconds of healing time :P
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@Archol123 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246461#Comment_3246461
That's a completely different thing... The reason why syringe is hated is because you can use it in chase, not because it saves you 16 seconds... When you're playing an M1 Killer against sb. with a syringe it can be really rough... So first of all you don't know if it is a syringe or a styptic, so for like the first 8 seconds you cannot hit him without the risk of it beeing a styptic, during that time with increased healing speed he can already be fully healed by the syringe, which makes it even more ridiculous and after that he only needs to last for like 8 seconds... Which is not too hard in some places of some maps...
If you want to keep the addon in the game I would at least have it take more time to heal and not being able to be used while in chase or shortly after chase ended... Because that's why people really hate that addon...
I said that already before, healing in chase causes you to stop, then it takes a second before the healing prompt appears and then you still need to start healing and press space which might take x milli seconds, and that buys time for the killer. a second of just standing is 4m of less distance the killer needs to cut, which is a lot. It is not that easy to heal midchase.
And btw, you could bring this argument too for Second Wind, because if the killer returns to you after the unhook, you get healed midchase. Still haven't heard any killer complain about it. Same about styptics? You get the free hit instantly and all you need is a window to vault within 8 seconds to force the killer hit you. No complaints either
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@Archol123 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3246159#Comment_3246159
Don't you need to heal a person beforehand? At least that has a condition, the other stuff does not... So at the least the condition makes it so you won't always get value out of it...
Yeah but once a match it should normally work, and you don't have to get out of your way to force value. You just play the game and on average get 1 heal per game. Basically the same as a syringe with the potential to be twice as good. If the free heal is the problem, then Second Wind would be a game changer and heavily discussed. But in numbers it only saves you 16 seconds that you can spend on a gen instead, which would be the same like a toolbox that finishes a gen 16 seconds faster.
I think the syringe hate is just "legacy" from what it used to be (which was definitely OP)
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@The_Krapper said:
Actually it helps and hurts , sure it can be easier to some but it may cause a lot of people to be too early on their saves if the window to blind is increased because you cant blind while the animation is locked so something that may have been a save before may not be
I dont think this can happen. It is about the delay you are granted now, if you were too early, the pickup animation will finish and then you get the save. If it was a save before, it will still be a safe after the change
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Disagree. I enjoy playing with and against tombstone Myers. Normally it is clear that he has it and you can dodge it by keep working on a gen or jump in lockers, if some randoms get moried, it becomes difficult but still challenging to get around it. Tombstone is no insta loss, especially because many Myers players focus too hard on it and lose a lot of pressure on gens doing so.
Agreed with syringe to be not effected by healing speeds, because normally it doesnt grant you an in-chase heal. Having to stop for a second and use it normally gives the killer enough time to catchup and down you quickly enough. But with green medkit and botany you are already at 8 seconds. This should not be possible. And having a single free heal per match is not that OP. Strong but not "needs to be removed"-level OP. Never heard anyone complain about Second wind, allowing up to 2 free heals without timeloss
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the best match making so far was BP based. as far as I remember.
but I think the MMR system might work at least somehow. the problem is the "soft cap" thing they explained which means that at (if I remember correctly and the info is trustful) MMR 1600 basically means that you can get matched with everyone at 1600+
And this is the same issue that emblem match making had, where basically 80% of the playerbase was consistently reaching red ranks and therefore 80% of the playerbase were matched vs each other
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@FizzieSprite said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3203422#Comment_3203422
Absolutely not. Read through some of the other forums: hundreds of killers, including myself, are planning to uninstall this shitshow fiasco if it ever goes live. Any Killer main with enough braincells to catch an urban evading meg can see that this is ridiculous and should not happen. Majority are leaving, again, including myself.
that was spiced with a lot of irony. although I really think that the killers that stay will tunnel even harder than they do now
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Nah everything will be fine. Killers will keep playing. They will just do what they are forced to do. It will be the survivors that quit. There are enough tools and basekit changes now to counter everything "fair" the killer can do to get pressure on survivors. Split hooks, split damage, pressure gens/multiple survivors... the only efficient way to play killer now will be hard tunneling.
The only pressure you can get is forcing an early 3v1. And since it does not make any difference if you hit the unhooker twice or the unhooked with his 80 sec Endurance, basically being an insta unhook health state, it is just logical to go for the guy that is closer to death hook, when both chases will take equally long.
And that's how it's gonna be. Deadlock, Pain Res, Corrupt and NOED, just to get as much time as possible, and then hook survivor A,A,A, then B,B,B and so on. I always smiled at people yelling that DBD is gonna die. Such a game doesn't die so fast, thesy really need to F* up. But that's how it feels to me now for the first time. Like they intentionally F* up, like they want to kill the game. They always had strange decision making and explaining the opposite intention of what their changes actually do. But this patch now is beyond my understanding...
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First: 50 seconds of extra gen time is A LOT. Old Thana was viable and did way less than extra 50 seconds. I think it is clear how painful old Pop was, that required 3 kicks to get an equal amount of slowdown. Eating 6-8 full pop regressions was a pretty unwinnable game in most scenarios. The problem with the recent changes is at a different spot.
- Btw it is not "literally 1 second", it is literally 2,25 seconds (or dont use the word literal just for fashion reasons, not even sure if you can use "literally" for a number). and this is enough to damage the gen over time if 2 survivors try to rubber band it
- and the 10% buff is actually a nerf to STBFL because each stack gives you less noticeable value than before and rage quits always have been a thing, old kill rates are based on them too.
- Meta will always be gen slowdown vs gen rush / chase extension, each side wants to buy time because DBD is a race, who gets their objective done quicker? This is the natural meta and will always be as long as there are perks doing this. Removing every second chance and every gen slowdown from the perk list is the only way to change it, otherwise you will just exchange the perks that try to do the same effect.
They showed some stats, also here on the forum. I think killer kill rate went up from ~50% to ~60% or something. In my personal opinion the last midchapter increased the hard tunneling and the meta to contain 1-2 Prove Thyself and/or Hyperfocus+Stakeout.
So basically it got worse. The new Unbreakable basekit will also increase tunneling even further because this is another level of pressure taken away from the killers options so spreading damage and spreading hooks is not rewarded in any way and getting kills will only be achievable by tunneling, since forcing an early 3v1 is the only viable way that is left to pressure survivors. Just a rough guess
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@kizuati said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3196552#Comment_3196552
I'd argue second stage proxy camping with dead lock is still extremely strong.
it is, but reassurance with comms or kindred on the hooked guy will completely counter that
@kizuati said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3196552#Comment_3196552
But why ever wait it out? With every second killer running STBFL and quite a few survivors using DH it's incredibly beneficial to just hit them and if not just force them to mend,but also go on to tunnel them.
On the topic of it not doing anything while you're camped and tunneled - that is my point. OTR does not promote fun gameplay.
I think this is exactly what I said, right? Tunneling is harder, but makes more sense, because waiting out the BT isn't worth it anymore and therefore you have the option to chase a survivor that needs 2 hits or a survivor that ... needs 2 hits, to go down.
#########? Why does OTR not promote fun gameplay? Does DS promote fun gameplay? BT? These are perks to counter unfun tactics. Does Reassurance promote anything? Does Dead Hard promote fun or unfun? No idea what you mean here
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He cant shut down small loops, loops need to be decently long so it makes sense to vault them, otherwise you will make it to the vault again without risk.
His mobility is not even close to "extremely fast". He has a charge time where he slows down and a recovery after that. He is faster than regular but NOTHING compared to Blight or Billy, even still slower than Legion, Spirit, Onryo, Freddy...
Thrown into the corner? Well, if you let him catch you in a corner... Bubba can instadown you when you are in a corner of the map. This is called game sense or awareness to get out of there in time. He has a 40m terror radius, your choice if you stick to an unsafe area.
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Hmmmmmm tons of echoes of "D34D HarD is D-E-D" resound through my head... xD
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Off The Record does nothing if you are camped AND tunneled, otherwise 80 seconds is insanely strong. If you just roughly manage to start a good chase without dropping pallets because you are safe and AFTER the hit start dropping pallets as well, you can waste so much time.
Regarding tunneling: the tools to counter tunneling got so strong that it literally doesn't make sense for several situations to not tunnel. If you get the hook exchange, it will make sense to take it as killer, but also most likely you will be good to chase the unhooked survivor afterwards. And if the unhook goes through before you can get the hit, it basically doesn't matter who you chase regarding chase time, because you will need 2 hits anyway. As it makes no sense to wait out BT (it can be 10s, 20s or 80s and there is no value in waiting out to know if the unhooker had BT or not) as killer you just hit the unhooked survivor. 2 hits on unhooker or 2 hits on unhooked is the same, so pick the one that got a hook state less until sacrifice.
So regarding it with this POV, tunneling got harder because you can't wait out the BT or have a chance to not have an endurance protection. But it is more valuable because it makes no difference regarding chase time.
@OnryosTapeRentals said:
Tunneling and camping were optimal strategies before, and they're even more optimal strategies now.
It's the easiest way to secure a kill.
I find tunneling much more prevalent in my patches post 6.1.0.
Camping was never a valuable strategy unless survivors rewarded you to do so by leaving all the gens and the team staring at the hooked person without going for the unhook. With Reassurance and Kindred being more common perks it would even be a bad strategy today and could outplay camping Deadlock killers.
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@DBDVulture said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3194710#Comment_3194710
You seem to have some anger issues. Also several of your points are not clear in your previous post.
Nemesis is a joke cmpared to Nurse/Blight. If I queue with Blight I can get the same kill level of people that I get with Nurse or Nemesis. That's stupid unless the killers are equal in skill.
Nemesis would be fine as is with a handicap - cant play against more than 2 ppl in a swf. He is for sure better than trapper but not good enough to handle large maps or SWF. Both together is a nightmare.
Well, if you read anger in my posts I dont know what you are reading.
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@DBDVulture said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3192553#Comment_3192553
-"I don't know why you compare Nemesis to nurse"
Nurse lost the busted addons this patch so once again it is fair to play against her. That being said SWF got stronger this patch with the rework of all gen slow down perks. Nurse needs to exist as a strong killer as long as SWF exists with no penalty or restrictions.
Nemesis might be "OK" enough with just an addon shuffle if he were unable to play against SWF teams. But that's not how the game works.
-"The game should be balanced around M1 killers."
You're joking right? The M1 killers primarily speaking are some of the worst killers in the game and survivors want to go against them because it is a guarantee of an easy win. If we balance the game around M1 killers then no map can be larger than 9000m². Likewise there can never be more than 12 pallets and at most each map will have 1 "god" pallet and 6 Unsafe pallets +5 safe pallets.
The opposing argument is SWF groups should only play against Nurse or Blight. No I'm not actually suggesting that but it would make SWF fair in its current form.
"I dont think that it is that easy to dodge his tentacle strike. do you only try hits open field?"
Open field hits are actually the hardest place to score a hit against good survivors because they can go in any direction to dodge.
I play Nemesis a lot so I know how to bait tentacle hits and I know how to hit people on loops they think they are safe. But I see some survivors who are almost impossible to whip. Some of them are just absolute mad lads.
I got 99% of my rank ups for blood point rewards this year playing Nemesis so I know how to play him.
- Any nurse reference has nothing to do with this topic
- Did you even read my post?! I said M1 should be what to balance around but the maps are a problem. So yeah, Im not joking. The solution is not to design busted killers but to balance maps. Then you don't need nurse
- Again, did you even read me? Of course are open field hits hard, that's not where you T-strike survivors! gawddammit xD And if that is the problem for you, there is no problem because survivors in open fields are heaven for killers. Cuz map design is unbalanced. Read what I write and at least try to think about that for a second
- And if you got 99% of your rankups with Nemi, it doesn't seem like he is that weak as you want to make him look like. And you just want your fav killer to be buffed just to get even easier games
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@DBDVulture said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3186854#Comment_3186854
Remember when that boon came out that said it gives you 2% speed? Every survivor main said - nobody cares it's 2% speed.
When you play against PH you can choose to never become tormented. When you are good at dodging you can almost always dodge a whip attack from Nemesis or waste so much time that it was not worth it.
-"but giving all the other effects for free? really?"
Nurse and Blight are the strongest killers in the game with no buildup required. They are the killers that should have buildup. Make Blight start with 3 stacks and give him +1 every time he does a bounce rush and hits someone. That would be a huge nerf to a killer that is what most people call : way too strong.
Likewise make the Nurse hit people 6 times with a single blink before she ever gets access to a second blink. That too would nerf her significantly.
-"its not like he stays useless like a myers until he first reaches tier 2"
But here you are saying yea Nemesis would be a problem if he got buffed. No he wouldn't. The Zombie aspect of Nemesis's power is a joke. Overall that part of the power does something useful about one in five games when you consider all the giant maps and maps where the zombies repeatedly get stuck. If Off the record didn't or Sprint Burst didn't work 20% of the time there would be a patch fixing it within one week
If you take this one addon then Killer XYZ can have an ok game. Ok well do you not see the problem with that? Nemesis isn't Nurse; if you need an addon to make his power accessible then that should probably just be a part of his base kit. See Ghostface and Legion rework ideas for why certain addons were removed and folded into the base kit.
yeah... I totally disagree with most things. I don't know why you compare Nemesis to nurse. Nurse is a problem because she ignores everything survivors use to protect and will always be a problem in the state she is as long as she isnt't nerfed to a point where she can't blink (which is kinda what you suggest). She already got nerfed like "she cant blink as often as before" and everyone was like "nurse dead now" and look where we are now. Still the same as before, aren't we? So I don't argue on that part.
Just in short: The game should be balanced around M1 killers. But if you balance around M1 killers, you will notice that maps are the main problem. Therefore they fix it with killers that have anti loop powers and the closer you get that anti loop to nurse, the worse it will be for game health. I don't say Nemesis will be a problem if he got buffed. I'm saying it will be a problem if he gets buffed too hard. You listed 4 effects and adding all of these will not be just a slight buff and can easily get out of hand.
Not sure how exactly your next points are related to Nemesis hindered effect, so the following is basically offtopic I guess.
- I dont care what people say when something is new, they also said on PH "the telegraph! you will never be able to hit with his ranged" until they noticed this is mainly a zoning tool. I don't agree that 2% is nothing. it helps only on certain loops, yes. shack for example is easier to play because if you mess up the timing the boon gives you back a bit to compensate. and 2% is hard to notice, if the killer doesn't notice, it messes up with hit timing on when to go for lunge attacks, especially on vaults and pallets
- yeah you can chose to never get tormented, but that (in my experience) gives the killer just a bunch of free hits as you have to run into the open and PH is still faster than you while trailing.
- I also disagree that zombies are useless. They are buggy sometimes but that is a bug. and pls let's not start the "BHVR is survivor sided" discussion here. it is a bug and everything needs to be fixed. you just don't notice the effect of zombies regularly. If I play against Nemesis, zombies can be annoying AF, more regularly than not in my experience
- Where did I say that you need an addon to have OK games? I just said that it is pretty easy to get to tier 2 because you need just to hit 2 separate survivors or with addon the first chase already gets you there. This is both pretty fast. (Nemesis addons are overall pretty lame btw, he could use a pass, imho it doesnt change a lot if you play him addonless)
- I dont think that it is that easy to dodge his tentacle strike. do you only try hits open field? as soon as there are any obstacles right next to the survivor you can zone them. they cant dodge into the wall so you can make them dodge into your strike, while you can still strafe during the attack and move the hitbox into the obstacle. as you describe it, it sounds that it is almost impossible to ever land a hit, like a new billy that tries to land chainsaws at 20m distance
To sum up: Im not saying Nemesis is the strongest killer in the game. But I think people underestimate several effects when discussing about buffs and just point out single numbers or effects and forget about several side effects or the total picture.
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3187834#Comment_3187834
There's a couple things that may be contributing to that. For instance, the game build up confidence in your rating the longer you play. When you start out, it radically adjusts your rating each time you win and lose, but over time, it adjusts your rating less. This is because the game's trying to get a feel for where you should be, then trying to fine tune it the longer you play (since you're typically not going to get rusty overnight). However, big balance changes can cause your escape rate to drop, and it will take some time for the system to adjust.
Outside of that, there's some other conditions that can cause your rating to decrease slower than normal. For example, if you are the last Survivor to die, your rating will be adjusted less than if you were the first. Or if the Killer's rating is significantly higher than yours, the game expects you to have a lower chance of Survival so you'll lose less rating if you die.
If this is how it works, would it be an idea to losen the strictness of MMR adjustments at least a bit after each midchapter/chapter? Because everyone needs to adjust and especially people that stop playing for a few months might be confronted with a big bunch of changes.
Like new killers that you don't play against from the beginning but when most of them already got a feeling on how to use the power while you don't even know how the power works nor which addons are available. Speaking of addons, also when perks are reworked and you get info, explosions, blocked gens and status effects of perks that you barely saw before last patch
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@DBDVulture said:
The Nemesis Licker Tongue addon should impose a 2% speed penalty until you are "not blue" anymore.
Likewise the NE-a Parasite should make you oblivious until cured.
Nemesis was delivered in a state where he would never really be viable vs good players because his anti loop requires you to hit someone three times. If they gave him a complete rework of his addons, fixed the zombie AI and changed his whip then he might be "ok".
Infection not giving a speed boost would help.
Letting Nemesis always be able to break pallets with his whip would help
Zombies giving Nemesis infection progress would help.
Letting Nemesis give infection & injury with tier 3 whip would also make perfect sense as he has to build up to that point.
THis already might already be busted because you have, unlike Healing sprays with Wesker, a very limited amount of cures through the match, which means like half way through the match the entire team runs at perma hindered, which is a big thing for a 115% killer
Btw I think his anti loop is way stronger at pallets when you dont hit the survivor but insta break the pallet. No waiting for the drop until you may kick it, being able to at least move a bit, not stuck on the pallet during the animation + no speedboost for the survivor to force him use the next pallet available. Nemesis is equally strong at shredding pallets as Bubba.
injure + infect at tier 3 makes sense as you have to build up to that point, but giving all the other effects for free? really? I mean he only needs 2 hits on separate survivors to reach tier 2, its not like he stays useless like a myers until he first reaches tier 2. even with the one addon for more progress on survivor infection, the first survivor hit 3 times is enough to reach tier 2
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@FeryGEN said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3185173#Comment_3185173
Joke, hohoho, I would understand that this is a joke, if it was a reference to at least some streamer, jokes should be in obvious things or funny
Then I would like to make the addon more interesting, not hindered, but interesting.
Just Nemesis main meeting what kind of survivors they usually meet?
1. Who are thrown pre-drop
2. Who use zombies to get infected and run away on boost
Therefore, a solution is needed, although so that zombies do not give speed boost when infected.
- I think it was obvious (I even would say the "period" lol "period" notation were intended)
- why th does it need a streamer reference? is DBD only related to streamers?
not sure what your list is explaining. what does predropping has to do with the hindered effect? and I think survivors granting free infection without you being slowed for using your power is a benefit for the killer, unless he has an exposed effect active. The only thing where it really hurts is when you are still in tier 1
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@Malkhrim said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/346389/nemesis-hindered-is-awful-now
Not to mention Licker's Tongue, the ONLY add-on that actually makes his tentacle lash stronger... only increases it by 0.2 seconds. Like, wow, a fifth of a second more of a hindered effect, who cares. It manages to be one of his worst add-ons even though almost all of them are bad.
By the way, his Hindered Effect is not THAT small. According to the Wiki, 20%. The problem is, they still get a speed boost, so all the hindered effect does is making a survivor run for either 130% (if Hindered is additive) or 120% (if it's multiplicative) movement speed for 0,25 seconds. So yeah, it makes a laughably small difference.
I think it will be 120% because it is like that in almost every case.
120% movement speed for 0.25s gets you 1.2m away. add 0.2s of 100% speed is another 0,8m which is 2m total distance for a normal tentacle strike hit.
Using the addon will get you 2.16m away in 0.45s so an additional 0.16m which is truly a really minor effect. But the hindered effect itself steals the survivor 0.3m and with the addon steals 0.54m compared to a normal hit without hindered, and don't forget that Nemesis has half a second less cooldown after a tentacle hit compared to a normal hit. That adds up, you can't just look at the pure numbers of the hindered effect only. It is not much, but it is not nothing either
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@FeryGEN said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3185023#Comment_3185023
Oh my god dude, You are probably the only one on the forum who thought about this perk, but I will tell you why, because you just read the topic, but did not read the description.
I think that Nemesis should have the power of the addon (Licker Tongue) in basekit, and on the addon either add more slowdown for the non-infected, or rework it and make it break generators with a tentacle by 3.5% and call zombies to this generator. Killer addons that somehow affect generators and pallets have always been more popular, if only because it's interesting.
and you have no sense of humour, I guess you belong to the minority that didnt get that
But anyway I think the post is a trolling attempt. Why would you want hindered to get nerfed. Free distance for what? Tentacle hits are already lower cooldown than regular M1 hits, kinda like hatchets
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At first: for killer adepts you need a double pip, as far as I know you don't need a 4k. SUre, a 4k gives you at least 1 more emblem points, so you can miss that point on other emblems. Just for info.
In general, maybe take a look into the emblems on the wiki page to understand how you need to play. And tunneling the first guy out is totally fine, you dont need to spread hooks as long as 4 survivors are alive. Tunneling the second guy would be the problem, because when you only have 2 survivors left and both are not hooked yet, you might get only 1-2 hooks from possible 6, which hurts 3 of your emblems.
As already said: insta downs hurt your chaser emblem (or was it malicious?). So for billy for example, use it as mobility only, but also if you want to slug while you have multiple survivors around, because you rely on getting the multiple hits to get enough emblem points. But slugging is generally the "counter" to missing emblem points when you use insta downs.
Unluckily you can request help for every killer seperately, because everyone has its own addon combo to support either your perks or add missing gen control/tracking. I would suggest to run brown/yellow addons for the first few matches and get used to the killer (I guess you are not mastering every killer yet with 800 hours) and then see how you can work with the kit you are given and how to adjust for the adept. Because I guess you don't have a bunch of iri addons and the perfect map offerings on every killer available for multiple attempts. So I would give it some tries before and then use the best addons when you feel comfy.
Regarding the best addons, every killer is unique. But you can ask here if you struggle with anyone. I read already that you should't use GF stalking at all to get enough emblem points for example. This may be true, so one of his most useful addons would be faster power recovery to get your stealth ready as soon as possible for more free surprise attacks. But on the other hand, driver's licence can be extremely nuts if you can get that to work, so combining this with "Philly" for faster stalk might also be a good option.
Or on Myers, scratched mirror might be the way to go which now works best on RPD. But you need to practice that. You can't chase survivors. As long as they know where you are and following in a straight line, you will never catch up on that map. You need to hit&run, do a lot of surprise attacks, catch them while healing or doing totems etc. Demo has pretty strong yellow/brown addons like shred recovery after hit/miss/pallets but his best addon for adept is probably the iri arua reading, as your perks dont give you that, as well as the whistle, so you get a lot of information. For pig, you have a nice Corrupt-like addon for slow early game. Combine Video Tape with Ruleset No2 so they have to either risk their traps activated (and having 2-3 active traps in play completely stalls the gen progress) or they need to invest some time in the beginning to find the boxes without seeing their auras. Even better if you find them while doing that, so they need to go on with taht after unhook.
Just try some basic matches with good addons which you have a lot of and see how the perks work for you, maybe you even get the adept in these matches already. Otherwise try to find the best combo after that, or ask here for tips.
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@Wezil said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3178839#Comment_3178839
And the reason I say this is because, if the game had good game health, there wouldn't be DC issues.
The game health is not the problem when people DC against a Freddy that got them down within 15 seconds.
So: No
If a single person just doesnt feel like going against nurses, this is not justifying ruining the game for 3-4 other people
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@Akumakaji said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3179101#Comment_3179101
Yeah, but Eruption is one of us killers perks, so its noble and precious and must be protected, while your Wiretap is a survivor perk and debased and despicable.
Jokes aside, Wiretap has the potential to be really strong. Strong perls aren't a bad thing, but Kindred plus Open Handed has shown me how OP longlasting wallhacks are and how much it trivialises looping and renders all of the killers mindgames void, because there are no mindgames.
I still love the idea, but 80s wallhacks are a dangerous idea. I would like something like a Wiretap symbol on each survivors screen that acted like the cat from Spine Chill, ie shows proximity of the killer in relation to the gen, but not outright wallhacks. I think this would also be more in line with the "lore" behind it, ie some spy gadget that peeps, but no x-ray vision. With this you could also have a comfortable radius.
Regarding Blastmine, yeah that was a totally uncalled for and harsh nerf, and I am not saying that because I am an avid Blastmine user myself. Everytime I get hit by a Blastmine myself I jerk back and then smile a little and think "well played". Even with the old system you rarely got two successful Blastmines off. Best bet was when you were chased off a 80%+ gen to leave it there as a parting gift and even then the killer might chose to chase you for its entire duration. But right now with it fizzling out and wasting 59s of gen time? Oof, thats harsh for just a little stun in a non-critical situation.
Tofu had a theory that this "bugfix/nerf" is just an accidential change that came inline with the new perk as it used the same mecahnic behind to trigger or whatever
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@Hensen2100 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3179031#Comment_3179031
I think it's amazing tbh. Especially with a map offering? On Temple of Purgation the downstairs gen was giving wallhacks on the killer upstairs and i'm sure that will translate well to maps like Midwich, The Game, or other multifloor maps.
Or maybe some Wiretap + Shadowstep on Lery's? That would be insanely safe assuming you don't have to leave the totem to get an unhook or something
Can be combined with Repressed alliance to keep your radar active and the killer cant kick it. And I love Wiretap on multi floor maps because it tells you if the killer approaches you or is on a different level. That saves so much gen time. And knowing from where the killer approaches if he really approaches you also helps just not running into him. A better Premonition perk imho
Of course it can be difficult to work on trapped gens then ^_^' although wiretap is available earlier, so you could install the radar a second before repressed alliance activates
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
Every day I'm reminded that not everyone is blessed enough to be a homosexual with posts like these and I do not like it
I think there are homo sexuals that could write an equal post about David. This has nothing to do with sexual orientation
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Not too often. Currently I run brown medkits with syringe and gloves and hope for that one great skillcheck so I can get 2 heals out of a brown medkit. But I do that as 2-heal medkits is generally all you need, emergency medkits with 3-4 heals normally never get fully used unless you deny your mates to heal you.
Mostly I try to save rare/ultra rare for challenges or dailes so I can get better chances to quickly get them done in case I dont want to play too many games with a challenge or build I dont really want to play.
On killer side, this totally depends. There are a lot of killers that need rare addons or have fun builds with them like Myers or Wraith, some like on survivors where I mostly save them for challenges (like gen/pallet kick speed with Wraith) or some killers where I barely play them because they are either crap (most Hemorrage or Oblivious addons like Nemi) or the killer has totally fine brown/yellow addons like Wesker or Demo.
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@Xord said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3177688#Comment_3177688
"I love when things like that are removed for game health and therefore I would appreciate when there is nothing brought into the game that basically will extend most games for no value"
Then why are you asking for a healthy change NOT to be made in this case?
Don't "im 90% survivor" if you're going out of your way to prevent survivors for having an oversight not fixed. Chill. Just let us use deliverance. If you don't think it's a good perk, no one is forcing you to use it. Just don't use it. But leave us deliverance users alone.
I think nothing in this post met anything I was typing before xD
I did NOT say that Deliverance is a bad perk, I said that using it as last option while being last survivor is a waste of time and the only occurrence helping out is when you combine it with another perk, but then forcing killers to stare you to death for a possible DS even if you don't have it, and picking you up a second time. The change you request is forcing a lot of time waste in 99 of 100 games, maybe even more.
That's why I said it is an UNHEALTHY change, affecting WAY more games negatively then positively. I always hated already when I didn't have DS pre-nerf but killers still stared at me, being afraid of the nonexistent stun. You would get that in every game when you pick that perk to escape the hook. Btw for consistency you would need to allow the 4% in that scenario as well, right? If that happens, don't you think that killers will just stay in front of you and wait for the kobe? In how many games do you think you would get away with your Deliverance as last survivor?
And how am I going out of my way? If Im survivor main, do I have to agree with every buff? I "90% survivor main" you because you "salty killer main" others. And I explained now twice why I don't think this is a fix to anything
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@Xord said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3174025#Comment_3174025
Litterally nobody asked to revert the change. We're asking to change how it is now.
Just because it needs to be changed doesn't mean it needs to be changed like it was before.
I did make the effort to give one example of how it could be: Being hooked gives 5 seconds to attempt one unhook. If you don't, you die.
It's... Actually stupid to go P2 when being hooked for the first time as the last survivor. Just go from P1 to death?
you still request a change that will only work if you pair it with a second perk, which will cause killers to stare at the hook and wait for it to happen and this is a waste of time for both sides in 99.99% of the time. and as you insinuated salty killer mains already: Im 90% survivor main and dislike a lot of changes like that.
for example the reassurance nerf was necessary. I Loved it on PTB how it massively was able to counter camping, but having 2 reassurance in game allowing to keep you on hook forever is simply a design mistake which should not exist. same as mori spamming that allowed killers to prevent bleedout. hatch standoff was boring aF. I love when things like that are removed for game health and therefore I would appreciate when there is nothing brought into the game that basically will extend most games for no value
@kingcarl2012 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3175818#Comment_3175818
As everyone on your team is getting 3 hooked, and you have deliverance ready to go, you never thought gee maybe i should take one for the team to get some pressure off. Especially since you know you can get off the hook yourself thats pretty crappy teamwork, and you making a selfish decision.
Nope sorry at that point you dont deserve to get off the hook.
the killer always has the option to ignore you, that is not in your hand. some killers even down you to still go for the deadhook guy, especially if you grant the killer a free down to force a hook. having one down and one needing to go for heal while chasing your death hook prey makes 3 survivors off gens while you try to get to the 3v1
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btw survival category gives 7k for escaping and since last patch, where they added a lot of survival scores, I regularly get BP for eswcaping and still 1-3k when dying. I dont think survival BP is still that hard to do
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because gen greats BP were buffed, when they nerfed the bonus progression from +2% to +1% of gen time, due to the gen speed nerf when they also nerfed toolboxes etc and Ruin from hex skillchecks to auto regression. the increased BP reward was to incentive still doing great skillchecks
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First: I think there are always survivors that give up for no real reason. Like Going against nurse, even Legion and whatever. Some people DC against every killer when they go down within 10 seconds. Some DC against exposed addons. You will never fix that. Some even DC when they go down and see that right in that second noone is working on gens
Second: the warping is something I already dislike on Phead. Yeah, fixes camping. But this is the same strange solution like making survivors invisible to be not tunnelable or something like that. It doesnt fit into the game designwise. Feels clunky.
Another note: I dont have your experience regarding matchmaking. I mostly run into Chuck Norris. So I agree that DS should revert to 5 seconds and even think that it should activate on every hook. Not too sure about the basekit because I think the basekit BT makes the perk obsolete already. And there are enough tools to play around camping. But the issue is, you cant adjust the game around your experience because this is not what everyone experiences. The problem is MMR and matchmaking (and map balancing). I stopped saving randoms during endgame because I regularly get left behind, by scared survivors and people leaving while I'm on hook first stage and all 4 people still alive. This drains my MMR and I get to play with people with even less experience and never get out of there. Escape/Death is such a bad spot to build an MMR on... I think the emblem system would be better if it would be tweaked a bit. Had a topic on that as well some time ago.
The major thing to adress would be to reward the killer to go for hooks, rather than punishing quick for kills. Like survivors hooked for the first time need a noticeable unrevertable debuff in any way, so you want everyone hooked once quickly. Or there was already a good idea around like not having personal 3 hook states but a trialwide hook counter. And a survivor dies when he was hooked at least once and there are 7 hooks in the game. So it doesnt matter if you hook this or that survivor, it even would be better to hook the guy that hasnt been hooked yet, to give him the debuff and make sure his next hook is possibly his death hook
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I think it is based on whatever is needed. There is no specific rule for region or time of day, because there is no rule when people are online and which role they play. This is only probability. I think the only thing that makes sense is MMR and that seems to be true because I got a 100% survivor boost while my brother had a 50% killer boost at the same time. He is killer main, Im survivor main, so we most likely have different MMR in each role.
If there are many mid MMR killers and many high MMR survivors currently, then mid MMR survivor will get incentives and high MMR killers will get incentives. Not sure what happens if you, in this scenario, are a mid MMR survivor and high MMR killer. Pretty sure you wont get both, but the one that is more necessary. But no idea
And to add to OP's situation: I also had 100% survivor boost for the whole day, the boost of my brother is varying and sometimes jumping from killer to survivor within 10 minute cycles
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3153039#Comment_3153039
BHVR listens to killer mains because they're the most vocal. I can't believe he actually believes it was beneficial for survivors to force themselves into a 3v1 lmao.
Tell me you face camp every game without telling me you face camp every game energy.
Killers complain about second chance perks then get a second chance on all the time they lost over committing to one survivor with slowdown perks.
Killers whine about survivors getting rewarded with "free escapes" then face camp the baby meg they caught once and force trades getting free hooks and kills without: moving, mindgaming or doing anything that takes actual skill.
The killer hypocrisy is why this game lost 25% of it player base just on steam (who knows how much including other platforms) with this last patch.
And still survivors get anything to counter brain dead killer campin? nope nerfed into the ground because "muh facecamping wah wah"
People dont "force a 3v1" to win, but to piss people off. Sandbagging is also not done to win the match, Makes sense, right? The issue is the infinite hook state, that got adressed, and try to camp against my mates when I run new reassurance, and I'll show you that it still is worth running it
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@mizark3 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3152415#Comment_3152415
Non-camping killers... yet the killer is disrupting the rescue? That sounds like he was camping to me if he was in range to disrupt the rescue.
Rescuer takes chase but still got within 6m of the hooked survivor? If they had to go in the direction of the hooked survivor, the killer had to be camping to force that scenario.
Little late getting the rescue... at 6m to activate? That is 1.5s of survivor running at 4m/s, and 3s of unhooking. That buys you 4.5s so that turns 59s rescues into 63.5s rescues.
Each example of a "non-camping killer" was actually a killer camping, and late to the rescue gives you a whopping four and a half seconds. I'm sorry, but your complaints have to be pretending in falsehoods in order to prevent nerfing camping.
Edit: To be fair, I will allow a survivor being near hook when their ally is being hooked changing the hook to a 90s hook being an abuse case scenario, which could also be fixed by needing at least 10s on hook before it can be used.
No not really always the killers fault of camping. Survivors play greedy and offensive enough to show themselves to the killer while rushing for the unhook. You can't always blame that on the killer, survivors are OFTEN mindless enough to rush it like that. And as killer, if you hit one survivor near the hook, it is most likely that another will think "he got injured, I need to safe now because he is in chase". And that pulls survivors off gens right into the killer. This is one of the most obvious reasons when camping is a legit strat and gets rewarded. Because of bad survivor play and they dont let the killer get away from the hook. It is actually the survivors forcing the camp in these situations
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@Rovend said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3152736#Comment_3152736
It is strong if the killer is willing to spend 3 minutes face camping someone even if he knew they are spamming reassurance. If you continue to camp while knowing you will be countered by reassurance, then it is not the perk effect's problem.
Like saying "Lightborn is too strong" because i am constantly trying to blind the killer.
I think you and Crowman dont disagree. He said that it is still very strong, he said that the PTB version was nuts and needed to go. The PTB perk effects problem was the infinite hook stage hostage which is simply bad design and shouldnt be in the game, no matter for what reasoning
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To OP, this must be trolling right? For the Reassurance nerf, read below. Bad design needs to go, period. 30 seconds is still enough to allow a lot of gen progress, you can even do a gen near the hook and activate it a second time on the next hook stage, which basically allows every survivor to finish a gen. 3 gens for a single hook stage is quite a bit. Beneath that I cant really remember that there were killers yelling "I can't camp now D'UH"
And the nerf for Awakened Awareness? How was that hindering the nurse? This is actually to nerf nurse, old Awareness was way too strong if you combine with Starstruck and Lethal. 4 seconds aura reading on an exposed survivor within 20m? That's a safe double down on each semi decent nurse.
And regarding the basekit BT and the conspicious actions, there you completely ignore how old DS was abused. Nice one. Argue without even half of the facts, cant take this serious.
@dictep said:
Another trash survivor perk. As always, to give survs perks they listen to killer mains. And probably they don’t know yet why people are abandoning this game
So they listened to killer mains when they invented the perk to finish gens solo in about half the time it should take?
@Firellius said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3152349#Comment_3152349
Why was the CD insane?
It's a bad perk. It is basically a weaker, more conditional version of a baseline feature. It ONLY benefits you against camping killers or really, really bad ones.
The only valid complaint was the griefing one, but that didn't warrant the perk's neutering.
Now getting, at max, thirty seconds out of it is not enough for a perk that, effectively, only the killer can activate.
If you're terrified of a survivor being incapacitated for an additional thirty seconds as opposed to being taken off hook to help his or her team, you're probably playing above your skill level.
And if Reassurance scares you, I think we can make an educated guess as to how you got there.
It is a band aid perk as others in the game, but a much needed one. That only the killer can activate? Is the same on BT and Unbreakable for example right? Do you trashtalk Unbreakable like that? It is a game changer when it comes to action and is exactly for this situation. You can say the same on almost every perk, everything is conditional. No Dead Hard against insta downs or SLinger/Legion, RIP Bite The Bullet when the killer has Nurses Calling and so on and so on.
You bring this perk as asssurance to counter a playstyle you dislike, or to counter it when it simply makes sense to camp.
And the CD was insane because you could activate it 5 times per hook stage. Two survivors can keep the hook stage active for an unlimited time. And this is simply a bad design, nothing in the game, for whatever solid or dumb reason, should ever allow to extend anything for an unlimited amount of time. The trolling factor is the same reasoning like the mori spamming that was possible for killers not too long ago, which stopped the bleed out process and could take the last survivor hostage for hours. Bad design, needs to go. This was not about 30 seconds of not being able to give up
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@Jplanas98 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3147134#Comment_3147134
You typed a whole lot of words and still said absolutely nothing. Yes, landing a power hit can sometimes lead to a quick down right after, is that your only argument? You realize with no cover blocking the crow it becomes incredibly easy to telegraph the path it will take. So much so that if you get hit by it while it's placed in the open, you deserved to get hit by it. The Huntress's hatchets don't have that sort of telegraph, survivors play a guessing game on when she's gonna actually throw the hatchet so they can dodge it. When the Artist places her crow down, you simply just don't walk 10m in front of its path.
What kind of argument is "an injured survivor is weaker vs. a Bubba than a healthy one"? Not sure if you knew this, but an injured survivor is weaker against literally EVERY killer in the game. They're one hit away from going down. This argument makes absolutely no sense.
I also never said that a survivor looping the hook is invulnerable. But it creates a situation where now the Killer has to decide to either hit the survivor and potentially give them a free unhook, or play the waiting game and hope the survivor messes up and the Killer can grab them while they are trying to unhook the survivor, which is why it would be similar to old DS. But of course you wouldn't understand that. Before calling someone's argument weak, make sure you at least have an actual argument and not just jumbled words.
So you got nothing out of what I wrote? You dont want to understand or you cannot? I try to repeat.
An anti loop power is meant to give you easier hits at loops, right? So against artist you cant loop windows and pallets that effectively because you have to cross crow paths that are easy to place. Which you cant do near a hook. Not sure how you got there, but we were not talking about running through the open and eating random crows, we were talking about looping close to the hook. That weakens the killer because he has to play the tile like a regular M1 killer. But this is basekit on a lot of killers as mentioned above, and noone talks about abuse here.
Comparing that with hatchets was to say that also Artist can get nearly instant downs if played correctly. Not as efficient as a chainsaw but still strong, which is gone when too close to a hook. Your initial point regarding Artist also makes no sense btw. Your argumentation was "it is an anti loop, not an instadown". Is the power level relevant to be able to talk about abuse? I could understand this argument if someone compared Phead trails that vanish near hooks with chainsaws, but not when talking about powers that help you get quick downs.
With what I wanted to say with the injured survivor is, that it seemed like you think that Bubba HAS to down survivors with his chainsaw (also related to your argumentation "he has insta down"). This is not the case. M1 survivors that you cant chainsaw because they get too close to a window is common. Which means having to M1 a survivor too close to a hook makes Bubba weaker, but surely not making the survivor invincible. Having the option to M1 a survivor and continue the chase is not comparable to old DS, where you had to ignore the survivor or grant him a stun that allows him to make like 20m of distance, even allowing unhooks while both still get enough time to get distance after the unhook. You have the option to do something as killer and deal with the situation.
You didnt say the survivor is invulnerable but you compared the DS abuse with Bubba not being able to revv his chainsaw. And that is comparing an invulnerable survivor with a survivor that eats hits and eventually goes down like in a normal chase. So this is not really comparable because the killer has a possibility to act. I wouldnt call it a free unhook, you still can grab and the unhook normally means a trade, granting the killer a free hook rather than the survivor a free unhook. It is better for the killer to get a fast hook rather than having to wait 60 seconds for it to happen automatically. Unless you want to argue with tunneling, the hook exchange is something that is always welcome as a killer. Having 2 survivors escape from the hook is not comparable to a trade. And you are not forced into a lose lose decision, you can just force the trade if you are not up to gamble for the double down. The killer is totally in charge and gets rewarded in whatever way.
Btw you started calling out dumb arguments while not getting my or other's points apparently, we can go on bitching or keep it civil.
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Basic info on the update:
- you now dont have teachables anymore. you unlock perks by prestiging. prestige 1 on dwight for example will unlock his 3 teachables bond, prove thyself and leader on every other survivor you have at tier 1. meaning you dont need to find them on others bloodwebs anymore, you directly get them into the inventory of all characters.
- prestige 2 and 3 unlocks the perks on tier 2 and tier 3
- prestige 4-6 will unlock the bloody cosmetics, but you keep them if you unlocked them already before the patch
- prestige 7-9 will unlock perk charms of that character. which is their 3 unique teachable perks icons on a square with purple backround
- prestige is now capped at level 100 and after matches you see the prestige level of these characters, where you used to see their grades/ranks
For having put a lot of BP into your chars before the update, there was a benefit logic to reward that. The rule of the update was as follows:
- for several perk levels above 50 you get a free prestige level. regularly you have around 50 perks (tiers, meaning 3 perks at tier 2 count as 6) at level 50, so the offset was 70 for the first prestige level for free and then for each 50 more tiers (70-120 perk tiers gave one free prestige level, 121-170 gave 2 free levels, up to a maximum of 6 free prestige levels I think)
- for each prestige level you already had, you would get 2 additional on top. so a prestige 1 character was pushed to prestige 3, prestige 3 was pushed to p9
- the prestige *3 multiplicator and the perk levels were adding up, but the free prestige buff was capped at prestige 9, so there was no difference between a P3 level 1 and a P3 fullperk.
- having a character on P3 before the patch unlocked a fancy portrait with animated scratchmarks in the background
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@Jplanas98 said:
It would be similar to old DS before the added conspicuous actions, where even though you weren't intentionally tunneling someone they could do objectives directly in your face and your options were to either leave them alone or eat the DS. Making it so Bubba can't use his chainsaw within hook range will cause similar situations where even if the Bubba isn't camping and is chasing another survivor, if that survivor runs to the hook he can no longer use the chainsaw.
Also, the Artist argument is dumb because her ability isn't an insta down, it's an anti-loop ability. They aren't comparable.
dumb... ok...
you still cant use her anti loop ability near a hook and have to M1 and, comparable to huntress hatchets, landing a power hit can sometimes lead to a quick down right after that because the cooldown with power is way less than with an M1 hit. And still you have your M1, it is not comparable to old DS. you have a way to play around it. An injured survivor is way weaker vs Bubba than a healthy one because you can chose to M1 or chainsaw him when playing a pallet. The survivor looping a hook is in no way invulnerable. Either wasting time to heal or you can just pick to chase him unless you are sure to have more survivors around
This is a pretty weak argument and not at all strong enough to be called "abuse" and since you still have the ability to chase the survivor rather than let him escape or work on objectives, this is not really similar. shall I call you dumb now?