What if dead hard didn't let you drop a pallet or vault for 5 seconds?
Title.
What if dead hard prevented you from dropping/vaulting a pallet or vaulting a window for 3 - 5 seconds after you used it?
I remember seeing this suggestion somewhere in a dead hard thread, and thought it was a good idea.
Current dead hard is pretty strong but horribly unfair as it has no counters WHEN USED FOR DISTANCE and it just removes a survivor mistake in a loop. A time where you would've caught someone you now don't because the survivor dead harded to a pallet.
This would promote using it in a way that requires lots of forward thinking (such as dead harding super early) or to avoid a hit where this change will have little impact.
Other than that I think it would be in a fine position. Maybe also remove the ability to dead hard over traps along with it but keep the partial invincibility. If these changes made it too weak it could have it's exhaustion timer reduced to 30 seconds.
I didn't wanna do another nerf dead hard thread, but this idea seemed pretty good so I wanted to see others opinions on it.
Comments
Also, it should be fine to have a Perk that can cover for a mistake, when we consider that Killers are having Bloodlust, which is the biggest "cover up for mistakes" in the game.
Sounds like a great deal to me 👀
Dead Hard is fine
@Leachy_Jr
Thats because it’s meant to be used for distance. I don’t now if you are purposely acting confused about it’s concept.
I use DH all the time, and I don’t agree that every time you use Dead Hard is to correct a mistake. As an example, if I am being chased at shack, and I already know I won’t make the window but I also understand how much distance I have with DH, so I purposely extend the distance with DH, not because I made a mistake. Much like if I was using Lithe when there was no pallet to throw down.
It would be useless
Isn't that the whole point of deadhard? Why would you run it over any other exhaustion perk?
Then after the DH nerf mains would go after Lithe (or wathever takes the spot in the meta), one of the things I was palid about DS nerf even when I never use it is that at least made Killer mains hellbent on nerfing it so they didnt pay attention to other perks, now DS will be gone and DH has the target on it.
Didnt the devs say that they would change dead hard. So you should wait for this change and use the time to complain about sprintboost. Bc i bet that people will complain about it anyway when dead hard is nerfed. So you can start a few months in advance.
Or what if it didn’t and it stayed the same because it’s a perfectly fair perk?
What if we increased the required number of tokens for Devour Hope, since Devour Hope can be paired with Undying now.
...What? You don't like that idea? You don't want your perks nerfed? What's fair for the goose is fair for the gander.
well then just use ghost face or myers you can counter deadhard.
1 hit down what else ?
The perk would be absolutely useless if you made such a change. The moment you used DH, you'd be unable to do the most basic of things to avoid being downed. This would result in you being downed 1 second later for the majority of the killer cast if they didnt swing and miss and you'd go down after 3 seconds if they DID swing and miss.
You know all survivor perks are absolute trash when killers want a perk that doesn't even work properly to be nerfed.
Totally agree with this
I agree with you on this. You can't take away everything. Just like how noed is fine dead hard is also fine as well. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean it SHOULD change.
So give the survivor a small speed boost to avoid a hit then, make them unable to do anything with the distance so, that the Killer can just hit them anyway...
Sounds amazing!
Yea I have, I use crutch hard myself and it feels dirty.
Maybe if you played killer you'd see what I'm talking about when I say it covers up a survivors mistake.
So you want it to be useless?
Removing the unfair part about the perk and actually making it take skill to use and forward thinking is making it useless?
You realise that you can only loop a Killer for so long before they bloodlust and catch you or, force you into a 50/50 mind game which basically comes down to luck?
50/50 mindgames are mindgames lmao. So encouraging a skillful part of the game by nerfing a crutch is bad? Am I getting that right?
The "second chance" perks are really designed to prolong the chase and waste the Killers time. It's a game of time management.
Killer perks like Ruin, Sloppy Butcher, Thanataphobia essentially do the same thing, waste survivor time.
So the survivor dead hards and avoids the killer swing. Within the next 5 seconds the killer will down the survivor since they can't use vaults or pallets as Dead Hard does not give the survivor a lot of distance.
With the 5 second penalty there would never be a situation where dead hard would be useful.
I get not liking facing a perk, but you might as just ask for the perk be deleted with how your suggestion would absolutely kill any reason to use it.
I play both sides pretty equally and from a killer perspective I have no problem with dead hard. I've never lost a game because someone used dead hard on me. It's also quite easy to bait someone into using dead hard so as for it having no counter play I just can't get behind that. If dead hard causes you a big issue when playing killer you just aren't very skilled at killer and you need to work on your game. While there are many issues playing killer sometimes, dead hard just isn't one of them.
Dead Hard is probably one of the hardest perks to use correctly. It requires the most skill from survivors to use and use correctly. You have to think when to use it and how to use it to get it's full potential from it. If you mess it up any or it glitches, you just wasted your perk. Sprint Burst is always guaranteed to give you 3 seconds extra chase time. Dead Hard only gives you 3 extra seconds if you time it correctly and it doesn't glitch.
You are literally asking to remove one of the most interactive survivor perks in the game. And honestly, the games pretty killer sided right now, especially with hit boxes. So maybe there needs to be some killer sided nerfs to equal out the game at this point.
So most killers wait out dead hard anyway because of how easy it is to counter, this would just make dead hard useless because you know no matter when you use it, if they use it to avoid a hit, they'll end up on the ground exhausted anyway, if they use it for distance and the killer doesn't swing (like almost every killer because they have the brain to wait) then any amount of seconds "gained" by dead harding for distance is instantly nullified because the killer will catch you regardless, thus killing the perk entirely.
Two/Three years ago nobody complained about Dead Hard, now that nearly every perk on the survivor side has been changed or is getting changed it's become this heavy target because survivors had to change how they used it because dedicated servers killed it's dodging hit ability.
You are back :)
👏Give👏us👏a👏reliable👏anti👏exhaustion👏perk👏
Dead Hard is a stupid ass perk, but I think there are far better ways to nerf it than this.
I would say 2 - 2.5 seconds. It'll make the perk more skill based or force the perk to be used as intended.
This ^! This is the mindset of someone who doesn't want to use skill, or their brain to outplay the killer.
@TicTac
They are changing Dead Hard so it actually works better, meaning you are not exhausted on the floor constantly. They are not changing it's concept.
I don't even use dead hard because of its inconsistency but nice try, maybe try to use your brain before you comment.
Dead Hard is very annoying for Killer. Other exhaustion perks are very strong too, but not that annoying, also they require more planning ahead, not just reaction.
They can make good perks for survivors, but how the other side feels should also be taken into account.
I'll expand a bit more on this idea. For the record I'm someone who HATES dead hard. I think its the most awful perk in the game right after OoO.
I don't think this is the way to go because it removes the utility from DH. I think it would be better if they buffed it (longer i-frames or something to compensate for lag) but put a requirement on it (unhook etc).
I think in general second chance perks should not be able to activate within the first chase. This is what really cucks the killer, it's what old DS was so bad for. 4 survivors spread across the map and do gens, killer chases 1, rest have very little pressure early game....extending that first chase with DH for distance to a safe pallet or window, is just as broken as old DS activating in the first chase.
New DS is better because it can never activate before the 1st hook. Deliverance can never activate before the 1st hook. Unbreakable....well you can just pick them up, it doesn't stop you from getting the 1st hook.
I just wish the design team would realize this and go with this approach moving forwards. Sure second chance perks can be a pain later but it's that early game that really takes the cake when it comes to ruining the game.
If DH had a more consistent i-frame/dash but required an unhook it would be a more consistent chase extended for survivors that aren't skill enough to pull it off every game, but it would stop 1st chase dead hards from doing an irreparable amount of damage to the killer and it would stop what we see now on red ranks PC where pretty much every single chase has a DH in it for a free chase extension.
that's the point? so you stop doing mistakes and git gud instead of relying on a perk that save your ass
dead hard is fine doesnt need a nerf when btw work half the time.
Don't get [bad word] with me. I was just saying that if something like that WERE to happen, you can't act like that's the only available option and you just ruined survivor. There's other exhaustion perks. Don't get mad because one would have gotten nerfed. You're right it's not getting nerfed, it's hypothetical.
While playing as killer dead hard is the least of my worries.
While playing as survivor using dead hard is the source of all my worries.
Some of us killer mains actually do play the survivor role.
There'd be no skill aspect of it because you'd get downed no matter what. After missing it takes well less than 5 seconds for a killer to attack again so yes, it'll be useless.
What if we just leave DH alone and fix real issues
If it would have to be changed, yeah