Scott junds gen slowdown video devs look at this
https://youtu.be/LVnWIe-5Lcs
I agree with this 100% this would help killers out so much it would also let devs continue making bigger maps I see no downsides to this -also to make it to where it can’t be cheesed by wraith- just put a 120 timer on it thus giving the killer time to find someone without being gen rushed right off the bat
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It would help a lot and I think it's a good change. But they said they wont do it.
Oh well that we have nothing currently other than speculation. I would speculate differently than you. No where else to go with that though since we don't have stats.
Exactly. All arguments are pointless because devs don't provide stats :/
As a survivor main, this sounds like a solid thing to add to the game. Fits the lore, and isn’t so punishing that I feel like I am “being nerfed”. I would like to see more variety in the killers I play against. I think this would make a lot of killers more comfortable (I dunno if that is the right word) not picking only S-tier killers. It would be cool to test it out and make sure it feels fun, but it sounds like a step in the right direction and encourages interaction. I wholeheartedly agree that increasing gen times would work but be super boring. This would be a solid band-aid until the devs can run more maps thru their rework machine.
It sounds like a good idea to me. I think there should still be a timer of some kind as well even if a survivor isn't found so hide and seek games with afk wraiths don't become common.
Invisible ranking system based on emblems has a very high chance of working.
And if we are talking about MMR in assymetrical games, BHVR has the same amout of experience = 0
So I do not like the 120 second timer idea, imo it would need to be longer but a timer should be involved at least to the point where the survivors don't wanna sit around and do nothing... since the point of implementing something like this is to give a chance to the killers to get in the game before 3 gens are done..
Also this would not punish stealth players. This could give a new reward for stealth players to work for. since a timer exists in this idea all time you stealth/evade the killer is time wasted for the killer and progress can still be made on gens soo.
juts dont use the choosen idea, give the obsession status to the first survivor, this status dont affect the gameplay anyway if someone is not using an obsession perk, "ah but the killer wont know if someone has DS" as a killer main i think that you must be prepared to it anyway cause is like the survivor ruin 80% uses it, and its just not tunnelin that everything will be fine.
This obssesion first person find will help pwyf stacks making this perks not being so useless and more used, also it will make STBFL more viable cause the other survivors will stack you if you dont tunnel your first hook the obsession.
I really like your idea and I sincerely hope they will eventually implement something similar, but I still think there is some tinkering to do regarding the triggers to end the Trial Warmup: for example, what about The Map, which is on two levels and you, as a killer, don't necessarily have the ability to go from one floor to the other immediately? The 4 meters could be already too much to trigger the end of the Warmup without having an idea of where a survivor may be.
At the same time, if you lower the radius you risk giving an unfair advantage to instadown killers like Hillbilly or Bubba, and, similarly, other killers could be able to induce potato survivors to drop pallets even when not in a chase but very close to the killer.
Again, a killer could induce survivors to waste their sprint burst without triggering the end of the Warmup, catch up with them and when close enough finally start the chase, adding valuable seconds to the slow down.
I think with your current implementation there could be a lot of exploitable potential by killers, which could be very nasty against low ranked survivors - and that's why I think they'll never implement this :P
nobody has experience working on asymmetrical games that use MMR #########
Agreed they could also keep creating bigger maps aswell and not limiting themselves well that’s how I feel
Careful, your personal bias towards Scott is showing.
I'd actually love to see this looked more into and can even test it first on the PTB.
This isnt punishing stealth play and "stealth play" shouldnt be rewarded. Hiding from the killer all game means doing nothing. If u work on a gen you will be found. Maybe get good at chases instead of urban evasioning around lol. It literally rewards a single surv by encouraging interaction and allows teamwork because it allows gens to actually begin to be worked on. It hurts no one in the long term and makes killer feel less hopeless.
The only addition I could think of would be adding "Reaching Tier 2 Evil Within" as a Killer-specific trigger for ending the warm-up. Getting from EW1 to 99% EW2 is a huge amount of progress that never requires Myers to start a chase, land a hit, or get within a few meters of a survivor. By the time he's out of EW1, he's basically past his sometimes frustrating "setup" phase anyway.
I mean, he's already hell on 90% of maps. So either you're on a good map for him, and you can probably get a sneaky hit and end the warm-up, or worst case-scenario you get looped for 2 minutes and the warm-up times out.
Same here when playing survivor
As a survivor who mains stealth, I would like this idea (even if my addendum of increased Cleanse, Search, and Sabotage speeds was not included) because I would hate to know that other sniveling cowards like myself are wetting themselves in a corner of the map while I'm desparately running from the killer and they are completely unaware because I'm not the Obsession.
It's the thrill of evading the killer. He's there and he's actively looking for you while you slip around an object. I find it far more enjoyable to play cat and mouse in this scenario than I ever have playing ring-around-the-rosie with loops.
In a chase, I look for an opportunity to stop running and slip from sight, to lose the killer entirely and disappear like a ghost. It's far more thrilling for me to genuinely outplay and lose a killer, to watch them frantically searching where they'd lost me than it ever was to run them in circles until they down me or give up.
I don't feel I won when they choose to walk away. When I slip away though, those are the moments I love most.
Last night I "hid from the killer" most of the game. Was chased once, where I slipped them, did three gens myself and unhooked 4 people safely, then broke his 3-stack devour hope and another hex as well as two dull totems. Then proceeded to escape through the hatch as my potato team finally perished.
Considering I basically did *everything* myself, I find it hard to take you seriously when you say stealth play accomplishes nothing.
What stats? I don’t have to think, I just sat here and got 5 straight instant games as killer after waiting 5 as survivor and never getting. One.
I like how many things now need to be redone in the game just because they nerfed Ruin. This was definitely a very wise decision by the developers. Or not?
Given the implied answer being yes I'd say that indeed nerfing Ruin is thus the right move.
Because if this much is needed to make up for it, then it's a good thing we are finally getting to ripping off that bandaid so we can get a REAL solution.
This, 100% this. As long as Ruin was around, making bad killer players look good and making low tier killers look playable, then there was never a chance for the Devs to fix the actual issues.
Will they fix them now that Ruin is nerfed, I dunno, all I know is they never were going to do it while it was around.
You will have to forgive me, I am one if the killers that doesn't have problems with a couple gens popping early, so the whole need for this kind of thing isn't on my list of things bhvr need to address. I automatically assume it's to stop gen rushing, which is only really possible against 4 man co ordinated SWF groups, anything else is just sloppy killing. Anyhoo, that said.
1) 50% reduction still has a gen popping before some players can get to the other side of the map. Even if it's just 4 survivors with commodious and speed add ons and a price thyself.
2) It's not a problem that all hooks can now be virtually disabled before the killer has got into a chase? Lol ok
3) I won't argue an opinion about killers needing buffs, but giving me extra time to lay traps before 2 gens pop, is really making it too easy. Yes, of course it helps high mobility killers, they're the ones that benefit the most from an in game slow down at the start.
4) 4 man SWF is when the whole gen popping quickly happens the most. Penalising randoms because 4 man SWF is too strong for some players, is a bad idea and bhvr have consistently stood firm on on this. This mechanic, punishes random survivors.
5) How does the game decide which gens to block off? Would it be the 3 that aren't touched yet? Furthest from the killer, at start, at that point? Be interesting.
Yes, there are other considerations, such as stalk killers.
Also, why does a chase need to be initiated, it could be argued that seeing a survivor/killer is the true start of a chase, as now it's planning your move. Seems a bit strange to give stalking killers a disadvantage of being able to stalk while the other killers can get up close and personal. What about killers that have terror radius debuffs?
Like I said, it's a nice idea. But simply fixing low mobility killers is the better way to go (like they did with DR, not that he really needed changing in my hands), rather than over react to the gen rush koolade and make large in game changes to fix extremely rare scenarios. I think, waiting for how matchmaking changes and bhvr seeing how long games last (if they don't already) would be a better way to decide what needs to be fixed and how
So, while the killer is in warm-up and everything is horror-like and slow, would all killers be in undetectable status too until the first chase starts?
It would be fun to have at least one jump scare in a match
I like this idea. It would finally give killers a fighting chance at the start of maps. Sure, some are still going to be a little unbalanced, but a good majority of maps would be fine. It really does add a feeling of dread, like, is it me that's going to be the first to be hunted? And it really fits in well to the game. It's pretty much a EGC, but a start version.
Thanks for the feedback, @PatBrutal. It's good to hear a confirmation, that you started to pick-up things, and thinking about it. :)
Personally, for me, this is like a lightbulb has just activated in my head. :D So simple, yet amazing idea, and benefitial for both sides. Ofc needs some/lot adjustments on perks side as well, but maybe this is a kind of thing a 3-4 years old game needs: some completely new, yet very simple part.
This is easily the best idea I have heard.
the thought of having no blink on early game nurse give me shivers maybe each time a killer uses their power it reduces the timer by 5 or 10 seconds and if the killer does something that affects survivors (like docs static blast and traps) it ends the warm up phase
Edit: oh wait maybe instead of the others not being in a chase getting endurance their aura is revealed for 5 seconds and they are exposed for 15 - 30 seconds so that survivors are encouraged to look for the killer early game so they don’t get the penalty for playing stealthy
Yes i do find that needing to be in a chase to end the phase is a bad idea for survivor side so to balance it maybe give the other survivors who weren’t found get the “endurance” effect for 20 - 30 seconds so they don’t get injured and the person who was found have the “endurance” effect stay until they get the protection hit. So is it balanced enough for both sides now?
So add a 2 minute timer? Its like end-game collapse but its Pre-Game Build up
For one chase? So what? This is a really good idea and might add some horror aspect back in to the game as well
I think you make a good point about how the system could be exploited. SWF especially could exploit this quite easily. And killers who can avoid triggering Chase can get alot of value as well..
@ScottJund
I don't see a problem with this idea but will it be enough?
This isnt a problem, say you've got 4 blendettes that all just trying to be stealth. If the killer is never able to find one of them, which simply does not happen, they would just have to spend more time on gens and escape. What happens in reality is that even a bad killer will find someone by at most the third gen he hears being worked on, and then the other 2-3 will finish the gens they were on while he gets a down. If this happened without a slowdown at all, 3-4 gens could be done before he even gets a down. It's a minor slowdown to bandaid the problem and make the game less survivor sided. It's actually a really great idea.
What game are you playing? Doesnt sound like dbd
i’ve thought of something its like each time you use a power you reduce the timer for 5 seconds each time you use it but i think for continuous powers like these killers maybe a x5 speed boost to the timer
This isn't much. This doesn't make top tier killers any stronger. Does that mean more changes are still needed because now the top tiers are too weak?
I don't know it seems like a decent idea but there's a one issue I see that being It punishes solo survivors much more than SWF. A SWF could just nominate the strongest looper to run the killer and end the start up while solo have to either just work on the gens or multiple people end up running towards the killer.
I don't think it'll fix gen times tho, There's plenty of games where you find a survivor quick enough but gens still get done easily thanks to strong loops side by side being able to waste the killers time. It's better than nothing though.
The idea isn't that much different than what I proposed in this thread:
The main difference being the penalty is far higher but ends faster. I think there are pros and cons to each. A 50%+ penalty is so high that survivors might as well not even touch a gen (other than tapping for a second and leaving so killer wastes time searching for a survivor that isn't there). Which one could argue is a good thing. But what are survivors likely to do if gens are pointless at the start of the game? There are a couple options:
There are knockdown effects to both of these choices. Hex perks in general will have less value if survivors all actively search for them while playing immersed at the lower tiers. The primary purpose of slowing the game at the start will almost be completely negated at the higher ends.
Would it be better than what we have now? Yes. Absolutely. But is it the best option? I think that is debatable. The option I proposed would be harder to abuse for both sides and would last long enough to provide guaranteed real value to the killer while not being overly frustrating to survivors trying to work generators.
This wouldnt really help though?
I like the idea. It takes away from the gen Rush. As killer. The gen rush does get to be a pain to deal with. and the only good play. is to slug the first survivor you always strike, or the game shifts too much in favor of survivor.
Running BBQ. - I really despise that perk. Because it becomes very underpowered to very OP. Too much of a dynamic shift for what it could/should be doing.
Wow corrupt starting after the warmup. Thats legit one of the stupidest ######### ideas ever. How about like gen speed. It goes down twice as slow.
The idea is not intended to have people. Run at the Killer.
He simply mention that as a method to counteract it.
Point of this is mainly to allow a lot of setup Killers to get ready or not have two gens pop out the killers in the process of finding somebody.
That way it's more down to the survivors skill vs. The killer skill on how The game goes because two gens don't get pop before the killer can get any more momentum.
Is it the best system not really? But it's probably the best suggestion I've heard and it's a lot better than the current system we have
So you want corrupt intervention as a core mechanic? No.
Just shrink down the maps and I can almost guarantee you will see results.
I dont really lile that youre trying to make my points subjective when they arent, like the whole "i feel your exaggerating..." Bit. I mean. I dont care what you feel. Im stating what i predict to happen based on what i know and have experienced.
Secondly, i dont really know why youre advocating this as you said multiple times that "it wont change that much" and how easy it is to counter by survivors. So based on these two things. I dont beleive you mean what you say. Why would you advocate for such a huge game change when youre telling me its super easy to counter. I dont get it.
The problem with stealth gameplay on the survivors part is about the same problem as slow down gameplay when it comes to generators.
When a killer is running a hardcore slow down build. It is not fun to sit on a generator for a good solid. 3 minutes to get it to work.
The same way, it's not fun for a killer to spend a good 3 minutes just walking around the map hoping to Dende that they get lucky enough to bump into the blendette
What if dev discuss something similar like this and they still ignore the great idea?
Stealth gameplay is intended, and don't play killer if you don't like hide and seek.
I appreciate what he's trying to suggest, but if this was to implemented, se might as well make solo survivors start the trial already on hook.