sinkra
sinkra
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Twins kill rate jumped from 59% to at least 65%, so if a good update means making a killer op then it's great.
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This is why I don't play much anymore. Survivor gets nerfed and killer gets buffed every patch. Survivor is starting to feel like you're just a plaything for a killer on a power trip. My opinion is that balance is extremely important in a pvp game, instead of winning or losing just because of the role you picked.
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Twins was already strong before the update with a near 60% kill rate. My question is why are the devs buffing killers that don't need buffs? Of course if you make any killer op it's going to become more popular to play.
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Yes it's balanced around high MMR SWF, that's why they're the only ones with close to 50% escape rate.
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@Wiggles_Diggles said:
This is the situation we have found ourselves in. Playing solo Q feels like you are just qing up to die. Playing as killer has gotten boring/repetitive due to the ease of the game. I now find myself handycapping myself on killer and can still 3-4k just about every game that I want to. There are only a handful of games where I can say I couldn't get any more then a 2k and that is usually due to either me making a lot of mistakes or my opponents just simply being better then me. Simply put on killer as of right now you can almost always get a 3k simply but tunnaling someone out of the game. So long as you do it before there is one gen left its is a near guaranteed 3k.
If matchmaking was betting this could solve a some of these issues, we have seen what can happen if killers are put into a skill bracket equal to their skill level, the game becomes an actual tug of war between gens being done and pressure a killer is applying For me at least those are some of my favorite games. It wont stop camping and tunnaling(although I do believe these should be options open to the killer, they need to be disincentivize) however it will mean it will take longer for those downs to happen, or survivors will be getting gens done while this is hap[pining.
I've been saying this, making the game so killer sided doesn't make it make more enjoyable for killers. Winning game after game without much effort gets old fast. When many killers feel the need to handicap themselves to make it more challenging says a lot.
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I would be fine with the 60% kill rate if it was actually 60% and most games were ending in 2k/3k. In reality though the kill rate is closer to 70% since they didn't include games with a dc, and most games are ending in a boring stomp where the survivors stood no chance and it's either a 4k or 3k with hatch.
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There is no counterplay to tunnelers when facing an unloopable killer.
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Yesterday I faced a hacking huntress. We were all suddenly downed when the match started and the huntress moved at warp speed hooking us. The game was over within one minute.
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More survivor nerfs on the way. First Adrenaline then probably Windows next. Devs also said in a recent Q&A they consider Buckle Up and FTP "problematic". It seems like they want to boost the kill rate to 70%.
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Even some killers are complaining the game feels too easy now. I hope the devs realize that making most matches an easy stomp for killers is not fun or engaging for them either.
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@NarkoTri1er said:
3-4 kills is treated as a win by SBMM for the killer.
Escape is treated as a win by SBMM for the survivor.
You can get max 20 MMR points per match.
Here comes the big problem now, once you reach 1600 MMR (soft MMR cap) you will be matched with everyone between 1600 and 2100 MMR points, and there are already way too many players of different skill levels in that range.
I thought the soft cap started at 1800? 1600 seems low, in other games that means basically intermediate.
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E-sports in a game in which good killers literally have a 100% win rate 😂
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@DaddyMikeyMori said:
If you guys are surviving 3 out of 10 matches I'd love to know what you're doing that I'm not. I get maybe 1 escape in 10 these days.
Before the 6.1.0 update or whichever one buffed killers and nerfed survivors? sure, a few escapes in every 10. Now? Lol no.
I've been tracking my escape rate. Over the past 64 games it's 30.3%. In so many games someone dcs and those games don't even get added in the stats which is why devs say the escape rate is 40%. I'm on the verge of being done with this game unless they make changes because this is just too discouraging to even try anymore.
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@mecca said:
Having a low 3/10 winrate for survivors is a problem. If balance is not fair for both sides where the objective is obtainable equally then you have the problem you say where one side decides the objective is simply not worthy of effort.
The game had the highest number of players ever when the kill rate was 54%. If they had kept the game balanced I believe it would have kept growing instead of declining.
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I tracked my escape rate over the past 57 games. So far it's at 31.5%. This is worse than ever. it seems like the only way you can escape through exit gates now is if whole team is slamming gens with hyper efficiency, there's no breathing room.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3700082#Comment_3700082
Agreed. A huge part of what made playing comp so fun was that it was consistently good players vs good players in an even match. That rarely seems to happen in public matches.
Games usually seems to be a runaway in either direction. I'll have a game where a teammate is found in basement at 5 gens for no reason, or a game where we 4 out and the killer has 3 hooks. It feels like they're matchmaking for a kill rate and not for gameplay.
And maybe they're not. Maybe MMR is usually really close between players in a trial. But it doesn't feel like that, and we have no way of knowing that. I would think you want to be transparent with a well-functioning system. It's not like SBMM is some industry trade secret that other devs are going to steal. This isn't a new problem BHVR is trying to solve. So I don't understand the smoke and mirrors surrounding it. The feedback on it seems to be consistently negative. I'd think you'd want to prove that it's functioning correctly to counter that feedback.
I'm convinced the matchmaking system in this game matches you against players at much higher or lower MMR to maintain your win/loss rate. It's like you lost a few games in a row? Ok Here's an easy stomp. It might also be placing skilled survivors with newbies with the intention they carry them.
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3700187#Comment_3700187
It needs to be revived on PC as well. 99.99% of the time it’s used to hurl insults at the other side.
Or just let everyone use chat but put an option in menu to hide it.
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Are you using any info perks?
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@jajay119 said:
I couldn't imagine anything worse.
I will occasionally message people to say thanks or GG, but most messages I receive are abusive or mocking. End game chat would be abused by the worst of the worst. Let's be honest.
You could use that argument to remove chat from pc users too. There's no reason console players shouldn't have access to chat. Other console games with crossplay have it too.
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If the only chance those remaining survivors have of escaping is hatch, and neither are willing to sacrifice themselves for the other, then stealth gameplay makes perfect sense.
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@Shirtless_Myers said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3699903#Comment_3699903
Say it with me now. This. Is. A. PvP. Game.
The game should be balanced. I shouldn't win by default because I picked one side over the other. The current design and what the developers are leading into is awful. You want a one-sided game because you play killer primarily. Slightly leaning in one side's favor to account for a horror theme is fine, but this is not a slight lean, this is straight handholding.I can't count how many killer mains I've seen say the game is more balanced now than ever before. Killers are very, very happy with the state of the game right now.
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The devs are clearly happy they made another killer op. Next month they'll post the 80% kill rate for Twins rework and call it a success.
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Yes the killer should be allowed to kick the gates to start regressing. /sarcasm
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Here's the core of the problem. BHVR just released new stats for Hillbilly and they're clearly happy about the fact they increased the kill rate from 54% to 63%. Most survivors think Billy is op now after the rework, but the devs think it's a good thing. That's why I think when they said 60% is the target they meant 60% minimum.
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@jesterkind said:
Where does the whole "three out of ten matches" thing come from?
All we really have to go on is the devs' stated goal of a 60% killrate, which would be somewhere around five* in every ten matches, which is… balanced. If you can only have fun when you win, you've got roughly a 50% chance of it, which is about what you should expect from a PVP game.
*I'm not great with numbers, I don't know the exact number. Somewhere between four and five, trending towards five, is my understanding.
Now consider they didn't include games with a single dc, and they counted hatch in the escape rate even though it doesn't feel like a win for survivors. Furthermore there are numerous killers with a kr at or near 70% (SM is higher) and the devs have no plans of nerfing them. Then you have the Twins rework which makes them the most powerful killer in the game's history. Based on their actions I'm starting to believe when the devs said 60% I think they meant a minimum 60% kr for every killer, with the range of 60-70%. Personally if they want killers to have a slight edge I think they should aim for 55%.
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I think there's a disconnect between the devs and the playerbase. The devs say they want a high kill rate to support the horror theme of the game, based on the assumption that survivors have more fun if they die most of the time because it makes the game more scary. Meanwhile many players view it as a competitive pvp game with a horror theme, and pvp gamers generally want fair balanced gameplay.
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@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3699058#Comment_3699058
https://c.tenor.com/cJRcMyUAiMcAAAAC/tenor.gif
A 53% killrate means killers almost always draw with the surivors. This is because a win for the killer is a 3K, with 2K being a draw and 1 or 0K means a loss.
That's the reason behind the 60/40. 60% killrate means 2.4 survivors killed per match on average (or, 40% winrate) at the same time that survivors escape 40% of the time, or in other words, also 40% winrate for survivors as them only need to escape themselves to win, as I already said.
There, your "equality in the inequality". That's why they want a 60% killrate and why the game was unbalanced before, not now.
"A 53% killrate means killers almost always draw with the surivors. This is because a win for the killer is a 3K, with 2K being a draw and 1 or 0K means a loss."
Absolutely and completely false. Average does not mean that number is the most likely outcome. A 50% kill rate would mean something like this (roughly)
20% chance of 0k, 1k, 2k, 3k, 4k. So a 2k would only happen about 20% of the time.
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@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3698937#Comment_3698937
That would make any sense, if this game wasn't asymmetrical. In your "50/50" case, the killer draw because he did a 2K, two survivors won as survivors win by escaping by themselves, and two other survivor lost because they died.
There is not 50/50 in this game, as survivors are not a team and if you die and your other three teammates get out, you have lost anyway. And you can't compare if your opponents are "equal" because they are not equal by design. Not their gameplay, not the skill needed to play them, nothing. You are either good at looping the killer and better at mindgames than him, or you are not.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3698941#Comment_3698941
But that's a survivor problem, not a killer one. It's not the killer's fault if your teammates don't have enough game sense to make the right decision at the right time.
"Asymmetrical" has nothing to do with kill or win rate. It simply means uneven teams and different roles on both sides. It's perfectly possible to have an asymmetrical game that aims to balance 50/50 for both sides. This game used to be, before 6.1 the kill rate was 53% and the playerbase was growing every year. Yet I keep seeing killer mains saying the game is more balanced now than in the past. This is the only pvp game I've heard of where the devs intentionally state their desire to make it unbalanced with a 60/40 split.
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3698546#Comment_3698546
Sure. Could be. But I'd noted previously that the immediate uproar from content creators stopped pretty suddenly, and none of them have said a single word since about the changes that they were so heavily against because it affected their bottom line. Otz going back to win streaks kind of feels like another tick in the box.
Are you saying you believe the devs adjust MMR matchmaking so that streamers can go on win streaks?
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This is what the devs want. In their exact words they say they want the killer to feel like "an unstoppable force".
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Can someone tell me what is the purpose of holding the tape? Should I turn off tvs whenever possible near a gen?
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I recently had a survivor that was crawling around the map at warp speed. I've also had some survivors that seem to run too fast, and I think they could speed themself up on demand because when they were out of my line of sight they'd suddenly make a huge distance like they were trying to hide it.
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Playing killer feels far more relaxing for me.
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@WolfyWood said:
Can't agree with this one.
Killers should not be punished for being good enough to kill someone early.
Getting someone out early just needs to take more skill.
Right now the game gets easier with every kill. It would be like for every gen completed the next gens take less time. A change like this would keep it challenging for killer the whole game even after they get kills, instead of it being set in stone that killer will win after 1 or 2 kills which is boring for the killer because it's too easy.
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There's no way it's a ping issue because my ping is fine and the hitbox is ridiculous whether I'm playing survivor or killer. It's intentional to make the game as easy as possible for killers.
https://www.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/comments/ejylb7/this_is_the_worst_game_ive_ever_played/
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Response from killer mains and the devs who listen to them: "Dude it's a horror game, survivors are supposed to die just like an 80s slasher flick."
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The necessity of always using kindred + exhaustion perk + WoO in solo q makes the game stale for survivors.
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I'm worried that WoO is next to be nerfed.
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@Pluto_1 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3696565#Comment_3696565
The game considers a 2k a draw. Besides, that's not what you said.
Since the game is balanced around a 60% kr a 2k is considered a loss by mmr otherwise the mmr system wouldn't work.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3696314#Comment_3696314
Not only that but it also drives people away from the survivor role.
If the Twins changes on PTB go through it's about to get MUCH worse. The devs are ruining this game with their desire to make sure streamers can continue their 1k+ win streaks for views.
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Killer main streamers are still telling devs the game is survivor sided, more killer buffs on the way. The devs think they're making the game more fun for killers by doing this but it just makes killer boringly easy.
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https://twitter.com/DeadbyDaylight/status/1773353911954329994@Hoodied said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3694564#Comment_3694564
I hope you are kidding or else imma have to add this to my list of game devs telling people counterplay that isn’t exactly easy to do
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They keep buffing killers every patch like the new Twins rework. It's only going to get worse.
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As soon as it becomes clear I need to do 7 gens worth of gen progress in a game I lose the will to continue. Nerf it into the ground. Killers have been abusing gen perks for far too long. They were never intended to be used in combination.
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If windows gets nerfed it's going to be the straw that breaks the camel's back for survivors and many are going to leave the game en masse. There's only so much they can take.
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It's because they are balancing the game for top mmr 4-man swf.
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@Azulra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3687664#Comment_3687664
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3688064#Comment_3688064
Yeah, I also realized this flaw as well after I made this post. With the fact that Victor won't be able to down multiple survivors back-to-back anymore that means that there's nothing stopping survivors from running in pairs of two and just insta-kicking Victor on a down so they can deny Charlotte of any of the Haste she'd get.
However though, an easy solution for this problem that not only fixes the issue which helps with balancing for them, but also makes sense from a lore perspective is that kicking Victor gives Charlotte a Haste effect(even if it's a smaller Haste effect such as like 5% Haste for 5-10 seconds). This would resolve that problem of Charlotte just getting completely denied of her Haste after a down(while also just occasionally helping Charlotte out a little in general) and it'd make sense from a lore perspective since Charlotte is shown in her story as being EXTREMELY protective of Victor and will get angry if someone tries to hurt him so this could be her in-game way of expressing her anger over the survivors hurting Victor.
I don't think Charlotte getting haste makes sense at all from a class fantasy perspective. It makes sense for athletic killers to have haste, but look at Charlotte. She's a bloated diseased lumbering sack of flesh. Haste is a lazy game design decision especially when it doesn''t fit.
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It's amazing how they managed to make Twins both less fun to play and play against while taking away aspects that made Twins unique.
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Viktor is only strong when sneaking up on an unsuspecting survivor. Then latching on and you try to hunt them down with Charlotte. That's the whole flow and fun of the playstyle for me. With these changes you're just going to be playing Viktor 90% of the time and only use Charlotte for hooking? That sounds boring. Not to mention giving Viktor a terror radius is a SIGNIFICANT nerf. As soon as survivors learn they can negate Viktor simply by hanging around a vault or window it's game over.
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I'm a Twins main and it seems these changes are going to make it both less fun to play and play against. If they nerf Viktor's speed it's going to feel like any other killer and ruin the unique playstyle.