jonifire
jonifire
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I only hope it’s not just nightfall from dredge!
If it’s not, it will be cool.
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@Skitten56 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635602#Comment_3635602
If BHVR refuses to address her strong counterplay in other ways, I would accept a passive condemn buildup for holding a tape, even if it is slower than it was on release.
However this discourages survivors from doing the counterplay again, and with global condemn lite, it could be a balancing issue in Sadako's favor. Passive condemn was fine on her release version where condemn could only apply directly at one TV location. However, I think passive condemn has no place in any version of Sadako which has a form of global condemn. Its a problem because it creates a position where survivors are punished if they take tapes and if they don't take tapes.
If they reincorporate passive condemn gain, they should return her kit to only spreading condemn to her Projection TV and not all powered TVs, maybe with some slight buffs like the condemn range being 18m basekit than 16m.
If they went back to the old old version, I would have made a that the condemned radius gets split in the parts. In the first (16-20m) you get 0,5 stacks, in the second radius (10-16m) 1 stack and in the last (0-10m) 2 stacks.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635294#Comment_3635294
I miss the old tapes soooooooo bad!!
Yes they were cool and should definitely return.
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@poujh said:
title. to maybe get some more uses out of these perks
Yes, wiretap got really difficult to use since it got increased to 50%. I still prefer the 33%, but 40% would be a good start. Also flashbangs should stack.
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@SoGo said:
Changes that need to happen:
1. Scrap the lock on and condemned nerf
2. Return the tape inserting and picking speeds back to 2 seconds.
3. Remove the "all survivors see all TVs" thing. Then only need to see the one they need to put a tape into.
4. Buff iri videotape. It sucks rn
💯% agree
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635438#Comment_3635438
All I ever wanted for sadako was the same old version, but to have TVs condemn everyone within 16 meters. Keep the passive punishment for tapes. It’s such a neat feature.
It would be so cool getting our old beloved ghost back. Mostly her old addons and how everything worked.
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@Gwinty said:
They announced that they will change Onryo once more only 2 hours after the Developer Update.
PTB feedback is clearly taken into consideration. Also their watch list showed that they are aware of the shortcomings of the PTB and that they will monitor these possible issues (DMS + Grim Embrace is also on the list).
As such I think PTB is still valuable and the Devs read the feedback.
Not really if they would have read it, it wouldn‘t have come to this. They only changed their mind a bit after all the backlash yesterday.
How I know behavior, they will do changes nobody wanted and then they make new problems like with trickster. They won‘t just undo those changes:“That would be too easy!“
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@appleas said:
I’m beginning to wonder if the dev team even used the PTB feedback when making a decision about the two nerfs.
The liner about noticing some Killer players teleporting to the “wrong” tv to stack up more Condemned stacks on a Survivor gives the vibe of the devs watching a few content creator videos which utilized this strategy or saw a few Survivors get hooked while fully condemned, panicked and started working on the nerfs.
Assuming that the Live release changes had to be pushed early due to console certification and tweaking teleports to not Condemn if the power button is on cooldown would take more effort than changing a few numbers which was the majority of the PTB feedback, devs wouls have had to start working on the nerfs fairly early.
They should just stop making ptbs! They are useless and half of the players can‘t even access them.
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@glitchboi said:
Are you referring to the PTB Onyrō or the new changes proposed in today's developer update? Just wanna be sure before I cast my vote.
I‘m shure he means the ones from the dev Update
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635322#Comment_3635322
The thread was almost 300 post long. Most where on the same side.
Nothing got implemented. Not even considered.
This did not have to happen.
Now I even consider her first version stronger!
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@Mooks said:
There is probably more players than those that you consider the dedicated players or that share only your opinion.
also they confirmed that Onryo will get further changes down the line
I‘m confident that they will be terrible! They did the same with trickster. Fist they change things, then make them trash, then do things nobody wants!
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I think the PTB is only there to test the things for free and nothing more. So people, who want to buy Alan wake could just say his perks are terrible.
They clearly didn‘t read any feedback. Most people in the Sadako feedback wanted buffs and not nerfs!
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@CammyChameleon said:
I don't like the Condemn Spread Cooldown, because like you guys even said in the post, it was Clever and we had to be smart about how we used it.
I feel like just revert her state back to what she was on the PTB, but please PLEASE make the tape insertion 2 seconds again.
The devs basically stated: They want people to play like current live Onryo works, no thinking just spamming!
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
Well I think they thought it is still too strong and if you read the dev notes, they wanted to nerf her even more to prevent spamming teleport condement and to not help her tunnel condement people.
But the issue is, killer doesn't need power to tunnel you so that is pointless and will punish non-tunneling Sadakos harder and makes condement joke same as before her rework (ori version).
Her condement is now yet again not scary at all, you can prob ignore it most of the match too.
She is like slightly better than ori version which is pretty bad in terms of power strengh. Like imagine having a broken plank and now just paint it with more fancy color but its still broken useless plank xD.
Her old version was stronger. At least tapes gave condemned.
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@Vanishlord said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635090#Comment_3635090
Do not even joke about that (though i do find it funny given that they would do that) the devs might actually go through with another unjustified change about that if I still find Sadoko to be boring when I am able to play her. I need Pig as my main. Its a shame if the devs had not changed Sadoko in the first place she wouldn't be where she is now and her two rework slots could have gone to someone who needed them. I have no idea why the gave her the first rework nobody asked for and then on the second rework they had it pretty much bang on and then screwed it up for the live version. I actually think we should make a union for Sadoko she has been done dirty.
Completely agree, she was fine in the first place and now they refuse to give us her good old version back. They said they wanted to bring her more to the original for the old Sadako mains.
I kinda find the #Nerf pig funny even if she is too weak. I don‘t think the live update for pig will be a buff, they wouldn‘t dare to fight that meme.
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@Vanishlord said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634624#Comment_3634624
I am in complete shock. I said no way they could mess Sadoko up again. They proved me wrong. I still prefer this power to the one we had pre PTB. At least Billys got what they wanted. Sadly Sadoko is probably near the bottom of the list again unless the devs do Freddy mains dirty.
They should at least #Nerf pig, so that Sadako is above her XD.
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@Reinami said:
Don't know what you expect when they keep nerfing all the perks that aren't related to gen defense
STBFL was fine and they gutted it
They are gonna nerf sloppy for some reason
They keep perks like dragon's grip useless
Hexes are all useless
I guess a better question i would have is.
Take out these "problematic perks" and the ones they are about to "nerf" What build do you think a killer SHOULD be running that is competitively viable against good survivors on killers who aren't nurse/blight/spirit?
The problem is the constant call for nerfs. Both sides clearly say to behavior all the time we only want nerfs and no buffs.
Very frustrating for me, because I think most things in this game are just as strong as a snail is fast.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635072#Comment_3635072
If memory serves me right, Pig's most severe nerfs were the ones aimed at her end game potential, around the time EGC was added to the game.
Her tweaks later this year will probably be something like "screaming no longer interrupts your progress on Jigsaw Boxes".
That would be one more for #Nerf pig.
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@Geiz said:
I was looking forward for the next update since I enjoyed the original Sadako way more than the current even if it's easier to condemn now. The PTB I didn't have time to play as - but seemed fun to play. But looking at the DEV Update, it looks like they literally ruined her, I do not want to play as this Sadako, all I ever wanted was a chasing power.
Me too!
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635020#Comment_3635020
I don't think I would quit the game, not if I didn't quit back in July of 2019, but it would be devastating and I'd be heartbroken. I really miss my favorite killer, and I want him to be fun and unique again.
That I wish me for Sadako too, but we will see.
Hopefully Fredy comes back.
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@Caiman said:
I'm gonna run Repressed Alliance. Killers can't block my generator if I block it first.
😂😂😂😂
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635030#Comment_3635030
Considering every match has 16 survivor perks vs 4 killer perks, they do have to be careful on making survivor perks too strong. Usually it's one good or decent perk mixed in with 2 niche or combo-suggested perks when a survivor drops.
My round always: 3 times Windows of opportunity, everyone one exhausting perk, Hope/ Adrenalin or both and something else. Survivors only have 10 good perks.
Those perks aren‘t even strong against good players!
The problem is they don‘t make useful perks any more, they don‘t need to be super strong, BUT USEFUL!
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I will finally get artist for this. Just 2+ min slowdown, that doesn‘t allow anyone to progress the game.
Current slowdown always only effects one person or one gen.
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Behavior only allows 10 good perks at a time for survivors. Variety between good perks isn‘t wanted.
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@ChaosWam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3635001#Comment_3635001
That's completely on the survivors at that point though. That's like saying 'This boss has a mechanic that kills me if I don't stand on this pillar. But I don't want to stand on this pillar, even if it takes 2 seconds to do it. Therefore, I shouldn't stand on this pillar' then dying and wondering why you died.
If 4 survivors are split, Sadako is likely to see one of them and give chase. It still gives everyone time to grab tapes regardless if she chooses to take that chase or not anyway. If all 4 survivors are on the same gen, it only takes one of them to grab that tape to save the rest from gaining condemned. I think a strong counterplay balances a strong power this way.
I started playing this game when Sadako came out. It took me less than half an hour to realize what tapes and teleportation does.
I really liked; that cursed tapes gave passive condemned, that made them something bad and not just sth positive. In the last rework that negative and positive effect in my opinion was pushed too far. Either you condemned people by hitting them and distroying the tapes or you got no TVs available and no slowdown.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I wouldn't worry about any Freddy change. There's literally nothing they can do to him to make him worse than he already is.
But they could make him good like billy on ptb and let him go live like Sadako. Then @GeneralV would quit this game for shure and loose all hope in behavior!
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Still too bad!
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Probably never. I‘m just honest. The reason behavior gave us; is that Sony and Microsoft are money hungry and won‘t give people their account to other platforms to keep you spending your money on their platform! Fortnite even needed to pay for potential losses to get cross Progression and maybe still has to.
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@GeneralV said:
Ok, so Peanits just posted this comment:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/WD99WSQJCRYJ/image.png
We're still going to have to wait and see how things will change, but this is good. Perhaps the patch is still going to be a step in the right direction for both Onryo and Hillbilly.
I have no hopes for this. He didn‘t say they undo the changes. Now they will do unnecessary changes like with trickster, that nobody wanted!
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634862#Comment_3634862
I feel so bad right now friend. I think ill play a bit stbfl only Piggy to calm my nerves and distract myself. If this doesnt help, im gonna go to bed early today.
Soon piggy will be hanged like Sadako and Fredy!
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634734#Comment_3634734
it is not non-sense. with 7 televisions, you incentives to teleport every single chance you get regardless of whether you hit the survivor with condemn or not. there is simply no drawback to not doing that. By teleportation to all 7 TV's, you emulate old condemn effect of applying 0.75 condemn stack to the entire map. Now it is just 1 condemn stack on the entire map. if you hit, you build condemn. If you don't hit, just teleport to another location. There is no bad teleport. The 10 second cooldown is there to discourage mindless teleportation.
In order for survivor to counter massive teleportation spam, survivor are incentives to always grab a tape or deposit tape to turn off every single television on the map near a gen that is being worked on. TV's spawn next to generators so you can grab a tape, work on a gen then go to another gen and turn off television. you can do gen objective and tv objective in such a way that there is no game-delay. only positive benefits in deleting her entire passive and her teleportation capacities. there is no decision making or skill input from survivor end with new tapes. you see a turned on TV near a generator, you turn it off. You have a tape? Go to your television and turn it off. It is just free counter to her ability with no downsides. it might be worse Singularity EMP'S.
I dislike entire Onryo rework because there is no substance gameplay left on either side. The killer has no skill expression in applying condemn/manipulating condemn to be more effective and survivor has no skill expression in deleting the ability. The killer is spoon fed condemn stacks for existing and survivor is spoon fed the counter-play. I was heartbroken by her rework and decided to not give any further feedback beyond what I am writing here. All I can hope now for her revert to be downright failure and hope that she is reverted.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634744#Comment_3634744
Developer post explains their reasoning for lock-on stack change.
With your current Condemned progress becoming permanent when you were hooked, Survivors who were hooked with several stacks became a clear target for The Onryō; it would only take a few more stacks of Condemned to secure a quick and early kill. This indirectly encouraged the Killer to seek out and chase the same Survivor after they were unhooked (or “tunnelling” for short).
To tone this down, hooking a Survivor will now lock in a maximum of 2 stacks of Condemned. Any additional Condemned will remain but can be removed by the Survivor as normal. This can happen again when the Survivor is hooked for a second time for a maximum of 4 locked-in stacks.
This will give Survivors an opportunity to remove some of their Condemned after they are unhooked while keeping Condemned kills as a far more prominent threat later in the match.
The short answer is that they want condemn to be a late-game threat when it doesn't matter. It is like they forget that Pyramid Head exists... who also has a name called Executioner who gets mori's for just applying torment debuff on death hook. Sadako now has identity crisis where a Pyramid head does what she does but better.
It wasn‘t even easy to fully condemned someone, but now it’s just simply impossible!
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@jasonq500 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634944#Comment_3634944
Who knows, all I know is that I lost my excitement for this update, especially since I’m a console player who didn’t get a chance to try this version of sadako and have to wait another 2 weeks for her nerfs to be changed
Me too, I‘ve waited since they announced the rework „ to bring her closer to the original“. Very disappointing, what they did!
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@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634902#Comment_3634902
I don’t get why we’re going to have to wait for a follow up update. Surely they can just push the PTB version to live instead?
They won‘t just revert it, otherwise he would have written that. They will do changes for her like with trickster, aka changes nobody wants.
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@Peanits said:
Hey folks. It’s clear that the changes we’re making to The Onryo didn’t live up to expectations, so we’re preparing a series of follow-up adjustments to address the feedback we’ve received. These adjustments are planned to release as part of the minor updates in the weeks following the Mid-Chapter. We’ll share more details once we've got a plan locked in.
You just need to undo those changes from today and remove that survivors see all the tv auras permanently, they only need to see the Tv where they need to deposit the tape. If this stays approaching someone with TVs will most times result in people prerunning, because they see the tv aura disappear.
And maybe you should go through the ptb feedback for Sadako again. We made a lot of suggestions for new addons and addon changes!
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
BHVR is trying to nerf Blight challange: Imposible.
We all focused how Sadako butchered by them but it's not only terrible change with upcoming patch.
Adrenaline Vial is busted and new problematic addon.
Alan Wake perks are terrible bad.
I was hoping to play Billy and Sadako but now, i will just stay away from this game for more. Because balance changes is really amazes me.
They are giving busted add-on to S tier killer while nerfing weak killer to ground. I don't unserstand any reason of this.
I already started playing less, because I can‘t understand all those terrible „balance changes“!
At least they should stop doing ptbs, when they don‘t read/ listen to the feedback.
I was very active in the feedback of Sadako and most people asked for buffs not nerfs there!
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@ChaosWam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634827#Comment_3634827
Heck if they had the ability to throw on a cooldown for condemned, current Sadako would be less oppressive while correctly adjusted for mapwide without gutting her movement.
Yes they could have just changed the live version like that and I would be more happy than with these stupid changes.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634552#Comment_3634552
I’m hoping in the next week or two they will revert some changes, ideally, I’d love to see some things reverted before it goes live, but we shall see.
My heart is just in a sad place right now I’ve waited a while for these changes, for me personally, respectfully, I never wanted the current Sadako.
I wanted old Sadako with some buffs to condemn.
I also hoped we return to her old version completely with some Buffs. Then they decided to do a good middle ground and now we got another useless killer. They should either give us her first version back or the PTB version, but nothing useless!!!
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634506#Comment_3634506
No cooldown teleportation promoted spamming teleport mindlessly with no decision making or thought process. The lock condemn stack promoted tunneling survivor off-hook and slugging people next to TV's to finish the 7 stacks of condemn on the "Locked Condemn" survivor.
These were grossly problematic designs in PTB Sadako. All the change are justified.
Giving condemned a cooldown would be fine if she had global condemned still and the other change makes no sense like the explanation to nerf it.
The lock in: supports tunneling!?
How is it supposed to do that? It doesn‘t help you to tunnel someone for the condemned lock in-> she has no chase power and she didn’t ‘t get the condemned increased just by tunneling.
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@Skitten56 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634578#Comment_3634578
Agree with you on these 2 points.
- Condemn lock must apply and lock all current condemn, not just locking 2 stacks
- 2 second tape insertion speed is a must. They can keep it at 1 second for grabbing tapes.
The TV spam issue isn't even an issue. After the initial few weeks of learning the changes, in most games survivors will do the proper counterplay and never work a gen by a powered TV. This completely makes teleport spamming nonviable and would only serves to reduce Onryo mobility and future condemn avenues. Onryo should NOT be punished with a mechanic making her weaker if survivors cannot grab a tape from a TV with a while aura before working a gen.
What they really need to do is make is so survivors carrying a tape cannot see the auras of TVs aside from their target drop off TV. This would be an important quality of life change. It would still allow for survivors to do proper counterplay while also allowing Onryo some ability build condemn in chase. It also makes it harder for survivors to just run around the map turning off all her TVs, which they can do very easily right now at low risk with the 1s tape insert speeds and the ability to only lock 2 stacks of condemn.
Agree, but I would remove, that they see the TV auras outside of the target TV. It negates too many things in my opinion.
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@Caiman said:
There really should be some tweaks, some updates. Everyone's stressed about Sadako being nerfed but there is no word on Alan Wake flying by without comment. It feels like BHVR never listens to feedback on new perks, so what's the point of PTBs?
They don‘t want to make good changes. Half of the bad perks are easy number changes in this game. I could make half them great in one day.
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@Dwight_Fairfield said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/LOGB82DPTV5W/myers.jpg
General, I am concerned about my boy Mikey, too.
Mikey is so cool right now. They shouldn‘t remove or change anything from him. Instead they should give him more in his kit, so people don‘t have only tombstone and infinite tier 3.
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It‘s just stupid, that Sadako is weaker than her first version with those changes. I‘ve waited for them to announce to remove the Tv auras for survivors (except of the targeted one).
If this change goes live, I doubt you want a Fredy rework like that Sadako one.
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Either they should give us the PTB version without seeing all TV auras or the first version back.
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Behavior said they did it for the old Sadako mains and almost everyone said she is too weak in the ptb. Now she gets two significant nerfs, that make her weaker than her first version!
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634547#Comment_3634547
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634544#Comment_3634544
At this point im thinking about creating a petition.
I will sign it!
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@Skitten56 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634510#Comment_3634510
I guess BHVR will ignore all the complaints and critisim on the PTB forums again and release her in a broken state. Except instead of being brokenly strong, this time they are making her brokenly weak. Condemn is a joke now. I thought they would make the appropriate buffs to make the risk reward more fair to combat the easy counterplay. But instead they just nerf her. The PTB was almost perfect, just needed some tweaks in the right areas. we all gave BHVR extensive feedback again but BHVR just does its own thing.
I fully expect BHVR to just ignore us all and keep these nerfs; all just because survivors didn't learn to grab tapes from TV auras. Guess I'll see you all again in 6-8 months for her 3rd rework.
I don‘t Even know, why they do these ptbs, when they can‘t take real data from it. If they did take her kill rate as excuse for those nerfs, then😭. Nobody plays real on ptb.
Yeah see you in 8 months for the next rework.😭
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634538#Comment_3634538
Not a fourth rework. We need to somehow stop this.....
She was good on ptb. This was absolutely NOT needed.
Agree, but that‘s what will happen, I think!
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@pizzavessel15 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634485#Comment_3634485
the people that were complaining wanting the weak onryo back were all survivor mains. especially the ones claiming they're "onryo mains." bhvr knows this too, thats why they made her trash again
I wanted the old version back (I maimed her before the rework), because of the tv cooldowns, but even her first version was better than this. Now we need a fourth rework. Great.
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The most important changes, that were needed in my opinion, were addons and that survivors don‘t see all TV auras only the target TV. Then she would have been great, but no.
Behavior: We did a good job. Why not make everybody hate us!
Behavior Boss: Great idea! Let’s do that!
Hopefully they change those parts back like they did with batteries included!
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3634481#Comment_3634481
I don't know either.
A lot people pointed Alan Wake pers are pure garbage, ignored.
A lot people pointed Sadako has some weak points, ignored.
A lot people pointed Quick Gambet needs rework, it's still terrible. Not ignored but core issue did not fixed. So it's still dead perk.
A lot people pointed DMS is problematic with buffed Grim, ignored.
I am surprised Blight feedbacks did not ignored. Like i am really shocked they actually saw feedbacks for him.
That was my last PTB. If devs don't care about our feedbacks, why even we waste our time and test things? Feels pointless. It's very disappointed right now.
I guess i should play Sadako before they nuke her. Because she will be unplayable after this patch.
That‘s how they do everything in this game, either it‘s strong or useless (no in between) and they want it to be that way. I was really happy getting my favorite killer back in a good spot, but they just straight up gave her Fredys place. They should stop doing ptbs and just bring it to live. At least I could have played her like she was on ptb.