jesterkind

@StalkingYou said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3889370#Comment_3889370
always found it odd that people think endurance/otr/DS is fair because it only disables when you touch an objective.

your suggestion of giving survivors godmode after they get unhooked is obnoxious and absurd because who cares if it only disables if they do an objective? so they can get unhooked, run to a gen and wait. if the killer tries to get them… well they cant because the survivor has godmode. so the killer goes away and the survivor does the gen.

conspicuous actions were needed, but they do not automatically make these perks fair because the perk only disables when you've actually done an objective. it doesn't disable when youre planning to do an objective. so if a survivor gets unhooked and starts running towards a gen its a lose-lose. you either try to stop them from doing it and eat whatever benefits they have from the perk, or you go away and they do the gen.

Or you could go chase someone else…?

The whole point is to encourage you NOT to be lingering around that person to try and chase them again. If anti-tunnel allows you to prioritise the person who was just unhooked, it's not functioning.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 27, 2025

@buggybug said:
Ngl I will not like it. Unlike prestige that I can tolerate since 100 or 0 means nothing, perks certainly mean something to me. If I see like innovactions, no mither, left behind, urban, bond, fixated,scene partner sprint burst I do not want that team.
Just like if I get people with flashlights I dip. Only person I trust with said things will be my swf who ofc do not use those perks nore run down killers with flashlights who has lightborn.

…Why Bond and Sprint Burst?

The others I get even if I fully disagree, but Bond and Sprint Burst are some of the strongest perks in the game. Surely you'd be happy to see your teammates running strong tools?

in What do you think about seeing teammates loadouts? Comment by jesterkind February 27, 2025

@PetTheDoggo said:
just return her first version until rework, no?
kicking perks are gutted and there is 3-gen feature

Skull Merchant 2.0 was the more interactive and skill-expressive version, so it'd probably be healthier to bring her back… absent the context that a lot of players vehemently hate both versions for arbitrary reasons, anyway.

in Revert Skull Merchant changes already. Comment by jesterkind February 27, 2025

I appreciate the clarification on what the purpose of the "showing your own perks in the lobby" change is for, if nothing else. That seems pretty reasonable to me, I'm on board.

As for showing teammates' perks, I think it'd be best to do that in the loading screen and mid-match pause menu, instead of the lobby. Cuts down on the whole dodging and toxicity thing.

in What do you think about seeing teammates loadouts? Comment by jesterkind February 26, 2025

I wouldn't say to leave it alone entirely, there were some issues to tighten up.

For instance, her power doesn't telegraph itself properly, making it hard to know what exactly it's doing without extensive research outside of the game itself. Addressing that would've been much smarter than just dismantling her core gameplan for no good reason, in my opinion.

A couple other small things here and there could be tweaked too. I actually liked the idea of giving her a slowdown effect when she places drones, for punishing the whole "loop zoning" thing, and addressing some other small things like drone overlap and the entirely unnecessary Deep Wound effect being removed would be appropriate.

Unfortunately I suspect that BHVR are planning a second ground-up rework for her instead. I hope it actually works and people stop complaining this time, at least.

in Revert Skull Merchant changes already. Comment by jesterkind February 26, 2025

@Cataca said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3889360#Comment_3889360
Hard disagree it exists to bail you out the killers job is to kill your preventing that with this perk it's a bail out

At that point, isn't every perk a second chance perk?

They all exist to make it harder for the killer to kill you, at least in theory. If the context of why and when doesn't matter, that means every perk is a second chance perk.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 25, 2025

Predator, maybe?

The unshakeable Tyrant that has an unerring sense for his prey, makes sense you wouldn't be able to slip chase that easily.

He has a tendency to pop up at the least opportune moments out of nowhere, too, so maybe something like Furtive Chase or Machine Learning?

in What are some fun non meta perks to use on nemesis Comment by jesterkind February 25, 2025

@Cataca said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3889355#Comment_3889355
You failed the Chase that is classified as your mistake even more so if you get an endurance proc while being tunneled and still get DS, DS has always been a controversial second chance get out of jail free card in all it's years it's been around same as other problematic perks that were mistake erasers like Buckle+FTP now that was extremely mistake wiping

Considering that you started that chase on a massive back foot and 60 seconds is a long damn time to be in chase even if you weren't being tunnelled, I don't think that's particularly fair.

It exists to protect you when you're otherwise very vulnerable, not to bail you out of a mistake.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 25, 2025

@Cataca said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3889173#Comment_3889173
It bails you out of the mistake of getting down within those 60 seconds. Your just moving the goal post to fit your narrative when in technicality does what you are describing in your original point

…But that's not your mistake. That's the killer making a very specific decision. If the killer doesn't chase you off hook, you don't get to use DS.

It's the same as Unbreakable- that doesn't fix your mistake, it protects you against the killer leaving you on the ground for over 24 seconds. Sure, you needed to be downed to use either perk, but it's not being downed that lets them work, it's the killer deciding to do the thing they're supposed to protect against.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 25, 2025

@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3889311#Comment_3889311
I think you may be losing sight of a few things, here.
Same for you…
I would say most killers don't see 2k as a win, many see it as a loss instead. And losing to something outside of your control would bring lot of frustration.
A 3k wouldn't be all that much harder, again, because of the cooldown on the hatch.
You want to tell me, you find the hatch within 20 seconds in every game? I can see Wraith would have chance for it, but most killers simply can't.
We're talking about a game that's at 4-5 gens and is already over.
Yeah and it would feel that much worse. You demolished survivors just for them to get 2 free escapes…
This change would just give them a fighting chance at not dying
Sad thing is your "fighting chance" is better than killer has to kill them both. Without slugging, you would not be getting 4ks.
3ks would be best you get and often not even that (if survivors bring key).
I'm not saying there shouldn't be testing or that adjustments would never be necessary, but I think the core idea functions pretty well.
No, it would be almost exactly as bad as previous version.
This would never go live, unless it's actually random and hatch should be revealed only if survivors manage find the key. Otherwise were are back to impossible 4k.
You downed last survivor and you need 4k for whatever reason (ego, challenge, achievement). With your change it's to be expected last survivor knows where it is, because either survivor saw it during chase, or other survivor found it. Which means you have to slug and then hope you didn't down one of those survivors near it.
That sounds very flawed to me.

Like I said, if 20 seconds isn't reliably long enough to find the hatch and prevent the final escape, there are ways of adjusting it. Increase the timer, give an audio cue, hell, teleport the hatch somewhere else— the point is to give the killer time to get the final kill, not that the timer itself has to be exactly how I pitched it there.

It's not two free escapes, for that reason. It's not any free escapes- it's playing for hatch, the way the endgame is supposed to be, it's just that the survivors have a bit more of a head's up. It doesn't stop the killer from being able to get one or both of them, it just pushes the last part of the game to be more active instead of excessive hiding because survivors do actually have a chance at not dying.

You haven't actually won yet with two kills. If it happens early enough on the live servers, you've basically won, but only because your opponent has been locked out of their win condition- you haven't actually achieved yours yet. It's not actually a problem for there to be some chance of that outcome changing.

in Something More For 1v2 Scenarios Comment by jesterkind February 24, 2025

@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3889307#Comment_3889307
It wouldn't really be easier, you'd just get to try it earlier
I have all the time in the world (well, something under an hour), where killer can't see the hatch at all.
In SWF we will have two survivors looking for it and there are several perks to find it. So you have more time, you can do it earlier and killer can't do much about it.
The whole point of the cooldown is to give the killer time to find the last survivor, so you could either lengthen it or give more of an obvious directional cue if 20 seconds doesn't end up being enough in most scenarios
Either it's vague and in most cases you will have both escapes, or it will be easy to find for the killer and then second survivor will always be forced to play gates (which can be easy, or impossible on some maps)
In both cases, it would create a frustration for either side.
If the rats or the aggressive SWF are actively running around searching for and opening hatch, they're going to be easier to find
Why do it fast? We have all the time in the world to find it. Even when one get to chase, other survivors can just look for the hatch in advance and at that point at least 1 would be guaranteed unless killer is going to slug…
So you are trying to "fight" slugging for 4k, while it is actually going to be mandatory instead.
3ks wouldn't actually be all that much harder because a SWF can't just easily disappear two people at once.
Why not? Go into locker when second survivor gets hooked to avoid BBQ and you are fine.
that's definitely not worse than old keys where everyone could exit the game early
They couldn't do it at 4-5 gens. This would be possible and in both cases only answer is slugging, or just give up to fact survivor/s have free escape for flawed mechanic.

I think you may be losing sight of a few things, here.

Most pressingly, two survivors are already dead in this scenario. This is when BHVR have already said they want to move the match along and don't want things to stall out, so that's your answer for doing it fast- the game is about to get some mechanics that push you not to do it slow.

A 3k wouldn't be all that much harder, again, because of the cooldown on the hatch. Unless the killer's completely clueless on the other side of the map entirely - which certainly could happen but isn't guaranteed - that's a long time to come approach the hatch and get a down.

The major thing to remember is that we're not talking about a game that's just at 4-5 gens. We're talking about a game that's at 4-5 gens and is already over. Functionally, anyway, there's absolutely zero chance in hell that even the best survivors in the world can actually repair those generators with only two players on the board. This change would just give them a fighting chance at not dying, which ensures that the match doesn't stall out, it's become a race for hatch where the survivors have to keep active but the killer can't find the hatch to camp it. It pushes the players together, which is the desirable outcome.

I'm not saying there shouldn't be testing or that adjustments would never be necessary, but I think the core idea functions pretty well.

in Something More For 1v2 Scenarios Comment by jesterkind February 24, 2025

@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3889300#Comment_3889300
I don't think rats who bring keys would actually be able to get more than they currently can, honestly.
It would, because it would be way easier to do than now and they can take 1 survivor with them (unless killer somehow manages to find the hatch in 20 seconds), so kinda the "effect" of rat in your game would be more annoying
Also thinking about it, why not bring 1 key in every game when we play SWF (2+ players). Suddenly even 3k becomes way more difficult for the killer, which brings as to even worse situation than original keys, where at least gens were requirement for spawn.
I still have too big PTSD from dealing with that…

It wouldn't really be easier, you'd just get to try it earlier. The whole point of the cooldown is to give the killer time to find the last survivor, so you could either lengthen it or give more of an obvious directional cue if 20 seconds doesn't end up being enough in most scenarios.

As for being able to try it earlier, to be blunt, that's what we want. The whole point is to push games that are functionally over to actually end quicker, the same as the anti-hide situation. If the rats or the aggressive SWF are actively running around searching for and opening hatch, they're going to be easier to find, and they can't skulk around looking (presumably) because of the anti-hide stuff being added, so the interaction happens a lot quicker.

3ks wouldn't actually be all that much harder because a SWF can't just easily disappear two people at once. Even if they could, though, that's definitely not worse than old keys where everyone could exit the game early.

in Something More For 1v2 Scenarios Comment by jesterkind February 24, 2025

@PetTheDoggo said:
I might be fine with it, if you remove keys as item, so you actually have to find it.
Would be very annoying to deal with rats again who just bring keys.

I don't think rats who bring keys would actually be able to get more than they currently can, honestly.

In the game right now, they'd still be able to bring keys and play like rats. This'd give them a slightly bigger window, sure, but it's still fundamentally the same scenario from the perspective of any other player. From the killer's perspective, one guy played like a rat and got hatch but you killed the others (assuming they don't get sacrificed earlier), from the survivor's perspective one guy was useless.

What it would do is allow players who just want keys to be safeguards and otherwise play completely normally to get a little bit more of a chance at value, which I think is healthy- both because it makes keys more appealing and because if you bring a key you can't bring a toolbox, medkit, or flashlight.

in Something More For 1v2 Scenarios Comment by jesterkind February 24, 2025

@Nomade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887191#Comment_3887191
I agree with you on Babysitter, even if it isnt used as much as some other perks it was overbuffed. I was pretty mad when they buffed it too because it was apparent even just at first glance that it was being immensely overbuffed. Its just not a good idea to buff and nerf survivor and killer perks by such enormous amounts all in 1 go if balance is what you are after

Honestly, the fact that Babysitter is as powerful as it is and still doesn't get taken as much as other perks says volumes about how powerful the other perk options survivors have truely are.

I think that an anti slugging feature is just a bad idea in general. Even adding a bunch of anti slug perks is probably not super necessary. Simply buffing some of their chase perks might be enough. Survivors need to be pushed away from this tunnel vision gens mentality, and start helping their team more. If survivors are leaving you on the ground to bleed out, it can be easily said that these are the kinds of teammates who would leave you on the hook to die too.

Can I ask, what makes Babysitter overbuffed, in your opinion?

From my perspective it seems like a pretty healthy strength. It makes the person who just got unhooked an extremely unattractive target, but cannot be leveraged to gain any other benefit than that.

What's wrong with it?

in Dbd doesnt need new anti-tunnel system. At least for now. Comment by jesterkind February 24, 2025

@Cataca said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3888920#Comment_3888920
Ds literally does what your describing though?

Nnnno?

DS only activates after an unhook, only for 60 seconds, and only if you don't do anything to progress the game in that time. That isn't a perk that bails you out of making a mistake, it's a perk that exists to protect you if the killer makes the specific decision to chase you immediately after unhook.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 24, 2025

@Nomade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3888928#Comment_3888928
I dont think my difinition is necessesarily wrong but I also dont think yours broadly is really wrong either.

Maybe second chance perk should be treated as a larger term and then you have the perks that fall under it sorted into groups according to the type of second chance effect they apply? In general I think this is more of a useful system to adopt because rather than using a term like second chance where many many perks can fall under it, you can say I dont like these specific kinds of second chances or go even more specific and say I dont like these specific perks (which people already do get that specific). So, less generalization.

I think using the term "Insurance perk" is best for stuff like DS/OTR/StB/UB and such. That more accurately conveys that they're a shield against specific types of gameplay, rather than being generic aids to help mitigate the effects of your own mistakes, from the survivor perspective.

Or just talking about the specific perks you dislike, where appropriate. That works too.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 24, 2025

@Nomade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3888920#Comment_3888920
any perk that give the survivor another chance are second chance perks. STB is a second chance because it allows the trading of a hook state from a stronger survivor to a weaker one. The stronger survivor is not necessarily the best target to chase if you have the option to chase a weaker survivor. There are A LOT of second chance perks and most of them arent even all that bad to deal with. Heck, even the ones that are meta wouldnt even be that bad if it were just one person with one of them. Instead though you end up seeing all the survivors have at least 1 and stacking them has a compounding effect on how difficult a match can potentially be for the killer.

Out of curiosity, what definition do you use for second chance perks? Maybe my definition is not completely right, and i'd like to compare.

My definition would be that it allows survivors to undo a mistake or extend a chase that should've been lost- an actual second chance at doing something so you can do it better the next time.

By that definition, the only second chance perk I can think of is Dead Hard. Maybe Deliverance too? But that's getting a little abstract with it.

DS, OTR, StB- none of those revolve around undoing mistakes or extending a chase when it would otherwise be lost. They're insurance perks against specific actions the killer could take, and don't work outside of those actions. The same goes for Unbreakable, which sometimes gets called a second chance perk.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 23, 2025

@Nomade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3888894#Comment_3888894
DS, OTR, STB mostly. There are more than that but those 3 are downright offensive. People call them anti tunnel second chance perks but thats not really what they are at all. An anti tunnel perk would activate only if you are hooked consecutively. Thats not what these perks do. DS and OTR have timers. If the killer is playing really well, it is entirely within the realm of possibility that another teammate can get hooked, and the person with DS for example gets chased again for sticking around or trying to unhook, downed and then the killer is punished because they are playing well. They didnt tunnel. This kind of thing happens all the time.

When every survivor in the match is running not just one second chance but many it becomes extremely frustrating to play against

Also, its not like I have a problem with every second chance perk either. Some of them are perfectly fine IMO like DH and SB for example (that is not even close to a comprehensive list)

I see.

The reason I wouldn't have considered those myself is that "second chance" implies they simply give you the option to bail out of a lost chase, which these perks don't- they don't undo your mistake, they punish the killer acting in a specific way.

None of them are OP either way, of course, but I was mostly wanting to know your definition.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 23, 2025

@Nomade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3888887#Comment_3888887
I dont get why survivors need their hands held so much.

Just look at how many second chance perks survivors have. It's laughable and completly outrageous that people think thats STILL not enough. @danielmaster87 is right. Survivors are so incredibly ungrateful towards the devs. Basekit BT + haste off hook, an enormouse number of OP second chances, removal of hook grabs, anti camp and so much more. Not one shred of gratitude. It is never enough no matter how much the devs give to survivors.

Anytime the devs throw killers some crumbs people come out of the woodwork and completely lose their minds. "AHHHHH this game is so killer sided. The devs never give survivors anything". Blah blah blah blah blah.

Im sorry but, it is getting asinine and frustrating.

What OP second chances are you referring to?

That's a genuine question, I'm actually not building to anything. I just see the term "second chances" thrown out a lot and I've realised that if I were to define second chance perks there'd probably only be one in the game currently, so I'm trying to figure out what people typically mean there.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 23, 2025

@Oputeeva said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3888740#Comment_3888740
Just say that your exploiting mmr to sit in low mmr so you don't want to see it

I'm engaging in good faith here, friend. I'd like to understand your position.

in Let us see our MMR rating Comment by jesterkind February 23, 2025

@Oputeeva said:
MMR SHOULD BE VISIBLE AFTER A MATCH, SO NONE DODGE, END OF IT NO NEED TO ARGUE HERE, WHO SAYS OTHERWISE IS A FAKE PROBLEM THATS HOLD THE GAME FROM GROWING

I'll bite.

How does the game grow because of visible MMR? What growth is it that we're hoping to get from showing people where they sit in the matchmaker?

in Let us see our MMR rating Comment by jesterkind February 23, 2025

As others have pointed out, it's an altruistic anti-tunnel perk, which I've personally found to be less popular even if they're all pretty damn good. Babysitter and Borrowed Time are nothing to sneeze at, but they're not as common as Off The Record or Decisive Strike because those perks add a little more guarantee to the value you'd get if the killer tunnels.

Add onto that the downside of the Exposed that can put some people off, and I'm not too surprised it isn't popular.

Plus, y'know, some people don't see tunnelling frequently enough to justify running any anti-tunnel perks. I'm in that group fairly commonly.

in Shoulder the burden Comment by jesterkind February 23, 2025

It's always been way more of a prevalent issue for content creators, since cheaters have scripts to inject themselves into specific lobbies and will prioritise streamers for that.

Personally speaking, I think I've seen cheaters literally twice. Content creators unfortunately get a severely disproportionate amount of them, from what I can gather.

in Reaching for the Banhammer Comment by jesterkind February 22, 2025

@Nomade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3888197#Comment_3888197
Tunneling is just a natural part of the game. On a team of survivors not all survivors are going to be of exactly the same skill level. Someone might be having a really good day, someone might be having a really bad one. A killer is going to find the weakest person on a team and down them, and then because they are the weakest player on the team they are more likely to make more mistakes and be downed more. Its not a malicious thing. If you were playing killer and you had at least 1 and probably more gens pop by the time you hooked your first survivor are you going to pick the strongest person on the other team to commit to or are you going to pick some of the weaker players?

Gens go by way way way too fast for killers to just hook random survivors if the team they are playing against is good and they are being efficient on gens. There is just no way to do it. As frustrating as being tunneled out can be, it is often just necessesary for killers to keep up against good survivors unless you want every match to devolve into playing against Nurse and Blight only.

If people want for a meta to exist where killers dont tunnel as much survivors must be willing to accept certain concessions to keep the game fair. Either gens need to have far, far more ticks to completion or the slowdown that killers have needs to be a lot stronger, and or the killer needs to be able to use a 3 gen to slow the game down to a point where they can catch up.

Every single time I have ever brought this up, people just gaslight me and tell me i'm wrong or try to shift the discussion away from that point.

You don't have to tunnel to avoid letting the strongest survivor dictate your chase. Hell, you don't even need to tunnel to capitalise on the weakest link, necessarily- you can go chase and hook other people then choose the weaker player at crucial moments without actually chasing them as soon as they're unhooked.

Beyond that, I have an issue with how the entire breadth of the game encompassed by simply not tunnelling is reduced down to playing directionlessly or "randomly", as you say here.

It's not a lack of skill or a lack of strategy to actually be engaging with the macro skill expression of this game, and in fact the rewards you get for doing it effectively are pretty solid if you're in any game other than the worst case scenario of survivors that are better than you and using stacked, unfair tools.

What we should be moving forward to is a state of the game where any killer who wants good results should be expected not to use shortcuts that minimise their opponent's ability to respond, and to instead actually outplay their opponents fully. In a few small ways that will include killer buffs (or more accurately a few specific survivor nerfs), but nothing nearly as widespread as making generators take longer by default.

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 21, 2025

@StalkingYou said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887130#Comment_3887130
if you are getting tunneled and are dead at 5 gens, that is not the killers problem.

any survivor who's good in chase and has OTR can make the infamous "5 gen tunnel" turn into a 1k for the killer.

The problem with this line of thinking is that it puts two requirements on the survivor player that aren't reflected in any requirements for the killer player.

In order to beat tunnelling, a survivor both has to be disproportionately skilled in chase and only bringing three perks of their own actual choice, since one slot has to be reserved for OTR.

By contrast, the killer player needs no dedicated perks to attempt to tunnel, and it requires disproportionately less skill in chase to do considering that the survivor starts the chase out of position and down a health state.

Doesn't that sound unbalanced to you?

in yay guys, more anti-killer changes coming soon Comment by jesterkind February 21, 2025

@biggybiggybiggens said:
You're never going to fix people wanting to go next. There are too many reasons why a person would want to go next. Maybe they don't like the map, Killer, their teammates, equipped wrong perk, their mom told them to get off, they got caught playing at work, they just feel like it, etc… Obviously they actually can't solve the overarching problem with a players mentality where they feel they just have to d/c for whatever split second reason during a game.
These are the same people that won't be stopped when it comes to disconnecting. Ah, they can't kill themselves on hook anymore..? Now they'll just press "Esc" and d/c. Wait..now they can't press "Esc" and d/c anymore..? Time to just Ctrl-Alt-Delete to end the process. Oh shoot…now BHVR somehow implemented a way that they can't press Ctr-Alt-Delete anymore in this alternate reality..? Looks like it's time to just unplug the CPU power cable from the wall and throw it in the street.
You can't make people do what they don't want to do and if the amount of people that are "Going Next" is a big enough chunk of the DBD fan base, I'll be in the background ROFL while watching BHVR try to fix something that simply can't be fixed. Hopefully the amount of players that do it is moderately low.

You don't have to stop it outright, you just have to make sure that whenever someone leaves a match early, they get the DC penalty.

Eventually, that'll mean leaving the match prevents you from "going next" because you can't queue up again, meaning people will be at least a little bit more discerning about when to leave.

in Comments on developers QoL upcoming changes from 9k hours player: 'Go Next' Prevention Comment by jesterkind February 21, 2025

@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887715#Comment_3887715
I can almost guarantee that will make the issue worse if we do not address why people want to go next.

Would that not be what the second half of the roadmap is for? Addressing slugging, tunnelling, and camping seems like they're tackling all the unpleasant balance stuff that can lead to miserable games.

What would need to be done, separate from the context of that roadmap, is a combination of stricter penalties and addressing common complaints— you can't just cherrypick the reasons for going next that are worth talking about when so many instances are just giving up because the match didn't immediately go their way, after all.

in Comments on developers QoL upcoming changes from 9k hours player: 'Go Next' Prevention Comment by jesterkind February 20, 2025

They aren't a failure, there are just some bad examples. There are good walls too, like the ones in the generator-controlled walls on Gideon or the one adjacent to the vault in Torment Creek's (? I think? I get these maps mixed up) main building- those are walls that actually add some texture and decision making to the gameplay, they're a good example of what walls could be.

On the flipside, there are definitely some walls that need to go. Stuff like the walls in Badham's main building that have to be broken or you can't hook anyone, those are the kind of walls that need adjustments.

They're not a bad concept, it's just that a lot of them don't add any variation to the gameplay, they're just an extra chore you have to finish or that loop won't be usable.

in It's Past Time to Remove Breakable Walls Comment by jesterkind February 20, 2025

@danielmaster87 said:
I don't think they're gonna nerf DS. They did so much work on that numbers change, buffing it to 4 seconds when it was overpowered at 3, they won't soon undo it.
And I know people will knock on the Babysitter take, but they're not seeing the full picture. Just because it's not as used as DS or OTR doesn't mean it's not ridiculous. Like he said, you're literally running faster than the killer and get Lucky Break for 30 seconds. That's abusable by SWF, who are more likely to use it than solo because they can communicate/dedicate an unhooker. It consistently being given to the unhooked probably makes it better than OTR.
But that's mostly all I can say. We know the game doesn't need more anti-tunnel, but maybe it'll end up replacing the bad system we have now.

How on earth do you abuse Babysitter? Haste is pretty much the only anti-tunnel effect that categorically cannot be weaponised under any circumstance.

You can't use it to bodyblock, you can't bait the killer into a stun, you don't get any shield of invincibility to progress the game with… I guess you could argue someone can use that Haste to get to a gen quicker, but I don't know that I'd call that abusing the perk.

in Dbd doesnt need new anti-tunnel system. At least for now. Comment by jesterkind February 20, 2025

I think it's a little unhelpful to frame "playing fair" as a strategy, personally. From context, I'm assuming this is about tunnelling and slugging (+ to a lesser degree camping), since that's the big discourse at the moment— and in that context, "playing fair" is not a strategy, "playing fair" encompasses the entire game that isn't those three things in particular.

So, what's being asked here is kinda just "what do you think is unbalanced about the game in general", which could be a fairly long list lol

If I were to give an answer, though, toolboxes. I think toolboxes are quite unbalanced and do give me trouble at the moment, I think it'd be completely appropriate to rework the repair speed to something else. On top of that, specific maps are still busted- in either direction, but since killer was specified, maps like Garden of Joy and Badham are nightmares to play on.

in Killers that try to "fair play" as much as possible Comment by jesterkind February 20, 2025

@Roco45 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887422#Comment_3887422
Nope, other games are completely relevant. If the vast majority of the gaming community and all other asymm games don't have these issues that you claim DC penalties need to combat, especially DC penalties this severe, it is completely relevant. You just don't want to talk about it because it highlights your flawed logic and you'd rather stay on your straw horse.
There also is an objective measure of why people are going next lol You can attempt to state that SoloQ does that for every reason under the sun, but that is false and there are common majority reasons why Survs either DC or go next. There is also a clear cut reason why slugging has become so common place that BHVR is scrambling to fix it.
I find your unwillingness to talk about why the game clearly isn't fun for SoloQ players or Killers and how to actually fix that, not conducive to an actual discussion. You can stay in fantasy land, I'm not going to reply to you anymore lol

Well, the problem with that first part is, we're not building a game from scratch. DBD already has DC penalties that work the way they do- if we're talking about them, then it is necessary to justify changing them, which so far you haven't done. The burden of proof is on you here, not me, because you're the one pitching a change- or at least implying that a change should be made.

As to the objective measure of why people are going next… there really isn't. There obviously isn't an objective one, but assuming you just mean a commonly accepted one… what is it? I've seen a hundred different reasons up to and including just not liking whichever killer is being played. What would you say the reason is?

Same for slugging. I've seen a variety of reasons given and a lot of them are like, observably just wrong, not even up for debate. Which one are you referring to?

I'm not unwilling to talk about why the game isn't fun for various players, that's just not what we started with. We started with talking about the DC penalty, which is what I've been attempting to continue talking about.

in Faster Bleedout vs Basekit Unbreakable For Stopping Slugging Comment by jesterkind February 20, 2025

@Roco45 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887335#Comment_3887335
Do you? Because 5 really isn't that much, especially if you know actually anything about how the penalty system in DBD works, because it doesn't have to be five consecutive DC's either. Though you were in another thread not even understanding how the penalty for gen speed works when multiple survs are on a gen, so that's not surprising.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887315#Comment_3887315
You should re-read my comments, I'm not re explaining because you skipped over everything I said. Don't respond if you aren't going to actually read. Try again with another alt pls.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887312#Comment_3887312
DC penalties to this severity, exist only to keep a game functional that's in a highly competitive state, mostly always esports games. That's a fact. Name another asymm or pvp game, that's not esports, that locks players out for 72 hrs after 7 DCs or have penalty time limits that deescalate only a single level of severity, after 24 hrs, taking an entire week to deescalate 7 DC's back to start. Then explain to me why DBD needs that, but doesn't need competitive balancing.
Clearly DBD is unfun and miserable, that's why BHVR has to urgently do a "QoL update" and halt actual content, because most Survs don't want to be in a match (Most Survs are SoloQ) lol You also never answered, why aren't all PVP games filled with bots or empty lobbies if DC penalties are soooooo needed yet almost all PVP games lack DC penalties? Maybe it's because other PVP games are actually fun and engaging, hmmmm?
You and I both know that BHVR should be focusing on fixing why people are DCing and going next, not further penalizing players because they don't want to sit in a unfun match and no amount of force is going to do that. Also let's be clear, the going next epidemic is a SoloQ issue and the penalties that are going to be handed out to those who die at 2nd hook phase, is an issue that is solely going to decimate SoloQ even more, SWF don't do that.
If your intent is to shill for the game until all that is left are sweaty S-Tier Killers and SWF groups, then keep on trucking, you will surely get that!

I'm not mentioning other games because they're irrelevant. We're not talking about other games, and we're not even talking about the balancing of DBD, we're talking about a very specific thing: Should people be allowed to DC multiple times in the span of a day without a severe penalty.

The answer is, of course, no, no they should not.

Do you know what makes my solo queue games miserable most frequently? It's people leaving matches. Giving up on hook especially, but even DCing can put a team on the back foot since the DC bots aren't that good. People feeling entitled to just give up at the drop of a hat and doom the rest of the match is what makes games miserable, and does need to be kept in check by penalties. It's also why this "go next prevention" mechanic they're talking about is a good idea (in theory, depending on how it's done), because a lot of people don't even have to deal with the penalty on account of just leaving the game via hook instead.

The problem with invoking the idea of "looking at why people are going next" is that if you ask ten people why, they'll give you eleven different answers, and eight of them will be nonsense. There's no objective measure of what supposedly makes the game miserable- there isn't even a unified measure of what most people would agree makes the game miserable in their opinion.

Still, all of that is a moot point, because obviously BHVR are trying to improve the experience, that's what the entire back half of the roadmap is for. It's just very, very silly to be arguing in favour of lesser DC penalties when people going next is a big chunk of what actually harms the game.

in Faster Bleedout vs Basekit Unbreakable For Stopping Slugging Comment by jesterkind February 20, 2025

@XtremeDBD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3887264#Comment_3887264
I think i only know the first 3 cus of videos ive seen (mostly during the hacker epidemic).
Its First 1 minute, than 5 or 7 id remember, then an hour ...

To my knowledge, I think 5 DCs is 24 hours?

I've never seen it myself though, obviously lol