bobateo
bobateo
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@Phasmamain said:
Is there really any way to fix this? If someone doesn’t want to play a match they won’t even if it means just going AFK
Yep, had a teammate quit halfway through a match with a Legion. Got them off the hook, they stood there and got a deep wound, let the time on the deep wound put them in the dying state. Thankfully, the rest of us realized they'd gone down to DW and left them for the killer to hook again. I think the killer realized it too, they gave us space to get one more gen completed virtually uncontested and then it was game on as normally. Ended up a 3K (he let me have the hatch at the end), but at least the 4 of us still in the game managed to salvage something.
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Alert is probably the best bet, but still not great. I do think the perk needs to be changed.
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I don't think my escape rate has changed by much overall. I'd say most matches are still a 3-4K overall with probably more 0Ks than I'm used to seeing and rare 2Ks. But the side objectives are nice. The speed bonus from the voids have come in clutch in a couple of games both for survs and Killers. So far it feels like this event has 'shaken up' game play more than any patch. lol
Bloodpoints seem to be plentiful in most games and I appreciate the prevalence of the event BP item.
People do seem to be interacting a lot with the event and as the event has progressed, I've noticed less survivors simply quitting because they had all their void juice and less killers actively trying to camp or tunnel the first hook. Maybe the first wave of people trying to the match cosmetics is over? IDK.
But I did notice a weird trend last night. Saw it mostly with Killers, not sure if survs can do it to, where they were hitting the void rifts to make them disappear. It wasn't just them depositing rift energy because the ones I saw deposited rift energy then immediately went to hit the other rifts in the area.
Last night was the 'worst' for me in terms of playing. The Killers who did camp and tunnel on the first hook were really dedicated to it and I had more matches with possible 2 man SWFs who - I think - were trying to help each other complete challenges for things like blinding and stunning the Killer which inevitably resulted in catastrophic losses because they got downed so fast and often 2 at a time. I don't think they completed those challenges.....
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@Nathan13 said:
I never trust stats period. Because how many of those kills were due to survivors giving up??
You can say the same in the opposite direction. Are the kill rates depressed because of Killers going AFK? Not to mention that raw suicide on hook numbers wouldn't tell a complete story either. I have a lot of games where the second to last surv kills themself on hook to give another surv a better chance at the hatch. I've seen others suicide on hook when the game is obviously lost. (1 surv dead, they're on 2nd hook stage, someone else got downed, and there is 4 or 5 gens left). Sure there's a chance the game might turn around, but in the vast majority of cases, it's a 4K. Maybe 3K if the last dude gets the hatch.
In short, hook suicides aren't necessarily an indication that the amount of escapes significantly changed due to it.
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Depends -
For Killer or Surv, if I have an obnoxious tome to complete, then any significant progress made in a match is a win. That also applies to things like the current event and the extra cosmetics. If I'm able to get my 30 void points, then I'm happy.
Outside of those, for surv, I'm perfectly happy if I die, but overall contributed to the escape of my teammates and especially glad if we get down to endgame and I die, but that death allows another to get out. Escaping isn't really a hallmark for me as surv of 'victory' or 'defeat' just because there can be a lot of things that heavy tilt the game in one direction or another and since many of those factors are largely outside of my control, I just roll with it. Same for Killer. I'm more likely to let at least 2 survs escape if its pretty obvious I'm going against people who have way less experience than I do. I can't help it. I feel bad otherwise. lol.
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That is amazing. Thank you.
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@Nun_So_Vile said:
Everyone thinks they're a down bad Wesker simp until they're stuck with him for a day and realize he talks about himself nonstop.
Unless it's Chris. Then he talk about Chris non stop. :D
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Want to? It can depend. On what's going on. I'm not going to get irritated by teammates trying to get that last bit on a gen/mistimed how much time they had to come get me or things like that. But if it's pretty obvious that the rest of the team is just messing around, then I don't particularly want to stay in the match. I will in most cases.
The only ones I won't stay for is when it's obvious that most/all of the other survs are purposefully throwing the match. There's just no point in bothering to stay.
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Any number I didn't post, assume agreement/didn't have anything specific to add.
#1 Not necessarily - Survs (especially in soloQ) will leave teammates behind and Killers already force people out of the gates to reduce the number of survs that they have to deal with. How common that is? I honestly haven't clue besides witnessing it enough to know that it happens enough to remember.
#2 I suspect some Killers will try to slug for the 4K, at least in the beginning. If the UB basekit makes it too much of hassle to achieve and results in more surv escapes, then most will stop. But, I also think it's possible that some will want the 'quick' 4K that slugging promises, and matches will turn into a long, drawn out slug/res/slug/res until either gens get finished and most survs escape by playing around the Killer trying to slug everyone or bleed out timers mercifully end the match with a variation of 1-2 survs escaping.
#8 Tentative disagreement. I understand what you're saying and do think it has merit. However, this change potentially makes slugging way to appealing for Killers and some already have high slugging potential. Not allowing survs to pick themselves up would, I think, make matches a disaster, especially once 1 surv is already out. Now, whether or not a surv should be able to pick themselves up more than twice? Maybe not.
#9 I don't fundamentally have a problem with a nonboon perk being stronger than a boon perk because boon perks a.) can give their benefit to multiple people (and multiple people at the same time), including the character w/ the perk, b.) can give that effect to the same person multiple times with no cool down and c.) multiple boons can be placed on one totem. The later can create some pretty powerful effects. But 100% may be way too much. Until I see it play out in matches, I can't really say beyond, I suspect, this is to give a counter to Killers with high slugging potential.
In regards to your comments on perk changes - survivor or killer, I agree that potential impacts here are huge to the point of making this change seem nonsensical. Is it going to make some perks way to powerful? Will it make others completely trash? Are some perks now going to near the sad state of 'must have'? What will it mean for future perks? More Killer perks to increase time spent on the ground (yikes! being slugged is already pretty boring)? Or keep survs from getting up at all? More survivor perks to decrease time spent on the ground/prevent being put on the ground?
If this entire thing is being done so that mori animations are 'seen more', I just. Wow. What a silly reason. I could be in the minority here, but I don't find mori animations worth watching after 5th time that I've seen them. I hope the there is a different and more gameplay oriented reason.
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With the mori change, not have basekit unbreakable would mean that UB would pretty much become a required perk. Builds that allowed for fast pickup would also start to fall if not fall into highly necessary. I wouldn't be a fan a game change that, just to have a shot at escaping, would make certain perks more or less required.
Whether or not the time length for the base UB needs to be longer, or if it needs to be change to a limited number of times per match is definitely in question.
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@kingcarl2012 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3204287#Comment_3204287
RIP 4man slug race
As dumb as it is, this truly saddens me. I think I've only had 1 or 2 slug races in DBD and while it's not something I'd want often. They were a fun break on the rare occasions that they happened. Long live the 3 man slug race?
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719674#Comment_2719674
If your intent is to prove a general camping point, doing so with specific builds and Killers is inherently a biased starting point. I don't see how that can even be in question: intentionally or not, you've skewed your data and heavily limited its scope. I wouldn't even say it's that useful as a test case to check your methodology, beyond "yes you can still camp".
Literally every conversation regarding camping on this forum, attempts to fix facecamping, and developer commentary have delineated between facecamping and more general proxy camping (and all sorts of grey areas in between). The advice to deal with it is always regarding facecamping--because, by definition, facecamping precludes looking around and patrolling nearby gens or going for anyone else. And then there's the trap-setting Killers. Which I think proves my point about why we need to define what we're talking about when we bring up camping.
I mean do you honestly expect two people to encompass the scope you think is valid? This is the point where you throw your hat into the ring to help. And no, I think this is the point you maybe hung up on. How to handle camping is not SPECIFIC. Not specific to Killer. No specific to Map. Not specific to what the Killer perks. Not specific to survs perks. You do not need to test for those variable when those variable ARE NOT IN QUESTION.
You're moving the goalposts a bit here. You want them to test under the scenerio you think is relevant despite their stated goals. You're trying to defend EOC camping when CLEARLY these tests are not about EOG. And are not about the things you're talking about. At all.
And no, trap setting doesn't 'prove your point' because you haven't actually laid out a point there. And lms, as someone who predominately plays Trapper, I own teams that I don't have to camp. It's pretty damn easy until higher levels. Get one person down and lay some traps. I can go freely pressure other gens and literally wait for someone to step into a trap. This is knowing that against good teams, I'll probably get creamed. Yet despite that, I let people out because I don't like shitting on other people. And that's what camping does and it's very lucrative. I get 3K's easy. Sometimes because of surv mistakes, but alot of it? Just how easy camping is.
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Audodidact - COH has completely overshadowed it and it wasn't that great to begin with. But damn, when it works, it works.
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@emodeshort said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719663#Comment_2719663
Yeah, I'll try to explain it to you again, but after that I literally give up.
"In response to the gen rush, we gave survivors boon totems, which encourage them to make secondary goals, I believe this was a step in the right direction"
I open this paragraph with the comparison of gen rush with tunneling, and use boon totems as an example of what to do to encourage killers not to camp. Boon totems are great, They encourage survivors not to just stick to generators and do other things for that extra edge. and I believe that for the most part, they will do the game more good than harm. But I end the paragraph with the only mention of CoH in the entire post.
"although I think a boon totem in specific needs Changes *cof cof CoH*"
I did this because CoH can take all the pressure off a killer if he loses survivor for a few seconds, destroy tri-gen strategies, and obliterate some killers like twins and hag.
At no point did I compare CoH with tunnel and camping, the only comparison was between Tunnel and Camp with GenRush, and with boon totems and a possible incentive to make killers not use this strategy. I didn't compare CoH to anything in particular, and if after that you still think I did, I literally give up, think what you want.
I appreciate your clarification. However, I have to ask, why do you think strats as old as camping and tunneling are the same as boons? Boons don't inherently encourage Killers to not camp. Especially not COH. And I think I roughly understand that your issue is with COH in particular, but why? Yes, it can cost the Killer pressure, but why shouldn't it? If a boon doesn't give survs - as an individual or a team - an advantage, why bother taking it? And yes, 3 gens are a big deal for Killer! But they are also a big deal for survs in breaking. I'm not sure what your point here is.
KIllers need to protect a 3 gen, survs need to break it. That's the game?
Gen rush is partly a thing because of tunneling and camping. The best - generally - thing survs can do is slam out gens, especially with a campy killer. If you're not comparing COH to camping and tunneling and I am somewhat struggling for what's frustrating you here and I do, honestly want to understand.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719609#Comment_2719609
I disagree with your disagreeing. If you don't record the Survivor perks, you're not going to have a starting point for asking any further questions, because you've laser-focused on trying to prove a point. And in the process, you've eliminated a lot of information that might be useful for eliminating games that were pointless in general--e.g. a team full of people who don't even have a full set of perks, in which case we can predict that basically anything would have been strong. Not recording information because it might not be useful yet is not a good habit.
And if you don't actually establish what you mean by camping, both your testing and results are meaningless for communication. If you can't even agree what you're talking about, you can't answer the question. And if you mean "camping in general" but you only test facecamping Bubba, what we've proved is that Bubba can facecamp well--but not why, especially if you ran an optimal build for that. "Is a build designed to do one thing on the Killer best suited to it good at that thing" is a very different question from "is facecamping an effective strategy in general" is a very different one from "are all forms of camping effective", and in the last case you'd need to make a case for why this is even worth asking--you have, after all, ruled out literally half of the ways a Killer can locate Survivors at that point.
Incorrect. You will only be "laser like focused on trying..." if you're biased. You're assumption is that the people doing this are automatically biased which, from this thread, you don't know. They're playing games and seeing what happens "out in the wild" which is valid for the assumptions presented. You can, from a general set of data, start to ID trends, if the trends are actually there. Both people have offered to have you and others provide your own data set, which, from what I can see, you have declined to do. Why is that?
And no, it isn't useless, because the advice to dealing with camping doesn't change. No one delinates between [x camping] and [y camping] except during ECG. Therefore, the question is interesting but not valid for the purposes of this test.
You are kind of putting the cart waaaaay before the horse. But I respect your disagreement! I would suggest if you care about this topic to get enough people together to test it to your satisfaction.
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@ShinobuSK said:
Imagine being a main
Imagine all the people.....
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@emodeshort said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719656#Comment_2719656
I'm literally not comparing, I really don't know why you think that. I'll assume you're trolling because it doesn't really make sense
You can assume that if you want. However, you might want to go back and read your opening post and then clarify your actual intention.
Also, accusing someone of being 'a troll' because they don't agree with the POV you present is not a valid strat.
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@steamed_hamzzz said:
If survivors want to get out of a game fast then they can simply kill themselves on hook, be it a legitimate reason for wanting out i.e. cheaters, trolls ect or just “rage quitting” because they don’t like a certain killer
killers on the other hand have no such luxury, If they’re being bullied by a toxic SWF or going up against cheaters then they just have to grin and bear it or DC and receive a penalty.
My question is how can this be addressed?
Does the killer need a way to end games fast? Maybe something like being able to trigger the end game collapse before all gens are done?
Or maybe change the way self unhooks work? Because even though there should always be a small chance of unhooking yourself, abusing this mechanic and purposely killing yourself just screws over the rest of the team so it’s a tricky one to address
Because you as the Killer can actually yeet people out of the game. survivors have no mechanic to toss a killer out of the game in the same way.
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I did read your post and you are comparing them. You cannot, absolutely cannot take complaints about tunneling and camping and compare them to complaints about ONE boon totem. Two of those have been around for literal years. The other has existed for a few months.
And COH 'not encouraging better playstyles' is very vague. What do yo mean there? There are, for Killer and surv, a handful of things that actually matter. What deplorable playstyle does COH encourage?
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@SvarturSteinn said:
I'll give you a few easy examples to get started;
Dead Hard is a perfectly balanced perk.
CoH takes too long to bless a totem.
NOED is unfair because it rewards no skill.
Tell me you're a killer main without telling me you are because.....
You think people using DH don't understand how to use DH and it's just a 'free win'.
You think that having one area for survs that is moderately safe is #########.
You think I should be able to do ######### all game and at least get a 2K is cool.
See? people who play survivor can do that too and it's still dumb af.
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@AsherFrost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719512#Comment_2719512
Tbh I've never once heard anyone complain about lithe
They came for DH they will eventually come for all exhaustion perks. (This is a joke and only a joke.)
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@emodeshort said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719633#Comment_2719633
I never said that circle of healing does anything against camping or tunneling, I just said that, unlike the other boon totems, CoH is overpowered, and I don't use that word lightly. and we are Speaking of lowering some numbers in a perk vs creating an entirely new mechanic that doesn't punish innocent players and isn't easily exploitable. Two different things, one is easier than the other, and this thread wasn't even about the CoH, I just used the boon totems as an example of positive reinforcement with the exception of CoH because that was actually a bad idea.
It doesn't sound to me like you are speaking of "lowering numbers". You're comparing a new perk to old strats. These two things are not comparable at the end of the day. Yes, survivors hate being tunneled/camped out of a game. This is not new. What does that have to do with CoH? Nothing.
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@emodeshort said:
I always see complaints about how killers that tunnel and camp are bad, or they are boring and should be punished in some way and blah blah blah. The thing is, This playstyle, as tedious as it is, is a valid strategy, punishing those who use it will only fuel this gang fight that the dead by daylight discussion has become. We should encourage killers not to camp, rather than punish camping itself. In response to the gen rush, we gave survivors boon totems, which encourage them to make secondary goals, I believe this was a step in the right direction, although I think a boon totem in specific needs Changes *cof cof CoH*
We don't have anything like that for killers, except maybe, devour hope, but it's a totem, not exactly the most consistent thing available.
COH is new, tunneling and camping have been around forever. Is that to say COH shouldn't be nerfed? No. But to use a relatively new perk as a defense against 2 strategies that effectively lock at least 1 survivor out from playing the game is not the defense you think it is. There is no way to 'encourage Killers not to camp/tunnel' without punishing it. You have to make the strats less viable to get a 2 or a more K from the outset. Meaning, camping can't be lucrative at 1 gen completed and 1 hook. Survs need (potentially) better tools to deal with being tunneled.
I have literally body blocked Killers from a recently unhooked teammate and had them ignore me to go get that person. There's nothing I can do as a teammate in that scenario because the Killer is always faster than me except carry a flashlight and hope I can get into position soon enough to prevent the second hook. (Which is time I'm not doing gens, so yay, free pressure for the Killer.)
Camping has been around forever.
And COH does absolutely NOTHING against tunneling or camping.
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@RainehDaze said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719555#Comment_2719555
You'd also want to record Survivor perks, is the thing.
And have an agreed-upon procedure for camping. Are we facecamping? Proxy camping? Try and fake people into thinking you've left the hook? Or are you just standing there being Bubba, waiting?
Mmm, I disagree about survivor perks for one reason. BT is the strongest surv perk against camping and it's a hugely run perk, especially in SWFs. The rest are probably Killer dependent as far as effectiveness goes which gets way too granular for a "is camping weak" question. Because again the arguement isn't "is camping weak if survivors are against [killer perks]" or "is camping weak against [Killer] if survs run [these perks].
Camping advice across the internet is NOT that granular. No one is telling survs to run any perk aside from maybe BT. In fact most of it is "if you aren't in a SWF coordination a save against anyone but Bubba, let them die." It's very general to survivors "just be 'efficient' on gen and you will get a 3E". No perks. No map. No other variable. Therefore, other variables don't need to be tested at this point.
And I think it's pretty apparent from our two testers that they are face camping. However, that is an interesting question because some Killers will excel at face camping while others excel at what would probably be called proxy camping. Example, my friend gets downed by a Huntress and hooked. Huntress goes so far away that I can't hear her lullaby. I go to get my friend and get sniped by Iri head. (She later admitted in post game that was her strat.) I couldn't even be mad, because to make that shot, she had to have a practiced a bit.
BUT even that said. This is a "is camping weak" test which can encompass any type of camping at this point.
The questions you're asking are relevant, but they are relevant later down the line. If it's established that camping is actually pretty strong, then you start to dig into the specifics, but you need a general baseline first before you can dig into the specifics of this [Killer], those [perks], [etc] become relevant.
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Myers on an indoor map when the Killer made the map offering. I know what's about to happen and none of it is good lol. Also Myers once it becomes apparent he's running the tombstone thingy. I want to just hide in lockers at the point I hear T3 pop.
Artist - just because I hate the noises she makes. Makes my ears hurt.
Third place is Doctor - most matches are okay, but I hate the shock mechanic. I hate my screen going weird. And I hate snapping out of it.
The runner's up are Plague and Legion for a very specific reason. I like running healing builds of all kinds and these two just make those builds absolutely pointless. Hurts man.
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@NOEDENJOYER said:
I'm a killer main, and I generally enjoy the role, however, I just played a match against a TTV that made me beyond frustrated that I immediately switched to survivor after only one match.
For context, this is a TTV in a 4-man SWF, I entered their chat, said my pleasantries and proceeded to load into the match. I'm Demogorgon, and we loaded into Haddonfield. So I already know that I'm not going to have a pleasant experience. For the entirety of the game, the survivors were very efficient, splitting up, doing gens, holding W incredibly early (which on Haddonfield.. bruh), body blocking for each other, using COH. Fine, all of these things can be frustrating for me as the killer, but the survivors should do these things, it helps them survive, naturally.
However, because of the nature of the map and how the survivors are playing, along with the fact that I'm Demogorgon with trash perks (Spies from the shadows, jolt, bitter murmur, BBQ) against their meta perks, I can't win by playing ''fair and nice'' as they put it. It's taking too long to down people because they're holding W on a survivor-sided map, so to apply pressure, I decide to camp hooks more and patrol. By doing this, I squeezed a 3K out, and yes, it wasn't interesting and I could tell it wasn't fun for them, but I did it anyway, because I wasn't going to allow myself to have 2-3 chases with zero kills by the time all the generators are done.
Load into the post-game chat, of course, everyone is salty, upset, toxic, and telling me that I face camped every hook and that I shouldn't have bothered to ''GL & HF'' in their stream if I was going to do that. I explained my position, got practically ignored with my reasoning and then told that I shouldn't face camp because X Y Z reason that wasn't even valid in a debate and that if I can't win without camping, that I should just accept my lose.
It's the sense of entitlement and double standards that makes me hate playing killer. Survivors expect killers to not play at their most efficient when they do so themselves, and that the killer merely exists for their pleasure and enjoyment. Forget about the killers enjoyment right? Let's bring COH, Haddonfield, Hold W extra early, meta perks, 4-man SWF with comms and then expect the killer to accept the bullying and loss.
Honestly, just have more sympathy for killers (and for the other side in general).
I mean, salty people are salty people. Good on you for wishing them well and don't take what they say to heart. But, I would also caution you from taking a 4 man SWF as 'ALL SURVIVORS'. No, most people do not think this way, or care. It was crappy of them to get on your case, but they are 4 people out of a player base of thousands.
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@wewantbetterfun said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2717548#Comment_2717548
if it is, why everyone use DH over SP?
Because they have more control over it's use. Imagine for a moment that SB was tied to E key, allowing survivor the choice on when to use it. I would be dollars to donuts that you'd see SB waaaaaaaay more than DH.
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@wewantbetterfun said:
None.
Reach a pallet/window they don't deserve extending the loop by 2 gens? removed
Killer outplaying you and you get your jail free card? removed
dead hard hit validation abuse (there's no way with the amount of validation killers get you'd get this often exhausted on the ground) removed
using different exhaustion perks so at least when they don't reach a pallet/window they don't deserve the chase simply ends
If dead hard alone would be removed killers would be easily nearly half as hard as it currently is, survivors running dead ahrd are so insecure about their looping skills they simply cannot live without their jail free skilless perk, I once played with some good survivors who always ran dead hard and we played a kill your friends and removed perk, they couldn't last more than 2 loops without dead hard
If you are a survivor constantly running dead hard, try to live without your second chance perk.
You're working off of a bit of a faulty assumption here. Good survivors, and I mean ones that genuinely good, understand the exact value they can get out of DH in most circumstances.
They go to a weaker pallet or a window, knowing they can reach it with DH to save a stronger pallet for later in the game.
They fully understand the mindgames, but set it up to let them reach a window after the killer has BL'ed and is zooming around.
They're using DH to set up a safe unhook save in a normally unsafe situation.
They're using DH to get a blind save/wiggle off save.
My point is, survivors who are good with DH aren't good by accident and just putting on the perk. They know what they're doing and most of those survivors are perfectly comfortable using other exhaustion perks or no exhaustion perks at all. They just play differently when they do. And, for full transparency, I am not one of those survivors (I suck with DH), but I do watch a few of them on YT and Twitch. There is nothing accidental about what they do with DH.
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@AngyKiller said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2719440#Comment_2719440
'I can see why you'd think that is the proper way to run the study, but if you want to really analyze the strength of camping you need to give each killer the strongest loadout for camping.'
Wrong. If you want to look at the power of camping and ONLY camping across every Killer, you do proper scientific method; You remove or normalize all variables possible.
Survivors: Short of finding a crew to do all this in KYF; not possible to normalize.
Maps: Again, short of KYF; not possible to normalize.
Powers: Change per Killer.
Perks: You pick the same perks on the same Killers. In this way, you're removing the PERKS as a variable towards your study.
Since you're studying how well CAMPING works, and ONLY CAMPING; you use the same perks per Killer. Anything else is contaminating your study.
It stops being 'How strong is Camping?' and becomes 'How powerful is <Killer> at Camping with the best possible perks?'. Which is a different test all together.
Not quite - you only would need to control for variables to that degree if you are attempting to look at very specific questions. I.E. "Is basement Bubba more effective on x map or y map", "which survivor load out can combat camping if [Killer] is running [these perks]". What these two are looking at is "is camping as weak as people say". The only variable that might need some control at that point is: is the Killer pool represented over a breadth of games. By Killer pool, I mean powers and possibly speed. There's probably little reason to test both Hag and Trapper for example. Their powers are very similar and would probably be applied in a similar manner for camping. (Hi basement!) And even that's iffy because any Killer can be used to camp, certain perk loadouts will be better for certain Killers, and survivor load outs can range from all over the place to pure meta builds.
None of that really matters at this point because the argument for camping isn't [on this map], [with these perks], and/or [against this Killer] camping is weak. It's that camping in general, even against Bubba, is weak if survivors play "efficiently". So, testing Bubba is completely valid.
Ideally, 50 players would come together, split up all the killers, record their results on K/E and gens with possibly some other easily recorded data - Killer perks and maps. At that point, trends (if any exist) can then be seen and tested. But I doubt anyone wants to dive that deep.
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STBL on a Myers with whatever the add-on is that let's him insta-yeet when he powers up. Spent most of the match avoiding him because I automatically assume all Myers are running that add-on. Managed to power through the gens with my team but heard the knife pop and watched three of them go down like dominoes.
Saw the hatch, bee-lined for it, but he caught up to me. It was a close race though!
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Playing surv and spent 3 bloody party streamers.
Match 1 - Steve teammate who decided that 3rd hooking early was the way to go
Match 2 - got tunneled by a pig. (Not faulting the Pig, but still sucked.)
Match 3 - Well not much I can say about match 3
There was no match 4 w/ streamers. I don't think anyone deserves them now. Especially since it's Midwich lol.
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@StarLost said:
This is one of those things that becomes pretty awkward for me, as I do try to consider that there is a living, breathing human on the other end of those avatars.
So - the situation. We've all been there.
Game starts, I manage to catch someone and they rage DC. Possibly other players follow. Or more annoying, just goes and stands AFK next to a hook somewhere.
Now, there are 2 or 3 survivors left, and maybe 3 or 4 gens.
I can either close the game out, or I can give them a break, chase them around, wound them, let them earn some BP and maybe let them escape.
I tend to do the latter. I don't like punishing other players because of one rager or troll and I feel legit bad.
However, wow - for every team that thanks me for doing this, another rages at me for 'holding the game hostage'. And of course, I get raged at if I just annihilate everyone.
It sort of feels like there is no right move here.
TL/DR: Survivors, in a situation where someone rage DCs or AFKs, would you prefer it if the killer just closes the game out ASAP, or would you prefer it if they went easy and let you earn some BP/escape?
I would rather your second option. Heck, I had a game 2 DCs and the other surv went AFK so the Killer and I played around with chases for a bit and then let them hook me.
But, I don't care too much one way or another. DCs are frustrating for both sides. So, I can understand Killers and/or Survivors just wanting to get it over with as fast as possible too.
People chewing you out though is utterly ridiculous.
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@bibibib8 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2408295#Comment_2408295
The downside of no mither is nothing compare to be able to pick yourself up. Some player know exactly where to go down because they know certain area are bug and the killer cant pick them up just like when we had the breakdown bug no mither was in a lot of game during that time. The sad thing is you need bug to exploit the perk
If any Killer let's a No Mither user pick themselves up, that's on the Killer. You know it from the start of the trail.
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@Snowbawlzzz said:
I'm sick of this nonsensical argument, "X is un-interactive and un-fun, they need a rework".
YOU find my killer unfun, I'M having fun. Your fun doesn't hold more weight than mine, nor does it warrant balance changes. 90% of the time a killer is given this title, it's done out of pure salt. The other 10% are people that mistake their personal enthusiasm level for a legitimate reason to suggest changes.
It does hold an equal amount of fun in a game that we both like and want to have a good time time in. Otherwise? Someone else's fun matters more which makes the whole thing collapse.
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@burt0r said:
I have one too. Happened a few weeks ago.
I had a daily for hands-on kill with spirit and used rancor (I think even my only perk then since I know how much people hate spirit). 3 normal survivor and one obnoxious clicky-click tbagger and they are my obsession 😍. I play normal with the 3 and completely ignore the obsession all game. 1 gen left and I start chasing the obsession and exact on the down they get the last gen. Cue rancor mori.
THE SATISFACTION. 🤤
Dude, clicky bs is legit clicky bs. Congrats to you for you making it not an issue for you.
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@HulkHodn said:
what a war story...
War story? nah. I'll save that for the people who actually have to lay their lives on the line. But thanks for devaluing that, I guess. Props to you for fighting the good the fight.
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@ShinobuSK said:
Cool story I guess
Yep, it was. Thanks!
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@Kirkylad said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2396241#Comment_2396241
Yeah I feel good about having more important things in life to take amusement from.
Sure fam.
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@Kirkylad said:
I mean I wouldn't really care tbh.
Good for you?
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None. After you've tortured people you don't know for your own base level issues, there is no "Good Guy". Redemption arc? Eh, maybe. But at some point 'you' still have to come to terms with the suffering 'you've' dolled out up until that point.
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@Ghouled_Mojo said:
I love that phrase. Butt hurt. It just brightens my day. Just like Booger Sugar.
My favorite is 'snit'. If I could do this post all over again, I would have used "in a snit".
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@Tvångsrunkar said:
I have played 3 games today as deathslinger - a killer I barely play.
But why do BEhaviour allow people to tbag at the exitgate?
I wish there was some kind of cooldown on both the flashligt, for the click-spamming, and on the crouchsystem so people wont be so toxic. How hard can it be to fix this?
Dont allow people to be toxic, devs. It ruins this game.
There will never be a cooldown because crouching is one of the ways survs can avoid ranged hits on loops. Hit them, force them out and be done with the match.
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There's probably a couple of reasons:
Asymmetrical games usually start off with the idea of 'party game'. In this case, the idea of being chased around by some 'unstoppable force', picking off 'the team' one by one until either they're all dead or 1 or more manage to get away. You will likely have a lot of people who love the concept - for a bit anyway. But after playing game after game, that novelty is going to wear off. At that point a player is either going to quit or focus on other objectives - usually advancing their own skill. When the latter comes, that's where balance itself becomes more important....
And balance is going to be hard to do in any x v. 1 scenario. The higher the [x], the harder it will likely be. But then the [x]...
Has a problem with random teammates. Sure, the game might be theoretically balanced to some degree at that point, but usually with the assumption that the [x] have some basic teamwork and are relatively close in skill. A team is only as strong as its weakest link. DbD is a prime example of that. Getting 1 survivor out of the game ASAP dramatically shifts the rest of the match into the Killer's favor.
Or, in the case of the unstoppable force role, they are either paired against teams of much lower skill or much higher. This creates a slightly different, but similar set of problems.
Next up, I would say the more complex the 'win' conditions are for the [x], the more the game is going to rely on organized teams aside from PUGs. I remember watching some gameplay of F13 of a group of friends pretty much just messing around. There were a lot of key items and much of the chatter was reminding someone where to find the item because whoever had picked it up had gotten killed before they reached the car/boat/whatever. What the heck do people do when they're playing with other randoms who might be using a chat box at best, or have left the game because they're dead and it's time for the next match?
And it does seem like a lot of the DbD's competition are trying to come up with more complex win conditions for the sake of interest. Which is understandable. How many complaints have we all probably seen about 'holding M1' for the survivor role? Yet, I would say that simplicity is what makes DbD function reasonably well. The more complex the goals for the [x] become, the more room they need to actually have a shot at completing them. And by complex, I don't mean necessarily skillful, I mean more in volume, order of completion, search for whatever item, etc.
I have a few other thoughts here, but need way more coffee. But this is probably enough for now anyway.
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@TheClownIsKing said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2382194#Comment_2382194
“I really don't care what any of you say. Because I want to see what everyone else's opinions about this are.”
This statement makes no sense.
I think what they mean is that they don't have a specific idea or set of ideas that they are looking to have validated by having other people agree with them.
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Small Game and Detective's Hunch are still overall better, imo. Yes, the cleansing speed with CF can be awesome, especially if the Killer is camping a Devour or NOED totem. But generally, I find the time saved by the cleansing speed doesn't outweigh the time spend zigzagging across the map. CF also somewhat relies on other people not cleansing totems or you stumbling over another one.
Someone who knows the maps and knows the hiding spots might find CF overall better, but I doubt that it is if the user is spending more time criss crossing the map than doing gens/hitting totems close to them.
Now, DH or SG paired with CF combos are the best of both worlds if you're really wanting to make hex perks no longer an issue. Hugely efficient on finding and cleansing and still compatible with gen repair.
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@TheGorgon said:
I don’t understand people’s mindset nowadays. DBD is marketed as an asymmetrical PvP Horror game. Both sides have different goals and they have to reach their goals to win.
As a Killer, I’m supposed to guarantee you to leave the match dead. As a Survivor, I’m supposed to leave the game via exiting the exit gates.
I happen to come across some laughable and to be Frank, popular unreasonable criticism. It sounds selfish, but as a killer, I do not need to meet your rules. I never ever read your personal ToS and agreed to it right before the game started.
My job is to kill you. I don’t care if you don’t like me tunneling or camping during one time or another. It’s admittedly an optimal strategy since it helps me reach my final goal.
I don’t like being tunneled or camped either, but sometimes the killer needs to do it to get the upper hand, which is absolutely understandable. So yeah, I dislike many things in DBD, but it doesn’t mean I need to obey or satisfy the other side.
Just thought I had to get this off, since many people are under the impression that camping and tunneling are super cowardly strategies, when they’re in fact very optimal strategies that are required in many situations to win.
Last but not least, a couple of the issues people have with DBD are from their ego’s being recently hurt, not actual core issues within the game itself, I.E Camping & Tunneling. Just because you don’t like something, doesn’t mean there’s anything particularly wrong with it.
Genrush away, it’s your goal after all. I have perks and add-ons to try to slow down that process that is required for you to win, just like you do for camping & tunneling. To both sides, stop verbally abusing people in the post-match chat and realize that putting arbitrary rules on the other side is simply silly & stupid.
EDIT: Since so many people are taking the post the wrong way, I need to clarify something: The only time I would condone and tunnel/camp someone is when the game is blowing by and I need to get some pressure on the survivors. Getting one person out of the game is favorable at 1 or 2 gens left.
Cool. So you agree 'gen rushing' isn't a 'thing' and we survs don't need to hold your Killer expectations either? Good to know.
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Green ranks does tend to be way more chill. Purple can be okay, but definitely see more sweaty playing.
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@D3spair said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2357018#Comment_2357018
Well either way, She would have gotten to the pallet by using Dead hard for distance. My Point is that Dead hard feels like a cheap "Press E to undo mistake" for Killers. That why I and most Killers hate it. We feel cheated for our good play only to get taken it taken away from us by a simple Press of a button.
I understand why it feels that way and that does suck. My only point is that it may not be a case of being cheated. Good survs are aware of where pallets and windows are. What can feel like a very good mindgame to a Killer that got 'cheated' may also very well be going against a surv with good situational awareness and knowledge of how best to use their perk. They aren't using it to undo a mistake, they're using it exactly how they were intending if the Killer got close enough.
Personally, I'm not that good, but I do watch a few players who play surv that are. Most of the time they know exactly how to play a tile with DH and when the Killer tries to mindgame them, the Killer is wasting time. When they make a true mistake (misjudging a mindgame, distance, or whatever) DH doesn't rarely buys them anything except a couple more seconds unless they successfully 360 the Killer.
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@Lord_Tony said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2357111#Comment_2357111
you can already do that It's called DS
I said long period of time.
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@Lord_Tony said:
survivors should trip like they do in horror movies and it takes them 2 minutes to get up
one thing this game is missing is survivors randomly tripping which prevented survivors from holding W in movies.
Sure. Just as soon as I can randomly (not predictably) down a Killer for a long period of time with well place knitting needles. Or the inability to look around a corner.