TigerKirby215
TigerKirby215
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Take cool concept,
add pointless cool-down,
"balanced" Dead by Daylight perk. :)
btw Infectious Fright has no cool-down despite being one of the strongest snowballing perks in the game but "hide your Terror Radius for a bit" only works when you hit the Obsession and has a long-ass cool-down.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/862062#Comment_862062
Basically this. I'd rather the problematic maps be changed rather than map offerings being completely removed/reworked.
Common/uncommon map offerings used to exist as a small % chance to land on a map, by the by. They can still be offered if you have any left over from that time. They heavily diluted the bloodweb pool and were an absolute menace to anyone who wanted more add-ons/items/useful offerings. I'm glad they're gone.
This thread is funny because I remember recommending the exact same thing on Reddit and being downvoted to #########. Only difference was that I recommended map offerings be Purple tier, making them cost a little more but much more importantly making them harder to find.
I think with the state of some of the maps in the game (Haddonfield) map offerings could stand to be rarer. Generally speaking though the map is one of the biggest deciding factors for if you win or lose so it's rather bullshit that you can just choose it for 5000 Bloodpoints. Even Moris make your job as Killer 33% easier, and that's a 7000 Bloodpoint offering that's
supposed to beincredibly hard to find. Going to The Game as Doctor or a cornfield map as Billy makes your job 333% easier, and it's only 5000 Bloodpoints?I'd also really like for map offerings to be rarer so I don't get half a dozen Jigsaw Pieces collectively on all my Survivors, but that's a problem with the lack of recycle mechanic among other things.
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Just to repeat in regards to Save the Best: It's very good on him but he doesn't use it any better than other M1 Killers. I think he's a little worse than the likes of Wraith with STB4L because he can't get easy hits, but it's still an amazing perk on any M1 Killer.
Also in regards to not running BBQ: I used to run Fire Up on Clown just because I'd get gen rushed so often but I swapped to Monitor for a few rounds and got really good results. Sloppy is also nice but I generally prefer Sulphuric Acid over Sloppy, and Dying Light is actually pretty swell since Clown is really lacking in map pressure. I'm All Ears is actually not godawful for window mindgames especially with the bottles' blurred vision, and if all else fails you can run Spiritduring, but I find most people tend to prethrow against Clown, ESPECIALLY if they realize you have Enduring.
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The problem with AFK Killers is that you get no Chaser or Benevolent, which is half your pip as Survivor. Lightbring is inherently limited, so the only emblem that's guaranteed is Unbroken.
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I honestly don't know why I'm trying to reason with a Meg main. I'd have better luck teaching a house plant particle physics.
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@MegMain98 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/875115#Comment_875115
Billy’s map pressure doesn’t mean jack when he is turned into an M1 killer because he has no opportunity to use his chainsaw.
A LOT of killers have no map pressure but it doesn’t make them unviable. Ghostface has 0 map pressure. He does great in red ranks.
Yeah the “LOL” reaction was great. Seems like you probably got that a lot.
If my boosted ass can 4K 85% of the time in red ranks with no add-on Plague then I doubt she’s a bad killer.
So does Billy not get Chaser because he uses his Chainsaw for an Instadown, or is he forced to use his M1 (and henceforth gets a good Chaser score cause he hits Survivors twice)?
Also imagine thinking that having the best map pressure in the game makes you bad because you have to hit people normally. Yup that's certainly why Freddy has such a low kill rate. His ability to teleport to any uncompleted generator on the map is offset massively by the fact that he has to attack twice like 80% of the Killers in the game.
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If Killer invested entirely on slowing the gens then they don't have chase perks. Just loop them while everyone else powers through it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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@ASpazNamedSteve said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/875109#Comment_875109
What did he say that's so ridiculous...?
Billy is bad at pipping, instadowns give you literally half the amount of chaser as hitting people twice. If you're good at him your Chaser emblem will almost always be trash.
Billy actually has ######### map pressure (leading to better Gatekeeper)? Also Billy has a fast pallet break while Plague gets to sniff her bath salts at every pallet?
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"Yeah she doesn’t pip easily but neither does Billy."
Hooooooooly #########. Man I miss the LOL reaction soooooooo much.
Yeah no. You can't convince something that has a negative IQ score.
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Remember that Decisive Strike is a perk to counter tunnelling... that lasts for 60 seconds even after the Killer has downed 3 other people, lets you do dumb plays, and is countered by slugging the Survivor for a few seconds.
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@AvisDeene said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/875048#Comment_875048
Thanks for the responses guys. After browsing the killer list, I decided to use shards to unlock the Hag so I could have access to her ruin. That becomes teachable at level 40, correct?
As far as the next killers I'll try it will probably be Trapper for the reasons DudeDelicious wrote. I'll probably main Spirit just because she tugs at my inner Weebness.
Hag and Trapper are very difficult Killers who rely heavily on knowing how Survivors play. They're hard to play without an effective understanding of the routes that Survivors run to.
Spirit's a little easier to play but still pretty challenging. Honestly if you want an easy and fun "weeb" Killer wait for the next chapter and buy Oni: he's very powerful on PTB, looks cool, is fun to play, and is quite effective even at high ranks. (Of course this is subject to change because PTB is PTB.)
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@MegMain98 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/875075#Comment_875075
That’s your own opinion. Doesn’t mean other players can’t do good with Plague. I’ve been playing her since her released and gotten to Rank 1 with ONLY Plague. It’s not like I destroyed noobs the whole way there either.
I can’t play Legion for the life of me and I never do good with them ever but I’m not gonna sit here and say that they are “noob stompers”. Any killer can be a noob stomper. I can destroy noobs with Nurse and I’m terrible with her.
It's objective fact that Plague gets #########-all for emblems (due to the fact that she only hits people once per chase, hence giving her a lower Malicious score. There's also the fact that she's a default Killer who takes forever in a chase) which makes it impossible to rank up as her at high ranks. She also has zero map pressure and more-often-than-not she gets gen rushed even harder than other Killers cause Survivors aren't healing.
The only way to win as Plague is to play against potatoes who cleanse, and not just because you get your AR-15. If Survivors are wasting time cleansing then they're not doing gens, and you can infect them again by lightly coughing on them.
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You NEED Brutal Strength. It's not even a question: people will drop pallets like crazy against Clown. The entire point of his power is to slow down a loop and force the Survivors to drop the pallet. Since his bottles don't make vaulting pallets slower you can't use them to get a hit at a pallet, so you're going to have to break them as fast as possible and move on to the next.
Other than that you want perks to start chases fast. Clown can end chases well with his power but he sucks at finding Survivors. Perks like Whispers and BBQ are both great at this, but one perk that's actually remarkably good on Clown is Monitor and Abuse. The lower terror radius really lets you get the jump on Survivors, and the higher FoV lets you see them if they try to sneak away, which allows you to counter stealth better.
Clown also has very poor map pressure. Perks that offer passive map pressure are great. Ruin goes without saying, and Corrupt is actually not terrible since Clown doesn't want to spend too long travelling around the map. Dying Light is actually pretty swell on him too though you should only use this if you can reliably chain downs on Clown. Huntress' Lullaby isn't godawful? But it's not great. Pop Goes is a little hard to use on Clown due to his poor map pressure.
I personally find Save the Best for Last to be somewhat overrated on Clown. The problem with STB4L on Clown is that most people expect it, and as a result the Obsession is liable to play aggressively. Clown is not a Killer like Doctor who can reliably ignore the Obsession, and unlike Pig / Demogorgon / Ghostface / Myers / Leatherbilly he doesn't have any way to reduce the number of hits on the Obsession. It's a great perk but I still like having a perk slot for something more reliable.
My personal perk build for Clown is Brutal Strength, Whispers, Ruin, and a perk of choice. Generally BBQ for le BP, but like I said M&A is really nice on Clown and I've got a lot of success with it. Fire Up is actually remarkably good in combination with Brutal.
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As for addons: https://old.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/comments/azgfde/clown_addons_tier_list/
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@JHarsch said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/875060#Comment_875060
You play a lot of Plague right? I mean you must know, you sound so sure.
I have Plague at P2 and have a friend who mains Plague. Neither of us have ever won a match as Plague beyond Rank 12. And before I get the infinite onslaught of "lol ######### Killer" I've gotten to Rank 1 as Wraith and have won at high ranks with Wraith, Clown, and Legion. So if I can win with "bottom tier" Killers like Wraith / Clown / Legion and can't get more than 2k as Plague if I'm lucky that's certainly a sign of something.
There's also the fact that Plague gets #########-all for Emblems, which makes playing her at high ranks a guarenteed way to derank without being "AFK."
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If you're waiting at a pallet just to stun the Killer then it's kinda a waste. You can run around the pallet to waste time as the Killer gets into range to hit you and then stun them. This gets you more time value per pallet. Pallets are your main source of defence against the Killer so you want to get as much time out of them as possible.
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SURVIVOR
Overrated: Adrenaline
Underrated: Tenacity isn't that good but it's honestly the best anti-slugging perk for standard Survivor play. No massive play potential like Unbreakable but it's good to "sneak" away while slugged and get to someone to pick you up.
KILLER
Overrated: Corrupt Intervention by a goddamn country mile
Underrated: Fire Up. I mean it's a poop garbage but combined with other perks (notably Brutal) it can become really good.
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Want a Killer who only wins against complete brain-damaged morons and will absolutely never succeed at any rank above Rank 20?
Plague.
Plague relies almost entirely on the Survivors playing like trash. There is also no higher end strategies to be learned as Plague: you puke on Survivor you chase them like a default Killer.
Plague is more brain-dead than Leatherface and more of a noob stomper than old Freddy.
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Survivor meta right now is to sniff your ass all match and then take the hatch. Making hatch spawn regardless of # of gens done was a massive mistake. As both Killer and Survivor I notice that Survivors do 2 - 3 gens and then start crouch walking around without Urban Evasion to do totems and #########.
Tome doesn't help.
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Ghostface has a far longer cool-down on his stealth than any other Killer. He also gains no extra powers while stealthed beyond the ability to stalk: Wraith moves faster and gets a burst of speed when he decloaks, Pig gets an extended lunge that can be used for pallet mindgames, and Myers' stealth is essentially permanent as he has a smaller Terror Radius constantly. Myers can also effectively 99% a stalk with zero warning unlike Ghostface who has to 99% the specific Survivor he wants to instadown. Myers can also stalk midchase while Ghostface has to be stealthy.
The reason Ghostface has the "best" stealth ability in the game is because it has a very long cool-down and some of the easiest counterplay in the game when compared to other stealth abilities. I know "just look at him lol" is a meme from back in his PTB days but... just look at him lol.
The only complaint I have with Ghostface is that his reveal "hitbox" (like all hitboxes in this game) is very buggy. With some work on that he'd probably be one of the better balanced Killers in the game. Yeah his addons need work too but that's another discussion.
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https://twitter.com/DeadByBHVR/status/1200171700702371841
Guiz da chalengzz rnt dat hord juzt donut do dem if 2 herd lol
Yes because keeping quiet and licking Behaviour's boots is the fastest way to let them know that the community has a problem with the game. Thanks for listening to feedback, Behaviour. :)
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I agree but don't have much to say. So here are some memes:
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@JohnyBlood said:
I dont know why so many people are defending the devs considering these Tomes. This is just a lazy work imo. This game is full of perks, full of great possible ideas and they take the most unimaginative way possible and they don't even consider the impact of these challenges on the gameplay. Everyone is doing some challenge now so every other game is completely broken - friendly killers, survivors who dont repair and compete against each other..it's a mess..and considering how much grind is required this will be happening for a long time.
I have managed to complete Level 1 and Level 2 of the Tome, so yes, it's doable but it doesn't mean it is done correctly and that the amount of the grind is ok... After the 4th level leak, I really hoped the devs would listen to the community because their concerns were completetly right, in fact its just a common sense...but they didnt listen at all. Most of these challenges really feel just like doing chores and reqiure too much grind. This is a PAID game with the 10 E Battle Pass, with very expensive DLCs so why the grind has to be so enormous?
This Pass was a good idea but it is badly executed, not well-thought, just lazy and unimaginative. That's my opinion, but I dont think I'm alone with it. Until there will be some important changes done with the next Pass, I definitely wont buy it. Sadly there is no "completely ignoring it", because it has impacted most of the regular gameplay. That's just my opinion ;)
Because they're challenges they're supposed to be hard lol. Gonna lick BHVR's boots some more; maybe buy another $10 character skin.
@StardustSpeedway said:
I managed to successfully save one survivor during the end game collapse. Then the killer downs me, camps me, I get saved, and then rage quits. Why does it have to be TWO in a single match. That's absolutely ridiculous.
To quote myself: "It's not like the Killer is going to camp if more than 2 people are alive during EGC."
Also it's not like everyone and their dog is going to run NOED for the sake of the "kill 2 people with NOED" challenge.
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@ggallinftw said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/872584#Comment_872584
Really love the solution that every BHVR apologist on here comes up with... don't play.
Pretty much this. "Don't enjoy the content? Don't criticize it just ignore it instead lol!"
Maybe I'll go play Civ 5 instead.
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/872620#Comment_872620
Alot of the daily rituals are a pain in the ass as well. So I think your argument about the blood points is a bit off. I do think these challenges are a bit odd though. Not to mention far to luck based for my taste. However it's too soon to say BHVR aren't listening to the feed back. Realistically they weren't going to change anything from the first rift. I'm sure they are looking at the feed back and will hopefully improve with the next rift.
The full list of dailies is as follows:
- Repair 3 generators (any Survivor)
- Open an exit gate as a specific Survivor
- Escape as a specific Survivor
- Escape with a new item (any Survivor)
- Heal 3 people (any Survivor)
- Unhook 3 people as a specific Survivor
- Do co-op actions for 3 minutes (any Survivor)
- Sabotage 2 hooks (any Survivor)
- Be chased for 2 minutes as a specific Survivor
- Mori someone as a specific Killer
- Use a Killer's power
- Chase Survivors for 3 minutes with a specific Killer
- Sacrifice 2 Survivors as a specific Killer
These can all be done over multiple matches. While some of them are a chore (notably anything with a character you don't play, but also the ones do do co-op actions. Mori ones are also pretty much RNG based) none of them are as stupid as "deplete 8 keys" or "heal 4 health states in 1 trial."
What's more is that you can change your dailies if the one you got is too challenging. This again leads me to think that the Rift should've been a "second set of dailies" as opposed to the web system, or even just tied to the dailies as is. As they are currently it's extremely obnoxious to grind through and for certain challenges you may as well just go ######### yourself. Don't have Monsterous Shrine on the handful of Killers you can get a viable basement strat with? Go ######### yourself! Don't have many Medkits or Broken Keys to waste? Go ######### yourself! Don't have Trapper or Claudette levelled up? Go ######### yourself!
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@KuromiStarwind said:
We don't play or understand our own game, and how challenges like this affect it - BHVR, probably
Didn't you guys learn from the events you used to have that people complained about, and how they changed the way the game was played? This is that x50
ThEyRe ChALLeNgEs ThEYrE SuPpOsEd To Be ReAlLy HaRd - people in this thread probably
No, challenge shouldn't be something that can only realistically be done if you run into your SWF friends as a killer and message them on Steam, or you somehow manage to communicate by some miracle what challenge you're doing and see if the survivors/killer will farm. Otherwise you'll be stuck doing that same one, like unhooking 2 survivors during EGC, for literally ever. And if you're NOT playing with SWF so that one of you specifically gets them? Hell, someone might take that save unknowingly or just to spite you. And it won't. Be your. Fault.
Also love all the people going "jUsT dOn'T dO tHeM!" You're supposed to be able to do them in order to complete the rift without paying additional cash for more rift tiers. And the challenges give you Bloodpoints: why should Bloodpoints be locked behind obnoxious grinds because "they're supposed to be hard lol."
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A friend of mine recently posted a fairly active thread on the state of Demogorgon, and cited the fact that he's one of the least played Killers with the lowest win rates as one of the reasons Demo needs buffs.
Peanits comes along like "lol actually the stats aren't accurate, and the reason Demo isn't played is cause he's hard lol. Also way less people play Hag lmao."
The devs specifically release stats to explain to us why they make balance changes but then completely ignore their own stats when balance changes are suggested. Again what's the point of releasing stats then? Why tell us that post-rework Nurse is the only Killer with a sub 50% kill rate just to tell us "she's hard lol that's why she isn't getting kills", or to tell us that Clown is one of the least played Killers in the game just to say "he's hard lol that's why people don't play him."
"They're hard lol" isn't a good reason for a character to be dogshit tier.
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@antgnstea said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/872371#Comment_872371
I wasn't looking for an advise. I merely I stated the current player problems caused by new level. To help finding solutions for them. For example one of the solution to this rush could be unlocking all levels at the same time instead of giving everyone same challenges at the same time.
Criticize Fortnite as much as you want but their Battlepass is still the best of the best. The fact that the challenges are given out at random (as opposed to everyone knowing all of them all the time) makes it far more accessible for everyone. I really wish the Rift worked as a "second set of dailies" as opposed to the web format they decided to use.
Last Tome everyone was running Franklin's Demise and playing Plague specifically to cuck people out of the challenges to heal others or deplete medkits. I'm just waiting for the influx of Survivors running Small Game to deal with the NOED spam, though I guess teaching Killers to moonwalk in order to counter Spine Chill is a good(?) thing.
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@NoShinyPony said:
Also important to note: "unhook [high] amount of survivors" challenges motivate random teammates to not play the game properly and instead just farm their teammates. I saw this already happen today. Stuff like this is killing the fun when you aren't playing in a 4-men-SWF group.
Pretty much this. It's a goddamn shitshow since the first Survivor challenge is to unhook someone safely, so everyone just hook rushes with Borrowed Time and the game ends with 5 gens done.
@dkyguy1995 said:
This is so ######### whiny. You sound like a massive baby. I've been frustrated with how easy the first challenges were. I'm pumped the challenges are getting harder. You know you don't have to do challenges right? They're there for people who want to try something new with the game. You're complaining about healing too many health states or about getting two unhooks during EGC. You're complaining because you have to become a healer but then say a good challenge should make you play the game different. Well guess what play the game as a healer then!!! Getting 5 traps is a hard thing, that's why they call it a challenge!! What did you expect? Get a single unhook in a trial? Stop being a baby about this, having challenges is a great addition to the game and I'm glad they are actually making them challenging despite apparently salty ######### complaining the challenges are too challenging. This isn't promoting toxic gameplay and no ######### killer is going to play "antichallenge" builds like you think they are.
There's a difference between "escape the trial with a unique perk" and "drop everything to play as a healbot and hope to god that the stars align for you to get 4 heals."
Also it's funny that you mentioned "antichallenge builds" because I literally just got out of a game with a farming Trapper who just put traps down for us to step in them. I think he was doing the 4 Trap one cause very few people have gotten that far in the Rift, but I've already seen people running stupid builds just to do the challenges. (Again: spamming Borrowed Time to unhook people)
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@LordGlint said:
I actually JUST finished the Trapper one for 5 traps. These are do-able.
They're possible but extremely annoying and time consuming. None of them are impossible but they're beyond obnoxious to do.
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SURVIVOR MAINS SHOULD STOP RESISTING AGAINST NERFS
This is not a bait post.
Since BHVR doesn't listen to survivor mains anyway they should stop resisting against the nerfs. Let the killer mains continue crying about survivor being "too strong". This will cause the survivor mains to leave the game and then the killers are going to cry about the lobby times taking 30-60 minutes on average.
BHVR will also see that they are losing a huge number of players because of this so they are going to buff survivors in an attempt to get them back.
Just stop resisting against the nerfs. The devs will either destroy their own game or they will finally listen to both sides to create balance.
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If it sounds ridiculous with the roles reversed it was ridiculous to begin with.
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@Sylorknag said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/868730#Comment_868730
And I haven't run into him a single time on PS4. Uh...
Can't you guys, for once, admit you put out a mediocre killer and that's why no one is playing said killer?
You know, letting people know that you are aware would only improve community/devs relationship.
Guess I'll check back in 2 years, after the epiphany finally hit.
Took about a year for them to finally admit Freddy was trash.
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@mattyb78 said:
Jesus christ all anyone does is complain. Unfortunately game creators keep listening to these many nagging reviews that they continue changing their game. Wahh nerf killer wahh nerf survivor. Ffs shut up and just play it. I've started assuming that anyone who makes a long thread bitching about the game simply got butthurt for not winning or being good. RIP old dbd.
Game was much better with pallet vacuums, facecampable hooks, and instamoris. I agree: RIP old DBD :)
Criticism leads to innovation which leads to improvement. Stop living in the past ya boomer.
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@xerav said:
He performs better with this weird Killrate Statistic cuz they run basement builds on him (and the one gettin caught is not unlikely to die in basement).
Every Killer's kill statistic is inflated by dumb builds and memers. The average is 50% for almost all killers due to the shear volume of matches being played, and the number of games where 4 Pizza Dwights dance around the basement hook.
People point to 50% kill rate and say "this is fine" without realizing that every Killer has a 50% kill rate. Status Quo isn't fine, because if every Killer performs the same why should I play another Killer? I may as well play a Killer who's less obnoxious to play and doesn't come with some of the worst perks in the game
IE not Demogorgon.There's value in the niche details (Freddy's high kill rate, Clown's low play rate, etc.) and with that in mind the fact that Demogorgon only performs slightly better than Clown says a lot.
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@TheHourMan said:
Dark devotion already removes your terror radius as it is, so no, I don't think nemesis would do anything during that.
Nemesis makes the Survivor unable to hear your Terror Radius. Dark Devotion removes your Terror Radius
and puts it on the Survivor.I think it's an interesting combo and it has some meme value in no one knowing where you really are, but Nemesis and Dark Devotion both share the same problem of "why am I running this over the meta?" Unless you have a specific plan in mind with a hidden Terror Radius these perks don't do much, and getting two perks to hide your Terror Radius is overkill.
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I agree with you about the play rate of Demo except for one outlier: Plague. If Demogorgon was barely played when he was released Plague was released and forgotten about the next day. I didn't even play against Plagues the day she was released, and to this day I can go a full week playing several sessions daily and go up against at most 2 Plagues per week. This is also reflected in the statistics since she has one of the lower pick rates at red ranks (just above "how the ######### do I play this Killer?" Hag and "the worst Killers" Leatherface and Doctor.) At the very least you meet Doctors at high ranks who are doing dailies (mostly because his daily is piss-easy) but Plague isn't met at any ranks period. I know she has a dedicated following but I think far too many people who play Plague are playing her at low ranks where people cleanse and give them free wins.
But I can rant about Plague for hours. This thread was about Demogorgon so let's address them.
ISSUE #1 - Demogorgon's portals are meant to have counterplay obviously. Even the fact that they can be destroyed is no worse than (again) Trapper who has to go pick up his disarmed traps and replace them which arguably takes more time than Demogorgon. The problem with Demo is that the portals are so lacklustre in general that the strong counterplay makes them incredibly weak. Trapper's traps can completely deny a loop and give him a free pseudo-instadown so it's no wonder why they're so easy to counter. Compare that to... what? Slightly better map pressure? Trapper's traps are an AK-47 so of course you call the police to deal with someone running around with an AK. But you don't call the police to deal with a kid running around with a BB gun.
SOLUTIONS - Your solutions would help the problem, and honestly I do think that Demo's base kit requires a lot of tweaks but that's besides the point.
ISSUE #2 - Now HERE'S your problem. Not only are Demogorgon's addons weak but the focus of their effects are completely out of whack. Like you said Demo has 2.5 addons that affect Shred, 7 addons that affect the portals (sealing time, detection range, and the worthless status effect addons), and the rest of Demogorgon's TEN other addons affect the portal teleportation. (Cool-down, teleportation speed, extra portals, placement speed, etc.) This is COMEDICALLY poor balance and the problem is further extended by Demo's Shred addons all being Brown tier (with the exception of Mew's Guts which is yellow, but it recreates the effect of a Brown addon so w/e) while some of their highest rarity addons do absolutely nothing.
(Mmm yes 2.5 seconds off my teleport cool-down.)SOLUTIONS - I don't agree with all your addon changes but do agree that a lot of them need changes. That's all I can really say.
ISSUE #3 - Yes Shred sucks, and the SOLUTION is honestly easy. Either make the radius bigger or make Demo faster while lunging (with a longer cool-down to compensate?) There's a lot of other QoL stuff they could do but this is the big issue.
I will also mention that I find it funny how you don't mention the main problem that I find with Demo IE their set up time, especially when compared to Freddy. Freddy can teleport to any generator as long as their teleport is up and Demo has to walk over to a gen, place a portal (or two cause you know your first one's going to get cleansed), and then slowly walk to the next gen. Realistically there's only two places you're going to put a portal: near a generator or near a hook, and Freddy still camps better than Demogorgon since he can ignore Borrowed Time. It's laughable that Demogorgon's only "reward" for having a power that is pretty much objectively worse than Freddy's is a longer lunge and a "fast"
(same speed as a regular pallet break, but you can start it immediately)pallet break.Demogorgon is honestly awful in their current state and there is no reason to buy them. They're a worse version of Freddy in every way. Their perks suck, their power sucks, their addons suck, they only have one cosmetic and it sucks ("hey we put chains on the default model give us money please"); the only redeeming factor of Demo is their aesthetic which is fantastic.
I think the reason so many people say that Demo is good is because they enjoy their aesthetic and play them casually without thinking too deeply about the Killer's balance. I do agree that it is incredibly fun to emerge from a portal and get the jump on an unsuspecting Survivor. But the thing is that a Killer can both live up to the fantasy and be an effective Killer. Michael Myers feels like The Shape with his ability to stalk Survivors can catch them off guard before quickly killing them. Freddy Kruger feels like The Nightmare with his ability to be everywhere at once and be three steps ahead of the Survivors at all times. Amanda Young feels like The Pig with her ability to appear out of nowhere and suddenly force the Survivors into awful situations against their own will. Demogorgon feels great but doesn't play great. Myers is considered top tier, Freddy has the highest kill rate out of any Killer currently, and Pig is overall alright.
(Which the devs would stop nerfing her lol.)The devs are more than capable of making a fun Killer who's at least modestly effective at high ranks but Demogorgon was a big miss. The good thing at least is that it wasn't doomed from the start like Freddy, and with a few changes Demo could be a very potent Killer.
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/867116#Comment_867116
The data shows that she is pretty balanced. If she is so buggy that its one of the ways she gets kills, as everyone in this thread is complaining about, then she'd become, statistically, the worst killer in the game easily if she was "fixed".
Its obviously not that bad, but ok.
Plague is statistically "balanced" because statistically she goes up against potatoes constantly and gets 4ks, but also goes up against derankers who stomp her. Freddy statistically had about a 40% kill rate before his rework which is why he took so long to be reworked.
Statistics mean nothing in this game since they are so heavily skewed by all the bullshit in this game. What matters is that playing as Huntress feels more RNG dependant than playing Pig with 6 Jigsaw boxes, and playing against Huntress feels more RNG dependant than running Autodidact, Up The Ante, Ace in the Hole, and Technician together. You can't dismiss the fact that Huntress has been broken since launch with "nuuuuu u tok muh Spirut no taek mi huntrass u no want gud killurz?"
Give an actual reason why you want the game to be objectively worse due to bugs. "Nerfs already happened" is not a reason. By that logic Mettle of Man should've remained the way it was on release because Sprint Burst was nerfed. But considering that I have seen some people operating under that ass-backwards logic I wouldn't be surprised if Killer mains thought that way too.
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
Damn the Spirit changes aren't even out yet and we are already switching focus to the Huntress being "unfun" and "uncouterable"?
Damn the latest balance patch made a Killer slightly worse and we're already asking for buggy Killers who have been broken for 2 years to not be fixed because "Survivor mains won't stop QQing"?
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@Atrushan88 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/862343#Comment_862343
Been watching some Puppers videos of the new patch and he's been saying the PTB has been REALLY smooth, as others on those same videos were agreeing and that he never wanted to leave them. I'm wondering if perhaps those are fixes to dedicated servers that will make it into the next patch.
Played on PTB and... this is a ######### lie.
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Plague. So many people who play Plague at Rank 15 think that she's good because morons cleanse against them. Plague is easily the worst Killer in the game and is way worse than old Freddy ever was. At least Freddy had stealth and game stall. Plague is a default Killer whos power is either NOED or Huntress on steroids. Literally everything that Plague does is based on the Survivors making mistakes: Survivors being found too early, Survivors not dodging her puke, and Survivors cleansing to give her Corrupt Purge. Plague is incredibly easy to loop and gen rush since she is a default Killer with essentially no power. The only reason that people win with her is because they get lucky and find a dumb Survivor early, get them to max infection, and then start the snowball which is the only asset that Plague has.
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- Trapper, Billy (to an extent), Myers (faster vault + longer lunge), Hag, Doctor, Huntress, Freddy, Clown
- Wraith, Spirit, Ghostface
- Pig
- Wraith, Spirit, Ghostface, Doctor, Nurse, Myers, Perks
- Wraith, Hillbilly, Nurse, Freddy, Spirit, Legion
Here's a list of Killers who do what you list better than Demogorgon for every point you make.
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@Cetren said:
I'm sick of people saying its getting gutted. Nothing is being changed for people who don't abuse loops with drops. In fact, for these people, and for stealth players, balanfed will be significantly better due to it muffling the sound of falling, which is usually a dead giveaway of your location. Not only that, but you still get the stagger reduction, which means you don't lose any of the speed boost due to being staggered after a fall. Its still going to be my go to exhaustion perk.
This. So many people going "bAlAnCeD uSeLeSs" even though it's still great for what it did originally: allowing you to escape using unique map props / loops that are otherwise unsafe. It just no longer enables dumb infinites on Haddonfield.
Still think that Haddonfield needed a change more than Balanced, but Balanced is a problem perk and changing it now frees up design space for the future. TBH I have no idea how The Game and Mount Ormond were allowed to be added with Balanced Landing in the game.
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I have always stated that one of the dumbest mechanics comparing Killers to Survivors is how Survivors can bring items, use them 99%, and still keep them. Meanwhile if a Killer loads in and all the Survivors
ragequitdisconnect they lose their Bloodpoints and get nothing beyond a "lol go f@#k yourself" in terms of Disconnect Bloodpoints. Killers have a baseline 10000 cost to play the game while Survivors can leave the match with more Bloodpoints than they came in with. (On their person IE they can find items in chests.)It's easy enough to say "items shouldn't be 99%-able" but such a huge change would create massive balance issues and a lot of perks, items, and addons would require massive changes to compensate for this tweak. Franklin's is suddenly terrible and there's little reason to take Streetwise, and that isn't even mentioning how gloriously this screws with the concept of chests as a whole.
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@Madjura said:
No, because then people will be upset because their items become useless overnight.
A good solution would be if we had the ability to recycle / sell items, something that has first been brought up years ago, and then increase the value of whatever is going to be nerfed until the patch goes live. This way people can decide whether or not to use up the item in question or to recycle / sell it for increased value.
Been suggested a billion times and I still don't know why it isn't in the game. A recycling mechanic would fix a LOT of this game's problems with nerfs and people not enjoying leveling up crap Killers just for their perks (Leatherface) but if they introduced that Bloodpoints would be easier to acquire, and that would "ruin the in-game economy" or whatever.
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tl;dr I can't win without a massive brain-dead crutch so I'm going to demand that the game be fixed for me instead of learning how to play the game
If you think Spirit was the only Killer who could counter SWF you're out of your mind. If anything Spirit is countered a lot more by SWF than other top tiers like Hillbilly. If you want a really strong counter to SWF play Freddy (with Snares, not pallets) and learn how to properly apply pressure so you can be everywhere at once and have a power that the Survivors can't easily counter.
And I mean if all else fails you can just run a ton of anti-teamwork perks like Discordance and Make Your Choice, and play Killers that punish teamwork like Legion and Doctor.
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At least personally the problem I have with the Spirit nerfs is that she wasn't nerfed enough. The problem I have is that they didn't fix the two core issues with Spirit, being her lack of feedback and low skill ceiling. They didn't change any of her animations to be easier to read beyond her vault animation, and didn't remove her ability to brainlessly track injured Survivors. All they did was apply bandaid fixes to problems that people on Reddit who know nothing about balance bitched about the loudest.
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Just use addons 4head!
Nevermind the fact that this furthers a problem with Killer that it's largely unplayable without a BP investment (that often goes to waste because of DCers and other problems) or the fact that Nurse is still slower than an (addonless) 115% Killer.
Also to all the people saying that Nurse can blink through objects: especially on more open maps (such as Rotten Fields) this is a non-issue. Yes certain maps will favour certain characters (open maps for Billy, not for Nurse) but you can't use the excuse of "she's good on some of the worst maps for Killer" as justification for her being worse than a 115% Killer in terms of map pressure.
I do agree that in the grand scheme of things this isn't that much of a problem and Nurse did need changes since her ability is so powerful, but this still doesn't help an overarching problem of Killers being far too addon reliant while Survivors can do perfectly fine without items, can find items in a match, and get to keep their items after a match is over.
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@UlvenDagoth said:
I've been told to kill myself cause I like playing as Legion. No lie. The Legion hate is a meme at this point and I wish it would quit. I just like the lore and the feeling of chasing someone down to slash the heck outta them.
As someone who plays a lot of Legion I can confirm.
If you're one of those people who still hates Legion in current year you're a clown at best and a complete joker at worse. I can understand that Mending constantly is boring but it's no worse than Plague making you permanently No Mither.
@ASAPTurtle said:
A lot of killers avoid me when I wear darker outfits on Claudette but as soon as I wear a bright outfit everyone goes berserk.
Wear dark / bloody cosmetics get dodged. Wear bright cosmetics get tunnelled.
I don't know what people want.
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Being injured is never a good thing. That being said there are faster ways to heal yourself other than Self Care. Medkits go without mention, but there's also Inner Strength now from Nancy and all the ways to get your teammates to heal you faster. (Leader primarily.)
That being said Self Care is still the most reliable way to get healed. It always works regardless of situation. If you're playing against a Killer who hits-and-runs constantly (and isn't playing something like Legion) or have a team that can't get their ######### together it can be good to have a reliable way to save yourself.
That and, you know, sometimes the game bugs out and you're literally unable to heal people...
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Equip Small Game, find Ruin, and then gen rush. It's really not that hard ima be honest. Even with Swing Chains it's at most like a 20% gen slow if everyone's asleep.
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To quote myself from Reddit:
- generator takes 80 seconds without toolboxes or perks
- chase (including time to find a survivor and time to hook a survivor) can easily take 80 seconds
- 3 survivors can do gens while 1 survivor is chased
- 3 gens can be done in the time it takes to hook 1 survivor
- survivors do 60% of their objective in the time it takes killer to do 8% of their objective
- bhvr wonders why ruin is mandatory
- bhvr wonders why newer killers camp
- bhvr wonders why killers dodge lobbies with toolboxes
- bhvr wonders why adrenaline is so strong
- bhvr wonders why noed is so strong
If the new Survivor experience is bad the new Killer experience is bloody intolerable. I still remember the first time I played Killer I was a Rank 20 Trapper with Bitter Murmur 1 and nothing else, and I went up against a team of Rank 10s with full perk builds. I literally didn't touch Killer for months after that. I still thank my Killer main friend for telling me to grab Ruin when it was on the Shrine. Without it I likely would have never played Killer ever.
Gens need to be considerably slower. Either that or chases need to be done way faster (which is what I'd prefer since no one likes M1 simulator.) Currently it's way to easy for Survivors to do their only objective in a near-instant, and the only caviat of "clense totems for NOED potentially" is not enough of an incentive to do anything else since it's near impossible to find all 5 totems without the help of perks or items.
Truthfully it's not even a problem that Survivors only have one objective. Killers only have one objective of killing, but the thing is that there's a lot of sub-categories to that task. (Controlling generators, managing the map, and just generally downing and hooking survivors.) All Survivors have to do is hold down Mouse 1 on a gen and then hold down Mouse 1 on an exit gate.
This game has very low retention rate and an even lower retention rate for Killer players and I know it. I have many friends who don't play the game as much as I do and almost all of them say that they hate the Killer experience. It's such poor design that half of the game relies on you buying half a dozen DLC (Leatherface for BBQ, Hag for Ruin, and for a lot of other Killers DLC perks are mandatory like Monitor and Abuse for Myers or Make Your Choice for Hag) just to be operating at a baseline effective level. Meanwhile almost all the Survivor perks you need are in the base Survivors' kits (Self Care, Adrenaline, Borrowed Time, Exhaustion perks
excluding Lithe) and Survivor generally has a far shallower learning curve then Killer.