Sluzzy
Sluzzy
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No more survivor nerfs.
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That's how I see Huntress right there. Except, everyone is on the floor instead of running around lol
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"Ds is far more broken and unfair than pop"
I didn't read any further.
POP: Objective progress removed several times a match with no way to stop it. On a killer like Freddy it is incredible.
DS: Protects survivor from being tunneled and can be used as anti-momentum "if" killer allows. Can only be used 1-time.
I think pop is obviously a lot more unfair. It is still just as strong with a shorter timer. It's not even a nerf.
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On a fast competent killer, the combo is very oppressive. If killers can have such strong ways of slowing the game down then survivors need some more stronger perks to choose from. Perks with very small effects, like showing the aura of nearby perks just doesn't help against a fast rank 1 killer that has map-wide knowledge with the intent of slugging and what not.
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@Freki said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1650114#Comment_1650114
it's invincible because of the fact you can't get around it for 1 minute, either down them and leave them and then they get up with unbreakable or you grab them out of a locker and they ds you. just today I had a match where I was hooking survivors got one dead, two on hook then the other one jumped in a locker and i had to either let them stay there or grab them... thing is they'd been off the hook for two other hooks. so it punishes killers when survivors either weaponize the perk or are crappy survivors. thus it rewards bad play or weaponized play. this is much like the survivors complaining about noed rewarding bad play by the killer. and now pop is being altered becuase it's got too long of a timer. ds is much the same way and gives them 1 minute to work on gens (almost a full gen) with impunity because if you grab them off a gen pop they have ds to hit you with.
An entire perk slot is used for that small benefit. A small amount of anti-momentum. No different that killers using tons of slow-down perks.
Reducing the timer on DS would incentivize killers to tunnel more. Reducing the timer on POP doesn't affect anything other than killers simply need to kick the gen first instead of chasing someone else first.
Reducing the DS timer weakens the perk exponentially more than reducing the timer on POP.
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@MegHasCuteFeet said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1650069#Comment_1650069
Not completely defenseless, but also not invincible for 2 minutes every match across all 4 survivors.
Invincible means you can't hit them. That is hardly the case. It's also only one minute, you should be chasing someone else instead of camping if you don't like the stun.
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@pepperoninipples said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1645215#Comment_1645215
Because ds is and always been a problem. I guess survivors should grow a pair and deal with a hard killer to go against. And stop asking for nerfs to killer abilities, and more on to the next they want easy mode to play against.
A problem for who, incompetent killers? Tunneling killers? Killers that want ez 4ks? Because you are Mr. Killer you want the survivors to be completely defenseless all the time? I don't think so.
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@MusicNerd_TC said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1647930#Comment_1647930
Well, you can see where he is going to shoot before he actually attacks, as a big red line shows up on the ground, giving you more than enough time to dodge it.
Without some kind of sound or visual cues, he would for certain have no counterplay, like a deathslinger.
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@MusicNerd_TC said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1647918#Comment_1647918
Yes, but his attack is telegraphed heavily, meaning you can see where he's going to shoot, which means you shouldn't be getting hit outside of animation lock if you're a good survivor.
That's like saying he shouldn't ever miss if he is a good killer.
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I would like to remind everyone that PH can hit through walls. That alone is enough for his power to be more than useful. His torments also allows him to bypass all camping perks which is unfair. They are more than likely not going to be nerfing him enough.
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@Zozzy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1646389#Comment_1646389
These perks have been problematic since their creation with hundreds and even thousands of posts complaining about them.
Pop was rarely complained about above rank 10 and many think it is fine since the killer works so hard to get it
What perk got nerfed though?
There is no "whataboutism" here. Only some terrible balance decisions that don't make sense.
It doesn't make sense because you want everything for yourself. You are fine with just getting Undying with no way for survivors to turn off that aura read.
I complained some about POP BTW. Removing objective progress on a consistent basis is huge. On a killer like Freddy it is ridiculous.
DS is used only once a match if is able to be used at all. POP is guaranteed to be used.
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@Buckoben said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1646466#Comment_1646466
So you are arguing Hex perks should be always on, think before you type please.
What does hex perks have to do with a situational perk on a short timer?
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@TransverseCaster said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1646441#Comment_1646441
And deactivating during locker entry along with those. Yes, that would about cover it.
No. A perk should not have deactivation conditions no matter how much you don't like it. A survivor can legitimately try to hide in a locker and you want their perk disabled. That's a new level of entitlement and this is why the devs should not listen to biased killer mains.
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@Endstille said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1645683#Comment_1645683
lmao
that is the exact definition of playing poorly, why are you even there? having trouble to memorize where you have to go or what? the bloodbaths xD i like how you completely dodge the question and do not answer what skill ds actually requires because the answer is none. i am not picking sides i am just stating the obvious, pgtw gets nerfed while it at least required you to do something as killer which can really be difficult if a person is good. however ds on the other hand while being the stronger perk just gives you free immunity and rewarding to fail the chase.... it is literally unbalanced, when you can not agree to that or even see that than my dude all your objective game sense has gone down the drain
I have a feeling you don't play survivor much as going down is inevitable, this is not 2016-17 when infinites existed. What if I was hooked near an area with a deadzone, believe me I've seen huge wastelands with no pallets. What if I managed to get to a pallet, barely, and the killer had spirit fury? There's times the survivor can play better but half the time, if not most of the time, there is nothing you can do.
DS helps the survivor survive in specific scenarios so if it is unbalanced, then pretty much every killer perk is also unbalanced but to a much greater degree.
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@narf said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1645406#Comment_1645406
What you are suggesting is that you are fine with punishing the killer for doing well.
What you are defending is that survivors should be rewarded for playing poorly.
You don't see how skewed your perspective is?
@Endstille said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1645406#Comment_1645406
You have posted in the past, complaints about killer has to require skill. Tell me what skill does ds require? Pgtw needs to be earned from a killer by winning a chase, downing and hooking a survivor. DS on the other hand rewards a survivor with immunity from the killer because the survivor fails at a chase.
See how broken this ######### is?
No, you are picking sides. How does the survivor control who the killer chases? If the killer is hooking survivors so fast then anti-momentum is a good thing to give the survivors hope, as in I understand that is what the entity feeds on. You are so concerned in playing the game on a tournament level that you are forgetting what the game is all about. I've witnessed the bloodbaths with my eyes and survivors shouldn't need thousands of hours with discord to compete against what killers can bring into the match.
Going down in a dead zone with no pallets because of being tunneled is not playing poorly.
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@supersonic853 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1645384#Comment_1645384
In My scenario i chased and downed 2 people! And no they shouldnt because the devs already said their looking at fixing all slowdown perks. Without slowdown a single ds could cost 3 gens by itself.
Then it is your fault if you got hit with DS. You picked them up, you deserve to be slowed down, the perk is actually benefiting the survivor.
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@supersonic853 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1645365#Comment_1645365
If I hook 2 other people and find the guy on a gen i didnt tunnel and i shouldnt be punished for doing well. Old mom did this and it was HORRIBLE.
Let me approach this a different way; so you think it is OK for killers to have intense slow-down perks (punishing survivors) with oppressive loadouts but a survivor can't have an anti-momentum perk that can even be countered by chasing someone else?
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@Callmehandsome said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1645244#Comment_1645244
Well it's funny because my suggestion actually helped to make DS stronger against tunneling. You obviously aren't tunneled if you can repair generators 😂😂 If you fear that ghost face is lurking around the corner find a safe spot to heal or repair the generator with LOS. Using brains is allowed ya know and not being carried with just perks
The counter-argument: the killer should use his brains and not try to pickup someone that recently got unhooked.
I haven't seen your suggestions but every one I see has a million deactivation conditions, which is unfair. It just makes a niche perk even weaker. They could re-buff it to where it used to be so killers can appreciate it the way it is now. If it was truly decisive then it would be a 1-time use at any time, not on a timer like it is now.
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@Callmehandsome said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1645222#Comment_1645222
Then maybe you shouldn't run straight next to a generator next to you once you got unhooked and maybe heal first.. crazy i know. Survivors should never feel completely safe and DS gives just that. I've been a survivor main for over a year and it's definitely the strongest perk there is
Maybe I should use the argument "killers should never always feel entitled for a down"
DS is stronger than DH, that can be used multiple times? I think you just like to tunnel, sorry a perk helps with that.
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@Callmehandsome said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1643975#Comment_1643975
So are you going to change DS because it just gives 60 second immunity without conditions? Like turn the timer infinite in chase BUT DS-deactivates the second you go touch a generator etc.
Is that so you can hide as ghostface, let him touch a gen and then tunnel scott free? I don't think a perk should deactivate for doing the objective.
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@Callmehandsome said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1644391#Comment_1644391
People comparing DS and Pop which is hilarious because DS is monumentally stronger even if Pop was 120 seconds of use. DS needs to be looked at and hopefully it will
This is a case of Us vs Them, how dare you touch my timer on my perk when the other side has a timer.
The two perks are nowhere similar and I find amusement they are compared.
DS has already been nerfed heavily 3 times, I don't think it needs looked at. Killers do need to grow a pair and stop asking for survivors to be dead on a silver platter.
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@ClickyClicky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1644691#Comment_1644691
I don't think you grasp how they effect the game though. They keep the entire game rolling on and in some cases can even reset it.
Isn't that what killer slow down perks do but on a more consistent basis?
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@ClickyClicky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1644623#Comment_1644623
Perks are winning the game for them?
You mean like DH, Sprint Burst, DS, Unbreakble, Adrenaline, BT etc etc?
Half of those are situational 1-time use and depends on what the killer does.
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@ClickyClicky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1644354#Comment_1644354
I’ve seen you complain about Undying/Ruin. If you nerf Pop what do you think killers are now going to be more likely to run?
You’ve even said before about Hag being able to run across the map and Pop a gen within 45 seconds. It she does that shes giving up all existing pressure she may have on the map. Its not worth it at all, that was the issue with Pop in its original form.
And no if you take a DS it doesn’t mean you’re winning.
I dont like to accuse people of only playing one side but from all your arguments I cant come to any other conclusion.
I complained because there's another aura reading perk and now it is tied to slowing the game down. Killers depending on such perks to win means they are not winning, the perks are winning the game for them. If killrates are very high, which I can guarantee they are, then these kind of perks need nerfing. It's also too oppressive on fast killers.
A fast killer with an aura read is going to be oppressive to play against, guarding a totem all game and that's exactly what is going to happen. Will they nerf it, I'm already hoping so. If the hag can still cross the map is 45 secs then it isn't a nerf at all. It just means she can't stop and get a drink on the way.
I actually played killer when the game first came out when kills was actually no easy feat, so you might want to stop there. I remember when all four had sprint burst that replenished mid-chase, self-care was faster, insta-heals, insta-gens, and before DS was ever nerfed (3 times btw). Borrowed time protected the unhooker. Jungle gyms all had two pallets each and they were all vacuums. And maps had several jungle gyms. Every building had an infinite window. You killers have no idea how easy you have it now.
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@Slashstreetboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1644354#Comment_1644354
Yeah, but it's the others that are entitled and totally not you....
I agree tunneling( which is a very loose term) can feel ######### but slugging? Theres tons of stuff to combat that and in the higher skill brackets a much needed tool for the Killer to create pressure.
And if you think only tunnelers get hit with DS, think again.
If a killer is getting hit with DS when he wasn't tunneling, it is still his own fault and he is already winning. Guess what you can do to prevent the PGTW regression? Nothing, just watch it happen. Several times a match too. Comparing a perk that has a chance of never being used to a perk that slows the progression on a consistent basis is disingenuous.
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@SpaceCoconut said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1643975#Comment_1643975
Kind of like Decisive Strike?
Not related. The only people that want a reduced timer on DS are tunnelers and entitled killer mains. The nerf to POP won't even affect anything, it just means you have to POP the gen instead of downing someone else and even having time to hook someone else. Nobody needs 60 seconds to POP a gen. Tunneling and slugging is a huge problem and they would be silly reducing a timer on DS to make matters even worse. If anything, they should buff it so it doesn't count down while being chased or when slugged.
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@Hopesfall said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1643784#Comment_1643784
So define where a "smartly" use of his power is going to be? In an open field where the survivor can see the tracks and has 3 secs to doge it? At a loop where the survivor can completely see PH, essentially the same as being in the open in regards to reaction time.
So.. how should a PH player use their power that would placate you?
Let me guess, by missing every shot so you'll feel good about yourself.
If he's missing every shot that means he is bad. Relying on the no-win pallet hits means PH was boosted.
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POP was not nerfed enough! All they did was change it so you couldn't cross the map, down someone, pop the gen, hook them, and then pop it again. Even slow Hag can walk across the map within 45 seconds with BBQ.
They still have NO COUNTER to the objective progress removal. NONE. They didn't address why it was used so much.
They may be looking at stats and killers are enjoying a 3K+ average killrate all using slowdown perks is why they did it but it wasn't enough. It would be stupid to nerf survivor perks especially those that counter unfun killer strategies. And can be completely countered, whereas many killer perks have no counters or hinder the survivor so much it loses the game.
Still no information about nerfing the overpowered killers or the broken ones. They are hardly survivor sided!
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@oh_0k said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1638349#Comment_1638349
It's a crazy amount of free info that you can use pretty much all the time
Sounds like BBQ, Undying, Whispers, Nurses Calling, I'm All Ears, Infectious Freight, several other perks.....Blight's addons...
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UNDYING, RUIN, TINKERER is about as busted as it gets on a fast killer. Can't believe such a thing exists. The only thing you can do is either fall asleep or farm some points and die. Killer has become the EZ mode.
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@ Antares2332 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1638917#Comment_1638917
Oppressive, as all killers should be.
#FreddyTheMostBoringButTheMostBalancedKiller
Edit: Nerfing a killer just for being "boring" is a very sad excuse.
Give survivors the ability to teleport around the map to unhook survivors, repair gens, and then we can talk about that "oppressive" fairness you think he somehow is entitled to have.
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@ Antares2332 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1638259#Comment_1638259
I think survivors should stop expecting ez escape. A escape should not be a balancing metric.
#FreddyTheMostBalancedKiller
Teleporting with BBQ and dropping snares everywhere for an ez oppressive win is not really balanced imo.
#FreddyMostBoringKiller
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@ Antares2332 said:
No. Why nerf a balanced killer?
All killers should be on Freddy's level.
Stop asking for easy games.
I think killers should stop expecting ez 4Ks. A 4K should not be a balancing metric.
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@MusicNerd_TC said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1636413#Comment_1636413
Just curious, you thought Billy and nurse didn't need any nerfs, but huntress and deathslinger do? A good nurse will take down any survivor regardless of skill as well.
I might not have a problem with deathslinger if they nerfed him to have an animation of lifting his gun. Huntress needs her hitboxes fixed and a cooldown and I might be ok with her.
How often do you see a really good nurse? Once a month.
How often do you see a Huntress wiping the floor with ease? Every day. She's too powerful and convenient.
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@SkeletalElite said:
no counterplay ≠ unbeatable
a team who plays well by early throwing pallets and sticking gens will still win, but the game will be extremely boring. Killers like PH, deathslinger, doctor, spirit all have a very unhealthy design in how they're balanced. They're pretty strong in the 1v1 but so much so the way you beat them is by playing as safe as possible and when survivors play as safe as possible and do gens as fast as possible you have games that are extremely unfun for the killer.
Basically the way to beat them is to make the game unfun for the killer but the alternative is losing to a very unfun killer to play against.
The problem with deathslinger power is that because he can fire so quickly (and thus leave not enough time for a human to react) and also has no cost (no slowdown/cooldown) to only pretending he's about to shoot, that leaves the only counterplay as throwing pallets before the killer even has the opportunity to try and make a play at the pallet. This is boring as a killer because if survivors paly well you will just spend the entire game trying to catch up to survivors with your 110 speed and kicking pallets. If the survivors don't do this, all they can do is try and guess whether or not the slinger will actually shoot. If the slinger is bad he may miss shots but if he's not he'll just m1 you while you waste time juking or if you don't juke he will just shoot you.
Pyramid Head has a similar problem. When he sticks his sword in the ground, he slows down a little bit, but is still faster than the survivor. This means anytime you reach a pallet, PH will stick the sword in the ground then if the survivor does not throw the pallet they ran through he just cancels his power and will hit them with a basic attack. If they throw the pallet. Pyramid head will be able to hit them with punishment of the damned because throwing a pallet stops you from moving for ~1/2 second which is more than enough time for pyramid head to react.
Doctor also has a similar problem to deathslinger. Upon reaching a pallet a smart doc will make you completely unable to throw it and eventually get a hit by repeatedly shocking you just before you reach the pallet. Eventually he will catch up to you and get the hit even though he slows down when he uses his power because it doesn't slow enough to cause the survivor to gain a significant amount of distance. This makes the counterplay to throw the pallet before he can even shock you. Even then the pallet may be short enough that can he can still get the hit by shocking you to stop vaulting, but not all the time. At the pallets where this works, you have the same situation as deathslinger, you spend the game just kicking pallets and running after survivors with no mindgames.
Spirit's problem is more unique in that the problem is a lack of feedback for the survivors. Survivors are told so little about what the spirit is doing that when you get hit it often feels like all you were doing was running around like a headless chicken just trying to hopefully confuse her, but in the end everything is on her side. A survivor who plays well may be able to delay a decent amount of time by holding W against her but it's very unfun to do because the game feels like it's entirely in the killer's hands and lacks the back and forth interaction between killer and survivor that makes the game fun. The spirit player gets to do all the interacting while the survivor is basically just throwing the bones and hoping they get a highroll.
tldr; These killers encourage survivors to use boring play styles because it's the only way to consistently outplay good usage of the killer's power and the alternative is just getting killed by something you couldn't have done anything about. These killer aren't overpowered, they're unfun. The solution would be to adjust the powers to be more fun (inevitably making them weaker) but to give them a compensation buff in some other way.
A coordinated genrush should not be required to beat a killer. A survivor, which can be a single solo player, should feel like their time and effort invested should be able to thwart off the killer to a limited degree. A good deathslinger will take down any survivor instantly regardless of skill and that should not be acceptable.
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For starters, he needs an actual animation of lifting his gun. About like spirit when she was missing a vaulting animation, a completely unbalanced omission.
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@MusicNerd_TC said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1636286#Comment_1636286
"No survivor perk helps them complete gens faster or rewards them" *Dark sense, leader, resilience, and prove thyself have entered the chat*
So leader and prove thyself was nerfed. Resilence means you have to stay injured. They are all bad.
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I can't think of a survivor perk that is a crutch. However, any perk that slows the game down, provides a wallhack with simple ease, stops the opponent objective from being completed, removes objective progress, or hinders the objective from being completed are crutches. No survivor perk helps them complete gens faster or rewards them, especially in correlation to how the killer plays.
Killers have a lot of crutches and they use them every game.
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He should have already been heavily nerfed. He is the pay to win dlc.
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"Second game made a 3 gen as blight killed 2 of them 1 of them found a key in chest and the hatch spawned right next to them"
I'm really glad they found a key. 3 gens are not fun and you probably refused to chase anyone.
This is so why keys should never be changed.
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@redsopine00 said:
Very abusive I mean dude you could not be tunnling them at end game they take the hit and can crawl out because they decided to take a hit it should also deactivate of you deliberately run at the killer or take a protective hit
If they got the gates opened, shouldn't they have a small advantage in that scenario? I think so.
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I thought it was very ironic Ohtufu is complaining about a perk while getting a 4K so effortlessly.
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Pallets have been bugged since they fixed vacuum pallets. What I saw in the video is a common occurrence. You have to throw the pallet early to avoid getting hit. Same with vaulting a down pallet too, you can be totally vaulted on the other side and the killer will still hit you. Been like this for over a year now and the devs refuse to fix it.
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@BaldursGate2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1631840#Comment_1631840
Freddy is a M1 Killer and can be beaten like any other killer, you just need more effort and skill to do it.
And killers or people in general, tend to play scummy when they think the game is unfair. I bet, less killer would consider tunnel / camping / mori when they know, the meta would not be mostly 2nd chance perks that drains the fun out of the games.
The problem is Freddy doesn't need to learn anything to win. Asking SO much from survivors makes it totally unbalanced when the killer has to put in no effort.
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You were probably using the wallhack addon or abusing some perk in an unfun way.
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@BaldursGate2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1631812#Comment_1631812
Yeah, imagine 4 survivor would have as much power as one killer. Who is gonna win then lol.
A very coordinated genrush shouldn't be required to beat Freddy and others like him. But it is required and that is unbalanced. I actually wager a lot of coordinated SWFs lose to him and to a lot of perks killers use.
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@MusicNerd_TC said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1631645#Comment_1631645
BBQ has been touched, remember when they introduced the mechanic of hiding in a locker to avoid it?
That means stopping the objective. And most maps lockers are far away so that means most of the time it is a huge detriment. BBQ has way too much power in that regard. No survivor perk has that much power throughout the entire match.
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@OtakuFreak said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1631645#Comment_1631645
LOL?
Please tell me what combination of perks give killers free kills
Because survivors sure do get LOTS of perks that give them second-chances and invulnerability to getting killed.
Freddy. Freddy with BBQ, PGTW, NOED, just to name a few.
Ruin. Played a Freddy with tinkerer recently and nobody could get anything done because he was awarded for the other side doing the objective. It was the most unbalanced situation I ever seen.
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DS has been nerfed 2 times and reworked once.
Killer meta perks such as BBQ has never been touched. Killer perks have all been buffed with the exception of Ruin which I can argue is just as strong.
I think killer perks need some nerfing so they are not abused every match and hand their 4K to them on a silver platter.
Killer perks need nerfing and survivors need more better perks.