Skill_issue
Skill_issue
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@Wexton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3366257#Comment_3366257
While the first part is true, kill rates still have nothing to do with how good a killer is. Also, if a survivor sees your trap they can just take a hit from you and deadhard through it. Or they could just, y'know, walk around it like most survivors do. You're still gonna have to do with deadhard when playing trapper, like you do when playing most other killers.
i know kill rates have nothing to do with how good a killer is otherwise nurse would not be so low and the game wouldn't be balanced around that information.
deadhard grants endurance not invincibility; i havent had a single person deadhard through my traps when i play him.
the hitboxes being crap when survivors just walk around traps while the trapper walks into them i will give you that one
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yeah when i am not running legion, stbfl is on whatever killer that is played
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365348#Comment_3365348
Basically if you hit them with a chain while injured, they can't dead hard, and then if they break the chain, they get deep wound, and can't dead hard. So yeah, pretty much hard counters it.
thanks for the tip
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@Wexton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365007#Comment_3365007
And? Kill rates have nothing to do with how good a killer is. Freddy is an example, he's one of the worst killers in the game yet he has one of the highest kill rates.
Also, I don't know where you got the idea that trapper doesn't have to deal with deadhard because he certainly does.
kill rate stats are what the usually base nerfs on it just isnt specified if it is at a high mmr or low mmr. for example, the twins brown add on was nerfed because it was overused at high mmr while old ruin was nerfed because it was supposedly to oppresive for newer survivors.
and trapper doesnt have to deal with dead hard if you chase them into his traps
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@Reinami said:
1 shot killers till have to deal with dead hard. If you are injured, you can still dead hard the 1 shot.
Legion is played a lot actually, but the reality is they are mostly pretty terrible in general and have other problems that aren't dead hard.
The one i have been seeing the most of (and using a lot) is people playing pinhead with the original pain addon
does that counter deadhard pretty well?
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@AMOGUS said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365015#Comment_3365015
Source on that add-on update? Because if that's true, I'm gonna be pissed that they're listening to 1v1 babies and nerfing tombstone.
it was mentioned a while back after the addon update for ghostface i believe...sorry dont remember the official source just that myers was the next killer to be looked at for an add on pass
if someone wants to put the source please help out
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@Xernoton said:
My lord, you're right! You know what else counters DH? Tunneling and camping! That's the solution.
Maybe I'll just become a basement Bubba main.
it does counter it and the tools are all there...you dont have to basement bubba though normal bubba works.
i wouldnt fault you after all only kills and escaping the trial affects mmr
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@jinx3d said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365018#Comment_3365018
and its always people with dh and bnps and other good survivor things too, lol
@jinx3d said:
legion, myers, ghostface, slinger, skull merchant, bubba, and billy are all low tier killers who get ######### on by any competent team on a decent map.
also we shouldnt be forced to play an entirely different character than what we enjoy to deal with ONE perk
so how should dead hard be nerfed to make it fair for these killers?
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@OrangeBear said:
Expired Batteries, Corrupt Intervention and Jolt sounds like a good combo, though i haven't tried it yet.
Also combining Brutal Strength/Fire Up and Bamboozle/Superior Anatomy with Geographical Readout can make you faster in a loop with a drone.
She's an M1 killer so spirit fury and enduring can be fun, can also add hubris to it now with the knight's perks.
Also in an interview one of the devs said that information perks worked well with her so that's another thing to try.
thanks for the tips much appreciated.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365079#Comment_3365079
I was running the addon to gave her haste + action speed increase. But I was running out of those so I was messing with Expired Batteries.
I did try randomised strobes, but once I learned it was only 3 seconds of hindered and being in the drone area didn't refresh it, I stopped using them.
yeah she does have a variety of addons...was looking into a skill check build but wasnt sure if it would be strong enough on her
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@jinx3d said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365075#Comment_3365075
scourge hook is risky because you could get a scourge in your drone area which would deactivate it
trust me, the meta is very strong on her especially
good point
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@Crowman said:
My build that I've been having good success with is:
Jolt, Spirit Fury, Enduring, and Sloppy. Also I run the exhaustion inflicting addon so I don't have to deal with Dead Hard.
what do you run for the other add on? thanks for the tip
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@jinx3d said:
cob, overcharge, nowhere to hide is a strong combo on any killer but it feels especially strong on her because of her drones, she can contest a 3 gen and even a 4 gen stronger than any other killer in the game imo
the basic gen kick meta build does seem strong on her right now add in a scouge hook/jolt and that is a lot of regression
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@burt0r said:
We already see enough complain threads about bubba, legion and Myers?
About them always camping, being boring and only bringing their good add-ons?
if the killer camps with any of these killers then the killer lose the games with the other survivors doing gens...that is the counter play especially against bubba.
same with legion, don't group up and frenzy isn't as big a problem
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365011#Comment_3365011
Ok. So why are all survivors running Potential Energy every single game then?
are you saying why aren't they running it every single game? i guess they feel confident that 3 genning isn't a problem in there games and found the counter play using deja vu or splitting up the gens that are done across the map?
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@Monlyth said:
Because you can only use your one-shot once with those Killers; after that, the Survivor can just stay injured and get the DH anyway.
with bubba you can catch up and with legion you just make sure to get a frenzy hit first...there is counter play available. ghostface and myers yeah i guess they are screwed but myers is supposed to get an addon update.
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@Seraphor said:
Because people like to play the killers they find fun, not be forced to play specific killers that have certain strengths.
If 3-genning is such a problem, why doesn't everyone just run Potential Energy?
i agree potential energy should be used to solve that problem as well as off the record to discourage tunneling and reassurance to discourage camping. the tools are there they just have to be used correctly.
it isn't hard to designate one of each of those perks as a utility to survivors playing in a swf.
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@Krazzik said:
Because one-shot killers and Legion are generally low-tier, and can just be looped for ages.
dont legion and bubba have among the higher kill rates though? i only know of trapper being the lowest and trapper doesnt have to deal with dead hard with big brain plays either.
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@Seraphor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364990#Comment_3364990
The more options like this you include, the worse matchmaking ends up being for everyone. Having an option for crossplay is already an option too many.
If 50% of the playerbase have this ticked off, and 50% don't, that's two halves of the playerbase that won't be matched with each other, and everyone's matchmaking times just doubled.
but in theory it would affect me correct? others who dont click on option will have their quick fix games intact and i would just be waiting for a more even match
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@Seraphor said:
You might be happy to wait 10 minutes, but the majority aren't.
This was tested last year. The system we have is the one the playerbase preferred in a blind trial.
what i am saying is there should be an option just like it is an option to either include cross play or not include it in the menu
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3362473#Comment_3362473
Because that's exactly how this post comes off. Sometimes it is simply a skill issue. I used to 4k all the time on old eyrie. I don't really have a map as killer that I have a real issue with. I perform well on all of them. Depends a bit on the killer and my build. But none of the maps feel disadvantageous to me when I play killer.
may i ask what killer you use mainly?
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i honestly hope they do an anthology series of films like the dark picture anthology games. have the observer choose a lore book and that way each killer gets their own movie
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3358531#Comment_3358531
its not easy fix for trapper because his issue is SWF disable traps. if you follow trapper around and stay 20-30 meter away from him. The trapper following you will lose the game because he is m1 killer and has little to no power in the chase but if the trapper ignores you, you can disable all his traps and he will become an m1 killer with no ability.
Trapper's strength is unpredictability but once you remove unpredictability. there is only predictability. there is a number of ways to go about fixing trapper's primary issue but all of them have some drawbacks.
Solution 1: Make trapper traps not time efficient for survivor to disable them.
- Increase the time it takes to disable traps from 3.5 to 30 seconds.
This change makes it unrewarding for survivors to disable traps because it is so time consuming that doing so is waste of time. This means trapper can put traps at pallets right in the open and it becomes win-win. If survivor disables trap, they waste a lot of time doing so. If they do not disable traps, a potencial powerful pallet is eliminated from the game. I think biggest issue behind this is that it strength's trapper ability to lock-down 3 generators and basement. I think this gameplay relatively boring.
Solution 2: Put Iri stone base-kit.
- Traps are automatically reset every 30 seconds.
Disabling trap is fast but becomes just as time consuming as increasing the disarm time. it has same issues where 3 gen lock-down and basement are stronger leading to stale gameplay.
Solution 3: Make trappers traps transparent and add minimum viewing distance(e.g you must be within 6 meters of a trap to see the trap on the floor). Combine this change with the ability for Trapper to throw his traps similar to placing freddy's snare pools.
I think this would best change for him because he could do something i like refer to as dead-angle trapping. Dead-angle trapping is when the trapper puts a trap out in the open at a sharp corner and the survivor when being chased takes sharp corner and walks into a trap. this works because even though trap is perfectly visible out in the open, survivor when looping a specific direction such as clock-wise need to bend their camera FOV to see traps behind sharp corners. Most survivor player do not that because its irregular to do that especially in the chase. you usually place your FOV on survivor in front of you or behind you as survivor. Never to the side. As a result, 99% of survivors will just take sharp corner while looping trapper and directly walk into his trap. this would allow him to have increased flexibility in placing traps out in the open freed from requirement of placing grass positions but they could still potentially be disabled if someone sees you throw the trap. At very least though, it would be harder to spot traps and trapper could use LOS in key moments to make it tricky to figure out where the trap was placed.
If your out in the open in a stray pallet, the trapper being able to throw his traps means that he can zone survivors by pushing them away from pallet/window, kinda like mini-hex blood favor/bamboozle. This is similar to how Artist can put birds at loops and people can run away or Knight ability to throw guards. its not amazing anti-loop nor is it time efficient but at least its better than trapper power being so slow at placing traps that power is nearly unusable in the chase.
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If including all add-on and all perks. I think freddy is worst killer overall because nothing he does is better than other killers. Staying out of dream world is m1 killer. Gen TP can be outclassed by other mobility killers options. Anti-loop can be counter by pre-drop pallets given that his snares placement slows him down to 100% negating the purpose of the hindered. Has zero good add-on to elevate him.
never understood why iri stone isnt basekit or him being able to walk over his own traps(his brown addon), or injured survivors being downed after stepping in a trap(honing stone)...he is supposed to have supernatural powers like all the other killers right?
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@H2H said:
It’s funny that being injured is such a non-issue that the best strategy against certain killers is “just stay injured.”
which is just dumb that they can repair gens at the same speed while holding their gaping wound closed
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@Riski said:
Nurse was release to be the "fix" to an incredibly broken dbd. Infinites, insta heals and the works and Nurse was the only killer who could compete with good survivors who knew these ticks and was balanced by being hard to play. Her strengths of good chase helped against good survivors but didn't help with the more traditional, immersed hide and seek most players preferred. Over time this has changed as learning nurse became easier with guides and help from those who has already done it and these options being significantly less power, with nurse also being nerfed, and people as a whole focusing less on immersion and more on looping and competing.
Dbd's longevity early would of been in jeopardy without a killer like this to band aid the game's problems without hurting the upload cycle of content, although I believe perception on how powerful killer's should be now would probably be better without nurse. Do I think modern dbd would be better if Nurse was replaced with a different killer when she came out, yes. Would we have modern dbd without release nurse, maybe not. Overall nurse is an old killer who is arguably outdated in the ways that make her strong who was designed for a different game of hide and seek who beat looping, which is what was needed back then.
i always thought it was having halloween as a paid license is what kept bhvr alive actually...if she came out right now i am almost sure she would have the iridescent addon which is one blink and then normal walking speed as basekit.
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@bunnyfengenthusiast said:
Plague: Corrupt, Thana, Deadlock, Dying Light/COB
Legion: Corrupt, Thana, Pain Res, Jolt
Notice a trend? Corrupt is near mandatory on 90% of the roster.
i was using more of a chase build with legion enduring spirit fury pain res thana...thanks for the input
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@ARTRA said:
Otzdarva have a page with this, 3 builds to every killer. And at least 1 is "free".
Hope it helps.
thanks for the link i was using a thana dying light corrupt pain resonance build for plague
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@Phasmamain said:
Plague I like to run retribution, pentimento and plaything with pain resonance, Probably not the most meta but still very strong
why retribution?
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3357221#Comment_3357221
They will never be able to bring solo even close to 4 man swfs on comms. Truth be told killers in general don't need a bunch of buffs. Lower tier killers need buffs specific to them and maps need shrinking.
True but it is depressing to see the same killers after a certain mmr range. All killers should be somewhat viable.
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@Entitled_survivor said:
At the very least make it so if a survivor dies on a scourge hook , another one takes its place from existing hooks
This would be a nice change
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@TigerSnake said:
So the unhooked survivor can get a guaranteed free flashlight save that the killer can do literally nothing about?
free flashlight save where? if it is the unhooked survivor that should count as a copious action just like healing is.
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@Trollinmon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3357215#Comment_3357215
Pretty sure you get I-frames and that wouldn't work with you getting off hook.
30 second ds is the same as 0 second ds. Not only should you be lasting longer than 30 seconds but the killer will always wait out the basekit 30 second ds than eat it and give you 16 meters of distance. All that would be doing is making it a slight inconvenience for the killer tunneling you. The problem is otr is not good enough of a deterrent for tunneling as shown by the uptick in complaints and massive reduction in the usage of the anti-tunnel perk.
i agree survivors should be lasting for longer than 30 seconds but the game is being balanced to the lowest mmr player base. I mean the base kit unbreakable ptb was going to be a standard at one point.
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@Carth said:
It's from an era where sabo would also Perma destroy a hook and you could also permanently destroy trappers traps(literally turn his power off). As you can imagine survivor teams abused this and destroyed every hook possible(minus basement as you cannot sabo basement hooks). When BHVR tweaked that behavior they left the perma destroy mechanic in place for survivor deaths but removed it off of sabo.
It is almost assuredly not some big brain design choice on Bhvrs part but just laziness when they tweaked the behavior for sabo and never bothered touching the logic for hook deaths. It's a very rarely complained about mechanic that really has just come up due to swf + boil over and a few select maps
I never understood how the perma sabo mechanic existed in the game along with infinite loops without bloodlust. Early dbd was rough for killers
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@thrawn3054 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3357156#Comment_3357156
Not really. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. Also Kindred is incredibly powerful in the hands of those who know how to use it. Too powerful to given for free imo.
swf on chat can already relay that information, the only way to get solos to swf level is to give them access to as many swf advantages as possible otherwise the game will never be balanced in the way bhvr want to balance it.
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@SpaghettiVase said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3357156#Comment_3357156
No it won't. It's just information. I can send you wikipedia articles of random things, that doesn't mean you'll learn what to do with that information. Solos either get better with time, or don't get any better than they are currently. You don't just pile on buffs until the worst players become average by way of just sheer support.
isnt that what has been happening to help newer players though? base kit borrowed time and nerfing gen regression perks to help survivors and the small base kit brutal strength and stbfl buffs for killers
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@Trollinmon said:
1 isn't easy to add and would require them to code and do a bunch of testing to implement something like that. Reducing base bt endurance and massively increase the speed is the simple solution that solves that problem.
3 means you just body block and run unbreakable to abuse base ds. Anti-tunnel perks must come at a cost and can't be free basekit things survivors gets.
5 low tier killers are in general fine. Low skill expression and are designed for new players. The only issue that low killers need resolving is how badly designed the maps are. Sadly I don't think that will ever be fixed since it has been literally an issue since 1 month after release.
1.no hit detection code is already there after a survivor gets hit, just make that instance = true after an unhook
2.I agree with forgot to put the ds timer to avoid the old unbreakable/ds scenarios
3.Yeah map sizes really need to be looked at or if not the size at least the window/pallet spawns for some maps
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@Trollinmon said:
1 isn't easy to add and would require them to code and do a bunch of testing to implement something like that. Reducing base bt endurance and massively increase the speed is the simple solution that solves that problem.
3 means you just body block and run unbreakable to abuse base ds. Anti-tunnel perks must come at a cost and can't be free basekit things survivors gets.
5 low tier killers are in general fine. Low skill expression and are designed for new players. The only issue that low killers need resolving is how badly designed the maps are. Sadly I don't think that will ever be fixed since it has been literally an issue since 1 month after release.
any base bt endurance will be used to tank a killer hit offensively. No hit detection happens after a killer hits a survivor so just use that code after the unhook condition = true.
Base ds would have a timer so that it would be useless to try to run the old unbreakable/ds trap from earlier dbd.
Map sizes i completely agree with but will probably never get fixed i mean look at the eerie of crows reduction.
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@SpaghettiVase said:
because kindred doesn't counter camping? It just lets everyone know camping is occurring. You can take Kindred every game as a solo survivor and that doesn't mean your teammates are going to know what to do in that situation. Camping is countered by gen efficiency and hook trading at the right moment, most people don't understand that.
it would still help to bring solos up to the level of swf and learn what to do.
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@coldestwinter123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3357137#Comment_3357137
nothing. your suggestion is great and thats why i upvoted it and commented on it . good idea.
the second sentence got chopped off in the original post otherwise yeah it would have been supremely overpowered haha
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@coldestwinter123 said:
they should also add a 50 cal that i can 360 no scope the survivor across the map once the gens are done. and because of the impact it instantly counts as 3hook stages and it transitions in to a ranged mori.
what is overpowered from the suggestion in your opinion? gens get rushed they had time to do some totems on the side and if no one is dead then they clearly are outplaying the killer correct?
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3356499#Comment_3356499
Actually, the way to improve it is to 1: not get downed to begin with, 2: If this is your big grip, there are perks to literally counter it. Whether you choose to use those or not is your own problem. 3: As stated, it'll be the same issue as hook suicides. Im sure you can agree that sucks. Maybe not. Either way, it does, in fact, suck.
so hypothetically the nurse or blight or oni that downs everyone (redowns after unbreakable) and then just leaves them to bleed out for 4 glorious minutes means its a skill issue. at that point the killer won and i just want to move on to the next game so let me hold the button down and bleed out faster if no one is hooked in the next 30 seconds
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@GreyBigfoot said:
It's a good game design to prevent killers from using the same areas over and over. Some dead zones can inescapable if multiple people are caught out and the killer could continually use the same hook. Just like survivors need to be wise with pallets, the killer should be with hooks.
I find myself in this situation as killer sometimes where I'm like "do I want to sacrifice this person on a Scourge Hook, or should I risk going farther, and try getting 1-3 more uses from it before I remove it from the map?" It's an interesting risk/reward scenario and I think the killer can play around it just fine, except in rare cases.
And if the survivors insist on being extra obstinate about it, you have the power to punish that by leaving them crawling.
sometimes that isnt possible though and you end up with bad rng and 1 hook in 1 corner of the map only (midwich and ormond come to mind) it is just ridiculous that comp corner is still a thing
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
As your name suggests, sir. You merely need to improve. Killers just got their dead hard gutted, so lets let them have some time.
improve waiting on the floor for 4 minutes? vital gameplay that
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@Cassiopeiae said:
Aren't bot DC replacements coming?
with the ai of the knights guard? i cant wait haha
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@JPLongstreet said:
Primarily lore related. Also the challenge created by the hook deadline I suppose. This is one of the oldest game mechanics left unchanged, and many do call it outdated. Personally I just work around it.
it is very outdated and changing it helps slugging and a bleed out button more than base kit unbreakable would
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@Wexton said:
The last 2 can be viable strategies, if survivors with say boil over are going to areas where you can't hook them bleeding them, out is your only option. Teabagging a killer to get them to chase you also exists, although the survivors who do that tend to be cocky and will get downed 10 seconds into a chase.
that is just a design flaw for letting hooks disappear when a survivor dies on the hook which everyone just seems to agree with oddly enough
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@Akumakaji said:
Enough has been said to this bait comment, but I will humor OP one more time: you know whats vital to the game even more? Hitting survivors! Its absolutely core to the killers gameplay, in theory you could finish a trial as a survivor without ever crouching, but you need to hit survivors as the killer. So why is it that survivors call me rude and toxic for hitting them on the hook? Its just the most natural thing for a killer to do, even vital. Get it? :)
In theory you dont have to hit survivors to end the trial though.
I have seen ghostfaces that just run around crouching repeatedly and playing hide and seek and dont ever hit a survivor and the game ends with a happy time for all.
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Thanks to everyone for the ideas as there is only so much you can teach someone playing in private games until they hit thier first genrush squad.
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@Veroles said:
Corrupt Intervention from "Plague" is the best counter of early gens and i play it always.
I mean it's something you can "pay" iridescent shards so it's more a grind wall than a pay wall that's why i suggest you to unlock this killer soon as possible.
It is still a paywall while he grinds to get plague. It is that player retention that takes a nose dive if people get outplayed and then dont continue playing to unlock new perks and learn how to play killer efficiently.
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@HugTechLover said:
Yes. All are completely vital to DBD.
vital to a tilting a player?