Seraphor
Seraphor
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As people become more aware of backfilling, killers will end up dodging more. I know I do it, it's basically the only time I will routinely dodge a lobby, if I know I've been backfilled. And if I'm dodging a backfilled lobby, then that lobby had been dodged at least twice already, and is more likely to be dodged again. So it's like a chain reaction.
I don't have a solution, but you need to reduce the amount of primary lobby dodges. Why, other than backfilling, are killers dodging lobbies? Likely suspicion of SWF or "bad matchmaking", and the latter is itself probably due to a lack of understanding of backfilling.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3373436#Comment_3373436
here's issue with their change. if you place 4 drones by generators. there is no obligation for the survivor to power-up the killer until final generator and even then, now the skull merchant claw traps are more dangerous then her lock on. There is no incentive to ever put get a claw trap because Haste status effect is stronger then Exposed effect. You can outplay exposed by staying injured the entire game rendering status effect irrelevant.
so now what happens is that you will need to use all 3 drones on pre-determine 3 gen, i.e your power is irrelevant for entire game and once all 4 generator have been completed. the survivor will ignore your drones on gens and play permanently exposed on purpose. So these buffs in regard to gaining haste and gaining dissolution will never occur. Her anti-loop is tied behind survivor giving killer anti-loop.
Do you know what killer also has this problem? Plague
Her claw traps are like corrupt puke. Nobody will ever give a single claw trap the entire game and she has no ways to force survivor to willing place a claw trap on themselves apart from Iri add-on. So now her 3 gen is worse while her anti-loop is entirely controlled by the survivor.
6% haste isnt all that threatening when you have PWYF that gives 5% for one stack, and a maximum of 15%.
Besides, I still see survivors cleansing in all my Plague games.
This is definitely an improvement over 30 minute gen hostage games every single game.
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3 genning is definitely nerfed, but it requires survivors to engage with her power and lead her away from the 3 gen, in a way that's much more risky for them. Disabling the drones will actually prevent her having active zone denial over those gens, for as long as you hold the Claw Trap.
In some ways, it'll create a dynamic that's a little bit like The Plague, in the sense that her power will be used in two contrasting ways, depending on how survivors engage with it. Cleanse = Corrupt Purge, no cleanse = easy M1 downs.
Likewise with Skull Merchant. Disarm = chase powers, no disarm = zoning and gen defence.
A good 4-man where the strong runners grab the claw traps will absolutely destroy her gen defence. While a Skull Merchant who can master both strategies will be able to adapt as needed can pressure the survivors who have the claw traps.
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372231#Comment_3372231
Sure. Like when he made custom games KYF where people allowed to play had to be prestige 100 (and it was way closer to remake of prestiges - so it meant those people play way too much). How is it possible, that Ayrun was able to spin that Oni? Clearly it had to be beginner player /s
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371712#Comment_3371712
I specifically mentioned limited FOV helps against Blight and Oni - but it sure helps also against spirit, nurse and wesker (just not as much). Are you arguing those are weaker killers? Because it is clearly easier to "hide" from killer that zooms better then from killer that is regular slow M1 killer. So the exact opposite is true - it nerfs strongest killers the most
So 90% of killers should put up with disorientation and motion sickness because of a handful of killers that are too strong?
I would gladly see those killers nerfed in exchange for better FoV.
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It is absolutely dumb that you can "hide" either in front or right next to the killer, within 1 m, simply because you're out of their FoV. Literally standing on their toes, and completely invisible.
360's are equally stupid. You're gaining an advantage by playing a slight of hand trick and vanishing from view, without the use of any obstacles or LoS blockers. It works purely because it disorienting for the killer, making killer gameplay feel even worse.
Many things about DBD's early design are stupid and have been rightfully removed, like hook facecamping, being able to immediately down a survivor when unhooked, and instant flashlight blinds. This is yet another thing that should be shown the bin.
And the thing is, these things don't generally work against the best killers, they work against less experienced killers. They're also used predominantly by SWF and not solos. Removing these would get yet another thing that levels the playing field between SWF and solo.
Is it technically a buff to killer? Of course. Marginally, but it is a buff, because it makes avoiding killers attacks slightly harder for the most skilled survivors. But in light of rebalancing the game, with SWF and solo being brought closer together through solo survivor buffs, it's a buff that needs to happen just as much as those solo survivor buffs need to happen.
87 degrees is ridiculously specific and smaller than any other first person game. Being able to choose between say, 90, 95 and 100 would be more than enough, and still wouldn't be a significant info gain. Killers wouldn't be able to see things they shouldn't, but they wouldn't be disoriented or motion-sick simply by playing the game normally.
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@DBDVulture said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371536#Comment_3371536
"I could definitely see this being an issue for licensed chapters though. Why would you buy the whole chapter, when you could just buy the Killer, and then grab the survivors perks from the Shrine?"
Your statement makes no sense. In the first place you can't buy Freddy with Shards.
Also let me remind you that the purpose of the shrine as defined by the developer Dave in 2016 is to give everyone access to DLC perks. In part this is a measure to make sure new DLC is not "pay to win".
The shrine is most definitely not doing that when Pinhead's perks have not been in the shrine over a year later.
Yes, the purpose of the shrine is to make licensed perks available to everyone, but only after so many months. If you want them on day one, you have to buy the licensed characters, or the chapter as a whole.
Survivors are just skins, unless you specifically want to play as that survivor, buying them is pointless, you buy them for their perks.
Killers while unique, are also seperate to their perks, you may only way the perks and not the killer.
So if you were given the choice, would you:
A. Buy the whole chapter, killer and survivor, for $10.
B. Buy just the killer for $5 and then buy the survivors perks for 6,000 IS.
C. Just buy the perks for 12,000 IS.
How many sales would this cost them? And how many sales would it cost the license holders? They have a deal with BHVR to sell their product.
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Regardless of experience and skill level, you need to be able to shrug off unfair/unwarranted criticism, and to not let insults get to you. Easier said than done for sure, but it's also a useful skill for life in general and maintaining a good mental state in light of all the various controversies in the world.
Learn to think critically, learn to recognise fallacies, and learn to accept others opinions without taking them into yourself. Someone calling you a slur is only a reflection of them, not you.
In short; don't take it personally.
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@BarnesFlam said:
The shrine should not be a weekly rotation, but a permanent catalog, available at all times.
There, I said it.
This would be fine for original chapter perks. There's little functional difference between paying 9000 IS for a character, or 2000 IS for one of their perks. Value differences sure, that's just a matter of personal preference/priorities. So why not provide this choice at all times?
I could definitely see this being an issue for licensed chapters though. Why would you buy the whole chapter, when you could just buy the Killer, and then grab the survivors perks from the Shrine?
They would probably have to charge AC for licensed perks instead of IS, if they were permanently available.
Alternatively: permanent catalogue for orginals, rotating shrine for licensed.
Or more likely: permanent catalogue of 3000 IS / 300 AC perks, plus rotating 'discounted' options that includes 2 originals and 2 licensed for 2000 IS each.
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You overestimate BHVR's turnaround time.
It takes a full patch cycle (3-4 months) to evaluate changes. The Survivor HUD icons came less than 2 months ago, so you're looking at at least the next mid-chapter.
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The Shrine does need to update. With an increasing perk library to pull from, the chances of any individual perk appearing are getting less and less.
I would say it's probably time to have two separate Survivor and Killer shrines, still 4 perks each, so that there's greater coverage and greater choice available.
As well as excluding perks from free characters. There's no reason a perk from Claudette or Wraith should ever appear and clog up the system.
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If it's just you and not your spouse on PC, then could it be your wifi? Could the PS5 be closer to the router, or maybe try a wifi extender.
But yes, DC penalties increase incrementally. They start at 1 minute (by the time you make it back to the lobby screen it's likely only 30s or less remaining) and then increase to 5, 15, 30, 1 hour, 6 hours and 24 hours. However DC counts decay over time (around 24-48 hours) so if you only DC once per day or so, then it'll only be the 1 minute ban each time.
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@ThanksForDaily said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368024#Comment_3368024
I didn't say not to kill switch Spirit. Of course I do are you kidding me 😂
I believe they don't do it because 2 killers being killed switched is looking bad for them.
I don't think you understood what I just said at all...
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One problem here.
You say inconsistent collision makes the game 'bad for beginners', but it's not beginners who are abusing the hug tech glitch. All of these 'techs' are exclusively high-end practices.
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@ThanksForDaily said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368014#Comment_3368014
DbD never had 2 killer deactivated at the same time. Nurse an Clown were killed switched in different dates.
I'm not sure why this "2 at the same time" thing is even an issue.
This Spirit bug existed before the Dredge bug appeared. If they were going to killswitch it (which they wouldnt and shouldnt) then it would have been done already.
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I'd say it kinda made it worse.
The 3-gen is inherent to her power, it's literally tailor made for securing and monitoring three zones.
In the PTB she was so weak she was forced to use her power this way. But buffing her has simply made it easier to use her power this way,.
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Because Spirit's 'bug' is literally nothing. All it does is make part of her power the same as it used to be. It's not even the slightest bit close to "gamebreaking", unlike a totally invisible killer that doesn't even have limited invisibility as part of their power.
The Spirit bug is on par with the bug that makes the 'bubble' block out auras. Irritating, but ultimately inconsequential.
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Only valid use for it, is combining it with Sloppy, for a hit-and-run build that burns through medkits.
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If the reason being that there are 'too many cosmetics' in the shop, then I'd propose a system where you can enter a sub-menu of 'Collections', which would only display the skins from those collections in a separate shop menu.
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The CoH for Dead hard! Excellent!
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Spirit has been in the game for four and a half years, has had several reworks (nerfs) and add-on passes, countless discussions, and she's finally in a balanced place.
I also have to wonder, do you actually play killer? Because you can't tell exactly where a survivor is just from scratch marks. Most Spirit players are already very adept at tracking with just sound, she even has add-ons that remove scratchmarks, so that's not a significant nerf to her as it is.
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@Krazzik said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3366422#Comment_3366422
I understand why you'd put them on the 'not m1 killer' list, it's exactly why most people don't, however the very name m1 killer does imply it's all about using the m1, otherwise it'd be 'basic attack killer'. If however you -are- using the arguement that it's about basic attacks, then Spirit would HAVE to be an m1 killer. Yes her power helps her get the m1s, but most non-damaging killer powers help you get the m1.
"M1" is a colloquialism, not a definition. It doesn't apply to console for one thing.
Every killers power helps them get the 'm1', so that's not a definition either.
But high mobility powers result in a markedly different playstyle to those that have to walk at base speed or have to be in base range to attack.
It's all about playstyle and how survivors have to interact with the killer.
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Nurse and Blight are definitively not "M1" killers, because they have special attacks.
A blink + attack and a lethal rush are definitely not basic attacks.
Spirit is a little more vague, but I'd put her in the "not M1" box due to how she can combo phasing with attacks.
An "M1" killer is generally regarded as a killer that relies on basic attacks, and doesn't have a power that either gives greater mobility*, range, or loop denial**.
* If that mobility cannot be used in a chase, e.g. Freddy and potentially Sadako, then it could be debatable.
** If the loop denial is purely passive, such as Trapper, Skull Merchant, then this is also a little vague.
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@Reinami said:
It needs an actual downside/activation condition beyond "get injured"
The one i would propose is:
- After being injured for 40 seconds, dead hard activates, and lets you do the same stuff you currently can do. After being healed, or downed, the perk will decactivate.
This basically means that if you get hit and the killer can down you in the next 40 seconds, then you don't get use out of a dead hard. It means that it can be countered by playing well and doesn't reward the survivor unless they play well. However, it also gives the killer a chance to decide to abandon the chase so they don't have to deal with dead hard. If i hit a survivor, and haven't seen them use an exhaustion perk, i can assume they have dead hard, and if i have a hard time hitting them in the next 20-30 seconds, i can just abandon the chase and go after someone else instead of continuing to commit and risk them using dead hard.
It also is tied to "while injured for 40 seconds" rather than like a "40 seconds after being hit" so that after you get unhooked you can start increasing your timer to get dead hard, or if you want to stay injured due to a perk like "resilience" or you are running no mither for some reason.
I like this idea. It relies on you either getting injured long enough before you're chased, or for you to draw out the chase as long as possible so you can gain access to it.
Alternatively a "charge in the killers terror radius" pre-requisite like Pebble/Stake-Out could also work. It wouldn't be particularly difficult to do, but it would require some downtime spent prepping it first, and would reduce the number of instances on average that it is available.
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- Would have been fine for the old Dead hard (was actually my go to suggestion before 6.1) Now though, it would make the perk too weak, what's the point in tanking a hit if you just guarantee another one in under 10 seconds anyway?
- Would make the perk virtually useless, see above.
- Nobody who uses Dead Hard would like this. It sounds like a good idea for a fair perk based on protection hits though, whether it's for Dead Hard or not.
I think there could be a few other options though.
- Dead Hard could have a telegraph. Not for when it's about to be used, that would make it too clunky, but a sort of tell that indicates if a survivor has Dead Hard available. It could be as simple as showing the killer if a survivor is Exhausted, or giving Dead Hard a unique running animation while injured, if it's available to be used.
- Adjust the duration of Exhaustion timers. Currently all Exhaustion perks are 40 seconds... why? Make Dead Hard a 60s Exhaustion, meanwhile, Background Player could be 20s.
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@Nirgendwohin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3366279#Comment_3366279
not all edit's get marked, i can tell you by personal experience.
They're automatically marked by the system. If they're made within a short time (I think about 10-15 minutes), it's a white note at the top of the post, though this doesn't indicate the user who edited. If they're made after this time, it's a red note at the bottom of the post, and indicates the user who edited it.
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Most likely backfilling.
If you enter a lobby and there's already four survivors readied up, you probably replaced someone who lobby dodged. This process, backfilling, bypasses MMR.
So you should also dodge that lobby until you get one that isn't already 4 survivors.
It will be particularly tricky for new players because the MMR distribution is a bell curve. The majority of players are in the middle, with those on the extremes (newbies and pros) being the minority. This means if you get backfilled, you're almost guaranteed to end up in a lobby far, far above your level. (while a middling player who gets backfilled could go either way)
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Tbf, I don't see why all Exhaustion perks are set to 40 seconds.
You could fine tune balance a little more by adjusting the duration of Exhaustion.
Background Player could use a 20 second Exhaustion, while Dead Hard could get a 60 second Exhaustion, and the rest stay about 40 seconds.
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@Nirgendwohin said:
mods remove and edit (without marking the edit) user posts all the time. on a bigger dbd discord you can bet (for fame) on when a post gets deleted, moved or edited.
The edit is always marked. I regularly see Rizzo tidying up mine. XD
But the fact that there's a DBD Discord that's gossiping about forums posts is a little concerning...
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@roundpitt said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364636#Comment_3364636
Spirit has an addon that instantly recharges her power when she is stunned.
Which is pretty busted, and should probably be changed to "only loses 50% of her charges" or something.
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@Saiph said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365281#Comment_3365281
Yes better create unplayable lobbies and waste the time of the 4 other people who have a normal connection, right?
Have you even seen the video shared by OP? Can you say this will be a genuinely fun & fair game?
This game is incredibly latency-dependent, you shouldn't be able to play it at McDonalds.
The video shared by OP is tame compared to most games I play, and they're far from "unplayable".
But no, lets exclude huge swaths of the playerbase from playing the game. Lets just blacklist hundreds of thousands of players because they don't live next door to the servers. DBD is an exclusive service that only exists in a few cities. You need to move to London or Frankfurt to play DBD. Forget playing for Playstation Plus, you need to fork out for a visa and a new apartment.
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@TigerSnake said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365304#Comment_3365304
I just said what made them unbalanced. Newbies over inflate the kill rates cause they don’t know how to take advantage of the bs on the maps, let alone loop. That’s why those statistics are meaningless.
So you're saying that all kill rates are inflated by noob survivors? Are they inflated on all maps?
What about noob killers? Does that deflate kill rates?
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@TigerSnake said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365012#Comment_3365012
Majority of players suck ass at this game, so kill rates don’t mean anything to me when common sense would indicate that they’re unbalanced. Cowshed’s escape rate was a 50%, so that must mean that map is totally fair and balanced right? Lmao. Maybe you guys should tell me why the indoor maps aren’t survivor sided when I’ve already explained perfectly why they are?
If map balance doesn't have an impact on kill rates, then what exactly is the issue? What makes these maps unbalanced? They're less "fun" even though you win on them just as much?
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@Saiph said:
@Peanits The technical constraints are understood, but the least you could do to mitigate the problem would be to show the killer's ping in lobby to survivors (and please the actual number, not just the current icon). So people could decide if they want to play this match or not. Even having 100 ms is a clear advantage that guarantees the killer a free surprise hit on everyone in the lobby. Inexperienced most likely don't care, but I can tell you 90% of big survivor streamers would dodge 100+ ms ping killers...
High ping is banned in DBD tournaments and iirc even BHVR rules say it's bannable to use a VPN in order to get an unfair advantage so why can't we at least know if the killer is doing it other than taking a hit? The game would need to show current ping as well as the max ping over the last 5 seconds so we can also detect lag switchers.
Killers with high ping would be dodged every game and wouldn't be able to play at all.
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"even though I run kindred so everybody knows what's going on I will be doing a gen while the killer is just sniffing the hooked survivor and the other two are slowly approaching the killer trying to do a super crazy save even though we have 4 gens left. "
Other survivors only see the auras if YOU are the one hooked. Your Kindred won't help others if they're hooked.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364721#Comment_3364721
Thats why those extremely low skill based playstyles (basement Bubbas and afk survivors) should have a different queue. Where they are matched with each other until they start playing "normal" again.
Playing skillful during the rest of the match but dying at the end, should rise the mmr. Just as it should with 8 hook killers that get no kill. They both should increase their mmr (even when "losing" by not escaping/killing). Simply because the mmr is supposed to be Skill based. Not escape/kill based mmr.
Since then skilled players get matched against skilled players and afk players that try to tank their mmr instead of playing on their level, will end up with other players that tried to tank their mmr.
How do you separate out those killers? Serious question.
This all comes down to "how do you evaluate skill?" And it's an impossible question to answer.
Kill/escapes rates ARE a measure of skill, via proxy, because the higher skilled you are, the more likely you are to kill/escape. It's the only objective measure available, all others are subjective.
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Generally, I'll only dodge if I've obviously been backfilled. If I load into a lobby and there's already four survivors who are already Readied up. AND if they seem like they might be way out of my league, like multiple 30+ Prestiges, or multiple TTVs.
This might happen once every session, on average, so like, once every 5-10 lobbies. Backfilling seems to happen a lot these days...
For some very niche scenarios, I might dodge if I'm playing Hag or Wraith, and I see 2+ flashlights. but I haven't played Hag in months, and I usually only tend to see one flashlight at a time unless I've been backfilled anyway, so that's kinda moot.
But generally, a high prestige, or a flashlight, or a lobby already full of survivors that aren't already Readied, individually aren't enough reason to dodge.
As a survivor, I might have dodged the odd lobby with a survivor that has a wack name like... "Will DC if Nurse" or something like that. Otherwise I don't really see any reason to dodge as a survivor.
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@jinx3d said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364652#Comment_3364652
you can always buy one survivor, or none at all, you arent forced to buy it
And I won't be. But many players automatically buy every chapter on release, because it's the only way to access the perks for a minimum of 3 months.
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@Skill_issue said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364994#Comment_3364994
i agree potential energy should be used to solve that problem as well as off the record to discourage tunneling and reassurance to discourage camping. the tools are there they just have to be used correctly.
it isn't hard to designate one of each of those perks as a utility to survivors playing in a swf.
Ok. So why are all survivors running Potential Energy every single game then?
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If all of these maps are so survivor sided, then the data should support this, right?
Kill rates on all of those maps should be lower than average...?
Is that the case?
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@Skill_issue said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364996#Comment_3364996
but in theory it would affect me correct? others who dont click on option will have their quick fix games intact and i would just be waiting for a more even match
It would reduce the number of potential players for everyone who is in the queue.
For those who have the "3 minutes max" options, you're making their matches even worse than they already are, and potentially failing to even find any match within those 3 minutes depending on how many are online and currently queuing for a game.
For those in the "close match with no time limit" option, well instead of 10 minutes you're waiting 20, even 30m+, because it's not a linear scale.
And then you'd get your match after 30 minutes of waiting, and it'd be a super sweaty match that you didn't enjoy at all, and then you'd come back to the forums to complain about matchmaking.
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@Skill_issue said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3362604#Comment_3362604
what i am saying is there should be an option just like it is an option to either include cross play or not include it in the menu
The more options like this you include, the worse matchmaking ends up being for everyone. Having an option for crossplay is already an option too many.
If 50% of the playerbase have this ticked off, and 50% don't, that's two halves of the playerbase that won't be matched with each other, and everyone's matchmaking times just doubled.
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Because people like to play the killers they find fun, not be forced to play specific killers that have certain strengths.
If 3-genning is such a problem, why doesn't everyone just run Potential Energy?
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@ReviloDBD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364888#Comment_3364888
I don't enjoy playing "Meta" and I think it's fun to have different playstyles available in the game to keep things from getting boring.. this was one that actually worked really well, and if you EVER actually tested the build that I ran you would know for yourself that it actually PREVENTED tunneling and sort of confused the killer on what they should do..
As some others have pointed out, it's a bit of a lose / lose situation for the Killer because it isn't good or easy for them to tunnel, and it's also not easy for them to chase the unhooker. They have to choose between 2 decisions that are going to harm them and make them waste time either way no matter what..
Honestly if you actually consider how powerful it can be and often was against exactly tunneling or camping killers, I genuinely thought that they changed the Perk because they thought it was "Too OP" combined with certain perks, not the opposite which is what some of you are saying about it being too harmful to the team.. because it is simply not actually true if you've played it and tested it enough you would know that it is quite effective.
Also why would a Perk that has to be combined with other Perks be a problem or make it considered weak? Literally, at least in my opinion, the absolute funnest part of DBD is coming up with unique perk combinations that synergize well together and create uniquely powerful situations when played correctly. There's nothing wrong with that, it is often really fun and still gets wins for both sides, I don't see the problem.
Do you understand that your specific build "that definitely worked really well and prevented tunnelling"... was a niche build that no one else would run? That outside of that one specific build, this perk made the game worse?
...why would a perk be bad if it has to be combined with other perks to not be a toxic mess?
I feel like I'm going around in circles here. Please just read my previous posts.
"yeah ok, maybe this deadly pathogen kills everyone who comes into contact with it, but if you mixed it into potato salad it actually treats athletes foot, so why not disperse it into the atmosphere?" "I just like putting potato salad on my feet why is that so wrong?"
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@jesterkind said:
Her power can't be up near a hooked survivor, though, so she'd have to be pretty far away for that to work- and at that point, any killer can do what she's doing since she isn't using her power near the hook.
Drones can't be placed by hooked survivors, but they can be placed close enough that the edge of the active zone is only a few meters from the hook, which is all that matters.
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@Eelanos said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364776#Comment_3364776
"You know what a much better alternative would be?
- When you unhook another survivor, you gain a 8% increase to repair speeds for 60 seconds."
Ah, there we go. That's always the solution. Either more gen speed or the eleventh health state.
Oh there we go, assuming someone is a survivor/killer main.
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@ReviloDBD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364750#Comment_3364750
I completely disagree, I think it's a very unique playstyle that can be extremely effective under certain circumstances..
Just because some people might use it incorrectly, doesn't mean that it can't be used really well with the perk combos that I mentioned above, and the fact is unfortunately the people who will troll will troll whether or not this perk exists, that's not going to change.
Using BT + Guardian for example would make it so you could intentionally throw off a tunnelling / camping killer by giving the unhooked player speed and endurance buffs that should last long enough to get away (especially without leaving scratch marks or blood) and while also still giving yourself a speed boost to get away as well.. (or you can retreat together knowing the direction of the Killer and both having a speed boost)
During the PTB when I was testing it, I had a very high success rate of getting 3-4 Escapes on my teams using this strategy and it was really fun, and nearly invincibile in EGC.
There were honestly so many different fun plays you could do with it... I'm really disappointed the community wanted to get rid of it..
"I think it's a very unique playstyle that can be extremely effective under certain circumstances.."
Sure, and the other 99% of the time, it helps tunnelling.
"That's really sad to see, I didn't know people were so narrow-minded about new things being added to the game :("
It's actually the opposite. You're being naive and not seeing the big picture, because you're too narrow-minded about your one extremely specific certain circumstance.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364789#Comment_3364789
Literally what is wrong with tunneling? It’s a viable strategy that the developers of this game constantly reinforce. What’s wrong with another kil—survivor perk designed to make it more efficient?
It's an entirely valid strategy, it just needs to come with more cost.
Killers need to be giving up pressure in some way if they're choosing to tunnel out a survivor, but currently tunnelling is a win-win. You eliminate a survivor early (who doesn't get a chance to do anything but run and die) and the remaining three survivors don't have the manpower to repair 5 gens and escape.
There needs to be a valid cost-benefit trade-off to tunnelling out a survivor. Making survivors more costly to tunnel by making them more difficult to down, is one way to do that.
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@Xendritch said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364776#Comment_3364776
So your solution for a perk change for it in a game where gens go to fast...is to make them go faster?
Also old background player literally paired with BT. You used that with, BT and guardian and it punished the killer for going back to hook cuz neither target would really be good to go after. Instead we have a perk that legit either just gives the killer free hits when the survivor runs up and fails the flashlight save or literally nothing but free exhaustion for a survivor on a gen.
Again, if the perk relies on being paired with other perks to prevent it from being abused, it's already a terrible idea.
"gens go too fast" is an issue of balancing, and perception.
Gens don't go too fast if you prevent them going too fast, and this wouldn't make gens go too fast if you chased the unhooking survivor instead of the unhooked survivor.
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@Xendritch said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3364759#Comment_3364759
I don't see a ton of on purposeful griefing from survivors to each other in my games. Maybe my MMR is too high for that and you see it at lower levels, it's possible I guess.
It's not just griefing from survivors. If the killer perceives the rescuer as a less optimal target, then they will go after the unhooked survivor. This perk was undermining everything that BT, OTR, DS, etc. is trying to do. Encourage the killer to avoid the unhooked survivor.
You know what a much better alternative would be?
- When you unhook another survivor, you gain a 8% increase to repair speeds for 60 seconds.
Bingo, you now make the unhooker the target instead of the unhooked. You combine this sort of perk, with something like Sprint Burst, to make you a difficult to catch target. If you get chased, you save your friends, if you don't get chased, you smash gens.
Save friends, smash gens.
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@Xendritch said:
Because "iT IncEnTIviZeD tUNnElINg" according to the community. In reality it was an interesting perk made for a specific build but people only see perks being used cynically so like reassurance they got a good perk nerfed. This community has a habit of getting in it's own way sometimes.
You actually play DBD, right?
"I wOuLdNt UsE iT tO tUnNel, So WhY wOulD aNyOnE ElSe?"
Lets just give the killer a perk that shows them the aura of a survivor for 30 seconds after being unhooked, so that they can avoid them. Sounds fair right?