Saiph
Saiph
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- Saiph
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One killer you don't want to face specifically is Bubba because if he's directly facing you that generally means you're going to die in 120 seconds
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I don't ever see the DC problem go away, my hope is that they will fix it through reworking game mechanics, eg. having a bot survivor replace the person who left, or making the 3v1 less unwinnable for survivors (which would also partially fix tunneling).
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Doesn't matter what the "official" average killrate should be, because the way BHVR records it is flawed and doesn't match what we get in game anyway.
Eg. I wouldn't mind a 60% killrate if it was truly what I would get, but right now we are supposedly at 60% and yet as survivor I escape around 20-30% at most, with some very bad days where I get 10+ losses in a row. On killer it's the total opposite, I probably have 90% killrate or more, to the point where I consider 2K a major f*ck-up and I can remember every match where I ever got 1K or less.
The game was definitely 2x more fun for me in June when the official killrates were around 50% ( - I still was far below 50% escape rate). Despite the queue times which were slightly higher back then the game didn't feel so hopeless.
But the problem is that as it turned out, too few DBD players want to play as killer. Even right now I see the BP incentives are often on killer in my region, despite the state of solo queue being so bad, yet people would still rather queue for that than killer. It's not an easy task to balance a game where one role is so unpopular.
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Of course, you don't have any recording to prove your winstreak?
Even against baby killers I don't buy the 15 winstreak, at some point your teammates will throw hard enough that you'll lose, pretty sure OP is just lying. I'd be surprised if they got even a 5-game winstreak.
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Ah yeah, the usual "BHVR must buff killers or I will tunnel survivors".
Notice a pattern:
BHVR brings killer-sided patch 6.1. Killers reaction -> "Yeah but still gens go too fast, we have to tunnel to win".
BHVR adds Reassurance. -> "That's it, killer is dead, we'll have to tunnel to win now"
BHVR reveals that killer has a historically high 60% winrate. -> "Yes but still, we have to tunnel otherwise we can't win."
BHVR adds solo queue indicators: "Yep, definitely can't win without tunneling now."
At this point, if you really want to tunnel that bad just do it bro, you don't have to announce it to the world. In fact, you're not fooling anybody, most of you are already hardcore tunneling, and the reason you can't win without tunneling anymore is not because the game is more survivor-sided but just because your MMR has increased and now you're getting matched with tryhards like you...
OP's next post will be something along the lines of "I'm only getting matched against SWFs please BHVR let us dodge and remove MMR".
If survivor is that strong please go play it and also record your gameplay so we can admire your insane win streaks. You're so oblivious to solo queue state that you probably haven't even realized that sloppy/mangled bug makes it unplayable right now, it's a waste of time like it has always been but now you can't even sit at a gen because you're healing and mending and getting erupted every 2 minutes.
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@burt0r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3332490#Comment_3332490
You doubt anybody minds blight?
There is a three pages long bitching thread about blight on the front pages of the forums right at this moment called "Blight AND Nurse".
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/362861/blight-and-nurse
Here even the link. And something like that isn't rare.
And people already DC against Nurse so it's not like we are avoiding the problem with the current system
If the DC rate would be any argument for anything like this then we could delete everything because weak people already DC against every killer.
I said nobody minds Blight except at high MMR. The person you quoted is probably at high MMR, or thinks they are.
I think it is commonly agreed that Nurse/Blight are too strong at high MMR. I don't see what's wrong with letting high MMR players choose and see if they all ban these 2. I hihgly doubt this will be the case, but if EVERYONE ends up banning these killers to the point that their mains don't find a match, then it means these killers are very problematic, and hence, the solution was to rebalance these killers in the first place, not to hide the problem for years by forcing people to play against them.
But I highly doubt people will ban these 2 especially Blight, because even though he's strong, he takes skill to play correctly and he's also fun to play against. There will be other very strong killers like Spirit/Artist so survivors can't realistically ban all the top tier killers, if they do end up banning Nurse/Blight at first, they will probably switch to different killers after a while once they realize Blight was not that frustrating compared to the other.
Regarding which killers are going to end up being banned: (also for @HoodedWildKard )
Unfortunately there will be some speculation as I haven't found any poll explicitly asking "which killer is the least fun to play against", but we have Kyto's community tier list asking "who is the most fun to play against" (1 million votes)
In this list, Blight was voted the 7th MOST FUN to play against on . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXgFLrjKmLQ . I agree with this list and have seen this opinion shared by many survivor streamers, eg. Scott Jund: https://youtu.be/n6tfddNSQaM?t=1309 puts Blight as S-tier in the "fun for survivor". Note that Nurse is C-tier, not F-tier.
Anecdotically, you can google for various reddit threads and see for yourself that people have a wide range of killers they don't like, eg. https://www.reddit.com/r/deadbydaylight/comments/s36e88/top_5_least_fun_killers_to_play_against_no/
I don't see any killer there mentioned more than 2-3 times.
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3332289#Comment_3332289
I get what you're saying but people shouldn't just DC because they don't like killers. What you're descriving is exactly what my survs did. They wanted to play with flashlights and I brought a perk to prevent that. They then quit. And threw the match.
People should still have a duty to a least attempt the match. Because if a player leaves at the start then it ruins the match for the other 3 survivors. They have zero chance to win.
"Oh I don't like playing X killer, I'm going to quit, I don't care about anyone else in the game."
If a surv gets tunneled out at 3 gens left and there isn't any progress. Sure suicide on hook. Or DC if you really don't want any points. But throwing the game in the first 2 minutes is really unacceptable.
Well, I see this argument constantly on the killer's side: "I should not care about the survivors' fun, I play how I want". Then why would one expect it to be different for a random solo queue player with respect to their teammates?
Basically, you're expecting a person to sacrifice their own fun and stay in the game for 4 strangers' fun. But the very first reason why they play the game is supposedly to have fun themselves, not so others can have fun. You can add incentives for people to stay in the match (eg. DC penalties, bloodpoint penalties etc.) but that doesn't really address the fundamental problem. Imo, the better way would be to fix the game to reduce the chance that survivors don't end up in a match they have no interest playing.
Imo, it's a fair request to not want to play against all 30 killers in the game, let survivors ban 2-3. There are other fair requests like seeing killer's ping. Killers could be given the right to ban a few maps to compensate.
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@burt0r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3332289#Comment_3332289
Sure you can show all of that from the killer when you show openly what kind of swf solo composition the lobby. Just don't expect to ever get a game as 4 men group again just like nurses and blights.
Sure, no perfect solution exists, but letting survivors ban something like 2 killers (out of 30) seems like a fair middle ground.
I doubt anybody really minds Blight except maybe at high MMR. Nurse is another question, I don't mind her either, but if it turns out that Nurse players can't find matches anymore because eg. 80% of survivors don't want to play against Nurse, then why do we even keep her in the game? Like, having a killer so problematic seems like a much bigger deal than queue times. And people already DC against Nurse so it's not like we are avoiding the problem with the current system
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@Jay_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3331791#Comment_3331791
Don't get me wrong. I call them a bully squad but i don't mind playing against them as its the most free 4k of my life. Bully Squad was just the easy term to call them XD.
Regarding odds being rigged against that aint entirely true because although there are a lot of games i 3/4k there are also a lot of games i get destroyed by the survivors.
I think the issue for me when I see a survivor D/C whether I'm playing killer or survivor is when you hit that play button your agreeing to play the match regardless of what you come up against. Now granted if your being hardcore tunneled and face camped then sure, let go on hook and go next its understandable at that point but simply D/C because you went down quickly due to lethal or you can't loop because its clown or as OP had you can't get a flashlight blind because a killer brought lightborn is kinda pathetic and needs to stop. All you're doing when you D/C is prooving to the killer that your salty af, letting down your team and ruining the game for both sides.
Just because you go down fast doesn't mean that the killer is going to win. Lethal makes a quick hit/down very viable these days but after that its anyones game.
"In an imaginary world where killer's winrate would be at 40%, maybe you could call them entitled, but in the current state of the game, DC'ing is an absolute human reaction. Survivors don't have the luxury of knowing what the matchmaking put them against, unlike killers."
I don't understand this. How do us killers know what we are going up against. The only information we have on survivors is 1. what item they are bringing and 2. what their prestige is. We don't know perks, we don't know if its a SWF team, we don't know if they are on coms or not on coms, we don't know how good these survivors are. Now you think if a survivor knew which killer they were going up against do you think killers like Blight and Nurse would ever get a game within a reasonable time frame or would lobbies be dodged constantly?
Overall I will call any survivor who D/C out of a game a salty baby because thats what they are. They can't accept the game and cry because they can't win.
I'm actually for having larger penalties for survivor D/C than Killer D/C because its so much more popular. (Yes i play both sides)
I actually agree with most of the things you said, in particular that some survivors are really entitled and DC for really anything. I have seen people DC against the most baby beginner Wraith just because they got downed, no idea if some of them will ever actually play a match lol.
Where I disagree is when you say that, if people queue up then they should agree to play the match regardless of what happens. The thing is DBD is many things at once now. There are 30 killers, each with different sorts of counterplay (some that you can loop, some that you can't), then there is the variance of their perks, their playstyle (camping, slugging, tunneling), their teammates (are they potatoes or not?), and the killer's ping. All of that means for the survivor that they can get a wild variety of different matches, many of which they are just not interested in, maybe the survivor has brought a healing build because they have a challenge, and in reality they will be matched against a tombstone Myers which ignores their build. Maybe they brought a chase build in hope to mimic their favorite streamer and they get matched against a Nurse with Starstruck etc.
Now, add on top of this, that the survivor's role has a sub-50% winrate, so not only you sometimes must force yourself to play a match that you don't enjoy, but you also know that you're most likely going to lose. As a result when you queue up as survivor it does not feel like you're really signing up for something in particular, but rather praying for the matchmaking to not screw you up too much.
As a killer, you have a lot of control over what the match will look like. Survivor perks and the map choice are really the only uncertainty. Sure, once in a while you can end up vs. atypical survivors like a SWF sabo squad or something, but that's really rare imo, less than 1/20 games, you can dodge them if you don't like that. And you can see the items they bring, their prestige and their Steam profile, which can give you an idea of their skill level and whether they are in SWFs before the game starts. You can dodge private profiles if you suspect a smurf, cheater etc.
Because survivors don't get such control, some of them simply leave until they get the type of matches they really want to queue for. You can debate whether this is a d*ck move or not, but I think everyone agrees that there are matches in this game that are DC-worthy, in any case, it's very unrealistic to expect survivors to enjoy every combination that the game can offer. Some people want to loop more, some people are interested in BPs/challenges/achievements, some people want to go for builds which are useless against a given killer, some people can't stand specific killers (eg. Plague's vomiting effects). etc. Personally, I dc when I'm matched against killers with 150+ ping.
Ideally the matchmaking should let you ban a few killers, show the killer's ping and profile. Then a lot more people would dodge lobbies and maybe increase queue times but that's an issue with the game. If some specific combinations are so oppressive that nobody wants to play against them these combinations should be addressed and made more fun. The solution is definitely not to put random survivors to fill these matches, this will cause frustration and DC as we see now.
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Survivors are just leaving because they know the odds are rigged against them, nowadays you have 0 chance to win in solo queue if the killer is competent. So, for many, the only reason to play is to loop the killer, but, you're playing Clown and denying them everything they queued for and you're making that even more obvious with Lightborn.
In an imaginary world where killer's winrate would be at 40%, maybe you could call them entitled, but in the current state of the game, DC'ing is an absolute human reaction. Survivors don't have the luxury of knowing what the matchmaking put them against, unlike killers.
And btw, you're calling them "bullies" but as a killer I enjoy playing against loopers/flashlight squads. They are not bullies, they are people who want to play for chases, not for wins. I'd gladly give you the survivors who hide and sit at gens like bots.
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They should let survivors ban 2 killers and let killers ban 2 maps.
Survivors will very likely not all ban the same killers, so it will barely affect queue times. People blindly think it will just be Nurse when in reality there are tons of killers that are more annoying to play against, like Pinhead, Knight, Plague etc...
And it's much better to have a queue take maybe 15 seconds longer than have people DC in the 1st minute and ruin the whole match because they didn't like the killer.
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@Tostapane said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3329477#Comment_3329477
i stopped reading when you said otz put gideon as killer side map... but in all seriousness, there's no way that people with a lot of experience will put this map as killer side (add also the fact that otz has a DIFFERENT mmr from the others, specifically made for him since most of the survivors that he will face are straight up bad...). DH isn't overrated, quite the contrary, it's underestimated by people that think that's sufficient to bait it when there are various issues with that perk, and again if otz found people with that perk that will go down in 30 seconds then it further prove that he's currently facing people that aren't good (plus auto dead hard is still a thing). The fact of survivors winning by pressing m1 on gens isn't something new, but that's not the main issue imo since gen time is fine until someone took items or perks that aid to shorten up the time needed to repair generators (just like medkits or CoH erased the hit and run gameplay for example). The other exhaustion perks are nowhere near the POTENTIAL usefulness of dead hard for a couple of reasons:
1 unlike the other perks, dead hard doesn't triggher doing certain actions, but it require only to be injured and to activate it whenever you want with a button (it's potentially a lot more optimal essentially, especially when people that know how to loop use it)
2 unlike the other exhaustion perks it will pratically ADD another health state (3 hits with 2 burst of speed for the survivor instead of 2 hits and 2 burst of speed with every other exhaustion perk), not to mention that you are free to abuse certain loops without wasting your exhaustion perk earlier. For example: you are already injured and you have 1 pallet and 1 window in a jungle gym, where at a certain point you'll be forced to use the window to gain distance in order to avoid to be cached with lithe, dead hard will allow you to juice up that loop until the killer will have enough bloodlust to catch you while vaulting (and still being unsure if lunging at you for the possible dead hard)/fake it (and use dead hard)/throwing the pallet (resetting his bloodlust from the starting point, with the possibility to juice up that loop even more while keeping your dead hard for later)
regarding about another objective to do for survivors i fully agree, especially considering that generators skillchecks aren't exactly a funny thing to do (at least for me)
So you are saying that Otz does not have a lot of experience playing killer?
Watch for yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-L566X0gs_8
You are viewing only the downsides of killers, and not the massive upsides. Yes, the number of pallets on this map is annoying, but killers have a power that usually changes everything and many tiles can be mindgames/bloodlusted. In practice, survivors never play perfectly, they eventually make a mistake or end up cornered after 2-3 pallets.
If you believe it's Otz being too strong, I can record myself playing as Trapper and winning on Gideon, I've already had the discussion with many people on this forum, in fact I claimed that Gideon was an easy map for Trapper, before Otz made the video.
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This forum really likes exaggerating, but calling solo queue survivors "omniscient" because they can see icons is a whole new level lol.
I guess killers should be called hackers too because they can see things like gens location and loud noise notifications right?
I wish people making this kind of posts would share their survivor gameplay. OP please play ~10 matches of solo queue then come back and tell us how much you are in love with the survivor role again. Especially curious how you can exploit the omniscience information when tyour teammate is getting facecamped.
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@Sava18 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3329042#Comment_3329042
Peanuts literally confirmed that dh has server side validation now. Which means if you have bad ping then dh doesn't function correctly. Just like blight.
But it also means that if you have good ping then there are cases were it functions correctly... so it can be used reactively in this case, provided you have good reaction time.
So here we are in 2023 now the effectiveness of a perk is determined not by the respective players' skill, but by their ping and the server's tickrate, not just 2 things that are outside of your control, but in fact, the game doesn't even tell you the values so you can't adapt your playstyle...
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@Tostapane said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3329089#Comment_3329089
i partially agree with you... i said partially because devs won't balance around high mmr, otherwise buildings like the house in the garden of joy (not to mention all the jungle gyms and pallets present in that map), the school and the fake basement (badham), the central building in the swamp and the boat, the HUGE quantity of safe pallets in the game just to name a few ones shouldn't even exist because you can keep busy the killer for 5 gens without issues in those zones. Add also the fact that people can stuck multiple 2nd chances and you'll have a MISERABLE time aganist those groups no matter what you'll do... in low mmr the game is killer side without doubt since people are actually afraid of the killer and will hide instead of doing useful things like doing generators or destroy/blessing totems
Disagree. Half the killers in the game have ways to ignore the strong pallets/loops, even weak killers like Trapper do. This is perfectly illustrated by the fact Otz put Gideon as "killer-sided map" in his tier list despite most of the forum constantly complaining about this map. DH is overrated and is not a 2nd chance due to how unreliable it is, if you really get hit by DH more than once per game then you're getting outplayed, even Otz who constantly complains about this perk still wins his chases in 30 seconds.
The reason why the game feels hard for killer is not because chases are too hard (they aren't), it's because no matter how good you are in chase, survivors can just play like bots and press M1 then they will win due to math. There should be more perks like DH which allow outplay possibilities for both sides, I know getting hit by DH is annoying but think of the alternative, now if all 4 survivors run a perk like Lithe then now it is just a guaranteed 10 sec loss for the killer at every chase, so survivors get even more free time to press M1, which the game definitely does not need more.
Imo generators as a whole need a rework and the game needs actual secondary objectives for survivors. "Just do gens" is currently the optimal strategy for survivors in 90% of cases, and it's boring for both sides. Survivors doing gens are for the killer, equivalent to what facecamping is for survivors.
Killer is camping? Just do gens.
Killer is playing normally? Well, still do gens.
Want to open a chest, cleanse a totem, open envelopes, things that the game gives you BPs for? Well, you're throwing, you should be doing gens instead.
Wait, why did you even bring a flashlight? You should have brought a BNP and just done gens.
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I had roughly the same story and impression as you. For a while after I first played killer, I stomped every game with almost only 4Ks. The game ended up feeling so easy and unfair that I voluntarily played without addons, without gen perks, and tried to go for 12 hooks when possible.
However, something happened and now my story differs significantly from yours.
At some point, after a VERY high number of wins (500+), MMR actually started to catch up, and brought me some new types of survivors which I'd call... very sweaty. It was very obvious that something had changed, as my queue times became longer, and in every game I would now get 1-2 people with 4000 hours, sometimes streamers, while I still had barely 200 hours on killer. Suddenly every single survivor knew how to loop, most mindgames stopped working and it felt like they knew the map perfectly etc.
But still, I had already seen some good chasers, didn't prevent me from getting 4K's before. However, what I hadn't see before was the literally insane speed at which these new survivors do gens. The thing is, these players are actually playing to win, and as far as gens is concerned, they do not waste a single second. I have an anecdote here, in low MMR it would often put the game in background while in the loading screen and be literally AFK for the 1st minute of the match. But now, it feels like the total opposite, not only do I have to play with 100% focus from the first second, but if I waste even I'd say ~20 sec because a chase went a bit too long, then I know that I've already lost. Basically by the time I get 1-2 hooks the game is over.
I absolutely don't care about winning so high MMR killer games don't bother me, I still get some fun chases, I just find it a shame that the games are over so much quicker, and I'm very confused by the fact survivors enjoy this playstyle. As a survivor, why would you "gen rush" against a nice killer? We'll just be wasting our time back in the queue, and the game after you're gonna maybe meet a tryhard Nurse with Starstruck. I know as a survivor I would definitely prefer to meme in most situations rather than do gens. But anyway.
It turns out, there is indeed a problem with gen speed in this game. As a killer, it feels like the odds are really not in your favor math-wise. My survivors often bring medkits/toolboxes and gen perks but even without that, just getting 4 efficient survivors is enough to make you feel like you're being "gen rushed". When that happens, the balance of the game completely changes, because as a killer now it is physically impossible to win even if you win all your chases in 15 seconds. The gens are simply just too fast. To catch up, what I considered the "scummy stuff" like broken killer addons, basement, camping, tunneling etc, now becomes required. For me it is not fun to play that way so I still play nice, and I can still not understand the killer mains' logic that "I need to tunnel because they genrush", imo ultimately the fact that the other side plays in a boring way does not mean you should play boring too, but at least now I can understand why killer mains feel like the game is survivor-sided.
I'll tell you that difficulty-wise, this game is actually balanced. The massive problem, is that it is balanced around both sides playing in the most sweaty and anti-fun way. If survivors do gens as they are supposed to, then killers need to bring gen perks and tunnel, and then I think it's probably 50/50. The problem is that 90% survivors don't want to do gens because it is straight up boring gameplay. In this situation, then killer is indeed too easy.
TL;DR: killer is indeed too easy at first, but MMR eventually gives you sweaty matches regardless of which side you play, which is why both sides think the game is other-side-sided. Ultimately, DBD devs only care about high MMR balance, without realizing that very few players want to play this way.
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@Sava18 said:
It's intended. It's supposed to be a prediction perk not a reaction perk now. Although I feel the delay varies once in awhile which I can only contribute to latency diff.
Except that's absolutely not true. DH can be used in reaction if the killer has low ping. There are games where you will hit 100% of the time, and games where you will hit 0% of the time. I've noticed survivor streamers get the same results, usually if they miss the 1st dead hard you can tell that they won't hit it once for the whole game. Basically they made it the most inconsistent perk in the game, it's both the best or worst perk depending just on factors outside of your control.
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@StarLost said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3328461#Comment_3328461
Here's the thing.
Sound is an imprecise measure. Visuals are substantially more precise - which is why you still see a lot of Spinechill and why it's a solid perk.
The same information but a lot easier to parse. Mark my words - it's a big big buff.
Terror radius is imprecise because it was voluntarily made to be imprecise, not because it uses sound. You could as well implement it visually while keeping it imprecise. For example, they could add an indicator of killer's distance with 3 states: "Far", "Close", "Chase". Where did you find that they are going to make spinechill basekit? Because yeah that would be a buff, but that's not what accessibility means.
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@VoidOfMe said:
I get why we get bothered about face camping, but why do people hate so much when killers keep hitting them on hook?
It's so silly, I find it even a little funny, it means I played well and the guy got mad
Some people are really mad about anything... There is so much you can be mad at in this game, being hit on hook it's just silly.
I can totally understand your position, normally, that's also my stance, I'm all up for a bit of trolling, and in many games I would find that funny.
The problem is that in DBD, it's really funny for 10 seconds, until you realize that as the facecamped survivor you are basically out of the game, as in solo queue nobody will bother saving you. So while from the outside it looks like a situation that is entertaining, survivor players are used to see it and know what it really means is that they will sit 2 minutes on a hook, without being able to do anything about it, without getting BPs, most likely de-pip, then have to wait in queue again for 2 minutes, etc. and all of that while getting BM'd by the killer without any possibility to fight back (they can't even write in chat).
Basically, it's like somebody telling you a good joke, but then they keep telling you the same joke over and over. What's funny at first becomes stale and frustrating very quick.
Not to mention, solo queue is in such a miserable state, that this kind of BM, coupled with tunneling+camping, is making the game very discouraging for players on a loss streak and especially new players. Look at hookcamperlol's stream, half of his survivors don't last for more than 10 seconds in chase. Imagine a new player's reaction when after waiting in queue for 5 minutes, they play the game for 30 seconds, then they get hit on hook for 2 minutes, then they are sent back to the lobby.
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It's not reportable, it's encouraged. Hookcamperlol gets 500+ viewers doing it on twitch
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Usually this kind of profiles are people who use scripts to farm shards as AFK killer. I've seen accounts that reach 330 hours... Check what comments in his profile says.
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I just had the same thought today. This map's tiles feel very different to loop and are full of objects that you are forced to bump into at least once to know that they have collision. A good example is the shack which on this map, has 3 different objects that you can bump into.
When designing tiles they should go for objects with very clear boundaries. Examples of good objects: walls, boxes. Examples of bad objects: bushes (eg. Garden of Joy), piles of sand (on the new map) etc.
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@LordSturm said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3322709#Comment_3322709
the grind was absolutely worse before, BHVR is telling you that because it is true.
- you don't get every teachable at 30, you only got one, meaning to get all 3 perks (which is what hitting level 50 gives you now), you had to hit level 40. Additionally, prestiging your character instantly shares all 3 perks to every single character you own. Before, you would unlock it as a "teachable" perk, which meant maybe, if you wished upon a star, you might find it in other characters' bloodwebs - but who knows, maybe it's the last perk you will literally ever see. Not to mention, you actually have to, you know, level up and get it, so even if you have maximum luck, you had to go through multiple bloodwebs to actually get the perks, whereas now it is simply added to your inventory. A new character comes out and I can prestige them that day, and they'll have literally every perk in the game tier 3 before they're even prestiged. Tremendous improvement, not to mention you can actually prestige without deleting a character's entire inventory now, lmao
- BP offerings are in fact most of what I see in the first 20 - 30 levels of the bloodweb, along with random brown and yellow offerings you can just blow past, because now, EVERYTHING in the bloodweb costs much less, and you get more points from matches. Higher BP caps, higher BP gains, matchmaking incentive, etc. Hitting level 50 is now easier and quicker than it ever has been.
- BBQ is from a licensed character you have to pay for, too, you know. There are plenty of really good perks you can get without licensed characters, such as Jolt, Pain Resonance, Discordance, every hex in the game besides Plaything, spirit fury/enduring/hubris/brutal strength, etc.
Regarding your point 1, you will still have to go through your main character's bloodweb now, because the prestige unlocks the perk only at tier 1, so you need to level it up to tier 3. So it's barely a difference. It's also extremely rare that you care about getting more than 1 perk on a character, I actually can't even think of a single one that has 2 good perks that synergize well (maybe Onryo?).
Even with the reduced BP costs, the math is still massively in favor of the old system.
Take an example, say a new player wants to make a basic build with 2 character perks + 2 regular perks. Say for example they want Sprint Burst + Self-care + Kindred + Resilience, which is decent.
After the tutorials, they already sit at 100k. Getting to lvl 35 with the old system costed around ~800k. So they need to spend 700k leveling up Meg to lvl 35, then they switch to Claudette. They still need to level up Claudette around lvl 30 to get the full build, so another 700k. Total: 1.4 Million.
Those however are BPs from the old system, since then the BP caps have also been increased from 32k to 40k, so let's apply a 1.25x "inflation factor". Total: 1.6 Million
With the new system, you need 1.4 Million to prestige to lvl 50. Then lvl 30, so 2.1 Million total. If you know how to cut bloodwebs, it's less, but a new player doesn't know that.
So before you needed 1.6 Million to get a basic build, now you need 2.1 Million. That's a 25% increase in the playtime. And not just that but at this point the old player can switch to a new survivor and have their 2 teachables ready soon. While with the new system they need to continue lvling up Claudette to lvl 50.
It's a lot of assumptions but I'd say empirically 25% sounds right. I had friends grinding before and after the update, and the one after felt significantly worse.
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@StarLost said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3322709#Comment_3322709
No, it was worse. Way worse.
- You needed BBQ on killer for starters, which was on a licensed killer.
- Sure. But once that teachable is unlocked, it's there for everyone. Previously, you had to then go and unlock it on anyone you wanted it for. So if I wanted Dead Hard, but didn't want to play David it was a schlep.
- The BP offerings are as good as they've always been. I think I also see a lot more cakes/puddings than I did before.
- Eh...Deadlock is not what I'd call a 'best' perk. CoB is a fine perk, but that more comes down to better perks being nerfed. Eruption is...Eruption. It's a solo stomper, but will often do nothing in an SWF match. And...you don't need to chase the meta, because the meta is always changing. Surge is a decent regression perk and comes baseline.
Yes, there is a grind that is a bit much for newer players, but it's better than it was.
But a new player doesn't care about having dead hard on all their characters. They want to have it on 1 character, the one that they play, so that they can make a basic 4-perk build on this character asap. But to get this build now will be 2x more expensive because they have to go to lvl 50. Only 100+ hour players are going to care that they get Dead Hard on multiple characters.
The BP offerings drop way less than before, as said, I used to have stockpiles of them and now I'm running out of them (Not that I care now, but new players most likely do). Just pay attention to bloody party streamers the next time you prestige, you can pass a full prestige without getting a single one. Don't know about cake but I assume it's no different. That's because in the previous update we had the large lvl 50 bloodwebs with a lot of choice, so we could pick whatever items we were interested in. But now the first 30 levels have way less nodes and don't give us this choice. So maybe you get just as much stuff now, but it's more useless stuff than before.
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The grind was absolutely not worse before. That's what BHVR pretends, I don't know if they really believe that it's true or are just delusional.
In fact the update made it significantly worse:
- for new players, need to grind characters to lvl 50 to unlock their perks now, whereas before you needed only the teachable at lvl 30. Considering that the first 15 bloodweb levels are almost free, that's a 2x increase in cost. Before you needed ~20 hours to get a basic build now you need more like ~40 hours.
- huge indirect nerf to BP offering drops now as you only get trash for the first 20-30 levels of the bloodweb, then you get some decent stuff and by the time you can finally sotckpile something then you have to prestige again. Same applies to items btw. It has become so bad that even long time players are running out of good items/addons while before most of us had 100+ of them. Now you see streamers run perks like residual manifest just to get a flashlight.
- As killer, the best and easiest perks are now mostly pay2win (Eruption, Deadlock and CoB specifically). BBQ does no longer give BPs. The BP incentives compensate partially for this but they depend on luck while BBQ was consistent and healthy for the game.
Regarding your original question: I've introduced this game to 3 different players and none of them played it for more than 10-20 hours (mostly due to the grind, but also a few very bad games).
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What is your approx. killrate? I doubt you lose more than 50% of your games. So it's just MMR doing its thing, basically the reason you meet tryhards is because you tried hard too...
And if you think of throwing to decrease MMR, I hope you're not above the softcap otherwise it's too late (and you're most likely over it based on the games you describe).
TL;DR you're screwed
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@MB666 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3321794#Comment_3321794
"t's one of the best designed killers"
....just ..no .... really ....NO...
Very well constructed post. Thanks God this forum notifies me of every single reply otherwise I would have risked missing it.
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I don't know what is going on but my trick is if I get 2 or 3 clearly unwinnable matches then I stop playing DBD for the rest of the day. I initially thought that I could just keep playing and maybe after losing a lot the MMR would adjust and give me easier matches but that's not the case. Don't try this, you'll keep losing and get even more tilted, especially in solo queue. Just find an alternative game and play it when DBD is not in the mood. Since I used this "trick" I'm at around 50% winrate, but before I was at 20%. Many people on this forum have said the same thing and the "stop playing after a few losses" works for everyone.
I think that there is a serious bug in the way MMR works. I've played many other games than DBD and I am used to loss streaks, normally I just tell myself that it's how probabilites work. But the occurence at which it happens in DBD is simply too abnormal to be just probabilites. I've got 10+ loss streaks several times, something that should be extremely rare. The fact global killrates are at 60% even though there is supposedly MMR to bring it at 50% makes me even more suspicious that something is wrong.
Basically at some specific days/hours you'll get a series of unwinnable matches as survivor where you keep getting 4K'd and the game keeps placing you against stronger and stronger killers. It's totally random and does not depend on time of the day. The solution is to stop playing. Then the next day you get totally normal matches again.
For people who think it's a skill / low MMR issue, I've seen Angrypug get a 9-game loss streak, and he's at 2000 MMR (hackers revealed it).
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Nurse is one of my favorite killers to verse. She has a surprising amount of counterplay and lots of mindgames possible, imo it's one of the best designed killers, because while they completely discarded the M1 loop mechanics, they introduced other skilled mechanics to compensate. Comparatively, "Hold W" killers like Artist or PH are much more boring to face, despite being weaker.
I think it's good that they try to nerf add-ons and combinations with Starstruck. Once high MMR stop complaining about her, lower MMRs will realize that the Nurses they faced were actually never OP.
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3320521#Comment_3320521
If you have never used chat and you got banned for a week, then I'd say that's VERY concerning to me. The fact that you can get a ban when you did nothing wrong? I'd much rather have toxic behavior that I can ignore than have even a chance that someone who didn't deserve a ban got one (not just because that undeserved ban could be put on me.)
Overwatch is known for having a very paranoid stance against toxicity and an automated report system that is pretty abusable, I've played the game for 6 years so I guess it was just an instance of bad luck where a series of angry people decided to report me all at the same time. But all things considered it's still much better than DBD has now. The ban had virtually 0 consequence, it only prevented me from using the in-game chat, I could still play the game, and it only lasted a week.
I used to think it was a horrible and paranoid system until I played DBD. Both games are hard to compare but Overwatch has felt less and less toxic over time, while DBD feels more and more, to the point where it is overwhelming now.
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@Stabby_Widdershins said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3320962#Comment_3320962
They are clear on their stance:
Camping, tunneling, and slugging are not reportable and are not considered griefing. How much clearer of a stance do you need?
And my point was that you can't report someone for 'intent' because Survivors already attribute an 'intent to grief' whenever they lose.
Again the topic is GRIEFING, not specifically camping/tunneling etc.
If you don't see the difference: tunneling is not bannable, that's correct, but tunneling a player because they have the rainbow flag is reportable, as it's considered harassment. So you see that the intent makes all the difference between whether an action is or is not OK, not the action itself. Can you realistically prove that you were tunneled for wearing the rainbow flag? No. Have they ever banned people for that? Likely not. So why did BHVR make the stance? Because people know how to interpret rules with common sense, and even if it's not perfectly formal and applicable, writing the rule is enough to deter most people from doing it.
Please watch hookcamperlol on twitch and then come back. I'm tired of people pretending everyone is nice and using "valid game strategies". There are instances where you can clearly say what the intent of the player is.
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@Stabby_Widdershins said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3320679#Comment_3320679
And how would you know their intent?
Because I've had Survivors claim they were reporting me for 'griefing' because I 'camped' when someone was trying to unsafe unhook.
Now imagine if BHVR had to take those whiny toddler's reports seriously; Suddenly, anything the Killer does can be reported if it hurt some Survivor's fee-fees, because the Survivor decided the Killer's intent was to grief.
Not a good idea. Will never happen. Should never happen.
People are already reporting killers for nothing, that wouldn't change. BHVR ignores all reports without evidence so that wouldn't change anything for you. Where did you read that I want to change the report system works?
BHVR should just be clearer on their stance regarding actual griefers. Specifically, if they say that repeated facecamping/slugging etc. is considered griefing and bannable, even without taking any concrete action, then this would at least deter people from livestreaming it or doing it every game.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3320521#Comment_3320521
Wow. Could you make it anymore obvious you’re a survivor main? Slugging and facecamping is not toxic. It is a valid strategy. Just because YOU don’t like it, does not mean it’s toxic. I LOVE how you only mentioned facecamping and slugging. You don’t wanna talk about how toxic survivors can be? Should teabagging be cause for ban? Or pointing at the killer?
And secondly, in what world would overwatch system be better?? You can get banned for false reports? Lmao what are you on about?😂
I'm used to you writing bad posts but this is something else. Literally every time someone writes "facecamping" and "slugging" you're here to copy/paste the same generic response that these are valid strategies, without even reading the message, and completely missing the point. If you spent a few more minutes reading the post rather than just engage in hostile and unconstructive forum fights, then you might realize, my post is not about facecamping/slugging at all, it's about griefing, ie. facecamping/slugging should not be bannable as a tactic, but doing it with the deliberate intent of griefing should be bannable.
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3320068#Comment_3320068
Right, but what then does the OP want to happen? It seems they want BHVR to start banning those players.
As much as I dislike solutions like this, I noticed that experimentally it's better when a game fights too much against toxicity (like Overwatch, which uses a very abusable automated report system and now even has a ridiculous AI to parse voice chat) - rather than when it does too little against toxicity, like DBD does right now. And I say this as someone who has been silenced a few times in Overwatch likely due to unjustified reports (I was banned from using chat 1 week even though I never used chat nor voice chat lol). Due to this you're sometimes in fear of being reported for nothing, but at least you don't meet toxic players that often and overall I'd say Overwatch still feels far much healthier to play.
In Overwatch, you can meet toxic players but it barely has any effect on the gameplay itself, the game is still pretty fun.
While in DBD, playing against a toxic player will drastically change the way the match is played and most of the time will be a miserable experience that just makes you regret playing.
My preference would be for BHVR to limit the toxic playstyles through gameplay changes (prevent facecamping, slugging) and have the same stance against toxicity/griefing like they have for DCs: they don't realistically ban anybody for it, but they explicitly say that they don't like it, and that it's bannable if done repeatedly.
Something like this:
"Playing a match with the deliberate intent of griefing, annoying or wasting other players' time rather than progressing one's own objectives, is a bannable offence. This includes facecamping/slugging when this tactic is done repeatedly over multiple games regardless of the situation. This does not include cases where a player uses "annoying" game mechanics in order to get a genuine advantage, which is fair and not bannable."
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3319692#Comment_3319692
Right, so if one can so easily delete them, that proves they don't matter. Pages and pages of "-rep dirty facecamper" doesn't mean anything to BHVR, as they've said many times they are not going to punish it because it's an allowed strategy. The only things that TRULY matter in -rep comments should be things that are actually reportable, and it would be an actual report that BHVR would look at, not their easily deleted or not even allowed in the first place "rep" on Steam.
The fact that it's one click to delete -reps shows that these players DELIBERATELY decide to keep them, or that they don't care about them. And yes we all know that being an a**hole is not reportable in the current state of the game that's precisely what I'm saying and why OP made the topic.
The fact you have so many players who behave like this and expose HUNDREDS of -reps like they are some sort of trophies should be a good indication of the insane state of toxicity right now. Some of them are streaming with 500+ viewers.
These players are actively making the casual playerbase flee whether they are using "valid strategies" or not. You're treating DBD like it is a competitive game which it's not for 99% of the players. Enjoy your game full of valid strategies when you'll be the only one left playing it.
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I wish the matchmaking would place these a**holes with 10+ pages of -reps in the same lobbies together. Maybe from time to time also put in there those who defend them, if they really believe that those are just regular players then they will likely enjoy playing together right?
One can delete the -reps on Steam, it's literally 1 click. Keeping 10+ pages of them is not being a normal player. With a profile like this nobody would play with you if given the choice. In any other game these players would get a warning or matchmaking penalty. But not in DBD, here, toxic players and playstyles are welcome.
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Survivor role has 39% winrate. This is the only game I know where a role is that weak and yet people still pretend it's too strong.
This game is very clearly killer-sided to anybody who has placed both roles. If the killer wants to win, they'll win, especially at low MMR, the result of a match depends more on the killer's mercy and whether they decide to tunnel/camp rather than the skill of the players in the match.
That doesn't mean killers win all their games, because ultimately MMR tries to balance the game and matches them against sweaty SWFs who have 1000+ hours more than them. As a result everyone gets a frustrating experience and thinks the other side is too strong.
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This is a good idea, simple and effective. It will upset only facecampers who will get mad that the survivor they camped gets more points than them for the whole match. This suggestion has been proposed many times already and I can't think of any drawback. So my guess is BHVR will implement it, by year 2035.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3308834#Comment_3308834
Everything in your example is a problem with Tombstone, not a problem with PWYF. Take that perk out of the equation and what do you get? The same situation, except the Myers is a little slower. Far more importantly, though, take Tombstone Myers out of the equation and put that same perk on Trapper. Do we still have a problem in that scenario, or is that perk honestly not doing much of anything in the second case?
As for your second point, no you wouldn't, because those perks aren't designed to need countering in that way. They just kind of do what they do and that's it, similar to other perks that just provide some small benefit without being something survivors can counter beyond just, playing around it. The Obsession perks don't require survivor B to notice and counter, unless it's a perk that warrants doing that. Even the ones that do require countering don't require survivor A noticing but survivor B acting- if survivor B notices, that's enough.
Really, I think you're exaggerating this issue. In almost all cases the Obsession mechanic is a hindrance for a killer perk, not a benefit.
Myers will not be a little slower, no. With full stack he gets 130% speed, without he has 115%. But because survivors run at 100%, that is not just a 15% improvement, but a 100% improvement, because he now gains twice as much distance in the same time. Add bloodlust and it becomes impossible to loop him more than 5 seconds.
If you don't like the Tombstone issue then just look at Rancor. Concretely, as a solo survivor in this situation, what are your options to win, apart from going back in time and queuing in SWF.
I'm not "exaggerating an issue". Something is either well designed or badly designed, it does not have anything to do with its current viability. If we had the conversation 6 months ago, I would have told you that Eruption is a stupid perk, and you would have said "nah it's fine, there are better perks"
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3308788#Comment_3308788
STBFL is strong, sure, but I wouldn't call it "completely busted". It's a good idea for the Obsession to start taking hits if they suspect the killer has it, but if they don't realise... on a majority of killers, it's good, but not broken. Certain killers do make better use of it (giving a far more hefty hint that they're running it from the get-go), but even on its best user it's still just "above average".
PWYF, similarly, isn't even all that great? Tombstone Myers is its own thing whether he's running that perk or not, and it's almost useless on literally every other killer due to how it loses tokens. Clearly not a problem.
Those are also, for the record, not the only Obsession perks. What about Grim Embrace, or Furtive Chase? Dying Light? The Obsession mechanic isn't inherently a problem because there's one pretty decent perk that uses it, surely?
Let's take a bet, imagine we take a group of 5 random players with 100-200 hours of playtime each, 4 survivors and 1 Tombstone Myers + PWYF, who is going to win? 90% of the time it's going to be a 3K at least. In order to win this match as a survivor you have a ridiculous list of things to be cautious of, you need to have the obsession hiding all match, know that you shouldn't take risk in chase (probably shouldn't even go for chases if he has PWYF), somehow be able to track the amount of stalk even though you have no idea of how your teammates are doing, have everyone getting ready to jump into lockers at all time when close to tier 3, not go for the rescue if Myers proxy camps, etc. any mistake by any of the survivors and it's an instant game over. Do you realistically see these conditions met by casual players? I think at 100 hours I didn't even know Tombstone was a thing, let alone PWYF.
For the killer, the only non-obvious trick to know is that you can 99 the Tier 3, but everything else is straightforward, the perk literally tells you what to do, and it's even a Myers perk. Whereas for the survivors, the counterplay is not only to know all the perks in the game and a list of completely obscure mechanics, but also to have a divination gift to know what your teammates see and want to do.
The other perks you mention just have bad values to be useful, but it does not mean they are well designed. As soon as you buff these perks they will be problematic just like Eruption is today, not because they will be impossible to beat, but because they rely on unfun mechanics and the same problem of "easy to use, hard to counter" as I described above. Obsession is inherently a bad mechanic for solo queue because it usually involves one survivor A noticing the killer has X, then survivor B needs to do Y in reaction to counter it, but in a game where you don't give any ability to communicate between survivors A and B, how does that make sense? This just creates frustration and toxicity towards your teammates.
Another Obsession example, take Rancor. It's a useless perk but that's not the point. Imagine as a survivor, you're the obsession and the killer chases you at 1 gen. If you are in a SWF, then fine, you just tell your friends to 99 the gens until you're downed, and the killer can get literally NO VALUE from it. If you are in solo queue, then now it's the complete opposite, killer gets full value from it, both the mori AND the exposed synergize extremely well in this situation since as soon as the gates are powered it will be 1 hit = 1 dead. Maybe your teammates could take hits for you but they have no way to know, and because of the fear of NOED, it is extremely unlikely to happen anyway. So the perk will get either full value or no value at all depending on an entirely uncontrollable factor. It is inherently a gimmick, luckily it's bad so noone uses it today, but even if it would become viable it would ALWAYS turn on to be a problem.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3308761#Comment_3308761
...Wait, what's wrong with the Obsession perks in this context? I expect to see NOED pop up here despite not warranting it as it has a weird reputation, but this is the first time I've seen someone call the Obsession perks as a whole "ridiculously cheap and unfun", I'd love to hear your reasoning there.
As for the topic as a whole, I think this point probably would've seemed slightly more reasonable before the update on the action icons. Clearly, BHVR are in fact willing to attempt addressing solo queue.
Save the Best for Last's counter involves the Obsession somehow first realizing that the killer has it (while the killer will obviously try to avoid the Obsession at all costs), THEN taking hits for their teammates. Good luck having that level of coordination in solo queue. And without the Obsession drawback STBFL is completely busted.
Play with your Food gives tombstone Myers an easy 4k against 90% players and probably can be used in other cheese strats as well.
At 100 hours a player might not even know what the perk does.
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One big problem of the DBD designers is that they think it is fine to have mechanics that are ridiculously cheap and unfun, as long as there is a "counter".
- Tunneling
- Camping
- NOED
- Obsession-related perks (STBFL, PWYF,...)
Yes, all of these have a counter, but the counter is either boring (eg. do gens to counter camping, hide to get hatch...) or it requires WAY more skill to execute the counter than it does for the killer. The problem is that casual players are never going to be motivated to play a game for hundreds of hours just for a chance to not lose against someone who looks like a newbie to them. They are going to be frustrated and DC.
And even when you have 2000 hours, the counter usually relies SO HEAVILY on the execution of your teammates that it's still almost never working in practice, what is the point of learning and trying to become good in chase when the killer can always just stop chasing you and tunnel one of the baby Megs in your team instead?
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@Heytherebigguy said:
I just wanted to say, dear huntress player, that I was shocked by seeing you using a nice huntress build with scourage hook and corrupt and not using COB+Eruption+Nowhere to hide.
I was shocked by not watching myself scream and not being able to play the game for 25 seconds, I still lack the ability to believe this wonderful match had happened, I have full respect for you and ill cherish this game when I went into the endgame lobby screen and didn't see sadakos face and some gen with thunder above it.
yours,
typical solo queue survivor.
It's just that DC penalties are off so killers are adapting because otherwise they don't find a match lol
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@TigerSnake said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307402#Comment_3307402
Lol imagine actually believing or listening to -reps. Leaving comments like that is literally the calling card of a moron.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307412#Comment_3307412
Then they should do something about the survivors who go in to a match to ruin the killer’s experience by teabagging, flashlight saving, and spamming “gg ez” in endgame chat too.
I'm not saying survivors can't be toxic. But one advantage that killers have in this respect is that they can dodge much easier. You can look at the profiles before the game, and if they switch off to a bully squad last second, you can DC to ruin the toxic survivor's plans, while a survivor DC'ing will just ruin it for its own teammates.
And again the point is not that -rep are always accurate, but that someone who collects and exhibits 71 pages of -reps like they are trophies is not the type of person you want to play against especially as a new player. This killer is griefing on purpose just like hookcamperlol does on twitch (but at least hookcamper is funny). He plays 8 hours/day like this. Would I be paid by BHVR's competitors to sabotage DbD, then I would still not be as efficient and dedicated as this guy.
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307408#Comment_3307408
You're missing though that in June we had the big meta overhaul update, which brought in a massive boost in numbers. In fact, you can see it in the image you posted previously, in the bottom right hand corner (as part of the broader chart).
Player numbers doubled with that update, presumably people who had already left the game previously and came to check it out post major update. And a chunk of those players simply didn't stick around again.
I don't think that casual players would be particularly interested in a gameplay overhaul, compared to eg. event with a new killer or Steam sales. There were similar sudden increases of player count in June 2021 and June 2020, so most likely the big burst in June/July comes from holidays.
The difference is that in 2022 the players almost instantly left after June. In the previous years they were staying for several months.
The picture I shared above is not that clear but the exact player numbers can be found here: https://steamcharts.com/app/381210 (In particular, check the "peak players" column)
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@Murgleïs said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3307402#Comment_3307402
It's cringe the amount of survivors who trashtalk on someone else profil. Get a life, please.
You're missing the point with this killer's profile. It is literally 1 click to delete a comment on your profile, and one click to make it private. This killer is not getting flamed for his gameplay, he is ACTIVELY TRYING to get -reps. If you have time, check hookcamperlol on twitch (not this killer but similar and will give you a good idea).
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@RainehDaze said:
Good grief, the number of people in that screenshot going to someone's profile just to complain. Why you can get away with littering people's profile with permanent negativity...
Also, part of the player drop right now is it's kind of unplayable in some areas because of server stuff and people being busy with other holiday bits.
The player drop has happened directly in July 2022 with peak player count going down from 96,390 (June 2022) to 68,130 (July 2022) or -30%. For comparison in 2021 it went from 105,052(June 2021) to 96,393 (July 2021) so around -10%.
And it's not just the stats. I have 18 friends owning DBD on Steam and only 2 of them have played recently. In-game you almost only see players with 1000+ hours now. Angrypug stopped streaming DBD last month despite having 10000+ hours.
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Dead By Daylight in late 2022 is a totally different game now
Only sweats are playing the game now. There's no business playing unless you're training to play comp. Casual players have lost interest as they were tired of playing against those same exact sweats who are still playing now, this is very easily seen by looking at player charts.
We've lost -40% of the playerbase compared to June. People are still interested in this game, they try to go back to it during events, but they stop after a few weeks, because it just feels so horrible now unless you already have invested 2000+ hours in it.
This game is way too hard and obnoxious for casual players. People come here expecting a survival horror game watching exciting video with hiding elements and intense chases with the killer, instead, they get matched against players with 6000 hours who down them in 5 sec then camp them on hook. Then in post-game screen they realize their opponent has perks that are 10x better than theirs and also that they have no chance to ever access these perks, unless they grind the game for 100+ hours
I've been trying to get my friends to play this game and I felt literally embarrassed by how bad it was. In one particular game we faced a facecamping + tunneling spirit with only pink addons who slugged my friend 8 TIMES IN A ROW while she was trying like never to find me and get her 4k, look at the killer's profile:
That's 71 pages of only -rep. Please explain me BHVR, who wants to play against someone who has a profile like that. They're not even deleting the -rep, they are PROUD of it, and they played the game for 110 hours in past 2 weeks so that's 8 hours/day just with the intent of ruining other people's games. We got matched against many killers like this one and some of them were streaming.
So to conclude, the game has not changed much, but the playerbase has. If you played it in mid 2022 then you were playing against people like you who want to play DBD like it is a GAME, but now you are playing against people who do it like it is a JOB.
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The answers to this topic are kinda cringe.
You are playing a video game. If you think sitting idle for 4 minutes is ever the right solution then you are basically admitting that your time has little value, and probably you guys have too much of it.
You could have a chase or just go next right away, yes you'll give the sweaty killer a free win and some satisfaction, but why would you even give a #########. Everyone will forget about the game literally 2 minutes after it's over, the nolife killer you played against will get free MMR and have a higher chance to get matched against sweats who play like them, while you'll get matched against more casual killers, tell me who is the real winner here, you or them? Instead, you prefer to waste 4 minutes of your time, just so that you can MAYBE have a chance for hatch, and gain some virtual points and a satisfaction that will last 30 sec until you go next (that's assuming you end up winning the hatch game - because if you lose, you'll end up being even more frustrated).
You guys are really making a serious miscalculation at the cost and expense of your own free time. The killer will not lose anything regardless of whether you escape or not, if you escape they can still brag about the 3k, and they obviously don't care about you and your teammates opinion anyway otherwise they wouldn't play like this. I wish BHVR would give us a way to just report and dodge these killers but in the mean time just let them get their win. They'll just waste their own time slugging every game while you progress and practice chases more, and they'll think they're a god gamer for a while but at some point sweaty SWFs will put them back to their place.
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I guess you're talking about hookcamperlol? No idea why but this guy suddenly appeared in everyone's twitch recommendations and now he's consistently getting 500 viewers so might be him.
Imo he's a very representative sample of the current state of DBD so I'm happy to see him getting so much attention, that is a much more accurate advertising for new players of what this game is about and the playstyles that the developers promote.
Something that is worth mentioning is that he's not only tunneling, he's also regularly facecamping, hitting on hook and slugging survivors once the game is over. Of course sometimes he loses the game because of this, but from what I've seen he wins most of the time - which is only natural in a game where developers have made everything they could in the past year to protect and cherish their most toxic players and make sure they get rewarded for their dedication to ruin everyone else's time.