SOULWARRIOR71K
SOULWARRIOR71K
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They also don’t 99ed the door. They will open it and leave regardless of the situation at hand.
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I don’t like this trend either. There is no reason to try and unhook yourself when someone is right there to save you.
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@B1gMacEnjoyer said:
I think this is an exaggerated problem blown up by that Team Eternal video. I play Skull Merchant occasionally, and I don't focus on defending gens. I've also played against a handful of Skull Merchants that didn't either. If these 48 minute games were so common, I'm certain it would have happened to me by now at least once. That last killer that I actually saw HARD 3-gen was a Singularity, and before that, I have to go back to a Freddy pre-CoB and pre-Eruption nerf
The problem is not exaggerated. 100% of skull merchants that I’ve played against since her release, have tried to hold the game hostage for as long as possible. It’s to the point that I refuse to put any effort into playing against her. I see the drones and sloppy butcher, point me to the nearest hook or slug me until I bleed out. Not worth the effort at all.
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If you were skull merchant, you deserve to play against bots every game lol. If not then yeah.
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I think you guys are misunderstanding what they are saying. I’ve experienced this glitch before too. I used plot twist. Then the gens popped and I used plot twist again. However the killer then downed me and I was able to get up as if I had unbreakable and I was full health. Read that again. I was downed by the killer after having already used plot twist twice and was able to get up fully healthy.
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@MizukiAyu said:
Killers can do nothing in the end game now. We can't secure a hook with a grab, we can't slug, we can't go for the healers, our best tactic is again tunnel tunnel tunnel. We can't go for the unhooker because basekit endurance lets the unhooked get in your way and prevent you. We can't go for the person healing because MFT will give them endurance from the heal. We can't slug and hold anyone because Buckle Up means EVERYONE gets Endurance and a speed boost.
Every new perk you add or adjust punishes fair players and encourages tunneling. Give us grabs off healing to make healing underfoot a risk, give us a way to negate endurance, or remove all these protections in End Game. It's impossible to get kills in the end if someone's not already on death hook and you're not a Blight or something.
The devs could get rid of all of those perks tomorrow and people would still camp/tunnel regardless. Is getting out perked annoying? Yep. But so is getting tunnel off hook or camped. I don’t think they are aiming for perfect balance in every situation.
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@Satelit said:
The Skull Merchants can play PvE
Yep. Send em to the bots. 😂
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I don’t think cleansing is bad after the first few gens are done. Especially considering 99% of plagues run thana + other slowdowns, it will start to take too long to get gens done if everyone is injured/getting one shotted while broken.
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Just played a solo a game against her and got a 4 out for the first time since the update. Everyone kept grabbing tapes and using that to draw her away from gens. She tried hit and run but it didn’t work because she wouldn’t actually hook anyone. No one got condemned and moried so by the time the gens were done and she hooked someone, it didn’t matter. Everyone has to play smart or she will snowball for sure.
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@BlackRabies said:
Increase the number of gens on the map from 7 to 9. These 2 gens would be considered 'broken' with parts missing and players cannot interact with them normally. Survivors have to find parts around the map to rebuild the gens. Once rebuilt it can be interactive with like any other gen.
- There always be an odd number of parts on the map. Let's say 7.
- There's only enough parts to rebuild 1 gen. 4 parts are needed to repair 1 of the 2 gens, best of 7, best of w/e odd number.
- The 2 broken gens always spawn far from each other.
- Ideal to rebuild the gen late in game than early. Best to pick the 1 gen away from the 3 gen set-up that the killer refusing to leave from.
- Gives the survivors another objective to do and gain more objective points since it hasn't changed once since the games released.
Until camping and tunneling are addressed in a serious way, there is probably zero chance of additional side objectives being introduced. Unless multiple people are running reassurance, it is very easy to camp someone out of the game early. Now add time wasting side objectives in and you can kiss your chances of escaping goodbye.
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He’s easy to use. Has great mobility. And his infections make it easy to tunnel if the killer so chooses.
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@EnragedHeadwear said:
Let's call this "rework" what it is - it's a direct nerf, one that's targeted at the Onryo's most powerful, and most enjoyable, playstyle - using her power effectively to reach max condemn stacks and mori the survivors. The entire character has been taken out back and put down just because the devs didn't like that someone figured out a way to play Onryo in a unique way.
Condemn Onyro isn't even excessively strong - there is tons of counterplay (doing tapes, dodging TV teleports) that made the build exciting and full of skill expression for both sides. It only rose to popularity because it was the only way to play Onryo with a chance of winning, as the killer is notoriously weak in every aspect otherwise. Condemn is her power.
The nerf on the PTB has done worse than completely kneecapping one of the most interesting killer builds, it has dramatically reduced the skill ceiling of Onryo matches for both killer and survivors. You can't use her teleport for information, because now everyone gets a measly 3/4 of a condemn stack on teleport. You can't use her teleport in chase, because she has a 15 second cooldown (making her power significantly more clunky). You can't use her teleport to protect generators, because TVs still have a long cooldown. Survivors now have a reason to pick up tapes - the reason being that there is practically zero downside, as it shuts down her teleport completely and doesn't even pose a risk of killing the survivor. So what if they get condemn stacks on hit or hook? She is still an M1 killer with bad stealth, and tapes can be returned to any TV and almost completely wipe away Condemned.
The demanifestation changes are insultingly pathetic. She doesn't get stunned while demanifested - so what? She can't walk through pallets, so she is still shoved to one side and has to demanifest and break the pallet if she wants to get the hit. Stuns in demanifest were almost never a thing to begin with.
This isn't even getting into the add-on changes, which are so bad that I am genuinely convinced Behaviour has never actually played Onryo and simply got mad watching OnePumpWillie play the game in a different way that they expected, rather than embracing a unique playstyle for a killer.
The PTB's changes undoubtedly take Sadako from being around the weakest killers in the game with one moderately powerful build to being the worst killer with no ways for either side to show their skill at the game or the Killer. They took a fun, unique playstyle and gutted it while making one of the weakest killers even worse. I have long wanted some much needed improvements to our ghost girl, but now I'd rather that they had never touched her at all.
“made the build exciting and full of skill expression for both sides” - 😂 this is a joke right? Where did you gather the feedback that anyone finds being slugged over and over again exciting? This was one of the most boring strategies in the game. And it certainly wasn’t an expression of skill because it was almost a guaranteed win if done correctly. Glad to see this flowcart strategy get the nerf it deserved.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3470911#Comment_3470911
Do not paint every Skull Merchant player with this, as it isn't "basic psychology"
Plenty of us are "reasonable" people who don't do things like this and haven't done things like this.
I have yet to play a single “reasonable” skull merchant. Every single one has been the typical sloppy butcher + multiple gen slow down while holding the game hostage for as long as possible. I have no tolerance for this boring garbage anymore so I happily go next as soon as I’m hooked. I’m even okay with being bled out because it’s still way faster than playing the game out.
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Nothing will eliminate tunneling other than a mechanic that completely prevents it from being possible in the first place. Tunneling is a generally effective and easy way to kill survivors and provides more gen slowdown than any perk in the game.
Your idea while sounding good on paper, would probably have the reverse effect. Not only can the killer still camp/tunnel, survivors would be punished for hook trades too since the killer would get regression every time someone trades.
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@Zeon_99 said:
Once you unhook yourself by being camped, Sprint Burst can immediately activate and you can escape every good face camping killer like Bubba, Trickster, Oni, etc. I've usually never been a Sprint Burst enjoyer, but it's going to be a staple on every build. Killers luckily can't counter this so I'm glad there'll be an extra layer of defense when you're getting face camped.
Only until people quickly realize that this won’t change a thing against killers who want to face camp. The hook timer isn’t going slower. They can still wait right there and if you unhook, down you again.
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Just to taunt. But I only do this if the killer was tunneling/camping at 5 gens. Then I show no mercy.
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I think some of you are being a bit disingenuous. If your intention is to camp, 9/10 times 5 meters vs 16 meters will not matter. As soon as you see someone approaching for the save, you are going to immediately close the distance to cut them off. If you really want them hooked, just wait for them to unhook themselves and/or they will have to second phase (because it's not like the devs said the hook timer pauses).
And before anyone asks, yes I play both sides (started as a killer main). I find most camping/tunneling to be a lazy (but effective) way to get easy wins.
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@Sometimes_Sage said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3431432#Comment_3431432
That if you are feeling the effects of Sloppy Butcher or the self heal nerf, you're not being tunneled, because if you were being tunneled you'd have no opportunity to heal. "lol."
This is just false lol. Here's a common scenario: Killer hooks survivor. Leaves the hook to "chase" another survivor. Unhook happens, survivor goes somewhere to heal thinking the killer is distracted, but then the killer breaks chase to go look for them (and worse case finds them before the heal is completed). Is this not still tunneling?
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@Viskod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3431578#Comment_3431578
This is an idiotic change.
Thank you Behaviour. Now I don't have to wait the full minute to get someone to hook stage 2, I can just let them jump off and hit them immediately, and then chase them down and hit them again and throw them on another hook.
Facecamping just got way more efficient!
A smart survivor will just wait until the end of the hook stage. You will essentially be giving them 2 deliverances since the team won't have to come to save them. If this feature works as described, you will be ensuring that all of the gens get done, no one will be forced to take hits, and still have no guarantee to quickly secure your kill. Instead of doing all of that, why not just play normally? lol.
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@Sometimes_Sage said:
I remember a time, not long ago, when tunneling meant "hooking, camping and chasing again the same Survivor until they are dead while ignoring everything else" and not "killing a Survivor before the eighth hook"
People who hard tunnel (most games) do go after the same person right after they get off the hook. So what point are you trying to make? lol.
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@GrimReaperJr1232 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3431381#Comment_3431381
There's a better perk for that though and works on Special Attacks: Forced Penance.
But Forced Penance only works on protection hits. Sloppy just works.
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@Chordyceps said:
I don't know why someone would even tunnel with sloppy. The whole point of it is to slow down healing. Tunneling someone with it just defeats the entire purpose of running sloppy.
Actually tunneling with sloppy makes a lot of sense. If people swarm in to take protection hits, by the time they get healed, the tunneled person will probably have been downed hooked and onto the next hook phase.
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@BrightWolf said:
I've been running We'll Make It since the meta change, it is so helpful. Only issue is, that I never get a chance to use it... >.>
@Sonzaishinai said:
Sadly i am cursed, whenever i run We'll make it everybody runs away from me and doesn't let me heal them
Nah I have no problem chasing them down. They’re gonna hold this fast heal 😂.
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@DrKetchup said:
Resurgence got your back!
I love resurgence too. My only issue with it is that it doesn’t have protection against sloppy butcher. It would be nice if your health progress was frozen too.
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@MerleDixon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3419665#Comment_3419665
Exactly. Overcharge was perfectly fine
COB + Overcharge was not fine.
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As long as she can just place 3 drones and then hit anyone who tries to do said gens with sloppy butcher, she will never be fun. The drones would have to be reworked completely and have the exposed removed or if a drone is taken down, it removes 2 from her for a period of time etc.
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Not in favor of any more perks that increase/decrease gen progression/regression
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@Nirgendwohin said:
don't nerf it, just incentivize a healthier playstyle.
Incentives do not work. If an easier/lazier playstyle works, people will use and abuse it.
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Swfs are generally not impacted by changes very much. If you can do a solo q win streak (by win I mean at least 3 survivors getting out), then I would definitely be impressed.
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3403339#Comment_3403339
Medkit shouldn't be a primary source of healing. It should be an alternative you can use.
They are still valid imo.
I don’t agree at all. 9/10 games I’ve played today, the killer had sloppy butcher. Healing was almost impossible if multiple people were injured. End result most times were free 1 hit downs. Very difficult to power through gens while injured and then having deadlock, PR, sloppy, corrupt etc on top of it. The time efficiency decrease in solo q has been very evident.
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They didn’t need to nerf all medkits. Just make it so they don’t increase your self heal speed. Everyone is focused on COH but butchering medkits will have a much bigger impact.
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@DaddyMyers_Mori said:
What healing changes?
You are not able to play without free self-care (CoH)? Or without healing under 10 seconds (Green medkit)
I usually use only brown medkit, or none. You just got used to using training wheels...
If you need to heal so much try inner-healing. If you have so many hours, you should know totem spawns.
Do you play both roles? Go into solo q and play a few rounds with these changes. Then let us know if you still have this response.
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@ChaosWam said:
Chances are the ones camping at 5 gens aren't the ones complaining about gen speeds.
I complained about em as someone who spreads hooks, only to be punished by adrenaline and horrible map design. Not that I condone camping, but don't tell me a genrush SWF isn't annoying as a killer trying to play nice.
My original post mentions swfs too. I’m not talking about either side playing nice. I’m talking about people who insist on tunneling at 5 gens but then complain that “gens went too fast”. I’ve multiple people say this in the end game chat. But it makes no sense. How are gens going too fast at 5 gens? And then if they lose they say the got gen rushed.
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@meromero said:
What is it with the DBD community and making up imaginary scenarios to be angy about?
How is this imaginary and who is angry? It’s an observation. If you somehow don’t think this happens a lot, I don’t know what to tell you. We must be playing a different game with a different community.
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@adsads123123123123 said:
After hooking a survivor, I leave the hook (so someone comes to rescue) and patrol the nearby area until the survivor is unhooked then I immediately return back to hook to tunnel. I'm finding it's the best strategy since when I tunnel, the unhooker often follows the hooked survvior around to protect them, so I am occupying the time of 2 survivors. The unhooker also usually gives me a free hit, which saves more time. The closer the survivor is to death hook, the more survivors will come to protect the survivor. It isn't unusual for there to be 2 protectors, so I am literally occupying the time of 3 survivors at once and also getting free hits on all of them. I still end up tunnelling the survivor to death no matter what, so I am also removing a survivor from the game, which reduces all action speeds by 25%. After I hook the survivor on death hook, there will usually be a protector survivor nearby, so I literally get to start a new chase on an injured survivor immediately.
What is the point of this thread? Most killers tunnel/camp these days. Most find it incredibly boring when killers do this. Does it work? Yes. But then don’t complain about swfs/gen speeds when you are boosting your mmr taking the easy route of tunneling.
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@solarjin1 said:
well the gen regression perks getting nerf so the strat will be way easier to beat. I rarely see her myself.
Sloppy butcher can play the same role if paired with Jolt/PR/Corrupt/Deadlock etc. I’ve seen Skull Merchants basically do the same thing without any gen perks too. All they need is a map offering to the game and sloppy and those gens aren’t getting done any time soon.
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Yep. The minor changes she got didn’t actually do anything to stop the 3 gen from the start of the match issue. It’s gotten even worse because a lot of them play map offerings like the game to make it even easier to do.
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@EYAL5555 said:
I just had a 1 hour game because 2 survivors were left and decided to hide the entire game.
There were 2 generators left to complete so I couldn't open the gate to finish the game.
The result was 2 survivors wasting an hour of my time because I couldn't find them the entire match.
My suggestion, a new perk to battle this annoying strategy.
Effects of the perk: after not being in chase for 180/150/120 seconds, this perk activates. While this perk is active, ALL survivor's auras are revealed to you as long as this perk remains active. The effect lingers for 10 seconds after the perk deactivates.
The perk deactivates after you start a chase with any survivor.
The perk cannot activate while someone is on a hook.
I know permanent survivor auras are extremely strong, however, this perk only punishes survivors who make the game boring and waste the killer's time. Also, it won't incentivize camping, because it has an anti-camping mechanic.
For 99% of the games, this perk might not even activate, so maybe you can add a secondary effect to this perk to make it a bit more worth it.
Did you aggressively camp/tunnel the first 2 survivors out of the game? Because survivors going out of there way to just hide for long periods of time is usually a direct response the killer doing this (not always tho).
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Hemorrhage protection would be awesome.
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@Crowman said:
The trade off is survivors don't automatically teactivate her drones so she has to manually reactivate them.
I don't see a reason to change it. It makes her rather weak power on most maps somewhat good on a few select maps.
she can still hold the game hostage. Add sloppy and a few gen kicking perks and the idea of her being “weak” becomes nonsense. Indoor maps and easy 3 gens maps are still miserable against her.
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@pigslittlepet said:
You are correct. I said the wrong number. I meant a 2k. A effecient team will let him get no more than a 2k. He is playing in a manor that if countered properly will only allow him to tie. Not even win. Why should the devs take the time and resources to change a playstyle that doesn't even let a killer win when there are so many actual problems with the game? Let's let them focus on real balancing issues instead of one thing that annoys a few people.
How many non-swf teams are “efficient”? By the time people realize what’s happening, someone has probably wasted time going to the hook, opened a chest, done a totem etc.
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@pigslittlepet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3397250#Comment_3397250
Because playing solo q survivor you are at the mercy your team and the killer. As a basement and preferably insidious bubba you are in complete control of your game. If survivors do what they should and pound gens and leave than you get a one k. If not than you might get a lovely tree in the basement. Basement bubba isn't about the 4k. It's a alternative way to play the game. You can 3 gen. You can hit and run. You can do cool snipes with huntress and ph. There are many fun ways to play and basement bubba is just another alternative. It's one that's intirely up to the survivors on weather it's a 2k or a 4k.
There is no 3 out against a bubba that camps with deadlock, no way out and NOED. The first person will be dead before the other 3 finish gens and no way out/NOED will guarantee at least 1 more kill.
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@pigslittlepet said:
It's called mixing it up. After 6 matches of hard looping and pounding gens against stacked slowdown perks it can be refreshing to have a different kind of game. If you're raging about being camped out by a bubba I think you're more angry with losing then with how you lost. Killers lose all the time because of things they can't control (a billy who gets taken to bedham for example) sometimes if you get a few really bad matches in a row you just want to chill by a hook and spend time with your favorite survivor. Let's not take that away from poor bubba.
So because you might have lost a few games, we should encourage having a 1 chase game with basically no interaction after the first down? If you don’t actually want to play a real match as killer why not just play survivor? Lol.
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I don’t understand how anyone can think this is healthy gameplay. A face camping bubba with deadlock and noed is guaranteed at least a 2k (more than likely a 3-4k) against solos. It’s lazy gameplay and design. A simple change could be something like: after x amount of time within x meters of a hooked survivor, the chainsaw will injure but not instadown.
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@VirtuaTyKing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3394659#Comment_3394659
Neither is gen rushing so not sure what your point is? I get bored kicking gens though anyway so might be roll of the dice hex builds for me.
Great when all you can rely on is a roll of a dice.
2 things can be unhealthy at the same time. My point is that boring gameplay is trash. 3 gen cob/overcharge? Trash. Swfs on comms using bnps? Trash. Face camping and tunneling at 5 gens? Trash. I play both sides so I refuse to encourage lame gameplay just because it might benefit me.
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I really wish my fellow killer mains would stop pretending like the gen kick meta is healthy for the game. There is nothing more boring than trying to break a 3 gen for 20 minutes because the killer has COB/Overcharge. It also isn’t even skillful.
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@AssortedSorting said:
Character traits in PZ are akin to Perk selections, not player coordination.
In addition, playing as a group in PZ multiplayer incurs no penalties. In fact it allows for role specialization and faster resource collection.
Back 4 Bloods new player friendly campaign multiplayer difficulty stated their rewards were reduced, so most new players played the advanced campaign with “normal” 100% payouts and subsequently tanked runs by being under geared.
Players don’t like less, and adding negatives to SWF play will literally just drive players away from the game.
I also don’t see the need to penalize people for socializing with others in a broad sense.
nothing would stop people from “socializing”. You can still socialize all you want if the added a debuff. The game just wouldn’t automatically be in the swf’s favor as much anymore. It’s not just communication. It’s the fact that most stealth killers and perks are negated nearly completely by said communication. Why shouldn’t there be a drawback for having such an advantage?
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@Rudjohns said:
There is no way for the game to know if people are playing as SWF
Queueing up together doesn't mean they are on comms
Thats punishing for just playing together
The game 100% knows if players are a swf. They have to code the game to bring premades into the lobby. The devs probably don’t show this because people would start dodging lobbies. And it wouldn’t be punishment. It’s called balancing. Everyone knows good swfs are too powerful. Having some kind of draw back would not be the worst thing in the world.
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I truly think most games are decided in the first few minutes of the match. Did the survivors all split up on gens so there’s 3 on gens and 1 in chase? Probably going to be a 3 out minimum. Is it a camping bubba with deadlock? Nurse/blight/spirit/artist etc? Start looking for hatch when the game starts etc lol. Is it a skull merchant who burns the game offering so they can easily stall the game on both floors? Move on to next game and so on. Either side can feel wildly op depending on the situation. Solo queue generally feels doomed tho.
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To gloat. It’s the only reason no matter how much anyone tries to convince you otherwise. When I play survivor, that’s why I do it. But I usually only do it to killers that tunneled/camped.