Reinami
Reinami
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- Reinami
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3855115#Comment_3855115
I stopped playing entirely, honestly.
Certain events have made me lose faith in the company, but I still enjoy the community, hence why I'm here.
Ultimately, I think DBD is about to crack under its own bloat. Unless BHVR massively changes, there's no way that the current content schedule and update schedule is sustainable. We have, what, 300 perks? Maybe 25-30 of which are good on either side? Tons of Killers stuck in the backlog that need major updates.
They do need to cool it with the changes. The fact that it takes months or even years for simple numbers tweaks is insane. I don't understand how games like DotA 2 can basically rework the entire game each year and do numbers tweaks in DAYS when needed while often reworking entire characters every few weeks.
They should start with an "operation health" type update where they cool it with new stuff and just fix some old stuff, then if it goes well maybe only release 3 chapters a year and the 4th one is a health update.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3855110#Comment_3855110
I mean, it's not a terrible strategy…if BHVR moved at any rate faster than a glacier.
Myers changes took four years and they amounted to some small number changes. Twins "rework" got completely scrapped because it was so bad after many years of cooking.
"Make sure it isn't an issue and revisit it" is fine…if the revisiting is relatively quick.
Its not good even if they moved quickly but as you said BHVR is so slow. They are the ones who said "you won't have to wait a year for SM changes" and then it turns out we have to wait 10 months. Like wooo we get an extra 2 months! This is precisely why i have stopped buying content until they stop doing this policy.
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@ThatRyanB said:
Hopping in to provide a little context on this, the team has been closely monitoring The Houndmaster's performance and determined that Knotted Rope posed a potential balancing risk when paired with certain perks and addons. They're currently re-evaluating this addon and plan to revisit it in 2025, but ultimately wanted to ensure that heading into the holidays, the risk of an over-tuned combo was minimized.
We know larger balancing changes like this can be frustrating, but we appreciate your patience as at the end of the day, we want to ensure there's a solid balance between having fun as the Killer and playing against the Killer.You guys need to stop just nerfing things to be completely useless and "revisit it later" that is not how you balance games.
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@TheSubstitute said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3854179#Comment_3854179
@Reinami 's suggestion is really good but I don't know if it could be coded in.
Another possibility is having a repair debuff on gens while all survivors are alive and have it replaced by a gen repair buff when a survivor dies (and have it scale in speed depending on how many survivors are alive). That would slow down the early game and give more time to spread hooks while also making it so a survivor dying doesn't mean it becomes nearly impossible to do the gens. Theoretically the best chance for a 4K under this system would be to put everyone on death hook before starting to sacrifice survivors.
Another option that doesn't change mechanics is buffing gen defense perks but having them deactivate on survivor death. Pain Res could go back to 25% each hook but stop working when a survivor dies and Ruin could go to 200% again but once again deactivate. This doesn't provide a disincentive to not tunnel though which I think is also important.
Another option suggested was having group hook states. That wasn't my preference but it would work as well. It would probably need gen repair speed adjustments based off my gut feeling. I could be wrong though.
Another option would be cages sort of like how they do it in 2v8. The Killer saves time by not walking to hook and, in return, the Survivor is hard to find making it more difficult to tunnel.
Anyway, that's a summary of suggestions I remember seeing. It's perfectly possible to get rid of tunnelling (or decrease it substantially) if BHVR would test a solution and code it in.
A change on gen speeds based on survivors alive is something i haven't thought of and probably the easiest.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3854543#Comment_3854543
So it was completely reworked, in what i think is BHVRs greatest balance decision they have ever made.
You liked it?
I must admit I've always hated this change.
I admit i hated it at first, but as i started to play more and more i realize how good of a change it was.
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@Thusly_Boned said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3854659#Comment_3854659
I don't know about boring, but it's more aggravating to be bled out because you know the killer would get more points if they hooked, but choose to leave everyone on the deck for no discernable reason other than spite.
At least if you are on a hook you have some degree of control of how/when you exit the match (of getting the 4%). And it is marginally less boring as at least there is some interactivity via skill checks. Crawling around isn't exactly a blast.
Leaving people on the ground for four minutes is the tiniest of tiny d behavior; I always take it as:
- The killer is just being a power tripping douchenozzle
- The killer isn't confident they can down everyone more than once
I definitely think there should be a basekit UB mechanic that kicks in after a couple minutes.
See THERE it is, i think you hit the key point. On the hook, you can just let yourself die and give up.
I think that not only should that mechanic be removed from the game, but ALSO they should ban people for throwing matches. I suspect kill rates are actually massively inflated due to people giving up very early into the match.
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@solarjin1 said:
i swear @Reinami posted that vib so many times it becoming meme worthy
Its a good vid, but please ignore the entire post i made and comment on that video again. I think it would be very productive.
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@Inosennatoki said:
There will be a random killer nerf with every update. Who do you think will be the next killer to get nerfed in to the ground?
Maybe thrill of the hunt will be nerfed to be worse than version before they buff it like what happened with thanatophobia.
Singularity. Pay attention to the content creators and what they complain about those are often the things that get changed. Otz and a few others have posted videos about slugging and singularity so i suspect that is what is next.
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@buggybug said:
You admit alot that you camp and tunnel and use noed to boot. So am thinking maybe that is why they use the get good. Everyone has their right including you to play and enjoy the game as you see fit. Do not be surprised if they say that if you did those things.
However looking at the other side of things, if you did not camp or tunnel and beat them normally, then they have no excuse for their lack of skills.
Killers too bash survivors who played well like running them all game or get a lucky kobe or deli out when they thought they would be getting at least 1 free kill. Thus the life of pvp no one honestly likes losing xd.
Playing the game, regardless of strategy does not matter. If someone wins, they win, the players who lost need to get over it.
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@ImWinston said:
- Devs need to remedy this problem. Today I had an hour to play video games (I'm 46 and I can't play more than that, I have other things to do during the day). First game, slugging for NO REASON with 4 gens left... I was slugged to death after 4 minutes on the floor. Second game, slugging for NO REASON while a Huntress threw hatchets at the sky like an idiot... after two minutes I DC because I preferred 1 minute ban instead of having to be bored for another 2 minutes on the ground. Slugging become a serious problem and I don't understand how it can be accepted peacefully by everyone. Slugging is many times not a strategy, but just permitted toxicity
Why i being slugged less fun for you? A hook timer is 70 seconds, meaning you could sit there for a full 3.5 minutes, with slugging its 4 minutes AND you can move around.
I never understood the survivor argument that being slugged is boring. When i play survivor and get slugged its better than getting proxy camped on the hook.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3854543#Comment_3854543
The killrates part always kills me. The only thing anyone ever says to explain why the super easy killer with the OP power has low killrates is "Well... I get 4ks all day and I'm not even a killer main... No I'm not gonna show video of my gameplay." Surely if Nurse was truly such a low risk high reward easy killer, the average stats would reflect that.
And its at high mmr too from the published stats. I'd argue that nightlight is showing "higher than average mmr" because in order to be someone who posts on nightlight, you probably need to be someone who knows a bit more about the game and what is going on to know the site even exists to post to, and then also have the mentality of wanting to post there.
Which makes it even funnier.
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@Xxjwaynexx thanks for tagging me on this, as i usually post in these.
@i_dont_care223 said:
what the title says how is chucky keep getting nerfed but nurse isnt getting touched like ever he isnt even that awful to play against like seriously biggest joke in 2024 and dont start with "nurse takes skill" she doesnt especially not in this era of the game
There is a fundamental problem with nurse, that i usually respond to when these threads come up. It is a simple question, that most refuse to answer or deflect, but i'll try and ask it of you.
Should DBD be balanced around the highest skill players, or average skill players? I'll tell you my own opinion at the end, but i want you to really stop here and think about it before you keep reading. How should ANY game be balanced really, not just DBD.
Every time BHVR releases data around kill rates, nurse is usually at the bottom of the pack in terms of kill rate. Devs balance for a 60% kill rate (you can disagree but thats what the stated goal of the devs is, mathematically it amounts to killers winning 50% of the time, but that is a different discussion). Anyway, 60% kill rate is the goal. But when devs release their data, it shows nurse usually being around 49-50% kill rate. Even at high MMR her kill rate is often only around 50-55%, usually the lowest or one of the lowest in the game.
Here are just some examples:
Even looking at UNOFFICIAL data, if you look at nightlight RIGHT NOW and sort by kill rate. You'll see that nurse has a 52.97% kill rate. When you look at averages for killer as a whole, that is currently at 54.66% kill rate. So it stands to reason that, when looking at most players, even the "high mmr" ones that BHVR classifies as "high mmr" nurse is actually BELOW the average in terms of kill rate. This would indicate that nurse is completely fine.
But, and i think most would agree. Nurse is objectively the best killer in the game. When played at the HIGHEST level, not whatever the hell BHVR says high mmr is, but the HIGHEST level of play, she is clearly the best killer. As someone who is a nurse main with 4k+ hours in this game, i can truthfully tell you that legitimately, i cannot remember the last time i lost a game as nurse, like i literally cannot. Occasionally i get a draw, maybe a couple of times a week, maybe if i'm memeing around, or going for a tome challenge, or honestly just go up against a good team that puts up a good fight. But a loss? No. My "no loss streak" with nurse is probably well over thousands of games at this point, unironically, but i don't bother counting.
I don't say this to brag, i say this to agree with you, that nurse is a "problem" in the sense that, someone who dedicates the time and energy into playing her, into maining her, is going to be able to exploit her to her fullest potential, and when judged at that level, she objectively needs massive changes.
So, lets say i agree with you, and that nurse needs "nerfs" so to speak (personally i think she needs a total rework, but that is again, a different discussion). Well now you need to contend with the reality of what you just said. You want a killer who, for all intents and purposes, at average level and high mmr is below average, to be nerfed, because of what a few VERY high level (like top 1k or even less) are capable of doing with her. So now, you need to own up to the consequences of that decision.
And what are those consequences? Well, the fact that when you look at things at THAT level of play? Nurse is pretty much the only viable killer. Arguably blight and hillbilly could maybe compete as well, but its probably an uphill battle. At THAT level of play though, with the best of the best players in the world? Nurse is basically the only viable killer to play a "fair" match.
Now this is the part where someone usually says things like "But killers like ghostface and dredge also win matches in comp". But, what most fail to see is that comp usually balances things differently for different killers. Different killers have different perk bans for survivors and killers, different killers get played on different maps.
Ghost face for example, is played on Lery's a very good map for him, that makes him much more interesting. Similarly dredge is played on Midwich, another very good map for him. And different killers have different things that are banned for them. Effectively, comp balances things on an individual killer level by trying to change perk bans and maps and such perk killer, rather than overall.
To conclude, if you think nurse needs to be nerfed because of what the highest level players are capable of, per the data, then you must also content with the fact that at that same level, she is the only viable killer, and nearly every single killer either needs MASSIVE buffs, or survivors need MASSIVE nerfs, to come at the same time as these nurse nerfs.
Now, i said at the end i would answer the question i asked of you, should the game balanced around average skill players, or high skill players? I think the game should be BALANCED around high skill players while DESIGNED around low skill players. Keep in mind that BALANCE and DESIGN are 2 different things. What i mean by this for example, is lets look at Nurse, as you have. Nurse is very OP in the hands of a good killer player, but really BAD in the hands of the average player. This is why she needs a total rework, she needs to be designed in a way that new players can play her and have a good time, but BALANCED in a way that she is fair at the highest level of play.
There is a video i like posting that explains this idea for TF2, i linked the relevant timestamp, but the entire video is a good watch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1p42KtZOCw&t=203sThis often happens in games where maybe a character is really really good in low level play (a noob stomper) but actually bad in high level play, so the devs need to do some redesigning that "nerfs" the character in a way that makes them less of a problem in lower level play, while also buffing them for high level play. And vice versa is also possible, where characters can be really really bad in low level play, but way OP in high level play, such a thing also probably needs to be redesigned in some way. Maybe not totally, but certainly some better design decisions need to be made.
The perfect example of this in DBD type of decision IMO is the original change to Hex: Ruin. If you weren't around back in the day, the OLD Hex: Ruin did this:
This perk was basically taken every single game by every single killer. It was in like 50% of games or some crazy thing at one point, because it was very effective at slowing the game down. Not only did it make great skill checks not give a bonus (which at the time i believe was 5%, and this was on 80 second gens), but it made it so good skill checks actually REGRESSED the gen.
People who were bad at hitting great skill checks would often resort to "gen tapping" which made a gen take around 100-110 seconds depending on how often you did the tapping JUST to avoid the skill checks. If you were bad at skill checks, this was actually faster than just doing the gen. Lower skill survivors have a hard time with skill checks, and finding totems.
Basically, every single game was "find the ruin before you do gens" and if you found the ruin in 60 seconds, great, the game was an even playing field, but if you didn't, survivors probably lost. And if the killer lost ruin as soon as they spawn because survivors spawned on it? They probably lost. However at the HIGHEST level of play, what did this do? Well, those kinds of survivors can ALWAYS get great skill checks, so all it really did was remove the bonus, they could just ignore ruin completely and fly through gens. On top of that, ruin "just worked" there was nothing the killer needed to do to get its effect unlike pop for example which requires a hook. Its slowdown just worked by nature of bringing the perk
So it was OP in low level play, and very weak in high level play. So it was completely reworked, in what i think is BHVRs greatest balance decision they have ever made.
Now, ruin sucks because 100% is not nearly enough, but that again, is a different discussion.
This ruin was GREAT from a design perspective. It required the killer to push survivors off of gens and pressure them in order to get the effective regression it provides instead of it "just working" this means that the effect of ruin is proportionally effective to how good the killer is at pressuring survivors. So in low skill play, where killers are not able to pressure gens as effectively, ruin was much weaker, but in higher skill games, where killers can often pressure multiple survivors at the same time by juggling the different gens, they could get MUCH better regression, making ruin a real threat. It wasn't long before high skill survivors were always cleansing ruin, and lower skill ones could ignore it a bit for the first few gens and maybe stumble upon it.
It wasn't much longer where we got undying, which made it even stronger in the high level game, while only making it slightly better in lower skill games.
So anyway. BALANCE the game around high level players, and DESIGN the game around low level players, and the game will be in a much more fun and fair state for everyone.
Thanks for coming to my TED talk.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852559#Comment_3852559
How would it be possible to make tunneling impossible without having serious balance problems by telling 1 survivor "You are untouchable"?
By embracing what this game has become.
The game was originally designed around being a game of hide and seek, which is clear from how people originally played it. Eventually, it turned into a game of freeze tag, which is what we have today. The problem is that the "freeze" part of the freeze tag, is a bit unfair. The freeze part doesn't last long enough, and when you get "unfrozen" you have to hop on one leg for 30 seconds before you can actually run away properly again, meanwhile you are able to get frozen again.
So basically, my suggestion would be a "time out" when you get unhoked. A guaranteed timeout of some set amount of time, where, you get unhooked, maybe for 30 seconds or 45 seconds. The time doesn't matter too much, that can easily be tweaked, but the general idea is that you can't do anything, as a survivor, you can't work a gen, you can't heal, you can't progress the game. But, in return, you also are immune from anything the killer does, and completely invisible to them, so they don't even know where you are.
After this timeout period, you automatically get fully healed, and are back in the game.
So, yes, you tell that 1 survivor "You are untouchable" but also "you don't get to progress the game for a bit".
I'd also probably couple this with survivors sharing the 1st hook state. That way the earliest you could kill someone from the game is at the 6th hook. Which should be well into the game at that point.
This would be the "simple" fix that they could do, but honestly i think the entire game should be reworked from kills and escapes, to creating a "hope" meter, that is filled by the killer. The survivors still do what they do to attempt to escape, but instead of the killer "killing" the survivors, their ultimate goal is to fill up that meter by doing various actions like hitting survivors, downing them, etc and then if it fills up the entity kills the survivors, meanwhile the survivors goal is to escape before that meter is filled.
That would be much more lore accurate anyway as it is the entire point of the game. It is why the game rewards you so little for camping in terms of bloodpoints.
Ironically i think the old system we had of the different emblem categories did it better than the one we had now, The problem was people still tied kills/escapes to winning and losing rather than pips, which is how it should have been seen. That sort of thing showcases more skill from both sides, because you can't just "gen rush" or "hard tunnel/camp" someone out, otherwise you don't pip.
But anyway, such a rework would likely never happen because its too risky, so the first change would probably be the simpler one to implement that doesn't change the core game too much.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
This is a bit of a mild rant about how the DBD community discusses topics such as Generator Speeds…
5 Generators. Survivors have to complete 5 Generators, which take around 90 seconds per Generator to complete. Yes there are ways to shortcut the Survivor's objective, such as bringing a toolbox or perks to make the Generators go faster, but it often leaves them more vulnerable to the various Killer strategies available (tunneling, proxy-camping, slugging, etc.).
I see a post every now and then about how Generator speeds are too fast or how slowdown is ineffective. "All the Generators get done quick, something must be done about it," but within these discussion, I think people kind of ignore how DBD, as a game, is structured. When all 5 Generators are completed, the game isnt instantly over, the Survivors dont instantly escape, the end-game exists to give the Killer a bit more time to wrap things up or pull the game back into their favor.
Technically speaking, (while I dont have %s to give) a vast majority of my games I win as Killer, often only running 1 or 2 slowdown perks and relying on macro gameplay to slowdown the game and strategically deal with Survivors by applying pressure in the right areas. I dont win every game of course, but I do win a majority. A lot of these games that I win, a decent chunk has all 5 Generators being completed, but Im able to pull things back in the end-game or the game-state is in a way where it doesnt matter if all Generators get done since Id still leave with a 3K or higher.
Endgame IS important. A lot of people like to write it off about how the Exit Gates dont take that much time to open and how you are always going to lose in Endgame but it is far from the reality. Perks can extend the Endgame and help with much needed pressure, and you dont have to worry about protecting Generators since your objective at that point is to play for kills. And even without perks, playing smart can give you an extra hook(s) which can make the difference between a 2K and a 3K.
Overall. Im tired of people ignoring the impact the endgame has on DBD, especially when it can make a massive difference.
Gen speeds are "too fast" but its not really about them being too fast, its about the ratio between gen speeds and chase time is off at the higher levels. The game is theoretically supposed to be "balanced" around chases lasting 45 seconds. Lets math that out.
Imagine a game where, before the first chase starts, all the survivors spread out and the first chase starts right as all the survivors hop on a gen, and lets assume that every chase lasts exactly 45 seconds, the killer doesn't tunnel, or camp, and attempts to get 12 hooks.
So, the first chase starts at 0 and 3 survivors hop on 3 different gens.
At 45 seconds, the killer gets a down, and 3 gens have 45 seconds of progress. The killer has to wait 2.7 for the wipe animation, and then picks the survivor up taking 3 seconds, then walks to a hook which takes 10 seconds then hooks the survivor which takes 1.5 seconds. We are now at 62.2 seconds. Lets just say 62 seconds. So of the 450 seconds needed total for a gen, 186 seconds have been done.
After hooking the survivor, lets just pretend that the killer literally teleports to the next survivor, and another survivor teleports to the survivor on the hook. So now you have, 1 survivor in chase, 1 unhooking and healing, 1 unhooked and healed, 1 on a gen. During this time, the survivor gets un hooked and healed, which takes 19 seconds, and then they spend the another 25 seconds running to a gen. So lets say that they hop on a gen, right as the other chase ends.
So we have 45 seconds of a chase and 45 seconds of gens being done. This process will repeat until the 9th hook, after which a survivor is killed. So how what happens?
1st chase = 186 seconds of progress
2nd chase = 231 seconds
3rd chase = 276
4th chase = 321
5th chase = 366
6th chase = 411
7th chase = 456
So you can see, in this world where, every single chase starts immediately and lasts exactly the "balanced" 45 second mark, and only 1 survivor is on a gen during every chase after the 1st (simulating them being occupied at times). Survivors complete all the gens before the killer barely gets over the halfway point. And the survivors are well over halfway done.
Now, this is assuming chases last 45 seconds. Well, how long does a chase actually last? Against top tier killers like nurse, chases can last maybe 15-20 seconds. But what about a normal killer like doctor, or demogorgon or your standard "m1 killer"? How long can chase last if the survivor just shift+w and doesn't use pallets and windows? Well, about 45 seconds. That's right, if the survivor just shift+w to a corner of the map, the chase should last around 45 seconds. How about a pallet? Well, every pallet break adds about 20 seconds to a chase. I can show the math if you want.
Yes, killer powers and such can lower that amount, but once you realize this, you see why all of the "top tier" killers are the ones that can catch up. They are the killers like nurse, blight, spirit, hillbilly, etc. While killers like myers, drege, demo, and so on are left in the dust.
The other problem is when you factor in the higher level play, where a good survivor can use checkspots, to basically force killer shack to be 3 vaults before a pallet is broken, and they can waste a solid 45-60 seconds of time before the killer even gets a pallet, let alone a down and a hook.
The problem is not that gen speeds take too long, its that maps are too strong for good survivors. The average survivor is busy predropping shack pallet while still getting hit anyway, whereas the good survivor is chaining that shack into a filler into a jungle gym and wasting 60+ seconds of a killer's time before they even land their first hit.
What needs to be done, is not increasing gen time, but decreasing the power of the maps. Every single structure and loop should be a pure 50/05. If the killer guesses right, they get a hit, if the survivor guesses right, they can either "A: get a few more loops around the same structure before the 50/50 again, or B: run to a different loop and start the process again" But most pallets in the game are safe in some way (again against GOOD survivors who know how to use check spots) making it so you MUST break the pallet to get past them, and then you just added 20 seconds to your chase.
Adding gen time will only hurt the low skill survivors who can't loop. If anything the gen time needs to be lowered, while buffing killer basekit gen defense and regression, and nerfing base maps and structures. This would even out the game in a way where lower skill survivors, who are likely going against lower skill killers, will have a much better shot at winning their games, while the higher skill survivors, who are going against higher skill killers, are able to better showcase their skills so a win actually proves who is better.
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@Mandy said:
There's no current plan to change Shoulder of Burden, it was adjusted from the PTB - Live, and it is something that will be monitored on our side, if we see it behaving problematically then it's of course something that we can change, for right now we're happy with how it's performing.
So you aren't going to fix the bug that makes it so the exposed part of the perk just doesn't function?
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@solarjin1 said:
Killer Updates
The Houndmaster - Basekit
- Chase Command cooldown reduced to 4 seconds (was 5 seconds)
- Completed Generators now appear light orange to The Houndmaster after charging Search Command (previously Completed Generators were visible at all times)
- Houndsense Radius only visible to a Survivor when the dog is within 20 meters of them (previously was visible at any range)
- Survivors afflicted with Houndsense appear with reduced color and opacity outline to The Houndmaster (red tint used to blend too much with Killer Instinct feedback)
The Houndmaster - Addons
- Training Bell:
Increased the Survivor aura reveals to 8 seconds (was 5 seconds)
- Spiked Collar:
Increase the duration of the Mangled and Haemorrhage status effects to 60 seconds (was 45 seconds)
- Gunpowder Tin:
Reduced the action speed bonus to 30% (was 40%)
- Marlinspike:
Updated effect to exclude grabbed Survivor from receiving Houndsense (was previously all Survivors within 20m of location of Dog Grab)
- Fixed an issue that caused the Dog to grab Survivors that are being killed by the Entity during the End Game Collapse.
- Fixed an issue that caused the Dog's Chase command to always vault if it is next to a vault location in Redirect mode.
- Fixed an issue that caused the trail boost to have no effect when starting a chase on the search path.
- Fixed an issue that caused the Dog to get stuck on walls and fail to dash when the Killer quickly sends the dash command on the other side of a wall.
- Fixed multiple path finding issues with the Dog in various maps.
- The Dog no longer teleports at the start of a dash.
- The Dog patrol path can appear above ground level when the patrol is sent to a different elevation.
- Fixed an issue that caused the Houndsense Killer Effect to be removed when an injured Survivor is grabbed.
- Fixed an issue that caused the Houndsense Killer Effect timer to reset if a Survivor was hit while having the Endurance effect.
- Fixed an issue that caused the power not to visually appear on cooldown when spectating.
- Fixed an issue that caused spectators not to see the reverse Red arrow marker when The Houndmaster points at objects with the patrol ability
- The Nipping at Your Heels score event is no longer earned twice when the survivor escapes the trial with Houndsense
is she better?
No,
- the problem with chase is not the cooldown, its that the cooldown doesn't start ticking unless the dog is near you. And you move as fast as the dog, so it can end up "Behind you" and giving you infinite cooldown until you stop and let it catch up. Reducing the cooldown by 1 second does not help.
- Completed generators is just visuals and doesn't do anything
- Houndsense radius being less is okaish, but it has a lullaby and heartbeat indicator, so the dog is easily avoided anyway.
- Houndsense color is again visuals and don't matter.
- The aura on the addon doesn't do anything, because if they stun the dog you probably need to break the pallet anyway.
- 15 extra seconds of mangled doesn't do much
- Nerfing the action speed, her only good addon is funny
- Nerfing marlinspike an already bad addon is funny.
- Endgame collapse bug is super rare and like, who cares, all the survivors are already dead, you aren't chasing anyone with the dog
- Fixing the vault thing on the dog is nice
- I'm unsure on the trail boost, do they mean like, you can now start chases on the trail and keep the movement speed? If so this is actually pretty solid, but i'm assuming it meant that that trail was just bugged forever and wouldn't give the movement speed bonus after the chase ended.
- Dog stuck on walls when doing chase is good
- Fixing pathing issues, unless this means they are gonna make it so the dog doesn't go 10,000 MPH to the nearest pallet when it grabs someone then idk man.
- Dog teleporting might actually be bad if it is stuck? IDK how exactly this behaves.
- Dog path is okaish
- Houndsense being removed on grab is w/e, houndsense does nothing anyway
- Endurance fix is w/e
- Spectate bugs are w/e
- Bloodpoint bugs are w/e
Realistically these changes are going to do basically nothing to fix any of her actual major problems unless the dog pathing is fixing it running to a pallet really. And if so, great they fixed 1 of the 10 things wrong with her.
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@CipherMRV said:
Sorry if this has been said before. I think I know why people hate NOED so much. Besides the fact that it's a surprise instadown, I hear all the time that NOED is a crutch perk that has no activation requirement. I think that's why people hate it more than other endgame perks. Every other endgame perks require build up to get the most value out of it (no way out/remember me) or it has a specific requirements to fully activate (blood warden). The only way to counter NOED currently is to cleanse every totem.
I think NOED should have to be built up throughout the game. They can remove the hex and make it token based or something. Maybe something like "NOED lasts 30 seconds basekit then adds 30 more seconds and 1% haste for each survivor hooked for the first time". Could also make it permanent if all survivors are hooked or grants the speed boost only if all survivors are hooked.
My other suggestion is that the only survivors exposed in the endgame are the ones you hooked at least once in the game.
I'm fine with NOED as is, I just know most survivors hate it so I was trying to make it more "fair".
There are tons of survivor perks that survivors don't have to build up. Things like DS, DH, OTR etc. all just "happen" because they get hooked.
There really isn't any good reason why killers can't also have perks that do this.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852775#Comment_3852775
Not impossible, but highly unlikely
Then all i can say is just wait my friend. Let me get it all together. Busy weekend and even week with the holidays for me, but i'm getting there. I had a little time to play last night and played a couple of freddy matches showing the differences. I had 1 game against a solid team, and 1 game against a not so solid team to show the differences. Once i get a few matches with each of the killers you played, i'll show you some on my mains and you can see the kinds of things that i see every single day. Give me a little time and i'll post some matches with some commentary so you can see what some of us are complaining about.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852557#Comment_3852557
I did, but the above basically completed invalidates what you said and also contradicts the reason why you wanted to see gameplay in the first place. You cant say that you want to "learn" from seeing gameplay and then do a complete 180 and say the reason why you wanted to see it was because you wanted to confirm that the survivors I was going up against werent the same caliber as yours.
Everyone has tough games. The Dredge video was one of those games and it showcases that you can still recover after a bad start. (3 gens done within 2 min) I did still end up with 2k 9 stages though, would of maybe gotten a better result if I hadnt made further mistakes (specifically miscounting that Styptic which was basically the final nail in the coffin.)
I can analyze my own games with commentary even and say my thought process throughout the entire thing. Since again the whole reason why this thing started in the first place was because it was under the assumption that would "learn" from it, in which I should of started with analyzing my own games to begin with.
I just have a REALLY hard time believing that people get different caliber survivors consistently since not only is my experience with matchmakimg inconsistent, but so are many streamers who are definitely considered very good and are more than likely at the soft cap.
Well it was learning, i was learning what other people are experiencing. And that is precisely what i'm doing, i'm recording some matches and am going to show YOU what i see on a regular basis. I want to do some editing and commentary on them to explain my through process at the time so its taking a bit of time. Do you truly think it is completely impossible that maybe i'm experiencing something different from you?
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Probably because you list perks like Dead hard and Sprint burst as F tier, but put perks like Any means necessary, FTP, Invocation and plunderer in S tier?
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/8FUHPZ4F50WE/screenshot-from-2024-12-07-19-32-20.png
I sure do love being Bleed out for 4-minutes when the Killer can just end the game. It would be nice if there was some level of agency from the Survivor's end to deal with this issue. :)
Also yes, as you can imagine, the Killer did ye ole' W + S on top of me, nodded, and threw hatchets at me while I was on the ground.
(Also since I know someone will look at my perks and complain in some shape or way, Im going for the Left For Dead achievement and Im using Sole Survivor and Wake Up for the increased Gate Opening Speed. Adrenaline and Hope are there in case I get caught opening the Gate I can hopefully make it through without going into the Dying State.)
I wish there was a way for killers to give up just like survivors can. Especially when toxic SWFs wont just end the game.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852468#Comment_3852468
The game will and cannot be balanced. Not sure why this is still being chased. You can't balance a game like this in a meaningfully competitive way.
And this is why the comp side of dbd is why there's so many meta problems and such. Remove the comp side of things, and its actually a pretty fun game.
And lol, the claim is still there. Would just rather the 'other objectives' be fair and not something broken that some players apparently can't win without. Skill issue, indeed.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852567#Comment_3852567
BHVR is abysmal with their 'nerfing's'. I hope Thrill isn't tossed in the Grave also, just adjust it BHVR. Just an adjustment. Please you gotta get this one right.
You can't "Remove the comp side" people are always going to want to play to win. And BHVR created this problem by doing MMR. MMR literally by design, makes it so when you win, your next match will in theory be more difficult than the previous one (not literally every single time, but statistically it trends that way) Thus creating a mentality where, to win, you have to optimize the fun out of the game.
This game has always worked best from a fun standpoint when the survivors "roleplay" a survivor, and act like a person would if they were really in the situation they are in. But it hasn't been like that for many years at this point.
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@iloveandhatethisgame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852559#Comment_3852559
I think the game would be better if we didn’t have toxic survivors and toxic killers
Every game has toxic players. But the problem is you are conflating "toxic player" with someone who uses a strategy you don't like. The only one to blame there is the devs.
If a strategy is so effective, that it is going to give you the win more often than not, and it is hard to counter, and you are trying to play the game to win, then you would be a fool to not use that strategy. The devs are the ones to blame for allowing the unfun strategy to exist, no the players using it.
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@TheWheelOfCheese said:
Compensation… for what, exactly? If they made each hook state 5 seconds and people complained, would you say that reverting it back to 70 would require "compensation" in some way? No, that would be lunacy.
Everything else mentioned in your post is completely unrelated to Thrill.
Well, in theory, the reason they made the change was because the perk was underpowered/underutilitized. So just nerfing it back to where it was just makes the perk bad again. Personally i think they should try meeting in the middle, it was 10%, they buffed it to 14%, lets try 12% and see where that lands us. But knowing BHVR they will probably nerf it down to 8% and make it even more useless like they did thana.
They did this thana, they buffed it because it was bad, buffed it a bit too much, then nerfed it to be worse than it was before the buff.
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@iloveandhatethisgame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852442#Comment_3852442
“Maybe if the devs stopped punishing killers for hooking survivors by giving survivors tons of perks that work off of being unhooked”
There are people in this exact thread that admit they tunnel at 5 gens. Blame people like them for it
Don't you think it would be great if the game was balanced around hooks instead of kills? And that tunneling and camping were not just "discouraged" but actively impossible to do from a gameplay standpoint? Would be so much more fun for both sides.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3852178#Comment_3852178
"Don't take this the wrong way, because i absolutely don't mean it as an attack on YOU or YOUR gameplay. These survivors you are going against are NOT the same kinds of survivors that I go against."
Please read the entire post, i even said you played well in your games.
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@Xxjwaynexx said:
Yeah I'm all for using strats to achieve a win for both sides but this meta we're heading towards of slugging and bleeding out isnt it. I seen some content creators be the "Villain" running these builds and it's just gonna force unnecessary nerfs to killers who don't play like that and buffs to survivors which the very killers using this new meta are gonna complain about. Shoulder the burden isn't that strong to warrant this level of slugging.
Maybe if the devs stopped punishing killers for hooking survivors by giving survivors tons of perks that work off of being unhooked, or hooks, and stopped nerfing killer perks that encourage them to go for hooks, hooks might actually be useful again.
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3851563#Comment_3851563
Ask and you shall receive
Now idk what you want to learn from this exactly but hey, here it is! (Also @GeneralV , Freddster as requested <3)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yY_BufsmpBQ
Trickster
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sM0AEy4eow0
Trapper
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfANalYU5MI
Dredge
Thanks for actually doing this, it is pretty rare that people actually respond.
I watched the videos a bit, and i do plan on not only taking some notes and probably make a "reply" to your videos here, but that will take a bit of time. But also i want to record my own matches using your same builds and killers there (attempting to try and get the same maps even with map offerings but that will depend if i have them or not), as i want to compare them.
Don't take this the wrong way, because i absolutely don't mean it as an attack on YOU or YOUR gameplay. These survivors you are going against are NOT the same kinds of survivors that I go against. For example, in your first game as freddy, survivors didn't finish the first gen until about 150 seconds after the match started. In the matches that i play, i would play similar to you and do some of the same things (pushing survivors off of multiple gens, not committing to one chase very long). But in the games i played? I would have probably lost 2 gens at the 100-120 second mark.
I will say again, that this is NOT an attack on YOU or YOUR gameplay and not meant to be, i actually think you played very well in these games for what its worth. My purpose for asking for footage was because i genuinely think that people are simply not experiencing the same kinds of things in their games as some others are and that this is precisely what leads to this great divide.
I suspect that a lot of the people on the killer side who think survivors are "too strong" are going against the kind of teams that others rarely see which gives them the perception that tunneling/slugging and generally playing scummy is not only "ok" but necessary.
And on the flip side the ones who think survivors have a horrible time are the ones experiencing the killers playing nurse/blight/billy and slugging and hard tunneling immediately into the match before anyone even has time to touch a gen. I think this ultimately boils down really to matchmaking being as wild as it is, or maybe its time of day, or region or some other unknown factor and has little to do with the actual state of the game balance.
Again, i will spend some time this weekend going over your videos in more detail, and posting my own matches using your same builds (and then maybe a few with the things that i tend to play) so you can see things from my perspective and the kinds of things i am going against.
Thanks again for doing this and i'll try and get this all done on my side as soon as i can, but i do have a busy weekend with the holidays and such coming up.
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@vol4r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3851142#Comment_3851142
So you prefer going against bots, right? Because if surviviors get even more nerfed, there will be not much of them left.
I win every killer game with 3 or 4k. As a survivior I escape like maybe 50% of the time.
I will never agree that game is survivior sided. It might only be if you put 4 great surviviors together. Casual lobbies are getting shredded.I'll say the same to you i said above, can you post some videos of your games? Would love to learn what we are doing wrong from someone who seems to be having a different experience.
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Hey, can you show us maybe what we are all doing wrong? Maybe record some matches using OBS and post them on youtube. Both things are totally free and you don't need to really do any editing as i'm sure nobody would expect crazy editing or commentary. Just some footage of your matches which gives everyone a chance to learn?
Looking forward to learning from you!
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@Lixadonna said:
Sorry you can't handle High MMR. Maybe get good instead of blaming an Offering.
Hey, we'd love to learn what we are doing wrong. Can you post some videos of gameplay for us to learn from you?
You can use the free software OBS (the same streamers use) to record footage of matches pretty easily. You don't have to actually stream to twitch or anything, OBS can also just record. Then you can post the videos for free on youtube. Should be a pretty easy process. Let me know if you need any help!
Looking forward to learning from you!
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850905#Comment_3850905
Yes but they also have to push out all the updates all at once for all platforms. This can pose issues since DBD is on many platforms and each platform has requirements before updates get pushed out and they also need approval from each platform to push it out; PlayStation is the biggest contention with this.
Again, i am a software engineer. I know how long things should take including shipping things to multiple platforms and globally and dealing with localization and regional specific changes (and censorship) and dealing with China, etc.
Dealing with those things is the same whether you make one small changes (number tweak) or you ship a whole new game (maybe not the localization process). The way it works is ship a build do PS or xbox or w/e, they run their tests and tell you if they are happy with it. If you are shipping a number change, the test takes just as long as if you are shipping a new character, or if you are shipping a new map. Its all automated regardless. But the point is. Why does it take them 3 months to change the numbers of 5-10 perks? They should be able to ship that in a week, and in 3 months they should be able to completely rework every perk in the game if they needed to.
Like, if all of that stuff took that long, why does fortnite do the same thing? They have to ship to multiple platforms (even mobile) and they still manage to do more things than BHVR does and the crazy in-game events they do? And the collabs with multiple different IPs and products? The new skins, new modes, new features. etc. all the time?
What i don't know is BHVRs internal processes, code base etc. obviously. But my point is, if those things are setup in such a way that it makes them take this long to do even the smallest thing, what they need to be doing is restructuring their teams and org in order to make it so it doesn't take that long to do things.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850877#Comment_3850877
Because BHVR normally throws these changes in with Hotfixes for bugs.
And also even though BHVR is larger than a lot of studios, size does not necessarily equal speed, sometimes the larger amount of people can result in things taking longer in the workflow; more people means more people to communicate to about specific issues or problems.
I'm a software engineer i know how long things should take. And they should not take as long as they do.
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@ArkInk said:
Houndmaster will take months to fix. For Thrill changes all they need to do is revert the number buff it got. Not really seeing how this a clean comparison even if Thrill got mentioned and Houndmaster didn't. They aren't comparable content.
Why does it take houndmaster months to get fixed, but a game like dota 2 can in the same time frame:
- Completely change the layout of the map
- Completely change every single character adding massive new basekit mechanics (like the facet system)
- Completely rework multiple characters
- Completely rework almost all the items
- All of these changes amount to effectively playing a new game.
- Have a team of < 100 people
Why does it take BHVR a few months to change 5 perks with numbers tweaks that don't actually ever make the perks usable because everyone still uses the same 10-15 perks on both sides? But yeah, i bet if we give the teamwork perks some bigger numbers people might use them.
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@solarjin1 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850620#Comment_3850620
we go live forever got immediately nerf so it happen on both roles. Perks on both side was allow to run rampant not to long ago. weave, ultimate weapon, background player, ftp/buckle, etc
imagine thinking weave and UW were a problem, both of those perks were garbage then and they are garbage now. There's a reason comp didn't ban either them but they ban nowhere to hide.
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I just wonder why when its a killer perk, why do they hotfix it, but when its a survivor perk, we have to wait 6+months for it?
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@ToppingPanic said:
Anybody notice Kill ratio is up and there is practically a permanent Bloodpoint bonus for Survivor? Would be cool to address that.
Where is this "kill ratio is up" data you are seeing? BHVR has not released anything.
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@Unequalmitten86 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849878#Comment_3849878
They can't fix it but it's going to make all the other players leave. They need to enforce their bad sportsmanship. I barely play killer and I had a game.where a squad refused to leave just torment me. It is happening every game. It also feels as if I'm not matched up correctly. When I play survivor same thing. It's like the potatoes need to be harvested.
The thing is there were never any asymmetrical games out there but now there are. Yes DBD has a solid player base but at this point they don't have the loyal ones like they used to. Now it's just bad spuds.
They can fix it. They start banning people for doing it.
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@CodeDB said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850003#Comment_3850003
My interest is in win streaks and the general game, not explicitly balance because I think its a very nuanced topic.
I wouldn't have even commented on this thread if you didn't bring up win streaks but when you did, I was intrigued. So, I brought up the recent ones I've been seeing to relate and provide what I'm seeing to see how it relates to your streaks you've been seeing (which you still haven't specifically referenced, by the way).
So, I guess I just don't know how this is straw manning to ask for the examples you explicitly referenced but I apologize if it comes off that way.
And what is your point then? I don't want to misconstrue it but if the point is that a team of 4 survivors with 10,000 hours each on comms playing explicitly to get 3 escapes no matter what only managed 20 in a row proves some sort of imbalance towards survivors, I'm just not sure I follow.Let me put it this way.
I'm saying:
Hey, at the highest level of play, this game is a survivor sided.
And then you are saying:
Yeah, but when you look at these crazy win streaks which are these highest level players playing in "average" level matches, this thing happens.
It doesn't make sense.
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@CodeDB said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3850003#Comment_3850003
My interest is in win streaks and the general game, not explicitly balance because I think its a very nuanced topic.
I wouldn't have even commented on this thread if you didn't bring up win streaks but when you did, I was intrigued. So, I brought up the recent ones I've been seeing to relate and provide what I'm seeing to see how it relates to your streaks you've been seeing (which you still haven't specifically referenced, by the way).
So, I guess I just don't know how this is straw manning to ask for the examples you explicitly referenced but I apologize if it comes off that way.
And what is your point then? I don't want to misconstrue it but if the point is that a team of 4 survivors with 10,000 hours each on comms playing explicitly to get 3 escapes no matter what only managed 20 in a row proves some sort of imbalance towards survivors, I'm just not sure I follow.Because you are comparing win streaks in matchmaking, which is a different thing. Please take a look at the comp discord. There are tons of rules and bans for specific killers. Like you can't bring a ton of stuff against clown for example, or must play on certain maps. Then look at the killer perk ban list, and its so much smaller compared to the survivor one. There are reasons for that.
When killers go on big win streaks, you'll see they often will play matches and say "oh my streak is paused right now because i'm playing more chill" and they "unpause" the streak at various times. Streaks are meaningless. Please look at what i said.
At the HIGHEST LEVELS OF PLAY this game is survivor sided. At the LOWEST LEVELS OF PLAY the game is killer sided. Nothing you have said attempts to refute that, you just keep bringing up win streaks in matchmade games which have nothing to do with what i'm talking about.
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@CodeDB said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849998#Comment_3849998
Cool stuff. Weird comment to give to me though, as I never once mentioned balance.
I was talking about the win streaks you referenced which now sound like they…don't exist?You are being so disingenuous at this point. I literally said they exist, Team eternal has done major win streaks before. I'm pointing out that the argument of win streaks itself is just a bad argument anyway. I would like you to make some counterpoint to what i just said though and stop strawmanning. Otherwise if you are going to be disingenuous i'll just disengage because no point in having a discussion with someone who wants to argue in bad faith.
You even proved my own point, by arguing that the people going on those win streaks are survivors with comp experience and 10k+ hours. Which is literally what my point is, but ok.
Also, this entire thread is literally about "balance" its asking the question, is this game survivor sided. By definition that is a question about balance.
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@CodeDB said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849986#Comment_3849986
These 4 streamers, all with 10,000 hours in the game and some with comp experience even, are the average survivor players but also one of them happens to be the best killer players?
Can you elaborate on that? Possibly also include some more specifics on the Otz/other survivor win streaks you were referencing?You are missing my point.
At the HIGHEST levels of play, the game is survivor sided, at the LOWEST level of the play, the game is killer sided. At the average level, it is relatively balanced but swings heavily from 1 side to the other based on RNG, the map, what perks people bring, the killer played etc.
When killers do these "crazy win streaks" they are playing in matchmade games, against the AVERAGE PLAYER, so a top 0.01% killer is playing against the "average" survivor player. Which is more about the skill differential in the players, not the actual killer role.
Yeah, sometimes RNG factors into play and survivors are 4 players, so there are 4x as many opportunities for one of them to make a game ending mistake for the team. Which is why survivors typically are going to go on smaller streaks, more opportunities for mistakes. But the reality is that the "Average player" is generally pretty bad at this game, which is clear from the data.
When you look at comp matches, they impose a ton of rules to more balance the game and remove unfair elements. On the survivor side, a ton of perks are banned, you can't have duplicate perks, a bunch of item addons are banned, you can't bring the same items, etc. On the killer side, they basically just ban a handful of perks, things like mori, and myers tomestone. They also often create separate scoring systems, and its usually less about kills vs escapes, and more about team vs team (I.E. Team a has a killer player and a survivor team, and they go against Team B, and its about how many escape against Team A vs Team B not, oh well the killer wins because they got X Kills). This often results in things like Team A gets 1 kill because they hard tunneled the guy who didn't have DS, and Team B gets 2 kills because they did the same, and also got a good NOED spawn, so Team B ends up winning. Its an entirely different system.
And the data that BHVR releases clearly shows this. Unless you are going to look at the data and honestly tell me that nurse is one of the worst killers in the game, and needs to get on a much high level like killers like freddy and pig. And that is looking at the "high mmr" stat that BHVR releases.
When i talk about "high level play" i'm not talking about whatever the hell BHVR thinks "high MMR" is. Because obviously their idea of "High MMR" is not looking at the best of the best players, otherwise it would clearly show nurse being the best killer in the game.
The main point is. If you took the best survivor team in the world, and put them against the best in the world for each killer and had them each play 10 matches. Most killers would struggle to break the 50% kill rate, with the exception of maybe nurse and blight. With many killers probably never winning any games, and probably only getting a number of kills you can count with 1 hand.
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849969#Comment_3849969
No it doesnt there is a single team(eternal) or 2(elysium) that have managed to get about 100 and they play comp dbd
Otz and his friends havent got to 30-40 .
Please stop making things up.
Your comparison is still terrible and they arent even in the same realm of people who make killer streaks, and coordinated SWFS making streaks.
So not only do comp[ SWFS not get several hundred win streaks, the amount of teams even out there that are capable of even barely over 100 are limited to less than the number of half the fingers on one of your hands.
Killer several hundred win streaks there are several dozen.You have yet to explain to me why comp bans so many survivor perks and imposes so many restrictions on survivors, while only banning a handful of things on the killer side (like moris)
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@CodeDB said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849969#Comment_3849969
I would love to see some of these streaks. Only one I've seen recently has been OhTofu (playing with Xeno, Zubat, and Alby, all players with I0,000 hours each I believe though I can't say I'm familiar with all of them) and the most they got was 20. They did do it twice though, losing to a Blight and a Dredge, and all within the past 2 weeks. Unfortunately, doesn't look like they have picked it up again since the newest chapter but I hope to see it continue.
Funnily enough, OhTofu also got to 50 wins with Oni on his first try at the same time. Weird coincidence though, I'm sure.I see, so when we balance the game, we balance around the average survivor player, but the best killer players? Makes sense.
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849942#Comment_3849942
Apparently you dont pay attention when you watch him.
Hes never got to several hundred wins in a row on a survivor. I think he probably has reached in the 15-20region in terms of survivor.
This isnt a whataboutism this is reality.
Your comparison is just laughably misplaced, with the difference in magnitude between the two in the order of several decimal places.Right, because again, he goes on crazy difficult challenges. My point is that even handicapping themselves they still manage to go on big 30-40+ win streaks. There are survivor teams that have gotten hundreds of wins in the past by playing the best stuff, it exists on both sides.
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@Shinkiro said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849944#Comment_3849944
Then Thrill just becomes mandatory and running hex's without it is basically pointless as they'll be cleansed easier than ever.
And that is any different then undying is now? If you run a hex build either you take undying, or you are running hexes like plaything/pentimento. What it does is unlock a potential build the might be viable if they just took out the part of it that is super problematic, which is the quick interrupts with things like screams.
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@Firellius said:
I don't think it's a good idea to make sweeping changes to account for a messed up value on one perk.
Thrill should just be nerfed.
But then thrill just becomes useless again. Better to change the mechanic as a whole, and fix the one part of it that is problematic, and now we have another viable perk and build that isn't just the same 4 slowdown perks every single game.
Or do you like running into pain res, dms, deadlock every game?
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849926#Comment_3849926
You cant point to the "exact same kind of streaks and challenges on survivors side" when that number is not in the several hundreds or even thousands of win streaks(Supaalf).
Go ahead and point us to the win streaks [comparisons] emphasis on sample size and "s" though and it will become apparent there is one side clear out in narnia with several hundred for kill streaks and the other is barely reaching 20 escapesHave you never watched otz? He goes on challenge streaks all the time with his friends. Usually they are absurdly hard so they don't get into the 300+ games, but they certainly complete them. Also, whataboutisms aren't useful.
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@WolfyWood said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3849705#Comment_3849705
So survivor sided that we can have 300+ kill-streaks on even 'bad' killers.
The reality is that the game is killer-sided until 'high mmr' where its more of a mixed bag due to various means of cheesing a skill gap.
Please stop spreading misinformation.
High MMR also shows that nurse only has a a below 50% kill rate and that freddy is a better killer than her. So i'm not talking about whatever BHVR says is "high mmr". I'm saying, that when played at the highest level the game is very survivor sided. This is very apparent given that comp tends to ban a ton of stuff for survivor, and have different rule and scoring systems based around hooks and chases rather than just binary "escape/kills"
Plus i can point to you the exact same kind of streaks and challenges on survivor side. Remember otz doing the one where they had to like, escape with every survivor and perk?