NuclearBurrito
NuclearBurrito
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@VincentRedfield said:
A big problem is that 4k is the definition of fun for a lot of killer mains. That means 4 people need to lose consistently for 1 person to win.
Agreed.
4k is how you win.
But just because you lost doesn't mean the match wasn't fun.
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False. In a well designed game your fun is not dependent on the outcome of the match.
You can have fun and lose.
The game being asymmetrical changes nothing here.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/810088#Comment_810088
I feel like I accomplished something when I juke a spirit.
Me too. Because I'm NOT just randomly guessing.
That's how you end up being predictable and getting hit.
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Balance should not be based off fun because balance is a mathematical concept which describes how much of a difference in effectiveness (in relation to the roles wincon) it has relative to other elements in the game.
Non-balance issues can exist however and should be taken into account.
That being said a balance issue and a non-balance issue should be handled differently even if the fundamental cause is otherwise the same in some specific case.
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BS saves 0.45 seconds
Enduring saves 1 second
However nearly every pallet must be broken, but a stun can in theory be avoided always. Thus BS will add up faster.
This means the difference mostly comes down to your playstyle in a chase. Specifically if you are better at reading Survivor pallet drops then BS is better. Otherwise Enduring is better.
Additionally BS has Synergy with Doc, Freddy and Clown (Survivors drop pallets early against them) while Enduring has Synergy with Nurse and Legion (1 second stun is shorter than their fatigue stuns)
Enduring also Synergies with Spirit Furry for obvious reasons.
If one of theses Synergies are in play you should chose your perk accordingly (assuming you are going for one of these perks)
It's important to note that BS will additionally increase generator break speed saving 0.34 seconds. While this won't help in a chase very often it will reduce patrol times if you are kicking generators.
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@Katzengott said:
As a Pig Main i would also say go for Brutal. Since Enduring got nerfed (from 75% to 50% and doesn't work with DS anymore) i switched to Brutal. It also works on Gens which... well, just feels good but doesn't really make a difference. But if you break a pallet on the right side and/or Survivors are not aware that you have Brutal you can end chases quicker . Just don't break every Pallet (instantly), only the good ones as you don't have enough time.
50% reduced stun is equivalent to +100% stun recovery speed.
Previously Enduring was a +70% stun recover speed.
Thus Enduring was buffed with respect to pallets.
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I use better addons than normal. This is to ensure that I can prevent anyone from escaping and thus denying me sacrafice points, and to improve how many chases I can fit in for other score categories.
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Assuming that you have 4 people asleep, 4 survivors all injured and have 2 hooked all non-obsession Survivors generators will take 145 seconds to be completed by a single Survivor.
That's 65 extra seconds which is roughly a 40% increase.
Note that simply adding up the %'s is a 55% time increase. Debuffs are multaplicative and thus suffer from diminishing returns when separate sources are stacked together.
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Nea was just a distraction. Meg was the real Killer all along.
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@Desolate_Sands said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/807791#Comment_807791
What do you mean the other survivor? Hatch standoffs are a 1v1 situation. I don't think I have ever seen a hatch standoff when there were multiple survivors alive; because the key survivor just jumps into it mid-chase and then the EGC is triggered for everyone else.
Right now, whoever gets to the hatch first wins. If both are standing on the hatch as it opens, the survivor always wins. Personally I think the killer should be the one who wins that situation, especially since that's how it was in the past.
You are saying a hatch standoff will occur if they both are at it at the same time, the killer closes the hatch (triggering NOED and EGC) and then the survivor has to just stand on it with a key because they could get grabbed if he reopens it.
No. Survivor with key finds closed hatch. Killer also finds hatch. Survivor with Key can now just wait at the closed hatch and leave once the Killer leaves. The Killer thus has to stay to prevent the escape.
There is no EGC because the hatch was never closed. It has to be opened first and that hasn't necessarily happened yet.
You don't see hatch standoffs here because they will just jump in due to the lack of a Grab. If there was a grab then there would be a stalemate here due to the Survivor not wanting to jump in while the Killer is there. This would be fine if the Killer had a way to capitalize on the hesitation, but he doesn't.
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@Desolate_Sands said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/807760#Comment_807760
The chances of having the last survivor having a key, and you both running into eachother at the exact same time on the hatch are pretty low. The EGC would also have been triggered so at max it would go on for a few minutes. I also don't believe you can open the hatch while downed so NOED would mop up as well.
Seems like a very niche scenario to be worried about when at the moment the only real counterplay to keys is tunnel the user down hard.
The EGC would not have had to be triggered. It could end up going on for as long as it takes the other Survivor to complete all of the gens and leave on his own assuming they are actually on gens at all (rip solo que), so this speeds things up by skipping all of that and resolving it instantly.
Keys are a problem don't get me wrong, but this change makes sense with them in mind.
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@Desolate_Sands said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/806343#Comment_806343
How can hatch standoff be a thing when killers can close the hatch now? A patch ago if the killer and survivor both stood on top of the hatch at the same time, the killer would always close it first. Now, the survivor will always escape first.
The killer should really be the one who wins if both the killer and survivor meet up at the hatch at the same time. The survivor failed to find it first, failed to remain hidden from the killer, and the killer is supposed to be the more powerful of the two.
If grabs weren't removed then Keys would cause the exact same stalemate the hatch closing mechanic is supposed to prevent.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/807701#Comment_807701
It isn't. You briefly hit a Survivor and get flung out of phase. You don't know where they were and they have a head start. Far more fair then letting Spirit choose when she unphases.
Not really.
It isn't a buff or anything but you'd still get the hit.
You just press M1 the second you get knocked out of phase and you get a hit.
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Taking away hatch grabs means that a Survivor with a Key + a closed hatch isn't a standoff either.
Instead of just sitting there waiting for the Killer to leave the Key just goes through and skips to the part where they escape.
Unintuitively this actually helps the Killer here. Because in the alternative scenario the Killer would end up waiting until any remaining generators were powered before the stalemate is broken that way still with a Survivor win.
This does have downsides in other situations, such as where the Killer and final Survivor are standing on the hatch while the 2nd to last Survivor is in the dying animation on the hook. But otherwise the change makes sense and it helps more than it hurts.
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@FireHazard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/807311#Comment_807311
I guess the challenge doesn't specifically say to stay injured for "This Is Not Happening."
But with a lot of things in this game when it comes to achievements, challenges, dailies... its kind of hyper-specific with some of them...
So idk, it may or may not work I have no idea... i'm just going off of logic with the description but the description might not be as black and white as it appears to be.
Just think of it alrithmically and make sure not to add any conditions not stated by the challenge.
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Maybe. But only for the item dropped from the perk. Not items dropped manually or items sitting in chests.
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/802257#Comment_802257
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/802216#Comment_802216
Before (you said) "they will break (instantly) when they try this thus giving you a free hit"
Then (I said) "What's on my mind is legion's add-on, the pallet will break (after) the vault" (I said it to let you know that my assumptions are wrong)
Now (You said) What do you mean? (It's exactly like legions addon but the Survivor has it).
But considering that even Spirit Furry is considered a free hit, and this doesn't stun the Killer like that perk does, it's even easier to get a hit afterwards.
TLDR it doesn't need a stun because you'll get the hit without it.
So now (you said) pallets will break (after) the Vault?
Is English your first language?
I even used similar wording to the Legion addon:
A glass-like button moulded from The Fog that captures The Legion's likeness. The surface is warm and reverberating with The Entity's power.
During Feral Frenzy:
- Your Terror Radius affects the entire Map.
- Any Pallets you vault are immediately broken.
This effect lasts until the power gauge is depleted.
"The youth consumed by the iridescent glass magnifies and widens the reach of The Entity."
Immediately and instantly are synonyms.
If you have a problem with me saying the pallet is instantly broken after the Survivor vaults it twice then you should have a problem with the Legion addon saying he breaks the pallet immediately when he vaults it. The addon doesn't even specify that the break happens after the vault, but it does because vaulting is the trigger and until he's vaulted the pallet the trigger hasn't happened yet. It's the same thing here.
Take the Syringe for example.
It used to be that once you tap M2 you instantly are healed to full. This is still a sequence however which leads to tricks like how you can tap M2 at the exact same time as being hit and go back to full hp from downed via a self heal
contrast to the new Syringe where you tap M2 but the effect doesn't actually happen until 16 seconds later.
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/802257#Comment_802257
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/802216#Comment_802216
Before (you said) "they will break (instantly) when they try this thus giving you a free hit"
Then (I said) "What's on my mind is legion's add-on, the pallet will break (after) the vault" (I said it to let you know that my assumptions are wrong)
Now (You said) What do you mean? (It's exactly like legions addon but the Survivor has it).
But considering that even Spirit Furry is considered a free hit, and this doesn't stun the Killer like that perk does, it's even easier to get a hit afterwards.
TLDR it doesn't need a stun because you'll get the hit without it.
So now (you said) pallets will break (after) the Vault?
Is English your first language?
English is my first language.
Where is the nitpick comeing from? You brought up a stun I never mentioned. I'm saying there is no stun because there is no reason for there to be one.
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Nah. You also need to get away from the window after vaulting it.
The Killer isn't a trex. They can reach through a window opening.
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@humanbeing1704 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/805926#Comment_805926
Well I mean your just back to square one if They use unbreakable
Not quite because they don't have unbreakable anymore, and are still injured, and are still in the rough location you last placed them.
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@humanbeing1704 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/805867#Comment_805867
sometimes thats not advisable they may have unbreakable
Even if they have unbreakable I'd still recommend it.
Killing them gives them the hatch.
It's easier to slug 2 Survivors with no hatch than to down 1 Survivor with a hatch.
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Slug and ignore salty Survivors that tell you not to.
It's the tactically optimal thing to do
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@SteelDragon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/804630#Comment_804630
from what I hear they are not a bug, they used to glow a lot more after her release but then was changed, also her hair resets its animation when she phases, yes some skins hide the hair detail but there is always glass shards on her to see, some skins hide it yes but don't forget blendete exists still so using cosmetics to ones advantage is not unheard of in this game
I'm saying I'd prefer to plan as if they are going to use a cosmetic to their advantage so that if and when they do I'm not screwed due to relying on info that I now don't have.
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@hiC said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/803941#Comment_803941
So if you make the wrong read you take a hit, right? Please tell me how it makes any difference when I substitute the word ‘guess’ for the word ‘read’.
Human beings are often predictable in situations where they don't have to be. This game is one of them.
Basically people are incapable of acting randomly, and when they try it's fairly simple to tell the difference between their attempt and actual randomness.
If a Computer were using the Spirit and chased you then they would catch you exactly half the time at each mindgame attempt no matter what. But since Humans are not computers this isn't the case.
It's the difference between flipping a coin and someone putting down a coin on a specific side.
Either way you statistically have 50/50 odds of saying the right side. However if the person is deliberately chosing which side is face up then it's possible to develop a pattern of when each side will be up based on which sides have been up on previous attempts.
In dead by daylight you can do even better, since each action each player could take also has advantages beyond the mindgame itself, this makes each player biased towards specific options before predictability is taken into account making it even easier to make a prediction.
So in the pallet juke I just defined, the Spirit has given me 0 information, yet I'm still highly likely to have predicted them successfully because I've made the option I want them to take seem artificially optimal.
The only reason I can't keep doing it is because a good Spirit will just wait for me longer the next time to catch the juke. But now I know I can just keep running and not take a hit since they'll expect a juke.
After that a prediction is harder since they know I'm willing to mix it up, but considering that both of those jukes should work on nearly every Spirit at any sufficiently long loop that's already really good.
There are a bunch of other jukes that are more situational, but the point is that you are looking for information in the wrong place if you are expecting the game to just tell you what she's doing.
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@SteelDragon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/804022#Comment_804022
don't forget that in my post I said that I look at the details to know when she is phasing, so there is no fake out mindgame that happens
Considering that those are likely a bug and they don't work on some skins I'd not use that. You might get a falsely think you know something you don't and make a mistake.
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Also with this nerf in order to use it with tombstone (which is also nerfed here) You'd need to get literally all of everyones evil.
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You'd like this suggestion:
@NuclearBurrito said:
First off I want to start by saying that I've never like the idea of Killer's or Survivor's SOMETIMES being way stronger than other times, and that there should be some baseline powerlevel that they can consistently have no problem which is then balanced around. It's ok to have a bit of a progression requirement to get to that point but I've never like the idea of something being balanced around the idea of "oh this one thing is super strong but can only be used in one match so it's fine".
Thus addons and items throw the game completely out of balance, since you can't balance around 4 Survivors with items and 4 Survivors without items at the same time, let alone basekit Killers vs Killers with their best addons and Survivors with their best addons on those items and also Mori's because why not.
Since it's impractical to expect high level addons to only be used against opponents using those same addons, balance is not maintained and no matter what everything is thrown out of whack.
Thus the primary change is this:
Make all items and addons not consumables. You always keep them after every match no matter what so long as you got them from the bloodweb (not chest items). Offerings stay the same as they don't generally provide a major benefit and just alter the games RNG instead although Mori's should be completely removed.
The bloodweb would be altered to be MUCH smaller per web compared to now, however besides offerings all prices would be significantly increased to compensate.
As for the specific addon and item effects they would be altered so higher rarity means the effects are more extreme but with a drawback of some sort. Higher rarity means bigger effect and a bigger drawback.
Now to list out what I'd specifically suggest for each item/addon:
Medkits
- Camping Aid Kit - Moderately increases healing speed. Unlocks the self heal option (24 charges)
Note: This means self heal speed is increased too.
- First Aid Kit - Considerably increases the speed you heal others. Unlocks the self heal option (24 charges)
- Emergency Med-Kit - Slightly increases the speed you heal others. Unlocks the self heal option. (32 charges)
- Ranger Med-Kit - Tremendously increase the speed you heal others. Moderately increases Skill Check success zones. Moderately increases Skill Check bonus zones. (32 charges)
Note: No self heal option with the Ranger's medkit.
Addons
- Rubber Gloves - Moderately decreases the Healing Skill Check difficulty. Moderately increases the Skill Check bonus zones.
- Butterfly Tape - Slightly increases the Healing speed
- Bandages - Adds 8 charges to the Med-Kit
- Sponge - You don't get skill checks while healing. Overrides other addons.
- Self Adherent Wrap - Moderately increase healing efficiency when healing another Survivor and slightly increase healing speed when healing another Survivor. (not yourself)
- Needle & Thread - Moderately increase the chance to trigger a skill check. Moderately reduces skill check success zones.
- Medical Scissors - Moderately increase Healing speed. Decrease med-kit charges by 8.
- Gauze Roll - Add 12 charges to the Medkit. Slightly reduce healing speed.
- Surgical Suture - Considerably increase the chance to trigger a skill check. Considerably reduces skill check success zones.
- Gel Dressings - Add 16 charges to the Medkit. Moderately reduce healing speed.
- Abdominal Dressing - Considerably increases the healing speed. Decrease med-kit charges by 12.
- Styptic Agent - Using the secondary action button will cause you to consume this addon as well as 16 medkit charges and gain Endurance for 8 seconds during which time you glow (the visual effect when you are hit with endurance but the entire time). If you are hit during this time you will gain 20 seconds of the Deep Wounds status effect. Overrides normal healing with the medkit until used.
- Anti-Haemorrhagic Syringe - Using the secondary action button will consume this medkit and automatically heal the target up to 1 health state at the normal healing rate. This requires 32 charges to use and overrides normally healing with the medkit.
Note: Unlike with Second Wind taking damage does not interrupt the automatic healing. However it will reset the healing and picking up the Survivor WILL stop the heal.
Toolboxes
- Worn Out Tools - Moderately increases repair speed. Slightly decreases Skill Check odds. Unlocks the Sabotage action (120 charges)
- Toolbox - Moderately increases repair speed. Unlocks the Sabotage Action (130 charges)
- Mechanics Toolbox - Considerably increases repair speed. Considerably decreases Sabotage speed. Unlocks the Sabotage action. You cannot hit great skill checks. (80 charges)
- Commodious Toolbox - Slightly increases repair speed. Unlocks the Sabotage action. (160)
- Engineers Toolbox - Moderately increases repair speed. Slightly increases repair speed further if the generator is less than 50% complete. (80 charges)
- Alex's Toolbox - Slightly increases repair speed. Tremendously increases Sabotage speed. Sabotaging does not consume charges. Unlocks the Sabotage action. (110 charges)
Addons
- Spring Clamp - Moderately decreases the repair Skill Check difficulty. Moderately increases the Skill Check bonus zones.
- Scraps - Adds 15 charges to the Toolbox
- Clean Rag - Slightly increases the Toolbox's repair speed
- Wire Spool - Adds 30 charges to the Toolbox. Slightly decreases the Toolbox's repair speed
- Socket Swivels - Moderately increases the Toolbox repair speed. Remove 15 charges from the Toolbox
- Protective Gloves - Moderately increases the chances to trigger a sabotage Skill Check. Moderately increases sabotage Skill Check success zones. Considerably reduces the sabotage Skill Check failed penalty
- Instructions - Moderately increases the Toolbox's Sabotage efficiency
- Grip Wrench - Moderately increase the chance to trigger a repair skill check. Moderately reduces repair skill check success zones.
- Cutting Wire - Sabotaging a hook does not produce an audio cue
- Hacksaw - Moderately increases Sabotage Speed
- Brand New Part - remove 30 charges from the Toolbox. When you start to repair a generator with a Toolbox consume this addon. You will repair the generator by 15% over 10 seconds. During that time you will receive 2 difficult skill checks. Hitting each Skill Check will result in 5 % progression each for a maximum of 25 % added progression.
Flashlights
- Flashlight - You may blind the Killer. (8 charges)
- Sport Flashlight - You may blind the Killer. Slightly reduces blindness duration and blinding speed.(12 charges)
- Utility Flashlight - You may blind the Killer. Moderately increases blindness duration and blinding speed. Slightly decrease blinding range. (6 charges)
Addons
- Wide Lens - Moderately increases the Flashlight Beam's width
- Power Bulb - Slightly increases the Blindness duration
- Leather Grip - Slightly increases the Flashlight Beam's range
- Battery - Adds 2 charges to the Flashlight
- Focus Lens - Slightly increase Blinding speed
- TIR Optic - Moderately increases the Blindness duration. Reduces Flashlight charges by 2
- Rubber Grip - Moderately increases the Flashlight Beam's range. Slightly decreases Blindness duration
- Low Amp Filament - The Killer does not see the Light beam (he may still be blinded by it). The Flashlight activation sound is muffled
- Heavy Duty Battery - Adds 4 charges to the Flashlight. Slightly decrease Blinding speed
- Long Life Battery - Adds 6 seconds of use to a standard Flashlight. Moderately decrease Blinding speed.
- Intense Halogen - Considerably increases the Blindness duration. Reduces Flashlight charges by 4
- High-End Sapphire Lens - Moderately increase Blinding speed. Moderately reduces the Flashlight Beam's range
- Odd Bulb - Each time you successfully blind the Killer slightly increase the Blinding duration of future blinds. Slightly decreases the initial Blinding duration.
Maps
- Detailed Map - Start with 1 Generator and 1 Exit gate Marked. Unlocks ability to track Generators, Hooks and Exit gates within a range of 16 meters. (20 charges)
- Rainbow map - Start with 3 random items marked. Unlocks ability to track Generators, Hooks and Exit gates within a range of 8 meters. (40 charges)
Addons
- Map Addendum - Start with 2 additional random items marked
- Yellow Wire - The map also tracks items in range of other Survivors
- Unusual Stamp - Increases the map range by 8 meters
- Retardant Jelly - Gain 5 additional charges
- Red Twine - Unlocks the ability to track Killer Belongings
- Glass Bead - Unlocks the Marker Ability on secondary action creating a marker that can be seen by all the Survivors.
- Odd Stamp - Increases the map range by 12 meters and reduces it's charges by 4
- Black Silk Cord - Unlocks the ability to track the hatch
- Crystal Bead - Every Survivor sees the Aura generated by the map when the owner activates it. Decreases map range by 50% and the map starts with 1 less item tracked.
Keys
- Broken Key - Reveals your aura to Survivors within 32 meters. (30 charges)
- Dull Key - Reveals Survivor auras within 32 meters (30 charges)
- Skeleton Key - Reveals the Killers aura within 24 meters (30 charges)
Addons
- Prayer Rope - Adds 10 charges to the Key
- Scratched Pearl - Increase the range by 4 meters
- Prayer Beads - Adds 15 charges to the key. Reduces the range by 4 meters.
- Eroded Token - You may channel the key while preforming other actions.
- Gold Token - Revealing a players aura also reveals any auras they can see
- Weaved Ring - Decreases channel time by 0.5 seconds
- Blood Amber - Revealing a players aura also reveals other player aura's within 8 meters of them.
- Unique Wedding Ring - You may see the obsessions Aura during the entire trial. Decreases your odds of being the obsession. Reduces the keys range by 8 meters.
- Milky Glass - You may open a closed hatch. Makes the Key brightly glow at all times. Shatters if you are ever downed, destroying the addon.
Basically: The addon/item system is inherently unbalanced.
This is because of the disconnect you are trying to point out (and are generalizing to conclude Killers as a whole are OP) regarding Killers with red addons vs Killers with no addons or low tier addons.
The solution is to make addons/items not consumables and re-balance them accordingly, the specifics are in the link including that would need to be done to successfully re-balance the various items/addons.
For tuft of hair specifically the suggestion is to reduce the amount of evil each Survivor has by 25% in addition to it's current effects.
This means all 4 Survivors have 30 evil between them out of a required total of 20 needed to get to tier 3. This means he'd need 2.6 Survivors worth of stalk, so even if 2 Survivors are deliberately giving him as much stalk as possible he'd still need another 5 evil in order to actually reach tier 3.
Do remember that without unlimited Tier 3 it's possible to use Tier 2 to get closer than normal to Survivors with the lower TR and then pop T3 to get the down in record time. With unlimited T3 this trick can only be used once, hence why further downsides are unneeded.
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@SteelDragon said:
she doesn't need a nerf, here is HOW YOU COUNTER SPIRIT, LOOP HER LIKE A M2 KILLER NOT A M1 killer. notice when she is phasing THERE IS TELLS, when she is phasing at a loop with the pallet down JUST WALK AWAY. I can NOT tell you how many times I have juked and out played spirit by just walking away, not running WALKING until she is out of phase and notices you have walked away, not only have you
1 gained distance on the spirit
2 spirits power is on CD and can not be used to catch up to you
3 that pallet is still there for you or other to use later
4 you gain more distance that a regular killer because out side of her power spirit is still a 110% movement speed killer so she will be SLOW to catch up giving you ample time to get to another loop and repeat
those who loop her like a M1 killer will get dominated, destroyed, and killed then they will complain instead of adapting, they use the same strategy against 90% of the killer roster but it doesn't work against spirit and survivors cant adjust so they complain instead
I've found that method is too inconsistent. If they were faking the phase they can just see where you are walking and phase there with certainty of where you went making it a 50/50. You can get better odds than that.
The most consistent way I've found to juke the Spirit at a pallet after dropping it is:
Step 1 - Run directly away from the pallet
Step 2 - After about 2 seconds of running double back and vault the pallet. Veer off to one side slightly when doubling back
Step 3 - IMMEDIATELY slow vault back
Step 4 - Run away for a bit again
Step 5 - Walk out of LoS
The exact timing depends on the length of the loop
From the Spirit's PoV:
1: She sees you running. This forces her to make a snap decision so she can't stand still and wait for you to make your move. She will almost always phase.
2: By the time she actually gets around the loop you'll be at the pallet again and can vault it
3: Since she heard you vault the pallet she'll double back around to that side of the pallet
4: By the time she gets there you'll have gotten back to the other side of the pallet. Since she thinks you are still at the other side of the pallet AND that the scratchmarks you are now running over to reach a hiding spot were from your initial juke, that gives you a good chance of losing her entirely
Do note that this won't work more than maybe twice against a decent Spirit, so be sure to switch it up throughout a match. But that kind of thing is a personal favorite of mine since it doesn't fall victim to the normal 50/50 at pallet loops.
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@thrawn3054 said:
This is the most ridiculous concern/thread I've read in a while. I needed those laughs. Thank you all.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/803446#Comment_803446
But what happens when he hits tier 3?
Death by snusnu
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/802216#Comment_802216
What's on my mind is legion's add-on, the pallet will break after the vault. ...
ok now i understand, you should put a description of the survivor will get stunned when it breaks
What do you mean? It's exactly like legions addon but the Survivor has it.
But considering that even Spirit Furry is considered a free hit, and this doesn't stun the Killer like that perk does, it's even easier to get a hit afterwards.
TLDR it doesn't need a stun because you'll get the hit without it.
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/802162#Comment_802162
Everything can be balanced
Correct. The thing that caused me to drop the idea was that doing so lead to other non-balance issues since there was no decisive niche to what he does. Just being kinda good at everything while technically balanced isn't the most interesting, so I came up with this instead.
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/802164#Comment_802164
OP: it would be mark of the beast perk
The other 2 perks are lacklusters
Power: the numbers needs adjustments (especially the human form M/S supposed to be balance with TR)
I really do think you are underestimating the decay perk.
It's extremely common where you'd be chasing a Survivor around a Pallet, and they can just vault the pallet repeatedly to force you to break the pallet wasting a ton of time.
This causes the pallet to just break instantly when they try this thus giving you a free hit and forcing them to leave future pallet loops until the Hex is broken saving you even more time.
As for Mark of the Beast I can make it a scream like Infectious Fright.
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Can someone test to see if the edge of the screen actually does allow for stalking or not? Because I'm pretty sure it does but don't have either Myers or Ghostface so I can't test it.
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@TAG said:
Remember, 85% of all percentages are made up by the person stating it.
92% actually.
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Real quick:
Do you think this is OP, UP or balanced with non-balance issues?
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/802030#Comment_802030
It will cost money if you get the looks of the movie's werewolf and put it in dbd (for example twilight) so i stick with the mythological werewolf
I think we should just let clown have the slow effect on power we should just give werewolf a different effect
I do want to try to make the slow work.
If it turns out to be absolutely necessary then sure but a slowdown has all of the properties I want in the effect.
Specifically it's impactful enough that Survivors would want to purify it, assists in a chase thus making up for the time it takes to apply it and it doesn't give information to the wolf.
I explicitly don't want him to have a tracking ability, since if a Killer is fast and good in a chase like this Killer is then the best counter is stealth. Thus you need to be able to hide, hence why I didn't give him a smelling ability.
Trust me I did consider it, but it just leads to the issue of being unable to hide OR run, at which point balancing everything out just leads to the entire kit being underwhelming even if technically balanced.
As for causing fear I'd argue that the tether mechanic qualifies due to it's interaction with the terror radius, how when stacked it becomes extremely deadly and also the howl giving him a presence much like the demogorgon in terms of atmosphere. (which wasn't announced when I made this suggestion btw).
In any case for now I can make base form 16 meters.
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@DeathEscape said:
I think this will be unbalance as you can stealth walk around on human form hit them then go on full wolf form mowing everyone with the 120% mobility, having 120 mobility and with that 5% slow would be too much.
Mark of the beast- this is too much over the top of revealing effect because it had no expiration after you hit them and applying the effect
I think it will be good if you work more on this idea
Of course! Balance takes time and I'd love to hear suggestions.
Base form is a bit tricky.
On one hand he isn't supposed to be a stealth Killer, hence his TR being such that M&A doesn't quite reduce it to 0. But on the other hand you need to be able to get hits as him. Hence having a significantly reduced TR at all.
I could just make base form 115%, but then it would be too easy and wouldn't justify the slow.
In certain I can make it work, but I need to get the Numbers right.
Also I've been brainstorming a downside to the wolf form. Note that I don't want an additional limitation, just a downside.
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If they didn't need a license for the Hillbilly then I can't see them needing a license for this either.
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/801989#Comment_801989
If you are getting ideas on movies and other games, then it will cause BHVR lots of Money because of licensing because if not it will be illegal
It's lose enough that it shouldn't be an issue. No one has the rights to Werewolves or the idea of it being a sickness, and since I'm not drawing from a specific portrayal, just loosely drawing from a common type of portrayal, that's not an issue either
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/801965#Comment_801965
Then leaving it unattended will kill the survivors or turn them to a ally werewolf (50/50) and not slow them
Yes but balance. I'm taking liberties.
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/801965#Comment_801965
Where did you even read that?
It's a thing in TV and some games.
Not everything portrays them like that of course, but trust me it's a thing.
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/801902#Comment_801902
Lycanthropy- the supernatural transformation of a person into a wolf, as recounted in folk tales and myth lycanthropy is a supernatural condition in which men actually assume the physical form of werewolves
It is not a sickness that makes humans slower or weaker its the opposite
That's the definition. But it's often portrayed as a sickness with the transformation being a symptom for those that Survive.
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@NuclearBurrito said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/680564#Comment_680564
I would like to point out that it's the duration that is what is scaling and not the speed.
Meaning that no matter how many times the Killer is stunned this perk will still only grant a 2.5% speed increase, which IS a big deal when once it gets going but is still small enough that the amount of tokens it needs in order to be problematic is large enough that a cap just seems unnecessary.
This one references the pallet breaking perk.
@NuclearBurrito said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/682430#Comment_682430
Base speed IS 4.8 for beast form.
Also that doesn't even make a whole lot of sense. It would just needlessly promote switching back and forth between forms and requires a lot of otherwise unnecessary nerfs in order to make it work without loopholes.
Again wanting nerfs to counterbalance the speed is fine but in this specific instance I'm going to insist that whatever it is be a drawback rather than a limitation.
Movement speed
@yandere777 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/86698/killer-idea-the-wolf
Why even play in your base form? From what you said a tainted survivor needs to purify so why taint them in the first place. You spawn in, go wolf boi, now you are 120% and there is no way for survivors to do ######### to you because you are 20% faster. In a different perspective, you are always in bloodlust 1. If you can switch between modes with no time limit i feel you need more ways of being kicked out of the mode. Getting stunned by pallets could be a good way to boop you out. Maybe breaking pallets too but that just seems overkill. I agree with an earlier idea of slower vault speeds but i dont think disabling his vault is where its at. If you cant vault while in beast mode then now you are forced to play shacks with bloodlust.
But back to my main point. Base form is actualy useless because it gives survivors the ability to kick you out of your power for what? 3 maybe 4 seconds. Thats really not worth it, maybe if there were a cooldown placed after being forced out than it'll be more worth it. Cool concept but there are a ton of unnecessary things. The howl for transforming sounds cool but it can also be used to spam it so it can be annoying. Same for that clown effect you wanna add onto survivors.
If you say being tethered is the benefit to being tainted, even that isnt worth it. It'll just make chases even more brain dead. You move at 120 while the poor Dwight you are chasing is now moving at 95 because you managed a cheap early hit with your 12 meter tr, which was reduced to 4 meters due to m&a. At that point it's bloodlust 2. His chases are very boring and unfun. Might as well face old legion with franks and deep wounds study.
Also, the way you have it worded means you can only cleanse while tainted but being tainted and tethered are two different things. So you cant even cleanse inside his tr, which can be increased by 25% with distressing and by another 8 while in chase with m&a. You effectively have a dumber tr than impossible skill check doc.
Being tainted is a death sentence but at the same its stupidly easy to get tainted again after the first cleanse.
I'm not trying to be disrespectful but i wanted to give you my critical feed back on your killer idea. I do hope you'll respond because I'm open to a discussion and helping to flesh out this idea
Howl and a bunch of other stuff.
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/801880#Comment_801880
That won't change a thing you still edited yours and copied some of my idea
Read the other comments.
Note how they reference the howl, movement speed, perks ect and were all made before you made your post.
That should serve as proof I didn't copy.
For all I know you copied me. You don't see me accusing YOU of plajorizm now do you?
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@DeathEscape said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/801880#Comment_801880
That won't change a thing you still edited yours and copied some of my idea
The edit I made yesterday was to rework an addon that I noticed didn't do anything.
Specifically one of the ultra rares said that hooking a Survivor wouldn't remove taint. However I had previously removed that as a mechanic in the first place so the addon did nothing. So I reworked it to remove the howl instead
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And as for your question about Taint.
lycanthropy is often seen as a sickness which the wolf spreads, and so being near the wolf is itself harmful.
Now for balance reasons and to give the base form a function it's the base form that applies the status itself. But that's what gave me the idea and is part of why it's the wolf form that actually applies the debuffs associated with it.
There was also a draft where the wolf would be able to track tainted Survivors in wolf form. But I was having trouble balancing it so I went with this instead.
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@DeathEscape said:
Can you explain what is the Taint in the Myth of Werewolves?
2 of the perks are lackluster compared to the existing perks
Hex:Decay:Simply Breaking the pallets is better or use Brutal Strength for better performance, its already bad, survivor breaking the hex totem will make it useless knowing that its already bad they might not even break it.(Seriously why 1 hex totem only?)
Growing Rage:its mobility increase is not good,you even lose a token if you hook and overall Play with Your Food is lot better like heaven and earth
Mark of the beast:so this mark is Permanent this will put a lot of pressure on the survivors with the werewolf's 120 mobility because its permanent after the hit and it also reveals their location just by doing almost anything. (this will greatly benefit nurse,spirit and especially hillbilly to the point that everyone will quit being a survivor)
You Reconstructed My Killer idea, Copied my 120% mobility idea and 40 metres TR, reconstructed my howl alarm idea and break action move speed perk idea and you did not credit Me and @Carlosylu before creating this
Have you heard of Plagiarism?
Plagiarism: the act of using another person's words or ideas without giving credit to that person : the act of plagiarizing something
Read when this post was made.
This was made long before you made your Killer idea.
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Seeing a lot of werewolf Killers lately. I guess it's fitting considering the time of year.
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I don't get you people.
The advantage of a 120% Killer is that
A: You can mindgame/brute force loops that are normally too long to do so
B: You catch up to Survivors faster in a straight line, thus also reducing how many loops the Survivor could possibly reach to further extend the chase
C: Patrol times are reduced.
Remember, this Killer will end chases at LEAST 33% faster than a 115% Killer in the same situation.
For example given a 10 meter head start and no loop:
115% = 16.67 second chase
120% = 12.5 second chase
That means for a 115% Killer the Survivor can reach a loop within a 66.67 meter radius, while against the 120% Killer that drops down to a 50 meter radius. Given the way area's work that means you can prevent a Survivor from reaching a loop with a significantly smaller deadzone compared to a 115% Killer.
You also find them faster due to reaching them faster while patrolling and when they do reach a loop you will force them to drop the pallet faster and will be able to break less pallets due to being able to get a hit at loops on more pallets saving more time ect ect ect.
This is why 110% Killers are so bad at looping and almost always have movement based abilities. The 5% MS difference is a huge deal.
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For anyone wondering. Yes this is in the patch notes, it's listed as a bug fix.