Nos37
Nos37
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This mode needs Pyramid Head's Cage of Attonement treatment for hooks.
Once a survivor has been hooked, teleport them to a different hook somewhere else on the map. Prevent the killer from seeing the hook's aura so they just can't go and camp the new hook or get a head start on tunneling (they have to wait for the unhook noise notification to know where to go and then make their way over if they want to tunnel)
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3644810#Comment_3644810
You said another survivor kites them to you, meaning the the killer is chasing them, then you said once the killer starts chasing you the other survivor doesn't take over your gen, meaning you were working on a gen. Nothing about that situation is being tunneled.
I see how my wording made it sound like that. I meant that the killer proceeds to tunnel me after I've been caught. Fixed it.
"In my solo q experience, that 1 survivor being chased kites the killer into me, the killer almost always switches to me, the previously chased survivor runs off to look for heals instead of taking over my gen, and I end up getting tunneled out of the match from that point on (either because I looped too long and the killer's ego was hurt, or I didn't loop long enough and am seen as the weak link)."
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@fussy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3644784#Comment_3644784
If killer want to tunnel hard, Distortion does nothing, because it's happening right off hook. How do you imagine "Oh, i will use my BBQ/NTH to tunnel this person out" situation? It's true in UW-CS situation, but not in Distortion.
Distortion does not stop you from getting tunneled once caught. It helps prevent you from being caught in the first place.
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3644782#Comment_3644782
If the killer finds you on a gen and has been chasing another survivor, you weren't being tunneled.
That's not what I said in my post.
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Double-edged sword.
The killer cannot tunnel survivors who they cannot find, so some players will run Distortion and Calm Spirit to avoid being caught in the first place and subsequently at risk of being tunneled afterwards.
However, that leaves the survivors without those perks to be tunneled.
The real problem is that the killer can and will tunnel someone either way.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3644715#Comment_3644715
Tunneling at 5 gens is blaming the killer for something that is the fault of the survivors. If the killer is chasing 1 survivor, you have 3 survivors who can work on gens. Assuming relatively equal skill on the killer and survivors, survivors should have at least 1 gen done by the time the killer gets the first hook.
So if the killer is capable of tunneling out a survivor without any gens getting done, the survivors messed up.
In my solo q experience, that 1 survivor being chased kites the killer into me, the killer almost always switches to me, the previously chased survivor runs off to look for heals instead of taking over my gen, and I end up getting tunneled out of the match from that point on (either because I looped too long and the killer's ego was hurt, or I didn't loop long enough and am seen as the weak link).
This has reinforced my stealthy selfish playstyle. The killer can't tunnel me if I don't get found in the first place.
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The very next match was ANOTHER 5-gen chase where I only got 1 hook.
Onryo has NOTHING for chase!
Why teleport away and chase someone else IF SHE CANNOT GET ANY DOWNS??
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I liked the idea I heard from another user a while ago.
Survivors could pick themselves up off the ground as often as they'd like, BUT they could only fully recover if they were right next to a functional hook. This meant that survivors couldn't just run to a corner of the map with no hooks around to force a slug, recover, and then hop back onto gens.
There may be issues with edge cases like going down in the corner anyway and then using Tenacity to get to a hook when the killer leaves. I don't remember everything about their idea. I'll try to search it up.
Edit: Found it
@AssortedSorting said:
The Dying state gives a feeling of helplessness. Appropriate, given the Killer "got you".
Only being able to be picked up by another Survivor is also appropriate, given that one of the Survivor themes is that through cooperation, a stronger foe can be overcome.
Slugging (Keeping a Survivor in the Dying state) itself isn't always an issue either. Such as instances where the Killer slugs a Survivor in order to chase another nearby Survivor that could be trying to setup a save.
While that fits thematically... This is a game, and the experience of all players should be considered.
Where it becomes an issue is when a Survivor is left as a slug for an extended amount of time, be it through The Killer properly zoning them (leveraging meta-knowledge that the slugged Survivor cannot pick themselves up), Aura suppression of some form (EG: Blindness), Survivors simply being clueless, The Killer quite literally forgetting where they left the Survivor, or the chase with the other Survivor taking far too long. While this does work in the Killers favor, the experience is unengaging.
So how do you go about addressing excessive slugging?
BHVR suggested that base-Unbreakable could be an option.
In my opinion, that would conflict with existing systems regarding recovery speed. While it is simple, it promotes more sit and hold a button gameplay. Nor does it introduce any new gameplay considerations from a tactical perspective (that weren't there before). While this does introduce synergy with crawl-speed Perks by allowing the Survivor to crawl elsewhere and pick themselves up, that nerfs temporary slugging. It also fails to take into consideration sabo-squads or unfortunate hook spawns creating dead-zones where the Killer is unable to reach a Hook at all before a Survivor wiggles off, requiring a Bleedout.
My suggestion would be the following:
Counter-Slugging
Survivors can get themselves up to their feet over 32s with a "Persist" Action at an unoccupied Hook.
This Action takes 32s, the Survivor can be interrupted, and if interrupted, or stopping the Action, the Survivor becomes Incapacitated for 8s. (This prevents the Survivor from attempting "Persist" spam if under hook while the Killer is nearby).
An unoccupied Hook is a Hook that is not Destroyed or that has a Survivor Hooked on it.
While attempting to "Persist", the Hook will rattle and creek occasionally, similar to the purposes of Gen Repair sounds.
With the above, the Survivor has more options available to them if the Killer leaves them to chase someone else. If they're left slugged near a Hook, they will likely get back up fairly quickly. They're not able to get up without being near an undamaged Hook, so this should restrict its usefulness against sabo-squads. The Killer will have a rough idea of where a Survivor is if they leave them slugged, or they won't if Survivors cooperate and pick up the slugged Survivor elsewhere. The lengthy self-pickup time itself also means that unless the Survivor gets slugged right under Hook, it's a commitment to try and go for a Self-pickup over Recovery. While it is more hold a button gameplay... it's an ever-present choice between options, instead of just Recover. It's also a distinct system from Recovery and would be independent of any Recovery Perks/Balances.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3637471#Comment_3637471
This is more a reason to buff visionary than it is to nerf deja vu.
The devs said they were only temporarily buffing Deja Vu until 3-gen scenarios were under better control.
Then again, they said that Bloodlust was only a temporary band-aid.
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Right now I'm running Deja Vu, Kindred, Bond, and Open Handed. I thought about swapping Deja Vu for Visionary so I can see all the gens and get more value from Open Handed, but why should I use Visionary?
It does not give me a repair boost, I have to manually judge gen proximity to find the critical gens, and it disables briefly each time a gen is completed. Deja Vu completely overshadows it.
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Leaving through the hatch is not an escape. It counts as a draw.
Endgame perks that activate when the hatch is closed should ALSO be proportional to gens completed. NOED punishes survivors who do 5 gens but not all 5 totems. Therefore, NOED should only activate briefly if the survivors did not complete all 5 gens and the hatch was closed.
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There are not enough buttons on the controller for more emotes. They would have to replace the emotes with emote wheels.
---- That said...
SWF survivors on comms can say "I'm behind you, stop so I can heal you." Solo survivors without comms cannot; they must have a flashlight equipped and click it to get the injured survivor's attention.
That's why they should add audio effects to the emotes.
- Beckon plays a "psst" sound
- Point plays a "shhh"
- The killer cannot hear these
- Survivors can spam the emotes, but the sounds will only play one time (5 second cooldown)
Should be easy to implement across all the survivors since the sounds are universal, regardless of gender or nationality.
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No ADS time, but a longer reload time / heavier movespeed penalty when reloading?
With a more penalizing reload, the Deathslinger could also be allowed to move at 115% movespeed instead of 110% while his weapon is empty.
I enjoy playing Deathslinger, but if I get tired of missing shots or being denied reels and hits and just want to play him as an M1 killer, I'm out of luck (since he's too slow) and may as well camp the exit gate in defeat.
Trickster got a movespeed buff... (and he doesn't need to be out of knives either).
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"First one is basically free" Just ONE, really?
When I play killer, my first 3 gens are free. I can only chase 1 survivor at a time, that survivor has all the map resources to use, and changing targets does nothing when the person I stopped chasing takes their place on the gen.
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Recently, I've been playing Skull Merchant without placing any drones or kicking any gens.
Some survivors still disconnect at the sight of her / hear her terror radius.
Others refuse to progress the game at all and just hide for hatch, even after I 2-hooked everyone and dropped any death-hook survivors that I downed at the foot of a hook instead of sacrificing them.
Some even come up to me willingly so I can let them go next.
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Your proposed changes would make Distortion weaker for mid-mmr survivors who rely on stealth and need the help, and make Object of Obsession easier for high-mmr survivors who already excel at being chased and don't need any help?
These changes would put me in perma-low-mmr hell, and I'd have to spend more time hiding in lockers. 😔
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If this were tested in a Public Test Build, the requirement for disabling it would have to be more than just 3 gens completed. It would also need a time requirement as well; say... 240 seconds.
Otherwise, there's nothing stopping a coordinated group from getting 5 gens to 99% without completing more than 3. They keep the killer stalled by purposfully getting tunneled or bodyblocking for others. The gens can only be regressed so many times, so they will eventually be stuck at 99% and the killer can do nothing about it. When everyone's in a good spot they pop all 5 gens back to back.
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Is this a bug?
In the lobby, it does look like a flap of material is pulled up and pinned to her waist, but I recorded a clip of her walking in the post-match screen and that flap isn't even there; her skirt looks like it was cut/designed that way. 🤷♂️
Nos37 playing Dead by Daylight. View more Xbox clips at GameClips.io -
Lady Dimitrescu.
Her killer power, Dragon's Claw, is an extended lunge attack (with retractable claws) over pallets and windows using a rock/paper/scissors interaction with the survivor. (While charging the extended lunge, the killer determines whether to swing ahead and down, to the right, or to the left. All 3 will hit a survivor that has made no distance after vaulting; otheriwse, only the input matching the direction the survivor ran will hit.)
After putting the obsession into the dying state, she can choose to summon her daughters to hook the obsession for her. They whisk the survivor away to the basement and hook them there. This ability goes on cooldown after the obsession is unhooked or the killer changes the obsession.
---- Perks:
Filthy Wretches - Survivors succeeding a great skill check while repairing grants you a token, up to 10. Whenever you put a survivor into the dying state with a basic attack, all generators at least 40/36/32 meters away explode and instantly lose 2% of progress per token. All tokens are spent in the process.
Hex: Manthing - Chasing non-obsession survivors applies oblivious to the obsession. Injuring a non-obsession reduces the obsession's repair speed briefly. Putting a non-obsession into the dying state makes the obsession scream and reveal their position. When this hex is cleansed, the obsession is exposed for 40/50/60 seconds.
Limb from Limb - Injured survivors who fall from a great height suffer from the mangled and haemorrhage status effects and produce louder grunts of pain for 40/50/60 seconds.
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So a 5th health state?
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@ProHillbillyMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/399338/bug-tech
???
Hug bug on Blight not fixed since 2 and half years.
Oni exploit going over 90 degree hard cap on flick, not fixed for 3 and half years.
Where is it patched?
Exactly their point.
You aren't calling these techs, you are calling them bugs and exploits.
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May I suggest Ultimate Weapon as your 4th perk?
It helps you find that 1 specific survivor you're looking for to get those last 1 or 2 No Way Out Tokens and/or find the Obsession, assuming they don't have Calm Spirit.
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Generally, if an unintended feature doesn't negatively affect survivors, it's called a "tech" and left in the game.
If it does negatively affect survivors, it's called a bug or exploit and is swiftly fixed/removed.
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How often do we see killer killswitched? If you main or enjoy playing that killer, you're stuck struggling to find a replacement or just waiting it out.
Oh, but when female survivors have a distinct advantage over male survivors (or vice versa), female survivors are not killswitched, even though survivors are just skins and players still have half the roster of survivors to choose from.
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"Why is no one complaining about survivors tunneling gens?"
Generators cannot post on the forums, otherwise there would be many complaints.
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The Skull Merchant and Singularity's ability to remove and immediately replace a disabled drone/biopod makes their 3-gen stronger.
That, and it feels like a slap in the face and a waste of time/effort/energy for the survivors who bother disabling them.
Maybe leave the disabled drone/biopod in its place for some period of time before the killer can remove and replace it?
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Upvote.
When there's no mori offering I get left on the hook to die, even when I desperately hang on to try and stay in the match.
When the killer brought a mori offering, there's only 2 of us left, and I try to give the other person hatch, they come rushing over as soon as I hit second stage and unhook me so the killer can mori me. Pisses me off. 🤦♂️
If no skip button, at least add a Kick-The-Survivor-Away option when they try to unhook me against my will.
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@tjt85 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3600015#Comment_3600015
Would that be fair to the Killer, though? Some perks like Coup or Spirit Fury rely on the element of surprise to be fully effective. Just because the SWF portion of the player base uses outside comms to gain a competitive advantage, I'm not sure Solo Q should be buffed to replicate that. SWFs unbalance the game enough already.
I'd rather see SWFs receive some nerfs and have BHVR balance the game more for Solo Q and Killer. I only play Solo Q and Killer, by the way. So I may be biased.
But A random perk mode would need some feature to remind players what their own perks do, I agree with that. I definitely have perks in my collection that I have pretty much never, ever used.
How is BHVR going to nerf SWF?? Ban players who talk on Discord while the game is running?? Best we could hope for is survivors in parties get less perk slots. Or some perks are unavailable to equip while in a party, like For the People, etc. (Which perks are unavailable could also depend on the party count, with more perks being locked if it's a full party of 4.)
The only way to make the game fair is to give solo and SWF the same capability of info sharing / callouts / coordination potential. Example: show lockers in yellow to nearby survivors while someone inside it has Head On. Etc.
Then perks like Spirit Fury that lose their surprise advantage get buffed. Spirit Fury now requires 4 pallet breaks and instantly shatters the next pallet dropped within 4/6/8 meters. Etc.
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Not really, but it would make for a decent buff to the perk Predator.
Predator - Scratch marks are shown in yellow and spread out slower. The scratch marks of the survivor with the total most time in chase are shown in red.
(By spreading out slower, instead of rectangular-shaped trails behind survivors, it would be cone-shaped trails pointing toward the survivors. This lets killers STILL see scratch marks from afar, unlike the current version of Predator, while still keeping the scratch marks tight when chasing the survivor. The colors help discern scratch marks from multiple survivors.)
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Who says the bots needs to be able to use their powers?
Just program a basic attack bot. When a 110% movespeed killer disconnects buff their movespeed to 115% like the rest of the basic attack killers. (Might be OP on Chucky though)
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My question is why locker blindness?
It was put in the game back when Object of Obsession was strong as, and the survivor could hide their aura with the locker while still seeing and calling out the killer's location to teammates. Object of Obsession has been nerfed since then.
Meanwhile, killers like Alien and Demogorgon can see auras while underground, so the argument that "oh, well survivors have limited view because they're INSIDE a locker" does not work.
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The only nerf Whispers needs is to activate when near the exits, as if the Gate Exit Switch were a survivor, when there is only 1 remaining survivor.
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OP at what? Good survivors don't mind being found; they can loop for 3 gens straight.
The only thing Whispers is OP at is securing the 4k, either by helping in the hatch race or completely preventing an exit gate escape after the hatch is closed. The hatch race part is already easy thanks to the hatch offering and doesn't use up a perk slot.
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I don't understand why hatch offerings are available to survivors anyway when they heavily favor the killer; especially now that SWF cannot DC to give hatch to their last teammate.
The only way I see it being beneficial is if two survivors burn hatch offerings, one for each location. Then, assuming the map has BOTH of those locations present, the last survivor can hide near 1 of them and has a 50/50 chance of getting hatch (better odds than without any hatch offerings at all).
Or maybe the survivor has Sole Survivor, makes the hatch spawn at shack, and then camps the exit furthest away from shack to have the most time to quickly open it. 🤷♂️
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What if the perk icons were still visible while paused (while viewing Match Details tab), and you could hover over them to read their description/effects?
They could even show your entire team's perks.
They could go a step further and bridge the disparity between SWF and Solo Q by also showing confirmed/witnessed killer perks. (If swf players on comms can say "the killer has Enduring," why should that info only be shared amongst swf players? If a survivor stuns the killer and they have Enduring, show it as their perk on the Match Details screen for all Solo Q survivors.)
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@adaw0ng said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3599748#Comment_3599748
Exactly. Those people don't plan on playing as a team anyway, so their team mates don't deserve to have a handicap on their team that willingly will do nothing to support the team. Makes sense I guess, no? They can wait until somebody with their same playstyle meets them.
At that point, just split the survivor queue. Queue for Team or Last Man Standing. Just remove survivors' ability to see other survivors' auras or it will be a grief-fest.
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I hope that if they ever implement random perks as a feature in the future, that it not be all or nothing for the loadout. Let it be on a perk slot by perk slot basis. Add a new "perk" to the list of perks that is just a question mark or dice.
I'm all for random perks, but there are some perks I can hardly play without. Let me keep those perks on and randomize the rest.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3599657#Comment_3599657
While it is true that Survivors can force themselves into a 3-gen, I've found that generally, Killers will identify and hold them from the beginning of the game.
This could be addressed in spawn logic, but with maps seemingly getting smaller every update, the room for gen spread decreases.
Doesn't help that only the swamp maps can have gens along the outer edges of the map.
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The changes could go different directions 🤷♂️
- Small buff to stun duration
- Big buff to deter tunneling once and for all (survivors now only have 3 perk slots to work with, effectively)
- They rework it to do something else entirely BECAUSE they made its effects basekit (instead of anti-tunnel being locked behind a $5 paywall)
Here's the changes I proposed. It only got hate because it's coming from me. Had anyone else suggested it, the idea would've gotten at least 1 upvote.
DS needs to scale with gen count. (Long stun to punish tunneling at 5 gens. Short stun so it's not a free escape in endgame.) It needs to deactivate if the killer is hooking more than 1 person. And its timer needs to pause while slugged.
@Nos37 said:
- Decisive Strike now activates when hooked instead of unhooked.
- Decisive Strike's timer will pause while hooked or in the dying state.
- Decisive Strike now deactivates when the killer hooks another survivor or the survivor performs a consipcuous action.
- Decisive Strike now stuns the killer for 1 second, plus 1 additional second for each generator remaining.
By activating when hoooked, it's now possible for the perk to deactivate if the killer hooks someone else before the perk user has been unhooked. This means Decisive Strike should no longer punish the killer if they aren't actually tunneling 1 person repeatedly.
The timer pausing prevents the perk from being wasted while on the hook, and prevents the killer from slugging and waiting it out.
The 6 second stun duration should heavily deter/punish tunneling early on, yet a 1 second stun shoud not be a simple "free" escape at the end of the match.
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I like Aftercare, but the deactivation makes Bond better.
I only use Aftercare with perks like Blood Pact, and Teamwork: Power of Two / Collective Stealth. After a heal, both parties need to be near eachother. It helps if both parties can see eachother. (Those 3 perks are still useless in solo q though 😔)
Plus, the deactivation makes the perk user far less likely to take/keep aggro.
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Upvote, but 2 seconds of aura reading is strong. It's not just where the survivor is.
- It's which survivor is which (killer can hand-pick the survivor who gets hatch, if they want to give hatch)
- It's which direction that survivor is headed (WHILE you close distance on them)
- It's what that survivor is doing (cleansing, searching a chest in basement)
- It's potentially what perks that survivor has (Urban Evasion, Fixation)
Just reveal their location with the standard bubble. Then the devs don't have to mess with anti-aura stuff not anti-aura-ing.
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New anti-camping mechanic. If the survivor camps a pallet for 10 seconds, the killer can drop it themself. 😂
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3599655#Comment_3599655
If pop was nerfed, it probably wouldn't have changed that match. We shouldn't just nerf perks, because the killer used it against you one game and won.
You're right. It likely wouldn't have changed the outcome. But it would have stopped the perk from sucking what little hope we had left. I stopped playing for the rest of the day after that match. Probably would have continued otherwise.
It's not a nerf in most normal cases anyway, as I stated in the suggestion. By defending Pop Goes the Weasel, your comment sounds like "if I can't utterly destroy gen progress at 5 gens with Pop, then it means the perk is being nerfed." 😔
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Backstory for this suggestion: We're getting tunneled and slugged at 5 gens. Killer's snowballing. We almost got a gen done several times, but PGTW kept taking chunks off of it.
Why..?? Being kicked while you're down? The survivors should just give up and go AFK...
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Sounds like you're not adept with that killer.
The achievement is not called Play Chucky with Only Their Own Perks. 🤷♂️
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If I were still playing on Xbox One, I would 100% agree.
On the newer generation of console, I barely feel the load screens.
Just don't make me restart the game 😪The initialization process takes ages.
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With how much crap survivors give killers for cherry picking lobbies, it would be hypocritical of them to then cherry pick teammates if this loadout preview were implemented.
In the long run, probelmatic perks that get dodged often like Self Care and No Mither will be more likely to be looked at by the devs.
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@D0NN1ED4RK0 said:
Adept David is gonna be near impossible
The perk needs to change. The devs said, years back, that No Mither was added as a Hard Mode perk.
- That Hard Mode also applies to the other survivors in their match.
- Sweaty players gravitate toward perks like pre-nerf Dead Hard and pre-nerf Made For This that make their match easier not harder.
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What if we went a step further and also made your team's loadouts visible during the trial via the pause/match menu?
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@CatnipLove said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3598915#Comment_3598915
They could test it like they did with hiding prestige. But I agree there is the potential for it causing more dodging.
I think the lobby dodging will fizzle out.
It will happen a lot at first until players realize
- "Bad" / meme perks are more common than they thought and will just have to work with/around them
- Cherry picking their teammates gets boring; eventually they'll have to settle
Players aren't going to start equipping "bad" perks now that the new system shows loadout. They have already been and actively are using them. Now, you get better forewarning and preparation. It's a plus.
That said, I do think that lobby dodging should have an accrued penalty system with slow decay, but it should be seconds into minutes into tens of minutes. Not like abandoning a match that goes from minutes to hours to days.
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Imagine knowing a teammate has Deliverance and you can decide to intervene in their chase when they're inevitably the first survivor chased.
Camaraderie. Power Struggle. Those pesky heal perks that make 2 injured survivors fight over who heals who first...
Of course, this feature would have to be put off until after No Mither is reworked or until lobby dodging is not as feasible.
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Nah.
The idea came to me while I was lying on the ground, slugged, and not gaining any Stakeout tokens even though the killer was still around and I was in their terror radius.
I could see this being too much for dual-layered maps while hooked, but not for slugging.