LockerLurk
LockerLurk
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The game as Killer in general feels a little sweatier than average but fine, Killer itself is not in a bad state. But the general vibe has changed; I feel maybe that MMR has become more screwed up than usual because I am seeing a lot more of the "babies or tryhards" situation since Springtrap released. I'm also seeing a BIG increase in toxic players, TTVs, and toxic TTVs. My Survivor games feel completely normal - a mix of some chill Killers, some normal Killers, and some toxic Killers.
Gen efficiency is extremely high right now and if the Devs wish to continue improvements for Survivor they should probably look at what's going on with this. I'd also suggest a soft reset of MMR for everyone just to iron out any weird kinks or bugs with it.
There's definitely an increase in weird ping for Survivors I get; I am seeing many cases where hits I should make don't land or hits I shouldn't make DO. I'm also noticing it feels like pallet stun distance may be broken again as it feels like it's hitting from further away than it should in some cases, perhaps ping is messed up.
I have noticed very long wait times for Killer, sometimes rivaling 2v8 wait times, but very quick Survivor queues. I ironically think maybe, just maybe, the anti go-next may be overly punishing more casual players, and this may be contributing to long match times and sweatier team-ups. Either there are too few Survivors so they are all SWFing, or too many Killers.
I generally feel my Survivor games are going better than my Killer games; I'm escaping more and having better quality matches. But for Killer, as per kill rates, not been seeing any sort of weirdness. I'm still 3-4king if I run a stronger Killer but getting the expected mixed results as weaker more casual Killers. My Dredge pulls 3-4ks or 0ks, my Ghostface pulls 2k or better usually, which is in range. I definitely in both cases have to play harder to win right now, because it feels like Survivors are playing super hard. I don't feel like I am allowed to show much personality, unlike the pre-Springtrap release days.
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Going to also buck the mold here and say Ghostface.
He's nearly perfect I think but could stand some kind of slight mobility fix, and maybe a couple little QoL buffs to Reveal, but he's otherwise fine. The other issue he has is that some addons legit do nothing or don't have a purpose except to promote bad playstyles - I think of the ones that make reveal off Hook and revealing if someone is slugged take longer here. Rework addons like those and maybe give him some kind of slight haste in Shroud and he's a solid High C to low B as clearly intended.
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It's gears, because Survivors work on generators. IDK why because generators typically don't have gears. I guess because they're doing repair work and gears have always symbolized repair and factory type work? Also, interlocking gears suggest teamwork towards a bigger goal, which is a core part of Survivor.
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We already have it. It's called 2v8.
It has a lot of the issues you mentioned.
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@Roco45 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3967080#Comment_3967080
Filling the bar even when there is a "chase" around the hooked Surv, like right around it because the killer is camping. The bar absolutely should fill even when there is a "chase" directly next to the hook, I stated replies ago why it should be in the game, but you chose to ignore that and type literal nonsense as if you were having a convo with yourself lol
The problem with this is if it worked this way, people could lead Killers to hook in chase to trigger a false flag and get their friend off the hook for free. That's not camping. Chasing someone else around the hook is not camping that hook no matter how hard people want it to be, if the Killer is doing ANYTHING ELSE BESIDES HOVERING AROUND THE HOOK AND GUARDING IT, it by definition isn't camping the hook.
Kicking gens nearby, breaking pallets, in chase with someone else, contesting an unhook they noticed, patrolling an area they have under control because of bad Survivor play or just good spawn luck, reloading their power, using their power around a hook, etc. is not camping the hooked Survivor.
Camping hooks is only, and only ever has been, the act of hovering around a hooked Survivor for the sole purpose of preventing anyone from getting the unhook, or to make unhooking as hard as possible for Survivors. It can be, and is, and should be, punished by just doing gens until the Killer gets bored and leaves, and now by anti facecamp (which let's say it for the people in the back, is anti FACECAMP not anticamp and thus it working only when the Killer is FACECAMPING is the mechanic working correctly).
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
Scratched Mirror does need a change now, but that's all. There is not anything else in the game that required an indoor map and the offering nerfs were needed for both sides
I mean, I personally like indoor maps and thought it was fun to play against Ghostface and Myers on Midwich because it's spooky, but yeah, that's about the only thing I personally miss from this change. It was objectively unfair to have Dredges forcing Midwich, SWFs four-stacking to force Eyrie with their sabo-wiggle builds, Huntresses and Onis forcing open maps, Survivors forcing Macmillan's because they watched the Ayrun tutorial and know they can break Killers' ankles on it. It wasn't fun to be on the other side of that because the game was basically lost from the start depending on the Killer and depending on the map.
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@Testoviron said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3967234#Comment_3967234
What camera issue are you referring to? I'm not aware of any (meaningful) bugs regarding the gateway POV.
As for box logic, mobility; Pinhead isn't a weak killer by any means. He doesn't need big buffs. They could and should change box spawns on maps like Swamp or Shelter Woods, where the LC is basically impossible to find. But Ceno is fine, aside from that.
Still, the design philosophy behind chains, and their tendency to snap instantly giving you 0 value, is just sickening. It's pure casino the likes of which can't be found on any other killer.
There have been 2 characters in the history of DBD who got PUNISHED for landing their power: Pinhead and Nemesis. And Nemmy got fixed.
Pinhead is the only character who can lose distance (and indeed often does) for correctly using his power.
Basekit Original Pain wouldn't solve that problem, especially since it requires the target to already be injured.
Haste seems like the only realistic solution.
For a few months around Bone Chill 2024 and a bit before, he had a really terrible camera zoom issue that was making some players nauseous.
I don't think a slight mobility or some updated box spawn logic would be "big buffs", more like sidegrades. Haste is indeed probably the solution.
You are correct he's punished for his power landing. He's not a weak Killer, no, but being punished for hitting is dumb. It's also a little dumb he can break his own chains by walking through them, why can Survivors control how fast they get unchained by making him do this depending on where he chains them at?
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@Brokenbones said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3967229#Comment_3967229
Yeah a plot twist style refresh would be good.
Once per trial and is refreshed when the final gen is done.
I'm not sure about once final gen is done would make sense, because of how it works. I do think maybe once per hookstage, so you get two. One on first hook, one on second hook. The perk would need you to get healed from your injury off hook, and then get hit again. Then you can make risky plays with the perk like this, but it would be fair.
It just should neither be infinite nor active in the endgame. We already have an antislug for endgame; it's Plot Twist.
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@lettuchia said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966905#Comment_3966905
You say "survivor-biased" as though you're neutral :/
Friend I comment equally about changes for both Killer and Survivor, and things that can and do affect both. Just because I happen to bring up the side I like more often doesn't mean I don't play Survivor enough to know what Survivor needs.
This mistaken assumption, that people who talk more about one side ONLY main that side and want the other one to suffer, is one that you seem to keep making with multiple people on these forums, myself included. Check your own bias before calling out that of others.
Speaking of that, I seem to remember you calling Killers as low tier as Doctor and Ghostface "overpowered", "boring", and "faceroll gameplay" because you struggle against them and think somehow that makes them unfair… I'm not trying to call you out or anything but it sure seems like maybe you're the one here who's not neutral.
If you don't have anything to add to actually improve a currently bugged Killer that is so glitchy it currently negatively impacts the Killer game experience, or if you do not play Killer at all (I'm sure you must play SOME as you commented here), then perhaps this discussion isn't one where you can help.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966831#Comment_3966831
Average event experience in DBD, sadly.
Some players out there really do sweat as much as possible during events.
@oecrophy said:
"Killer, why are you so efficient and not playing the event properly? Be softer, it's for fun and points..."
Meanwhile: 4 toolboxes — 2 with brand-new parts — gens getting juiced right in front of the killer, throw in 2 styptics for variety, and of course 2 flashlights so the killer can’t even get a hook.
Both sides are sweating hard.
As always, I guess
And hence why I say any event designed around increasing BP by doing the objective is bad event design. Events should not encourage doing the objective harder, they should encourage interacting with the event special stuff. The special hooks, the special gens, the special anything that isn't a sidequest? Should go. I also hardcore think Bloodfeast type bonus weeks should go, just make the game give us all more BP by default or add a multiplier on the end for the score overall. Make the objectives give zero extra points outside the norm, and just slap a doubling or tripling multiplier on the result at the end that goes for everyone playing, that cannot be that hard to code. They did it in Blood Moon so I KNOW it's not hard to do - and I hope it's what they do in future anniversary events. Then add extra things you CAN do for BP, like the Twisted Masquerade totems or getting and using the invites. Those are fine.
You know why they stopped doing the Chinese New Year and BBQ events? Because the way it was designed felt boring and added nothing new besides some stuff to get for points, everything was about pushing the event objectives harder and harder. You know why people seem to enjoy Haunted by Daylight and Bone Chill more? Because the bonus stuff you can do gives points outside of just doing hooks and gens.
Events should alter gameplay and add an event multiplier, NOT make the players want to sweat more.
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I just wanna know what they planned to do before the Plague and Cenobite changes got pushed back. I think his biggest issue is frankly, the chains and the camera for it. Could probably stand an update to box spawn logic and some mobility too. I don't think haste on Chain Hit is the right call. Maybe Deep Wound on Chain Hit?
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966898#Comment_3966898
My guy, its not us who needs to make a case why Ghostface should not have haste during nightshroud.
its you who needs to make that case, if you are getting downvotes its because you didnt make a convincing case and people still disagree. Ask yourself, well if I am a person who currently believes GF is fairly balanced, how can I convince them?The case has been made so many times by so many people who play this Killer, do I really need to dredge up every single thread asking for it, some of which have been buried in the PTB forums we can't access anymore?
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@TxQ said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3965140#Comment_3965140
even if you don't slug the twins don't have time to switch back, then pick that survivor who has PS!
Watch this clip:
https://www.twitch.tv/lynxi/clip/SpunkyPatientBananaChefFrank-wC6Pj4OduG8uiVTD
if the killer (not just the twins) downed the survivor under a pallet, they can't check around if they can pick up or not
A good killer will check first, then pick the survivor up, but with the perk Conviction, it's going to be a very big issue, by the time the killer looks around, the survivor will recover 25%
Conviction is certainly an issue and probably needs a limit. I think 2 per round like Plot Twist is probably enough.
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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966868#Comment_3966868
If you are stunned, and then get stunned again, it's a stunlock because you are locked into a stun animation. If you are blinded which causes a drop, then get stunned again for whatever reason, it's a stunlock because you are locked into a stun animation. This is the literal definition of a stunlock.
The issue is that 2nd blind does not lock you in animation or does not extend the duration of the initial stun animation. While your definition is true, it does not match the situation of being chain blind.
If a survivor can constantly blind a killer and that killer cannot move until it stops, that would be stun locking. You cannot point to a situation where that is true in DBD.
If you had read the comment I made, you'd see I mentioned this specific situation as not being a stunlock. However, I DID mention it as feeling similar to one in that the Killer doesn't have agency to stop a blind when in the middle of an animation, any animation - such as the stun animation. Nobody is getting mad if they get blinded at a pallet, but being stunned and then blinded when you cannot do anything to prevent it feels bad. That's it that's the whole point it feels bad. It feels as bad as actually being stunlocked does. Why is a Survivor allowed to stun the Killer, and then kick them while they're down by blinding them? it makes no sense and serves no tactical purpose except to farm BP off the Killer, who probably got annoyed you forced them into an unavoidable blind through an animation. At least give me the chance to preemptively ward the blind off.
I also believe the "prefilling" of the blind meter should be looked at. At the very least, a successful stun or blind beforehand should definitely reset it back to zero and give at least a second of resistance so the Killer has a chance to avoid it. This would also serve to make blinds and stuns more skillful for Survivors, because they have to be more careful of how and when they do it.
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@I_Cant_Loop said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966880#Comment_3966880
Lethal: helps you get your first chase and first down faster, which takes one survivor off gens, another off gens to rescue/heal, and maybe a third off gens if you get to another chase more quickly. When paired with other aura perks like Nowhere to Hide or I’m All Ears it’s immensely helpful in finding/downing survivors more quickly, thus slowing them down from working on gens.
Coup de Grace - helps end chases more quickly, which allows you to get back to patrolling gens and starting other chases more quickly.
Anything that helps killers find survivors, chase survivors and down survivors more quickly is also slowing down their progress on gens.
Gen perks are those perks that specifically pressure or control gens directly, in this context.
Lethal is not a gen perk, it doesn't directly control any generators. It helps you naturally find people and do the basic pressure every Killer already has. It's an info perk. Its purpose is info. Info pressures by controlling how fast the Killer can find someone to chase or shove off a gen. That's all it does.
Coup is not a gen perk, with the exception that it activates when gens are done - it is a chase perk. Chase perks control chase pressure, not gen pressure. Coup is not helping you make gens more difficult to do.
Just because a perk helps Killers pressure better, doesn't mean it's specifically helping them pressure generators better.
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@Legion_S_Tier said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966883#Comment_3966883
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966955#Comment_3966955
I’ll admit I was wrong with this take, however I do believe killer instinct should be taught to new survivors in some way without needing to play the killer itself. I just suggested what I thought was the only way however maybe I rushed to a conclusion too fast.
I agree that part of the tutorial for Killer should teach about Killer Instinct and what it is to new Killers.
Survivors never need to know what Killer Instinct is for the same reason Killers never need to know Survivors can do gens faster with two on a gen. It's a feature that doesn't really do much for them and that will never feasibly impact them more than other things that are more important to teach about.
The only thing Killers need to know about stacking on gens is that Survivors can do it and it makes gens go faster. Similarly, the only thing Survivors ever need to know about Killer Instinct is that some Killers can still find you if they do certain actions and can trace you that way - and it's not blockable.
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@UnicornMedal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966326#Comment_3966326
Sure, but why is it so dire? Why should it take priority over game balance?
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966334#Comment_3966334
It's not abusive in my opinion because it's purely voluntary and has no greater impact beyond the game (i.e. one's quality of life). It might exacerbate existing problems, but it's not the sole cause of them.
Although given that stance, I would agree that it could fall under the category of S/H if you willingly expose yourself to things you know you cannot handle, despite having countless measures to soften your exposure or to cut it off entirely.
Also my point with the charms and the mask is that those players were actively being discriminated against and seemed less upset about it as a whole than players getting bagged at the gates. At least from my experience.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966336#Comment_3966336
Agreed.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966356#Comment_3966356
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966344#Comment_3966344
I said it has the spirit of Mario Party, which is to say that it's like a fun game between friends. It's not something you're supposed to sweat over or take to heart. That is at its core and is why the game suffers so much when players don't respect each other.
Now whether the devs or the players treat it that way is something else entirely.
Simple: If Killers feel the game is unfair enough Survivors can bully them, that would suggest a game balance issue right?
Also, when things like THIS death of a child and THIS study about how online harassment in gaming affects people are a thing, I'd say it's definitely dire enough for BHVR to do something about it in their game.I could list you more resources about this. But we'd literally be here all day. Basic psychology and multiple studies say you are wrong - the brain views this behavior as abuse and as painful, this behavior is abusive, and this behavior has a real effect on peoples' wellbeing. And it usually strikes minority groups, young people, and already vulnerable people the hardest.
It's NOT just "gamertalk" or "friendly bashing" when someone calls you slurs or threatens to harm you. It's 100% NOT just silly banter when you don't know what someone may have been through, and no. The solution is not "just don't play PvP games." The solution is coming down hard on it and treating it like the abusive behavior it is. Abusive behavior should never be tolerated towards anyone, anywhere, ever. As a victim of sustained and vicious online harassment myself that nearly led to my own suicide attempt when I was 16 years old, I can and will die on this hill.
This sort of behavior has a real, tangible, serious effect on people. People have been harassed to suicide in online games. People have been given real mental disorders such as PTSD and anxiety disorder over harassment in online games. Occasionally, harassment online has spilled over into physical aggression in the real world including murders outside of games.
It's for the good of everyone overall mentally and physically if BHVR takes it seriously.
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@ObsidianButterfly said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966896#Comment_3966896
I find him incredibly boring to play as and play against. So no, he doesn't have something for everyone. He is just ANOTHER repetitive projectile killer.
Opinions are like noses, friend. We all have one.
I disagree with yours and it appears there's enough others here who disagree too. Not sure why you singled me out. -
@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966909#Comment_3966909
I was not talking about Houndmaster or the person that's complaining in this thread.
This one was a completely different case.
Oh my mistake. I thought the thread was about Houndmaster. /gen
You're right though, even harmless asks for buffs to lower tier Killers get the massive complaint and downvote treatment. I'm not sure why, are people scared if we buff lower tiers they suddenly will be too strong or something? The game has to change and update to keep these Killers relevant.
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@ChuckingWong said:
Currently have a few clips in my library of him spawning on the same side and corner of the map with his box. Kind of funny.
I dont know about worst state. Hard to say he seems…. fine? Middle of the road pretty B tier killer.
Think hes just about right barring any bugs.The issue his bugs make him feel unfun to play as, and his chain mechanic still feels needlessly clunky.
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966905#Comment_3966905
Yeah.
Believe it or not, I have encountered worse.
In a nutshell, that person's deal was: Everything killer does is unfair and should be nerfed. You make a suggestion to buff a C tier killer? Cue the "survivors have suffered enough" and making themselves victim.
While I don't think Houndmaster is C tier in the right hands at all, I do think she's buggy and needs some addressing. I feel like she's in a similar boat as poor ol' Knight and could use some looking at, but her power overall is fine. It's a weird boat to be in.
She definitely doesn't need a full on power rework.
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@ArkInk said:
Haywire legitimately irks me. The idea of giving Springtrap an endgame perk is great and shows they paid attention to his character, why is it literally useless unless you use it in an intentionally almost hostage holding playstyle with remember me?
Genuine question, if they changed it from 50 to 80% because Singularity can become basically unwinnable trapping the gates with them, does that mean the perk is designed predominantly with that strategy in mind?
I'd rather it be reworked to something like gaining Undetectable for a minute when the trial starts and then again when the gates are done.
Haywire's effect should just be basekit and Haywire itself should just make the gate switch drain run out faster. It's kinda useless otherwise, why would I not just take No Way Out instead?
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I frankly think everyone should be able to see the bar. Killer included. But that's just me.
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966631#Comment_3966631
Judging by the replies, only a freddy/skull merchant treatment would be satisfactory.
That's not just you noticing, unfortunately this is a common pattern I've noticed amongst some of the newer Survivor-biased posters on these forums. It's just Us versus Them by another name, "Buffs and fixes for me but not for thee."
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Frankly I think BHVR should stay away from any more Killers with AI companions as a power, they never seem to turn out very well. Either they end up too strong, or they end up with a billion reworks that destroy the Killer.
Houndmaster is a cool concept. My issue is that she feels bad to play against (how am I intended to loop or counter her at ALL, the counterplay doesn't seem obvious to me at all), and frankly she feels buggy to play as with a bad addon selection to boot.
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Frankly maybe Scratched Mirror Myers should be reworked then. Maybe it should not give the downsides it does anymore. But the answer is 100% not to bring back Map Offerings as they were before, they were too often used to tilt games in one side's favor.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
I still want one of the surveys to actually care about frustrations for people playing the killer role.
The most frustrating thing for me is how absolutely awful the audio experience is for killers. But instead of choices like "it's too difficult to hear survivors during chase music" or "it's too difficult to hear survivors that aren't in line of sight", I get a whole bunch of options that don't help at all.
As in, I remember multiple surveys talking specifically about survivor-only frustrations, but I've never seen a survey ask me about killer-only frustrations.
My fear is the Devs don't ask those questions because they think it will alienate Survivor players who will go, "BUT YOU'RE NOT ADDRESSING OUR ISSUES IN THE SURVEY YOU ONLY CARE ABOUT KILLER >:("
I would certainly hope most people who play Survivor aren't like that. I'm not, I play Surv about half the time.
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Not sure why this got downvoted and shoved to the bottom of the queue.
This is something that many Ghostface players and even some Ghostface Mains have been asking for. Just give us it please.
If there's any good reason anyone can give for why we don't have this or we shouldn't have this, please just engage with the thread instead of downvoting so the Devs cannot see it. That's not engaging discussion.
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I just keep getting Swamp, Crotus Prenn, and Coldwind. It's super frustrating. I think I have gotten the new Fazbear map one time. I've gotten Ormond Lake twice. Haddonfield I have also gotten a lot.
Why on earth does the game insist on giving me the worst. Possible. Maps for all my characters? It feels like something about map rotations or probabilities is broken, it should be an equal chance to get any one map - unless you use the Map Offerings, then it should bump it tom a flat 20% chance.
Feels like those are working better than intended too by the way, because not once have I seen a map offering NOT send us to the requested map. I am getting tired of people who have realized this sending me to MacMillan's.
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Killer ain't that strong but he's fun. Killers do not have to be strong if they are fun. He's fun to play as and against, he's got the sneaky jumpscare elements, he's got something for everyone with his kit and the license and cosmetics definitely feel faithful to FNAF in my opinion. Great Licensed DLC.
11/10 would springlock again.
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@Testoviron said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966653#Comment_3966653
Clive Barker's site mentions an upcoming Hellraiser game, but I figured it's an old, old announcement. Guess it isn't. And I guess now we know why Barker wants Pinhead all to himself.
Frankly, it's a somewhat silly move by him. Seems like he doesn't want to "split" the potential playerbase between DBD and his game, but it's unlikely his title (probably a multiplayer game) will be super popular. Texas Chainsaw Massacre was dwarfed by DBD (while it still existed).
Hoarding the IP like that is gonna make Hellraiser fans resentful, if anything. DBD players deprived of Ceno aren't gonna flock to this entirely new, suspected asymmetrical horror thing.
As a Hellraiser fan and occasional Pinhead enjoyer in DBD yes, this makes me very mad. It's my second most favorite horror license after Scream actually, and it frustrates me that THIS is why we lost the Hellraiser license and Pinhead won't get fixed.
Demogorgon was getting fixes when we didn't have Stranger Things in the game, he still got tweaks and changes. WHY is Pinhead not getting anything? His chains have camera issues, his power needs an upgrade, he could stand to use several tweaks to how the Box spawn works, he really should have his chains apply damage the way any good M2 attack does. He's a complex Killer that currently doesn't feel good to play and it makes me so frustrated, because Pinhead was a day one buy for me as a fan of this franchise.
If Barker wants to make a PvE Hellraiser game I would play it, I would run around with my Cenobite gang and play Keepaway with the Box in the Labyrinth all day long. That sounds super awesome and I would love to see it expand into an open world puzzle thing even, something like Killer Klowns or DBD meets The Secret World with a dash of the ancient puzzle-adventure MMO Myst: Uru Online would be good for a Hellraiser game I feel. But if that has fallen through, I don't see why he won't work with BHVR on this. I get it's his baby, but it really feels like he doesn't want the fans to have this.
And whatever Barker decides, there's still not a single excuse for BHVR refusing to address any of the problems this character has when they did it for Demo. Fix Pinhead, BHVR.
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Whether or not a Killer will do well on a given map depends on the Killer. Ghostface for example suffers on big maps like Suffocation Pit with strong mains and on bright maps like Coldwind. Dredge meanwhile suffers on maps that lack lockers, like Ormond Resort. Nemesis will be fine on Gideon or Hawkins or even RPD, but Billy suffers in Hawkins AND RPD (he's sorta OK on Gideon).
That said there are a couple maps that are awful for Survivors to be stuck on - Haddonfield, Rotten Fields, Forgotten Sands. These must be addressed. In addition there's the Swamp Maps, which are uniquely awful for both sides in different ways and are a curse brought upon us all by the Entity to mock us for our hubris.
Honestly the maps you mentioned plus the ones I did, need to be adjusted. If the map sucks for most people on one whole side, the map is too one sided and needs balancing.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
For me it’s whispers. While I think the perk is unique, I just remember a couple years ago when I was brand new trying to use this perk for information. I didn’t know anything about this game.
I think it confused me more than anything. I feel like it’s missing something.I think Whispers should give aura read along with the whispering sound when near a Survivor, but that's just me.
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Everything bad would come from a change like this, specifically for weaker Killers who often have Killer Instinct as a feature.
Why on earth do you believe that Survivors need to see a Killer-specific mechanic like Killer Instinct, which is always used as a reward tool or a balancing option to help the Killer when they are either in power or need a boost because they just lost their power? It's something often put on weaker Killers or Killers that may need a slight more bit of info anyway. It's also an important tool for new Killer players to learn. It's MEANT to be used as part of a Killer's power to help highlight nearby targets for Killers so they can get in the next chase or find their next hook, Survivors 100% do not need it for any reason as it provides them no benefit.
Why do Survivors need to see when Ghostface got Revealed that he can see them? Or Legion is aware they're there? Or Dredge can see them near a locker in Nightfall? Or that Springtrap can tell when he just missed with his axe as a form of antiloop? Letting Survivors see this would unfairly disadvantage and weaken these Killers for no real benefit, and make Survivors stronger for no good reason. If you wanna see the Killer when they see you, run OoO.
Survivors get things like comboing on gens and fast-vaulting, Killers get this. Not EVERYTHING needs an equal and opposite thing on the other side just because one side gets it.
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Listen, people who ragequit are gonna just ragequit, you cannot stop that. You CAN punish them for it. And you should. Ragequits ruin games.
When people disconnect because the Killer player decided to be Plague today, that ruins the round for the other four.
When the Killer disconnects because the MMR did a screwy-wewwy and gives them a team too strong for the player and they get frustrated, that ruins the game for the other four.
When a Survivor decides they don't like that they were downed too quickly so they DC, that ruins the game for the other four.
When a Ghostface successfully uses their power and the Survivor that got Marked doesn't like that "because Ghostface is broken/glitchy" (he is neither), that ruins the round for the other four.
When either side gets mad their build isn't working - the Lithe failed to save them, their hexes got cleansed too soon, etc. - and they ragequit over it, that round gets ruined for the other four.
Ragequitting. Ruins. Games. There needs to be a penalty for it. I have said it before and will say it until I'm blue in the face - my game is less ruined as Survivor by Killers who hard tunnel and humptech than by Survivors who throw a fit and ragequit over the most minor things even when we could have won. THAT is what ruins my Survivor games the most.
I'm happy it's been addressed, and I want to see it become more severe, even.
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@Nazzzak said:
I use one slowdown (Corrupt) and no regression. I mostly use chase perks as quick downs and hooks are my priority. My breaking gens milestone was at like step 8 by the time I finished my hooking survivors milestone. I find I just don't need the extra assistance in that area as the playstyle I've gravitated to (ie the one that naturally works for me) just doesnt need it. My biggest asset while playing killer is honestly my experience playing survivor, that helps more than any perk could. Diversifying my builds is something I've always done too because I honestly get bored playing the same stuff over and over anyway lol
For me it depends on the Killer. I use two max on Killers that are low mobility and one max on those with high mobility. If I use two it's usually something strong that I can boost with something else - Surge and Pain Res, Grim and Thrilling, etc. - or block AND pop, something like Surge and Thrilling. If I use one, I favor gen block over pop or regression; my favorite one is actually just plain ol' Thrilling Tremors because it pulls double duty as info and some light gen block. I diversify the other two or three slots. Experience does the rest, because you can't replace that with a perk.
@I_Cant_Loop said:
I don’t even know what “slowdown perks” is suppose to mean. Every killer perk is a slowdown in some way. Every killer perk either directly or indirectly serves to keep survivors from completing their objective faster.
How is Lethal Pursuer slowdown? How about Coup de Grace, you know, the perk that actively is about letting gens get done for a longer lunge? There's a lot of perks that 100% are NOT "slowdown in some way" because they aren't a form of slowdown in any way.
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@TiSeraph said:
I really like the "catch up mechanism" idea. It would be an intrinsic anti- tunneling mechanism too.
I get a LoL out of "killers need a catch up mechanic tooooo"
The game skews killer the longer it runs. Pallets get burned. The killer has fewer gens to patrol. Consumables are gone. And I pick up a hook or two at endgame, every other game.
That's your catch-up mechanic.
But that's cool. When we're down to two, I'll be the one rapidly exiting lockers to distract you and then hiding.
Over and over.
For five minutes or so.
So you admit you a) only want the game to be fun for me but not for thee, b) like to harass people just because they beat you at the game, c) enjoy holding the Killer and one other Survivor player hostage out of pettiness because your team isn't winning, d) don't realize all Killers are not at equal strength levels?
You sound like fun to play with… /s
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@Mr_K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966318#Comment_3966318
I didn't calem or I say it was rare. I believe we both said it's not a stunlock and even in your statement you prove it's not a stunlock. The only time you are stun/unable to move is when you are blind while caring a survivor. Hooking a survivor is not a stun, it's an animation lock which you will be in blind or not.
But the Killer doesn't get any sort of stun if blinded while hooking, plus it's not usually possible to actually blind in the hooking animation. I had it happen to me only once, and that was back when the blind hitboxes were bugged for a few months making blinds more powerful than they should be.
If you are stunned, and then get stunned again, it's a stunlock because you are locked into a stun animation. If you are blinded which causes a drop, then get stunned again for whatever reason, it's a stunlock because you are locked into a stun animation. This is the literal definition of a stunlock.
Here is the definition of Stunlocking from Wiktionary:stunlock (third-person singular simple present stunlocks, present participle stunlocking, simple past and past participle stunlocked)
- (video games, transitive) To render (a character) unable to move or react by repeatedly hitting them and keeping them in a stunned state.
It does not say it has to be a specific number of times. It does say repeatedly. A Killer being stunned and then stunned again right after is therefore a kind of stunlock.
Here is a discussion on NeoGAF from as recent as 5 years ago about why Stunlocking is still a thing and still feels bad. The general consensus there is it feels bad unless it's a fighting game or it makes sense to have it, in which case it's a feature not a bug. DBD is not a fighting game, and it doesn't make any real sense to be able to double-punish the Killer this way unless you want to irritate them, so being able to stunlock a Killer is therefore poor game design that needs addressing. And being able to chainblind, though not a problem, is similar for the reason that it doesn't feel good for the Killer to get blinded repeatedly especially when they cannot act to stop it, such as while in the stun animation.
Now, I will concede that in many cases a blind isn't a stunlock, but it still FEELS unfair because you still cannot react in an animation. The Killer cannot stop a blind while they are in the stun animation. The Killer cannot look away from a blind while picking up so they have to preemptively face away from a possible blind. The Killer does not get to "save" against stuns or blinds while already stunned, and that doesn't really feel good. Why does the Survivor get to have double stun/blind points off of me while I am locked in an animation, that feels like insult to injury.
If you have any further discussion on this feel free to disagree or add it. But my description of what a stunlock is wasn't wrong just because you disagree with it.
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No. People abused it to go-next and ruin matches for everyone, so now nobody can have nice things.
If you want to self unhook, you have options. Run Deliverance, Slippery Meat, Wicked if you expect a basement hooking, or a luck offering. You also get to do it for free if the Killer facecamps. Neither you nor anyone else needs more.
Killers need to be able to have some hook pressure and Survivors need to be able to have players who will remain on their team and not throw the game just because they went down first in chase.
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@vol4r said:
Oh, I had a game yesterday, when I punished hard tunneler for tunneling me.
4 man out! It felt so good.
NOED didnt help him.
He hard tunneled me for 3 gens, didnt succeed, left me and after that I made like 3 pallet saves. That punishment was GOLDEN.
Congratulations, you stomped a baby probably truly trying their very best. Experienced Killers don't generally hard tunnel for multiple gens or use NOED seriously, and if they're using it while tunnelling they're extra doing it wrong. Let me guess, it was a P0 Wraith and he was running basekit stuff and his own perks too?
Shame on you for this Us versus Them post.
@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3966317#Comment_3966317
Tunneling on low gens seems accaptable to me. Killer simply needs to take someone out of the game to win and going for this at like 1/2 gens left seems reasonable to me.
Tunneling for me is an issue basically only if killer goes for it since from start of the game.This exactly. Pressuring this way is really a tool you only use to generate SOME pressure or get SOMEONE out if you are low on gens and don't have anyone out yet. It's rare you have the luxury of being able to breathe and spread hooks equally. That's just not usually how games go if you're evenly matched. Some Killers even have to use this tool more than others.
It's as you say, ONLY a problem if they focus the same person from the word go and never go for anyone else SOLELY so that one person can't play the game. THAT is what hard tunnelling is. THAT is toxic. Anything else is pressure.
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@Rookie1978 said:
Uhh.. why not have them at 100? Sometimes I wanna play on my favorite map. Don't know why everyone is crying
Nobody is "crying", this is a necessary change for balance and your usage of that wording betrays a disdain for anyone who wants a fair game.
Maps in DBD are not always balanced and can heavily tilt the game in one side's favor, which is exactly how they were used. Plus, Survivors can bring it four times more in a group than the Killer can, which isn't fair. The only counter was a Very Rare Offering that was hard to gather because of the bloodwebs being cluttered; it just wasn't OK to make people bring an Offering every round just to counter another offering that isn't as rare. They cannot and should not be at 100%. They should not be at 50%. They should not be at 30%. They should just not exist anymore as they are never ever used for their intended purpose of just playing a map you like or for cheevos.
I frankly want these items removed and all related cheevos made either easier or simply removed. Achievements should not be based on random sheer luck.
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Honestly this map should not be a Withered Isle map at all, it should be a Lery's Memorial map and mostly indoors with a small outdoors section. It's been forever since we got even one solid indoor map, it's like the Devs are gunshy after how nasty the RPD map release was. There's too many Withered Isle maps and some realms STILL only have one or two maps.
We can cut some of the extra MacMillan's, Autohaven, and Coldwind maps too. Do we really need five different ones for these realms? Does anyone even like playing on some of these maps?
I think FNAF in the Withered Isle is fine and makes sense as it plays on the nostalgia theme the realm has, but the pizzeria should still, STILL have been an indoors map with a small outdoors; surely Fazbear's Pizza is a big enough building that if upsized a little could make a full map. How cool would it have been to find the fully rendered security room with all those cameras, have a bigger parts and services section, a larger kitchen, a bigger backstage, a larger arcade, a room with climbing structures you could actually loop inside of? I wanna see the hidden room Springtrap was found in and loop Killers there, complete with bloodstains showing Afton's final struggle as he was springlocked! That would have been a great Easter Egg!
Or what about a big indoor map that, due to the Entity's warping of ideas, has areas that blend seamlessly between FNAF 1's Pizzeria, FNAF 2's big open rooms, FNAF 3's scare attraction, and even FNAF 4's house and Sister Location's gallery rooms? That would have been so much more interesting than just another boring outdoors map with a themed main, the rest of that map doesn't even feel like it belongs in the FNAF universe… Movie OR games. BHVR could have done so much MORE with this idea and they chose to do the same basic ahh "themed main in a kinda generic outdoors area".
TWD doesn't fit the theme and shouldn't be here period.
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@Mandy said:
This was removed from the game when the system changed (the ability to not get crows by picking up and dropping the item), what was kill switched was the messaging and subsequent penalties for "going next" until we adjusted the system.
Can you please test it and be sure it's working then? I've seen people do it and I have also been able to do it in customs.
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I pretty much agree with all of these, good thread.
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Same here.
Made sure to ask you for some real changes.Also asked for Ghostface Night Shroud Haste, which I will continue to ask for until the end of time or until we get it because seriously it felt great in 2v8 and there's no reason not to give him some. He needs some map mobility. If Trapper can have it he can.
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They're happening but I have not seen them on Killer much lately.
Good riddance. These maps all need some looking at. The pallet spawns on some of the Autohaven maps are too high like with Old Borgo (maybe a return of that glitch?), and MacMillan's should have the more balanced versions of the maps over the ones we currently have ASAP. Too unfun as too many Killers, these realms should be balanced again.Don't get me started on Haddonfield and that new Eyrie map.
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Friend? It's been just as sweaty and nasty on Killer. This is how events go. Either you sweat and get points, or the other side does and you get no points.
This is bad event design.
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Perfect storm of the event, the rank reset, the new spawn changes, and the anti go-next mechanic.
Frankly we need to stop making the objectives give extra points and just slap on an event multiplier to the end result. Otherwise, it always leads to sweating harder.
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Hey friend?
Sweaty tryhard Survivors also exist. This is not just a Killer thing. Some DBD players are just super sweaty. -
Frankly yes, stacking 4 slowdown on most of the roster is pretty much always a bad idea. It often boosts Killers out of their intended effective niche, which is how you get tunnelling Ghostfaces and Springtraps hardstuck against really good teams who can kick their butts.
That said, it's not always meta on all Killers. Aura is more meta on mobile Killers for example.