I_Cant_Loop
I_Cant_Loop
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Well, Nowhere To Hide got deleted from the game, so kind of a moot point now.
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Just in the past day I've gone against survivors who run without scratch marks (without the perks that allow you to do that) and also saw a survivor that used Sprint Burst when I found them, didn't stop running, and then got a speed boost from Lithe.
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@humanbeing1704 said:
it’s easily the most powerful add on in the entire game I’m surprised it’s lasted 7 years
I'm not surprised it's been in the game this long. It helps sell DLC content so of course BHVR aren't going to change this add-on.
I hadn't seen it in a while but just went against two in the past two days. I can't say what I recommend people do when they face a tombstone Myers because it's against forum rules. It's really not even worth trying because you can loop him all game and then once he finally catches up to you bam you're dead. But I guess selling DLC content is more important than ensuring everyone has a chance at a fair match.
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@flotaku said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3631346#Comment_3631346
So have the devs...
It's absolutely ridiculous how long it's taken to fix these bugs. I enjoy the game and want to support it, but I'm reminded over and over again why I can't bring myself to spend money on it. I don't feel like I'm valued as a customer at when bugs (especially ones that affect some of my favorite parts of the game) just get ignored for this long.
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@missionnhunter said:
I've literally had 30 rounds in a row where the killer does nothing but tunnel each person right off the hook. This game is broken. Devs don't seem to care because the minor changes they've made have not removed tunneling from the game. It's literally unplayable garbage at this point. This feature is not fun, does not add challenge, and does not make new or existing players want to continue playing. The purpose of a game is fun, literally no survivor ever has said that tunneling adds fun - that's 80% of the players in each round (4 survivors 1 killer) and yet it's ignored.
It's so easy to solve. Make DS automatic and unlimited until the killer gets a certain distance away from the survivor, or until the survivor does an action to benefit the team ie generator, heal teammate etc. And it disables when only 2 survivors are left. And if a killer persists in tunneling they get stunned an increasing amount. SEE? Very simple to fix. It didn't take an entire dev team to come up with a solution that would make the game considerably more fun for survivors and would make the killer use skill to win, which is the whole point right? Right?
How about trying to play killer and see how difficult it is to win, especially against coordinated teams, without tunneling at all? Eliminating tunneling from the game would make it nearly impossible for killer to win high levels for all but the S-tier killers. If you disagree, I would love to see your gameplay videos to show us how it's done.
Against new players and bad-to-moderately good solo queue, I 100% agree you can win without tunneling. But once you get to a level where you're consistently facing coordinated SWF and/or pro loopers who know how to string together every broken loop in the game, there are many times where you have to tunnel if you want to have a chance to get at least one kill. The problem is that you don't know which teams you have to tryhard against because the devs refuse to show MMR score or SWF status in the lobbies, so you
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3629594#Comment_3629594
I don't want any of those things. I want to feel like my gameplay and loadouts actually matter. But right now matchmaking is so bad for solos that wins and losses often happen before the match even takes place. There is absolutely nothing I can do when a killer leaves me in chase and my teammates end up double slugged within 30 seconds by that same killer. You can have some skill difference in a lobby, but not so much that players are essentially robbed of agency.
It would be super easy for BHVR to implement a ranking system based on something simple like average time in chase with a killer before being downed. Even something like that would be far better than the terrible "SBMM" system we have now. It's incredibly frustrating that we haven't gotten past the "escapes = skill" and "kills = skill" system that everyone can see is incredibly flawed.
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@th3syst3m said:
Just an MMR system that rewards individual skill. Not much to ask, I say make killers as strong as you want, just reward individual (solo q) survivors for playing well with MMR. I don't see the problem with this, it's a very small ask, please BHVR just do it.
Yeah maybe something like a system that scores you based on 4 categories: escaping, doing objectives, rescuing/healing people, and running the killer for long chases. If only a scoring system like this existed...🙄
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This map has been complained about by killers for a long, long time. At this point I wouldn't count on the devs doing anything about it. It's not like they haven't seen the complaints on the forums. They just aren't going to prioritize it, apparently.
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I love using Nowhere To Hide on many of my killers, but it's been broken and killswitched for almost a month now. Apparently there is no urgency whatsoever to get this (or Knight) fixed anytime soon. Sigh...
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@Pulsar said:
No.
Generally as a Killer, if people are obviously baiting you, the best thing you can do is not to fall for the bait.
I ignore these survivors until they either 2nd to last or last alive. These are pro loopers who do nothing all day but play this game. They'll just waste their time following you around, thus not doing gens and hurting their team. Best thing for you to do is go after the weaker players who are doing gens, then when the pro looper is the only one left, you'll eventually be able to catch them (assuming you find hatch and close it first)
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When I play killer I ignore boons unless they are right next to me. Like most hex perks, boon perks are awful. Hexes and boons are failed concepts that need to be completely reworked.
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As long as Hex totems can still get found and permanently cleansed in the first 30 seconds of a game, they will remain trash tier perks.
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Maybe people are sick of going against Chucky every single match
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It's incredibly frustrating. Nowhere to Hide is one of my favorite perks, but I guess I'll have to go play something else until they fix it. It's really not a mystery why the player numbers are stagnant/declining. There is no urgency whatsoever to fix issues that affect the customer experience. You know they won't be a minute late on cranking out new skins/chapters, but if your favorite perk or killer is kill-switched, you have to wait a month or longer until they get around to it.
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They'll put resources where the money is. It's as simple as that. nothing wrong with that - it is a business, after all
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Yep - this is why people shouldn't complain about WoO. If you're sick of people using it all the time, just run blindness perks/add-ons.
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I don't have a problem with the Iri Head add-on. Just dodge it and huntress has literally no power (to go along with her slow 110% movement speed) unless she wants to drop chase and reload. Seems like a sufficient downside for a powerful add-on.
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@Chilli_man2400 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3620491#Comment_3620491
hillbilly and Onyro rework. Fov slider, 3 gen solution and new solo survivor character
I can't believe they are spending time and resources on another Billy "rework". Literally all they need to do is put him back exactly the way he was before (add-ons included), tweak a couple of his strongest add-ons, and everyone would be happy.
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It's not an exploit but it's definitely an unfair advantage. SWF teams get free Deja Vu, free Fogwise, free Kindred (and more), and can use those perk slots for other meta perks. Not only that, they can also synergize perks across the team. Coordinating efficient gameplay makes it mathematically impossible for a killer to get more than 1 or 2 kills unless they get incredibly lucky with the map setup or the survivors can't last more than 10 seconds in a chase. The only reason that this unfair advantage is allowed to stay in the game is because most of the content/skins revenue comes from long-time players that play together in survivor groups and BHVR will never risk killing that golden goose. Also, enough killer players are willing to put up with this unfair advantage.
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@TheSyndromeOfClowns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3617985#Comment_3617985
Otz has been saying this for god knows how long and his recent video proved your statement. BHVR doesn't care and their lack of ambition shows that.
I don't agree that BHVR don't care. I think they do care, but they are extremely slow to respond to any feedback or make any sort of positive or innovative changes to the game because of lack of competition. There are no other games in this genre that BHVR have to compete with for play time/revenue,, so they can take forever to make changes without having to worry about losing players.
They've been able to operate this way for the past 6 years, but I think that the clock is finally starting to tick for them to either step up their game or risk a mass exodus of players. In past years, new content and events would show large influx of player count on Steamcharts. This past year, that has not been the case - new content and events have brought in much smaller increase in players, sometimes very minimal. I think we've hit the point where the game has become very stale and unless there are some significant changes to game mechanics, game modes, fixing balance issues, etc., it could start to go downhill very quickly.
Just the other day I was thinking to myself as I looked at the hundreds and hundred of useless items and addons I have in my inventory: "are these still going to be here years from now?" That just speaks to the stale state of the game. Removing old items/add-ons that nobody uses and introducing new ones is something very simple that the dev team could do to keep the game fresh but because there is very little competitive pressure, these things just don't get prioritized.
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3618083#Comment_3618083
Yes, but feedback can be filtered. You just need to look at everything very carefully.
Hillbilly is an example where feedback was ignored, twice in a row. It is a situation where the majority was asking for the controversial decision to be scrapped and later removed. Neither happened, and now no one is happy with Hillbilly.
Another example is often seen: the initial feedback right after a killer releases. This one is different because people still need time to adjust to the new character, to understand how to play as and against. On this scenario some pieces of feedback won't make it to the game, in order to avoid premature nerfs and changes, like Freddy suffered in 2017.
But you see how different the two scenarios are? The problem is scenario#1 happening far too often with several things:
Like, BBQ and WGLF losing their bloodpoint gains. That also had a negative impact, negative feedback, and nothing was done.
I really can't understand the refusal by the devs to revert Hillbilly back to the way he was before his overhaul (other than keeping insta-saw out of the game). I've seen 100% universal negative feedback about those changes on this forum. It seems like this is one of the cases where BHVR know the change was wildly unpopular but they don't want to admit that they made a mistake.
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The only hex perk I ever run is Plaything. The activation upon hooking someone is a good design, IMO and I think BHVR need to be more creative in how hexes activate and get deactivated. In their current state, all hexes except Plaything are pretty much useless unless you're going up against noobs, in which case you probably don't need them to win anyway. If I'm running a hex perk, half the time it will spawn out in the wide open or right next to a gen. Even if it's well-hidden, it will usually be found within the first minute or two and then I'm down a perk slot for the rest of the match.
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What actions do you want the devs to take? Maybe I missed it in your other comments above, but I genuinely want to know what changes you would suggest to make the survivor experience better without making the game even more difficult for killer players than it already is.
We could get a bunch of killer players posting videos showing how broken coordinated SWF is or how broken many maps are with multiple connected safe loops that make it easy to extend chases to multiple minutes - should those be taken as proof that the devs need to nerf survivors?
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Basekit corrupt would help a lot. Survivors have gotten a bunch of free basekit stuff recently to counter killer strategies that they don't like. Killers have gotten basically nothing in return and as was mentioned above Corrupt got nerfed when literally no one was asking for it. So now the only way for killers to apply any kind of pressure is to tunnel and survivors wonder why killers tunnel all the time. Slow the game down a bit and tunneling won't feel required to secure a kill.
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Well try playing killer without any gen regression perks and you'll get sick and tired getting 2-3 hooks by the time all the gens are done and have all the survivors t-bag you at the exit gate.
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Nobody runs hex perks because they are trash. Half the time, the hex totem spawns about 3 feet from a generator or out in the open in blatantly obvious spot. If if they are hidden, experienced survivors (which is pretty much everyone if you're at a halfway respectable MMR level) know where all the totem spawns are and find them about 30 seconds into the match. Unless you're playing against solo q noobs, you're likely not going to get any value other than a very slight amount of slowdown on gen progress.
The hex totem mechanic needs to be reworked completely to make it a more time-consuming secondary objective. Maybe something like make the hex move to a different totem if the survivor is interrupted while trying to cleanse. In their current state, hex totems are nothing more than a minor annoyance to non-potato survivors and certainly not worth running over the plethora of better perks available to killers.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
It can't be fixed.
Unless devs decide to balance game around them. But this will be terrible for game because playing solo will be pointless, even now solo-q is already so bad.
Devs can't remove SWF too because this would just kill game. People are playing online games with their friends.
So there is no actual solution.
It can be fixed (or at least partially fixed), but it never will be. It would be easy for BHVR to introduce balance handicaps based on number of survivors playing together in a lobby, MMR rating, etc., but they never will because SWF players who have long been spoiled by their unfair advantage will stop playing.
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@Pulsar said:
Not really, honestly.
The VAST majority of SWF's are just as bad as Solo Q, you just have a better time because your with friends.
The ones that exploit it to its fullest potential? They could likely win even as four solo's. I see that as more of a matchmaking issue
I disagree 100% and I think a lot of other people who play killer would also disagree. I'm not saying that your individual experience is wrong, but my guess (based on your post history) is that you're probably a top 1% performer on the killer side and so you can handle a coordinated SWF better than most. Based on my experience (casual killer and survivor player), SWF's a FAR more difficult to beat than solo Q teams. If BHVR would release the data we wouldn't need to have these speculative arguments, but we all know they never will and I suspect I know the reason why they won't.
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Buckle up for the straw man arguments of "people shouldn't be punished for playing with friends". Literally no one is asking for this. People are asking for a balanced, fair game for both sides. Removing an unfair advantage is not "punishment"
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It's a good roadmap, but we've seen so many times in the past where "plans" were never actually delivered. I'll believe it when I see it :)
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I wouldn't count on anything that is said in the livestreams or any other "official" communications from BHVR. There are many, many examples of things that have been "planned" but were never followed through on. The only thing that drives priority is what will bring the most revenue (which is completely understandable - it is a for-profit business after all), but it would be nice if rather than promising the world to appease people they would just be honest and say "sorry, we're not going to work on that".
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@Gabe_Soma said:
When are you going to adapt instead ?
Let us know the counterplay, please
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@Paternalpark said:
Imagine struggling with killer in 2023.
Would love you see some of your gameplay so I can learn how to improve
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@Coordi said:
I just want to note that not everyone who needs captions or visual terror radius is d/Deaf. Accessibility is for everybody.
Everybody except for killer players. What about killer players who have a hard time hearing footsteps or grunts of pain? They are at a big disadvantage, yet BHVR have done nothing to help these players. Survivors very quickly gained this TR accessibility feature when the community asked for it, so why the delay/inaction to help killer players?
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The visual terror radius was a huge buff for survivors, even for those without any hearing disabilities. There's a reason that literally everyone uses it, myself included. It gives survivors a big lead leaving a gen to get to safety that they didn't have before the buff.
When the visual terror radius alert for survivors came out, I saw a lot of killer players asked for similar "accessibility" buffs but as far as I know, these requests were ignored. Why does one side get accessibility features and not the other?
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@xEa said:
Okay i did it one game but that was really horrible. Felt sorry for the survivors, and i got my well deserved rage in post game chat.
If by any chance you read this, yes it was me and i appolgise. I explained the situation and what i was trying to do and refered to this post. Again, sorry for that game, wont happen again.
I'm already done with this bullshit 😓
Is this supposed to make other people feel guilty about playing the game the way they want to play?
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Absolutely deserved. I've had many survivors make it to the exit when they otherwise would not have if they weren't carrying this busted AF perk.
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Matchmaking has always been trash - I'm still getting wildly variable levels of skill for the survivors in my killer matches. But it does seem like whatever was done with the SBMM system is making my matches way more sweaty on average. I'm definitely getting god-level loopers and super-coordinated teams more frequently than before the SBMM change.
The main problem with the matchmaking system is that there are WAY more really good survivors than really good killers. So average to low skill killers have to be matched against good survivors or else the survivor queue times will be excessively long and players will quit the game. Due to the inherent design of the game, BHVR has to make a choice between making survivors happy or making killers happy. There are way more survivor players who provide a vast majority of the game revenue, so that's the side they've chosen to please. Every now and then killers will get thrown a bone, but on average the adjustments to game balance tilt in favor or making it easier for survivor players.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
Making the game a 1 v 3 will always top getting a hook on everyone,there has never been any incentive to spread hooks.This stuck out to me. Its true. But the part I love is that these humans need an incentive to enjoy a game. Do killers not enjoy the chase? Is the 3-4k all your tunnel vision can see? That cannot be a fun and exciting way to play and be enjoyable everytime. I've tried tunneling a few games, and it's boring and quite lacking in any sort of skillful approach.
I'm sure I'll be told I'm wrong or 'I love tunneling! so fun!' Cool! You're still not skilled at the game. You're still doing something you know is pretty crappy to other people. But in this world, that's humans!
Hope I run into any of you. You'll chase me til the gens all pop and Ill enjoy the moonwalk out. Especially a tunneling Blight. What a joke they've been lately lol
Wow you sound really amazing at the game! You should stream - I bet you'd make a lot of money
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@luvcraft said:
I hate getting tunneled when I play as survivor, and I'm sure everyone else does too, which is why I always try to be nice as killer and go out of my way to NOT tunnel. And I appreciate other killers who do that too. But it occurs to me that by being nice we're being counterproductive; if tunneling isn't constantly happening, then survivors aren't running into it and complaining about it as much, so the devs aren't pressured to fix it. Whereas if EVERY killer was constantly tunneling, the survivor players would all be up in arms about it and something would get done.
How about this instead: let people play they want to play and don't make this game so incredibly miserable for killer players that they all leave and get replaced by bots? I guess maybe that would make the players who never play killer happy.
If you're getting tunneled out every single match, maybe you need to work on not getting caught first or you need to equip more anti-tunnel perks. If you're not the one being tunneled then it should be an easy escape for you if you're doing gens efficiently.
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@WilliamSN said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/397884/possible-solution-to-tunnel
Tunneling happens because there just isn't enough gen time at Higher MMRs to have multiple 30-60 second chases with each individual person.
4 Chases would equal 120-240 Seconds , A *single survivor* can pop one gen in 90 seconds , but obviously theres 2 other survivors doing gens aswell, so in those 90 seconds, theres 3 total gens being worked on, 60% of the survivors goal being finished when the killer gets a single hook (8%~) just doesn't feel right. (Again, this math is easily verifiable by checking speedrundotcom where 5 gen pop escapes take 4-6 minutes)
And with current state survivor perks, its a guarantee that no gen will take "90 seconds".
Got commodious toolboxes turning gens from 90s solo to 60s solo.
Got Deja vu telling survivors which gens are critical to avoid a 3 gen while also shaving 5% off just because you spawned in. (84s gens perma) (That is 60% of a BNP on every single gen)
Got Resilience, for some reason providing a 9% speed buff to everything , which results in a 9% shave (81s gen).
The only way to solve this situation would be to encourage killers to not tunnel by providing benefits (ex: Basekit Grim embrace).
Or basekit Corrupt so 3 gens don't fly by the time you find your first survivor, hence indirectly giving more gen time.
See, this is a rational response from someone who sees the issue from the killer perspective, using actual numbers to prove how doing what some players are demanding makes it mathematically impossible for killer players to win.
The devs are smart enough to know this and are hopefully ignoring the players (who never play killer) who are crying for "tunneling" nerfs because they aren't escaping 95% of their matches.
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I play each side about 50/50 and I know how much it sucks to get tunneled. I also know how difficult it is to get even one kill without tunneling against efficient, coordinated teams. so I understand why killers do it. Even 2-man SWF or good solo q teams can coordinate pretty effectively with the HUD info that survivors get now. Survivors have already gotten basekit tools to make tunneling much more difficult. Some players won't be happy unless they escape 95% of their matches and the killer has to get 12 hooks for a win. The devs are smart enough to understand that making these players happy means no more killer players.
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@Beatricks said:
Decisive Strike needs to be reverted to five seconds and OTR should stack with BT, like Mettle of Man.
"GEN SPEED TOO FAST!"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiDirlaBuqQ
Skill.
Issue.
Was this a video of you getting 500 wins in a row as killer? If not, I'd love to see you post some of your game play so that all of us with a "skill issue" can learn to be a god-level killer like you.
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The optimization has been awful on all platforms since the game was released 7 years ago. I doubt the devs are all of a sudden going to fix it. It's already clear that the game code is a nightmare given how long it takes to fix bugs and how many new bugs appear with every update. Optimizing the code would probably take more resources than creating a brand new game.
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I
@jesterkind said:
I'd probably peg Wraith as the gold standard for addon design, with all those criteria in mind.
The one area he scores fairly low in is Variety, since he does have a fair few repeated types of addons that only scale with rarity, but he scores high everywhere else. Basekit is consistent and easy to understand, the addons all follow one another logically, they're almost all genuinely viable, and they have decent opportunities for synergies within full builds.
I agree with Wraith having the best overall add-on selection. Outside of a couple meme add-ons, they are all useful and don't unduly punish the killer with a downside for using like many other killer add-ons do.
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@FilthyLegionRevival said:
I know people are going to come in saying that it would take way too much time to build it from the ground up but you're forgetting one crucial element. Dead By Daylight mobile's engine. That's more stable and optimised than what we have over in the core branch. Since the dev studio is partnered with the folks behind mobile, why not use the already established engine they have and improve on it for the core game?
Having this framework would reduce overall instability ranging from game performance and the likelihood of bugs. Due to this and other factors, the efficiency at which the programmers can work on the game would be increased by a noticeable amount and would be less hassle for them than it already is with the structure the current one has. I'm willing to accept criticism as I'd like to hear genuine discussion had on this topic since I've never seen anyone talk about the possibility of rebuilding the engine using an already established one like mobile's.
BHVR could develop a new version of the game and maybe they are. If they are, I doubt they would say anything until it's almost ready to launch. If they're not, I think it's a horrible mistake because the player numbers for this game are slowly declining. If they don't have another blockbuster game ready when this one finally dies (it will happen eventually), they won't be able to stay in business.
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It sure seems like the cheating problem is getting worse. I've had a lot of matches recently where scratch marks randomly disappear even without the survivor running scratch mark-associated perks, subtle speed hacking, survivors teleporting halfway across the map after I hit them.
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@Basti2k said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3586405#Comment_3586405
Well, if you have skill, you don't have to tunnel
Oh great it's another survivor main telling killers that they are trash if they don't 12 hook every game
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I've noticed this too. I've just chalked it up to subtle cheating which is rampant, but it's definitely possible that it's yet another bug that has taken way too long to fix.
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SWF teams getting all the killer location tracking perks for free that solo q teams have to spend perks slots on (and better yet knowing exactly where killer is at all times), knowing which gens should (and shouldn't) be worked on, knowing where pallets have been dropped, knowing where to go to heal injured teammates, being in exactly the right position to get a pallet stun, being in exactly the right position to get a flashlight save, being in exactly the right position to block a door or take a protection hit.
SWF is never going away, but let's stop pretending that it's not a massive advantage for the survivor side. Let's also stop pretending that these types of teams are rare. They're not, at least in my experience.