Gandor
Gandor
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3224067#Comment_3224067
The perk has less chance to hit a relevant pallet on elementary school map. Its like using spirit fury enduring on elementary school loops. its just sort of pointless. On open maps like mother dwelling, you have more chances to hit relevant pallets. The perk is potentially a lot stronger on these maps in comparison. At the same time, the killer has less reason to take chases in places where no generator resides so the pallets broken might not matter in the long run if no chases take place in the area where the perk had an influence.
I wouldn't say the perk is guaranteed value but the current version of Claustrophobia would never bring more value for windows compare to perks like bamboozle, hex:crowd control or superior anatomy. With broken pallets, there is more of a chance to get value out of the perk from deadzone that the perk creates and it might change the way a survivor team would approach doing generators in a match. Not sure if killer would use it, but it would have more appeal than current version of the perk.
I agree the perk needs buff. I disagree with you how big effect your version of perk would have on midwitch/game (or e.g. wrecker's yard). There is barely any place you can disregard on these small maps (horizontal distance). Even if that spot has completed generators.
So let's agree to disagree
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Nah. The range is not the real limiting factor as 32m is usual TR (so maybe reducing it to TR distance might work).
I think I would go more radical on this perk - make the survivor both oblivious AND exposed when not within 16/12/8m. 2 survivors looping at same time fight for same resource (windows). But spliting poses high risk to getting insta-down.
Then again - the perk does not have any setup condition, so long-ish cooldown would be required (say 90s). What do you think?
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I think there is no saving grace for both dejavu and visionary. Both are useful only for beginners. Dejavu outclassing visionary in all aspects (speed boost, time when active/useful, which generators are highlighted, free vs behind paywall). The perk could only see some usage only if there would be a lot of new players AND the perk would be free.
Or if it got separate new effect (making current effect side effect, not the main idea behind the perk)
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223866#Comment_3223866
About 5-time usage. Hell no. Say I had old DS that could activate 5 times. Or medkit that could heal me 5 times. You see the problem right?
comparing survivor perks to killer perks is little weird considering that survivor have total of 16 perks vs killer 4 perks. the killer perks are supposedly meant to be around 1.5x-2x strength because the killer has less total perks. across all 4 teammates, if all 4 teammate run decisive strike, you have 4 chances to take old decisive strike. In retrospect, your more likely to hit 1 or 2 of them but there is 4 chances. a yellow med-kit with grey bandage add-on is 2 heals, so across 4 survivor using same yellow med-kit with 1 grey add-on, you have 8 heals. As far your argument is concerned, that is/was already in the game. Do not completely agree with comparison but this is what your comparing.
old DH did not really work well against laggy killers (huge map) vs normal killers (midwitch, the game, ...).
Dead hard had 70-75% usage rate at highest MMR, roughly 40-50% usage at lower-middle level MMR. It was used because it was universally strong against every single killer on every map.
what else do you have on the map? Those ~3 strong windows between rooms? Ok. And then? The map is already very resource hungry and if you can't juice each and every pallet on the map
when approaching this statement, I am puzzle for where to begin. I think this is misconception regarding pallets. A big reason why early game for virtually every killer is really bad is because safe pallets are proxy to fast gen-speed especially in early game. I think it comes from newbie perceptive where there is this idea where you can -waste- pallets but the entire objective for survivor is to use every single pallet and trade it for 5 generators. You see, it does not matter if the entire map 0 pallets when exit gates are powered(99%). you can use all the strong pallets at the start and because your leading in generator as compare to killer hooks, you use your 4vs1 advantage to close out the game. If you use all strong resources on the map and your team is efficient at completing 3 or 4 generators in 1 hook, it becomes a lot less likely that the killer can go for 11 more chases in the span of 1 generator remaining. that is why there is conceptual idea that early game is most important for killer. A common reason to early game being bad for killer is that generator are spread out and while that is true, its not defining factor to why early game is bad. Another reason that you get is that survivor all start as healthy so killer has no injure pressure. This is also true but not defining reason either. Pallets are defining reason why killer's early game is bad.
Supposedly, perks that give you an advantage for losing generators as killer is meant to be comeback mechanic for the killer. Its just that 30 seconds of blocking windows is pathetic reward for losing generators as killer. Breaking pallet on the other hand for losing generators, that reward sounds way more enticing.
The perk is unlikely to change, but it is interesting to brainstorm a version of the perk that rewards the killer for losing generators that a hypothetical killer might use in everyday killer build.
Killer perk being stronger is a given. No argument there. I was just trying to illustrate the point. 5 very strong effects can make the game. There are perks with strong effect that trigger exactly once - like haunted ground. And even if it's not meta perk, there is clear usage. Removing all pallets in 16m radius (depending on map) can be just as strong, but you would get 5 usages. As I said. On mothers dwelling - nobody would notice. On midwitch, this perk will solo make the game.
Also on midwitch - somebody finishes generator close to a chase. Suddenly there are 0 resources left for you. So you go down (you can't travel 32m without killer catching you - radius 16m is 32m diameter and on midwitch it's very likely you will have to travel full distance). Finish 4 gens and it's possible map contains 2 pallets even if you used 0. Without any pallets and with killer slowdowns (oc, cob, eruption and pr) it's very possible you can't finish the last one. The exception is if you have some strong window (but it's possible you will not have any).
What I am getting at is - the perk would be at the same time "meh" and broken. Not a good design for a perk. Blocking all pallets for limited time gives potential for waiting it out at some window. Hiding. Or taking a single free hit to move to a part of map with better windows. That's why I like no distance restriction more as a buff.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223957#Comment_3223957
The amount of battery that would get eaten by correcting your flashlight mid save is very minor to the point that if this is an actual problem for you, just get better at timing the save. And no utility is being removed as you can still click the flashlight in a direction you want to point (or use the actual "come here" and "over there" emotes in the game). Timing adjustments are being made harder, they are just different. You just gotta adapt.
But with your point 3 is literally just "I can't bm the killer mid chase with a flashlight anymore", so I really do not feel any sympathy towards your issue with the changes. I'm sorry you think your ability to bm is more important than health issues.
It's not bm. The idea is not even to point flashlight at killer when clicking like this. The idea is, that clicking flashlight immediatelly slows you deleting your momentum at that moment. If you do not use flashlight and instead use keyboard, you will change your direction slower.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223895#Comment_3223895
On both killer and survivor side, I'll see at least 1 flashlight every 3 lobbies or so. They really aren't that uncommon.
Also the timing doesn't need to be more forgiving, because you can just move off killer's face briefly to correct your flashlight timing.
a, It eats your battery way more
b, it removes utility from it - point another survivor to go some direction or ask to be seen by one
c, you can't use it mid chase to slow yourself (to 360 killer) any more, because it force-stays on for too long.
d, as mentioned it makes timing adjustment harder
All of these could be solved if you were able to click 3x quickly and then no more for a full second.
So I gave you 4 reasons why this is a (unnecessary) nerf.
A note. You see so many flashlights not because they are that good, but because they are fun. For similiar reason I always take saboteur to my games even if most killers can ignore the fact, that I sabotaged their designated hook to their face. Because they will make it to next one regardless
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@EUphorik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223589#Comment_3223589
I had to lay down spots for survivors to be Tormented and break the walls, so most of my gameplay was just pressing space and holding m2. When I play trapper it just gets worse
Ok. Remove them. Make the windows always so strong without ability to weaken them after all the map is considered even or killer sided by community and killers already have 61% killrate.
Or do we want to leave the map as is after all?
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223819#Comment_3223819
Keys and Maps are objectively weaker than flashlights.
And you can see this by items survivors bring into trial because toolboxes, medkits, and flashlights make up the majority of items survivors chose to use.
Medkits < toolboxes <<<<< flashlights <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< rainbow maps
Yes. I did no mistake. Keys are not there because their usage is within statistical error.
Anyway - nerfing worst still usable item is sad by itself. Maybe flashlight timing should be a little bit (like 0.1s) more forgiving to offset the nerf.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223609#Comment_3223609
The difference was that EVERYONE was silent because of IW all the time. It was like Dead Hard. There was no option not to go after that person because everyone else would have had the same stuff. OTR and BT both work fantastic as anti-tunnel perks when used as such. But people actually prefer to use OTR by bodyblocking the killer and then wonder why the killer would chase after them instead of anyone else. If you REALLY want to make it pretty much impossible to tunnel you try OTR, Lightweight and Overcome. It works and it's strong enough to help in any game really. Also to your last point: Yeah. That is how the game works. A killer should be able on average to get to a certain amount of hooks with pretty much no conditions other than playing good enough in chases. If a killer decides to do the logical thing and spend them on 1 survivor of course they are gonna die. Do you stop working on a gen and go to another once you hit 33% on it for no reason? No? How dare you tunnel that gen, then?
I see you adopted certain killer main's stupid "tunnel gen" argument. Well the same person also said that patch 6.1 was survivor-sided so you are in very good company...
To the point - no. Most killers I meet would camp and tunnel no matter the situation. Because it's easy to do and because it brings most results. They don't need to chase, they don't need to think. They just stay near the hook and wait for easy pray. Once the person is unhooked, you smack him immediately to get rid of possible OTR. Now you just chase him. And it does not matter if you are bad in chase. If other survivors bodyblock. If they go down just so that you stop tunnel. No. Actually all you need to do is to catch him after several failed attempts and you are just handed your win.
And now you wonder why killer queue is so long. Why so many soloQ survivor DC. Makes no sense. The game is good the way it is. DS nerf was justified. The game can be finally played right. Waiting next to hook is fun for everyone. Why do those pesky survivors even complain all the time now that the game is finally so much fun and so easy?
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223820#Comment_3223820
elementary school pallets are generally weak so no reason to use the perk. on normal maps, 16 meter would be killing 1 tileset pallet, for example completing the shack generator would destroy shack pallet on most maps. The perk would be the strongest on The Game(Gideon) but The Game has so many pallets that the perk removing few of them might not be a bad idea. The perk only activates 5 times. Shouldn't a perk that only activates 5 times have a powerful effect attached to it? Blocking windows for 30 seconds is not really powerful considering that other perks perform a similar functionality for easier trigger conditions.
what else do you have on the map? Those ~3 strong windows between rooms? Ok. And then? The map is already very resource hungry and if you can't juice each and every pallet on the map, then you are screwed. And no - midwitch contains also some good (but still mindgame-able pallets) + 2 god pallets. Get a perk that destroys those strong pallets on both floors and you just took away at least 30s from looping. By single trigger of a perk. That can trigget 5 times. No thank you. I don't want your version of a perk.
About 5-time usage. Hell no. Say I had old DS that could activate 5 times. Or medkit that could heal me 5 times. You see the problem right?
But I agree with you that current claustrophobia IS weak and it needs buff. Just not your buff. It's like you took buckle-up and made old dead-hard out of it. Actually this analogy would be even good - because old DH did not really work well against laggy killers (huge map) vs normal killers (midwitch, the game, ...).
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@Leachy_Jr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223537#Comment_3223537
It takes around 23s to self care in CoH, which is barely any time at all considering its a self heal (only 1 survivor is busy).
If the self heal time was something like 32s or current self care at 45s then I'd probably agree.
15s to get to boon area with huge risk to being seen (or make it 25+s if you want to hide), 23s heal, 15s to get back on gen. Now compare it to SC - 46s for heal + 3s travel away from gen and 3s back. 53 vs 52. BUT. What if killer went next to boon and snuffed it (+14s). What if you didn't find totem (because even if you know all spawn points, some maps are lery's, the game, shelter woods, ....) so you can add anything between 1s to 200s for healing time. And now - what if the killer runs full hex build (e.g. pentimento + plaything) and everyone immediately destroyed all the totems (so you risk having no boons). What if somebody plays inner healing or overzealous. Or somebody has archive to cleanse totems. Or killer is legion/plague (ok this last thing applies also to other ways to heal). And then there is that miniscule chance some killer will bring shattered hope (but that one I agree is the least of boons worries).
To sum up - if you don't play boons, you will never understand how bad they can be (actually how bad they usually are). I play them - but for 1 reason only. I disagree with self-care nerf (I will not use 46s heals out of principle) and have no spot for 2 healing perks (I would have replace my for fun perk - saboteur). If they did not nerf SC, I guarantee you I would not touch boons. And I can guarantee it, because that's how I played before SC nerf.
A note - every other heal is limited so it does not apply (and if it did, then purple medkit with built-to-last is clear winner over everything else).
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@dugman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3223049#Comment_3223049
Some people enjoy using map offerings and flashlight macros and leaving survivors to bleed out for four minutes straight, etc. Just because some people like something doesn't mean it's a good idea for the game as a whole.
I used to love playing nurse with White Nit Comb (lunge -50%) and Dull Bracelet (-4m blink range) to make her fair. But they changed her in patch 5.5 and now I don't consider her fair even with these 2 addons (and I refuse to play Spasmodic Breath because that one is not fun). So I play her only for dailies now.
The point is - some killers need meme perk. And I don't care about BP bonus. That was not the reason why I took the addons.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
bamboozle and superior anatomy already cover perks related to chasing survivors around windows. they do not have a generator requirement. The killer does not have a reason to chase around areas of the map where a generator is completed.
an idea for the perk that I had a long time ago for this perk was that it destroys drop and standing pallets around the generator that is completed in a small area(16 meters). I just do not see the reward in the perk in chasing a survivor in the area where no generator are present. Bamboozle and Superior anatomy are better perks for improving the killer chase against windows compare to the situational activation of this perk.
I don't like such perk. It would be so damn map dependent. On midwitch it would be meta hard winning perk. On Game it would be really strong. On red forest it would barely do anything.
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@Starrseed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3222865#Comment_3222865
Yes it makes sense what else you gonna do?
And of course killer see the same we got basekit BT because some killer tunnel like crazy but not all do this
The difference is, that it was cheap and rewarding to do that. That was the reason for change. Flashlights are already so hard to use (and have so many counters), that toolbox/medkit is always better choise - meaning another nerf makes no sense from gameplay perspective. No toxicity stuff involved in discussion...
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@Starrseed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3222739#Comment_3222739
That is true it is still a nerf but it's a nerf that is maybe necessary and if it's really bad now to use a torch you guys should maybe go and complain to your own part of the community cause it was survivors who overdid it with there macros just like you lost the anti camp idea bhvr tested because survs where quick to find a way to turn it into a weapon
collective blame. So nerf all killers because some nod head, attack ppl on hook and stuff. Right? Makes sense right?
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Maybe I have totally different idea for this perk. Make it so, that during healing someone else, this perk charges. Once it's charged, it allows you to heal yourself at 100% speed.
Meaning it's quick self care with condition. I think this would make it very strong perk, but thanks to limitation of at most 1 heal at a time - not meta perk.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3221610#Comment_3221610
I suggested that empathic connection give you 100% healing conversation for survivors healing you and you were like, that is too strong. Dug makes a post on solidarity and suddenly you agree on a similar perk that I suggest as rework.
The expectation for when a survivor equips a healing perk is to get healed for 1 health-state. If the perk fails to do that, then there is no practical point in equipping the perk. the survivor does not get anything for half-health state. it is not worth equipping multiple perks just to get healed. It is easier to find teammate at that point and use a perk slot for something that properly impacts the game.
Resurgence and Solidarity would need to be 100% for them to get used. Reactive healing should be something like 25% max progression, not 50% current progression. survivors still use self-care over any of these healing perks because at least self-care fully heals you regardless of how long it takes.
You are right. I changed my mind. 100% would not be too strong when I thought about it more. I just forgot to return to your thread.
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@kingcarl2012 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3222567#Comment_3222567
Gotta disagree before DS wasnt an antitunnell perk it was a weapon.
I cant even begin to count the number of times i got hit with an undeserved DS, between downing and having the unhooker wiggle out with a DS bodyblock or flashlight save, or faking working on a gen, or just not being able to tell which meg was the one that came off the hook.
No the DS nerf was well deserved because the perk was abused. Now it is an anti tunnel perk, if you cant get to a structure off the hook with the basekit borrowed time that is a skill issue and poor planning on where you went down.
No. Now it is a meme perk. Or you can take 2 other perks that make it 3-slot antitunnel perk. Well not even that good version of antitunnel that is...
@Hannacia said:
You have Off The Record now. Its just a different type of decisive strike now.
DS does not help against real tunnelers. Those will hit you during your unhook "stun" when you can't move yet - making OTR unusable. OTR helps only against soft tunnelers = not worth bringing to trial.
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@IlliterateGenocide said:
Even then i think it would still be kinda bad
True enough. But there would be some beneficial usage. We don't need every perk to be as useful as old DH. Just that no perk would be as (or less) valueable as not bringing any perk. OP's version would help to those hiding survivors just before they are going to be found at least.
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Don't touch my BL. I love it the way it is. I agree shelter woods suck and tree house would be very welcome, but this perk is the only reason I don't cry when I see midwitch. Please don't touch it. Don't make second calm spirit like "buff".
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@King_Viper said:
Can we get dc tally next to survivors names in the lobby indicating their number of times they have dc'ed from the game in the last 7 days. Almost every match someone dcs or suicides. Not only does it hurt the entire team in the benevolent score. the team is also now struggling to finish out the game with one less player or 2 in some cases. i had two players dc because they were swf . then its left to two remaining survivors who wanna play to do 5 gens and escape. all that happens at that point is one player tries to do gens while the other waits in the locker for you to die. None of the objectives change after a Dc. just gets not worth playing anymore after that.
Sounds reasonable. I would add deaths on hook or at least unhook attempts to that number. It would be fair warning who to dodge.
After these players experience a lot of dodges, they will probably stop playing like that. Sounds very reasonable.
One additional thing. Add number of games played as well. It's vastly different seeing 5 of 10 dc/unhook to 6/100.
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Blight 100% no. 2nd strongest killer in game. He desperatelly needs nerfs (#removeHugTech).
Pig's traps are made to be slowdown that you can't ignore. Any kill from it should always be misplay on survivor's part. Buff other aspects of her
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@Sava18 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3220579#Comment_3220579
Not to be rude, really. But your comment translates to: I can't run meme builds when killers run full meta now because they are not lagging behind as they were before and I really miss my old boring busted perks that were meta for 5 years. It was a meta shakeup because people were tired of seeing the same old perks EVERY SINGLE GAME. As much as people want to think nothing has changed the increased build diversity is there 100%. I quit this game from April until 6.1.0 because survivors were quite literally running the same 7 perks(max) every single game. I would call them bots with perks because I wasn't going against good players, I was going against bad players running carry perks. Although I would still win against these "bots" because I am playing blight and am capable of beating players in my mmr but way below my skill level. But imagine wraith or bubba or slinger or demo or anyone that wasn't spirit, blight and nurse. The killer had to be that much better than the survivor's and even more so the worse the killer they played. IW and DH being the most unskilled free perks on survivor side by miles.
Now I more often see sweat squads that actually know how to play the game, know how to play vs blight. Hell I went against a comp team a couple weeks ago and for the first time ever since playing blight said "Wow they are so good at w". This game is in a way better spot then it has ever been in it's history. Solo queue is lagging behind now, but as a solo queue player myself and from killer pov I would attribute it way more to bad players getting randomly backfilled into a game they have no right to be in than the lack of information that solo queue deserves.
And one last time I will mention how DH after validation was the most busted perk to exist for such a long period of time ever in this game. Not only did it start deleting killer powers instead of dodging them(victor being an auto kick, huntress hatches getting deleted instead of going through to a survivor on the other side), ping above even 50 started to become extremely annoying to play against. I play on 50 ping as killer, and I could finish a hit fully before dh kicks in and says no because they had 80 ping. Quite literally the most forgiving thing I have seen since playing this game.
As a side note I do consider full gen kicking meta to be way too good right now on killer side but mostly due to how busted eruption is. It promotes a hit and run tactic that I find disgustingly unskilled.
DH validation for killer back then is same (and for exactly the same reason) as survivor using DH right now. If you get killer with ping, you don't have DH. That's why I refuse to use the perk (well I play in EU so russians are likely to connect. Sometimes even middle-east. I presume this is much better for US).
Also the game is not in a good spot. 39% escape rate means it's killer's fiesta. Not a good spot to be in.
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@dugman said:
Continuing a series of threads on the least used perks according to Nightlight, next up Jane’s perk Solidarity (0.36% usage)
Solidarity - While injured, healing a Survivor without using a Med-kit also heals you at a 40/45/50% conversion rate.
The idea of healing yourself by healing other people is interesting. For instance, if you are injured, and you can manage to heal two other survivors in a row, then you yourself would be fully healed without anybody needing to directly heal you at all.
I suspect the main issue with the perk is just that it seems like it’s a bit trickier to activate than, say, simply having a medkit or using a Circle of Healing Boon or other healing effects. You have to be injured and you have to go and heal someone else to get the healing benefit yourself. Meanwhile they can’t heal you first or you won’t get the perk benefit so the order you heal each other matters. And all that to shave off 8 seconds of a 16 second heal that the person you just healed could perform on you next.
To put this in perspective, let’s hypothetically say for a moment that the 50% conversion rate was buffed to 100%. That would mean if I have Solidarity and I am injured and heal someone else over 16 seconds then when it’s over both of us are healthy. It’s not even clear to me that would necessarily be overpowered. And if that isn’t overpowered, or is maybe only a little too powerful, then what does that say about the perk at the 50% conversion?
So just at a glance I could see this perk having its conversion rate beefed up, maybe even to 100%. It still might not see a ton of use even then relative to other healing perks but it might help. 🤷♂️
I think I agree with you. 100% would at least do something. But it will still not be worth running in majority cases. Because it's rare that you are able to heal somebody while being injured yourself (everyone brings their own way to heal - especially in soloQ).
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v50MggXgOks@Marik1987 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3221292#Comment_3221292
What argument? Your "Nurse or Blight or Range-Killers like Huntress can hit"-thing?
Congratulations. No one said a perk should make u god-mode against every killer.
Oh and about Nurse: She is no killer u should balance this game around. She was and is broken.
So how many kilers is it?
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@K139K05 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207750#Comment_3207750
It depends. If the killer is playing the Nightmare and is using a hard skill check build it might be, but honestly it wouldn't be too strong if it would be mapwide. But sometimes there are situations where the killer comes to you but you also have a skill check. In these kinda situations, I say it might be too strong of you can fail them on purpose.
Nah. As survivor you run early enough that 1s difference is not that big of a deal. Making it map-wide would actually prevent 100% random skillcheck-leaving-regression that can't be avoided otherwise. Making this perk actually trigger semi-reliably.
I am sure it would still not be meta. But at least it would become situational counter to colourphobia/doctor/etc with effect that can trigger also if it's not the case maybe 1/trial on average.
Note: It would still not become full counter, because these things would eat tokens very quickly
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3219891#Comment_3219891
its more that a perk that is based around seeing aura reading for survivor should be made base-kit for survivor. spending perk slots on aura reading is perk tax for soloq. If everyone had base-kit global bond, then this perk related to seeing people's aura has little reason to exist. 10% healing sounds like laughable bonus for healing.
I think the perk should be reworked to be a reverse solidarity where when survivors heal you, 100% of healing done on you is passed on to the user. that sounds more in line with idea of emphatic connection. Survivors healing you will heal themselves as full health-state.
Bond basekit is more then what SWF has. SWF has approximate position (like killer instinct). Bond is knowing precise position.
Also reverse 100% heal might be little bit too much. I think both of these perks should maybe give 75% but not 100%. But I might be wrong :)
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3219849#Comment_3219849
You could. They’re both good picks. But one thing EC does that empathy doesn’t is help your teammate not bring the killer to you if they’re getting chased while injured, and then they know where they can go for a heal if they get away, whereas empathy does the opposite.
But empathy does have a bigger range (and 128m is more or less infinite at tier 3) and I agree with giving EC the same treatment.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3219891#Comment_3219891
Pairing it with autodidact is exactly what I use it for. But autodidact is the perk that needs that slightly increased skill check chance buff, not EC.
Ok then. Buff autodidact by making it have better chance to give skillcheck (but this is already questionable buff on AD as it might make "we will make it" worse every time) + add icon in bottom right corner to inform EC is the reason why you see the survivor and maybe, but only maybe we will see quadruple usage (but I doubt it). Meaning 2%.
Still you need to use 2 perks that will not even help you be healthy as well as it does nothing to cut down travel time (especially if you unknowingly run away from surv in need of healing or if you or the surv are being chased).
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3219743#Comment_3219743
Idk, most people ssy that either no one at all would use it or that people would be constantly toxic. But never utilise it properly apparently. Which is nonsense. Obvs those issues would be there but not to the point it would be more detrimental to the game than beneficial.
Maybe you 2 are from english speaking countries.
Here in Europe a lot of people have thick and specific accent. There are still a lot of people that can't speak english very well. A lot of people have way too much background noise (e.g. the game itself, because they don't own headset) and a lot of people playing this game actually are not old enough to play it - and you don't wish to listen to e.g. racist and sexist slurs and wishes for your premature funerals from 12 year old squeaky voice.
I would much rather have proper ping system.
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@shapeofmyheart said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3219551#Comment_3219551
I'd say the Tombstone Piece is the only really problematic one, although Judith's Tombstone is still dumb because it does the same thing, just harder.
Is infinite tier 3 that OP, though? I genuinely think the add-on makes Myers a B-tier killer. He has to spend a significant time stalking to become a Bubba that is better at Windows and worse at pallets mid-match.
The combo of the two iris is stupidly unfair in solo with the right build, but I don't think it's that good vs. good survivors because it has its counters; the thing is, not a lot of survivors know them.
Try to get that last survivor from hook at endgame. If you got 1 during trial (not that impossible) and have anyone on hook at endgame, it's already 2k.
I mean it's not like nurse or blight. But by buffing his base kit he can quickly become too much. Judith's ofc is just too much with any basekit buffs.
Also both iri addons are hard (not impossible mind you) to play around already even in SWF when you know all the tricks (and places where he can and can't stalk and lockers and all). Again - basekit buffs would make it way too much. Or delete perk "play with your food" - after that you can buff his basekit a little.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
Just bump up the range to 64/96/128 (instead of 32/64/96) so it’s basically map-wide at tier 3. It doesn’t really need to have the range limit.
Other than that the perk doesn’t need any changes, it’s massively underrated and I’ve had a lot of success with it. The 10% healing buff doesn’t seem like a lot, but it’s not really the main point of the perk, it’s just more of a nice side effect you get.
I wonder what's wrong with this forum. When @dugman mentions useless killer perk, most suggestion are buffs that would turn it to niche-useful perk (like read furtive chase thread). But once it's survivor perk, then it's basically already fine and people just underrate it.
The perk is dogshit. Barely better then buckle up. Survivors bring a way to heal themselves or are able to play injured like almost always. There's no way that emphatetic connection will provide any real benefit if there are better ways to do the same thing - in this case CoH being 100% solution even if they slowed the speed to 25% (making it horrific 64s heal = killer perk).
So to fix it make it purely altruistic version of botany on top of aura stuff and maybe someone will use it from time to time in very specific healing build. Or delete it. Or make it much more likely to give skillchecks and someone might pair it with autodidact (another mostly bad perk)
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/349630/better-than-new-discussion
Yeah if they were to add repair and vault speeds it should probably be only 6% but if they dont and only add on unhooking and sabatoging then itd probably be safe at 19%
Keep the bonuses for 3s after hit and this would actually become mildly useful for sabo plays
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@not_requested49 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/349537/pharmacy-discussion
Basically in other words youre saying un nerf it, cuz it was that change that made it lose its value
I am pretty sure pharmacy would not become OP even if it outright lost the condition to be injured and that's it.
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I think many people ate going crazy with her buffs making her way too strong (like that 16m aura around all tvs suggestion. You know tvs are always close to gens? So at most 2 tp to interupt gen progress - combined with slowdown perks + condemn and I wish to play against 6.1 legion instead).
Just swap cd timers for tv's (turn off by killer or survivor) and make both 10s shorter.
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@Spirit_IsTheBest said:
I had this rework I came up with a while ago, I still think it will work very well.
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https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/51N7ZM6LXCDG/image.png
Better Than New ~
You are an expert in combat medicine, patients leave your care reinvigorated.
Whenever you safely unhook another survivor, or successfully save somebody from the dying state, Better Than New activates.
The next survivor you heal will leave no scratch marks, pools of blood, and grunts of pain. and their aura will not be revealed to the killer for 30 seconds, then Better Than New deactivates.
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This change will allow the healed survivor to let them stay safe with no aura readings from the killer or no scratch marks, I'd say this change is good as it requires some work before it can be used.
I would still not use the perk as it requires heal that takes too long to be really useful (to prevent tunneling), but at least your version would not be just a joke.
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@shapeofmyheart said:
The problem is that people can't bring themselves to slug heavily with him, so they think his power sucks.
I see a lot of Myers players waste time and give up pressure by stalking, popping the power, and hooking the survivor they downed immediately. They usually run out of time before getting more than one other down max; doing this is the equivalent of not using the power at all and just M1ing all the time in terms of macro play.
He's genuinely fine the way he is. Here are some changes that could help him, though:
- Memorial Flower base kit because it does take too long to tier up base
- It's annoying the game won't let you stalk if the survivor is behind certain tiny obstacles like bushes and desks
- Stalk through corn
If the infinite picking yourself up update goes live, he'll need real fundamental changes.
Any buffs like this even if helpful by themselves would need to not apply when any of the 2 ultra rare addons are used. Meyers can't be buffed until these addons are changed. Or any buff to him must be excluded when these addons are in game
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@BrightWolf said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3219386#Comment_3219386
Just curious, which perks would you personally make basekit for killer? Personally, I'd made Sloppy Butcher and NOED basekit for all killers or maybe Spies from the Shadows, since they're free perks.
NOED 100% no. It's very strong clutch perk as is (even if no longer meta perk). It makes 0 reason to make it base kit. Also it would be indirect buff to another super strong - borderline meta perk (that rn poses risk of not doing anything or requiring to make build around it) which is called pentimento.
For sloppy it's also full no. Devs have already made most of heals slow and the rest of them very limited. I see no reason why make it take longer AND removing all progress on any interupt - also this would be basekit counter 2 healing perks (solidarity or built to last for medkit).
Spies would be somehow OK, but I think that's too much. I think basekit stuff should be perks that are something you would never bring to the trial on it's own because it does not provide enough benefit - or it fixes some gameplay mechanics that breaks the game (like partial BT and partial STBFL+surv speed nerf after hit, that we got from 6.1 patch fixes hard tunnel and hold-W tactics). For this reason I can think of stuff like deerstalker or weaker corrupted going basekit for killers
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@Hannacia said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3219501#Comment_3219501
61% killrate means killers are getting 2k more often than they were before. It doesnt mean they are 4king every single match nowdays.
I'm all for balance but how behaviour and people here want the game to be balanced is to slap powerful meta perks as base and call it a day and that will cause issues down the line. Since those perks go also on the high end survivors that knows how to use and abuse them well.
This will cause killers to be just a toy for survivors again. ( this already happens on higher MMR plays) . Killers should in the end be the more powerful side. If you want powerful survivors...check VHS...not doing so well that game though.
I am firm believer that people should learn the game and get better themselfs instead of getting powerful tools to do it for them. This game isnt unplayable or unwinnable for anyone. How people play quite often tell how the game will go. Game is more balanced now that it has been in ages. Survivors really didnt lose all that much with the perk balance patch.
Quite the contrary. 50% means 2k. Everything above 50% means it's leaning to 3 or 4K. It means it's actually survivors who are just toys for killer to play with
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@baked_town said:
I was playing and go to loop around the window at shack but Wesker shoots at the window and grabs me through it! I Think its a bunch of crap how he can grab you through the window and push you up against the wall. if anything he should have to vault and push me out side the shack... at least thats what i thought would make sense with his ability.
This is a thing with all killers. They can hit you over fence (for example inside rancit abbatoir main building around the generator - you can get hit over those fences) and at the window. You can't be very close to these or you risk the attack.
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@Hannacia said:
I'm not sure why behaviour should make the game easier for new and low skilled players. They need to put more gametime in and learn the game instead of getting help from basekit perks and whatever else.
Give too much to the survivors this game becomes unbearable to killers. Its not that easy for killers when survivors know more than selfcaring in the corner.
Besides i personally think its time to give killers a basekit perk at this point. Survivors are going to be running with 6 perks soon ( 2 being basekits)
SoloQ issue isnt perks or killers or maps or whatever else, its the survivors themselfs. If you have 1-2 survivors that are hiding and not helping out the team, sure you will lose and you will lose hard. Self care is almost in every match, Its a killer perk..stop using it.
You already have 61% killrate. People on this forum claim, that this does not apply to high MMR where survivors win more often. That means that to have 61% avarage killrate and high MMR struggling, you need to have way more then 61% kr in low MMR.
What this means - if you are new killer, you win almost always. As a first time survivor, you will play your first 10 games and chances are, you will loose them all. Would you be willing to play a new game that you have just installed after outright loosing 10 times in a row? When each game takes 10+ minutes? And you saw no way how to turn it for the better? I presume not. For this specific reason - low mmr needs to be balanced too and new players needs to get good experience too. Otherwise it's just a matter of time until the game dies. And no - if you provide noob stuff "basekit" (I did not specify what kind of help should they get), then that does not mean best SWF will benefit. How does any skilled player benefit ever from corrective action? How will they benefit from technician? Contrary to this one - when will hyperfocus or DH or flashlight (disregard some killer-specific-ability interaction for argument's sake) do anything for low MMR? On the other hand I don't know of single thing that unskilled killer can't use/do. So no. Low MMR killer will not have a bad time if we help beginner-level survivors.
@HoodedWildKard said:
I've been pretty vocal about VC for solo queue, and still think it would be a great QoL thing for solo q. But been thinking and there are a couple of perks that i think should be basekit should be added exclusively for solo queue players that would make the game more playable for them.
Deja vu, maybe remove the gen repair speed bonus but I fond one of the reasons solo queue games often end in 4ks is because randoms will just do whatever gen is infront of them and often end up giveing the killer an easy 3 gen. Deja vu if they utilise it means they will always work on a gen close to 2 others, naturally spreading the gens being worked and passively helping to avoid a 3 gen. Wouldn't hugely unbalance anything but just give less experienced players a nudge in the right direction and more experienced ones a little more info to avoid 3 gens like swfs can.
Left behind. In a 1v1 looking for hatch, killer has a definite advantage. They don't need to worry about getting caught and can move around the map faster and more freely, so killer will often close hatch before survivor can find it. Giving solo q players only a basekit left behind, perhaps with a reduced range, say 12-15 metres would help redress that balance. Don't think killer mains will like this suggestion, but hey, turning a few more 4ks into 3ks isn't the end of the world. It's still a solid win for killer, just allows individual solo q players a slightly higher survival chance.
I don't like what you propose. These things provide information to survivors, that are actually helpful to everyone every time. For example - one of the things that are kind-of time consuming on some maps is finding a generator (think lery's or the game or even midwitch sometimes). So even if skilled survivors do not really need to know which gens are 3-gen (because they will figure it out during the match), it will still help them shave-off some time from finding a generator at the start of the match (and we already know how much killers hate proof for taking away at most 7s on a single gen for 2 people). I think that all that needs to be done to help survivors not 3gen themselves is to permanently show aura of completed generator - this way they can always look at the map and know which spot has many fixed gens and which spot does not (and this does 0 in high MMR, because SWF will communicate this stuff excplicitly and solos are good enough to remmeber each location where generator already poped - because this information is already shown briefly).
Left behind on the other hand promotes hatch play. As of right now the most boring part of the game is when you get to the stage of last 2 survivors and killer all being stubborn when there are 2+ gens to complete. Survivors will start to hide instead of doing objectives making it extremely boring/long until killer is able to find one of them. When killer finally finds a survivor and downs them, if he decides to deny hatch - killer can camp the body and pick it up (downing immediately after wiggle) and look for a last survivor. This can go on for sooo long. For this reason alone - I don't want to make hatch play any more appealing that it already is.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3219064#Comment_3219064
So because you personally don't like her, she deserves to rot? Believe me, I've felt that way about Nurse. But Nurse is unfun because of how strong she is. Hag is unfun, to you, but she's weak. Do you not see the problem? She's supposed to be able to instantly tp to an activated trap, and hit the survivor, but she can't. Could you imagine if another killer's power, like Twins or Nemesis, straight-up didn't work, how much outrage there would be? Hopefully some at least, because I know people could care less about those killers as well.
She is absolutely not supposed to get hit on every triggered trap. That would be way too OP. Survivors also need a way how to get rid themselves of the trap. Otherwise you have trapper on multiple steroids with no counter play.
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Midwitch needs deleting instead of another version. Lery's is almost as horrible as midwitch. Saloon sure.
Shelter woods should get at least 1 reasonable main structure around the tree. Rotten fields should also get something around mid to connect shack with rest of the loops. Eyrie would be OK after removal of a few pallets in front of main. The game - take a few good pallets and change them for a window. The map has no loops and right now you get killer that can handle pallets (auto loose) or not (auto win)
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Give same treatment to midwitch or shelter woods pls. All of these maps heavily favor one side. Maybe it might be cool idea to make all maps less of a deciding factor.
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@RaSavage42 said:
OK so even if 1-2 Gens pop... does that mean that the others aren't progressed at all or does that mean they are between 1%-99%
Again I didn't run other Gen regression perks (for the most part)... as in me, myself and I... but I did experiment with running COB and Eruption before the perk change patch (on my main Killer... Pig)... So is that because Killers are extending matches by running Gen regression perks or is it MM in general
Ok much appreciated... I though I was the only one
Also... I haven't played the game since before The Dredge came out so I do need to play the game to get experience with all of changes and new stuff
TL;DR.... BHVR needs to change players minds about Camping (and Tunneling)... but it doesn't seem likely (as of right now)
Depends. From personal experience it's most likely 1 full gen done by 2 survs. 1 half gen and 1 barely started gen. But it can be 1 started gen and nothing more (lucky spawn + good chase for killer + corrupted intervention did not allow anyone any quick gens), or it can be 3 fully completed gens and 1 or 2 started (horrible chase, survivors started spread out, no corrupt or effectively no corrupt because wrong gens blocked and chase went deep into corrupted gens). Both extremes being quite rare.
Anyway I will give you the fact, that your life as a pig main is harder then for most killers. Still. If you have fun with her, then who cares that you can't compete with the very best? You will still get games that should feel nice (and they should not be very rare)
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@RaSavage42 said:
If players understood why other players make decisions then the game might be better
Like if I camp... rather then explode in messages just simply ask why I did that
Gens regression is weak (without perks)
Quick saves are a thing... why would I (as Killer) allow that to be
And I don't run Deadlock on every Killer... Corrupt is the only slowdown I bring (for the most part)
Sure camping sucks... so does having 2-3 Gens pop in one chase (no matter how long the chase is)
And certain Killers don't do good at Hit and Run (again without perks)
"so does having 2-3 Gens pop in one chase (no matter how long the chase is)" but this one got fixed. You see 3 gens pop at first chase about as often as 0 gens. Most of first chases end up in 1 or 2 gens completed (does not apply to campers for obvious reasons).
About gen regression. Yes it is weak. But there are strong regression perks. Some killers can already protected their 3-gen indefinitelly. If you want to buff base kit, you need to nerf all of CoB, OC, eruption, PR and so on. One other thing to note is 61% so it's not like killers are hopelessly weak.
Quick saves - agreed. Survivor's fault. But a lot of (and I would say at this point it's majority) killers will not give you single second when safe unhook can happen (I call safe unhooks those, that don't allow immediate unconditional possibility to tunnel right away. Alternative definition - where basekit BT does nothing and not just because killer decided to wait it out).
@Lastchild said:
No, the survivors play hyperfocus because it allows you to finish a generator quickly.
Their main objective is to make generators.
Killers win 61% already. Survivors genrush to get their mediocre 39% chance. Everyone wants to win from time to time. But it's killers that can decide how nasty to play during match (instead of just in lobby - where killers get more info then survivors). If survivors go unprepared, they will definitelly loose. In fact, chances are they loose anyway (again 39%)
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As both survivor and killer I know this mechanics create hits that should have never happened that way.
As a killer the game decides to stuck you to loop instead of survivor in front of you. As a survivor - and this is just best example and it does not limit to this case only - you can get hit by nurse with her back if she tries to use her power mid-blink (survivor is locked before the hit starts and she can hit him even if she overblinks).
The mechanics should go. Give us real hits & misses they way they truly happen.
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@Zeidoktor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3218591#Comment_3218591
Current Furtive Chase only applies while in chase, at which time Monitor and Abuse increases your terror radius.
For clarity, in case I missed it, does your suggestion for Furtive Chase also apply to out of chase?
My own thought was maybe have Furtive Chase gradually suppress the chase music as well as the in-chase TR. FC seems designed as a perk meant to give you more value in chase than out, so having it lower your TR out of chase works against its purpose.
Ok. I admit that I could have been wrong on this one. There are not that many sadako's that I face and most of them kind of give away there location. I did not realize it's because of their directional power instead of TR.
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@Lastchild said:
Don't try to offer a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
The problem is indeed real. And from what I see, there clearly are survivors that unhook to killer's face. But for each such a survivor - there are quite a number of killers, that decide to NEVER leave the hook. Not even for a single second. Alternatively there are a lot of killers (most notably huntresses), that actually go a bit away from a hook. But never far enough so that they can't get free-ish hit going for unhook and 100% not far enough to be unable to tunnel right after that - and I would say that for each killer that never leaves a hook, there are quite a number of killers that proxy-camp into tunnel like this.
I mean - proxy camping at least gives hooked survivor 3 incomplete chases, so it's immediately better situation, but it's still very dirty/abusive tactics. Makes it pretty clear why a lot of survivors bring fully-stacked commodius with hyperfocus & stuff.
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@TeabaggingGhostface said:
The killer should be immune to stuns and blinds when grabbing survivors (not picking up), either off a gen or out of a locker
why? Why nerf flashlights even more? The timings were updated so many times, that flash save is totally not automatic for a lot of us even if killer picks up survivor under ideal conditions. Killers have several perks to combat flashes and flashes still take good deal of time and effort that would otherwise be spent on gen progression.
I mean I understand that 2 lockers with 2 survivors are unfair. But why take fair engagements away together with the unfair ones? Or should we get a compensation buff for removing all locker saves? E.g. I would appreciate 0.3s longer time-window for rescue.
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@dugman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3218591#Comment_3218591
Sure, but having no terror radius during a chase doesn’t really matter much. It’s your terror radius between chases that makes the difference.
I am talking about new version where this would be working also outside chase. I thought we are talking about buffed version already